Dark Souls 3 Lore: Was the Firstborn a Former King of Lothric? Feat. Mitch L 

Last time I was this early the First Flame didn't need linking

Since I met ur channel everything has became so clear. Ornstein = spyro

Firstborn: Hm... We've been fighting these dragons for years now. And I can't help, but wonder... can I boink one of them? ... Gwyn: He did WHAT?! But, how he even... Never mind. I don't want to hear of this. EVER. I... I don't have a son anymore. Gwyndolin: Hey, dad, but I'm... Gwyn: Not now, sweetie! ... One of the Four Kings: So this is a shard of Lord Gwyn's soul. Pretty cool, but why does it make me think about boinking a dragon? Another one of the Four Kings: I don't know, but, hey, Valley of the Drakes isn't far away! ... One of the Four Kings: So we can suck someone's humanity, while boinking a dragon? Sign me in, Kaath! ... Sealer Ingward: I, I don't even know or want to know, what those bastards are doing down there anymore. Let's just flood the place and never speak of it again. ... Witch of Izalith: Oh, you think dragon bonking is the new hot stuff. Wait untill you get a hold of my new flame! You can boink things you couldn't even imagine before! ... Gwyn: Damn, I still can't get that metnal image off my mind. What even are the logistics of that? Screw everything, I'm better off burning it away along with my memories.

Here's an item description that I found interesting and may yet relate to this topic: Cathedral Knight Greatshield: "The face of the shield is decorated with the emblem of an old king of Lothric: a bold image of a great bird gazing skywards." The Storm Drake does resemble a bird, in contrast to the usual depiction of dragons, thus this description could be implicating the Nameless King.

I think that before he was banished, the firstborn was appointed king of lothric by his father. The firstborn got fed up of all the lothric knights killing dragons, so he taught them to tame them instead. Papa Gwynn gets mad and banishes him and so he leaves to go to arch dragon peak. Oceiros is appointed as the new king and he sends gwynevere to marry him and she became the queen of lothric. I don't really know if this adds up but from what I know it does. Just a thought I had watching the videos

It makes me appreciate that fight a bit more when I realize how much you've taken from him when you kill the King of Storms. He threw away being the god of War and this beast was the representation of that decision...and you killed it. A former god of war who has led somewhere between 0-3 civilizations and now he wants to kill you more than he has ever wanted to kill anything ever before. Explains why its so fucking hard.

go a check the cathedral nights great shield. it say something about the emblem on it was made in the image of a former king of lothric. a dazzling bird gazing skywards(or something like that. ) but the bird image looks JUST LIKE THE NAMELESS KINGS STORM DRAKE. I belive the nameless king was in fact a former king of lothric.

I have no evidence for this but, in my headcannon The Nameless King found the Storm Drake when it was young and didn't want to kill it. They bonded and eventually the King started seeing them as more than beasts and that's when he turned

I just had a thought. Since the firstborn was banished and Gwynevere wasn't, that has to mean that thes were both fighting on opposite sides. So if the firstborn created a kingdom of sunlight-warriors and then Gwynevere suddenly came and "took over", there would be more than enough reason for him to leave. What if Oceiros was actually the firstborns son, and Gwynevere married him and had some children with him without knowing of his father? It would explain why all of their children are either cursed or crippled.

As a Mexican, I definitely got that food reference

I never miss a video from ya. good shit as always. would also enjoy seeing more collabs with Mitch. he's brutal. keep up the good work.

8:39 anyone else amazed at how we walks through the flames like a boss and none of it hurts him

95%of this is believable and lore changing

If the Queen of Lothric was Gwynevere then I find it interesting if maybe her brother the Nameless King helped guide and rule over the Kingdom of Lothric. Also did you know you can find statues of a woman with a crown in Irithyl? That woman could be the Queen of Lothric. Perhaps she was also involved with Irithyl since her brother Gwyndolin seemed to rule over that place before Pontiff Sulyvahn took it over. It seems all three children of Lord Gwyn worked together with one another.

You get a like for that food reference at the start

Aw hell yeah, more Ashen lore videos👍

Great video!

Hi Ashen Hollow! First, let me say that I subscribed to your channel because I really appreciate your uncommon theories, even if don't always agree. Having a different point of view on DS' lore is solid gold, I think. And this video is truly solid fucking gold! It all makes sense. It's simply perfect. Keep it up, cheers from Italy. :)

I know this has been pointed out over and over, but when Nameless gently places his hand on the storm drake. It's like despite the fact that he's in a battle to the death, he takes a second out to mourn his companion.

Its too early for my mind to be blown. Another great vid.

aparently on the original japanese version is "Nameless Lord" not King

I enjoy your ideas as much as I enjoy the game. ty

Great video, I would also like to point out that if you look at the cathedral knight shield, it says it depicts the simbol of the old king. That simbol is a bird which kind of resembles the storm drake that the nameless king rides. Just a thought.

there are 1 more thing to be noted about, Nameless king being faram, 1. is all the lion symboligy, The faram armor, lion clan sets etc.( i dont have the time to be specific, so i will let you do the reading), it is said that forrasa, worshipped a lion god of war of sort, and giving that Nameless king crown makes him appear as a form of lion warrior, it would make sense to connect them there. if you take these things in consideration, it would give The nameless kings actions an extra layer

great video. Its an interesting thought that the nameless king was the former king of lothric. One thing that I'd like to see explored is the idea of the old gods trying to tease out an undead linking the first flame again dark souls 3. I think its real interesting that after you beat vordt(one of pontiff sulyvhan's chronies) you have the the winged demons carry you from lothric to undead settlement. meanwhile, after sens fortress, you also have the winged demons carry you from sens fortress to anor londo to once again help you on your way.

i came from the last video from vaaty... and this channel is fucking great! love it!!

Does that Angel Knight really need to be carrying around 5 Huge Axes and a Longsword? C'mon Bro... Ur Drunk , Go Home..

Great video! Always love the lore bombs you drop dude. What is the music that starts @4:50 ? Sorry and thanks, you are great.

Good stuff you two. But would expect no less from either of you!

thats some vaati-level shit right here ! really good video, seems to me like a pretty "solid" idea considering all these hints

my only problem with dragon slayer armor being the nameless kings armor is that the fighting styles are so different.

awesome vídeo... thank u ashen hollow... following the words of your man mitch ... o think the lightning damage os something that tells a lot about the relation with the gwyn firstborn... and i am thinking that the Dragon Hunter axe who belonged to lothian has some sort of connection... since lothian was also from forossa.... (faraam???)

the ashen hollow spitting bars 🔥🔥🔥

Maybe the recent King, the consumed king oceiros, is the first son of the firstborn, hence his obsession for dragons

There is also lots of sunlight medal symbols on some kind of cast iron in archdragon peak

Fucking awesome as always

Basically I really enjoy listening to all these. especially when I'm actually playing ds3, as only the people without ability to have ps+ need to grind for vertebra/swordgrass/proofs will understand the struggle for platinum, these videos make this time not feel so frustrating (I hate grinding). Keep up the good work and have fun with that, remember! Thanks

great video as always! just to add to the theory; If the nameless king was the first, or one of the first kings of lotheric, and was then usurped/up and left to boink dragons, oceiros may have married gwynevyr in order for him and his children to have a claim to the throne

Cool idea

new viewer here your channel is dope you got any idea about them pilgrim butterfulies and the lore behind them?

Would the First Born possible be the same deity as Faraam? I mean they are the only two War Gods mentioned in the entire series.

I wish they used the music you used during the nameless king fight. Also, despite all evidence leading the fact that the nameless king is Gwyn's son, I am still hoping it's Solaire. Good video, it made a lot of sense

My Man Mitch! He's Comin' Up in the RU-vid World

I really like the theory that the dragonslayer armor is the nameless kings. It would make sense that he used to wear the armor when he did slay dragons before he befriends them and ditched the armor.

That last theory makes total sense. Nameless King shared his soul with the dragons. Gwyn don't like no sharing, and definitely don't like no dragons, so he tossed NK out! That's why Sens fortress is filled with lightning wielding manserpants, and Gwyn place Iron Golem at the gate to keep them out of Anor Londo!

The Man Serpents were created by Seath during his experiments in Dark Souls 1 (and were called imperfect dragons in that game) and Seath was an ancient dragon, so in that way they would be "descendants" of an ancient dragon.

first? great job m8 keep up the vids :-)

Nameless King, 1st born of Gwyn, Tamer of Dragons, Captain of Knights, Progenitor of Lothric, Maker of Dragons

Just a thought about how the Serpent-Men could have innate lightning abilities that doesn't involve boinking: it's entirely possible that Nameless, the First Born, shared/empowered his followers/allies with his great soul, which was a lord soul like his father's. In the same way that Gwyn (likely through the First Born) empowered his knights during the war with the ancient dragons, the First Born would empower his own allies. Empowering them with lightning would also help combat their weakness to it, at least in a psychological capacity; they wouldn't fear something as much if they could control it, and their enemies would feel less confident in using a tactic that their enemies have incorporated into their very being. The serpent-men could also be descendants of Storm Drakes in particular, who appear to have a closer affinity to a kind of primal, chaotic energy that was probably the closest thing to lightning in the world before Gwyn and the First Born created true lightning from the first flame. It's also possible that the Storm Drakes, or their ancient dragon ancestors, had the original lightning and that what Gwyn, Nameless, and all others who followed them used was a new construct based on that phenomena but created through entirely different means, in this case sunlight and ultimately fire, and possessing (mostly) different properties. That said, the video did make a very convincing argument that either Nameless or very close followers of his founded, ruled, or in some way significantly influenced the development of the kingdom of Lothric. Heck, the Nameless King may have been part of the reason Oceiros became obsessed with the power of dragons. Though he also may have thought that, with his son's failure to link the fire, the power of dragons would be the best way to survive the dark. They were the only beings absolutely proven able to survive in a world without the first flame, after all.

It is also a possiblility that the nameless king was trying to take back his kingdom? The lanterns held by the pilgrims are STRIKINGLY similar (if not exactly the same) as the ones in Archdragon peak. Also, if (based on another video I cant remember, by you!) there is a little civil war going on within the castle, this could mean that those wearing red are with the nameless king (since one is guarding his statue)?

will you do a Q&A live stream dark souls 1,2,3 gameplay or do you post on twitch to

damn now i want some mexican food

Hey it's Nicholas and btw their are sunlight medal plate type objects in the room where you fight the drakeblood knight

I'd say it's pretty likely that some sunbros went with the nameless king given the fact that ornstein went looking for him too

When you asked when a dragons and humanoids did produce offspring i could swear you were going to bring priscilla to the talk(of course, the origins of serpent men predate the crossbred).

i feel that oceiros' obsession over dragons and seeth led to him training his lothric knights to defeat or inslave dragons so that he may experiment upon them and himself

I'll add the fact that there is a statue of the nameless king inside lothric castle (altar of sun). The fact that the statue is destroyed is surely related to his betrayal, while the clear reference to the sun I think depends on the fact that he is the son of Gwyn, Lord of sunlight. It might have been the king of lothric but a king lost in the ages, and few people remember him

Another proof of the warriors of sunlight following the firstborn to the archdragon peak is the symbol of sunlight in all the dishes among the meditating warriors/dragonlike humanoids (seen first in a VaatyVidya video)

What sword were you using in the video it looked awesome

I wish the Stormdrake breathed lightning like the drakes in the valley, though besides the blue color they're pretty different. It'd still be cool :v

I know this is an older video but I wondered how much you could back a theory that Lothric kingdom was founded before the war with the dragons. Sacrificing everything could have meant he lost his kingdom as a result of siding with the dragons. Also the Twin Princes were Lords of Cinder by birthright, perhaps the Nameless King is as well.

I always assumed the Nameless King was the King of the Dragons, for his care and protection of the dragons, and his dragon society. He was also Gwyn's heir, and with Gwyn dead and gone, he earned the title of King. Many his sun followers probably named him King out of respect? I currently prefer to think Gwynevere was connected to Lothric, either as its runaway Queen, or former Queen, an ancestor. Nevertheless, this was a great video and was very well done. You both are awesome!

Gwyn hates his son for allying with the dragons, proceeds to ally with Seath ?????

The sun covenant found in lothric ,the queen that might be gwynevere ,she might have left to tell something important that her big brother told her known by him, something that would change everything,So she left to tell the other deities ,Which we might see in 2nd dlc.My theory though.

Pretty cool idea. I think Lothric definitely rose after the fall of Anor Londo's supremecy. Quite possibly the allying of humans with the Nameless King would be a likely result of coming out from under Gwyn's oppression. I will say, the taming, or subduing of Dragons and subsequent use of them in battle does not necessarily prove they were befriended or worshipped. Simply used in battle as a viable technology of sorts against what could be a concern or "anticipation" for a coming war against the Nameless King and his dragons. Dragons are after all, not of the Age of Fire or Dark, so an allying with them by humans would be an incredibly reactionary turn for humans in the face of nature. Furthermore, with the elaboration on Monarch you offered, one could also say it is a King of Kings, which is what the Firstborn would've been if his heir ever came to be. The obsession of Oceiros with producing a perfect heir and this directly connected with his idea of becoming a dragon does lend credibility to the union of Archdragon Peak and Lothric or at least its influence albeit twisted by Lothric's independent goals, tho we cannot overlook the outlasting maddening corruption of Seathe's research. As for humans mating with dragons... Although I liked your previous theory that Ornstein was the Stormdrake, and I absolutely appreciate the possibility that the Dragonslayer armor originally belonged to the Nameless King which puts to rest for me the imo obnoxious claim that it was Ornstein's armor... there is ample evidence for mating with dragons, esp given Seathe's stealing of maidens for his "experiments". Priscilla/Yorshka crossbreeds, the Painting Woman having serpentine eyes etc. If Velka had children with dragons, could it be that the Stormdrake was also one such child? Consider that it doesn't really have scales... so much as black feathers... If a child of Velka's became a dragon, could it have looked like this? Perhaps Ornstein wasn't just a knight, but royalty as well. thoughts thoughts thought. Thank you so much for making me go hollow with lore, or giving me Frenzy whatever. Such amazing collections of details (albeit years old) are helping my heart in the absence of Elden Ring. Oooooh Elden Ring...

I personally think that the king title is referring to that he is the "king" of archdragon peak.

although not related but there's a line regarding ocieros that a lot many assassins were send to his domain, we find dead bodies of man serpents behind locked doors after the boss fight also one alive so was nameless king the one who was sending assassins!

Damn, that's awesome, here I thought he was just the king of lightning

Maybe the nameless king, old God of war, didn't completely choose to give up his title. Maybe solaire took it from him. We do end up finding his sword at lothric castle which becomes imbued with lightning meaning he became the sun like he wanted

I think the civil war was oceiros getting tired of following nameless and he decided to make his own kings Lorian and his brother then kicked nameless from lothric

When lore theorizers do mental gymnastics by obsessing over how things are worded in the game shouldn't it be based on the Japanese text and not something that can very possibly be lost in translation?

-did you note that there is a room in archdragon peak near the bonfire before nameless king which is decked out with several banners bearing the lothric coat of arms....? Even more evidence of involvement between the the NK and lothric. So my theory had been that Gwynevere has been the long term queen of lothric and had several kings as husband over time. -and I saw NK as more 'helping his sister out.' -but i dont have too much to substantiate it aside from the fact that the queen gets a more central spot in the lothric throne room door 'society sculpture panel thing' I would have thunked if NK was a king of lothric you would see more direct references to a powerful King in Lothric's architecture and artwork.

Maybe the Man Serpents do descend from the Nameless King, and perhaps the storm drake he rides and "allied" himself with is his bride. It's not too far fetched to see him falling in love with a dragon. After all, dragons have God-like power (something he valued), control over the manifestation of the sun, and are more than just the mindless beats they're portrayed to be in most cases. If we look at Sithe then we can clearly see that dragons had the ability to communicate with the Gods and humans. Perhaps the Nameless King subjected himself to the burden of dishonor not out of pity and remorse for his actions, but out of love.

I’ve been thinking of Quesadillas all day and you made it worse 😂😂😂

The possessed armour is a clue that the sunlight bros left? People who didn't believe the dragonhunting left hence an empty suit defending the archives

I am not sure if it was mentioned in the video or already posted below, but the drake blood set, especially the helmet, looks like the lothric knight set. Further evidence to support the theory?

yeah but Lothrick is Lordran so maybe the nameless king came back ages after when he learnt Gwin has died to reclaim his status

Interesting theory, but I don't know. You are assuming that when they say "The Sun", they are talking about the NK and about Gwyn himself, while in the Titanite slab translation it says: "They (the meek) found a spark, which turned into a Sun". This doesn't make a direct mention but it clearly involves Gwyn more than his firstborn.

This is an excellent theory! I always thought it was weird the gwynevere was stated to have married flaan, yet it seems implied that she is the queen of lothric. I always thought it was a descendant of gwynevere, so perhaps tales of lothric exploits reached flaan's land, or at least what used to be his land, and this descendent journyed to lothric, but by the time she got there the firstborn had already left, or perhaps he was still there, recognized she was a descendant of gwynevere, and granted her high authority. once he left, she married ocerious. maybe lothric and lorian arent even the children of the consumed king, but rather of this descendent and the firstborn (weird, I know, but this sort of stuff happend all the time) and the inbreeding is why lothric is sickly. they probably didn't know they were of the same family, after all. this is all just a bunch of speculation, but I thought it was interesting. Hopefully we learn more about flash in dlc

Only 15 minutes? Where are my 2 hour lore lectures.....

HOLY SHIT THE DRAGONSLAYER ARMOR IS THE NAMELESS KING'S ARMOR.

Well, this is certainly food for thought (no pun intended), but when you said that DSII is its own entity, I had a thought: what if DSII doesn't happen in the same timeline as DSIII. After all, the first game did feature two endings, so what if each ending leads to a different timeline, thus the reason why so much of DSII seems to have more or less not happened in DSIII. As of right now, all I have to support this thought is the inconsistency between DSII and DSIII, but I'm curios to know what you think if this idea.

Oh no! Lightning. Our one weakness!

What about the lothric knight in the path of the dragon position on illrythl dungeon

One thing to note however, the Japanese version translates better to "The Nameless Lord" rather than "The Nameless King."

What if, Faraam (Gwyn's First Born) was a leader of some sort and was held in high regards, but was never the king? Or what if, in Lothric, he trained the knights of the kingdom to tame dragons, but yet give them lightning infused weapons, knowing their destructive power? This begs so many questions. One thing we do know is that he has had an influence on Lothric, or we could assume so because the knights fight along side dragons using lightning weapons like Faraam did when his deific status was removed when he sided with the dragons.

Nameless King just had to get his, give him credit for not discriminating between species

Guess the firstborn loved his storm drake a little much huh

Have i told you that you are a fucking G yet? YOU ARE A FUCKING G and your videos almost ALMOST inspire me to go back and play dark souos every time i watch them. ALMOST but naah cuz monster hunter.

seems like there was a resurgence of dragons, and once again it seems like the age of dragons ends again. the cycle repeats.

What if the nameless king boned Gwynevere ? That could explain why all the children are messed up due to incest

Random thought that occurred to me as I watched this: Ornstien (possibly) laid down his armor when he went to meet with Gywn's firstborn on Arch Dragon's peak. Which is why his armor is left there. Would he do this as an act of peace if the Nameless king didn't do this before to show his side with the dragons? (ie: Leaving behind the dragonslayer armor) Both of the weapons, the Dragonslayer greataxe thing and the Swordspear have similar movesets (Especially the weaponart) _____________ Just a thing I thought about solidifying this theory a little more in my mind.

isn't it a lotheric knight found dead doing the way of the dragon pose just before the untended graves. could suggest that the journey to arch dragon peak was a form of pilgrimage for the knights ?

Woah, woah, woah. Are you bashing on DS2 lore? I have you know, that DS2 sunbro has much in common with the lore. A certain ancient civilization that praised both the sun and a slumbering dragon. Of course I speak of Shulva Sanctum City. If it isn't obvious they praised Sinh like a God. It's harder to prove that they were sunbros. First, Shulva was proficient in miracles and shunned magic. Second Sacred Oath acquired by Velstadt Soul is the tale of the sunbros, Velstadt's origin is none other than Shulva. In the mural depicting the discovery of dragons is a brightly shinning Sun. The Alter of Sunlight was dug up by the Mytha in a search for her beauty poison, also skeletons dual wielding Falcions are littered around Harvest Valley, while much larger in size, Shulvas Knights also dual wield Falcions. Yet another thing can be found in Harvest Valley the Sunlight Medals dropped by the Overseers who took these treasures from the slaves as they dug deeper into the earth. And even the poison itself is proof of Shulva relics, as the queen was turned into a serpent, lesser kin to the dragons, when exposed to it. As if traces of Sinh still linger within the toxic fumes. But anyway cool theory I think it has a lot of potential.

i like the "nameless king fucked the storm drake" idea cos i also seen the theory that ornstein is the storm drake... the gay dark souls romance we deserve

Some more proof of your theory... The Cathedral Knight Greatshield's description says that it's image is of a former king of Lothric and is a great bird looking skyward. It looks like a stormdrake or wyvern. NOT TO MENTION this same great bird image is on the golden crest shield that drops off the Faraam knight in Lothric castle. So it would support that the former King of Lothric is related to Faraam. And if you say that the Nameless King is the former King of Lothric who is known as the God of War... It would make sense that he IS Faraam.

Regarding the theory about Man-Serpents, there is an alternative explanation. We know from the likes of the Gaping Dragon from the original Dark Souls that, at the dawn of the Age of Fire, the previously Everlasting Dragons were subject to change by their new environment. Furthermore, from Dark Souls III, it becomes clear that Dark, or Humanity, has the capacity to infectiously contaminate any sort of being with which it comes in contact, as shown by the Pus of Man which, most importantly, is shown to affect even the drakes that guard Lothric Castle. The relevance of this theory is that Humanity is shown to have the capacity to invoke anthropomorphic traits within its victims, like the undead parasites surrounding the Cathedral of the Deep. Thus, I propose that the Serpent-Men are the long-term result of a contaminated dragon lineage, spanning centuries, that has been mutated by the ubiquitous Humanity that arises at the end of any Age of Fire.

Wonder if priscilla (or yorshka) was the nameless kings daughter?

Interesting theory, just a side note: the description of "Onislayer Greatbow" item is curious: "A unique greatbow handed down in an eastern land, where tales are told of its use in slaying giant horned oni." the giant horned oni == the storm drake ? Does that mean the nameless one was the king of this eastern land? Just a thought.

7:01 *new message*