In 2012, I was in Afghanistan and saw some of the first issued CZ 805 BRENs that were issued to Czech soldiers. I remembered thinking that they Czechs got issued some strange G36 things when we saw them from afar. Czech MPs at FOB Shank, good guys, let us shot them when we were on the range together too!
@@dilldowschwagginz2674 Larry vickers has a video on both the 805 and the 806 or Bren 2 both are in full auto and he said that it was pretty controllable
@@Apfsds120 Accuracy International makes sniper rifles and anti-material rifles in the UK, but pretty much all of their small arms are American, German or Belgian made
@@danielcurtis1434 They aren't for sale, as nobody was able to capture one yet. They only come out at night when everybody in the house or factory (yes, we sleep in factories, under our tables) is asleep. Then the next morning, we wake up and pretend to work on what the dwarves have already made for us. Czech magic, also called zlaté české ručičky.
Ladislav Findorák was the head of the arms service of the Czechoslovak People's Army, who in 1989 approved CZ-2000 for service in the army, after the end of the Cold War he started his own company, where he dealt mainly with various universal constructions. The BREN was intended as a fast-changing multicabar rifle. This eventually turned out to be a dead end of development, as one advantage it has, the barrel fixed between the screws in the frame can be easily replaced when worn, and because it does not touch the body, it can be thin and will not heat up, making the weapon lighter. For a sports shooter, this can have the advantage of changing the caliber in the garage conditions, for shooting at short distances, it should not affect accuracy.
Places keep trying Multicaliber stuff like the more recent ACR prototype with Magpul. It's just such a waste of time. No military wants to have it's regular infantry carry around spare barrels and bolts for the off chance that they get stuck in a place with lots of enemy ammo (but no enemy guns to shoot it with), so they can tear their rifles apart and put them back together and etc etc etc. It sounds great to a committee, but it's just a terrible idea that repeatedly fails for a good reason. (Plus we already do have """multicaliber""" rifles in common use; it's called the AR-15, with a different upper slapped on.)
@@TheMCD1989 Would be neat, but I don't really get the allure. It's the same AK with the same flaws and outdated elements (front trunnion disaster, right hand charging handle, rock-in magazines, severe overgassing, frustrating optics mounting, poor modularity, etc) but with a better cartridge and less comfortable stock. There's much better 5.56 AKs out there, like Arsenal imo, though at that price you might as well just buy a high quality AR. Like I own an AK, but I will be the first to say it is NOT a modern and well designed firearm that is worth the money. They are like Nixie Tubes; old fashioned and really fascinating, but way less efficient and way more expensive than modern LCD, LED, and OLED displays.
@@hedgeearthridge6807 The point of a multicaliber rifle is really for the manufacturer's sake, not any military value-- it makes it attractive to be able to offer various calibers to various militaries without requiring any additional engineering work. Client A wants 5.56, grab barrels from this bin and assemble. Client B wants 7.62x39, grab barrels from that bin, everything else is the same (or nearly everything, ideally). Whether that actually ever works out, IDK...
@@AndrewAMartin it's not the multi caliber thing we think of but hasn't the latest generation AK series done this? As much parts commonality as possible for all of the rifles in the series.
vz. 52 is used by the guard in Czech as well as Slovak republic. Modern assault rifles (vz. 58 included) are unsuitable for the job and. vz.24 bolt action is looking too much "nazi" It was sort of outlier as a army weapon but without it - I do not know what guard units would be using. Old cap&ball rifles ? 😁
The problem is they interchange only one way - you can use G36 in 805, not the other way around - the mag catch in 805 is wider and so is the lip on the 805 mag, but then it doesnt fit in G36. So this point gets only 50% credit.
@@warel5730 I dont think you understand our mindset behind that we want to use german ammunition and magzines if we need to not the other way around XD. We had enough of that in 1938 and that ended with capitulation of France XD.
We'll get to see a loads of cool stuff. Ian posted on Instagram pics of the complete CZ-2000 system, including a suppressed carbine ( I think a carbine ), weird Skorpion with a wooden stock, the new gen Skorpion...Can't wait. Hopefully we'll also get to finally see the Vz.52 rifle.
I don't have any hands-on with this generation of BREN, but I remember some interesting and funny stuff from the news since I am from the Czech republic. The controversy was, that it was quite expensive (the red dot was included alongside other accessories so it was difficult to find out the price only for the rifle, in the end, it was like 3.6K USD). One way of looking at this generation of BREN is that it helped jumpstart the Uhersky Brod factory but at the expense of us, taxpayers. CZUB was able to use the money and experience for BREN 2. This brought us new jobs and the ability to produce rifles at home. The fun part was something like: The red dot is big, heavy, and power-hungry but you can throw it at the enemy. If that does not help, take the BREN by the barrel and beat the enemy to death with the sharp Picatinny rails. If the enemy still overpowers you and takes your rifle, they will damage their hand by the reciprocating charging handle.
Not sure if 3,6k was really that much considering the plain civilian version of Bren "1" (years and years ago) sold for over 2k. Civilian Bren 2 these days is over 2,5k. But can always count of the "guardians of the nation" to overblow everything, especially if it comes from their own lack of knowledge like the machinegun drama of last 1,5year.
If someone thinks that Ian is "only" a "gunfreak youtuber". His visit in this company (with enormous huge tradition of designing & producing different weapon systems) - must be a sign/litmus paper, that he's in a class of its own. Nickname "Gun Jesus" didn't came out of nowhere!!! 🤣
I thought he was called "Gun Jesus" because, with only a Chauchat and a couple of Berthier carbines, he armed an entire company of Frenchmen. That he created to defend a small Arizona town from bandits, with only a baguette and a few pats of butter.
@@PhycoKrusk You've forgot about the most crucial thing, which French armies trough the ages, couldn't even exist without. Wine 🤣. He obviously turned some nearby pond of water into a wine, saying "Réjouisses-vous tous! Avoir in verre, et oublie la guerre!" 🤣
Basic with this rifle was pain. It's fucking heavy, and the one I got had an aversion to gun oil, and the telescopic stock couldn't lock properly. Plus the army issued sight is big,clunky and makes the bolt handle slightly more difficult to use. Another thing is the iron sights are halfway to useless with the issued sight (rip aiming in rain). And the fire selector switch is in an akward position, makes operating it uncomfortable for some. But mainly it's just fucking heavy...
It is a chonk. I barely notice though, as I'm used to carrying around my 21" FAL in the mountains. The best part of the 805 is the satisfaction of feeling as if the bolt carrier is riding on ball bearings. Did they do the weird thing on the domestic ones where they "locked" the bolt into the carrier with a roll pin?
Interesting and subtle details showing that Ian had set this rifle up for left handed shooting. Both with the cheek rest orientation and the charging handle. I wonder if we get to see him shoot some rounds in the very near future? :)
Iam 20 year old czech and from time to time i go to a shooting range with my father to do a little competition. I once randomly found Ians videos and started to watch them. We got it in our veins hahahah
It really isn't too terribly difficult to make a gun ambidextrous yet somehow its still somewhat rare. It really is a great feeling as a lefty to pick up a gun and have it function as intended instead of having to do some wacky contortions to make it function
10% are rocking with the south paw... So if you want 10% of your army to perform suboptimally just make sure everything is right-hand-only.... simple...
The first CZ Bren looks modern and ugly at the same time. CZ Bren 2 looks awesome, like a mix between a Bushmaster ACR and the FN SCAR. Czech Republic have a good and remarkable style for architecture and also weapons. They have really good designers and engineers 😙
@@ForgottenWeapons Did you try to convince them to change their mind about not selling the Bren 2 BR commercially, Ian? Don't know what they're thinking keeping it for LE/mil sales only; they could really take a lot of the .308 market share from the SCAR 17, and maybe even force FN to come down to Earth with their ridiculous prices...
I noticed that the last episode filmed in that room. I'd like to have one, although I already have more quality .22 target rifles than are realistically necessary.
I absolutely love mine. The only complaint I have is the polymer mag it came with was kind of shit and stopped feeding reliably. Turns out CZ makes steel-bodied 10-rounders and they're WAY better!
@@koeryn Funny, I bought 2 of the 10 round polymer mags for a BRNO model 2 knockoff and they work flawlessly. Much better than the garbage steel mags it came with. Mileage obviously varies a lot.
Replaced the rear half of the factory lower receiver on my "pistol" version with one from Dan Haga Designs, which allowed for any AR style pistol grip to be installed. The reciprocating charging handle requires learning a different manual of arms, but I have had no issues. It is chonky, but also flat shooting. My biggest complaint is the trigger. Lots of travel and no after market solutions. Zero reliability issues, but I am concerned about erosion around the "normal" gas block port. Something I am keeping an eye on, with about 2K rounds fired.
I hoped Ian would get some juicy info on the bit controversial trials of the rifle. Where actually (if I remember correctly) the trials were postponed for CZ to deliver guns for testing, while FN had SCAR L ready (which were supposed to be build inder licence in Czech Rep.). I think SCARS were also supposed to be cheaper. And I am Czech I do appreciate that we have our own rifle, but I hoped the selection process would be more clear. As from the quick switch to BREN 2 can be guessed SCARS were probably better ... :) I also thought that the 805 was build from the start to have the option to chose proprietary, STANAG or G36 magazines.
I don't know about trials, but as far as things go now, the Bren is SIGNIFICANTLY cheaper than the SCAR. Mechanically the bolt assembly is almost identical to the G36, so I doubt the SCAR would beat it out in any significant aspect. Don't have hard feelings about this - I can without a doubt state that Czech smallarms manufacturing is EASILY world class level. For reference, a Bren 805 is between 1600 and 2000 USD a piece. The MSRP for the SCAR 16 is 3600 USD, and even used it's around 2800. So the Bren is a more cost effectice option. Also, look at the bolt assembly of he SCAR and the BREN. It's virtually identical. Both are amazing rifles.
@@horvathbenedek3596 It is one thing for how much it MSRP and for how much is it sold to the Army. On the other hand it is pragmatic to wait for the other competitor so there will be competition in the trials. So that part don't look as fishy in retrospect.
only reason why 805 won the competition was that the government send purposevly requests that were made only by 805 = double shot, switchable mag chamber without any tools and some other nonsense that other companies were just unable to complete. We could have PARs but the trials were made only for CZ to complete.
@@ilmt Price is price. The fact is, the SCAR is an expensive rifle. Moreso than the Bren. Unless you think CZ deliberately sells at a loss to the public.
I have a 14" Bren 2ms in 762x39. It's a awesome rifle. I've had it for over a year now and I still geek out over it as much as the first day I got it. I had to get a 556 gas regulator and the HB industries high load spring to take care of some over gassing issues, but now it shoots so smooth. It's feels like a 556 gun now.
same question, where did you get the regulator and what inch 556 gun did you order it for??
2 года назад
Welcome to the Czech Republic. I watch your videos regularly and I think they are by far the best on this topic. So take a look at everything we can do here and especially remember to have a beer and a "svíčková s knedlíkem".
I love my 805 S1, the heavy front seems to keep it on target for quick follow up shots. Learned something new about the take down pin holders in the stock, glad I didn't skip over the video.
2 years ago I was sent to fight narco cartels in the jungle of Jalisco in Mexico, while most Marines had the SigSauer 516 or Galil ACE 53, I was assigned a Bren 805. It was heavy and the safety selector was in akward position, but a good gun in general, the problem were the magazines wich performed poorly, 2 of them broke and the rest all the time were kind of Wobbling in the gun, giving me the feeling they would fall in any moment.
Man, that buttstock takedown is slick. As you slide the stock down, the main spring pushes back into your thumb, that you just used to push in the button holding the stock. Very ergonomic:)
I love my 805 S1 carbine, I wish they would still make them and import them to the US, but sadly they’ve been discontinued. I also have a BREN 2MS, but would have much preferred a BREN 2S as it is much closer to the military version. The 2MS is sort of a bastardized version for the US market (no lightening cuts, ‘modular’ MLOK handguard). Sadly only 300 total 2S guns were introduced ever imported and CZ has made no mention of that model ever returning, so we’re stuck with the Americanized 2MS.
Some of the info I saw recently shows the 2ms becoming a standard version for military use, it has a different front end from what we got but is modular. The Czechs may be using the 2s exclusively but we may see the 2ms version issued to military's in some form. I'm not speaking about the Bren BR.
@Jake Gore I'd highly recommend the 5.56 if the x39s issues didn't kill the whole platform for you. My 11" 5.56 2MS is my favorite not AK that I've ever had the pleasure to put my dickbeaters on.
This was one of those guns I rolled my eyes at back in 2014ish when they came in. I was one of those "well my AR can do more." sort of guys. Now I'm kicking myself. These look so sweet. Hopefully picking up a bren 2 at some point.
@Ubal_Blunt to get those 3 guns unlocked in the campaign, thankfully after completing the whole campaign in one sitting you just have to cheese the last level 2 more times to get everything (but boy is it tedious)
The Portuguese Air Force MP (Polícia Aérea) have an element within them, the NOTP, that is responsible, among other things, for aircraft protection when landing on hostile territory. They're equipped with the 805. Seen pictures of them with the 805, as well as older ones with the G36.
Cool modern rifle, I've never owned a cz but I am a bit of a fan boy Hope to see a shooting video tomorrow, make it so. Fun switch engage! If you happen to see this Ian ask if they have some of their old prototypes stored in their facilities, I'm sure you know there are more than a few quite interesting ones, in my research I've found a couple I would like to request: ZB530, ZK423, AP67, SA83 (krasa[#1 on my list!]), EZ-B, LOP(#2) And of course to see the vz61 revisited if you would. Great in depth informative video as always Ian, enjoy your trip!
Thanks to Ian, i turned into a a fact machine on gun every time i play video games with friends. It s like we are playing Hunt Showdown and i see the LeMat and explain it was not created for normal bullets
same here but for game purposes its less violent to change lemat to work with integral cartridges ammo with smokeless powder other than red dot on 50bmg stg44 :D
Awww! The little 452 on the wall behind Ian. They handle beautifully and have fantastic iron sights. Anyone who learns to shoot with a "Bruno" (as they're called in Ireland, CZ is from Brno, so... 🤷♂️) has a special place in their heart for that little gun.
when i saw this thing for the first time i thought to myself, its improved G36 ....and even after those years i still stand behind this opinion - those non captive bolts and two holes in stock for their "storage" during field stripping - typical HK thingy, and obviously G36 compatible mag.... but despite it is heavy ( more so badly balanced), those rails worked as saw and destroyed any piece of equipment it came in contact with ( included especially your own fingers!) and few things more ( but not reciprocating charging handle - we were switching from VZ 58, so no big deal), it was pinpoint accurate, eats almost anything you feed it with and best of all, it leads to Bren 2 :D, which is for me finished version of this thing, Bren 805 was just working unfinished development stage....
BREN 805 is IMO a very underrated rifle. It has some problems, yes, but look at the development of an AK, AR platforms.. were they spotless? Not at all. There are things that cannot be revealed and identified as an issue unless the gun is fielded and properly tested in combat conditions. Plus replacing Vz. 58 - an awesome rifle to say the least was very hard. Plenty of our soldiers loved Vz. 58 so BREN 805 had a really tough position to begin...
The thing just is that the BREN 805 is an AR at it's core. And it had problems other AR derivatives had solved long since. But the anecdote about not wanting a telescoping stock but then wanting a telescoping stock probably says the most about it's development: too much brass wanting to have a say in things they were no longer qualified to speak up about due to too much time behind a desk and not enough time in the mud, fog, mountains, rivers, ditches and forests...
@@andersjjensen they specifically requested changeable backstraps then proceeded to order no back straps, military leadership incompetence knows no bounds lmfao
@@Shiruvan not that I'm covetous of Ian, it's cool he's chosen to do what he does for the world. Just sounds awesome to be able to talk to the designers as well
@@brettalexander220 iirc they prefer the ballistic capability of the 7.62 soviet for the intended use as a compact cqb carbine. When you get into the 8” barrel territory like they chose, 7.62x39 loses far less performance compared to a 5.56 round (which needs a higher velocity to remain accurate and effective). In this context, they’re basically utilizing the same advantages afforded by 300 blackout but with a far more ubiquitous chambering. Again, for its intended mission it seems completely logical not to mention perfectly in line with GIGN’s unique history of service weapons
I was wondering when I'd see one of these on your channel! I have one of their semi auto rifle (S1) carbines, i have to say my biggest issue with mine is the charging handle position. It's just high enough to be a guaranteed knuckle buster unless you get slick- sided optics mounts. It is by far the smoothest action in a semi auto ive ever felt though.
My Bren 805 S1 is still my favorite rifle. Favorite to shoot also. Shoots so smooth. It’s like shooting a 20 inch AR. Being an AK guy the reciprocating charging handle is normal to me. Same with having no bolt release. All pretty easy to do being left handed. I noticed the rifle was set up for a lefty. Charging handle and cheek piece. At least the second generation was.
I am no firearms expert, yet I am very impressed by my CZ Bren 2 in 7.62x39 mm in the 14.5” barrel. It does stovepipe casings though (about 1 or 2 per 100 rounds), which I suspect is due to the speed the bolt moves.
This gun looks cool in photos but If you actually have to roll around in the mud with it, maintain it and expect it to function flawlessly in shit conditions... you're better off with either the older classic (vz.58) or the much improved BREN 2. (source: saw this gun jam, double feed, carbon-fuck itself with just few dumped mags in my and squadmates hands too often for a military firearm).
And if I remember correctly, didn't the charging handle reciprocate and run the risk of snapping at your off hand as it fired? And didn't the rails also have sharp scallops that tore into gear?
@@Anino_Makata Yes, the rails are sharper than on most guns. If you want to hold the gun by the bare rails, its better to use gloves or mount aftermarket covers on the rails. I dont have problems with the charging handle but one guy did get "bit" by it because his finger was out of position. It does catch onto gear, also the version that takes STANAG mags drops the mags free which is great but also has disadvantages, the mags are pretty loose in the well and rattle also if you are clmbing over shit, falling etc. the mag release button can be bumped by your gear and drops the mag, not super common but happens.
It is obviuosly heavly inspired on the G36 but they went from a 19,9 inch Barrel too a M4 length like barrel with 14,2 inch and added a 3 round burst fire Mode, i used the G36 during my basic military service, the first time i hold in in Hand i thought its a airsoft gun it consits of more than 80% of glass fibre reinforced platic but its still durable, the felt recoil is a bit more than a .22 long rifle, the low weight (8 lbs with empty mag) has a positive effect on long marches, and the cool Thing is the light-gathering snail so you can use the reddot in daylight without batterys, the Dot covered 9,8 inches of the target at 109 yards, inside buildings you had to close the flap on top of the reddot always so that the Red point could not be seen.
I am a total 🇨🇿 gun fan.... the Vz58 was a rifle ahead of its time in many features. The 805 is a damn nice rifle. Played with an early issued model during some NATO exercise, they were actually conducting part of their final field trials. Very well made rifle. Those heavy red dots, you could pound a tent stake in with one, and not lose zero lol.
Looking forward to your breakdown of the Bren 2. Maybe you’ll ruffle some feathers & you or your loyal fans will help build a fire to have CZ handle the issues some people are having with the 7.62x39 variant with it. Pretty sure GIGN own a few of that particular gun, so… I think you’d appreciate that. Good stuff fella!
CZ! Now I'm really jealous Ian. Please convince them to bring back their mauser style controlled feed bolt guns! Only option I'm aware of now is Zastava, which aren't that common around me.
@@brettalexander220 Some people are actually capable of evaluating firearms in and of themselves without politicising every little thing. This is a strange concept to many, I know, but if you listen to Ian for long enough you may one day be able to look at a weapon objectively too........
They may have never made different back straps for the grip, but the changeability and the redundant separation in the stock block, makes me think they had thought about the possibility of one piece, thumbhole stocks, possibly for a civilian market?
Actually for the grip backstrap, a larger one was offered. I bought one from Numrich. It makes the grip feel so awesome. I also prefer the Gen 1 mag release. I know it's not M4 style, but with the design of the Gen 2 button, if you sling it over your shoulder and go for a hike, it will repeatedly drop the mag in the mud. This mostly happens when going downhill, when the weight of the gun works against the button. Once switching it over to the G36 style mag, problem solved.
Not a commentary on function or quality, as I have found it's unwise to second guess the Czechs on either. But purely a matter of aesthetics. It looks like what a moderately talented B-list game developer would model for your near-future science fiction military shooter video game if you told him "Our game needs a generic assault rifle, but please don't base it on anything immediately recognizable, I don't want an AR or an AK to cause copyright issues. And also, we need it by tonight."
Theres an interesting feature, spring is pushing the piston back, so it is in contact with the carrier. On vz58 it was reversed, spring pushed the piston forward, and on full auto sometimes carrier was not in contact with the piston and piston hits it. I wonder if it was actually a problem after some years of full auto.
