Proxy carrier is a very niche build pvz. It should absolutely never be used vs a 2 base zerg, because they will just have too many queens. It's good vs 1 base hatch tech zerg that doesn't have super fast ravagers (in which case you don't have the spare money for stargate). The basic idea is that you defend with a low stalker count and a ton of static defense while beelining a carrier. Once the carrier is out, it's very important to move command it on top of the queens so they shoot the carrier instead of the interceptors, and then your 1 carrier will stabilize you. Zerg may be able to avoid dying with defensive queens and a spore or 2, but then your carrier count just keeps growing and trading well and you quickly snowball to a win. If zerg stalls long enough to get corruptors or has 2 hatch queen production, you're dead though. I think there are legitimate situations where proxy carrier is correct pvz, but I use it in a lot of situations where it isn't to learn more about the build, and because it's a fun meme. It's still under development, so forcing it in edge cases and novel scenarios is good for learning, if not for winning. Of the 3 games you tried it, the one in which it made the most sense was the 2nd game, but you went stargate a bit too quickly. Need to clear out the natural first, it's much easier to defend when the zerg doesn't have creep on top of your cannons. In general, a 3rd and maybe even a 4th stalker is good to be safe. You want a higher cannon to battery ratio, since you're cutting unit production and relying more on the cannons for dps. You can get a void ray sometimes to avoid dying vs zergs who cut queens to all in you with roach/ravager, but mostly you skip it to get your win condition faster. Since you're mostly cutting unit production, stalling indefinitely isn't viable, but you only need to stall long enough for the carrier, so getting it faster can be worth cutting the void ray. In the 2nd game though, a void ray would probably have been worth it, since the zerg was only showing one half dead queen, and you were still clearing the natural.
It would be awesome if you could coach Harstem on some cannon rushes and transitions and why you build certain things during the rushes so he can understand the reasoning behind the builds (essentially like this post but for a video or a video series), although I'm sure it might be hard to set up a time where your both free especially because of the time difference.
Good on Harstem for thinking better of responding to the troll. As Sun tsu once said, "when it comes to responding to trolls on the sc2 ladder, the best use of APM is not using it"
0:34 normal cannon rushes are followed up by voids because otherwise you kind of just die to roaches. but you also expand behind the cannon rush. If I recall, printf HATES expanding, he's all like "if I have to expand, then the rush failed"
I have won many games with this build, the trick is, you drop a maximum of 2 canons on your opponents side of the map - it will take him approximately 5 minutes to deal with the threat. In the meantime you build a Stargate and a fleet beacon at home whilst skipping all other unit production. Once you have 2 carriers out you slowly fly to your opponents base and seal in the victory. Yours truly, a bronze player.
The cannon cheeses really seem to be high risk strategies that also require great skill to succeed. And the games will be over usually fast. Makes for engaging games. That's some high Tier entertainment😄
then you're gonna love printF's channel. every saturday he streams. www.twitch.tv/quasarprintf He cannon rushes 100% in his 1v1 games, and no one does it better.
"How is it possible that I'm playing people that I haven't seen in my entire life ?" -- tell me you're a top tier GM without telling me you're a top tier GM
sometimes i been awake +14 hours and start watching harstem new video then the next thing i know 1 hour pass and im in bed watching another video and i dont even play starcraft.
Someone in this video feels extremely proud for being one of the 25 million people on this planet who can pronounce “Vincent van Gogh” correctly without incurring lasting throat damage in the process.
@Harstem about a month ago i was proxy tempest rushed. Me, a zerg spotted the stargate (not yet the fleet beacon) and he build cannons and batteries + tempests. I was completly thrown off and my defense prolly was more of a shitshow, tho i finally defended it but only because he executed it rlly bad. I was about to send Hamster the replay for the Harambo series but forgot :D tho do it with tempest vs Zerg and i promise you the zerg will hate you alot more than with carriers.
3 minute 26 second carrier. I remember some terran explaining to me how an 11 minute carrier was a rush lol. It's just that almost everything terrans say is completely wrong. I guess that's why harstem says they don't have an analytical brain.
He probably thought he was super behind because he went through a lack of a third and queen loss on top of seeing a carrier. Objectively he's fine, but psychologically the zerg feels miserable
Harstem really mismicroed the carriers in the last game :( the whole reason this is a build is because of the patch that target prioritizes the carrier rather than interceptor but harstem didnt take advantage of that and just lost all his intercetors right away
yeah terrans claim that carriers are good as an argument against terran being op. Carriers sometimes seem good because protoss gets way ahead before building them, and then has an unstoppable carrier fleet. This is due to eco though, and not the actual carrier unit, which is weak to almost everything that shoots air. I rate the carrier as probably C tier, useful for a specific purpose but not a good long term army unit. Actually I think void rays are better because they have a shot against BC, viking, liberator, corruptor, and do ok vs ground units in large numbers due to terrain inhibiting the ground units.
Is it just cannon-rushers-at-heart that go into protoss? Some of them evolve beyond that, but I find it interesting that Harstem claimed to be a big tower-rusher in warcraft 3. Is this the real reason they are worse players than zerg players? Zerg players are serious about being able to multi-task, as the zerg eco has a built-in multi-tasking requirement. If this scares you, you don't pick zerg. Zerg players are big-picture. They know that it's the hardest race to control, as they often have to control infestor-viper-queen-ravager against terrans that are using ghosts as the only active spellcaster, but if you can control it all, and keep on top of scouting while doing all that multi tasking, and fighting off terran drops, which are easier to execute than counter, I think it has the most potential.
