the wheels are presumably there to synergize with the commander's encore ability. if you throw creatures into your graveyard, and can bring them back with encore, then you didn't really lose them, and wheels tend to draw more cards than regular card draw effects, so you both, dig through a larger portion of your deck, and don't lose access to your best cards because you can always cast them later.
@@Cosmicgiant5070 To be fair, I just recently built a Sauron, Lord of the Rings deck, and as I was trying to figure out other good ways to fill up my graveyard besides mill cards, I realized wheels both fill your graveyard fast when you need to, and let you cycle through your deck for answer pretty efficiently. So I was sorta primed to see the massive value that wheels can generate. Maybe they just haven't built a deck with wheels in a while?
it's also some way to refill after dumping your hand of slivers onto the table if you deploy faster than opponents, then you can draft off your opponent's efforts to keep their own hands full, so you've both gone up more cards than the other players and not spent time and resources on other draw spells like they have, or paid the premium on spells that cost more because they replace themselves and of course now that you've incentivised everyone to wipe the board by filling it with threats, you'll come out of that with everything that got wiped and everything you discarded to the wheel ready to encore out of your graveyard and attack into the empty board with haste, as well as the new cards you wheeled into your hand. You are triplicating your wipe insurance.
I feel like you guys might be sleeping on Taunting Sliver. Slivers ARE going to be arch enemy at the table and having goad on etb with slivers will both provide a bit of protection (especially when recovering from a boardwipe) and clear your oppoents potential blockers for the next turn.
@paulcarpenter7210 the manabase is a little slower than I would like, but not useless. Out of the box Against other unmodified decks it will find its feet pretty quickly.
Suspicious Bookcase gives an early game blocker,which the deck has almost nothing to block with early game, but then it lets your drazi get through any board state late game. For 2 cmc this feels good and fits the deck well.
@@jayredharpstudios9672 I think being off topic was more the point. What you're saying has nothing to do with what I said. Addressing the usefulness of a card that came with a pre con has nothing to do with putting in crappy cards for flavor. You could have just made your own post. I think you should also get a job.
From a place of love, I have no idea how you guys agreed on Slivers being #1. For me they’re lower than the Eldrazi at least. All tap lands??? What was Wizards thinking man??
I'd argue if you fix the mana base in Sliver, you have the better deck because Eldrazi still feels like a bigger investment. Plus, the second commander that they didn't mention helps with mixing Slivers with other creature types(seen players play World Tree in their build and dump every creature they own onto the field by picking "Gods" while others worked with the better Eldrazi by giving them Slivers buffs using that commander). Will half agree though. You might be right that Eldrazi is the better-functioning deck but It's hard to rank these decks because the lot of them are incredibly bad. A very disappointing set of precons as usual.
Yeah. Out of the box no upgrades I was like slivers are number 4. With no tap lands and it would be amazing as it will be super fast but with tap lands it's so slow and everyone knows slivers are a problem so they will kill you before you get a chance
the lands are the worse but the rest of the cards are a lot better and more expensive, and the theme is inherently more coherent than the others since slivers support themselves.
For sure Slivers got an undeserved 1st place. People can say whatever they want about the other cards being powerful but as the old saying goes no matter how cool your card is, if you cannot cast it's useless. That ugly manabase and the fact they left out Sliver Hive are enough to throw this deck to 3rd or 4th.
@@PraetorGix its commander is leaps and bound better than the others, and you're way overstating how hard is it to cast. Battles between precons are slow, nobody is comboing off on turn 3, you will be able go cast your slivers
30:40 Windfall is fine IMO - wheeling your slivers from your hand into your graveyard then encoring them seems like a great way to lead to an explosive turn. Definitely depends on which sliver you're Encoring, though. If you ditch Legion into your graveyard with WIndfall, and can somehow dodge graveyard hate - having 3 copies of Legion on the board for 5 mana is pretty insane.
Yea not sure how you could read the commander, which rewards you having slivers in the graveyard, and then go "why are we trying to put cards in the graveyard??"
Another (extremely mean) suggestion for the enchantments deck is Out of Time. If you can reanimate out of time as a creature and sacrifice your commander/return her to hand somehow, you end up phasing every creature off the board permanently, including commanders (so that's why you wanna sacrifice her ahead of time). Super brutal and probably too backbreaking for most decks but worth a consideration if it's allowed in your playgroup
I think the idea behind Windfall in the Sliver deck is that you can dump a bunch of them into your graveyard to encore them while refreshing your hand while possibly disrupting what your opponents are trying to do. Do you want to do any of that? Probably not but that seems like why the card is there, it has some synergy with the deck.
I think its really funny that, much like WOTC, they didn't add sliver hive in the non-budget upgrades. Though I believe that they probably just forgot about it.
I used to get all the precons at once but it’s been ridiculous for the last two or three years. Now there’s like over a dozen precons a year, and now they’re over $100 right out the gate (I’ve seen the Eldrazi one listed for like 144 and I juuust got my first LOTR cards in the mail.
I goldfished this set last night. Commodore guff just owned it. But it did start with sol ring and another rock. Had chandra out at turn 4. +2 every turn and emblems on opponents ended up ticking for 5 life per turn, had 5 planeswalkers out and a copy of commadore guf. I -3 both to draw 10 deal 10 damage to each opponent. Had norns annex out and that just made it hard for the other decks to attack while already on lower life.
The Planeswalker deck has cards that let you copy planeswalker abilities. Leori, Jaya’s Phoenix, Chain Veil, and Oath of Teferi. I think the main way to upgrade this deck is to run ways to repeat planeswalker abilities, like Displacer Kitten, Rowan’s Talent, The Peregrine Dynamo, and the Lithofirm engine. And just keep using Planeswalker abilities, like say, Guffs -3 so you can spam them and push for victory.
@@CleazyMane-ef2cg most certainly. The creature base is pretty solid. But having the come in tapped fetch lands sucks for the premium price for a none premium product.
I get the wheel. It's there to help dump a lot of low drop slivers into the graveyard early so an explosive turn with Gravemother is possible. Turn 3 wheel away Sinew, Predatory, and Muscle; then Encore them all out the turn after Gravemother, and it's more or less instant Craterhoof lite (all slivers in that scenario get +9/+9 - meaning 105 power including Gravemother at 15 power). I could see a version of the deck wherein it's all "slivers that buff the team" + "slivers that grant evasion" + "Wheels and Loot" to get them into the bin. Jarad's Orders would be a great card here. 4 mana tutor a sliver to hand and to grave.
I mentioned this on the Discord, but am a big fan of Guff Rewrites History. Sure, it's a "0 for 0", but you clear out your opponents' best permanents, and you get to clear out some random token on your board to get a free spell off the top. My hot take is that it will become a commander staple, but it's definitely playable.
I'm likely going to build the alternate commander of Enduring Enchantments (I seem to not be the only one which is worrying) and Alseid seems like a slam dunk in that deck.
Narci looks so cool, art and abilities. Definitely one I want to do as well but forget about buying any of these decks for their prices, will get singles.
28:18 - I feel like you’re underselling Basal here. It’s not just itself, this is Ashnod’s Altar on a sliver body. You net mana if you encore it, and it turns other encores into rituals too (as long as they have less than 6 cmc, which is almost all of them)
I think Guff is most comfortable as a kind of Stax commander. You already have access to Blue/White which gets you a lot of good cards to slow down the game and discourage people from attacking you. A number of the cards included with the precon also help shape the battlefield in ways the limit your exposure to attacks and as I've been tinkering with the deck I've gotten the most success leaning into this kind of slow, defensive playstyle. Once you have a solid defensive base you can start playing planeswalkers and lots of them. Individual planeswalkers may have their own wincons, however once you get a critical mass of planeswalkers you can just start -3ing Guff to do damage to the entire table multiple times a turn, and resummoning Guff from the CZ to hit more. Even assuming *everyone* is still at 40 health, you can do upwards of 10-20 damage a turn to each other player using Guff like this in your endgame.
I was hoping wwould see a video like this soon! Great as always. If I hadn't locked the eldrazi deck at 80$ before the reveal I would not get it, but I've wanted a colorless deck for awhile and this seems like a decent enough shell to upgrade. I'm surprised you guys didn't have anything to say about ghostfire initiate! That card is super interesting to me and almost begs to be the commander of a different colorless deck with like steel overseer and walking ballista and friends.
Windfall is a fun card to cast when you have 1-3 cards in hand, which the slivers deck is likely to. Someone at the table is likely to have 6-7 which makes it a +4 or +5 Making your opponents wheel is usually more disruptive than helpful.
The thing with arasta is that you get a decent defensive body and no one will stop playing cards to prevent you from getting a 1/2 so its pretty much free value considering ramp spells exist and most people play non-permanent based removal.
Whoa, never got this early to a video, thanks for this breakdown, was a bit interested in some of these, but I'm still not sure if I'm ready to go back to buying wizards products, kinds got burned out back since Dominaria United
I think Basal Sliver is low-key a game ender in a deck with Sliver Gravemother! You pay for Encore with generic mana, so let's say you have the Gravemother and Basal Sliver out and you encore for 2. That nets you 6 black mana. So you can go infinite just like that. If you have even a bad mana filter like Signpost Scarecrow, you have access to infinite mana of any color. Imagine Encoring a First Sliver and have every Sliver you cast Cascade three times! Or if you have a nice and full yard, you can create a humongous horde of slivers with this little guy!
I just realized that with Sliver Gravemother and a mana filter out, one Buried Alive could probably win you the game, as long as you throw a Haste giving Sliver in the bin along with Basal Sliver and The First Sliver... If you already have Basal Sliver out, you can throw in a Sliver that allows them to tape for mana and you've got access to all colors ad infinitem as well!
Its not really infinite since when you Encore it exiles the creature as part of the cost. Still a great interaction for making an insane amount of mana for a finisher since a lot of slivers are on the low end.
@@RPGFanboy14 Drats, you are right! I was too focused at the end of the ability that said the tokens were sacrificed, instead of exiled at end of combat... Forgot to look at the first bit of text... xD
got slivers for $64 and pulled a full art foil demonic tutor in the sample collector pack! Sold the Eldrazi to my roommate for the same $64 plus tax and shipping
There are wheels because you are discarding before you draw and the commander gives slivers encore. Discard slivers to draw more slivers to play and cast the ones in your gravetard with encore to have three of them this turn and hopefully win with one large combat.
sry but planeswalker for me is the best deck if you look at value and making it better.. check jayas phoenix and especially onakke, also for me the best manabase out of the 4(with mystic gate!) maybe if you have money left just add 2 or 3 tutors and maybe one land out and you put atraxa in and you are fine, also you can use the reprints for other decks, especially on the landside.. and sliver is for me the badest set out of them, no sliver hive (which is essentinal to play sliver) no Sliver legion, bad landbase.. you have to invest so much money to make this deck good. And the playerbase agree with this, the price went down from almost 100 to 70 euros in EU. And good luck finding a Sliver hive now, if you are late, for a good price ^^ Eldrazi looks like a random summory of cards to have eldrazis great again.. also missing some important cards. Endurance is nr. 2 for me, looks superfun. Planeswalker also is the chepeast deck in EU with 58 euros. I dont know about your magic experience but saying planeswalker is the weakest set out of them is just wrong^^
i got eldrazi on preorder price for £80 (aprox $125) did you judge that deck too harshly due to the price of awkward inflating vendors and 2nd markets, also ive seen alot of games with people playing a pod of these and each game tends to go guff is killed first due to being useless or never really gets to go off, slivers seem intimidating but are constantly getting slapped, eldrazi is targeted due to putting out big threats each turn and is argueably the strongest deck but becomes archenemy, and the enchantment deck wins the vast majority of times
Talking about the difficulty with cataloging the card "Rise of the Eldrazi"..... I was making a mono blue deck and wanted to only include the free counterspells. Try looking for the card "foil"
I did go ahead and pre order the Sliver Swarm. I've always wanted to build a deck sround Sliver, but never had the money to. That will be a great start. The only other one I wanted was the Eldrazi, but i already have an Eldrazi deck i built.
Thanks for giving the Enduring Enchantments deck some much needed love :) All enchantress reprints are awesome and some of the precon-specific cards such as the 3/3 who doubles your enchants are likely to become future staples. Currently in Europe you can get it for as low as ~50€ and at that price, I'd say it's a no brainer if you want to play any enchantment-based deck but dont have any of the cards yet. I'll agree that lands could've been better though.
The few problems I have with Eldrazi unbound is that not enough big Eldrazi, X mana wiffs with cascade, and counters really? I don’t think counters work for a sub theme and should have been just eldrazi. Manifesting isn’t too bad but I don’t see it sticking around with upgrades.
Mystic gate is also on the Pw deck. You can also turn your PWs into dragons via Sarkhan :) but yeah among the 4, probably the most difficult to pull off a win
Day 21 of guessing the Moxfield ad at 16:44. The only two precons I'm considering buying are the Enchantments one and the Eldrazi one. It might just make more sense to buy the new singles, but sadly they're almost as expensive, if not more so right now, than getting the whole deck itself. Of course that's just preorder pricing.
I've been testing a proxy of For the Ancestors in a few tribal decks, and twice today I drew 0 cards off it despite playing it in a deck with 30+ creatures of the tribe. Whiffing once would be too many times for me, Harmonize would have been better.
Guff, uunfortunately, feels like it points to mass LD as the best path to upgrade-especially in the colors of Sunder, Amageddon, and Jokulhaups. Especially because its in the colors of pay to attack as well. Edition
I've watched a few games between the precons on other channels and the Sliver deck almost always performs the worst simply because of the awful mana base. Almost every land comes out tapped and by the time it's ready to pop off the enchantment deck has already flooded the board or the Eldrazi deck is swinging with annihilator at everyone. Now after upgrades is another thing entirely lol.
I‘m not sure if I should be glad that I preordered before the prices went up insanely high or mad that I bought these as my first decks because I didn’t know this wasn’t the default pricing on precons.
Depends on how much you paid. I’m not buying any of them, just bought two LotR precons… I’ll wait until either the price tanks or just buy singles to build my own version of the enchantments.
If you got them for like $80 then that’s not _too_ bad (though still overpriced). Damn shame about the price though, because at least 3 of these precons are extremely cool.
Lol, the planeswalker party is fun to be annoying, but I have played a couple games to where I generated about 20-30 3/3 tokens off of one turn, gave them all flying and just demolished players, it is certainly a deck that is able to win, it’s just unconventional.
i was getting the p;\laneswalker deck to take apart for my Atrexa planeswalker deck but i cancelled the order and well i have 2 sliver decks ( they function a bit different from each other)and a eldrazi deck already so no need to pay for the over priced decks. also i have yet to get emrakul out in play from my deck and unlike the precon it has all titans.
