Could THAAD & Patriot Defend Guam From 200 Chinese DF-26 Ballistic Missiles? (WarGames 205) | DCS 

Tried here, can't make the intercept in DCS for some reason: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-JkG8FH8VyUM.html

@@grimreapers With Chinese DF-26 Missiles

Let me guess it would get all of them

@@Jermo7899 Yeah because of Range, and powerful radio of the S-400.

@@Mr.Su-35Flanker-E bahahahah sure thing buddy xD can't intercept gmlrs with even 50% intercept ratio good luck with even harder target xD

Yes it's a limitation we have.

Tanksoldier, you are going to get a bunch of Chinese and Russian fanboi's to comment on how you are wrong and their missiles including Khinzal are all unstoppable and that you should stop looking at western propaganda and buy the bullshit they are selling.

I hope she'll be OK man. Don't keep yourself from enjoying now while she's still here by worrying when she might not be here though. One day at a time man, good luck👍🏽🫡

Don't worry. USA exports war. China doesn't.

why is she there?

It's all but guaranteed that these simulations are inaccurate. Purely because the info necessary to truly make accurate simulations is classified by several different parties.

Hard agree, I think the more modern patriot systems being modelled here are a lot more capable (probably difficult to model in DCS tho?)

I think one of the bigger issues is that because the missiles don't come down as steeply- it makes intercepting them actually a lot harder because the lateral movement is so much higher. Altitude is easier to intercept I would imagine because it simply slides the point forward but, with how high the lateral velocity is with it, the point is slid so much farther ahead that the missiles don't actually get to their designed altitudes for intercept and thus seem to have a higher fail-rate. That's just my speculation of course, correct me if I'm wrong of course.

@@Joe_IRL I think that difficulty might not be that big of an issue because we’re talking about CurrentHill-he’s an absolutely brilliant modder and he’s achieved so many difficult things already that I think he definitely could fix the Patriot if he put his mind to it…

Do you mean to say America should never lose?

@Daniel-yh9dz I mean to say that all of the SAMS in game that would be firing at these exo-atmospheric missiles would likely have worse hit performance as a result. In this case, it's Patriot and THAAD. However, those are not the only SAM systems they use in their war games. I don't know why you took a comment about a potential problem with simulation accuracy into "America cannot lose" but, it is your life to do with as you please.

That’s basically cheat code

@@sweatybotfn9982 yeah. anything even remotely maneuverable above mach 5 is impossible to intercept in DCS

Yup could add all of that.

I think they are trying to see how CHs stuff that stretches the limits of DCS. The real THAAD does not work well yet and this is NOT a realistic depiction of how THAAD works any way. THAAD is designed to fill the gap in the SM-3 coverage at extreme altitude way above what was depicted here. Integrated defense is what would really be employed. THAAD is a one trick pony that is just apart of a more comprehensive coverage. You want to simulate this correctly you need a real simulator not a game. DCS has the same bad physics as Flat Earthers ... not a joke the Earth is flat in DCS and worse yet there is a bounding box. This is a dead end.

Only the visuals are flat in dcs...

@@themusikpainters6707 NO it has a bounding box. There is no real physics emulation in DCS of any kind most especially the gravitational environment. It is literally flat Earth. It fudges the range radars can see you but the environment is flat Earth. The bounding box is well below the altitude these missiles operate. Its not just that there just no real physics emulation at all. Its more like a 1980s video game like Marathon. DCS is still mostly a single processor application and you just can't do all that physics for so many things on one processor. Its extremely primitive. Its just a game.

​@@grimreapers Do😮👍🏼

Sounds like a story teller

Right there would definitely be a few destroyers around

It can do it now its just not widely deployed. We have it mounted on aircraft and ships right now.

@@HyperionTwo I know of the HELIOS mounted on some cruisers bud didn't know the carriers had them mounted at this point. All still under development. Would be neat to see an early rendition in DCS

not sure how effective thermal lasers will be against RVs designed to survive re-entry

@@hughmungus2760 there are two types of directed energy weapons used for defense. you re correct that lasers deal damage thermally which will have to overcome the re-entry defense of the missiles. however, re-entry ballistic missiles will most likely either be using ablative plating that will be mostly removed during re-entry, thus making it vulnerable to heat, or will still have it's re-entry shield attached, which will after re-entry already be extremely hot after absorbing the heat of re-entry. in both cases, they will not have very much more shielding than needed, becuase extra weight means lower ranges/speeds and/or higher costs, so in both cases their heat shielding would be near their limits when the lasers come into play. i will admit however, that as laser defenses become more commonplace additional anti-laser defenses will likely be implemented, but it's unlikely for them to be implemented BEFORE the mass deployment of laser defenses. the second directed energy weapon in development and starting to be deployed is microwave emitters. the upside is that these attempt to directly scramble and overload the electronics and therefore mostly bypass thermal protection. the bad news is they are shorter range than lasers and more of an area deterrent rather than a single target point defense, but as you would expect a missile swarm to all generally be striking form a roughly similar attack path, a single microwave defense emitter that disables 20% of the incoming missiles paired with several lasers to target the no-disabled missiles would be useful, i will admit though, that form my understanding of their intended use, microwave air defense would not be particularly effective against ballistic missiles, as there lack of range and the relative simplicity of the missile electronics would be difficult to have meaningful effect fast enough, but microwave emitters are much more designed to be effective at disabling drone swarms or aircraft. if you're under attack form missiles there's no reason not to use the microwave emitter, it's just not the best defensive weapon for the job.

Lasers are cool tech, but they wouldn't be effective here. The incoming missile is too fast, too massive, and therefore has too much momentum. Lasers also suffer from various atmospheric effects impacting their accuracy and intensity such as water droplets, salt particles, dust, dirt, pollutants, etc.

A quick internet search seems to show that only submarines are based in Guam, so it's entirely possible that a attack is timed when no ships are close enough to help defend Guam. However... they are working on land based Aegis with SM-6, so that can definitely help and iirc, there's also talks about building a new missile defense system in Guam to help counter cruise missiles. Since the land based Aegis will be part of MDA (missile defense agency), technically the answer is no.

@@Blank27 IIRC they're planning to build an incredibly complex missile defence around guam. It would use a short range and cheap missile system to protect against cruise missiles and suicide drones, similar to iron dome, allowing for patriot, AEGIS ashore and THAAD missiles to be reserved for higher priority targets. What I've just described doesn't do it justice TBH, theres several new radar types and installations, satellite integration for long-range missile tracking and a new networking system to link literally all of these systems together to form a cohesive defence. There was also talk of permenantly moreing retired ticonderoga cruisers for missile defence at Guam, but my guess would be the fact that this was ever even considered spurred the system i described's development.

I was stationed In Guam, And yes only subs for the most part are there, its also a major stop off point for most things heading to Asia. There is always.a destroyer, cruiser etc in the area.

Yes but the simulation would quickly become more complex as AShBMs and long range AShMs would have to be calculated then as well increasing the number drastically.

Park the uss nj there ..see what happens

Everyone should see Threads.

Like Australia can travel for three hours at highway speeds and still be on the same farm.@@maqthedon8969

WTF are you talking about? Minot Air Force Base is in North dakota, damn near to the Canadian border nowhere near Wyoming😅 Now Warren Air Force Base is down near Cheyenne, but none of the missile silos are. There are a few scattered launch silos in wyoming, though I'm pretty sure they've all been deactivated by this point in time. But pretty much all the major ICBM fields are located in North and South Dakota Montana and just a very very few wherever in Wyoming. But hey it's a cool made-up story, if you ignore facts😂

@@Wyomingchief Warren still controls 3 squadrons of 50 missiles each. All east of Cheyenne, there's more than a few in that border corner of Wyoming, with most across in Nebraska and the adjacent area of Colorado. But yeah, a bloody long way from Minot!

No method that I can think of off top of my head.

did you search his videos? tons of info about what you are asking

Difficult to answer TBH, seems to depend per scenario.

Can try.

I mean thats assuming the DF missiles hit nothing of value.

Well considering they were basically setting on the runway you can't really get any closer and know it wouldn't make any difference anyway. And just remember that all these ballistic missiles in DCS have basically 100% hip probability when they're targeted at something which is way way way way way way way way way way way way way way way way way way way way way way way😂😂😂

That's assuming China is not using a tactical nuclear-tipped warhead

Idek if he'd be allowed to help them lol thats kinda encroaching on telling secrets territory

I work with HLC, I've talked to him about reaching out to the grim reapers a few times. He's got a bunch of stuff going on right now so he doesn't have a lot of free time.

@@ROTNReaper yup he is a busy man but very funny

@sbjchef I wish the internet wasn't so sensitive and he could be as funny as he is in real life, but people get mad easy so..

@@ROTNReaper Ain't that the truth oh and can we get a refund on those last two tridents that fell in the sea 🤣

modernized kirov won't be hypothetical considering that Admiral Nakhimov is currently under refit. The question is... when the hell will she be on the sea again

⁠@@Mgaming61I didn’t know she was under refit but imagine all those vls Silos with hypersonics, I assume she’s priority and wont be in dry dock forever like the carrier

@@buckintion7627 yeah... hopefully. And if all the reports are accurate to some degree, she'll be one hell of a ship

Yeah I'm sure the kirov will be just as Unsinkable as their other ships😂😂

I don't think any Kirov's have been modernized yet have they??

There is a lofting version we have used a number of times. I could give a very long answer but the short answer is dcs problems. Dcs missile code is different for each type of missile. So air to air missiles are not the same as surface to surface.

We have loft missiles now, we have a lofting set and a non-lofting set. Each has pros and cons so I use the version most suited to the battle.

that doesn't even make any sense. DF-26 travels @mach8.6 C-RAM has a range of 3.6km. it would take 1.25 seconds to reach the target. before the C-RAM even realises there's a target it would be destroyed. just count to 1.25 seconds. that's the time it takes. 1.25seconds BOOM. in fact maximum theoretical speed of C-RAM targets is 1000m/s, that's in best case scenario in perfect conditions and not real life which is must lower. DF-26 travels @3000m/s. C-RAMs weren't made to destroy these type of targets. it's like trying to sink a carrier with a bb gun. doesn't even have any logic. to put in perspective the cost of a single THAAD missile is $23.65 million. the cost of a C-RAM system is around $10 million. so to answer your question the C-RAM wouldn't even move let alone even attempt to track anything and not even mentioning firing accurately.

​@@riskinhosI like your answer better I just keep telling people that they should learn math it's important😂

I'm guessing you are commenting on the wrong video. Because number one it doesn't make any sense why you're talking about Naval defense on this video. And number two if that's such a great idea maybe you should try to go get it patented or maybe talk to somebody in the military because it just sounds like a meth ramble to me😂😂

lol yeah realised that afterwards and I am sure about the locomotion soft robots swim good Jim. The sonar would really depend on what the U.S submariners service has in it's database. @@Wyomingchief

hmm I'm a bit scared of saying anything that's classified these days. Prefer to stick to wiki open source.

I doubt he'd be able to say much as classified?

It's pretty small TBH. Tiny brain.

Yeah I'm not sure that's entirely accurate. I have a family member stationed on Guam and he has said that there are more than two separate THAAD batteries. Cuz I was talking to him about if he was worried about this type of attack. His response was what they print in the paper as far as our air defense batteries and capabilities are Wei Wei underestimated.😂 Him and I brought up the fact about the article that you're talking about, he just laughed and said yeah that's kind of funny

meanwhile UK Flubs 2 Trident launches in a row.

Maybe we were aiming at Florida??

Ahh the water missile, yes 90% will fail… nothing to worry about 😂

ballistic missiles

I don't actually know but I assume around 1 million ft.

@@grimreapers I mean I guess as long as they have fuel to burn to re-enter earths atmosphere then yeah it might be legit but 1 million feet is a LOT

@@immaturebread69 Then you might be surprised to learn than an old RAND paper says that for a 5000 km shot you can expect a ballistic missile to climb about 1000 km. Which is around 3.3 million feet.

True. And this mod would make the PAC-2 even less useful because for some reason CurrentHill set its max speed at around MACH 4 while there’s a publicly available Raytheon infographic from 2002 saying that both PAC-2 GEM-T and PAC-3 travel at “MACH 5+” 🤷‍♂️

plus, the fragmentation damage is simply less effective at stopping a terminal stage missile than a kinetic kill, although i don't know how DCS models the 'health' of missiles vs their impact or ability to accurately target, or just has a pass/fail of 'was it intercepted and therefore removed or not', so the in game modeling might be an approximation of reality

​@@delphy2478in DCS the missile being hit with anything is considered an intercept kill, and the missile blows up. You can intercept missiles with .50 cals in DCS if you slow their speed down enough to hit them.

I'd argue that frags are actually very useful. It's not your common grenade with small pieces of shrapnel and metal. The PAC-2 Warhead is slinging pure steel slugs and massive chunks of metal into the incoming missile at a 1000 meters per second (for that brief travel time). That fragmentation can punch holes through reinforced concrete as if it isn't even there. It will absolutely mangle an incoming missile.

@@ObiWanShinobi917 interesting, thanks for the clarification.

Well the ram would be absolutely worthless and if you don't understand why you should probably study math a little more. Nathan's basically the same reason besides which they're not designed to track let alone try to intercept a missile that's going mach 10😂😂

You can ask him directly in the DCS forums

Or contact CH his self he has a presence on the internet that's pretty widespread or at least pretty accessible

Guessing you didn't watch the video huh

Thaad should easily be able to intercept an SR-71 as it's going half the speed and 1/10 the altitude of a long range ballistic missile.

Yes super easily.

Why they would be useless. They literally by the time they are in range to be able to fire, they have less than 2 seconds to intercept them. Math is very important you should probably understand it better

Math is very important. If you know math you know why that question is kind of funny😂😂

Same with all Chinese equipment. In DCS, PRC missiles work BETTER than their propaganda.

its a 2000kg warhead so landing it anywhere on anderson will do major damage

@@hughmungus2760 if shielded by reinforced concrete the effects would be negleable 15 meters away, and to really destroy the runway you need a direct hit

@@maxlin3442 I was going to say more like things such as hangers, maintenance buildings, radars, fuel tanks and ammo depots Also, china does have anti-runway submunition for their warheads too

@@hughmungus2760 submunition?from a missile over mach 5? They're gonna burn before they got to the ground, and even if they did the runway could be repaired in 3 hours

Yup fair comment, what I was really interested in is how many missiles would get through, rather than the actual target hits.

你知道的还真不少呐。在中国他们也做一样的模拟，但是他们会用DF17来打航母。

This is nothing more than supposition. This contempt for our adversaries is dangerous.

它在2020年8月不是命中了移动靶船么？

lol yes fair comment.

Lol no.

I'm guessing you didn't pay any attention to the video you just came on here to make a comment based off nothing.😂😂

Pentagon says 200 DF-26 in latest report.

I'll yield to you on that, my friend. My data must be old, they said 86. @@grimreapers

@@miked6184200-250 is the Yr 2021 estimated figure according to wikipedia

The DF26s terminal speed would be much much lower than its max speed... it wouldn't be higher than mach 10. Also interception isn't all about speed.. its more about positioning and trajectory.

@@user-ft2zc5or9d Don't forget a lot of these modern missiles also have evasive and anti-jamming capability thanks to AI. Furthermore, when you lock into an incoming missile, the time it takes to hit the target matters....If your missiles takes Mach 3.5 and the incoming missile is travelling a Mach 10, isn't it a bit too late ?

Did you bother to watch the whole video

Haven;t heard anything yet.

You must work at the Pentagon. Congratulations on being so important.

@@shawnsdrop doesn’t take much effort to find The truth. But seems the truth hurts you.

@Zhujac oh, you don't take compliments well.

@@Zhujac remember what Sun Tzu says about being powerful or being weak.

Lolno. Anything can be intercepted. THAAD was made specifically built to counter ballistic missiles.

Chinese spies deleting comments on youtube....