After watching this video, I feel really lucky. My high school gave me a great opportunity to go to a Cisco academy for free. I'm 16 and passed the CCNA 1 and working on CCNA 2 right now.
@Suffer No Fools oh no. I'm so sorry to hear that. A similar story happened to me. I was going to pay my parking ticket and then ten cops showed up and said they received a call of a thug in the building. Ended up shooting me in the leg and I used for 10 mil dollars. Only got 3 though 🤗
I second what chuck is saying. Nothing is going to move you forward faster, further, and cheaper, than a certification. Once you have the certification, then you need the interview, don't be afraid to be confident in your abilities once you get that CCNA. Use networking language in the interview, VLAN, STP, BGP, OSPF, area, AS number, ect. The school doesn't make the engineer, experience does.
So get your experience in school!!! You guys are really being one sided. YOU WILL LEARN IN SCHOOL! Probably more than what you will learn in the books. And even better than that you will have a shit ton of letters of recommendation options from prof, dept admin, people who are well respected in the IT community. School is powerful. Do the research there are Great programs out there!!! Be safe,be smart.
Hands on experience and labs help validate the IT certifications. I got that in college, not so much on my self study for IT certs. I had to pay for the IT training, so either way you may have to pay for the training experience.
❤. Touch and hold a clip to pin it. Unpinned clips will be deleted after 1 hour. 8:01 Touch and hold a clip to pin it. Unpinned clips will be deleted after 1 hour.Welcome to Gboard clipboard, any text you copy will be saved here@@deanokanome
Agreed, that would not be bad option. I think the cost would end up being significantly more than just going for your CCNA but, like you said, you would also have your associates. I still stand by the self-study CCNA path if you are wanting the most efficient path.
I agree with Jason, having a degree in cyber is much nicer than a proprietary certification. You have to keep in mind that Cisco isn't the end all be all in everything network related. Im finishing up a degree and we are already having weekly discussions about how Cisco hardware will be obsolete soon. Things are changing faster than any school or certification test can prepare you for, if you wanna "get gud" don't do it for money. Take HTML, take SQL, learn Python, learn Linux, anything grants or financial aid will let you put into your brain. Dont worry about the money it will come.
I started at Best Buy in 2008 selling computers. After a couple of months I moved over to the Geek Squad for the next year and a half. When I realized in 2010 I needed some movement in my career but couldn't land the job I wanted due to lack of experience, I joined the Army as a 25N (Nodal Network Operator/Maintainer... basically a tactical voice/data network admin). Last year (March 4, 2016) was my last day in the Army. With no degree and only a sec+ certification, I was able to land a job as a Unified Communications Technician (voice networking along with teleprescence and video teleconferencing) making $38 an hour in Colorado. After 7 months I was made the Senior Unified Communications Technician. I am currently working on my associates degree in networking on an online school and after that will be working for my CCNA. Currently my bosses boss has basically told me I am next in line to take the next open UC Engineer position. I can't express how much I agree with your assessment between college and certs. I am in school right now only so that I can knock it out before my GI Bill expires. Because I have the experience and the job already I feel it's safe to push the certs until after I finish my degree. If I didn't have the job already, I would 100% agree that the certification is the first one to go for.
That's awesome! You have come a long way! Yeah, you have to evaluate what will give you the most value in your current situation. I started on my degree thinking it would give me a leg up...but soon realized that it would offer little to no value on my career path. (And I also really don't plan on moving into management) But for you it obviously sounds like a degree is a great thing to attain right now.
I can't remember if he mentioned it in the video, but something else about a degree is that there are no "updates" to degrees. I'm 45 years old now. I got a degree in 1994. What in the world does that degree have to do with today's technology??? Almost ZERO! But if I have a certification that is up to date... well that is actually relevant in today's market.
Supply and demand. One person with 3 years experience, certifications, and a 4 year degree vs one with the same experience an certifications... who will get the interview? Assuming they are the only two candidates, maybe both depending on the HR filters. I have hired in to IT and can promise you with the amount of applicants, your name may not ever be read if you are not a match. However, now let’s say the person with no college is up against lots of others that have degrees? When searching for a job, notice that most have the degree listed as a requirement while the certification is listed as a nice to have / additional requirement? Stay competitive and get the degree and certifications. I’m not anti certifications but you also need to consider that they are limited time and there are renewal costs for most and that needs to be factored in. You best position will be one that does not limit opportunities.
Doesn't a degree show that you have the capabilities of technical learning (relevant to this topic) and that you have trained your brain to be capable of learning? Yes, certs update but can easily be certified in untrustworthy ways whereas a degree show capability.. I have both BSC and CCNA. It's not easy but in my opinion get both.
It's safe to say that we all made mistakes in the beginning of our IT career. Wasting time working in the help desk and not studying for a major certification. There's a lot of truth within this video. I have BS degree and it was very hard me to find a Network Engineer job until I got my CCNA. So I would say certification is the way to go if you want to advance your Career.
Martell Campbell of course you don't have any focused knowledge on that subject, if you major in comp science you could probably land a network job but definitely a sysadmin job. definitely sysadmin with the Linux and Windows experience you can get.
Yanglers Guys I am really confused here seeing as I got the opportunity do i go an get a degree in computer science or networking (I will definitely get a certificate for ccna). Also does cisco certified certificate expire seeing how technology always changes.
Martell Campbell Ive found that certs will get you that network engineer job but degrees will get you the management job and typically more money. My company won’t even consider you without a degree but that’s just my company. I personally believe you should only do college if you can go for a low cost. I basically went for free which is the only reason I have mines.
This knowledge from Chuck is underated. Not only is Chuck full of solid knowledge, he's a trainer on CBT Nuggets and I highly recommend following his Twitter account. The power comes from that awesome beard 👍🏼
When on my second year of CS, one of our professors approached me and a friend and asked us: why don’t you go for some CISCO certs while you’re studying so you can get a job faster? Bless him. ✌️
I had no IT background I fixed a VP from our company's display settings in the cafeteria and found myself on the help desk the following week thank God for Google and A+ literature.
By far the best option is to get a degree and certifications. Degree lays a foundation that lasts you a lifetime. Certificates just build on top of it and allow you to climb up the ladder. I deeply regret not getting a degree when I had the chance and I don't wish on anyone to end up like me. Get a degree, look out for internships while you're at it, get certificates along the way. That's the best way to get you far in life.
And the best part is the certification cost is included in the cost of tuition. So for those receiving a grant / scholarship can now knock out certs they might not have been able to pay for. WGU is really a neat idea. I was enrolled but work got to be too much for me. 1/3rd of my way done.
I really wish there were videos like this out there before I wasted a ton of money on a 4 year bachelors degree, thanks for this and I hope a lot of newbies find this video because everything you said was dead on! Oh and to be clear, if your going for a networking job, def go straight for your CCNA or CCNP over any sort of useless college courses!
Very true, and i'm glad there is someone out there who understands that you can go further with an AS w/ a CCNA, CCNP, CompTIA cert, etc.. than you would with just a Bachelors. I'm graduating next year with an AS in Science and have already been looking into certs, because they could still land you a job without having the degree first. I believe the "experience" is the thing a lot of people struggle with.
I'm so glad I found this channel and others like it. I was in the process of trying to enroll in school and after watching numerous videos, I feel like just avoided a huge mistake.
@@RoseMary-qd2ie I actually let mine lapse, couldn't find work in my area w/ a CCNA and CCNA Sec (prior to the changes). Learned to code, got a killer work from home gig.
I live in SLC area, know it's an online school, but didn't know much about it. Used to be very into computers and starting a little programming in Jr high and HS over 10+yrs ago now... So I am not in the know or up to date AT ALL. Would this program be good for me if I'm interested in getting a degree in IT now? I'm 28, is it too late since now it seems 12-13yr olds know more than me now....
Logan Flynn I was in the same boat as you. I just turned 30 after I started on my certification classes. 2 of my instructors said they started at 50 and 51. Both of them are instructors at my school for both, IT “programs” ,and also lead instructors that train Lockheed Martin and guys from Raytheon and Northrop Grumman. It seems like it’s a young mans game, but the past month of school has really taught me a lot, and especially, that it’s never too late for education in tech.
Having that many certifications just looks bad on your resume with no real world experience working in the IT field. You still have to go out get experience before you can become a Network Engineer or System Admin. You can move up quicker from self study and job shadowing the Network or system admin team.
@@eman0828 That is a nice theory. That is not correct. Those certifications actually get you past the HR first pass and give you the opportunity to be seen by the hiring managers. But you do you.
@@johnday4368 Many companies these days, they don't care what degree you are from, what college you are from and what your grades are. What they care about or the people they are looking for are enthusiastic, hardworking, creative people who are always curious in certain fields.
I did exactly that, I have not IT experience, degrees or experience but I still landed a job for IT service helpdesk through a friend. (Networking with real people is also REALLY important) and I'm just right now considering taking CCNA while gaining experience in the IT field. I'm turning 27 soon and its not too late guys. Let's get this bread.
How'd it go? Did you get your CCNA? I'm 34, fresh out of the Army with zero IT experience, just got my Sec+ and am enrolling into WGU... hope it's not too late to to get that bread lol
Thank you for this. It is super helpful. I currently have 6 years working in IT, I have started taking courses at WGU. One reason I chose WGU is that you are working towards your degree and getting certifications along the way. There are some basic certs that will at least get you entry level jobs which is ok. I started as a helpdesk analyst making 28k a year. I am now making $31 dollars an hour, it takes time. If you are looking for a super quick way to make $$$ you either have to be very lucky or get into flipping houses or making money off stocks or w.e. None the less this is an awesome video. Thank you for putting this out there. When I got my certs I found getting contracts/ job offers were easy, but you have to have something. I tell people often do contract work, sure its 3 months here or 6 months there but it helps. GOOD LUCK everyone.
This is exactly how it worked for me. I never finished my degree. Got my CCNA but with no experiance I could only land a Help Desk position. However my CCNA helped me move up the ranks. First 6 months on the Help Desk, 2 years on Desktop then bam Networking. You just have to be very patient and bust your ass. When a position on the Network team finally opened up I was their first pick.
My career path took me to certification (A+, Network +, landed IT job, started CCNA , passed(after 3rd attempt) and then went onto doing my BSc (3 year part time - Saturday's)...degree helped me understand so much more than just ICT and I think developed my logic and finesse (ability to write, discuss, team work, researching structuring documents, basics of project management, etc)....... to each his own.....a degree gives you really good negotiating power when you need to advance so id consider it once you settle in your career path...
Theres a difference between being a network technician (what you all call engineer) which is just chasing certs and using the technology that actual computer and network engineers design for you to use. These actual engineers most likely have degrees, not just certs. You really need to know the difference between engineering and being a technician. It's like calling a certified mechanic an automobile engineer. That's precisely where a degrees value is.
I am a USAF Veteran. I have to agree to a point because it depends on what military job you have. I personally worked a specialised maintenance job for my 6 year active duty enlistment called Nondestructive Inspection. Which does well in the civilian world. However several other military jobs don't do well in the civilian world. I will say that military service does give you trade skills and benefits to prepare for your future job/career if you complete your enlistment and return to being a civilian.
This is very motivational! I'm about to graduate with my AA Degree for free paid by the state of Florida, and 2 weeks later graduate with my high school diploma. You helped me make a decision on what to do. I am going to get an OSCP soon and then other IT certifications to hopefully break into the IT field. My end goal is Pen Testing in either Red Team or Blue Team. Thanks again! :) Earned another sub.
Get both. Some IT jobs require a degree. And some jobs require an ABET accredited degree. It depends on what the employer wants from applicants. They set the bar. If you want to learn networking, I highly recommend attending any Cisco Network Academy based curriculum, not boot camps. The Network Academy provides you with a good foundational knowledge of how various networking technologies work. There are community colleges that offer Net Academy courses that are eligible for college credit or are part of a degree program. I learned more about networking from attending a Cisco Network Academy program than from reading a book, attending a boot camp, or attending course where I went to college. Certifications in my opinion are not an accurate metric to gauge an individual’s networking knowledge. I have interviewed people with CCNA certs and some don’t know to answer basic networking questions. But, for some jobs, certifications are one of the requirements for qualifying for a position.
You can do both. I run a program/teach at a technical college whose INT program teaches CCNA R/S, CCNA Security, Security+, A+, VMware, Red Hat, MCSA, plus other supporting courses like database and cloud. In and out w/ an AAS in 2 years for around the cost of a single semester at a traditional 4 year school.
My God it just dawned on me.. My boss already does basic routing and switching at work but as the sys admin he has a ton of stuff on his plate. If me or the other tech in our shop were to get our CCNA it would really free up our boss to focus on other issues.
I saw this video around two months ago, on the bus ride after failing the Security+ exam. I wasn't discouraged, about it. I had an expired CCNA, but a renewed sense on how I should've approached it again. I saw this video in February, and though I am a college graduate for IT, I didn't even see this video to answer the college vs CCNA debate (if there is one). I saw it, and just how calm, approachable and passionate you were in going for the CCNA, I was determined to approach it again - more serious this time, to move on in my field. I am now CCNA certified, after taking the 200-125, and I am thankful for what you shared, and just making approaching the field, WHILE ALREADY IN IT, more welcoming!
Great video! You make a lot of sense, very grounded! You tell how cost efficient it is to break into a great career in IT w/o a college degree, but at the same time you stress how important it is to have one. I am sure this will help a lot of undecided young guys.
Chuck makes good videos. This topic is always ask, and it is nice to see different opinions of those in the field. Nicely done Chuck. Looking forward to seeing your CCNP Collaboration done and CCIE if you are perusing.
What job can you get with a CCNA alone? This is the problem with your entire thing. I highly recommend a major disclaimer since virtually no where hires a CCNA with no experience (other than desk help which you only need a HS degree). You need to aim more for the CCNP. I highly recommend going to college. If you do it right you can get a few certs, actual hands on (depending on the college), and you can get connections (this is actually how you get jobs). The part I have to call BS on is where you can't get an interview with just a 4 year. Cisco actually has a program for people about to or just graduate. The jobs listed can't compete with people who has experience and they are actual network engineers. Keep in mind you must have a CCNP within a short time (they keep changing it but it's 90 days right now from being hired). In my experience, the experience itself is what matters. Normally if a job requires a CCNA it's just to fill a check box. But like you said, with a CCNA you went with the very very bottom (something someone with a HS degree get). Something you should've hit hard on is this highly highly highly highly depends on the area. Some areas are needing people and they will take anyone. Some areas like where I'm at it requires a degree. Pretty much ALL gov jobs in network engineering require a degree. Oh and lastly, I have 4 degrees and have 0 loans and had the gov pay for it. It's not that hard to do it, but you can't do stupid stuff and you need to budget
I don’t see how much this video actually helps anyone who isn’t already experienced with tech. And the thing is, people with experience won’t need to see this video because all you’ve really said is “just get your CCNA, college bad.” And you kept trying to make it sound like college wasn’t bad, but then you kept saying college wouldn’t help with this or that; experience will. And if your goal was to tell people that experience matters most, congratulations for giving the most obvious advice possible.
Thank you for doing this video, i went to school for a 4 year degree and finished in 2007. That was about $98k in tuition and now I'm studying for the CCNA 10 years later. If I could go back and do it again I would do anything but a 4 year degree. Do the 4 year degree after your starting to work! 4 year degrees don't do anything to get you a degree!
Also you forgot to mention the best motivator for getting that first job, or that large role. A family. Good work brother, keep it up, this channel motivates me.
Just discovered your channel and super excited about it! I’m exploring possible careers in IT after my military service. Looking forward to learning more.
This may have changed my life. Time will tell... I'm about to start my Junior year of college at a public university, and I think I'm wasting my time. 80% of the classes I'm required to take for a computer science degree aren't going to realistically be applicable. I don't think the interviewer for a network admin positing is going to care if I know calculus, but I could be wrong...
Yeah, I have to agree. Each path is different for each person....but I can say from experience that my certs are what gave me the credentials and leg up to land amazing jobs.
If you are far enough along that you're going into your junior year, it would be foolish to drop out and get a certification. Finish your bachelor's degree and get the certification. I've been in the corporate world for 30 years and, trust me, people in any field without at least a bachelor's degree will hit a glass ceiling fairly quickly. Many of the big companies won't even give you an interview without a degree, regardless of your certifications or experience. Finish college.
Watching this in 2019 and I think you're assuming that college students (associates, bachelors, etc.) who while finishing their degree are not also doing internships, or have IT related jobs while in school. The industry might be changing, but I think that one will always have a one up with that degree+certs on their resume.
Experience will always trump everything. If that college student has 2 less years experience than the highschool grad with the same certs that may well just give them the edge. Obviously there are companies that will not even let you through to an interview if you dont have a bachelors but tbh fuck those companies anyways because they dont know what is really valuable
I have a Bachelor's and Master's degree in Computer Science and the Master's had a focus in Computer Network and System administration. The only problem is about my degrees were that they consisted of mainly programming and theory. I never got any real hands on experience except for working as a graduate assistant with the System Administrator in the Computer Science department. I currently work as an IT Support Specialist working with Network Administrators in a College maintaining the Campus's network. My job consists of a lot of monitoring all of the access points on the network as well as doing wireless site surveys and installing AP's. My programming experience has helped because I have currently been working on automating how my job provisions their access points. Coming into my job I knew the basics of networking and I have learned a lot more than I ever learned in college. I am currently working on obtaining my CCNA.
Certifications are the way to go. I soon plan on taking a course for CCNA at my community college. I'm also trying to get an entry IT job which lets me work from home. I believe I'm heading in the right direction. I wish everyone else the best on there journey :) Also Chuck, your videos are awesome, keep up the good work, they sure have helped me in some way or another.
This video was spot on. I've been comparing these in my head for a long time. I'm starting to study for my ccna. I got into a small company and I'm working on all kinds of equipment.
Thanks a lot for this, Chuck! I have been struggling for a while now to find a path, but this makes total sense. Plenty of interviews planned for next week now. Should be able to land one and get my experience up while working on certs. I live in the UK but the relevance is the same for me.
Thanks for watching Adam! Let me know how the interviews go and if you need any advice. I've landed a number of job offers with a few key tips and tricks.
I'd also recommend considering a college that is, or has a Cisco Academy. They offer great courses and include lots of practical labs spread out over a much longer period. I'd recommend sticking to industry certifications rather than going down the degree route unless looking for a computer science type role.
Hey man, really informative video! I'm in my last year of college (UK) and I am thinking of doing a three year BSc degree in networking, the course also includes a chance to study for and take the CCNA exam. Also in my own time I am going to start buying second hand switches, firewalls and routers and configuring them. As well as practicing networks on Cisco packet tracer. Do you think this would be good enough to qualify as experience on a CV? Any help would be greatly appreciated as this is the only career path I wish to take.
Hey Alex, thanks for stopping by!! You're definitely on the right track. I've heard of a lot of guys volunteering to get some experience. Getting that first helpdesk job is important. Start working on that now.
I don't know if this was mentioned yet, but another path to follow is, get your CCNA, get hooked up with a bigger company that has education benefits, let THEM pay for your four year BA/BS type of degree. I just recently found your channel, it looks like a pile of good stuff. My OCD dictates that I will watch them all, in order. (At some point.) Epic beard, BTW.
I fully support your mission to watch all of my videos in order. Bonus points if you run through them twice ;) Finding a company that will pay for education is an excellent strategy. The only issue after that is will it be worth your time?
@@NetworkChuck , It may take you more than four years to complete a BA type of degree going "the company route". But, if your desire is to eventually move into management, this could be helpful. I would suspect that MANAGING a bunch of CCNA type of guys (and gals) (later in your employment) would pay even mo' money. Granted, some folks are just happy to do what they do and don't care to move up and up in the ranks. I was a perfect example of that type of worker. You know, the walking HR issue that "got stuff done"! Now I'm a happily retired Telecom (rhymes with "Verizon") LAN/WAN Engineer.
A lot of community/junior colleges have Associate programs that are basically just a lot of certifications pressed together, and they can still then transfer onto a 4-year school, so, all that to say, if it is possible to get a degree AND the certifications. I'm in a bit of a different position as I already have a career that is quickly becoming more IT-centric, so to continue and grow in my career (and possibly beyond), I'm starting down the CCNA path by going to my local community college. I know you are big advocate for self-study, but for me, this seems like a good fit. With the craziness of having a family and a full-time job, the structure that a class would offer forces me to stay on target. As you've touted in other videos, self-study is a great way to go, certainly the potential to be cheaper and quicker, but for me, I need to be more deliberate than quick. At least that's the plan, I'll let you know how it works out.
I know someone that has one year of experience and he's making 18$hr in Ohio. I only add Ohio so that you don't think he's making that in California. If you get your CompTIA A+, you'll get a help desk job easily. The A+ exam is supper easy. If you don't know much start there.
I took the CCNA path in 2001 and since then, I have worked as a Network Engineer, Operation Security Analyst (glorified firewall admin), started an IT managed services company, sold it, been a CIO for a healthcare company, now I consult for a very comfortable lifestyle of my choice... within reason. Not one degree... it's a complete waste in the US for IT, unless you are looking for something specific. Chuck is soft-coating it. Go study, be kind, and kick ass!
I agree with you and disagree. You missed part of what a degree really means, and I'll tell you why. Your look on it is just "what will give you a job?" Quicker. Which is true, but the classes you go through will take you to another level, for example human behavior in a single physiology class. A dude with a degree and a CNA would have kept you sitting at the Jr. help desk longer if that was the case. It does build you into a better person. You do learn a lot. However you are right, you don't come out jumping into a admin job obviously, but the knowledge is priceless. You are wiser! A total different human being from when you started your Bachelors. It's worth it from a different perspective which I wish you had mentioned.
I definitely see your point. But I would also argue that if you want to learn psychology or physics...etc....you can pick up a book or sign up for a Coursera course. You will often learn a lot more from this method. I believe that college is only valuable for the piece of paper. Everything you learn in college you can learn faster and go deeper with self-study.
That's the issue. If I wanted to learn that. I would have taken that path. You should not have to take a human behavior class to get a CIS degree. It looks more like a money grab instead of letting you focus on what you want.
Here's my take: Starting out, get some certs under your belt so you can get started and gain experience in IT. Then later after your foot is in the door get the bachelor degree. So do BOTH. A degree will most likely be needed if you want a manager/supervisor role later also. Good video!
great video. I've been using a guest login on packet tracer... am I going to hit a point where I need to fork out for it? I spent my first 4 weeks learning the basic theory from a book, and now I am labbing I am going to pay for CBT nuggets for a couple of months. Cost effective :) No prior IT experience whatsoever. Currently learning how to apply DHCP, NTP etc.
Thanks! I love stories like these. KEEP GOING! You are doing an awesome job. I would learn how to start working with GNS3 instead of Packet Tracer if you are worried about the cost. It can be a bear to setup but it will get the job done.
CCNA is only for learning conepts, you still don't know how to configure a Firewall, and a switch together with VLAN, and Site-to-Site and I haven't mention a router yet. In other words, not a good comparison because college can get you into a entry level job depending on which major, if it's math or science, College degree, its's way better. If you really want to compare a computer science BS vs. CCNP, then CCNP will save your time and money for college. But beware companies always low ball your salary without a BS, and also you cannot get a management position if you don't have a BS and if you out grow your technical skill. But one thing for sure, being a Cisco Engineer you never out of job and you work the same job till retired because it changes gradually. You deal with complexity as you move into advanced level.
The "X FACTOR" will always be your skill level and experience. In my experience the CCNA holds a lot of weight but you do need a bit of experience to back it up. That's why I think you should go straight to your CCNA and start working on getting experience instead of wasting 4 years on curriculum you will rarely (if ever!) use.
You learn to configure a firewall in CCNA Security. You learn the basics of switching and VLAN's in CCNA R&S. You learn basic concepts of OSPF single/multi area, EIGRP, RIP, OSPFv3, EIGRP for IPv6. I actually think one of the best ways to get your foot in a door this day is through an apprenticeship. I agree though that you'll most likely won't get a management position without a BS.
That is not correct, if you really study for CCNA there is no way you will not know how to set up VLANS, IPSEC based VPN ( SIte to Site). If you do not, it tells me you just cheated on your CCNA.
I agree with VLAN's, but IPsec based vpn...? You don't touch that at all in the CCNA R&S unless you actually mean CCNA Security? It is insane how much more you learn in the NP compared to NA... I can't wait to move onto security! ;)
Stand corrected IPSEC based VPN is not included in CCNA, but i still feel CCNA is supposed to be for entry level job, but content of CCNA ( R/S) is way beyond basics .
I'm currently a software dev student at WGU. For this degree I'm required to pass 4 certification exams. Comptia(Project+ and A+), Microsoft(prereq), CIW. I had no job and no experience when I started my degree program. Got hired at Best Buy based soley on my current student status. Still looking for a better job even though I'm content with my current one. On Indeed there are multiple job openings for numerous Tech Support soles. However I applied to Comcast/Xfinity and landed the interview quickly. The ISP route is the one I prefer career wise so the CNNA which incidentally is not required for my degree is my next major goal. Thanks for the video! I'll keep you posted!!
I don't even have to watch this video to answer that... CCNA hands down! BUT... only if you have a passion for and want to be in IT. As you would almost surely move on to other certifications. Otherwise college is the better route.
But adding the B.S. and M.S. to the CCNA,MCSA,CCNP,MCSE makes you a lot more dominant in the job market. Really like you're channel, you have been doing a lot of the same research as I have. Good to hear extra nuggets from some else. *thumbs up*
What if you have a degree unrelated to IT, such as Aviation Science/Management? Would supplementing it with Cisco certs be enough? This question is in regards to a career change.
To get experience quickly, find a group of CCNAs in your area and start doing volunteer work for small companies on the weekends. There can be liability issues but in my experience it is absolutely worth it.
Down-talking 4 year degrees, particularly the mention of "a four year degree will land you a help desk job" is ridiculous. Sure, if you get a BA in the arts or English of course you are unqualified for an IT position. However, if you actually take advantage of the opportunities available to you in University then you can easily start at a high salary position because as opposed to "rising through the ranks" with a high school diploma and certifications you can do internships, individual research, and work with professors (i.e. various forms of networking) that open up positions for you WHILE going to university. What you are conflating is that individuals who are extremely driven who don't have a college education can out-earn lazy college grads, with the idea that college is somehow inefficient because it doesn't guarantee some outcome. Encouraging your audience (which undoubtedly includes individuals who are still in high school) to forego university education on the basis of it being inefficient is biased, incorrect, and harmful. If you take a simple look at the outcomes and placement of individuals in the Computer, physical and mathematical sciences of any top 30 university they will handily out-earn their non-degree holding counterparts, the major flaw in your analysis being that you fail to consider life time earnings and opportunities for advancement that diminish for those with less education (even if it is wrong to prevent these individuals).
I agree that degrees show more value later in your career. But...starting out....they just aren't as valuable as certifications. I think getting a degree is a worthy goal...but you can get that later in your career without going into debt.
I have to lean towards NetworkChuck on this debate. I acquired my Associate in Computer Network Administration roughly 6-months ago, with solid instructors incorporating technologies and hands-on experience in order to apply towards our certifications. However, largely my 2-year degree alone has proven ineffective. I have received several interviews back in the day, but nothing to quite seal the deal; icing on the cake. It's not been till I've started studying towards my Network+, which will lead into my CCENT - CCNA R/S that I've slowly regained my confidence, and acquired useful, real-life, hands-on experience. The majority of positions I have noticed prefer, if not require experience and/or CompTIA or Cisco certifications. Ensuring a few IT certifications largely contributes towards a successful technician, and helps act in place of experience that you may not have. To boot, having a Bachelors or Masters is largely time consuming and expensive in terms of debt accrued. It also doesn't guarantee a job acquired, nor do HR/companies consider it as real-world experience... My biggest issue with college is that for those that attend full-time, work full-time, try to squeeze in internships, and have a family/kids/responsibilities/hobbies and goals will largely crash and burn with such spread out academia. When I was chugging along my 2-years, we were force fed many technologies in order to become well-rounded, that after learning one concepts I would forget it, in effort to learn the next concept from that same class, or the other two. Or worse yet, rote memorization towards a grade, rather than having a deep understanding of the concepts and their interoperability, or concentrated effort on equipment. As I study for my Network+ now, and eventual CCENT/CCNA R/S, I have learned more, and had higher comprehension/retention due to not being burnt out from too many classes. There is something to say for achieving your degree, but at the end of the day if you want to truly get good at something, become really well versed in that one topic, and then move on. "You can either become really good at one thing, or okay at many things." Note, I'm a firm believer that you can become really good at many things. But the catch is that in order to do so, you have to at first become really good at one thing, and then move on. If you split yourself too thin, you'll never truly master any one subject.
Speaking the god damned truth. College is never going to hurt you but you can always get into it with just cold hard work. Personally, someone who self studies and gets their CCNA on their own shows a lot of dedication and it says a lot about your personality. That's going to be important to an employer. College gets you credibility, and again, it's never going to hurt you, it depends what you do. For some higher up positions, they'll ask for a degree but a lot of jobs don't require a degree like that. What do you want to do?
i went to a community collage and studied computer sceince.. they taught us all the material that is required for ccna and much more. not only networking but also advance database managment and and shit ton of programing .... i would recommond going to collage they will teach you allot of stuff its more comprehansive .
I agree, some degree programs add more value than others and you will get a lot. But if you want to accelerate fast, starting from zero, I think certs are the shortcut!
Hey man im 24years old in a IT help desk for a large company and have only studied a diploma in systems technology. do you think its to late to give studying ccna or have i left it to late. ive been in the helpdesk since i was 21.
No sir! You are in Prime time!!! You are in a sweet spot, already having IT experience. I started on the helpdesk when I was 22 and didn't have my CCNA until I was 23. You are on a great path.
@NetworkChuck It has taken 35,000 dollars of student debt and me banging my head against the wall for the better part of a decade to realize that I just want to get my hands dirty, so the certification route may be my salvation. I have *very* little patience for things that don't interest me, and a LOT of college is just that--extraneous detail I don't care about. Certifications are focused. I turn 30 in two months, and I'm ready to actually DO something with my life.
I am currently at WGU working on my IT - Security Bachelor's degree. I have completed 3 certifications so far and by the time I finish, I will have 4 more, including CCNA and CCNA - Security. What helps me out is I have 6 years experience in the IT field and I was an Instructor at a community college where I taught Cisco classes (I have Cisco teaching certs) so I know how hard it can be. Going to WGU takes a lot of self-discipline in order to not get sidetracked. I am trying to finish up my Bachelor's degree because even with my experience and certifications most jobs near me won't even look at me because they all want Bachelor's degree AND certs AND 5 years experience. For an Entry level Sys/Network Admin. It is very daunting here in Nebraska. I am also looking in Texas since I have family all over the state. Good luck to everyone working towards their CCNA!
Do you think banking and mortgage experience would be an asset there? Laid off from banking looking at a career switch, thinking getting CCNA and moving up the ladder.
This is a great video. Im so glad im on track, currently taking the JNCIA JUNOS which is a FREE CCNA equivalent offered by Juniper Networks to gain experience with route/switch and then going to take my CCNA. currently apply to help desk jobs in my area. Super excited to start my career, thanks Chuck
Truth. Currently in school working on my associates in CIS and my network professor said if he could drive one point home I’d start working on certs. School is great but them certs can open doors when trying to break in the field.
i'm late to the party but i'll add my 2 cents! So... from my experience, and that's someone with a MASTERS but no certs, but working towards them, i think doing 2 years at a community college and finishing up at a traditional uni AND getting your certs whilst doing that is the route to go, IF your for sure goal is to be in IT. I say that because of A)costs/debt. going to CC first saves you a ton of money, if i'd done that im sure i'd be 40k richer :/. ALSO, a community college near you could have a basic certification course you could take for under 5k(the one i took did) and if you are someone who in unemployed or a displaced worker you could also qualify for FREE funding from the state that would pay for the course, labeled as professional development! B) next, i say go finish at a trad college because of NETWORKING/CONNECTIONS. Sometimes getting a job anywhere is about WHO you know not just WHAT you know! i've had an internship in IT 3/4 years of college career and one the summer before college. All from people i knew, and some colleges have career centers to help create resumes and such. C) by the time you are at the next level (4year school) you would have hopefully developed skills necessary to begin self studying AND have someone (a professor or older student) who you could work with and get help from. I'll even add in being able to use school equipment to practice on, usually networking classes will give that to you as well. To sum it all up in order of perceived importance..: 1) NETWORKING/Making Connections 2)Costs, saving money 3)Skill development 4)Access to equipment...
i'd like to add that if you purchase the official Cisco cert guide books you get access to the pearsonvue test prep software with literally tons of practice questions from every chapter and topic. and you can customize practice exams to focus on certain topics that you may need to work on
If you qualify for the Trade Assistance Program (like having lost your job due to overseas competition in the U.S.) they will pay for both your schooling and a one time fee for all the certification test of all the fields you are going to school for.
If I had to choose between an applicant with a CCNA or an applicant with a Degree and a CCNA, I’d choose an interview with the one that has both credentials. Standalone CCNAs are a dime a dozen. Chuck went down his path of thinking a degree gets you into entry level IT. He doesn’t account for working or internships while in school that have more weight than what he reads on paper. “Hustlers” cram three months of studying into a cert that gets them into an entry level position anyway.
If that's your criteria, you are missing some good candidates. I interview based on the big picture. Couple years ago, out of 30+ applicants, I chose a 24-year old US Navy vet. He was in Information Systems, has a Sec+ cert, and high school diploma. Some of the other applicants had up to multiple Masters. Within 10 minutes of talking to him, I was sold. Of all the people I hired over the past 10 years, he has been the best. (location is a 125-bed hospital) You would have missed him. Maybe you did. Thanks!
I have two Bachelor degrees (Business Administration and Geography). Neither of them have gotten me a job in the field. I am thinking the fact that I didn't get experience through an internship while in college, and once I graduated I wasn't qualified for internships and nobody would give me a job since I lacked the experience. I am going to start working on an Associates degree in Cybersecurity and Computer Networking though a community college, and the program is the Cisco Network Academy. Throughout my degree I will be taking classes to prepare me for A+, Network+, and Security+, and I plan on getting the certs while in my program and then get my CCNA. And I plan on taking an internship during my last semester. Two years and about $12000 in tuition in fees. I am looking forward to this!
The only thing I would say is the determining factor is debt. I got a degree and now have a networking job that will pay for any certs I go for and make a very good wage for a 24 year old. And I took the longest to land a networking job out of college(NYC job market is very competitive). My other classmates got networking jobs right out of school all ranging from Junior, associates, and some even managerial networking positions. But I went to a school with a very good program, we mostly did projects and had a lab room full of Cisco equipment and free OS licensing keys for server work.
I believe getting your CCNA at community college is the way to go. Classes are cheap and you will have opportunities to do internships and co-ops vs self-study you won't. And if you're in Network Management degree program most classes will be around IT and you will acquire lots of other helpful knowledge and certifications. Plus you will have a degree that will never expire. And if you decide to grow into management roles that require a Bachelor's degree (and it will), it will be much easier to reach. Always think LONG TERM!
This is a life saver! Throughout my high school life I wasn't sure if I wanted to be a engineer(electrical/mechanical) but I did take four years of engineering classes but by the time I went to college (Luckily I only went to community college) I was so unsure of what I wanted to be going for, so I have always been interested in programming because I took a easy and fun Visual basic class I and II, I would have made it through college but I got in a car wreck at the end of year one and had no vehicle to make it to school and ended up failing so im only paying about $2,000 back to them, which is happily brought down to $1,000 now. Seems like I would be interested in this because ive self studied C programming. Thanks for the great content.
I Agree with your points, all but one. If you're getting into IT just for the money. Please don't. You have to actually enjoy this line of work and be passionate about it. The people that just do it for the money are the same ones that try to quick close tickets, leave after their 8 hours are up, and are the first to try to kick a ticket to another dept without really troubleshooting it. Working in IT means long hours (I have had to sleep at the office more then once). Never doing things half ass or taking the easy route, it takes a strong work ethic and dedication. People that are in it just for the money tend to have neither.
Yeah rushing to close tickets can definitely get you canned since your supervisor is going to be looking at your SLA performance. You have to really love what you do esp in a fast paced break fix environment.
major in math and computer science, get your ccna and rhsca before you graduate and the work for the IT Dept. College is more secure and presents a greater opportunity for you will never be denied for not having a degree
NetworkChuck I agree, but say you go through a comp sci program and attain your ccna before graduating. Then you will have the programming experience to think critically and efficiently when scripting. Honestly, the best engineer/network/systems guy my Uncle worked with was a History major from Iowa Uni. but the reason he could write fluently in Perl and solve all kinds of higher level network issues was because of gaining the experience he needed through the IT Dept up there. Your are a 100% correct on experience, you do not need a degree if you are blessed enough to make it into an experience worthy role. Colleges need to create a method like the BSN programs, so nurses will go through this process already being at a level of RN, so then they are able to step on the floor and actually work through problems in real time. The Cisco networking academies are fantastic, but you are in controlled environment and not everything is going to be Cisco, even in Cisco shops you'll see other products. Therefore, to sum up my drawl, if you can get a job working with hardware and networking equipment then you don't need college, and ultimately you won't need a ccna if you are already in the job position. Sorry for blowing you up, love the vids tho keep it up.
I've been in the biz for over a decade. Here is my advice. Find a place that does student assistant or intern jobs (state governments often do IT student assistant jobs, that how I started) at the very least this gets you real world experience while you are doing school. That experience will be far more valuable than a degree. Do a couple classes a semester as you will likely have a few prerequisites to take care of before you get into cisco classes. Once you get through a Cisco class (at my college the first was intro to networking) start looking at getting your CCNA, A+ and network + certs. With those three and the work experience you will look better than if you had a 4 year degree, but no experience and no certs.
Couple of other things I would like to add, I'm from the United Kingdom, so the system is slightly different You are expected to specialize In a specific area during your bachelors degree, the good thing about that is that you don't have to do silly classes like you have to do in some countries. Anyway, back to the main point vendor certification vs College education. First of vendor certification , especially at the lower end is all about rot learning essentially means memorization And maybe a couple of virtual tasks during the exam. Cannot speak for the United States but in the UK , you're expected to have a deep understanding, theoretical and practical, you are examined in different ways, . Traditional exams, timed labs, group work etc and then after all that , you have produce a dissertation or artifact which essentially means producing a piece of software and presenting and showing. And after all that , if you manage to get through three and four years then you get your bachelors degree. That cannot be said for vendor certification. Like I said before, I've done both. And secondly, I work within the IT sector for the last nine years and I can honestly say while certifications, bachelors degrees are useful , you're definitely never going to use most of your knowledge nope in actual fact, I would argue in some IT roles You need very little experience just a willingness to learn, retain information And most importantly a team player.
Get your foot in the door before you get certifications. You do not know if the position you want will require them and experience is king. If you want a high paying position, you need to have experience in the lower tiers and it helps in order to understand how to manage the environment. Start as a help desk which doesn't require college or certificates while giving you experience, start considering certificates once you move to an analyst position. This will give you better odds of success, you could even get your company to pay for training and certifications.
Great video chuck. Want super cool jobs and be proficient in you area: go CCNA. Want management, be chief, handle people and budgets: go collage, do master. Big money in the beginning and middle: certainly. Big money at the end (but very big): degree+master.
Well said CHuck. I think the degree can be something an engineer does when he's slowing down or wants to manage, not get dirty. Then a business degree, management, or Mgmt for IT type degree pays off. All of which can be gotten online from reputable colleges galore now.
Three letters - WGU (and WGU accelerator). If you work hard, you can do it cheaply and quickly. Less than $10k starting from nothing if you are super aggressive. If you already have college credits or certs, you can cut that time and cost by up to half or maybe a bit more. Get your degree when you can as you're rising up from helpdesk and beyond. It will matter later on and cost you dearly if you don't have it.
I think a major thing which isn’t really addressed here is debt. Going to college is going to put most people into massive debt, often in excess of $100k. Debt is a major trap that everyone is trying to trick you into. You don’t want to spend the next 20 years chipping away at a pile of debt accruing interest. Be free.
