Can a 10 inch subwoofer dig like an 18 inch? Dayton audio High Excursion 10 inch VS JTR Captivator 

Thank you. It won't be too long until I can get the 12 inch version put together.

Yes, I agree. When the dual 12 is done, I'll include the REW measurements. For reference, the dual 10 hit 111 db at 26 hz with the mic about 15 feet away. That's a room gain measurement, but impressive nevertheless.

Thank you. Much Appreciated.

Thank you. They are a joy to build.

They'll be featured in future videos. :)

Thank you. Much appreciated.

The engineering behind them is the one that is expensive

Thank you. Yeah, I'm still very surprised at the performance. If you have the materials lying around, why not make something cool out of them? :)

Or 4 grs12 4he.

Agreed, there are good copyright free tracks out there. They're just hard to find :).

This design has been excellent with the 10 and 12 inch high excursion drivers. Those drivers would do just fine.

Gotta let those baby 10's breathe :)

You know there a article on databass , talking about small vs big sub , Music vs none, They have all been disproven

It's more a question of the output of the sub being matched better with the speakers for the 10. If you turned up the whole system in line with the output of the sub increasing, it would sound more balanced. And especially on a cell microphone it will compress and overpower when the bass is that much louder.

I also noticed that the 10 inch was more musical. Yet it can also handle home theater duty.

​​@@righteousbuilds3576sounds like the 18" not getting the power it need, or redesigne the box for it. It should be more playful than any smaler singeldesign, is the 10" pushpull??

The 10 inch is a down-firing/forward firing design. The down firing configuration tends to do more with less gain while the forward firing speakers sound cleaner. This is the best of both worlds.

It was just the samsung S-22 mic for that video.

You would be correct. Im in the Salt Lake, Utah Area.

You can find the speaker power sp series amps on GSG audio's website or madisound.com

I know that the sp1-4000 and the sp1-6000 have 2 ohm power ratings posted on their website, and I have the sp1-2400 wired for a 2 ohm load, which it's doing just fine with. But I haven't seen anything about whether they're stable at 1 ohm.

I got very similar results from my measurements. With the mic about 15 feet away, I measured 111 db at 26 hz

@@righteousbuilds3576 That's so close it's almost science!

He's built all these and you assume he doesn't know this?

True. the 2 tens combined have about 100 less square inches of cone area, but they put it to very good use.

Agreed. Two 12's might come pretty close in performance or beat it. :) Coming soon.

@@righteousbuilds3576is it a push pull setup? does the air pressure increase or stay constant?

@@chokechange They are in phase with each other, so they act as approximately one 13 inch driver.

@@righteousbuilds3576 Does having them perpendicular to each other make a difference or is it functionally equivalent as if they both were on the same baffle face? Still learning on my end.

@@chokechange Before designing this sub, I had seen several demonstrations about how a down firing sub will have greater tactile response than a forward firing sub. This one combines the two to make a reasonably small (take that with a grain of salt, it's still 18x21x27) sub with great tactile response and nice, clean, detailed sound. The 24 inch sub in my living room is a down firing sub and it's an absolute jack hammer. My neighbors often complain when I fire up that monster :).

That's awesome. Thanks for the comment. :)

I honestly think those JBL VRX subs, even the 18s, are my least favorite pro audio subs. They are a less expensive option though, and they are good for smaller spaces. My main complaint is that even the 18s just seem to kick, and don’t really go deep. Not sure if you have the powered version, but if you do, those seem to clip relatively easily and sound like garbage when playing bass music, especially outdoors at a louder volume. However I’ve noticed that pro audio subs, when done right, tend to usually sound punchier and more musical outdoors due to the general lack of echoes and reverb. I vastly prefer intimate outdoor concerts to any other music listening experience.

@@djijspeakerguy4628 Ive noticed they CAN if they are driver really hard. Mine are rigged with 2 line arrays below each one (1 per side 2 total). They are in my auditorium and for the space they are technically oversized. i do know that they are not at their rated power, only about 700wrms each. but i work with what i have. I do know that they can get low when i want them too. they do MUCH better for movies than they do for music at least indoors

@@hortonj63 Yeah, that’s sort of the story with the VRX subs. I hear that the passive versions that run off a separate amplifier are far better than the powered version with the Crown amp in the back. You can definitely get the passive ones loud if you want to. The best JBL sub I think I’ve heard is the SRX728 which is basically a VRX918 with two drivers. It was six of them in a medium sized auditorium. The main rig was actually a top-of-the-line VERTEC system and the SRX728 subs held up extremely well!

@@djijspeakerguy4628 you are absolutely right. Mine are passive with a QSC PLD 4.5k and they arent driven with full power but they sound great. The crown amps were tuned horribly and roll off was VERY high. they didnt dig at all. Now the PRX912 powered PA speakers are fantastic. i hung 4 in the gym and they get down at 30ft high.

@@hortonj63 Yeah, I’m with you on those subs with the built-in crown amps, definitely one of JBL’s failed designs in my opinion. I was at an outdoor stage with 3 918SP subs ground stacked per side covering an approximately 200x200 foot lawn space. They had a lot of pre-recorded modern pop music with heavy bass being sent through the subs at one point. It was pretty loud up front, but a bit quiet in the back. The sound was overall treble-heavy, and the subwoofers built in amps were already clipping so badly that the kicks started to almost sound like 2 or 3 separate peaks, like “Ppuph!” (In contrast with “Puh!!!”) and they just had no depth to them whatsoever. Funnily enough, I did hear a set of the new Crown-powered SRX-828 subs at a small indoor venue in my city and those were epic. I wonder if Crown revised their tuning!

When you calculate the cone area, the 18 still has more (254 square inches vs 157 for the 2 tens), but the higher sensitivity and their willingness to work makes them perform way better than expected.

@@righteousbuilds3576 eeeeeh. 😑. The size of the box will determine the performance

2 RULES.... NO REPLACEMENT, FOR DISPLACEMENT, AND THE ONE WITH THE MOST CONE AREA WINS, WITH THE SAME AMOUNT OF WATTAGE, GIVEN THAT THE SAME HAVE THE SAME SPECS.... SENSIVITY, ETC ETC....

I still hold a record, 30yrs later. I had two down firing 12in Blue Thunders from 1994. On a JSE 400watt amp, mids and highs off a 50x2 Precision Power Art Series. Clarion head unit. I hit a 152db with less than a total power of 500watts. I spent months with a music teacher, science teacher and MTX designing this set-up so the subs stayed within their maximum frequency range for a ported box, but using the car as a loaded horn. Down firing about 4 inches, I think during testing I used red bricks on their sides. Firing back through about 8in up, then the hatch glass acted like the horn. I nearly destroyed that car, breaking the mirror off the windshield, knocked the steering wheel collum off and so much more. 3 of us sat on the hatch and it bounced us up in the air. From a very literal 1/2 mile away it was shacking windows. I know because I got the police called on me. When you make the box right, you can maximize the subs output. When you use science, you can make that sound amplify by using physics the same as a horned instrument can take raspberries from your lips and fill an entire concert hall loudly. Tens will be cleaner with less mass for control, but the larger subs will be more efficient with lows because of the mass and cone area always helps with efficiency since a single 18 is like 4 10's of usable cone area. So 100watts on each, the 18 will be considerably louder. And the frequency range is dependent on the subs suspension, motor and coil. The enclosure size allows for the tuned frequency response or maximum frequency response, but at a cost or benefits of power handling. To get lows you need a massive box in most cases. Or a 4th order tuned extremely low with a subsonic filter and that ported sub brings up the higher stuff

He explains in the video that it's actually 2 10" woofers?? I don't understand your complaint.

@@MyFatherLoves read the title of the video. There's two tens in the box.

@@MyFatherLoves not a complaint, more of a statement. And it's one 10" in a 4th order and one ported. Also known as 4th and half by some. Regardless, what's more efficient at 100w? If you pay attention to the fs and box expectations to hit that frequency, you'll see, a single 12" is superior to 2 10"s in a 4th and a half. Same box size. Even that 18" is nearly the same box size and also about 6db louder at 1000w, but may not have the tight bass of the 10's. I do like his concept, especially if he opens it up to 12". Even Sundown claims to hit lows, or B2 with an 8". But it probably would take the same size box or even bigger and can do about the same. But also without the power handling either.

The enclosure volume is 2.8 C.F. Yes, it's ported. It's a 3x16 inch slot port. 33 inches if you don't include where it turns the corner at the bottom and goes past the down firing driver. 53 inches if you include that portion. It digs down past 20 hz with ease though.

It's a ported sub. 3x16. Just like the JTR, the port wraps around the entire inside of the enclosure and used the 3 inch portion on the bottom as a quasi-extension for even lower tuning.

​@@righteousbuilds3576Thanks

52 C.F. after you factor in the port and the drivers. My tuning frequency is 13 hz. They are definitely larger than life. :)

Thank you for the response.

@@righteousbuilds3576what a beautiful looking cabinet. Better than most ‘professional’ designed cabs I’ve seen.

2 10's works out to be about the same as a 13 inch driver. All of the design elements that went into the enclosure contribute to it's musical abilities and also the ability to dig like you wouldn't believe for 10 inch drivers.

Looks like the Perlisten runs about $5k for the r210. But you're right. With the planned 1200 watt amp, it would be around half the cost, finished and ready for pickup. I'm in the West Jordan, Utah area. Just south of Salt Lake.

That's a speaker power sp1-2400. You can find them at madisound.com or GSG audio. Be prepared for a long wait and a fairly big price tag.

That will be coming up once I get the 12 inch designed and ready to go.

I'll be doing some REW measurements on the 12 inch version. Watch for the next video. I'm just waiting on the amp to be shipped.

The dual 2 ohm 10 inch drivers are individually wired in series for a 4 ohm load from each of them. They are then wired together in parallel for a two ohm load on the amp.

Agreed. It depends on the 18 inch subwoofer in question, but it's hard to beat the JTR with anything smaller than it.

@@righteousbuilds3576the paradigm sub2?

I would say that the dual 24's would perform very close to dual JTR captivator 4000ulf with the slight advantage going to the 24's due to higher efficiency.

how many is enough ?

@@phillipmorris9847 depends on if you are married or not

ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-cTP5xmV5ejI.html

Email righteousbuilds@gmail.com and I can get you set up. Although if you're not local to the Salt Lake, Utah area, shipping might be a beast. :)

You really need 2 more subs, and then multiple sub optimizaiton! (I have 2 of those subs, and yes, they hit 20hz easy in the right cabinet.)

@@fredygump5578 If I had the room it would be a wall of sound, lol. Really happy with this single cabinet. Placed well in the room it is more than adequate. I have a few more spare subs and the matched passive radiators for some future builds. I am always building new stuff... it's a sickness.

It shows for a couple seconds when the Artist is credited. Max Bhron, Redemption, I think it was.

Thanks for the input. When I get the 12 inch done, I'll include some REW measurements.

Yes, it is more musical than the 18. Lots of people agree with you.

I 100% agree.

I agree. It's a very musical sub. Thanks for the compliment.

It's true, the 10 inch does punch harder than the 18 inch until you down near the bottom of the human hearing range :).

@@righteousbuilds3576 yeah 100% the 18inch, would properly win in movies. and when you feel the it, sitting leaned back in the chair;-)

That would be very much appreciated. You can send them to righteousbuilds@gmail.com

That's a speaker power sp1-2400.