Every single time it amazes me how Dave and team are so open in regards to the world biggest and best audio systems, lineups and events. If every other industry followed this example, we would definitely have a better world!
It is pretty cool isn’t it? I always wanted to be a live sound engineer but where I grew up in the middle of nowhere opportunities to learn weren’t easily available. Plus, it’s really cool that he not only reads the comments but actually replies.
This is becoming my favorite channel quickly. I'm setting up gear now.. I was up all night last night testing.. and I was like ?? "man I wish Dave was here"
Thank you Dave for the fascinating interview with Christophe and for helping to share L-acoustics innovations with the world. Excited to hear these in person. Cheers!
I really love your series, regardless of the content covered. As a non-technical non-professional soundscape designer, your videos always help me understand more than what I expected to even care about!!! Thank you Dave… PEACE
We are truly in a golden era for sound reinforcement. Designers who’ve long been at the forefront of bespoke touring systems, are seeing the culmination of their work brought to the market as finished products the public can purchase. The real winners are the SR providers who can design a venue-perfect solution and deploy in a fraction of the time systems of exceptional quality. I’m old enough to have seen the stacked boxes approach, with which I have to say some were able to achieve a fantastic result, to stock catalog products including software that can be snapped together to exact design spec by installers without designer knowledge, quickly & repeatably, and which pack like a dream. For those of us tasked with mixing a performer, the difference is palpable. Shorter days, better result. What’s not to love?
Thanks for poking into the details, Dave. So cool that they've been able to minimize the number of discontinuities in and height of the line. The ability switch to cardioid or supercardioid is slick, too. Looks like a winner.
Yeah definitely going to be a useful tool to add to the deployment kit. Single semi tours with sound lights and backline I'm going to love this stuff. Also arenas in the round and theater gigs. For the big stuff we'll still need the larger format boxes at least until they come out with a larger version of this
This is absolutely a turning point! As much as LAcoustics is not my number one favorite, I definitely can’t wait to mix on it. Thanks Dave for these videos. They’re 1000 better than what the manufacturer’s videos can explain.
So this is the system some engineers where secretly babeling about around my back a few months ago. I got a big smirk back when i asked what would be the next big thing.. they told me to wait and see.. well..The specs look so good can't wait to hear it.. i think they really delivered
Interesting concept, I hope this is also giving a little more stability with Sidewinds. But it will take a long time until we see these Boxes in the real world exept at the Projects... we are waiting for our orders at L-Acoustics for a year!
I"m going to go out on a limb here and say that I learned more from this video than I did from the big Hollywood Bowl presentation video! Now I wish that I was going to Coachella.
Thank you Greg! I personally like the info without the corporate spin. And same, finding out what the system actually does from the designer is pure gold!
@@DaveRat I agree. And as an oft-times recovering corporate spinner I see the gold in sitting on the lawn with "the guy. Of course, you and Christophe live in a rarified part of this. Sometimes it's useful to have the whole enchilada - graphics, the Bowl, snacks, etc. But this was cool.
Coming from a live music fan and non audio engineer perspective, I've been loving your videos. Thanks for coming out with super interesting topics that are also down to earth enough me. Curious if you'll have a video outlining the setup for the PHM (Skrillex, Fred Again, FourTet) set that closed out coachella this year.
its interesting how different companies make very different design choices, this is a big departure from say Meyer with very wide front angle splays between boxes... I'm very eager to hear this real life, definitely makes more sense to my head than other approaches
Yes the different design approaches are fascinating. Weight, size, maximum volume, fidelity, cost,, ergonomics (deployability) and aesthetics. Overlaying those onto any design you can usually see what they optimized and what they sacrificed. Increased angle gaps between boxes is it design choice to improve deployability at the expense of fidelity. Meyer typically tends to prioritize weight very low on the hierarchy. Also Meyer historically has tended electronically trying to fix things that are mechanically not optimized.
For line arrays, L Acoustics is one of the best in the game! Their systems always sounded better than Nexo, D&B, JBL, PK, Community, and EAW to my ears. Meyer is just about the only other one I haven’t heard yet… Can’t wait to hear these things in the wild over the coming years!
My list: 1) Meyer/Martin 2) L acoustics/D&B 3) Admanson/ JBL (A12) Doesn't matter what other says A12 is probably the only good thing that ever came out of JBL and its sound easily matches the likes of E15s and k2.... Just my opinion though
For the past few years we've had the JBL a12 in the Gobi tent at Coachella and right next door at the Mojave tent until this year has been K2. You could walk back and forth relatively quickly and hear the difference between the systems with multiple engineers over multiple days. Even with the disadvantage where the Mojave tent has just a plastic interior and the Gobi tent has drapery cover the entire inside, clarity differences could be heard though somewhat masked because of the increased reverberation of the Mojave tent. The a12 is definitely a full sounding and good sounding system one would be hard pressed to say it sounds equal or better than the K2. The main difference that was readily audible is the clarity of the mids and highs. Additionally the variable horizontal dispersion control using the horn flares on the K2 is extremely useful in reducing the amount of sound bounces off the side walls of the tents versus having the fixed horizontal dispersion of 90°. Being able to narrow the dispersion of the upper boxes to 70° and widen the coverage of the lower boxes to 110° and cannot be overlooked as a huge advantage. That said the cost of the JBL is lower and the entrance fee to owning is lower as there is not as strict of a minimum system purchase requirement. So for the budget-minded the a12 can be a good solution
RCF makes good gear and quite good value for the cost. When comparing the manufacturers won first needs to define the scope. If you're looking for a certain product cover a certain application there may be many options out there or several options they can do a very good to excellent job But that's a product based comparison while looking at a specific application. If we broaden our scope and look at the manufacturers as a whole, then we start to look at things like how comprehensive their entire offering and product line is. And whether or not the various products they manufacture work well together and have similar Sonic profiles such that various products can be used in various locations while maintaining sonic continuity. And what are the design tools? How good is the software that they make that allows you to design and optimize their systems? This is where L-acoustics kind of leaves all of the other companies in the dust. The Sound vision software is so advanced and so accurate and powerful compared to the other offerings that it makes the other offerings look like 8-bit video games. Even advance manufacturers like D&B array calc looks like an old space invaders game. Compared to the 3D rendering of sound vision where you can drop probes and look at the frequency response anywhere in the venue. But looking at it the other way, most or minne applications Don't need this advanced precision and why product range with interchangeable enclosures offering similar sonic profiles. And so seeking out a highlight product from various companies for specific applications is often advantageous and the way to go Has a company that rent sound systems for large venues and festivals as well as install sound systems in a wide variety of music and corporate venues, L acoustics tends to be the optimum choice for what we do. One final aspect is to look at the artist riders and what they are demanding or requesting and invest in the systems that show up most commonly from the most demanding bands. And for that it brings us back to the initial comments of D&B, L acoustics, some meyer, JBL and Adamson. And a few other companies as well
It's an interesting concept, though I will retain my skepticism until I hear it. I can see it being useful though it will be interesting to see how the pros/cons of ownership will shake out.
If it was some unique gimmick I could see that. But here is something that is smaller lighter louder sets up faster and sounds audibly clear when compared side by side with known speakers that are extremely popular. My prediction is that it will be extremely popular
What I like, it's I would save time trying to figure angles between boxes... With this model just give the top direction and done 😁 great for venues that won't have time design with the software.
I think this system does do a good job of making it easier to deploy a system and cover a room. You can fly the system up and bump the motors until the top box covers what you want and then using the software fill in the bottom side of the coverage. I do kind of miss that old school setup where you could fly everything up and figure out your coverage later rather than having to do everything in advance. This kind of allows you to take either approach
@@DaveRat I'm about to buy a Kara ll rig. 10 boxes aside plus subs from Backstage Productions in Alabama to put in the Strand Theater in Marietta GA. I'm watching as many videos on L'Acoustics that you have right now. Outside of mixing on VDosc a few times I really don't have much experience with L' Acoustics systems . I've recently downloaded sound vision so I can follow along in your videos and learn more about system design. hoping to get my chops up because we have a company that I have worked for a number of years here in Atlanta called Atlanta Sound and Light. That recently became an L'Acoustics dealer and I'd like to get more involved in the system design side of audio now. I'm getting older and the need to mix isn't as important for the ego, but system design is becoming more interesting. Thank you for your help and videos. We all REALLY APPRECIATE your point of view and the joy of sharing you have. TYVM
Absolutely appreciate these cutting edge advancements in density, size, etc... Each developer pushing the state of the art ... it benefits all of us. I straddle both hifi and pro audio, I encountered an individual recently swearing they'd NEVER experienced decent sound live ... let alone a quality experience. I enthusiastically shared with him the phenomenal advancements in live sound. I've been doing it since the 70's ... truly amazing how far things have come. Question; Danley, know of any working acts out there touring with Danley point source rigs? I know their fixed installs have been busy ... curious about Danley out there in the wild.
Volume yes but coverage no. Point source systems require multiple long and short throw box types to be hung in various configurations. With line arrays you just keep adding more of the same box so you can carry a bunch of the same boxes and scale the coverage Do you know of any world class bands that tour with point source systems?
@@DaveRat Afaik Danley is more focused on stadiums, rather than touring. How come Danley can offer great fidelity with fewer boxes than with line-arrays in these venues? For someone touring different venues a line array is the best compromise, but it's a compromise nonetheless. Sure they can be made to sound great, but there is a lot of marketing and bias in the industry, just like with the goldenears in hifi-circles. Manufacturers like to claim their line arrays are "line-sources" for instance, when none of them are actually true line-sources. If they were, then output power would proportionally scale with the number of boxes in the array, i.e. +6db for every doubling of speakers. Yet none of them do that even remotely when you stack more than say 4, which can only mean there is plenty of interference which a true line-source would not have.
Yes for permanent installs using large format narrow beam boxes can work well for long throw. The setup and rigging is complex but that is a good tool for the job. As far as line arrays in marketing versus what really happens I suggest just doing the predictions using the software where you can actually see what happens. The correlation between the predictions and real world at least with the top brands, is quite good and it's not marketing high it actually is predictable buildable scalable and deployable as the software shows.
Thanks for the video Dave, good to hear the thoughts of the designer. It feels like there's a non curving L2 box that's missing, 4 boxes a side can't be the maximum hang. I'm wondering if there will there be L1 that will replace K1?.?.?.....,🤔🤔🤔
Looking at this model there is 3 x 10° boxes and 1x 60° in box as the maximum hang. Offering a baseline of 90° that can be expanded or reduced using beam steering in the vertical. The concept is based on systems this size equivalent to 16 x k2 covers the majority of the applications that this box size format would be used for. And I do agree for anything larger than 16 deep K2 applications moving on to K1 would be preferred
quite fascinating how much smaller the systems are getting. what were the limitations in the past that forbid the use of vertical line arrays forcing sound engineers to use the 'speaker walls'?
This system is a step on the right direction for clarity. Would you consider doing a side by side comparison with some of the Danley Jericho range? I know SUBtract audio has a pair of Danley J8 about an hour and a half away from your shop. I have heard them close to far (500') and they basically remove the need for delays on large outdoor deployments.
Nice system!!! Can this new product be said to be a system that complements the limitations of the high-pitched up and down angle arising from the curvature of one element in the line array system? On the contrary, if you arrange all elements in a straight line, you will find that the wave guides of all the high-pitched drivers do not have a vertical direction angle of 0 degrees, causing interference with each other.
My understanding is that through the use of beam steering and control over each individual driver they can compensate the curvature to be flat or to extend the coverage vertically My experience with the product is that it definitely sounds clear in the the mids and highs than individual element systems
It's so interesting to learn how sound and sound sytems work, and developments are being made.... Is it still true that PA systems mostly are mono, or does it depend on circumstances?
@@DaveRat Haha LOL thanks for answering. I always wondered how commercial tacks collapsed to mono that were awful to listen to, were holding up at festivals...Now I know. Thanks!
Yeah life sound kind of sucks in mono but you can't use two stereo either as there's a lot of people that only hear one side of the system. So there's kind of a dual mono stereo-ish Way of mixing that can sound really cool and cover well. Unfortunately there's no common ground and the way people mix is all over the map
@@DaveRat In my music productions I always check mono compatibility and if it collapses too much I always go back and improve. There is conflicting info going around. Some say nobody listens to mono anymore. Then you have those that claim PA systems at festivals and in bars are still mono. I'm rather save than sorry and keep checking mono compatibility. Thanks for sharing the info!
Hi Mr Rat!!! A great video very clear specs of the new product l2 and l2d!! Its been a couple of years since i subscibed to your chanel and was wondering what your favorite brand to work with and why!! D&B , l Acoustics or Meyer sound! thanks sir greetings from Mauritius Island🏝🏝🏝
I preferred Lacoustics as a sound engineer as they were the first to reach worldwide consistency of their product deployments. So I can get the same system everywhere in the world Since then other companies have done a good job of doing the same thing. I started buying lots of Lacoustic stuff for my rental company back then and I do own some D&B but primarily ellacoustics offers the products we need and we work closely with them. I do like D&B and never been a much of a fan of Meyer. I always had trouble mixing on their sound systems with them sounding processed and phasing and requiring more EQ from time to get the sound I desired
@@DaveRat thanks for the reply and being close to your fans!!! 😀 good luck and hope one day you come to mauritius island doing some seminars on sound engeneering!!! god bless you are a legend man!
Yes that's true Ella koustics optimizes everything but it comes at a price One of the interesting aspects of elakoustics is that even though it's super expensive to buy it holds its value better than any other sound gear on the market that I've experienced. We actually bought vdosc for less than we sold it for 20 years later! And rarely does all acoustics gear drop below 50% of its initial value even after a decade with a few exceptions
Yeah the auto filter is severely limited and only does minor adjustments. Where is the EAW completely relied upon it. The L2 is definitely clear than the K2 and the K2 is clearer than the Anya
Can I build a small home single room line array with simple capacitive crossovers with small mid tiny high and small degree center deviation over a short distance using cheap car audio speakers? Having a mid life crisis and bought a mixing board and decided to hobby as a home party dj. I want to build a bitchin' speaker array on a dad with kids budget. Love the content my brother
Agreed that having multiple speakers reproducing the same sound causes issues. And the reason to have multiple speakers recreating the same sound is to increase output level and/or coverage when needing to cover larger spaces than a single driver set can do
It's not really beam steering and that you can't use it to expand the coverage. In order to maintain the sound quality the algorithm will smooth the coverage within the existing band or act as a high pass filter to reduce the coverage at the extremes. Beam steering is a term typically used to force the coverage beyond the areas that the horns are naturally pointed at
Hmmm, without doing a spec compare, I will bet that L2 is smaller lighter louder and clearer sounding while off ring better sight lines and faster setup.
Using the term point source when referring to sound systems is kind of confusing. A true point source is infinitely small and radiates the same sound in all directions and no sound system does this. The closest we get to point source is a single box with a single component or group of summed componentsfor each frequency Beyond that we need to array multiple speakers either vertically or horizontally or both So then you end up with either an array or a giant horn with a coverage for the entire area. If the array positions speakers horizontally you end up with more audible combinations that are less than ideal If you array them vertically the issues are less audible due to where our ears are on our head and how it's easier to walk side to side versus move our bodies up and down vertically for large distances When deploying sound systems for concerts, using large horns that have predetermined coverage patterns are not optimal And this is demonstrated by the fact that no major artist or tour travels with systems that lack the ability to be arrayed Those arrays are almost always in the vertical domain
Hmmm, just like a MacBook air that is faster and smaller is cheaper than a MacBook ? Usually, smaller lighter louder sounds better all increase price In designing sound systems and nearly everything, conflicting parameters are balanced. Making a loudspeaker louder generally makes it bigger, heavier and/or more expensive. Making it lighter means it sounds worse, is not as loud and/or more expensive. Making it smaller means not as loud, more dense weight, more expensive and/or sounds worse Pretty much th only way to raise sound quality, reduce weight, reduce size and maintain or increase max output and fidelity is to increase costs. It's a fun and tricky balancing act that few companies do well
Yes I agree and know what you mean and also I think that Bose does not deserve the abuse they get. Amar Bose was an innovative genius. And though Bose corp did get commercialized and overcharge for consumer gear, the innovations and creativity that he has come up with and the company has come up with our astounding and ahead of their time. And super cool is controlling interest of the company Bose was donated to MIT School of technology. So buying Bose products benefits MIT and the technologies that the university is involved with!
@@DaveRat Bose did more than just audio too, I think one of Bose' most amazing creations was their electromagnetic suspension system for cars, utilizing linear actuators. Seriously cool stuff. Awesome video too! Hopefully I get the chance to experience the L2 one day
Very interesting and thank you. Yes I share the disdain for bows with many people for many years and some of itself earned by their arrogance and pricing model. Which is unfortunate as it dilutes the awareness of the brilliance of their designs and contribution. It's interesting that apple has been able to propagate many of the same techniques yet retire levels of success and less of the notoriety
The days of sound engineers wanting to see big pa'8s is fading. The industry is slowly weeding out the weak ones and the engineers that rely on clean powerful sound that does the job at hand well are the ones we respect and look out for
The L2 look really nice. But for me it doesn't looks like a new idea ? Fohhn Audio is doing "beamsteering" since like 8 years with the Focus Venue series... For me, Fohhn is like 10 years ahead in this type of speaker (even the Syva, 10 years before, fohhn had the LX series), but can't get enought visibility to be known... That said, i really want to mix on those new speakers !
Beam steering is not new and unified waveguides is not new. Combining the two concepts and adding horizontal variable control into what I believe may be the best weight and size to coverage ratio out there while improving sound quality is what makes this special.
in addition to Daves comment the Syva isn't really comparable to the LX Series either. LX is a rather pure Linesource. Syva is more a combination of a more classic louspeaker-design with line-source-like benefits... more "like" a K2/K3-Box in a different order of drivers. That said physics will probably always be physics (..at least as we don't go to the strings and stuff :D ). HOLOPLOTs new system goes two steps further than Fohhn or L-Acoustics - with its own rather unique advantages/possibilities and disadvantages
Lots of powerful systems out there and not unlike a TV sound bar any system that has multiple speakers with variable phase and timing, recreating the same source or versions of the same source, in the horizontal domain inherently creates unnatural phasey sounds. Holoplot is super impressive and can project different sounds into different locations and is an extremely powerful tool but perhaps like comparing a hammer to a crescent wrench there may be some overlap in usage but they're different tools
Hmmmm, you can get all the specs from the L-acoustics website all good. To do a vid on stuff anyone can just go read themselves would be to boring for me. Also L-acoustics already released a vid detailing all the features from a manufacturers promo perspective. This vid is to meet and chat with the system designer. Way more fun and interesting in my opinion to share perspectives that don't show up on a downloadable spec sheet
I’m definitely not buying this! …. I can’t afford it lol tho I’ll be saving money ether way in life so maybe some day when someone designs a way to punch people in the face with sound from an invisible source just like telepathic sound waves control elements I also noticed how they beefed at Meyer’s panther when they introduced this box “we could have made panther but we are l acoustics … “ lol we like bandwidth over spl any day…..mmm full range and meyers new slogan be “honest sound comes from one source in Berklee” and l acoustics robots be like ewww pin points ! And me like what the f word I can’t afford any of these why am I watching this why was I born soo far past life was good tho I should have been a better person… you really have to hug people…
Well, perhaps pick a side and embrace the grump and snark from yourself and the manufacturers. Or reject it from the manufacturers and set an example by doing the same personally. All good I don't mind a little edginess from the manufacturers or from you, keep things interesting
@@DaveRat it’s all good I love ‘em companys they make amazing quality speakers and with different views which is why they are unique in their own ways I just felt like mentioning it, I’m hoping to hear this boxes soon to be amazed I’m sure, you rule Dave!
Super cool and every system has its limitations. I think what's really important is that sound quality is not the most important thing though everyone seems to think so. I believe what will propagate the system is the reduced setup time, size and weight, while still sounding good
Oh my, the VHD5 is a massive array of speakers trying to be a point source with electronic processing that bases its existence on how it is not a line array and that line arrays have high frequency issues due to gaps between the horns The L2 is a line array system that does not have gaps between the horns and solves the exact problem that vhd 5 says is the biggest issue. These are two completely different approaches but both do use some electronic beam steering which neither company invented.
Clearly you never owned or setup a system from the 70's and are not familiar with current deployments. I owned some tasco Harwell stacks. Replacing a 500 pound cart of 4 speakers with a 350 pound cart of a single speaker that does is the same output and offer more coverage control is no step backwards
@@DaveRat No one in a clear mind and sober memory wants to own those huge scary boxes from the 70-80s ... But the manufacturers seem to have run out of engineers once they offer such solutions ..?)
By combining four enclosures into a single smaller lighter version of the four, the savings on wood panels and reduction in wasted internal space allows higher output and more fidelity from a smaller lighter array with better sidelines. The challenge is the reduction in versatility because you don't have all the variable angles between but they did their research and optimized the enclosure shape based on the majority of deployments worldwide and added beam steering in to compensate such that it will cover a majority of applications. Additionally the reduction in deployment time by having 1/4 the cable connections and 1/4 fly attachments and 1/4 the cables is a huge asset that has very positive financial benefits. The reduction in truck space and flyweight while still achieving equal or better coverage is quite beneficial as well. It's very rare that I see nearly every angle of design parameters addressed and improved. Smaller lighter louder higher fidelity and similar cost At the expense of a slight reduction in low frequency response and versatility of array angles.
