Crime & Punishment in D&D & Pathfinder (Ep. 119) 

I highly approve of this video! You made the important point in a different video that prison sentences are a modern idea. Punishments tended to be quick. You didn't include slavery, which was common. Slavery was often temporary. It was a way to pay a fine. No money? Work it off as a slave.

"A Time Traveller's Guide to Medieval England" reads like a Historian's DM notes. It's great for roleplayers.

In the 5th edition book Dragon Heist there's a section that tells you the punishment for crimes in or around the city of Waterdeep. I use it as my basis for punishment, after running that module which I greatly enjoyed my players begged me to run a simpler dungeon crawl because a few of them had to run side characters while their mains missed out on alot of XP while they sat in jails for weeks. I regret nothing

Another excellent resource is a book called the Faithful Executioner. It uses the real-life diary of Franz Schmidt (1555 - 1634). He was the executioner of Nuremberg. He noted 361 executions he performed during his 45 year career. The book has a great discussion of laws, punishments, his apprenticeship, his thoughts on his job, and the social status and other functions of an executioner.

Good video. I read a book years ago called simply Medeival Cities. It went into detail about interesting things like guilds, and the fact that medeival cities often were the only places that someone could go to actually improve their own lot in life (raise themselves to the next class up) because there were various power structures which were (semi) independent of the feudal system, such as an elected mayor, an appointed constable with charge of the city guard, etc. You neglected to mention Sanctuary laws btw. Very important for people on the run, like ne'erdowell PCs...

The narrative about the wizard getting hanged a couple of hours after ripping off the merchant reminds me of how we played Hommlet when we were kids. Eventually our DM got sick of all the thieving, robbing and general mayhem and decided that the druid recruited some of his peers to hang around the town and whenever we got bored and started messing with people, they would teleport in as bears and maul us to death. An arms race of ever more brutish fighters or stealthy thieves vs teleporting mutherf'n bears ensued. We took a break after that!

The word "Sheriff" comes from the old English "Shire Reeve". Call your Sheriff "The Reeve" to sound more authentic.

In my campaign, I incorporate monsters into the spectacle of how society deals punishment to wicked offenders. Being hanged upside down and lowered into a refuse pit housing an otyugh is a common one. Another method is to have the criminal immobilized and sealed in a barrel with a stunted black pudding which slowly eats the victim over a period of days. Sometimes towns at the edge of a wood will lash the criminal to a tree and draw out an owlbear to devour him while the townsfolk watch from afar. Good times.

If I recall correctly (It's been 30 years since I earned my Criminal Justice degree), "Trial By Combat" was reserved for those of Nobility (or famous/rich merchants) only. Ordinary folk weren't given that option and had to beg for the mercy of the Court at their trial. This was one benefit to being "knighted" even if no lands or money were given with the title. You were still Nobility even if you were "landless."

My players have learned overtime that it is much easier to talk to the locals and befriend them. Even my most murderous rogue always looks for clever legal courses of action, and I firmly believe that players are a result of their DMs. If you do not immerse your player in a medieval fantasy world, they're not going to act like it's a medieval fantasy world. I Love this video, and it's going to remind me that - there are wooden covers for windows - tavern keepers are not automatically on the parties side - justice is swift, with mob mentality Also, thank you Professor Dungeon master. I play a low magic world where magic will have you hunted and killed. I now have a slew of reasons as to why it could have been.

Here in Brazil we had some folk who became popular heroes and/or received holidays after being accused of treachery and treated accordingly to the spirit of their time. Tiradentes(Removeteeth) and Antônio "The Pilgrim" Conselheiro(Adviser) are some examples. We were born as a nation much after the Old World Dark Ages but some harsh practices were plausible even after the coup of the Republic. Thanks!

Here is an unintended tip for this video. You can use these authority figures for building a fantasy town.

I tend to use olde justice systems, where, for expample, murder was punished with fee or enslavement. It really gives the feeling of being in different society, which could still be medieval

The fatal flaw with all these laws and punishments and precautions is that 5e makes characters immortal superheroes who can easily wipe out an entire town. "Oh, I'm sentenced to death, am I? Well then, it won't increase my sentence when I murder all of you. Yes, to be clear, our party of 4 can murder all 2000 of you."

love the return of figures in this video

Professor, what about adventurers being members of guilds and having their own internal laws (such as the medieval Law Merchant) or being issued letters of patent (or similar to Marque and reprisal) for hunting monsters and so on or privileges by the lord? One can set legal systems in a medieval fashion, although adapted to the additional features (like the actual presence of magic, monsters). Also, what are the rules for hiring adventurers? Is it formalized like in the Hobbit or is it incognito and illegal? Are they treated as condotieri? And also, how does the civil law (whether the Common law of Britain or continental post-roman law) in relation to mages? And yes - I'm currently finishing my PhD in space manufacturing law (ISRU + Patent law). :)

I like to add realism to the game but I also want an "air of fantasy" to exist too. There should be consequences to prevent "murderhobo's" from ruining other players enjoyment. I also imagine in a fantasy setting that magic is much more precious to those in leadership roles otherwise they won't be leaders long. I'm sure lots of mundane magic items have been created to prevent the shenanigans of adventurers. A lens of Seeing: These ocular glasses provide the recipient True Seeing. While being worn the user experiences vertigo and suffers disadvantage on all Dexterity Saving Throws, has 1/2 movement (as they zig-zag while moving; think of someone terrible drunk), and has trouble concentrating (can't hold a concentration spell). All effects dissipates once removed over the next 3 rounds. Detect Magic is already available to all 1st level NPC's so any Charm spell can be detected to verify "bewitching" or other such shenanigans players may play on the NPC's. Yeah, I like "consequences" but in my experience DM's can take this way too far.

Great video! Also, your mini collection is bad-ass!

i love your talk about wizards policing themselves. i have always thought that the concept that rowling portrays with the ministry of magic. a powerful scry user who could detect magical aura's etc. could send wizards out to investigate and license magical users. violating these laws gets hard to get around when you're policed with powerful magisteriums of mages. also the funny weird ones is a great worldbuilder. currently i have a party who's adventuring in the bay of spirits campaign setting and i've put together a law that all adventurers need to carry a writ from the barony, essentially a tax on anything they find because of it's cost. but they're not aware of this yet. so that'll be fun.

This is one of your best videos yet. Super useful.

Ahh I was looking for the dungeon craft video this week.

They would also brand people for lesser crimes. People think such behavior is barbaric but those Medieval communities didn't have facilities to hold people for long periods. Also for outlaws blanket amnesties and individual pardons could be handed out. Sir Thomas Malory (yes that one) was declared an outlaw for some offense or another. It must have been bad because when a general amnesty was declared the king at the time made a point of excluding Malory.

In my Peasant Mayhem campaign, everyone is subject to both the "Local Nobles" and the Inquisition. Even if they have become minor nobility they are subject to the laws. I had one player who was evil and killed a hapless drunk and started to cannibalize the corpse. They we caught by the watch and given an immediate trial and as punishment for such a horrific crime, given a blood eagle in the lord's hall before the night was over. Rights and responsibilities are a real thing in my campaigns.

Loved this video. Would love more medieval lore

A very educational video, thank you Professor. Would you ever consider doing a follow up video talking about laws and punishments in other major cultures found in the middle ages, such as the Nords, Arabs, Chinese, and Japanese? While Medieval Europe does make up a good portion of most games, sometimes they either start out in other cultures or might eventually make it to them through an adventure.

The 'Dragon Warriors' RPG by Dave Morris and Oliver Johnson has an extensive system like this set in a Grim British Folklore Fantasy World. A staple of my collection for DMing all fantasy RPGs since the mid-80's.

Outstanding, Professor. A little research goes a long way. I love that your campaign is based on the Keep on the Borderlands. I have tried it several times but it just never took. I recently tried a campaign based in Orlane (N1: Against the Cult of the Reptile God), and it is going well so far. Sometimes the old ways are best. I also appreciate your hybrid style (Warhammer FRP, DCC RPG, Moldvay Basic, et al.). My setting has likewise evolved from a similar combination of influences. I have a heaping helping of Earthdawn in my setting, for example, along with WFRP, DCC RPG, and D&D.| Thank you for your hard work, sir, and may Skycor bless thee and keep thee.

Another great video Dan! Actionable immediately after watching. This is level of detail and granularity is missing from too many campaigns. Keep it up!!

I use a lot of "Old West" style law in my games. Ironically it is all very similar to medieval punishments/regulations. My favorite is making the players hand over their weapons upon entry to the city/village, ala Dodge City.

Love the War Hammer Empire Crossbowman cameo.

This episode was awesome. Great to hear about implementing history into the fantasy game. Most of the topics are not mentioned in the DMG, although sometimes referenced. Thanks!

Nice video, good for some reflections... One comment thought. The lords has “dragon” problems, and he thinks, “heh easy peasy for these guys here”. Then says: Lord: “Heroes, I command, go kill that dragon!” Heroes: “Nope, fuck off” Lord: “Traitors! Guards, kill them all!” Now.... who is really going to be able to capture and kill a party that was just deemed able to slain a dragon?? Unless they are bathing naked with the king in the palace, it would be needed an army to bring them down...

Really nice video. I love how your getting off the beaten path to find inspiration for the game instead of just keeping it in the D&D books. Love it. More of these please. Great job. Cheers!

I personally ignore historic information and rather go with my guts. I once had a group that decided to go nuts in town several times, so I decided that they would be banished from that town and as they had nowhere to go they lived in the woods for a longer period of time. It turned out to be a lot of fun as they needed to take care fo everything by themselves and whenever they needed to enter the town for some reason they had to do stealth checks or be in disguises with the risk of being captured at any time. After some sessions I resolved the situation by giving them a quest with the reward of redeeming them and allowing them to move back into the city. They accepted the quest, but they never moved back, but rather kept on living in the woods (just in a proper house now, as they now could order somebody to build it) and of course doing occasional shopping trips and stuff in town.

Man you always have some of the coolest looking minis. I think it would be really cool if you could list what companies they come from, I'm sure they have been in your collection for a long time and might not remember, but it would be pretty awesome if you could post ones you remember! Keep up the great content, this will come in handy for future murder hobos lol.

Professor Dungeon Master's work are so informative that consequently the comment section transforms into a treasure chest of good references. Well done guys 👍.

Looks like either I got some +1 goggles or Professor Dungeon Master got a new and improved camera!

another interesting fact is that in middle aged despite people living of the land and their craft, although expected to be loyal to the Lord, Duke or count that owns the land, most people where in fact nomads. people living near a keep or a Manor have a social contract with the Lord of the land, but if his rule was cruel, unfair or even incompetent there's was nothing stopping people for leaving the land and the word would soon spread to near villages, people where expected to be treated fairly and get compensation for their work and also be treated fairly if they pay the taxes to the landlord. also things like well, Mills and such where sort of like commodities that the Lord would provide in order to attract more skilled people to his village, more people more transaction and more taxes paid, so this picture of a cruel Lord that can have his way with whatever evil deed he wants was probably mistaken after all if this was true it was only a matter of time before he has a ghost town with no one living it.

More "realism" in a game than I'd want to deal with, but great to think about none the less. Which is my favorite thing about your channel for me. It makes me think! Fyi chickens and turkeys (especially wild ones) can fly just fine. 😁

It's like you've said before. Actions should have consequences. In my games, I let the players do pretty much whatever they want--with the caveat that they have to live with their decisions.

Outstanding history lesson and peak into your creative world. Your campaign based off KotB is so intriguing. I have adopted a lot of your rules to my games and it improved my sessions dramatically for my players. 5e Initiative rule no longer used makes getting into combat quicker too. As always Professor you’re GPA is 4.0! Thank you

Great video! If you haven't read it already, you might enjoy "The Faithful Executioner" (Harington, 2013, non fiction). I believe it covers a period slightly after the books you mentioned - 15th century if I remember correctly, and it concerns the justice system in German city states specifically. It also delves into some other aspects that might be too detailed for roleplaying, such as the social stigma attached to the job of being an executioner, although other details might be useful for flavor.

Nice history lesson Good video

How about some rules for a hanging? Many were considered a social event/ obligation to attend. An encounter where the PCs rescue a fellow PC from the noose could be very exciting and perhaps more dangerous than facing down a tribe of Hobgoblins!

Great discussion.

I don't play DnD (zweihander player here) but I'm glad I found your channel.

Good stuff as always, thanks.

Thanks for going over this. I actually read Time Traveller's Guide, but explaining this stuff succinctly to my gaming group was gonna be a bit hard, so this should be really useful. I find that this information can lead to some much more flavourful worlds where it more readily makes sense. I never noticed until reading the book that a problem with the usual 'guards are everywhere' assumed fantasy setup is that it's kind of confusing because you almost always were left to wonder how these people were all so well equipped and organized and in fairly large numbers. Even in my games prior to that book, it was just assumed "Oh it works somehow" and is left abstract and less believable. Meanwhile the self-policing populace pretty immediately makes a _lot_ of sense, AND it automatically makes it not feel cheap to players when you say "There's no guards around to help" and things like that, without the headache of having to make an explanation.

The more videos of yours I watch the more I want your minis!!!!! You do a great job filming and keeping us entertained while being informative. You are a pleasure to watch :)

I love the info. Not only does it inform “random town encounters” it gives depth and texture to my game. THANKS!

This is a great video! I was researching different laws of the period after my group's session this week. So happy you put out a video on this topic :)

Excellent as always PDM!

I have a large city in my campaign and this video gave me some excellent ideas for when the party gets there. Thank you.

Time Travelers guide is so good, I picked it up this summer but haven't had the time to finish it

I'm planning a historical campaign with some serious realism. This video is gold.

15:20 just a little trick about this subject: I remember reading that, back in those days, they would bite the pieces to see if they were really what they were? Correct me if I'm wrong, it's been a long time since I red that! :D Very interesting video, in fact, I would like to ask if you could make more of these about medieval life! It'd be great for inspiration but also to expand our horizons!

Great vid as always, professor! Lots to think about the next time the barbarian in my campaign gets a bit too boisterous in a town...

One system I thought about was to require higher level characters to have certain infrastructure or objects of prestige to maintain their high level. Its not that your fighter gets a keep for free when he hits 9th level, its that you can't be a 9th level fighter without owning land with the ability to raise and train an army. A wizard has to have a lab, and then an apprentice, and then a guild hall full of apprentices, etc. Anyway, this is relevant to the subject of law and order because if the church freaks out and starts a witch hunt because of the party's actions, then the wizard loses her tower and her ability to the awesome magical energy needed for 4th level spells! There are exceptions, like the thief running a thieves' guild mostly outside the law, but those are also interesting. How is the fighter supposed to get land normally reserved for a noble title if he was born a peasant? Well, there is some hope for an outlaw building his own fort out in the woods, offering some peasants a better tax rate to move in, and eventually fighting it out with the local lord until some sort of agreement can be reached, usually involving the player-kingdom paying tribute to the lord. The players might do it anyway if they are sick and tired of dealing with the law. I recommend reading "the Test of the Warlords" module for land management in tabletop games in general: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-6E3oJgVejGU.html

So clear!! Nice! Sounds good too! Great info to incorporate into my game!

Excellent as usual. I would love to see more videos like this. These are the types of small things that really help a world come alive. I will definitely be implementing this stuff into my campaign world/sandbox even if I have retrofit a few things. Thanks again for the wonderful content!

Oh man, great video!!! A whole new way to get some fun in with my players.

Sounds like a great opportunity for a moral dilemma scene. Do the players come to the aid of the 13 year old girl accused of being a witch and enter a pit fight to determine her innocence to only find out she is a corrupted warlock of a major Demon figure.... Whole town in an uproar after the party frees her and the only way to get back into the good graces of the community is to hunt down and destroy the 13 year old monstrosity..... Perhaps cliche but its fun giving the characters a very healthy shade of gray and see them struggle with it.... Nice framework for putting the characters in an outlaw status cut off from resupply and an outlet for their gold.

I'm definitely saving this video somewhere. There was so much stuff in here, and so little time!

In my game, magic users gain prestige and respect by functioning as "court seers" who, if they have the temprement, (lawful alignment and average or greater wisdom) are taught ESP by their mentors so they can be employed, as such, and determine the veracity of such serious claims. This seems to make sense to me, but also it is a subtle rewards for magic users who choose to be of lawful alignment.

great:) in my game, the "wizards" have there own curt. the curt is ruled by the 6 most powerfull wizards of the world. if a mage is caught dabbeling in the dark arts or using his powers for evil, or rumours of him being to powerfull, the white counsil of six send out there "blackstaff" to bring you before the white counsil. the black staff is a powerfull mage chosen by the counsil. his job is to keep taps on other magic users, and to uphold the rules of the counsil and kings. ( the counsil dont want its members on the pire) the blackstaff has full acces to the guilds assets, and once you are on "his" radar you are never of it. credits goes to the "dresden files" for this idea

Great video. There are plenty of plot hooks to be had by adhering to a semi-medieval justice system, certainly your explanation of it.

Historical details like this are optional and can add flair to a role-playing game. What I don't get is why if you bring stuff like this up, someone is bound to say that there should be no realism because "It's fantasy, so all bets are off. How dare you even bring this up?!" Hyperbole aside, it seems like a strange thing to react negatively about.

My players conned a young upstart when they first started the campaign, I had him gather a small crew and come try to geta refund from the players before they left town. The crew was badly beaten and the main NPC was killed. They took his body, for no real reason, and left town on a mission for an NPC in town. Upon completion of the mission they were intercepted by bounty hunters and are now on the way back to attend trial. This video has been the most helpful so far after days of searching for relavant but digestible information that can help me plan the next session, thank you!

Informative perspective, I enjoyed that. Thanks for the video

This is the best episode that I've seen from you.

Have to say that I love your videos/content. The arguments of the different church factions about eating chickens is awesome. I'd love to see some of your game sessions. Your world sounds like it must be a very literal translation of medieval Europe. Love it, haha!

Great video, tons of gems in this one. Thanks again Professor.

I will try to make the npc’s more realistic like this suggests. Up the CR for role playing essentially

That was GREAT! Highly educational and inspirational. We often dismiss the mundane peasants of our fantasy worlds as insignificant, but with this type of criminal system, every suspicious farmer could spell doom for the PC's if they misbehave. Nice! I always like more verisimilitude.

Wish I'd kept my copy of Paul Vernon's superb low-fantasy Starstone module. If memory isn't jerking me around, there was a table in which crimes could be read off against player social class in order to determine punishment. Don't be a ragged thief and get caught.

Loved this! Thank you!!

This was the best guide I ever saw about city law.

I really like the new title cards

Great content! Very interesting professor.

I always love your videos even if I come away going "Wow, definitely not gonna be that way in MY game!" I still find at least something that make me go "Ah, that could be useful." Keep it up! I know the algorithm isn't always kind, but you're doing great stuff.

This is awesome material!

The Poultry Schism is brilliantly creative

My PCs where annoyed that when they started a street fight the local wizard turned up as well as the guards, dispelled their charm spell and pointed out the illusions they where using to try and weasel out of it.

Great video Professor! More like these please. :) More discussion on wizards in a medieval society and also how would a schism or reformation in a major faith such as Skycos affect the game world? Also, did you get a new camera? The video "looks" different somehow.

I found you channel with one of your clickbait titles, which is fine, because I love your videos. I have particularly enjoyed your Caves of Carnage series as I am about to run my group through The Keep on the Borderlands. This video in particular is wicked awesome. KEEP it up!

Aw man this sounds awesome and like a lot of work to implement remembering all the little rules. Colour me torn.

17 minute video?! We have been blessed!! *Continues to flog self*

A BIG thumbs up and a BIG thank you for posting this video. I think you should know I used to hate your content but I've been DMing now for about 5yrs and I've gone back and watched all of the videos I hated when I first found this channel something like 3yrs ago only to now find out that I agree with at least 80% of your videos with minor disagreements here and there. So again thanks and happy gaming!

An idea for a movie: How to insert characters into a room/scene. A lot of premade stories or the ones presented in your and other videos, assumes that the combat scene start in the middle of the room. When in reality my players tend to hang around the doors for a couple of minutes trying to find out what's on the other side. After that they will open the door slightly and start peppering the adversaries with arrows/magic from the corridor. This is fine from the realism point of view, but really hampers my ability to provide a diverse and interesting combat scene.

Great video Prof!

Good points prof.

I will never understand why this topic isn't more relevant to D&D groups given all the trouble PCs get in and how many adventure hooks can result. Of course, I'm a trained lawyer who once reconceptualized Vancian magic as petitioning a cosmic chancery for English style "writs, " i.e. spells, so I'm a bit biased.

this is great. awesome tips for worldbuilding.

No playing Tennis in the guild hall makes a lot more sense if you've watched Lindybeige's video on tennis!

me when the players start killing orphans they are supposed to protect:"the actions u committed are so atrocious even the gods are disgusted, from the sky a flash of thunder strikes down upon you and you instantly die"

Another great video in the books. Thank you for making this! Is your god mythology based on any source or is it your own design?

Definitely going to implement entry tax based on appearance! Great way to regulate weath, and it might incentivise PCs to have commoner garbs, or RP or sneak their way in

PDM, great video. One book you want to check out is Medieval Hunting by Richard Almond - he talks about Forest courts and the punishments for those violations... Parks in Medieval England is another good one -

The algorithm must be turning in your favor, there were three advertisement breaks in this video!

A hard world if your class happens to be called the Thief. The “get good” at the end is some sound advice.