Umpires should take note! This guy did an excellent job of moving to stay in the "wedge", close but out of the way. This allowed him to be in position to clearly see the tag attempt when the runner finally stopped dancing around and went for the plate. In our area, umpires tend to camp in one spot in the area of first base line extended with their line of sight often becoming blocked by the runner.
He did all that great and still blew the call. This girl was almost 3 full feet out of the base path(6 feet from the center of the base path) during that dance just before she dove for the plate. The initial tag attempt set the base path when the catcher lunged to get her mitt in front of the plate.
Coach blew it by not contesting rule book, that runner absolutely was outta the base path. Umpire coulda called her out also, but the coach missed his duty. Catcher should have known the rule too. Best coaches teach the players the rules for moments like this.
@@tnorthrup2711 Runner was never out of her base path. I think the correct way to look at this is the catcher's initial move was to cover the plate, not tag the runner. After reaching the plate, she then then began her tag attempt, which then established the base path.
@@mikemorgan5015 Yeah you got that Mike I didn't figure it out until the very last video footage she's clearly beyond 3 feet. She establishes the home plate line and then she gets three feet from there she's probably four or five feet out.
the batters box is 3ft wide x 7ft deep. It's 3ft from the center of home plate to the back of the box. This runner was running down the base line to home plate until the catcher turned to make the tag. At that point she is allowed 3ft to avoid being tagged out. She went about 3ft behind the box which means she went approx 6ft to avoid the tag. That puts her well outside the 3ft cushion to avoid a tag. She is out by rule, no run.
I have never seen a play like that before, but I have to agree that she left the running path to avoid the tag. By rule, she should have been called out.
Boy did you make that simple by using the size of the box! I had it the same way. She's her own body length from the plate and then dives in. Good call.
I think the OP meant stay at the plate after she had the ball.. she pulled her glove away from the plate for about 2 seconds.. long enough for the runner to reach and touch it.
First off this is really really great baseball. This is an amazing play it's very athletic and extremely difficult to call. I could see where the Umpire would not rule that the runner was out of the base path as he is concentrating on the tag. We all have the benefit of watching this over and over. Instant replay if you will. Sadly, here's the rule, Any runner is out when she runs more than three-feet away from his base path to avoid being tagged unless his action is to avoid interference with a fielder fielding a batted ball. So we have to assume that this player is likely 5 ft 5 inches tall, her last attempt at touching home plate has her arms extended and diving towards the plate. That puts her at least four feet from the established base path. She establishes the base path 10 ft from home plate when she is standing on the line as the tag play ensues. I argue that this situation is almost humanly impossible for the Umpire to track with one set of eyeballs. He's in good position to make this call. It's just a difficult call to make when you're trying to factor in distance. His focus is on the tag. That's the great thing about baseball or softball, which is the human element. It's all about the Umpire's judgment whether you agree or disagree. It's kind of like life isn't it?
Id disagree. She is where the catcher normally receives a pitch. As I am currently sitting at a fastpitch game 1st base line even with the plate, that is roughly 3ft from the plate. She also didnt run out to avoid the tag. The reason she looks so far out is that as she drops (nearly straight down to touch the unprotected plate), she kicks her legs out. At full speed, looks like she dives forward.
out......out of the baseline to avoid the tag.......I realize we've had time to review it so I don't fault the umpire for having to make the safe call in real time
And here I was merely impressed that Oklahoma has on the 2022 Softball Roster a Pitcher with an 0.10 E.R.A. at a highpoint in the season. Oh well. Shows me!😂😮⚾️B.W.
She did. Way before the base runner went by way of China to get back to the plate. The catcher was already waiting for her. Runner should have been called out. You can't run to the bleachers to avoid a tag.
When catcher was laying on plate all she had to do was tell umpire she wanted the appeal play when runner passed the plate. Runner out on appeal, play over.
@@olivialewis2391 Excuse me? What? Where did you hear that BS? The base path is the direct line between the runner and the base when the tag attempt is made. If the runner deviates more that 3ft from that line, he/she is OUT!
@@olivialewis2391 Otherwise, if you had a player with excellent lateral agility, every play at the plate would look like the closing chase scene from an episode of The Benny Hill Show, "Yakety Sax" and all! Haha! If that doesn't make sense, search for a video. Funny stuff!
If softball is the same as baseball, the “baseline” is established only when a defender is attempting a tag on a runner. At that point, the baseline is a direct line from the runner’s position to the next base or back to the previous base. This is the part of the rule that is often missed since it is fairly rare for a runner to be that far out of the straight line from one base to the next. It would be weird but a baseline could be established 10 feet into the outfield grass if the runner ran out that far prior to a tag being attempted. With that being said, it appeared to be a close call as to whether the catcher was attempting a tag or simply falling when the runner jumped to the side & whether it was more than 3 feet out.
Definitely not out of baseline. Not even close. Catcher needs to smother the plate. Give no access. They make the mistake of trying to get to the runner rather than protect the plate.
@@gregoryk.9815 you're correct. She should have been out. She was quite a bit more than 3 feet outside the baseline. Also the one guy said the catcher should have smothered the plate. That's also illegal. She was out, plain and simple.
@@jasonnies2169 A fielder in possession of the ball can be wherever they want to be on the field, including smothering a base if so inclined. There are no restrictions.
Sorry about that but if you look closely at the slow motion replay the runner is clearly more than three feet behind the plate. The real question is did that run decide the game?
@@jasonnies2169 You're wrong on both counts. Once a line is established, the runner can stay in that line as a base runner. The runner is allowed to try to evade the catcher, and since she never left the line she established, she was not out of the base path. Once the catcher, or any defensive player on a base has the ball, they can block or smother the base if they choose to do so.
My novice opinion is that her feet were more than three feet from the path from which she was running and she basically did a half circle around the plate- that seems out of base path (which I looked up the rules) and since the ball did not change hands the path could not change direction either.... right? Totally objective opinion here since I don't follow any of these teams.
The runner definitely moved out of the base path to score. She is out, umpire missed the call. She clearly went behind home plate, then returned to score.
She's not out of the basepath. The rule is that when a tag is first attempted, **from that point**, the runner must follow a direct path to the next or previous base, with leeway of 6 feet (3 on either side). Pause the video at 0:34... she is already a good couple of steps to the foul side of the 3B line when the tag is first attempted. At no point does she get more than 3 feet from the catcher after that point. (Also, the catcher stops "attempting" a tag, lays on the ground, then tries again, at which point the runner is already nearly at the plate.) It's a correct no-call.
I know I'm probably missing something and it's really not that important to me, but I'm curious. I could've sworn having a runner behind you creates a force out type of situation and as long as the player has the ball, all they have to do is touch the base before the lead runner. Does that only happen with the bases loaded or are softball rules different than baseball? I'm probably just misremembering, but I figured I'd ask.
Regarding the "3' out her her base path" argument, let's do a little math. The runner is approaching the plate running on the foul side of the foul line. That line extends from the back point of home plate. For the runner to violate the 3' rule when avoiding the tag, she must go more than 3' away from the back point of the plate. How can we judge that? (This is where it either becomes fun, or your eyes will glaze over.) The batter's box is 7' long. From the middle of the plate, where the straight lines meet the angled lines, to the front of the batter's box is 4'. From the middle of the plate to rear of the batter's box must, therefore, be 3'. From the middle of the plate to the back point is 8.5". The distance from the back point of the plate to the rear of the batter's box is 2' 3.5". (36" - 8.5" = 27.5") So, the runner has 8.5" to spare, beyond the back of the batter's box. To me, it does not appear that she is more than 8.5" beyond the batter's box.
3 Feet typically using the center of gravity of the runner drawing a line straight down. Whiler her feet seem to be more than three feet away her center of gravity seem to be over the baseline of the batters box. The measure from the center of the plate to that line is 3 Feet. Her base bath was just inside the fair foul line into foul territory so it was a close call. Arguably her feet were beyond the three feed however parts of her were taggable within the three feet.
Runners routinely go outside the 3 foot margin when running and rounding bases. Turning a sharp ankle when rounding 1st to second would stop momentum and be an ankle breaker.
@@cuivre2004 the base path is only set once a tag attempt is being made which is why you can round the bases all you want when there isn’t a tag attempt. In the MLB at least, when the tag attempt is made (fielder with ball) the base path is a straight line from the runner to the base with three feet of room on each side of the line.
She is out of the base path but the catcher should’ve been covering the whole plate so I kinda understand why the runner got at an angle where the plate wasn’t covered
What is the base path? Baserunner went to the back side of the plate. (I am not saying she left the base path, but just asking.) But, the catcher should have just stayed down. It was when she started to get up that the baserunner dived for the plate.
The base path is where you are within arms reach of the plate. But you are allowed to overrun the plate quite a way and still return to touch the plate safe if you missed it.
In a nutshell, the base path is a straight line from the runner's body to the base she is attempting to reach. It moves with the runner until a fielder with the ball begins her tag attempt. At that point the base path essentially becomes frozen and the runner cannot deviate more than 3' to either side of the line. In this case contrary to what some folks are saying, the runner stayed within her base path the entire time. Here, the distance can easily be judged by referencing the batter's box which in fastpitch softball is 3' x 7'. The catcher's initial move was to cover the plate, not tag the runner. After getting to the plate she then attempted to make the tag.
at the :43 mark, the runner establishes a new basepath. She is outside the batters box by 3-6 inches. The batters box is 3 feet wide plus the 6 inches of the outside line to the plate. The catcher does a "tag" that barely gets into the batters box and is no where near the player. There is not a 3 foot violation here. The catcher then retracts her extension in an attempt to get up and the runner establishes a new basepath.
I totally agree, should have been called out for being out of baseline to avoid tag. That seldom gets called. Remember it was the golden child of softball.
@@mikemorgan5015 rules state from where the tag is applied, not from the runners path. Once the catcher attempts a second tag attempt the 3 ft line is moved. She was definitely close to being out of base path.
@@cablepup1980 That's incorrect. There is only one tag attempt in question here. The second one was just after she scored. She was out of the base path after the first one and before the second, but that's irrelevant. Once a tag is attempted, THAT establishes "THE" base path, not "A" base path. In MY OPINION the rule is there to keep this play, and more egregious ones, of course, from happening. That said, the base path CAN change if the runner attempts to retreat to the previous base, and again whenever the runner's base selection changes(as in caught in a rundown). In this instance, since she didn't attempt to go back to 3rd, there was only ONE base path in this video. In MY OPINION, it is written this way to reward a good fielding and timely throw and prevent dances like this. She was caught dead to rights and should have been tagged. If the throw was better, or the catcher didn't slip, this video wouldn't have even been posted. She ultimately scored, but went outside the rules, as written, to do it and the umpire didn't catch it. The coach for the defense did immediately though.
@@rebelp311 Dick fricking Tracy. I keep rewatching it and he keeps making the same error. Maybe if I watch it some more the result will change. Oh well, back to it.....
See in Baseball in HS and College ball you have't slide you cannot be standing up at home plate bc they make you attempt to score on the play slideing not standing up. If you look at the play you reconize that the runner should of never took off for home she should of played it safe smart softball not stupid like she did. Smart ball always win games not stupid ball.
Definitely out of the base path. Out. In baseball and softball the rule is that a runner cannot deviate more than 3 feet to avoid a tag. Since umpires do not carry tape measures the way to determine this is if she moved beyond a step and a reach of the tag. Naturally this is a judgement call but I would have called her out.
The 3 foot rule begins when the tag attempt begins. It does not begin when the fielder receives the ball and the 3 feet are judged from where the GLOVE is in relation to the runner, NOT the fielder to whom the glove is attached. She was well within the rules.
Leaves the baseline to avoid a tag. Period. You can leave the baseline, but not to avoid a tag. How is she standing 4 feet behind home plate and not considered out of the baseline?
Totally out of the baseline. At one point was dancing in the umpires box. Might as well make a run around the other teams on deck circle while she was at it
Too much leeway given to runners now. No runner should be allowed to run completely around a base to avoid a tag. You see videos of it on every base path now with runners veering 20' off the base path to avoid a tag. It's not in the spirit of the game.
@@taylorrr099 3 feet either side of where the runner is at the time of the attempted play on the runner....runner establishes her own basepath. The white line on the ground marks fair/foul, except for the last half of the distance to first base.
Nope, she was out. The batters box is 3ft wide and there are 6 inches between the bb and the plate and another 8 1/2 inches to the center of the plate where the base path center line goes through. So if she's outside the bb, shes at least 1ft 2-1/2in out of the base path.
You being a fan or not a fan of either team is irrelevant. When experts even MENTION that subject, they impeach their objectivity, regardless of anything else they say in conjunction with it.
I wouldn't say the craziest play at the plate EVER. Not worth 20 seconds of my time as for craziness. But as for the rules of softball, isn't that running out of the baseline? I think it is. It's clearly going "out of bounds", so to speak, to avoid the tag. Where do they draw the line? In the bleachers? The catcher had her glove at home plate waiting for her.
She should have been called out once she passed the plate far away! You shouldn't be able to pass the base/plate and then come back and touch it! CATCHER GOT ROBBED!
