The ‘44 Pattern equipment was specially issued for tropical use, so the desert, Hong Kong or the Jungle. The ‘44 pattern bottle and mug were popular bits of kit to acquire because they were made of aluminium. During the ‘80’s having a ‘44 pattern water bottle and mug in a 44 pattern pouch as part of your belt kit was “ally as f@ck”, and a lot of the photos of the Paras in the Falklands in 1982 show a few 44 pattern bottles and pouches knocking around.
Now THAT is the way to make a review! You're VERY knowledgeable about Brit kit and I'm enjoying your video. I hope I'm not nit-picking but I mean the following in goodwill, I hope you appreciate the information. The '58 W/B can be nested in the '44 Mug. That's how I used it during my service. When I re-enlisted, I was issued 2x BCB Mugs: I never used it like that. For hiking/bushcraft, I would use a metal mug and plastic mug: cook with the metal mug, transfer to the plastic to drink as I cook with the metal mug back on the fire. 4:30 - W/Bs were made in black from between 1965 and 1967. Up until 1965, they were green; I've never seen any green ones dated later and I've not yet seen a W/B made in 1966; I have a 1967 W/B and it's black. Osprey FIRST made these W/Bs in 1976, on and off, then made them exclusively from 1990. So far as I know, "BCB" designed the 95 Patt Mug (aka Crusader Mug). BCB stands for "Brown's Cough Bottle" - no really! I use the cooker (which is non military issue) that nests under this mug. Designed for gel fuel, I've used hexamine and alcohol in it, a brilliant piece of kit! I use foil instead of the optional plastic lid: thinner, lighter replaceable. Good to know about the Pathfinder School lid.
Beware by the way. 2 companies make these. Osprey make the MOD/military contract bottles and plastic cup. That’s issue. Red seal inside. Says Osprey on outside next to NSN number etc. BCB make a crusader metal mug as shown which is good quality and is used by the military. I wasn’t issued one with the canteen and cup I don’t think but ...may be issued now. Or are bought privately. Worth having. BCB make a cadet/civilian copy of the water bottle and plastic cup. White seal inside lid rather than red. Neither bottle nor cup are the same size as the Osprey. Bit smaller. For some reason. So the plastic cup won’t fit on Osprey. Worth knowing. Also the BCB bottle is ok but thinner but is bit lighter and cheaper some people say they leak. Could be due to burrs on the screw neck which can be removed with a file or hot metal and burn off. I did that and works well. I have both and both very useful. Also if you can only buy BCB crusader metal mugs with a black non stick coating, sometimes they are only ones available, and want it plain steel just buy it, put it in a fire for a good while then sand off the soot from the coating. Will take only a few minutes and you will have the plain steel mug as shown here. No trace of the coating. Much easier than trying to sand it off cold which will take a long time. It scratches easily with metal cutlery etc so some don’t like it and that it chips off in what you cook over time. Personal choice. Metal USGI lid will fit BCB crusader metal mug if you bash the lips flat a bit with a hammer. Simple job. Keeps debris out and speeds boil. Or the plastic BCB one is ok too but don’t leave it too long on heat or will melt. There is a whole new design of this available a new version which is bit bigger, has a windbreak etc mostly aluminium. Taller I think. Pros and cons in comparison with each other. I prefer what is shown here the older version with the BCB crusader under mug steel stove with a rope coil meths burner and USGI steel lid. Works anywhere. Used it yesterday in fact for hot drink on cold evening in forest. Very quick and simple to use even windy and on damp ground etc. All the best 🇬🇧
Good to know. I've steered away from buying a BCB version of the W/B, I'd heard that it wasn't so good. That said, I think it's included in aircraft survival kits that BCB supplies to the military (I believe). RAF storemen probably replace it with a W/B from their stores. I'd just add that genuine W/Bs were made by Cascelloid, F&G and PP until Osprey took over ALL production from 1990. And there are HEAPLOADS of imitations, some moulding the NSN into their imitations...
While I have used the U.S. Canteen, Canteen Cup w/Stove extensively over my military career, I'm a huge fan of the British Crusader cup system w/ stove as well. Note from personal experience: Soldiers drink water directly from canteens, U.S. and British forces. The cups are used for coffee, tea, etc. Plantains, Black Beans and Rice??? You rock!
Hi John. Thanks for the video. Looks like a great hiking spot you have access to there. The British Crusader system really is very good. The stove nestles underneath the steel mug as you say, all inside a pouch or can store the stove separately. fits together well. Easy and quick to use. The stove can use many fuels even twigs etc I have adapted a small Vaseline lip salve round tin the size of a small cookie with a coil of fire rope inside used to seal stoves. Into this I pour a slug of meths which I keep in small hotel shampoo bottles which seal well and are easy to stow in a kit with a lighter etc. Can use a main meths bottle as well of course, they are just handy to keep with the kit. I have removed the metal handles on the plastic mug as they rattle, just pulled them out of the socket carefully, will go back in if needed. Cup never too hot to hold. With this kit can have a drink in plastic mug plus make a meal in metal mug all in one go. PLCE works although a bit tight with stove, can store stove separately which is easy or I cut then added a strip of material to a PLCE pouch to make it a bit bigger and that works. Also for lighter use (using bits of material lying around) have made a cotton bag which fits over it all to make it easy to stow and that fits in a nylon pouch I made too to make it easier to use. All the best to you from the 🇬🇧 UK 🇺🇸 and stay healthy!
Good to see you again. Great setup. I picked up the plastic crusaders cup at a local flea market back in the fall. I seen a canteen with cover at the local army surplus and was just about to get it and spotted the blue enamel water bottle with canvas bag. The budget wouldn't allow for both so I had to have the blue enamel.
I really like the British PLCE gear. I use the pouches for extra stuff. Both of the canteens I got needed O rings to keep from leaking. Never got the metal cup or stove. If you want you can put a USGI cup on top of USGI canteen, then you have two cups to use. My wife and I went to Walmart today, second time I've seen empty shelves there. First time was when I helped prewire it before they opened new store. We had to wait 40 minutes for them to bring out a pallet of TP and paper towels. Only one package per person. No rush or grabbing by people, wasn't anything like black Friday.
Grateful as always to be cheered by your posting. As I'm from Scotland I am very familiar with the old British mess kit. I used one when camping in the 70s and 80s. It may not be as efficient as the modern gear but it has its charms. If you get one I am sure you will find it fun to use.
IainB good to hear from you again too. I was just checking eBay for the US and there wasn’t any British mess kits available. Only some repos. I will find one someday for a cheap price. Thanks for watching another one and for your comment!
Dear John , just a few points of information to add to your files. Firstly, the '44 ptn waterbottle and cup were aluminium , and usually only issued to Para Regt, Marines and SAS, not the main stream soldiers.The '44 ptn pt waterbottle carrier was made of canvas and had the additional function as a "patrol magazine" holding about 25 rounds of 7.62mm belt for the GPMG ! Secondly, most folk applied a piece of duct tape to the '44mug to prevent their lips being burnt. Thirdly, (not needed in Florida) the 58 ptn waterbottle is 'reversed', ie turned upside down in cold weather/artic/alpine conditions to prevent freezing of the contents. The fill level of the bottle should be reduced the colder the weather. A temporary "handle" of tape or paracord is usually fixed on the bottom of the bottle to make pulling it out of the pouch easier and only the crusader mug used in the set up. Finally, the capacity of the 58ptn waterbottle, although widely quoted as 'one litre' is actually two imperial pints (40 fl oz) as it was created prior to metrication in the UK. If you are still looking for a set of British mess tins let me know and I'll send you a set. Cheers, thanks for taking the time to read.
Hi there .. from a South African living in Switzerland .. Nice share .. thanks 👍😊. I still have (and use) one of my early Personal Military Issue 70's Water Bottle Sets .. Canvas Webbing Holder, Plastic Water Bottle and SS Mug (we referred to them as 'Fire Buckets'). I've added later, a SS Lid (Miltec I think?). Like yours, it doesn't fit perfectly but does the job. Herewith some more 'Useless Information' 🙄😏 .. My original ('68 National Service) Water Bottle Issue was not as good as the subsequent 70's issue. It consisted of an Aluminium Bottle with a Plastic Top Housing and a Plastic Fire Bucket. We had to heat water in one of our 'Dixies' (Brit-Style Mess Kit .. I still have and use mine) for Coffee or Tea .. and one could never get the Smell or Taste of previous Drinks / Meals out of the Plastic Cup. I think that they .. the Military Supply Chain Top Brass that is, decided to change to a more practical version when one of them were 'invited' to come out of their Head Quarters Bubble into the Field and actually use one. One again .. nice share 👍 .. good to see you again 😊. We are not currently, despite the 'lockdown', having too much 'panic buying' in this neck of the woods, so pretty much is still available 😊. Take care .. stay safe ..
John its nice to see you be able to do a video despite the pandemic. For many people who are forced to stay indoors your videos relieve some of the monotony and boredom. Keep it up and stay safe👍 Nice piece of kit there! I also have a set. Wish the cup was alum.or stainless steel so you can boil water directly into the fire.as in this case you need the seperate stainless steel crusader cup to boil water. .....and hopefully this is a good sign that one of these days you"ll finally be getting the British 2 pc. Messkit.😊keep it coming!👍
Ryan Victoria Thank you very much! I like the kit with two cups. The only thing that would be better is two steel cups instead one nylon and one steel. Thanks for watching and for commenting!
Good to see you out and about John. I bought the BCB "cooker" that I use with my Trangia alcohol stove. I got it from fleabay for like $15. & it really works well. Take care and may God bless. Ken.
@@John-Sherwood-W4JFS The Trangia alcohol stove fits perfectly in this cooker and the height is just about perfect. You can find them on ebay for $14. plus shipping from the UK.
Knifeaddict67 yeah! I will! It’s like a hurricane storm is coming to Florida except we have gasoline with all these empty shelves at stores. Thanks for watching and for your comment!
I just stumbled on to your channel a few days ago and I really enjoy seeing old kits being used even if some are impractical to todays standards I think it’s fun. Keep it up. I see you use what appears to be old knives, do you have videos of them as well? Thanks for sharing.
I’m sorry but at this time I don’t have any videos on just knives. I just use the ones I have in my other videos. Thanks for watching and for your question.
interesting video as usual! The osprey/crusader canteen/cooking system is a really well designed unit, quite lightweight and good quality, as most british armed forces gear. (I use many british army, navy and RAF stuff cuz they are so classy, otherwise I like scandinavian equipment) It is though a little bit expensive compared to other equally good alternatives. I used this for some time but now that I changed to titanium I do not use it as much, but still think it is a very good set. Stay well, say no to Covid.
Good to see a new video! I think coronavirus is going to make a lot of us youtubers more active for sure. LOL. Also great meal you made, I love fried plantains and black beans and rice! Look forward to more videos!
Good to see you back, I was just thinking I hadn’t seen anything from you for a while. I like the plastic extra cup. You can have a hot drink and not burn your lips. That looks like a great lunch.
We used to put black tape on the older '44 mug to prvent burning lips. If you have the '95 mug on the fire for the minimum of time to make your beverage then leave it a minute off the fire, you shouldn't burn your lips on it.
Wow, this kit's like a way more optimised counterpart to the Yugoslavian mess kit. It's got a similar integrated mess kit/bottle design, but with less redundant cups.
There was a steel mug that you could buy from a company back in the 80s and early 90s, survival aids. This was way before these crusader cups came out. The survival aids cups came with a clip on plastic rim to stop burning your lips when drinking hot drinks.i had one when I was in the army,stupidly let my mate borrow it for a 2 week exercise in Germany and it got lost (so he said 😕 ) so my replacement was a US cup and bottle set bought from the PX . I still have it 27 years on 😁
I remember seeing those mugs advertised in Combat & Survival magazine (I think), they were outrageously expensive back in the late 80s at around £20 or maybe more, same ways a norgies were and anything from goretex, glad prices have come down nowadays. I don't think anyone who had one would have taken the 58 ptn plastic mug on top of that, they'd just have substituted one for the other right? Also I really used to like the tactical black mess tins with the lid, also very pricey. Nowadays I use a Dutch army canteen cup, and just ordered Dutch stainless mess tins
@@simonh6371 yeah the old combat and survival magazine. Not read that in years now. The bottle and cup I used fit in my webbing but it was tight,was still using 58 pattern stuff at the time. So I bought the metal mug and left the plastic one in my locker. I remember seeing those mess tins too but never got them.i got the mess tin lid that is a frying pan. HM supplies in Aldershot made them. That is still have, can't beat an egg banjo on exercise 😁
@@andrewjohnston4127 Yeah the 58 pattern waterbottle pouch was a pain at the best of times and nearly impossible to use when wet. Can't imagine anyone who splashed out on a metal cup took the plastic one as well. Ah egg banjos, the cornerstone of R Signals detachment snacks, we were on 3 man rebro dets, as soon as the 9x9 was up and on the side of the wagon, and the cookbox in it from the back, the det commander used to get a brew on and egg banjos all round whilst we dealt with cam nets, masts and genny. Happy memories lol.
I'm seeing comments by Andrew Johnston and Simon H confirming what I remember of the Survival aids (Morpeth - not the current nakesake business) mug. The price of it was off-putting so I never bothered with one, spending my money on beer and collectable junk like '08, '37 and '72 pattern webbing which was plentiful and dirt cheap in those days! (And aren't I glad of that, today!) But I was SURE that it was called a "Crusader" mug. It sticks in the mind because, when I had the '95 pattern BCB mug, people were calling it a Crusader mug and I was continually telling them that it was better than that Survival Aids mug - it was a few years before I saw BCB's marketing. I NEED to locate one of my old Survival Aids catalogues...
Thanks for another good review and as always a demo making something tasty. I am not sure when the Crusader cup became standard issue, I think it was more recently than the 90s. There were metal versions of the 58 pattern mug on the market back in the late 80s but they were outrageously expensive, at least £20 if I remember rightly. If I had bought one I wouldn't have carried my plastic issue mug as well, I'd have just substituted it for the metal one. Plus the old 58 pattern webbing water bottle pouches were a real pain in the backside, they were a tight fit at the best of times and when they got wet - which happened a lot in the field - they shrank and you would be struggling to put the canteen & issue mug anyway without the extra thickness. Noticed you talking about British Army mess tins further down in the comments, of course I'm familiar with these but imho as they are already overpriced across the pond - here they can be had dirt cheap - I'd recommend you look out for Dutch army stainless steel mess tins. I know they'd be pretty rare over there and not cheap at 30 bucks or so from what I've heard but they are bombproof and you can use them on an open fire which I wouldn't recommend with alu mess tins. My go-to canteen cookset is the Dutch Army stainless steel cup with a pathfinder lid, the lid doesn't exactly clip on as a perfect fit but who cares, it reduces the boil time a lot. I also generally carry one of my 2 Dutch Army mess tins too. I like the USGI canteen cup stands but they have a few drawbacks. The 2 generations of BCB crusader stand/stove are a bit bulky for me, as is the Swedish army one. The best solution for me personally is a Trangia burner with a folding Lixada-type pocket stove. That way I can also cook using an Esbit tablet and/or twigs.
Yeah, the metal version of the '58 mug was a survival aids (Morpeth) commercial product. Black non-stick with a plastic removable brim. Some units with clued-up storemen bought it in bulk for their troops. Often mistakenly called a '84 or '85 pattern mug. My unit was issued both '44 and '58 W/Bs and mugs as well as '44 W/B pouches until the late 1980s. My combination was '44 mug and pouch + '58 W/B. I was issued two BCB Crusader cups in 1998. They were dated 1995. When I signed for them, I signed for "Mug, '95 Patt x2". Two issued, intended to replace mess tins - but they issued me with those, too AND the plastic '58 mug!
Hello my Friend i hope a Day to Come on your country or you good meeting !!!! I have the same things like you... I love to use the old Military canteen! May be à Day in NOrmandy !!!!
I guess a bright spot with all the doom and gloom of the pandemic is that it can force you to be creative with how you eat. I've run out of multiple food staples only to find a few things I actually like much better.
I have the Pattern 58 canteen and i got 2 Heavy Cover Lid's for them but i don't think they make them now , if you are still looking for a Pattern 44 Mark 1canteen and cup let a know ,
