🚨I made a followup video! ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-gsmqijBjBAc.html 🚨 **Adendum** - This wasn't a brand new bottle, I've been using it around the shop and only noticed mild improvement which is what prompted the video. But I didn't do a bunch of sprays before the test so things maybe settled? I'll re-run the test and post an update (or video update) if it changes! - I have some "9H oleophobic" screen protectors on the machine (not pictured in the video) which actually do a pretty good job! Will see if I can unearth what/how they work - I did try the spray on the window and forgot to share how it went: about as good as the RainX style spray. Good for a few runs and then strips away. 😢 - Several good comments about how this might only work on soft surfaces (paint) or weathered/scratched up surfaces, whereas my glass slides were too pristine and it rubbed right off. Very possible! - AFM noise can be improved with isolation tables and isolation boxes. The nGauge is really good against noise so I don't usually bother, but I guess F-35s defeat even the nGauge 😂
I can't help but wonder what it might look like if you sprayed it on and then, instead of wiping it off, allowed it to evaporate. A few 'layers' of this should really fill out the field of view with ceramic particles?
I don't know whether you shook the bottle any more off camera before starting, but I don't think I'd call the amount of shaking you did on camera "shaking well"... Whether that'd make much difference I don't know - how fast do silica nanoparticles settle out? no idea.
@@StormBurnX That's more what I'd expect too; I haven't read the instructions myself of course but my intuition with a spray like this would be that you spray it on, allow it to dry, and then wiping with a microfibre is just to remove any streaks that are left after the solvent evaporates.
"Good for a few runs and then strips away" roughly matches my experience using RainX on my shower door, tbh! I often have my phone on a nearby shelf playing videos when I'm in the shower, so I try to keep at least a patch of glass free of condensation and scale from southern England's very hard water. A few layers from my _10-year-old_ bottle of RainX seems to help, but not for long enough given the effort of applying it 🤷♀️ Of course, newer bottles could be better; I've no idea! (Maybe one day I'll design & 3D print a phone mount to use in the shower... Water-resistant phone & case mounted away from most of the water ought to be fine, I think 🤔)
I work extensively with Si polymeric coating (and including some hydrophobic and oleophobic coatings) and here is my take on these “ceramic” coatings. They do work, they are effectively silicone polymer coating but the better ones are made with siloxane monomer with very specific functional groups to give the desired properties. For high quality ones they are basically monomers or oligomers in solution (usually an alcohol) that polymerize as the alcohol dries. The amorphous silica in the one you looked at was likely just a sol-gel and not hard particles of silica. It is used as a filler for the functional (expensive) siloxane monomers to bond with as it dries. Edit to add: While they do work, I would never consider them very durable compared to the automotive paint they are applied over (but more durable than most waxes). It would not surprise me if they needed to be reapplied every year, especially if you wash wipe down your car a lot. These are not hard "ceramics" but sol-gel and silicon polymers similar to thin PDMS or silicone caulking.
@@gingermany6223 any clue if there would be any benefit to applying the 3M ceramic coating to my cast iron table saw top as a rust inhibitor? Or on my shower door to prevent hard water spots?
There is zero benefit to these products. It’s literally a scam to have you pay for what wax does while also putting micro scratches and damage your paint over time. There is a reason real ceramic coating costs $1k+
@@gingermany6223 sorry to be a pest, but wondering if you had a moment to answer my question regarding the high end ceramic coating on cast iron and on shower doors.
Try a long duration spray on the slide and let dry and dont wipe it at all, just to see how many silica particles a single spray will yield 🤷♂just a thought
I suspect the nano particles are just there to give the water something to bead up on because of its clingy properties and the other stuff is good for helping the bead roll away.
@@BreakingTaps Do you realize this means you accidentally discovered a sensor that can detect one of the most expensive recently developed stealth aircraft? That's impressive.
I detail cars for a living and love everything science. This is literally the perfect video. Haven't watched it yet, but if you don't mention it in the video I'd love to see actual ceramic coatings and/or graphene coatings. Or products like Rain-X that leave a coating behind on glass. I try to imagine how thin the coatings are, but I wouldn't even know what to guess
That's what I was wondering as well. If a ceramic coating for a car would make any difference? And how would that coating look under the microscopes? I've seen some non-biased RU-vid videos with those nanoparticle ceramic coatings. It sure seems to make the cars super shiny and bead water like you wouldn't believe.
I second the request for a closer look at ceramic coatings. You can pick up small amounts that are used by professional car detail for relatively cheap. My vehicle had a ceramic coated applied professionally and it worked great as water repellent. However, it only lasted a year or so and I don't see myself having it installed again due to the price. Nowadays, I see "ceramic" on all automotive detailing products in stores, including products for leather and fabrics...wtf? Definitely seems to be a marketing gimmick.
@@StatueofGuyThinking That's what i had in the back of my mind the whole video. Based on the, (impressive) results in the project farm video I would at least expect some noticeable and significant layer on the material. Like the pinned comment mentions, maybe the glass is just to smooth for it to really stick on.
There's at least one more interpretation, maybe it's not that good at treating raw glass. The stuff is for cars, meant mostly for the paint but it's fine on all the typical car materials and in the worst case it would only be as effective as normal silicone coatings. It may also stick better to glass that has been exposed to weather and driving conditions for a while, maybe the silica* particles are better at sticking into tiny scratches, or something about exposure treats the glass so it's more receptive.
Hm that's a fair point. It does say it can be used on exterior glass, but perhaps it's really on effective on paint and scratched up surfaces. I'll sand some glass and see if we can get more of it to stick and maybe try on a painted or metal surface. Cheers!
@@BreakingTapshey! Did you wind up testing the scratched glass with the hydrophobic products? My thought immediately upon seeing the slides (man I miss playing with those as a kid), was just how damn slick they were when handling! I'm not sure what either glass looks like under a microscope, but I would assume some of these windshields on the road look like the grand canyon under a microscope and could sure use something to fill those fissures 😂
Oops! I did forget! It works about as well as the RainX variety: good for a few runs and then washes away. The best I've found are "9H Oleophobic" screen protectors (like for tablets and phones). Whatever they are coated with works really well and lasts a long time, and the tempered glass helps protect the machine's glass.
This immediately suggests to me another product to try - 'Novamin', a trademarked phosphosilicate formulation used by Sensodyne in toothpastes, supposed to adhere to tooth enamel, smoothening the surface and coating it with a protective silicate layer (yes, the claims go as far as granting acid-resistant glass-coated teeth). Would love to see this kind of home experiment with the stuff. (for that matter, examining tooth surfaces under AFM, and seeing how initial damage begets additional as the surface becomes craggy and thus has increased food particle adsorption)
These coatings are meant for clearcoat which is much softer than glass so I’m assuming the particles can more easily get embedded in the coating as opposed to glass which they will just wipe off
Exactly. I was an Automotive refinisher for over 25 years. I think a good wash and a coat of good silicon polish and or Carnauba wax is best to protect your car paint. I tend to think the Ceramic think is a big sales gimmick. Besides Is ceramic not an abrasive product anyway. The best thing you can do is keep your car out of the sun. Nothing will protect a surface indefinitely from UV rays.
This and I would imagine the coating of the Clearcoat finish to be much more porous than this glass. This stuff is not a replacement to rain-x nor does it claim anything on glass
Now if you were to run this experiment on the item it is intended for, that would be much more fascinating. That will truly debunk the advantages of these ceramic coatings
As a geology nerd, I was so excited for this. I know how amazing opal and chert can be. At first I thought it was going to be a lubricant using opal nanospheres as tiny little ball-bearings. Now I'm sad. THANKS, PRODUCT.
You should boil off the liquid and then burn the waxes. It will make it easier to see how much ceramic is actually in the mixture. It might be due to your glass being too clean and it being buffed off with the towel.
This is what I was thinking, a lot more of the coating will stick to a painted surface than glass. It makes sense that it forms a poor coating on glass, there's not anything for it to bond to.
what about the coatings advertise as "9H ceramic coatings"? seem to work surprisingly well, usually come in a small bottle; i guess the main ingredient is something like waterglass?
Unsure, but I have some screen protectors with that coating (supposedly) and they do indeed work really well! I'll see if I can track down a bottle to spray and check
I don't think this stuff is actually going to work, but I think what you sprayed was what was in the hose. It might be worth trying again and making sure to spray enough to replace the fluid in the intake. It will probably end up similar though.
One other thought: In watchmaking they use Epilame to prevent oil from getting into areas it is undesirable. It is crazy effective. You might want to try that. The cost is high in quantity, but it is actually fairly durable. The thing is, the coating is so thin, they state it is undetectable other than the effect. It would be very interesting to see under the microscope.
It's a good point! I neglected to mention that I've used this a bunch around the shop already so it was pretty well primed. I pinned a comment since that seems like it'll be a common question/point. Silly of me not to mention it! 🤦♀️
That's the best one. Turtle wax hasn't been very good until their last formula. Saw a test of several different more expensive brands. And that one won by far! Works like a charm! Surfaces become super hydrophobic. Use it everywhere.
You should check out maybe the n3 nano coating that blacktail studio uses for wood finishing. I'd be interested to see what that looks like on a small scale, and wether it would work well as a protection in the CNC enclosure.
@@gorak9000 the n3 coating isn't a spray, it's put on with a sponge like applicator, and has shown remarkable durability as a wood finish, so it definitely has something to it. Wether that is actually nano graphene or ceramics or some other film that it is creating is another question though.
@@joshwarner5676 can you actually order that overpriced snake oil? Their website says join the waitlist, their Shopify store says it ships at the end of the month, both might be out of date. In any case, I don't need to pay $120 + S/H to know the promo copy is intense marketing BS.
@@emislive I haven't personally tried it. Just seen some videos showing some impressive looking results, which is why I'd like to see verification from someone else of what it actually looks like at a micro scale and how well it works.
@@joshwarner5676 more on ceramic coatings would be great to see! Less productive rant follows... There's a lot of smoke blown around wood finishing, and online, so I get critical. A lot of nebulous, confusing and/or misleading claims are made about consumer "ceramic" coatings of various kinds. I see Blacktail make some claims that reach really hard about a product that is priced significant;y above comparable.
Take a drop of this product let it dry then use oxygen plasma to remove waxes that will leave you with glass / ceramic particles if there are any. I would do it directly on SEM stub probably tho.
Ooh, I like that! Will give it a shot and post a followup if there's anything interesting! Think I'll need to polish up the stud first, mine are _very_ rough and hard to see anything micron-sized or smaller. Would be nice though since I could EDS it for more confirmation (but was useless on glass substrate).
Depends on what you are trying to do with it. Ceramics are really just a metal and a mineral mixed together and in many cases they have very different properties but we have hard and soft metals and minerals that take on many different crystal forms. This allows you to mix and match a lot of properties and parameters to what you are trying to do. In some cases, it is the hardness or other physical property being used, such as in armor. Other times it is the heat transfer or heat resistance. Then there is particle shapes that accomplish certain things jagged particles can interlock to make a tight bond before sintering (making cups or plates) or can be used to scratch, polish, buff or grind. Round hard particles can work as a bearing or flat platelike particles can slide, working as lubricants.
If the endeavour is to have a clear view in your cnc. Have a look at hydrofiel substances. I ride a motorcycle and the visor in my helmet has a coating of sorts which is hydrofiel. The vizor brand is pinlock. I also know of hydrofobe sprays and they don't work. pinlock does work. perhaps also in an cnc?
Will take a look! I installed some tablet/screen protectors with some kind of special coating which does an OK job. Will look into that coating and see if I can get some or apply it to the windows!
It might be interesting to measure an amount and let it dry on a surface without wiping. You might be able to quantify the amount of particles left behind. Perhaps the ceramic acts more as a fine polish that buffs out scratches and makes paint look better? It doesn't seem like there is much there!
I've used the 3M ceramic coating on cars, as well as on the windows, with great results. It's a bit pricy, but definitely worth it! Maybe you could try that one in a future video? For use on the windows of cars there is also a pre-treatment spray that you can buy with the ceramic coating kit, but I'm not sure what it exactly is and what it does. I've never tried coating windows without the pre-treatment so I can't say if it's necessary or not.
If the silica settles out you may have sprayed most of it at some earlier time where you didn't properly shake the bottle, since the siphon tube pulls from the bottom. I assume the particles are supposed to make the water bead up around them through surface tension, leaving the rest of the glass water free.
As it relates to the problem of coolant on the windows of the mill, AvE did a good video a few years back where he tried to make his own water shedding spinner window thingy. Could be a fun project to piece together, and it might solve your problem better than this stuff does.
These "ceramic" sprays are notorious for showing little improvement over older, silicone-based waxes on automotive glass. Typically, however, they perform equal to silicones (or better) on paint in terms of smoothness, clarity, etc., but their durability is what truly makes them shine. These products commonly maintain their full hydrophobic properties 3-5x longer than their silicone brethren. They are also found to "build up" on the paint through repeated use, not unlike the seasoning layer on a cast iron pan, though not to the detriment of the finish (the way that traditional, natural waxes, such as carnauba do). Because vehicle paint is significantly softer than glass (paint hardness also varies between brands and vehicles), it's possible that, as the product is applied, the nanoparticles are deposited into the surface of the paint. This is most likely the reason the bottle tells you "do not over-apply". More product makes for more solvent, which is counterproductive when the goal is to remove the solvent and leave a thin, even coating of material behind.
The problem is that regardless of the fact that these coatings are proving to be as or more durable than traditional coatings, it is very likely NOT the presence of ceramic particles that is responsible more likely some sort of new type of silicon-based polymer wax.. My theory is that the production process leaves silica particle precipitates that are difficult or costly to remove, but testing showed that the particles were harmless therefore some clever marketing wank had the brilliant idea of just leaving the garbage in the formula and telling everyone its a magic ingredient instead and charging more for the product....
@@Flying0Dismount that theory would hold water if the formulations were substantially different than silicone-based waxes, but they generally are not. The main changes vs older, non-ceramic, silicone-based waxes basically boil down to the amorphous silica and various chemicals meant to support it. Clearly, one of those ingredients is extending the useful life of the properly applied product substantially.
Turtle Wax itself has actually been going through its older product lines and adding the "ceramic" ingredients to new formulations. "Seal N Shine" is one of the most well-know and widely-used waxes commonly available, and for good reason, but it's always had a durability problem. That durability problem is substantially mitigated in the new, "ceramic" reformulation. So, the question is, how did the mere addition of "garbage" improve the product's durability with no substantial drawbacks?
Some researchers have made superhydrophobic cotton, by coating it in silica and titania. (wikipedia page "superhydrophobisity", under potential applications links to some research papers) But that involved a multi-step process, and not one pre-mixxed product, that can be applied in one go. So theoretically one could make a way better coating with a "phase 1", "phase 2", "phase 3" carwax, instead of it being one component.
The surfaces we spray these ceramic liquids on are EXTREMELY porous. No mfg claims that they are great for glass which his one of the smoothest substances.
2 things. 1. The RU-vid channel Project Farm did a test with a bunch of ceramic coatings. This same brand you used was the winner in something like a 6 month test. The results left no doubt that it does do something good to car paint, and the manufacturer does say it can be used on glass too. 2. I tried my own experiments a. on a junker cast iron pan and b. on my glass shower door, but had poor results in both. I was hoping it would work as a protective coating on my cast iron woodworking tools and kill the hard water marks on my glass doors. The mixed results from your test, project farm, and my own make me wonder if settling is a big issue. I wonder what the bottom of the inside of the bottle looks like…
What about an air blade? Need to machine an air nozzle with a thin slot in it - if you can get a nice "blade" of air coming out of it, it might be enough to keep the coolant off the glass in enough area to see through with a camera
@@gorak9000 I've seen the ones made on Edge Precision channel to keep the cameras clear inside the Mazak enclosure. If all you want is to get the coolant to run off the lexan I wonder about something like Liquiglide where there's a combination of micro surface texture and a hydro or olio phobic component filling those pits. 🤔
Take a look into the siloxane, my understanding is "true" ceramic coatings are organometallic compounds in a carrier solvent that precipitate a xerogel coating that is technically a metal oxide (ceramic). Often you will see titanium listed, this is different from titanium nitride coated blades, but also a ceramic
I've thought about using a tablet screen protector on the inside of a mill. They are hard glass, have hydrophobic properties, should withstand the chips better than the poly panels, and when they do wear out, peel it off and replace it with another. Unfortunately my boss didn't see it as worth his time, and i dont care enough to spend my own time and money, so I have no idea how it actually works.
I wonder if the problem is that the glass slide is very hard compared to automotive paint. It could be that the silica particles are designed to be buffed into the paint, which effectively embeds them in the paint. Glass is hard, so they can't dig in. I take this concept from the principles of lapping, where you load a soft lap (often copper or aluminum) with abrasive to make a tool that will improve the surface of a much harder metal. Robin Renzetti has some great videos on lapping if you are interested. Tom Lipton of Ox Tools too, come to think of it.
If I imagine "buffing" silica particles into paint, I'm thinking you're doing abrasion with some particles digging in enough to stay. Automotive paint is plastic. I really can't imagine how embedded silica particles are providing "protection" when they're functionally acting as an abrasive. I'm guessing that the carrier solution is akin to the hydrophobic film that RainX leaves, and that provides the short-term feedback of the surface shedding water. The silica looks like marketing hype and the thin film would likely be as short-lived as RainX.
There are other products for "regenerating" ruined ceramic non-stick cookware that could be interesting. I think they are mostly metasilicate solutions but didn't really look into it. Regardless "non-stick" ceramic cookware is interesting and very easily ruined. Putting a piece of that under the AMF would be very interesting, there are many modes of failures and I assume they mostly are caused by very small cracks forming in the surface, but I have none of the tools required to figure it out.
Those "ceramic" cookware products use a sprayed silicone layer (like what's shown in the video) as the "anti-stick" coating They're misleading consumers into thinking its a durable and safe coating, while it slowly disintegrates into their food
Haha sorry! I completely forgot to close the loop on that. I tried, and it works about as well as the RainX variety of spray: good for a few runs and then stripped away by the coolant 🙃
Another cool test 👏🏼 Please test a wipe-on Si-based automotive protection like Gtechniq or similar if it's at all possible! They are clearly effective and the results would be captivating. Keep it up mate.
Knowing how amorphous silica is extremely hydrophobic makes me wonder if the sparse spattering of nanoparticles is still enough to disrupt the surface tension of the water in each area to such an extent that the water is unable to wet out the surface, and ends up coalescing into a droplet as a result.
I love how gullible mass market consumers and even most professionals are. There’s been products like that snake oil on the car care market since at least the 60’s.
Now that you know how it works as a product, could you centrifuge a sample to inspect more of the actual particles. Or just dip a slide and let it fully dry.
Where are very expensive ceramic coating , in very tiny bottles. They do help, but not for long. I use it for motorcycle helmet visor. They make surface very slippery and hard.
I know this stuff does things on my vehicle paint. Besides seeing water bead, masking tape won't stick to the paint for a couple months, and it feels clearly smoother. I do not know if the silica has anything to do with it.
how about just using "silicone oil", "wb40 stuff", but you can buy off brand, called and labelled as just "silicone oil" only ever seen it myself spray cans myself, but that should not affect the experiment of self? for doing lubrication, water, environments friendly in ridiculously large amounts, but that what using for here, plus I would love do close up in section of what actually would stick to the service like you did in this video 🙂 PS. like video also 🙂
Are your mill windows actually glass? Not polycarbonate or such? It is my understanding rain-x works by bonding to hydroxyl groups in the glass, hence I wouldn't expect it to work great on plastics. Rain-x does make a version for plastics (acrylic, polycarbonate, etc.) that might work better? Then again, tough environment with that water/oil emulsion. And yeah, I've always assumed these "Ceramic" car products are just marketing wank. What purpose do these particles provide, even if they could be bonded to the surface in some meaningful way?
Strange, would this be another kind of spray-on snake oil ? hmmm... 🤔 Ooooh ... I know, I know ! It's this newfangled "homeopathic" coating tech ! The less particulate, the more efficient it is ! Try not spraying any, it's even better ! 😂 Thanks for the video btw. ☺
My suspicion has been "ceramic" is meant to make you think of "ceramics".. hard baked clay or glass solid. They make ceramic armour. It shows up in the cyberpunks. From a room temperature squirt bottle. Yeah, right. "No, no, it's itsy particles!" That stick on how? That do what to my precious substrate when they get rubbed about? Yeah yeah, I don't actually have any clue, but the simple word choice makes me very suspicious.
I know its a bit of a side track but perhaps you could compare ceramic coatings for particles densities. I would be very interested to see your AFM in action testing different brands to see just what they offer and how much of the "ceramic" material is in them.
Wow, you totally bungled the test and misused the product! You did not even pretend to follow the actual directions, nor did you notice that the spray was meant for PAINTED SURFACES, not glass! The silica is actually added as an abrasive to condition the surface of the paint! Can you not read labels? After saturating the surface with 2 sprays, you were supposed to wipe the area with a microfiber cloth to work the silicone into the surface. Then, you were supposed to lightly wipe with a fresh cloth to remove the leftover ceramic particles. They were NEVER meant to be any sot of magical shield!
Funny you bring this up... I was recently ranting about abuse of the word "ceramic" in cookware marketing.... Seems like its spready🙈... TX for the video!
You went through all this trouble and didn’t even try a spray specifically made for glass. Chemical guys makes a coating for glass that honestly changed my life “Hydro View” also would recommend a glass stripper before applying (or just alcohol that works too ig). Also read the damn bottle on how to apply it “I don’t really know if you’re supposed to do this, but imma do it anyways” isn’t very controlled or fair to the product 🤷🏻♂️
Amazing content! Please do more testing the expensive ceramic coatings like Carpro Cquartz Sic or Huron any of their coatings. I don't mind sending you the ceramic coatings. I've been doing Rv's and Boat detailing for 20 years but still have my doubts about their longevity specially those claiming to last up to 5 years of protection.
I havent read all of the comments. I'll assume its been pointed out already but if not: nanoparticle coatings are supposed to create self-cleaning, high energy, low wetting "super hydrophobic" tribological effects by disrupting the surface regularity in just like microroughening* or surface patterning, ie in usually pointed to reference example of the smartphone glass display, the bioinspiration of the Rose petal, or more technically in modified glass, quartz, or silicon subtstrate so that a microfluidic device will exhibit a "no slip" boundary layer effect and increased performance in terms of the usual paramters like mixing, backpressure, and heat transfer, or a "self cleaining" effect, as is important for medical devices like flow cytometry lab on chip systems, among others. Incidentally its something you could reproduce with your laser marker (notably for microfluidic applications)...... DOnt yell at me if you already did and I'm clueless to your prior work! Its tough to say.... Im a very cynical person with very low faith in humanity, so I canimagine that its a load of hogwash and the silica is just inert filler like in cosmetics. Its also possible that its a real product and that the manufacturer has underestimated and under-directed how much agitation is needed to resuspend the particles once the bottle has set for a while Conside the anecdotal example of latex emulsion paint from Home Depot; that stuff requires around 30minutes of agitation to get it suspended. Its also possible that the product expired on the shelf more rapidly than advertised b y self-aggregation (irreversibly) due to interactions between the silica, silicones, and aliphatic compounds.
As a detailer most "ceramic" spray type coatings don't work well on glass at all. As for paint, it definitely lasts longer and is more hydrophobic than a traditional 100% carnauba wax. Now what we call "true" ceramic coatings or ones that come in a glass bottle around 30-50ml and require application by hand are probably more what you were expecting. That specific turtle wax product I've had last up to 3 months vs a true ceramic has lasted 3+ years.
after you shake the bottle, it takes several pumps to get the agitated product up the feed tube and out the nozzle. you should give it several pumps to purge the feed tube before applying it onto your test substrate.
Can you make something that sprays the CNC machine's window? Or have a curtain waterfall down the inside of the window. Or just install a car wiper if it won't destroy the glass. Maybe you could develop your own coating. Find the right combination of particle composition, size and application. Maybe go crazy and try some protein chains.
It's interesting that you choose the one by Turtle Wax. It was tested by Project Farm as the best overall. Project Farm is the definitive standard if you looking for product comparisons. I would think your looking for a Hydrophobic coating product. Stop by a hardware store and pick up a kit.
Just build a weighed stand with a flexible arm that will hold a deflector card of various sizes (1x2, 2x3, 3x4) at any angle, place it in the hood so that it diverts the splash directly downward. Then wax the window with auto wax, which as you know repels water very well including hard rain for weeks. PS yeah of course these lame products are bullshit. Duh.
Too much and its lapping compound. Overzealous people would just strip paint with their random orbital sanders. DuPont dryfilm Teflon might help ya. One of the big box stores like the depot has it. Its more for table saw beds (my future application) and whatnot but its probably hydrophobic.
Thanks for a well done report. I am a chemist and have often wondered what is in “ceramic” coatings. Looks like just a bunch of silicone water repellents.Looks like “ceramic” is just another example of co-opting a scientific word or phrase for marketing to an ignorant public. Truly clean glass will sheet off water and NOT bead. It’s a bit of a project though to get it that clean.
Don’t rule this out just yet. Quality ceramic coatings can last up to 7 years and cost a fortune. They provide a very chemical resistant and hydrophobic coating for years. The cheap car wax sprays with SiO2 added are meant to be reapplied every few months. They don’t last much longer than normal car wax. Those are mostly gimmicks.
What about that nano stuff you apply to car windshield? From my experience it lasts for about 4-ish weeks and seems durable enough to handle being wiped by the windshield wipers. Also it seems quite hydrophobic. I've personally never seen this spray, the stuff i use comes from a bottle and is applied by wiping it on.
Hold on a second, this is my research expertise (kind of, just submitted my master's thesis on silica). if you EVER need to find out nearly anything about Silica, you need to read the book from Iler "The Chemistry of Silica: Solubility, Polymerization, Colloid and Surface Properties and Biochemistry of Silica" The silica particles you see here are aggregates, as the primary particles produced by precipitation are never larger than approx 50 nm, but they can be as small as approx 2 nm, depending on synthesis conditions again. These aggregates cannot be broken apart further, even by mechanical means, once they reach about 500 nm or so. They're very bulky, which indicates to me that they have been formed quite slowly and aren't poropus at all. But I think you're right, the coating isn't very good, because you can just... RUB OFF The silica off the surface. there isn't anything in the formulation that would make it stick to any surface, other than already existing glass... and even then, that doesn't occur until like 80°C at pH 9-10 ish.
You got all the instruments all of us could only dream of, costing big money, yet you did not think of letting the stuff just dry on the glass without wiping it off. Or simply do some real world tests. On this small sizes, even a few particles could make the water repel off, so simply scanning the glass will not tell you if it works. Especially since there is no scientific method behind all these testing: we need first to check how much pure glass repels water, how much other substances help, THEN compare their scanned images, so we can draw conclusions about the method itself! you were using (scanning them and draw conclusions based on their visual appearance and measurements). In fact I saw videos where they just simply used such substances and compared them in real world usage, and a few of them actually worked well. That simple test was a lot more useful. Even a lot more scientific.
Youd likefly have better results using either automotive application ceramic coat. Or furniture applicator ceramic 2 part applicators, or something like Rubio Mono Coat. All hydrophobic and much more robust id think.
The "ceramic" ingredient could just be a minor addition of old-fashioned tripoli abrasive (automotive rubbing compound) or even diatomaceous earth, both of which are natural forms of silica. Run the crude material through a ball mill and you have nanoparticles. So it's just an ordinary ceramic polishing compound. Not something that generates a ceramic coating other than leaving some ceramic debris on the polished surface.
The ceramic coatings used on automobile paint expect the surface to be completely unlike a new glass slide. Paint under magnification looks like the surface of the moon. Very rough and uneven. The ceramic spray grabs onto the defects in the paint, which is why it works. In the CNC booth, it might work better if there is some 'tooth' to the surface of the plexiglass, which there probably is because of all the micro blemishes due to flying chips from the milling head.
These ceramic sprays are more like quick detailer / clean up solution to make things have a more slick surface and make them more water repellant. You should give the same test to Ceramic Nano Coatings that they sell in tiny bottles and see how that stacks up and see if thats a scam or not because theres companies out there charging anywhere from $50-500 per tiny bottle of the stuff and allegedly it hardens to some kind hard finish.
This would be such a great idea for a full video series! There are so many products advertising with magic-nano-graphene-molecule technology! You get the product and find out the actual science behind the claims. This would be so interesting, both from a science and consumer standpoint
If you’re looking for a glass solution the best I’ve used is Crystal Fusion windshield coating. It’s a 2 step coating. Not an ad but I’ve worked a lot with vehicle body and exterior. Works a lot better than the sprays.
It seems worth keeping in mind that this is an incredibly cheap version of an very high end product. The amorphous silicone content of products like Cquartz is going to be far higher but that's also why they usually cost 10 times as much for a 20th of the amount. But they do work
Dont use glass application "ceramics" rather use metal protectant applications (like car metal clear coat "ceramic"), but better yet I think high end furniture seal ceramic is best for hardwood furnitures, cause humidity can literally ruin expensive woods and burl. So 2 part applications are thicker, and more repellant.
I’ve tried this Turtle Wax ceramic spray on my car and remain deeply unimpressed. Usually Turtle Wax products are reliable but this stuff has changed my view on that.
I came to the same conclusion, more or less. I got Meguiar's Ceramic Hybrid Vax. Applied to a car with a very decent paint, and according to the instruction, down to the "t". First impression was that it made paint "grabby", quite the opposite of what you'd expect from a "wax" protectant. I used car normally in the next few months, and my "Look & Feel" test were that there is little to no protection to the paint. Car got dirty just as if I never applied anything, and same conclusion was when I was washing it - there was no "just rinse the dirt off". Nope. Applied it to a vehicle with much worse paint, with same results. No "beading", no slickness, no noteable "washability" of the normal dirt layer. Waste of time and money. Im sure the expensive stuff works better than $15 from Walmart, but I reverted back to usual wax treatment. You can go to see the video about my experience here: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-hmv7QA8EMZs.html
What about a piece of glass that is subject to the elements? Like a a wind-shield or a window? The "elements" make invisible scratches, and the particles accumulate in and around them, and make the surface smoother. effectively eliminating places for gunk and grime to hitch.
Could it be that this product is made for cars thus focused on paint? Your glass slide is MUUCH flatter through a microscope than a car's paint, right? I'd imagine that the amophous silicon accumulates in the paint layer's micro scratches and orange peeling. Which through the microscope may look like pooling but in practice works as a shield?
you could try plasma activating the glass surface before spraying on the coating. Exposing the glass slide to ie a low pressure inductively coupled plasma will add reactive hydroxyl groups to the surface of the glass that will more readily bond to silica in the coating. this is the same process used in microfluidic microfabrication to bond glass to PDMS.
I'm not familiar with these products, but it confused me when you would wipe the product away immediately after applying. Wouldn't your results be significantly better by allowing it to dry?
Try a quality semipermanent ceramic coating. Not sure if I have this correct, but this type of coating contains ceramic crystals suspended in a resin. Most of these coatings have a much higher concentration of silica than the sprays. I've coated my car in this stuff and it definitely seems legit. The channel Warped Perception did a pretty good video on this. However didn't use any specialised equipment or in-depth know to analyse the samples.
Suggestion: instead of using the bottle the product came in, use a micron atomizer and try diluting the base product progressively, and then skip wiping the surface. From what I can tell is that the cloth is wiping the product off. It seems best to just a case of their directions is dooming the product. On the other hand, maybe you are supposed to wait and wipe it after you let it dry. One way to determine what is in the product is to get the MSDS on it, and also get hold of one of the other guys who has a XRF spectrometer and do a spectroscopic analysis of the dried chemicals [you would be best in this case to pour some into a shallow tray like a petri dish, a baking pan or a shallow steel, copper or aluminum dish, or a HDPE lid but in such a way that once it driest, you pull the product away from the container and support it in some kind of edge holder so you can just focus the X-rays on only the dried product.
