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Can a PC flight sim teach you how to fly? 

Modern Classic
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Welcome to part 2 of my now 2-part series on whether or not consumer flight sims can make for good training aids in real-world flight training. In my first video on the subject, I had had a total of 1 hour in real-world flight, and I used FSX as my primary point of comparison. At this point, I am an instrument-rated private pilot. (I made this video while I was waiting for my PPL checkride.) I've also primarily switched to X-Plane with Ortho4XP, and have an upgraded PC setup with dedicated controls and even VR to give sims the best chance at helping me with my training. In what ways are sims a good training aid, and in what ways are they just video games?
Apologies for the soft focus on me that starts about halfway through the video - I only noticed that after editing and exporting, and I've got to move on to other things at this point, so no time to reshoot it. Luckily you don't have to look at my mug all that often after that point in the video :)
One thing I didn't mention that I wish I had was force feedback. Back in the day, I had a Logitech Wingman Force 3D joystick, and it went a long way in simulating those physical forces that you just don't get in a sim. (My stick broke, or I'd still use it.) Yes, you can feel the air pushing back on your control inputs in a small plane. No, you can't in an A320, but nobody's learning to fly in an A320. Small planes generally have their flight controls connected directly to the flight control surfaces through pushrods or cables, so you do feel a lot through the hands in a light aircraft.

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29 июн 2019

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Комментарии : 699   
@ModernClassic
@ModernClassic 4 года назад
Hey, so here's an updated pinned comment based on what I'm seeing from some of the more recent comments. I should clarify that by "learning to fly", yes, I mean actually obtaining your first license - not just taking a discovery flight. A discovery flight is an introductory lesson - it's a fun ride designed to figure out if flying is really for you, and I recommend one for anybody who's interested in flying. But your chances of successfully completing one are not affected one bit by whether you've simmed or not, and frankly, you won't know much more in terms of really knowing how to fly after completing one than you will beforehand. Your instructor is there to ensure you're not going to put the plane into the ground or another plane in any situation that might come up - they won't be once you've got a license. Really learning to fly is about learning to fly *safely* on your own or with passengers. As I say in the video, we all pretty much understand the very basics of how flight works, but the 35 or so lessons you'll take before your PPL checkride exist to teach you how to fly without killing yourself or anyone else, which is a real and constant danger in GA flight. (Airline flight is very safe; general aviation is no safer than driving a car, and trust me, there are idiots in the sky just like there are idiots on the road.) Your PPL checkride is a combination of ensuring you know how to fly safely, know all the pertinent regulations, know all you need to know about how weather works and how to interpret aviation weather products, and are able to complete certain maneuvers in real-world weather to very specific tolerances. Can sims help with any of that? Well... that's what this video's about.
@marknovak9310
@marknovak9310 4 года назад
I have flown for a couple decades and I think the SIM is a great way to stay proficient in both VFR to IFR. Sure it is not like the real thing, but considering that much of flying is in your head and being prepared---SIM flying does a very good job of keeping your mind sharp. I would say that if you flew a SIM while training to fly in the real world---you would say time and money and be a better pilot when it was all said and done. And did you mention avionics in the cockpit? There are several packages (like the Garmin 1000 or 500 or 430 or 650, etc.) where learning to train with a SIM is way cheaper and quicker than trying to learn in the real plane (not optimal when you are suppose to keep your eyes open outside the cockpit and not in it). Thanks for the video.
@Shamdouh1
@Shamdouh1 4 года назад
Modern Classic wow, you just exoressed all my thoughts, I was a simmer for the last 20 years, and now started my PPL and gone through all this lol
@RowanMorrell
@RowanMorrell 4 года назад
I did a discovery flight (my local aero club called it a trial flight) last Saturday after simming for about 4 1/2 years. Before the flight, the chief instructor gave me a briefing, and because of my experience with flight sims (not to mention reading articles and watching videos related to aviation), I knew a fair bit - he joked I should be briefing him! I still made sure to listen very carefully to everything he said. Another moment where I felt my flight simming experience helped me was during takeoff - when the instructor told me to rotate, I only applied a small amount of back pressure, because from flying light aircraft in FSX, Prepar3D and X-Plane, I knew that the plane (a Piper Tomahawk, incidentally) would lift off very easily once at the right speed. While in flight, I certainly felt the effects of turbulence etc., which is something flight sims can't imitate. But that wasn't too much of a shock for me, because the sensations are fairly similar to experiencing turbulence as a passenger on an airliner. When I had control of the aircraft, it seemed to need a lot of constant gentle correction, but I didn't find this hugely different to the way similar planes behave in flight sims. One thing I was guilty of was looking a bit much at the instruments (when I had the controls) and not enough outside. That is probably one bad habit flight simming teaches you (particularly for VFR flying, although it's maybe a good thing for IFR flight further down the line). If I do progress further into real flying, I will definitely use my home flight simulators to practise things I learn. They can help you with certain things and teach you a lot, but as you say, they have their limitations as well. I guess as long as you utilise their strengths and be aware of their limitations, they can be a real benefit.
@handsomechocolatebar276
@handsomechocolatebar276 4 года назад
Vatsim ATC go through extensive training. There are too many pilots to train, so the can't. That is obvious. Although, the ATC can be trained and are. If you want to learn more, look up how to become an Air Traffic Controller on VATSIM. Many people dive into the process. As far as I see it, they do a good job. You should try out VATSIM, it is completely free so I don't see why not.
@Bigpopp1
@Bigpopp1 4 года назад
what apps did you have on your ipads?
@Ricovandijk
@Ricovandijk 4 года назад
I learned myself to fly with a PC flight simulator (FS5 and up) I used a PPL theory book and practiced all the maneuvers and theories in the simulator. In flight school I never needed an extra lesson and I passed all exams in the minimum available time. Now I fly the 737-NG for a major airline. I still use these sims to practice for my bi-annual checks. In the end, my joystick and flight sim PC came out to be my best investment ever. So thank you MS-flights and X-Plane! For making my dreams come true!
@gstylez0107
@gstylez0107 4 года назад
Dude, that's awesome. Good on you man!
@simonjohnson6763
@simonjohnson6763 3 года назад
This is insane
@DonMrLenny
@DonMrLenny 3 года назад
You have no idea how much i searched that kind of comment
@lukeolender711
@lukeolender711 2 года назад
That’s awesome, very motivating. Out of curiosity, what theory book did you read? I want to take try to get my PPL next year when I’ll be 17. Right now I just have a simple setup with X-Plane 11 and a joystick, but I think it should be enough to learn the basics of flying. So, what book do you recommend to learn more about flying airplanes?
@jamesortega8681
@jamesortega8681 2 года назад
BRO PUT UP A FLIGHT SCHOOL WHERE YOU CAN TELL STUDENTS TO MASTER XPLANE OR MICROSOFT SIM AND AFTER THEY MASTER IT JUST ASK THEM TO COME OVER TO THE HANGAR AND JUST CHARGE THEM FOR THE RENTAL OF THE PLANE AND PILOT TEACHER FOR REAL LIFE TRAINING. THAT SHOULD REDUCE THE COST AND TIME FOR THE STUDENTS
@fastica
@fastica 5 лет назад
When I started flying lessons in 2003, I already knew the function of all instruments. The only thing that flight sims lack is the "feel" of the real airplane.
@paulrichards2365
@paulrichards2365 4 года назад
Right. FSX helps a lot, but doesn't 'really' teach you to fly. It taught me enough to be classed as an 'Advanced Student' when I did learn to fly. I found FSX harder to fly than real planes, mainly the visual and feel feedback.
@genec9560
@genec9560 4 года назад
Helps you gets you license, quickly. Sure, if getting if fast is your goal. What if you have your certs already. I'd like to now how many pilots still use a sim after they gain their desired certs, and why.
@PurdueJHanna
@PurdueJHanna 5 лет назад
When I was going through pilot training I modeled my local airport and imported it into Fly! I'd spend an hour or so every evening simulating pattern work and shooting landings. I soloed at 10 hrs and took my check-ride at 42 hrs. Both my instructor and the flying school owner attributed my lower than average hrs before being cleared for both events to my simulator time. Yes, the feeling isn't there, you can get a simulated plane outside the envelope of it's real-world analogue easily, and (unless you're willing to spend big $$$) the control layout and feel is different. But, for getting down the intangibles like cockpit management, visually referencing your height over the runway by the orientation of the runway in your view, dealing with ATC, etc...these skills can be enhanced with sims.
@RyanLoveMegenNicole
@RyanLoveMegenNicole 5 лет назад
Hey mate, did you use Ortho4XP to model the scenery around your local Airport?
@PurdueJHanna
@PurdueJHanna 5 лет назад
@@RyanLoveMegenNicole Nope. I've never heard of that program. I'm pretty sure it didn't exist two decades ago. It also appears to be only for X-Plane, which isn't the simulator I used.
@redleader
@redleader 4 года назад
WELL just to be fair and balanced...in 1988 i did my solo in 10.2 hrs and checkride (PPL) in 44.2 hours. AND never touched a computer. We didnt even have computers then. So...just sayin before anyone goes out and drops 2000$ on sim stuff....you could use that money for 12 hrs of dual instruction in an airplane.
@genec9560
@genec9560 4 года назад
@@redleader I'm debating spending $$ on a sim. I'm 53. My goals are to become a CFI, and retire from my current career (software security), and teach aviation. I need lots of hours. I have 50 logged and will get my my PPL soon, but I'll then need ~200 more. Some of that will be obtained getting more certificates, add-ons and endorsements. I'm not sure spending money on a sim will help me reach my goal. I have no desire to fly a sim as a game.
@SnakeGuyJohnny
@SnakeGuyJohnny 5 лет назад
It's 2019, almost 2020. Why does ATC still sound like ordering from McDonald's drive thru in 1983?
@ModernClassic
@ModernClassic 5 лет назад
It doesn't in real life, at least not in the headset I have. X-Plane voices are super clear, although not realistic in any other way. Hopefully the new MSFS finally gets things right.
@patrickmaartense7772
@patrickmaartense7772 5 лет назад
if you mean Real life ATC, that is because of the way the radio works , its still analogue on a rather old technology with a lot of background noise from both sides.
@mynameisray
@mynameisray 5 лет назад
Because X Plane is complete dumpster fire ripoff of Flight Sim. Microsoft did everything right, these guys did everything wrong and just stole assets from Flight Sim. Wait for the 2020 Microsoft Flight Sim, should have some fantastic ATC, actual traffic, everything X Plane never had without mods or that they couldn't rip off.
@patrickmaartense7772
@patrickmaartense7772 5 лет назад
@@mynameisray yeah sure, that's why MS completely sued laminar research. Dude X plane was developed for MAC in the beginning ,clearly you have no clue what you are speaking about. It was also developed from scratch with a complete different mindset for flight dynamics. But i'm sure you have used the early version of both products and are an experience pilot with many hours under your belt. probably even an airline pilot or fighter pilot. duh...
@norbert1636
@norbert1636 5 лет назад
this is VHF radio, one at a time, often inaudible but because of a speed and distance these are freqs fit to communicate, it takes time and practice to be able to understand, when working at BHX it took me a month or so to 'learn' understanding comms on 109-120 MHz (aviation as marines use different freqs of VHF radios)
@TheAirplaneDriver
@TheAirplaneDriver 5 лет назад
I am a CFI and have to say that you absolutely nailed the benefits of a PC based flight sims as well as their inadequacies. They are great for IFR training, learning basic flight procedures, acclimation to systems and flight controls, use of checklists, landing pattern setup, go-around procedures, emergency operations, etc. All aspiring pilots and instrument students should have access to as good a flight sim system as their budget will allow. ESPECIALLY instrument students. I can always tell when a ‘0’ time primary student comes my way that has had access to a PC sim. They get in the groove MUCH faster than someone that never flown a sim. However, for realistic “stick and rudder” training....they fall way short. I have not seen any PC based system properly emulate stalls, spins, cross wind (re: cross control) landings or takeoffs or even realistic taxi operations. Tailwheel simulation on any of these platforms is a total joke which is too bad. Hopefully, someone, someday, will develop a PC program that faithfully replicates actual aircraft performance. Anyway, great video. Not sure where you are with your training, but good luck to you,
@stephenzenerak7846
@stephenzenerak7846 5 лет назад
18:06 I think the opposite of Captain Sully would be Captain Silly.
@Som3D
@Som3D 5 лет назад
Captain suuuuuuuuck! LMAO
@JamesW81
@JamesW81 5 лет назад
I really thought he was gonna go for captain sucky
@StefBelgium
@StefBelgium 4 года назад
I agree I thought he would have said that since that s the first stuff that came to my mind 😁😆
@miporsche
@miporsche 4 года назад
Yes! Or "Captain Sh!tty"
@pkaser
@pkaser 5 лет назад
I learned how to fly helicopters in VR and 6 months later I'm a legit helicopter pilot. I was hovering in 1.8.
@SkippyOnMeBalls
@SkippyOnMeBalls 4 года назад
is it that easy to learn to be an actual pilot?
@pkaser
@pkaser 4 года назад
@@SkippyOnMeBalls It can be if you practice. I was already a fixed wing pilot, so mine was just an add-on. Learning to hover is the hardest part, and practicing in VR makes it way easier, more accessible, safer, and cheaper.
@Henriburger1
@Henriburger1 4 года назад
What game did you use?
@FirstnameLastName-mr8lk
@FirstnameLastName-mr8lk 4 года назад
@@pkaser what sim did you use?
@maximusextreme3725
@maximusextreme3725 2 года назад
@@FirstnameLastName-mr8lk He never responded so you know he's full of 💩
@daveslow84
@daveslow84 4 года назад
Years of geeky flight simming has definitely helped me, my instructors did mention how quickly I was learning BUT I must say that when flying in the real world you use your whole body to feel the aircraft so much more than I would have thought! As a flight simmer I also have to learn to look outside of the aircraft as I seem to focus on the cockpit too much and look ahead instead of all around me... but used correctly it is a great training aid! Edit: great video btw!
@hawkeye454
@hawkeye454 5 лет назад
Good to see you back sir! Always looking forward to seeing your videos.
@johnvybiral4896
@johnvybiral4896 5 лет назад
Outstanding, Sir! Extremely helpful to me personally, as a real-life Diamond DA20 pilot since 2005, and as a DA20 flight simmer since 2006.Thank you so much!
@aleksandrnestrato
@aleksandrnestrato 5 лет назад
Wow! Thank you, sir! That's a very thorough job you've done.
@Tom-kt8lu
@Tom-kt8lu 5 лет назад
The flightsimmers' pecking order: 1. Military pilots who also sim; 2. Airline pilots who also sim; 3. Former military and airline pilots who sim; 4. GA pilots who also sim; 5. Simmers who own a plane; 6. Former GA pilots who sim; 7. Simmers who have a PPL; 8. Simmers who used to have a PPL; 9. Student pilots who sim on the side; 10. Simmers who have become student pilots; 11. Simmers who have taken a discovery flight; 12. The rest of us.
@thesteaksaignant
@thesteaksaignant 5 лет назад
Great comment ! I must be 9.5 as a former student pilot who couldn't afford it anymore and switched to sim
@marchovens
@marchovens 4 года назад
13, aircraft mechanics who also want to fly what they work on
@hotcakesism
@hotcakesism 4 года назад
@@marchovens that's gotta be higher than 9 at least though
@lachlan0982
@lachlan0982 4 года назад
12
@BlackFoxFalcon
@BlackFoxFalcon 4 года назад
@@marchovens If you`re an A&P mechanic, I consider those folks pretty high up. Without them, nothing would fly at all. So, more like 5 or 4.
@StephenWoodOriginal
@StephenWoodOriginal 5 лет назад
A reasonable compromise between full VR and static is to use TrackIR. Having just got my PPL I agree with all your other points. For VFR the Orbx scenery is worth a look (at least in the UK).
@rob1964green
@rob1964green 4 года назад
Thank you for a most informative video. Rarely do we see flight sym vs actual flying, well paced, no showboating, clear, precise point of view. excellent.
@thatoldbob7956
@thatoldbob7956 4 года назад
I’ve got my Privat pilot permit in 1970 on a 150. My first solo was in the biggest turbulence and they changed runway on me. I was too high, did a go around and landed fine. We had to do spins too. I learned to fly because I was afraid of flying. Rented 172s for about 18 years, stopped because it was too boring. Communication was the hardest. Bought a radio and listen to it for weeks, especially cause English is not my mother tongue. Good show, you are 110% right.
@alcamerc9970
@alcamerc9970 4 года назад
WOW! What a great video. Informative and to the point. It sets my mind in a different direction. Flying may require a lot more time to master to where you can enjoy it than I had anticipated. It also shows a good comparison between sim and real life flying. Thanks.
@waltdog123
@waltdog123 4 года назад
I certainly found Sims helpful in my Inst training. Really helped my instrument scan while flying approaches.
@birreboi
@birreboi 4 года назад
Personally, I do think that home flight sims REALLY do teach you a lot for real world flying. I played around with flight sims for many, many years. One day, whilst visiting a Sunday market at a local airport, I saw a Flight School and thought, what the hell, lets have a look. To try and cut a long story short, I did a trial flight, then started taking lessons. My instructor was impressed about how I knew all the instruments, how fast a trainer plane (Piper Tomahawk in my case) descended and etc, etc. I did my solo at 20 hours, at the time, that was pretty darn good! There is no doubt in my mind, flight sims greatly helped me. I reckon it shaved off a couple of thousand dollars off flying lessons. Must admit though, after flying the real thing, flight sims have lost my interest. As good as they are, general home flight sims just cannot cannot fully simulate a real aircraft. But certainly go for them if you love the thought of flying and maybe one day do the real stuff.
@14rans
@14rans 5 лет назад
Great work (as always) love it! Keep them coming
@plannedobsolescence6486
@plannedobsolescence6486 5 лет назад
Did not expect to see a new video from you today when I was browsing the 'tube. So stoked. Welcome back.
@carlosc3768
@carlosc3768 5 лет назад
Great video. I thought you explained very well what one of this home simulators can and can not do for you. Thank you.
@davee8659
@davee8659 4 года назад
Well thought out and articulated. Many thanks for putting this together. As a lapsed pilot, it's been something of a burning question for me lately though I've probably reached a very similar set of conclusions. Cheers and thank you from Sydney, Aust - Dave
@mdrobc13
@mdrobc13 4 года назад
Just finished my PPL last July and have. been an avid Flight Simmer since HS and must say that it does help. I used Xplane 11 throughout my training and ended up finishing up my check ride and FAA PPL in about 55 hrs total and my sim helped alot of those. My CFI even noted that I was much better prepared in the aircraft during lessons and also my solo and especially cross country portions were very painless and quickly done. That was because I used my sim for checklist items (engine start, run-up procedures, etc) but also flew each and every cross country at least 2-3 times before we actually did it on Xplane first. Often flew actual flights we had just flown again afterwards on Xplane as well. In that way I was much better prepared on what I would see and where things should be from an orientation standpoint when in the real plane. Helped my comfort level especially when I was on those solo flights as I had the confidence as I'd done it before. Agree doesn't help for weather and wind and other forces of flight nor ATC interactions mostly but can make timing and reflexes and the mental aspects of flying a lot better and less familiar.
@s9360321
@s9360321 5 лет назад
I am a real life airline pilot, I can tell you that even those Full Flight Level-D simulators we did our training in are not fully real. The control feel, the flight dynamics are about 85~90% close to a real airliner. I have both Boeing and Airbus ratings, if we only talk about the "flying" part of the simulator, they can only give you a general idea of what the plane will feel like. It will always be easier to fly a real aircraft. Every six months, we need to go back to simulator to do our recurrent training / check. All of us can immediately feel the difference of the real from the FFS Level-D sims.
@andredarin8966
@andredarin8966 4 года назад
s9360321: I flew heaters for the Air Force for 10 years and have been flying for an airline since the late 90's. I agree with everything you say. Even Cat D sims have issues such as "training transfer" both positive and negative. I believe it was negative training transfer that was a causative factor in catastrophic mishap of AA 587 shortly after 9/11. In addition to other problems add poor motion cueing to the list and, at least to me, the obvious lack of pilot motivation during the awareness or threat of danger. The perception of danger and commensurate stress levels are often markedly reduced and pilots frequently make decisions, i.e., continuing an unstable approach when, if shooting an approach, they would elect a go around. I can almost always I.D. a guy who spends a lot of time in home sims. They have a tendency to have their eyes locked onto the instrument panel even in CAVU conditions, rather than outside the aircraft. I'm not knocking these "sims", they do have their advantages, but things can go south pretty quick in even a C-172 and there's no way you can build in a high pucker factor when you're sitting in front of a desktop and even if you wind up in a smoking hole you can walk away, perhaps wiser, but in no way knowing how you would handle a real mishap if airborne.
@genec9560
@genec9560 4 года назад
@@andredarin8966 I'm a student pilot, with no sim experience, for what that's worth. Perhaps the sims should focus only on what they are good at, and not try to be what they aren't good at.
@Verasterr
@Verasterr 4 года назад
Is it really easier flying a Boeing in real life? I would think it would be more difficult than the sim.
@captsonko.9345
@captsonko.9345 2 года назад
@@Verasterr its easier than its flight sim plane
@scottcampbell7249
@scottcampbell7249 4 года назад
Really appreciate this video, very in depth and the message is conveyed well!
@accutronitisthe2nd95
@accutronitisthe2nd95 5 лет назад
Good video, I've been In and around general aviation most of my life and your video is accurate and is realistic about the PC vs real life...
@stevenm936
@stevenm936 5 лет назад
Student pilot, just rigged XP11 with yoke and rudder, in real life learning on Cessna 172 and also Diamond DA40. Your RU-vid is appropriate and well-timed to my circumstances. Really appreciate your insight! Was about to subscribe to PilotEdge, didn't anticipate one could end up with grumpy ATC on the other end! Will look into Ortho4XP. Also will be more realistic about how much (or little) my XP11 setup will help me with my training. I like your presentation. Most others on RU-vid just rant without a prepared script, yours is well thought out and well presented, clear, and well edited.
@JMX246
@JMX246 4 года назад
Enjoyed the vid - lots of good points and ideas - I did a lot of simming in general aviation planes (from the Sublogic days to present) well before training and did my PPL in the minimum amount of time required
@bravoone17
@bravoone17 5 лет назад
Excellent perspective (Best I seen) between flt Sim and reality on many levels. I started with Sub-logic in the 80's now running MFSX . When I was younger I thought I would like to get a private pilot licence but I never got to do it even though I enjoy my flight sim's. Thanks for this enlightenment video.
@hugo-kikecastillomyfavorit7548
I learned a lot about flying from my sims! Good video!
@SunsetRider1337
@SunsetRider1337 5 лет назад
I agree on most of the points. For me the native VR was a huge change for more realistic experience using photorealistic sceneries and 'study level' aircrafts. VR improves massively your situational awareness making landings easier. The sight of the runway coming out of the haze feels just like irl. Of course touch gloves or similar things would still improve the experience in the future. What I'm trying to say is that VR simulates the flight environment in 3 dimensional space the real way which a flat screen can't do.
@brycedenning130
@brycedenning130 5 лет назад
I’ve done some turns around a point over that fountain. It’s impressive!
@adb012
@adb012 5 лет назад
I think that PC flight sims does help with stick and rudder too. No simulated plane is a very realistic model of it's real counterpart, true (and mainly because the unrealistic feel of the joystick or yoke compared to the real life ones), but the general response of the plane to control inputs is correct, because the sim is just solving the physical equations of flight mechanics that the real planes fly on. So you can learn how power + pitch = performance, how throttle controls altitude and elevator controls speed, how you need MORE power to fly slower (and for example keep the approach path) below best-glide speed, how to crab to correct for crosswind and maintain the plane trajectory aligned with the runway, how you need to pull up to keep the nose from going down in a turn, and how a stall happens at a faster speed when you do that, just to mention a few. It will not FEEL the same when you get to the real plane, but you will experience the same phenomena and you need to do basically the same things with the controls to account for them. So even if you practice SERIOUSLY in a simulated Cessna 172 and then go and flight the real Cessna 172, it will not feel like you are flying the same plane, but you will feel like you are flying a plane! More or less like if you were transitioning from a different type. (except of course for the physical sensations of accelerations and rotations that cannot be simulated, not even (fully) in a real-iron Level D 6-axis-of-motion airliner simulator).
@JillesvanGurp
@JillesvanGurp 4 года назад
This is a valid point. I watch a lot of RU-vid pilots fly different types of planes. I was struggling with the Stinson L5 tail dragger in x-plane and by watching how real pilots fly real tail draggers was able to figure out what I was doing wrong and understand why I ended up doing ground loops and correct it. Now I can take off and land the thing without issues. With taildraggers, I was also running in some edge cases with x-plane where the sim just isn't realistic. Austin Meyer has recently been talking up some flightmodel changes that should help for the upcoming 11.40. So, it's not perfect but in general you can indeed use a sim to learn such things as stabilizing an approach, nailing your speeds, and correcting for crosswinds. All of these things are practiced a lot during real training. Another point to make is that x-plane is actually used for commercial flight sims as well. The difference between the home version and the commercial version is a lot of equipment and a usb key that locks down the configuration. But it's the same software and it's being used to train pilots who can log hours on these things. It's realistic enough for the FAA. A final point to make is that most commercial pilots don't actually hand fly most of the time. If you fly an airliner, the auto pilot goes on right after takeoff and does not come off until the plane is lining up to land. All the rest is button fiddling, checklist checking, procedure following, etc. All of which you can simulate and learn at home.
@46monkeyes
@46monkeyes 4 года назад
Excellent presentation and explanation of your feedback. I just subscribed. Thanks! ✈️✈️✈️
@synthoelectro
@synthoelectro 4 года назад
Imagine how much more real MSFS 2020 is going to be, compared to the past.
@DonMrLenny
@DonMrLenny 3 года назад
True,but still pretty buggy tough
@blaser8042
@blaser8042 5 лет назад
Hi Jason - I have to say this is an exceptionally well-done video. Most pilots await a truly high-resolution sim that could help us maintain proficiency in all facets of flying. Technology that most of us can afford just isnt there yet. Perhaps someday... Thanks for your comprehensive discussion!
@keyplayermark
@keyplayermark 5 лет назад
When I was learning to fly real aircraft, I would use Flight Sim prior to my flights to get a basic idea of the flight prior. I found Flight Sim to be a good supplemental tool for me. I had the opportunity to log quite a few hours in a C141 Full motion Simulator that was nighttime only. The instructor was quite surprised at how well I did. I think this was due to practicing instrument night flying with flight sim. Practicing engine outs and other scenarios in my opinion made me a better pilot.
@gerardmoran9560
@gerardmoran9560 5 лет назад
You lucky dog! Most of my time in the C-141 sim was for a checkride.
@paulphibbs5362
@paulphibbs5362 5 лет назад
I only saw your FSX video last night and was surprised to see the XPlane one today. I’ve used sims from the very early days and currently have FSX, P3d and XPlane 11. These sims are alll expanded with detailed scenery and photo realistic scenery. The planes I fly are only planes that model the systems accurately so I can fly them accordingly. When I was training for my PPL, my CFI was constantly singing my praises and promoting the simulator I use as evidence of the progress and skills I demonstrated in my lessons. I now fly VR in addition to non-VR flights. I agree with the resolution issues but with high end computers, you can achieve much better resolution and there are new headsets that are improving on the original Rift. On the second point you made, there are addons that allow you to use and call up charts - paper or live in the cockpit along with POH details, checklists etc. I appreciate simming has a way to go but it has come so far and who knows what’s around the corner. I agree you can learn bad habits. But if you decide to get serious and learn to fly correctly, the sim can be so much enjoyable and support your passion to fly. Thanks again for presenting this information to us in a well balanced manner. Regards, Paul
@bernarddugas5251
@bernarddugas5251 4 года назад
I’m a real pilot, and everything you said is true.
@fukimoto
@fukimoto 5 лет назад
Nice video. Good overview for people wondering what translates in the real world and what does not.
@adamlink2485
@adamlink2485 4 года назад
i am also new to xplane 11 and i am loving it the graphics so amazing on the airports and runways
@scottwatrous
@scottwatrous 4 года назад
This is a pretty good overview. One thing I will add though is that some speculation about Flight Sim 2020 is that it will be done via streaming from a central sever network, and so all of the fight dynamics and physics may well end up being computed remotely with your local client maybe not doing any calculations or rendering at all. Or it may be some sort of hybrid scenario where the server is telling your clinet machine what the advanced physics are while also streaming terrain data but letting your local machine do the graphical rendering and primary physics work. It's hard to say, but it does seem like it won't be long before everyone will be able to log in to access a flight sim with the same sort of computing power as any of the big professional sims. Also with things like Hololens (which is also an MS product) there's a real chance that we'll see augmented reality coming to the sim world. Build your 'cockpit' and see your hands using it in real time, but with the graphical overlay of what's missing still shown. That sort of setup will be the real killer combo for flight sim in the 2020's. By 2030 who even knows.
@azcountry6064
@azcountry6064 2 года назад
Very good job. You incorporated a good many pros and cons in a very objective manner.
@virtual812
@virtual812 5 лет назад
Loved the bad habit part about looking outside the aircraft. Something worth trying if you can get a loan unit is TrackIR It's a compromise with a lot less of the issues of VR. If you ever do try it it is essential that Track IR is *DISABLED* in XP11, install X-Camera and use TrackIR via that instead. Default XP11 TrackIR is horrible. It's great to be able to look for traffic on final before taking the runway with just a simple thought and turn of the head.
@stevengarner4596
@stevengarner4596 5 лет назад
Thank you for this video. It actually got me thinking quite a bit about the issue and how it has helped or hindered my own training. I'm training in a 172 and my sim is set up with X-Plane, Samsung WMR, rudder pedals and a CH yoke. Honestly, after having VR I can't really go back to the monitor stuff although I very much appreciate your comments about not being able to see physical things around you (controls, tablets, etc.). As you note, the virtual controls and tablets can be a bit hard to use in VR and the image isn't as sharp as I'd like it to be (however, based on what I've heard from others, my setup seems much better than Oculus) but the immersive experience makes up for the shortfalls in my opinion. I think the usefulness of the sim for training depends on what you are using it for. Does flying the sim make it easier for you to jump in the plane and pick things up more quickly? That's a hard thing to quantify. You'd have to know how you would have picked things up if you didn't do the sim which is impossible. I felt that it might have helped a little but I also felt totally lost at times in the real plane. I often felt I was learning all this stuff all over again. Where I'm finding the sim really helping is practice after I've learned something. I find it especially useful for practicing stalls, spins, spirals and side-slips to re-enforce the muscle memory. The key is, I'm using it after I've learned something in the real plane. Practicing before just builds bad habits. I found I've had to unlearn many things that I was doing in the sim (I still forget carb heat because my sim plane doesn't have that and P-factor is poorly modelled in the sim so I have to really think about using the rudder). If you have a reference to work from (the real world) then the sim becomes a great tool for practice. I really see the potential for the sim in instrument training and this has been confirmed from other pilots I have talked to. Usually, when you talk to a pilot and ask them about sims the first thing they will tell you is it's great for instrument training practice. Again, it's using it to keep up skills you have already learned. Not the other way around. In the end, everyone learns differently. I'm a deep learner. That is, I need to know how everything is working to have it sink in. The sim has really helped in that regard. I can try different things in the sim that I wouldn't normally do in real life and see what happens. Most of the time it helps reinforce the fact that the plane isn't going to drop out of the sky and that a Cessna 172 will probably know a lot more about flying than I ever will.
@aaabbb-py5xd
@aaabbb-py5xd 2 года назад
What is your VR setup that is better than Oculus?
@fplbighead1352
@fplbighead1352 Год назад
Dude, I usually bypass long comments like yours but I am glad I took the time to read yours. I am building my home setup with an HP VR headset but I am going to wait on learning certain things until after my real life pilot training in a couple of weeks. Thanks for sharing.
@gemster18
@gemster18 5 лет назад
Great job with the video my friend I only found one issue with this entire video.... Your a Met Fan!!!! Lmao... of course I live in New York and I'm a New York Yankees fan. And I love X-Plane 11, however I've been in FSX user for many many years. Once again great job my friend.
@ModernClassic
@ModernClassic 5 лет назад
Hey, so just like my earlier video on flight sims, this one seems to have struck a chord! That's good! I welcome all constructive comments - as you know if you watch the video, I took many suggestions from commenters on that earlier video and incorporated them into this one. All I really ask, though, is that you actually watch the video before commenting on it. That's only polite, and just good RU-vid etiquette. I've seen quite a few comments so far where it's obvious the commenter has not even watched the intro, let alone the whole video, and just a word of warning that those comments will be deleted and/or hidden from public view. Thanks!
@nicholas1460
@nicholas1460 5 лет назад
Thanks, always wondered about this subject.
@Assassin1959
@Assassin1959 5 лет назад
Great video !!! In my opinion I think you're correct on all your points. To me the most difficult thing in flying is talking and understanding ATC. Talking, flying, understanding what ATC wants you to do is what's going to get you in trouble in real life if is not done right. I hated every time I had to ask ATC to repeat last transmission. Flightsims can teach you a lot of good stuff, but ATC "crap" is not one of them. Again, awesome video!!!!
@GunniesLetsFlyVFR
@GunniesLetsFlyVFR 5 лет назад
Really great point of view. Balanced and from pilot and sim point of view. As a fellow youtuber and low hour LSA pilot i agree with everything you said. :) Often the criticism comes from those experts that have never flown at all. Thanks for the video. Subbed ;)
@T-Tailer
@T-Tailer 4 года назад
Very well said, completely agree, especially with the point about all the forces in play, I’ve been saying that for a while now.
@pulit2000
@pulit2000 5 лет назад
For VR users I highly recommend voiceattack. Its a cheep game saver. I’ve been using it on X-Plane and dcs. Works amazing for comms commands.
@robertvozd
@robertvozd 4 года назад
I got my PPL a few years back. While taking flight lessons I did lots of sim time at home including ATC. It definitely helped me with procedures, navigation, instruments and G1000 operations. Of course, real flying has a different feel to it, and you can't learn to land in heavy crosswind on sim. But it definitely helps a lot!
@Turnbull50
@Turnbull50 5 лет назад
Really interesting video. Great explanations.
@LTFIRE64
@LTFIRE64 5 лет назад
Great Video, really enjoyed that thanks!
@Mucologist
@Mucologist 4 года назад
Excellent and fair discussion. You pretty much nailed it.
@airplaneian
@airplaneian 5 лет назад
re: pilotedge, my 2c, ff PE controllers didn't act like they expected you to be a pro, there wouldn't be much training value in the service similar thing about the airports covered, the goal is for you to learn the system not memorize the procedures at a single airport... you want to build your skills in a complex and potentially unfamiliar environment so you can apply them anywhere you fly in the US definitely not for everyone though... great video, thanks for sharing!
@thegeek3348
@thegeek3348 5 лет назад
I had a controller yelling at me on pilotedge. It was also really obnoxious to fly multiple states and have the same controller for ever tower. I'd never use it again. I got more out of just listening to Live ATC.
@linka1886
@linka1886 4 года назад
the geek that’s an interesting comment
@eddiedepool733
@eddiedepool733 3 года назад
This was very informative. Thank you :)
@pfv3462
@pfv3462 3 года назад
i have been taught in a combat tank simulator, and had learned all the procedures and operation of the buttons! in any case, you're not going to practice with a multi-million dollar vehicle, afterwards there is also a training tank with double control. But the knowledge in flying with these flight sims has proved its worth in many emergency situations when the pilot suddenly became very ill! even though they were helped through the traffic control!
@huascarlopez5821
@huascarlopez5821 4 года назад
Very well said, Mr. Captain. I am a fly sim enthusiast myself and I must say that in my personal experience with other sim enthusiasts is that they truly think of themselves as pilots and are very quick to point out any procedure errors you make. They live in a world of fantasy. While some elements of flight simulation can help you in gaining familiarity with real flying, it’s not even close. They need to get over the fact that they are not pilots!
@TheRealDasluft
@TheRealDasluft 4 года назад
Awesome commentary. Also spot on pros and cons
@JasonBlack66
@JasonBlack66 4 года назад
I think if you spend enough time on it, have a genuine interest in flight dynamics and meteorology you can almost certainly get a head start over a student who had never touched a sim. I already knew about most if not all controls for example before my first ever flight training. Unfortunately I could not afford to go much further past a student permit, but I did join a sail plane club and got a few hours flying Sailplanes/Gliders. So i think Sims are great for having fun and learning some stuff.
@da8675
@da8675 2 года назад
Awesome amount of information thank you
@2011joser
@2011joser 5 лет назад
Welcome back!
@RM-my9dn
@RM-my9dn 5 лет назад
VERY good video! I learned a lot!
@johnm2579
@johnm2579 2 года назад
First. Good video! Great insight for someone with the new Intrest in flying!
@Ramp10er
@Ramp10er 4 года назад
I learn driving in a driving simulator 'Gran Turismo" and it gave me an idea how to do it correctly i real life. It made my senses a little bit sharper when it comes to maneuvering and using the brakes when in traffic. It made me a better gamer and a better driver...
@qpSubZeroqp
@qpSubZeroqp 4 года назад
Same here. I leaned about general car physics and how to remain calm during an emergency
@martinf5342
@martinf5342 5 лет назад
Noticed you have the DA40 set up there. Like you I have very few flight hours. Hoping to get back up there one day but finances unfortunately get in the way. I started in the 40 and went to 20 for cheaper lessons... still to expensive. Good video!
@jojojoman78
@jojojoman78 5 лет назад
It does certainly help :) i am a flight student and enthusiastic simmer :) even our teacher recommended it
@captsonko.9345
@captsonko.9345 2 года назад
Thats true.
@gerardmoran9560
@gerardmoran9560 5 лет назад
Your comments are well thought out and presented. I was glad to see your emphasis on procedures. You can learn a lot in a sim but some people develop some very bad habits. Most guys I know who play with sims fire up the engine, takeoff (sometimes on a taxiway) and find the nearest bridge to fly under. That's fine if you never plan on touching a real airplane but terrible if you do. The cockpit makes a poor teaching platform; study and prepare to make the most out of every hour of flight instruction. A minor correction about f/o's taxiing- most airliners aren't equipped with a nosewheel tiller on the right side. Happy landings
@GeorgeGoosen
@GeorgeGoosen 5 лет назад
Thanks for the video. For someone who has never flown or had a flight sim, do you know where i can get started to learn about flying on P3D?
@pocdabeno1974
@pocdabeno1974 5 лет назад
Very professional and informative video.
@aureliomarsili3902
@aureliomarsili3902 5 лет назад
Nice setup for flight sim !!!
@LeadNarrator
@LeadNarrator 5 лет назад
How did you go about getting your two smaller size screen to line up properly when running the sim in triple monitor mode? I always have alignment issues when dealing with different size screen in my triple monitor setup. Also, do you think your perception of how the sim "feels" would be different if in a motion simulator with Xplane? Even one of the smaller scale ones that you can buy for your home? Also, force feedback yokes/sticks.
@PTurbo86
@PTurbo86 4 года назад
Arizona guy, too? Nice video. Ortho4XP is an amazing program. I just completed the entire states of AZ, UT, CO, and CA. AZ is Home. KGEU by EZrhino is amazing, and look up Blu Arrow for a couple cool sceneries like Pleasant Valley south of Lake Pleasant. For about a year before I started learning to fly, flying with pedals in FS2004 and setting my tail draggers to 180 degree true castoring wheels taught me to use differential braking extremely well. In 2007 when learning to fly, My CFI and father were amazed as to how well I could taxi, takeoff and land the Cessna 120; as he said, like a pro or as well as he did. Never even came close to ground looping it.
@Tkamsker
@Tkamsker 4 года назад
Hi i do like to say i liked your video because i do exactly that when i did my CPL/IFR in real live i tried all to me avail sims to see how realistic they are. Flying Seneca in that time (later Navajo,C425 and DA42) compared how the single engine haptic does. so i choose XPLANE and used an Opencockipt setup for my training (steam gauge GNS 430 ) this saved me a lot of money i flow all that DME approaches, Holding s in crosswinds (where my girlfriend changes the settings while i fly) that works great and is an good tool. And i didn't try stalling but single engine stuff non flaps landing etc are realistic. Now i work on an G1000 setup just to save me money on the DA42 so for IFR practice i like and use that setup
@StefBelgium
@StefBelgium 4 года назад
I fully agree with you. Learn to fly is a large term. Stick and rudder can only be learnt in a real airplane. But when it comes to procedures, ATC with PilotEdge (for me that s the only viable option to get in ATC skills and training), instrument flying, building muscle memory (I have a full replicate C172 cockpit, you can check in my RU-vid channel), and train for emergencies...then flight sim whatever the version, is absolutely a nice way to remain proficient and gain confidence in the real cockpit. It helped me to get my PPL with lower amount of hours and even though I don t fly anymore since 2 years now, I m sure I won t be lost if I have to fly again tomorrow!
@lt4324
@lt4324 5 лет назад
For VR, maybe one day they will invent slip on gloves, this way you can actually use your HAND to touch everything in the cockpit and that will make VR complete IMO. Wonder if this is on the drawing board or in production somewhere. Great video! Thanks for the upload.
@jorgegofy
@jorgegofy 5 лет назад
Valve Index on Google.
@Vortigon
@Vortigon 5 лет назад
Yes several versions in the works
@modernmaster55
@modernmaster55 4 года назад
This already exists, without gloves.
@hicknopunk
@hicknopunk 5 лет назад
YES. I literally in middle school learned for 1 year to fly on Flight Simulator (90s). Then we moved on to flying, taking off, but not landing single engine planes. They are literally that easy if someone can help you find the non keyboard controlls. Now rules of air....no.
@bertoverweel6588
@bertoverweel6588 4 года назад
I started in 2006 with FS in a Cessna 172 on FSX , crast a lot but working up from single engine to two engine to jet flying online on IVAO and VATSIM , now flying PMDG 737.800 and 777 and Aerosoft A320 , it keeps the brain working being 66 years old.
@greglawrence8899
@greglawrence8899 3 года назад
Thank you, very thorough.
@chrisbowpiloto
@chrisbowpiloto 4 года назад
I am a commercial pilot who has also spent a good bit of time messing with simulators. I think you nailed it. I have seen people who used them well and flourished and people who used them poorly and actually were worse off for it. I used them in private training to help me to figure out the sight picture during maneuvers and during instrument training.
@ModernClassic
@ModernClassic 4 года назад
Thanks - I'm finishing up my instrument training right now and as I suspected, it's been useful to practice on the sim in this stage, especially when I have to go 7 or 8 days between flights and start forgetting things. I've used the sim to practice unpublished holds, arcs, and even full approaches. Of course ATC doesn't vector you realistically - it just sticks to whatever your flight plan is, and flight plans in X-Plane don't work right either - so I just do it without ATC. I'm still missing that element. But it has helped me remember my instrument procedures.
@Zany4God
@Zany4God 5 лет назад
I enjoyed your video. I got my ASEL ticket a long time ago but I haven't flown in a long time either. I'm not using any flight sim software right now or since MS Flight died. I liked MSFSX as well and have used just about every rendition of their flight sims up until then. Disappointing that they are gone. But I have a question for you. What sort of computing muscle do the drone pilots use in their military pilot training to fly drones? It would seem that our (MSFS, etc) flight sims might come close to the military versions, sort of... Those pilots are in unmoveable seats so they don't get all the bumps and dips that real aircraft pilots experience. Thanks for the good vid.
@roop298
@roop298 5 лет назад
I managed to land the E3c Sentry on Waddo's flight sim after flying MicroProse's F117 (actually I think it was TFX). OK, so half of it was on the grass but it was still pretty special. The other guys crashed after we asked them to program a hurricane into the sim.
@davidshahin9753
@davidshahin9753 7 месяцев назад
Absolutely, positively, definitely YES. I told my Aviator friends to invest in x-plane and fly it in the comfort of their living rooms, the ones wo listened are better pilots now. Do not underestimate the power of repetition!
@henryhbk
@henryhbk 4 года назад
I think it's great for practicing procedures. One key is to have a buddy there (another pilot) to act as a pseudo instructor. So you can plan an IFR flight, execute the plan, practicing diversion, and other problems. This works well since it's not stick-and-rudder where the small sim issues mess up the realism. If you plan your flight to Topeka and you end up at the runway in topeka you did it right (well other than wanting to go to topeka for some reason, I guess), so it's really good for those kinds of things. And particularly if you live somewhere where a lot of the year just isn't flyable, then this allows you to practice this stuff without paying for "real" sim time.
@SAL10101
@SAL10101 5 лет назад
Great video!
@Elios0000
@Elios0000 5 лет назад
using the Avitab plug in in VR you can have all the checklists and maps and charts you could ever want btw
@henrykater9728
@henrykater9728 4 года назад
Yes well said about the lack of turbulence modelling. It is rarely said on flightsim forum. I only have 10 hours on a cherokee but I used to add 20 kt variable winds with 60 kt gusts in FSX to try to simulate a pretty typical day around Bankstown Airport YSBK Sydney in a light aircraft. I remember on one flight being unable to maintain wings level, it was rocking 45 degrees a side like a little boat in high seas, and when I asked my instructor what level of turbulence this was (I was thinking High), he told me straight faced that it was a low level of turbulence that day. The only sims to do justice to crosswind landings was Aerofly FS1 and Flight Unlimited 3 from looking glass imo.
@henrykater9728
@henrykater9728 4 года назад
By the way FSX does manage to simulate well a real-world view which I will never forget. The view of the city of Sydney high rise CBD and the Pacific Ocean as a backdrop when at 1000 feet just to the North East of Runway 28R (the standard runway for GA training flights in and out of Bankstown for the wind in that direction). Try it - go to 28R YSBK and go to the right downwind leg 1000 ft. The landing pattern is pretty tight with 3 parallel runways. On high AI traffic settings it is interesting. You will be facing the ocean and the city - the real view is 1000x more impressive, but FSX does recreate it somewhat. The ocean can look like tropical Hawaii sometimes. Very beautiful on a clear day. Its a standard view for pilots at YSBK.
@patrickg875
@patrickg875 4 года назад
Great job in the explanation. - 747-400 FO Cargo-
@gordons.dempseyii1345
@gordons.dempseyii1345 4 года назад
Thank you for the information. Now I know what to tell my daughter when I give her a new flight simulator. She will be getting when I get off my deployment. I am going to get her the new one from MS. Less that I have to do to get her off the ground. I know that she can learn the basic stuff on it.
@lfox02
@lfox02 5 лет назад
"Well, they're in their seat, just not the right one" 😂
@FlightSim2703
@FlightSim2703 Год назад
Definitely it can, but it will help very much if the required gauges are in right locations , thanks for sharing 😊👍👍
@gobysky
@gobysky 4 года назад
I’m retired airline after 33 years in that environment. Soloed in 1967. Flown 75 different aircraft types. Just recently started flying x-plane and found it useful in route and airport familiarization. Really liked it for low weather conditions and instrument approaches into unfamiliar airports. You can even screw up on an instrument departure and fly into the side of a mountain without getting hurt. 😁 Good review by the way. I don’t use the ATC function of x-plane because it’s so unrealistic. If they talked that slow in the New York area, traffic would be flying into each other.
@dabneyoffermein595
@dabneyoffermein595 Год назад
Sounds horrible, great review. Your contributions to the aviation community are valued.
@RPSchonherr
@RPSchonherr 4 года назад
I can tell you that yes it can. In 2002 I was a student pilot and had FS 2002 and was able to set up an approach to my home airport and do it over and over again using pedals and yoke. I was able to grease landings after that. Sort of. Still took real world practice to get it down right but using the sim knocked off a bunch of time it took.
@JuliusG73
@JuliusG73 4 года назад
Starting to use REP for C172 in 11.40b2. It's really getting there insofar as the flight dynamics and mechanical failures are concerned. I was using Just Flight and NHAdrian's mod for C152 during my student days. They weren't too bad actually, but sideslips/fwd slips just couldn't be replicated. Stalls and stall recovery are getting more realistic.
@Lee-vo5xd
@Lee-vo5xd 2 года назад
Thanks for the video fantastic information. Just wonder how you linked your ipads many thanks...
@sergioorduz7280
@sergioorduz7280 4 года назад
I would like to ask about the Hardware you are using. Impressive to see two ipad! working with monitors, all together!! And software also. Please advise.
@Moosemanity
@Moosemanity 5 лет назад
Great informative video
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