Destiny 2: The truth about Airborne Effectiveness

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I am sure you have seen 100 videos about this, but I hope you watch one more. Just one more. I don't think anyone is talking about what's in this vid. I show exactly what is going on with airborne effectiveness and I don't think you'll like what you see.
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#Destiny2 video for #WitchQueen Season 19 Season of the Seraph #AirborneEffectiveness
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2 окт 2024

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Комментарии : 409

@CoolGuyGames Год назад

Pretty crazy stuff

@TrueBolt18 Год назад

Indeed... Was considering trying the new exotic SMG on StompE hunter, but idk if that's even feasible now.

@mininearby Год назад

Honestly there's like one gun that has enough customization to hit high ae mine has 88 but could have one maybe two more and it feels great but if they want this to work it needs more options

@anthonymanzo7867 Год назад

this video was crazy insightful thanks. so my take away from this is that its skewed too much in one direction, like its 1/8 ratio between the aim assist and accuracy cone when it should be around 4/6 or 3/5. so I'd like a rework rather than scrapping it. I get why its designed this way though now, on paper this should be THE most CONSISTENT way to be accurate in the air, but its not the most rewarding in terms of HOW MUCH you would have to build into it. if this view on ae is correct then the only change to ae should be in a granular way to make each ratio more precise (40/60 or 30/50) so although on the players end its just 1-100 ae in practice its more precise ratio between the stats (like an avg player using a ratio 36/54 if at 60+ ae or 27/53 if at 80+ ae). ideally the ae stat number would look about the same but behind the scenes the ratio between them would be finer tuned the higher you go, so at certain tiers you could spec more into aim assist or accuracy because imo certain primaries act differently (like hc and autos don't benefit from the same ratios, or even some subtypes within the same family).

@jams5529 Год назад

This is what I’ve been saying!!! AA is where the bullet goes when you’re on target, Accuracy is the chance it goes somewhere else. Thanks for explaining so clearly.

@anthonymanzo7867 Год назад

@@jams5529 I don't think thats how that works

@althor5980 Год назад

I've always told people that one of the most important parts to the magic that is Bungie gunplay was their aim assist system. It makes the guns feel effortless and an extension of you.

@tenacity25 Год назад

And this is exactly why I think K&M last word is not in a good spot

@ugrena7419 Год назад

@@tenacity25 Man, I hate to break it to you, but it probably never will be. If it's too easy, people will bitch, and if it's any worse than it is, people will bitch. With this particular gun, it's a losing battle.

@tenacity25 Год назад

@@ugrena7419 It really just needs a tiny bit more aim assist. Not enough to be easy, but enough to help people who can already land those headshots with it now be more consistent.

@nocontender6409 Год назад

@@tenacity25 Let's not pretend we understand things we don't. Even some who have played every day since D1 alpha think they want accuracy when what they really want is tuned aim assist and they have actively been analysing their gameplay the whole time. Let's not strut about and not question ourselves.

@tenacity25 Год назад

@@nocontender6409 I already have a better understanding of the situation with LW than 95% of players considering the fact I know it's not ghost bullets and that it is actually accurate, and can usually land all headshots with it consistently. I just think it takes too much effort and focus to consistently land all headshots to be worth it compared to other options (some of which are not even exotic), but i don't want to completely take that away since it would simply make it too good for modes like Rumble and less fun from great players like Cammycakes (I'd say "and myself" but I don't want to cause the misunderstanding that I think I'm near his skill level overall) who enjoy the fact that it rewards their skill and aim with it. Like, I'd honestly compare it to Marth's tippers in Smash Bros, where I'd never ask for them to be brainless to land, but sometimes they need to be a bit more forgiving with a more generous hitbox because when everybody can move as fast as they do in a game like Smash Ultimate you can't expect Marth players to perfectly land tippers every time when they desperately need it, no matter how good, simply because there's too many variables. And similar to Ultimate, there's just more consistent options out there to achieve similar things (Lucina, in Ultimate's case) - which I personally find less fun.

@nicholascreamer2496 Год назад

This is why I'm still subbed to Cool Guy. No click bait, no salt, just facts and information. Love it. Keep up the good work!

@griever_85 Год назад

Facts. My favorite content creator. Completely objective pov's which is rare

@johngallagher2237 Год назад

Straight facts

@solarwolf1336 Год назад

@@literallynobody1515 - Yeah but that’s like the exception

@markcoventry1411 Год назад

It’s all bait. CoolGuy spends half a video talking without saying anything at all

@solarwolf1336 Год назад

@@markcoventry1411 - Really? I honestly feel like he spends the least amount of time talking about nothing compared to almost every other Destiny 2 RU-vidr. Not all the info will be relevant to you, but you can tell just about everything he says will be relevant and important to someone.

@cristiangomez3290 Год назад

I feel like the destiny community hates on aim assist but doesn’t realize how much they actually use it. Hand cannons, snipers, literally every gun in the game has a bunch of aim assist. Losing it makes the AE system we have now. It makes the game feel horrible.

@cristiangomez3290 Год назад

@JT My only issue with this is that it might still feel the same as it does now with no way of building into it.

@raz1572 Год назад

Worth noting this kind of aim assist is only necessary because of the inherent randomness of the accuracy cone. It's a solution to a manufactured problem.

@ShadowChief117 Год назад

Big shocker that the community absolutely doesn't understand jack about what they're talking about lmao

@Izbiski_ Год назад

@JT That'd be great and all, if not for Bungie's server architecture, and how we play the game. The "hybrid" system they have is going to be painfully obvious with even a small drop in aim assist values.

@ryanmolloy5421 Год назад

@@Izbiski_ one hundred percent I think this all can be boiled down to the shitty p2p/server hybrid crap we have had since D1. They wouldn't need these accuracy cones and massive aim assist if they game didn't have to have a "damage ref" because it has to jump through so many hoops to determine if the bullet hit someone or not. Don't get me started on crossplay. That shit has made the situation so much worse. I've pretty much given up on pvp after having thousands of hours of it between D1 and 2. It feels like shit being mercy to the games connection and losing to the connection and not because you actually did something wrong.

@danperkins4781 Год назад

I said it at launch. The system is not terrible, the problem is they released it half baked. No, not half baked. They released it completely unbaked. They simply need to make it possible to more 'easily' build into 70+ AE. Right now, even if you use an exotic like Foetracer (+20) its still pretty hard to get to +70 AE on most guns sand virtually impossible to reach 100. I'm totally fine with having to build into aerial combat. I think that is a fair and balanced trade off in this game. They just need to do better.

@TJskillz169 Год назад

Same thing I’ve been saying since it came out.

@musicaltarrasque Год назад

I mean wings of sacred dawn gives you +50 ae and plus seasonal mod and Icarus that is a +80 ae to any gun and you can get most guns to at least 20 with mag perks alone It does restrict you to dawnblade but it is possible to spec into it,

@TJskillz169 Год назад

@@musicaltarrasque only Warlocks are allowed is not a strong defense. A single class being allowed to build into it isn't really "building into it" for the rest of the player base.

@PoppyGaming43 Год назад

they released it unbaked so they can tune it before lightfall. imagine if they introduced op airborne subclass with an airborne aim system rework at the same time

@Rainbow-vf5uw Год назад

It would be good it they made it like the flinch system, plenty of ways to build into it, easy to understand, but as they recently said on the firing range podcast it’s underbaked for a reasob

@GeremyG Год назад

The issue for me will always be the game thinking you’re airborne when you walk over a small rock or other not perfectly flat ground.

@smakadragon Год назад

That's what the 80 AE on WotW was for

@CoolGuyGames Год назад

@@smakadragon don't forget about darci

@alexgt5811 Год назад

Yeah a delay being added seems like the most sensible solution to such a common annoyance

@WynnofThule Год назад

@@alexgt5811 yes. That or a ramp-up time.

@acethemain7776 Год назад

@@WynnofThule or fixing their geometry

@christianglassel9950 Год назад

Great breakdown and explanation. Everyone likes to think they don't need AA, but reality says otherwise for 99.9% of us.

@mercadepalmer6967 Год назад

After playing with it for a while, my sentiment is that the system is a good idea. The execution in terms of ability to build into it, is what is awful. What we need in my book isn't a reversal but a clear explanation, like this iluvucoolguy, and some actually sensible ways of building into it that don't involve tanking your stats or other huge sacrifices in the mod department.

@CoolGuyGames Год назад

Great reply

@jormungandr4690 Год назад

Except that is exactly why it is a bad system and a bad idea. I dont see how they can make it work, without forcing us onto wortheless exotics and weapons. They would have to back track like they are going to do with primaries

@kevincatal8869 Год назад

How do you feel about if we all started with a good amount of AE or perfect AE and then certain things drop the stat, like using certain weapons or certain exotics

@AGOGOATHOTH Год назад

@@jormungandr4690 very silly statement. coolguy literally gives an idea for a decent solution, or at the very least improvement, in this video. Just reduce the base penalties for things like stompies and reduce the overall amount of investment needed. Right now people are forced to run 'worthless exotics' to hit the high cap required, but if this was reduced + more ways to gain AE are added (which bungie is doing) then this wouldn't be the case. Just tweaking the numbers a little would make the system into something *much* more enjoyable and less frustrating for everyone.

@M0dernPatri0t Год назад

I really don't understand how making airborne combat less reliable than ground combat is a good idea. Could you explain?

@ballom101 Год назад

When it comes to options for building into AE, I've said it once and I'll say it again. The solar aspect of Elemental Capacitor should be changed to give AE, not reload speed. I mean, look at the rework for the Fundamentals exotic perk. They gave the solar mode AE. So it's clear that solar and AE go together. So just change EC to have solar give AE. It won't fix the problem entirely but more options is always better.

@FAUXCUSpd Год назад

honestly i’ve wondered if strand and elemental capacitor is going to give AE. it would make sense i think, considering we have grappling hooks coming

@thatguyyouhate3743 Год назад

I’ve always thought the biggest problem with ae was the lack of ways to build into it. Something I’ve thought that would work well is making mobility grant ae, 2-3 ae per tier would work well and it fits thematically. It would also make mobility worthwhile compared to recovery or resilience in pvp

@raymundodiaz181 Год назад

This is something mobility needs to become relevant, as a hunter main I feel left out when my best Stat isn't as flexible as the rest.

@ballsofsad Год назад

That sounds like a brilliant idea however AE came about because they needed to nerf stompees and hand cannons. There hasn't been a good reason to take stompees off since they've been around. I'd rather have stompee hunter rolling my team than lose a fight cause my enemy was on the ground I had to jump.

@ELVIStheDotA Год назад

Except we would then get jumping Hunters again like the stompee days which Bungie purposely made this system to kill except now every other class would be worse off cause they can't just slap on icarus and fight in the air with them. So I don't think they gonna do that.

@anand321123 Год назад

A lot of people really NEED to see this. Great work CoolGuy, as always.

@leewebster8446 Год назад

Excellent video for people to understand what's going on. I believe the issue was in the communication, leading to confusion that no accuracy penalty at 50/70 (can't remember which) meant that your weapon would fire like a Lazer; exactly where you're aiming. However, that would mean your in air ACCURACY would be better than if you were on the ground (a cone, not a Lazer).

@dylanlasky2389 Год назад

I like the system for its potential. I hated just slapping icarus on absolutely everything and calling it a day. I wanted to use other mods but I couldn't because icarus was too good. Greta video coolguy. I hope the system becomes a real stat to care about. AE mods for armor is one idea I have just like resilience or mobility mods. Sacrifice your stats and become juiced in air.

@cerebralassassin2185 Год назад

Tbh i think people really overhyped icarus back then. I could hit airborn shots without it just fine back then.

@KLGChaos Год назад

Not even everything. It was 95% hand cannons because it was the only archetype that didn't suffer severely in the air.

@AndrewOnYoutube Год назад

Guy, you are so Cool. Regardless of vertical orientation

@malevolentmoose Год назад

I've never realised that the circle and cross size actually represent something, great explanation. I feel like the system itself is a great way to standardize all the stuff about in-air accuracy but the execution is lacking. If not add more ways to build into AE, then they should probably just double the AA cone size at low AE or something like that to make it feel a bit better when not investing in it. Both could be even better though.

@thyme4935 Год назад

its only representative at 85 FOV (or whatever PS4 used to be locked at. they've talked about making it dynamic for the other FOVs in various podcasts but i'm sure that's low on the list

@southmcwow Год назад

I voted wrong for sure. I didn’t fully understand how the aim assist cone stuff was factoring in. Thanks for the clarification.

@mitchellprokopis7904 Год назад

Brilliant video! So much good info here. The whole community should see this

@jasonmontoya4749 Год назад

I think I FINALLY understand the difference. For Aim Assist, if I shot in the circle I will get a headshot. However if I shoot within the Accuracy, well that bullet can go anywhere in the X's and thus why it can feel bad sometimes. Got it.... I think... lol

@Dainurian Год назад

Aim assist is the Destiny secret sauce, it's why the guns feel so good. Play any other shooter and you will instantly notice the lack of aggressive bullet bending. For example, Overwatch has perfect accuracy even if you're in the air, but hitting consistent shots is way harder even on hitscans. There is AA in every shooter of course, like in OW one of the ways Sojourn has been changed is adjusting the AA of her rail, but in D2 I would say AA makes the biggest difference of pretty much any stat.

@samperez8364 Год назад

It's still hilarious to me that they wanted us to build into class identity and exotics but decided that stompees, an exotic designed around mobility and aerial play should be awful in the air

@xBigxBrainxWarlockxMainx Год назад

I want to start off by saying that you are an amazing gift to the Community and your work/diligence is greatly appreciated, keep it up! Regarding A.E. this information is invaluable. Now that we understand what's happening, we can focus on some overall solutions. A.E. is here to stay, but from your video I learned that this system has infinitely more potential than the old system could ever achieve. The REAL issue now seems to be 1) Investment in A.E. is unreasonable/unachievable atm. Solution: Provide mods that allow for easier benefits, but not without cost. Preferably add these mods to the Leg slot, bc in PvP this is an 'empty' armor spec slot. 2)Perhaps raise the floor on Primary A.E. once again, close to 50 on average, or lower the overall Ceiling so that it is more reasonable to achieve. 3)Give one of our stats A.E. bonus (think High Melee, Intellect, or Mobility) this would provide a wide variety of builds and give the aforementioned stats intrinsic value. All in all looking forward to the day where my Exotic HCs can feel like an old School adept Icarus grip Pali. The foundation is there, we just need to build upon it!

@jamarcusshakespeare6440 Год назад

You were nice about it, but I'm glad that someone has finally proven that Destiny 2 players have bad aim. Every time a good "feels bad" it's either because it has low handling or aim assist lol. But no one wants to be honest about it. We've been used to guns doing a lot of the heavy lifting for years, so anytime we have to shoot better? Chaos. AE is a cool system in theory. Putting Icarus on every legendary is BORING and stale. Not sure why Destiny players just want the exact same pvp meta where things never change and only one way of playing is competitive (Icarus, HC, Shotty, Stompees/movement exotics). I think AE should be tied to the recovery stat. Make all 3 of the base stats super important (so buff Mobility slighty). Would give each class more identity too. Warlocks can rule the air. Hunter can rule movement. Titans can take more damage. But make it a bit harder to hit multiple 100s. So if a Hunter wants to jump around a lot, they have to sacrifice strafe speed/dodge cooldown. Or if a Titan wants to move faster, they should have to sacrifice health. Just a thought.

@martindesgagnes6368 Год назад

There simply needs to be a trade off: just like weapon balancing, we need playstyle balancing. Wanna go hard on air play? Gotta lose that 10 resil. Wanna spam abilities? Gotta forgo some weapon consistency. Just throwing ideas around, but you get my drift.

@KipVelcrono Год назад

Probably one of the few creators for Destiny 2 that I actually appreciate. The fact you you keep personal opinions about things seperate from the actual info makes a world of a difference. I'm probably never gonna care about AE cause I'm not hitting any shots mid air, but I'm glad this info is out there for the people that need it.

@ado_fritos Год назад

I like the idea of AE being the 7th armor stat. Maybe each tier gives you +5 AE, and that way aerial gunplay is a trade off to recov, resil, mobility, abilities, etc

@sebastianturner2458 Год назад

Or just put it on mobility, like flinch resistance is on resilience.

@acknowledge1917 Год назад

While I agree the lack of aim assist is the major factor that makes it feel so bad to shoot in the air, I took cammy's vote as doing what we have at the moment, but more in that direction. I wouldn't complain about AE if we had perfect accuracy in the air and I stand by that. At the moment, although we have relatively good accuracy in the air at the moment, being directly on a target's head isn't enough to guarantee a shot because the aim assist cone is non-existant. If the accuracy cone was reduced all the way down to a pin tip, suddenly you can still hit shots consistently, and you know it's your fault if you miss. However, I don't think this would be a good system for everyone, because ultimately this favors mouse and keyboard absurdly over controller, due to the lack of fine aim without tanking your turn time. With that in mind, I do thank you for making this video to explain AE so visually, it's helped me understand the system much better and I agree, we need more aim assist, it would make the guns feel much better for everyone in the air. (the fact you can't even see your AA cone in 55fov is horrific)

@KababKnife Год назад

damn thanks for the video, did not realise aim assist applied BEFORE accuracy! that's nuts af, completely changes my view on the stats

@FloydianHate Год назад

they oughta put a set of AE leg mods in. break em out by weapon type, like the handling/reloaders. the helmet mod is fine as a stopgap but hat slots are already overcrowded.

@ardyh8789 Год назад

Well said. It's good to actually see what these thresholds mean, and I completely agree about building into it, because right now it's practically impossible to get 100 AE unless you're using heta rises, we need more ways to build into AND the ways to build into it need to be offering 20+ AE for each general way to build into it, or 40+ for "specialized" ways to build into it (hand cannons with lucky pants, smgs with peacekeepers, etc)

@ZomgLolPants Год назад

I think the problem with airborne effectiveness is it broke the ability to respond to incoming threats by using your jump.

@88baldur1 Год назад

This video was absolutley NEEDED. Thank you

@thekingswitness3374 Год назад

@CoolGuyGames This is really fantastic work! Like others have said, this is the wonderful type of healthy information, passion and excellence that I love to see! Truly wonderful work Bro! I consider myself a “dedicated casual” player. So, I usually don’t have the time to research things in the game and break them down to understand the mechanics like this. You provide a truly excellent service to us all with your work. It hasn’t been said enough. Thank you! Please keep up the great work! Your level of skill and understanding of things, is where I’d like to be when I grow up! 😊

@authenticbanana9505 Год назад

Hey coolguy, I know you're certainly looking at a lot of weapons and have almost certainly seen this combo already, but on the off chance you haven't, new trustee can roll enhanced pugilist + enhanced wellspring + bray inheritance, giving a unique trifecta of ability regen. It might have been nicer to have demo in the left, but this still seems like a special combo

@prettysoIdier Год назад

With this seasons artifact mod for AE, using an adept shayuras wrath with a depth, Icarus, grip and peashooter exotics on Titan, I hit 95 airborne effectiveness.

@terribletimes902 Год назад

Thank you. So annoying watching people spew incorrect crap in their “valid criticisms”

@mr_ekshun Год назад

DUDE THANK YOU, I am so glad you covered this! You really helped clarify some misconceptions I had. My thought: aim assist is important _in part_ because it helps compensate for network shenanigans, especially in a peer-to-peer connection. Would you say this is accurate?

@emilsingapurcan8054 Год назад

That actually might also make sense

@falrexion7709 Год назад

I'd like for specials to be the same as primaries with just an increase for 10 ae per level, and they really need ae stats on armor as you said. If with master worked armor and Icarus you hovered around 50 ae, I think people wouldn't actually be that upset. This said, specials, particularly precision weapons like snipers, need to be able to receive the same benefits as primaries even if it takes a little more building and those extra ten stats, needing to max ae to get the same is far too much investment when it dictates your subclass, weapons, and mods. There also probably shouldn't be guns where extended mag + Icarus gives you less than 30 ae. It should be balanced like armor stats insofar as less than a 30 is a penalty but the normal score is between 40 and 60, and investment gets you to 90 or 100. The fact a bunch of guns have single digit ae is pretty abysmal and really hurts the whole system

@TzHaarRealm Год назад

What I'd like to know is how anyone is resonably supposed to build into 70, 80, 90+ AE on Titan and Hunter. As far as I know, Warlocks are the only class able to hit 100 AE and they do it by using a grenade on a ridiculously short cooldown. There is a lack of build options. We only got an AE armor mod for this season. Icarus on weapons is okay, but where are the general armor mods? Maybe a mod that works like stat mods, a +5 and a +10 in the general slot? Sacrifice some stats elsewhere to get better AE.

@okamidt3298 Год назад

Bungie explained how this works just fine- the way the explained it is exactly how it translates in game. The main issue here is destiny RU-vidrs lying to their viewers about how it works, spreading misinformation. Aztecross, FalloutPlays, for example. Every single video with Aztecross is “Guys, airborne effectiveness is so bad seriously. Why is my gun so inaccurate?” When the accuracy of the weapon is identical to how it is on ground with a small investment. I’m glad somebody is finally telling the truth about this- maybe people will start shutting up about it. Airborne effectiveness is a good system and works exactly as intended, bungie just needs to make it easier and actually viable to build into. And people need to stop lying about what it does.

@just_d3spairity Год назад

I desperately want them to actually make any gear you have on to actually affect the gun stat's displayed! The fact that if I put on say Ophidian or Eye of Another World, it doesn't show on the guns? That feels awful to me because it's all knowledge that's outside of the game only. Let the API see it. Let the guns show it.

@firewarrior2822 Год назад

As much as people hate Airborne Accuracy, we're about to get a new subclass that's all about swinging and flying around, they needed to make changes before then for us to get used to the new system instead of adding at the exact same time. I hate the fact that it's taking so long, but they are loosening up on its severity and giving us ways of improving AA, just like they promised

@jamieblakely4043 Год назад

That's been my biggest problem from the beginning. They sold it as a much better system for primaries than icarus, yet after explaining it, gave you fuck all ways to build into it.

@danieljrea Год назад

"AE is not cool but can be cooler than our coolest stuff from before, but needs work" - a Cool Guy Incredible video, I learned a lot! I was shocked to see literally 0 AA cone there - and then realizing then that bullets are just rng at that point. I think more accuracy is not a bad play though - another part of the issue is "bloom" - the rng accuracy cone. Maybe a way to tradeoff for more accuracy as well? E.g., make those Xs tighter that they are by default. Not disagreeing with your video, options for more AA is great, but the fact that accuracy caps out at a fairly reasonably large circle is part of the problem. I think another issue is the accuracy cone is basically not represented well at all in ADS, where most people play. So their dot is on the target, and it misses. The dot implies the bullet goes there, then it doesn't, and feels bad. Perhaps more ADS reticle work to help? That's a huge ask for all the reticles in the game, but just a thought

@treyden Год назад

That twitter poll just shows that no one understands how accuracy actually works. Accuracy is RNG and Aim Assist overrules accuracy.

@ludwigtheascendant Год назад

So Aim assist is what makes your bullets hit the target, with little AA, no matter how much accuracy you have, shooting will feel worse, right? I always get confused with this system

@jimpahnse4704 Год назад

My Problem is with the AE system is: 1. You can't really build into it 2. They should have a better reward system with new Tiers and that 100 AE gives more benefits like bonus AA and that 60 AE is Like pre AE system ikarus Mod( acc+AA) 3. a pve Side of benefits 3.1 specials less penaltys

@ixlimacixl Год назад

If I could I would spam the like button. Everyone needs to appreciate this level of work. Well done👏🏾 Definitely a CoolGuy👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾

@davidcurtis8757 Год назад

Thanks for the research on this. I agree on the costs of getting high AE. I think Bungie needs to either go all in on build crafting and let us do some simple things outside of the current economy. Like why can’t we level up a price of armor so that we can make it more specialized? Let us add an intellect bump of 10 for only 1 or 2 slots after we have used the armor for a whole year. Bungie have put themselves into weird spot of limiting our creativity and time investment capabilities. I understand they have to balance, but is it that difficult to deactivate certain builds in certain activities? Maybe. If that is the case then build a whole separate Destiny PVP game. Just my opinion.

@diaconus1423 Год назад

What if they updated Mobility to provide a small AE scalar benefit? Like 1 mobility gets nothing, but at 10 Mobility your AE of primary weapons is improved by ~15%? And maybe slightly less for secondaries like ~10%? Feels like mobility needs something to make in relevant in light of the resilience change anyway

@thecubanlink2000 Год назад

Great video love the deal and braking down how the system works.

@patthemat7134 Год назад

The issue is 100% the aim assist. When I was trying out a build with bxr and lion ramparts on controller I immediatly noticed the lack of aim assist. Also side note, but why do lions only give 50 ae?

@jacobruiter592 Год назад

They changed it from 100 AE because of the DMT combination. It wasn't a listed change.

@ZadeKirian Год назад

This is gonna be a long one so skip to the bottom if you want a TL;DR I swear, every single Destiny 2 "die hard" I've met and played with for a good while (one of which is my best friend who practically has 6k total hours if we add his console days and current pc days together) think they know everything there is to know about the game. They always say the same things and even though they play the game religiously, it all just comes off so ignorant (and arrogant for that matter). I tried showing one of them a CoolGuy video (I think it was the Out Of Bounds one) and they said "This dude doesn't know what he's even talking about." This brings me to AE. I keep saying "If I had more ways to get AA in the air with mods, I wouldn't mind the AE system." and they all keep hounding on me saying "No we just need better accuracy." (and then the usual REMOVE AE argument ensues but that's besides the point) TL;DR: The point I'm trying to make here is that out of the 1.2k hours I've invested into this game, CoolGuy has taught me the most about what I need to know. I rival my diehard friends in PvP even though they have more experience because of the fact that I know what my weapon can do and they're just mind controlled by the meta. Keep up the amazing videos CoolGuy, you're an absolute powerhouse when it comes to information.

@ashens0ul Год назад

The thing for me is that when I think "low accuracy/high aim assist" I think D1 hand cannons when they had bad accuracy, and I don't want fights to be rng like that. I do think that right now we already have medium-high accuracy/low aim assist and I think the base will be ok with the next update. All I want is to be able to build fully into 100 AE. If I have icarus, extended mag, air assault (for the +10 base), and astrocyte verse I should have 100 AE on any primary that can have it lol.

@sherlocksvp5537 Год назад

Glad someone actually explained it. People were generally hating it for the wrong reasons simply because they didn't understand it

@xHarooko Год назад

Great video, people don't realize how much aim assist is in the game. I bounce between playing Hunt Showdown which has no aim assist and it is NIGHT and DAY for aiming with Destiny.

@F10n0 Год назад

TY for the information. I'll admit I was part of the 80%. I think this might be due to lack of understanding on my part. Ultimately I agree with your points especially how we need MORE ways to build into the system. There just isn't enough outside of certain exotics or abilities that grant boatloads of AE. It almost feels as though ppl who dont want to worry as much about AE will just gravitate towards weapons that don't really care about crits just cause its "less thinking". I know I have.

@Hamiltron_ Год назад

Thanks, Prof. CoolGuy.

@Poppyjasper1 Год назад

Brilliant video, CoolGuy. It’s nice to see an objective take on Airborne Effectiveness. I was surprised at the end when you said you still think AE should be scrapped. What reasons do you have for disliking AE? (Sorry if you’ve said before and I missed it.)

@LuisHGarcia Год назад

Thank you for such a detailed look on this issue. Was very needed. Much more than all the typical 'angry' takes that have flooded the discourse. I'm thinking one way to help AE maybe allowed the Targeting Adjuster weapon mod and/or the various armor mods that help targeting of weapons also improve AE. Or maybe adjust how much base accuracy, be it base or from perks like opening shot, assist with AE.

@Aj-py8en Год назад

The aim assist penalty should be 50%-0% 0-100 based on your grounded aim assist (rather than pre AE airborne aim assist) and the accuracy penalty should also be 50%-0% 0-100 (as opposed to 0-60 like primaries) That's all that really needs to change. Each stat point would decrease the accuracy AND aim assist penalties by equal amounts. As for how to get more AE there's a few things that should happen right away. Special weapon AE should go from 0-35 instead of 0-5. (primaries should be able to get that extra 5 points too) Having all weapons go from 0-35 allows the high end to reach Icarus levels of accuracy with an Icarus mod, while the low end needs more investment. Targeting mods should add +10/15 AE, but their ads scalar should be moved to dexterity mods. This allows exotics to have Icarus basically. Exotics should have more base AE. Up to 50 with certain weapons (cough manticore cough). As long as changes like these go live there isn't any issue with the AE system. Potentially in the future more AE can be added to existing weapon perks like grips, but that should be a part of a larger rebalance/update to the 1st and second column perks. Scopes, barrels, Stocks, grips, sights, rounds, and mags should all be 1st and second column perks with individual weapons choosing 2 of the groups to use (1 per column) then each group would focus on a hidden stat along with the main stats. Zoom, recoil Direction, accuracy, AE, aim assist, bullet behavior, and reload respectively. Also kvostov should return with a column for each group (except sights) and its rifle archetype switching trait.

@Thadiloth Год назад

This reminds me of Gutshot Straight being a widely unenjoyable and unused perk because of its reduction to aim assist. Even players like Wallah stay away from it despite the potential benefit it provides, because let's behonest here....aim assist is the secret sauce. Good video

@Electric.Spaghetti.Neon.Studio Год назад

Exactly. All these “cracked aim” PvP gods have been crutching high AA this whole time, just like everyone else. Particularly on HC, which have always had very high AA. Take that away, and suddenly “the guns feel awful”; WOW big surprise.

@chuyalvarado1631 Год назад

In other words we weren't ass good at aiming, neither on the ground nor in the air lol.

@franciscavallaro6356 Год назад

Outstanding video.... Bungie needs to contract you 😀

@SamuelMindel Год назад

Without a way to build into AE, it was doomed to fail. Inherent idea of AE isn't terrible, but the lack of tools to invest in AE makes aerial gameplay feel bad due to lack of Aim assist

@azura6648 Год назад

'this is heat rises but for all characters' Doesn't feel too genuine when the system itself doesn't quite allow you to build into AE for all classes. And I'm saying that with Foetracer (20), the season mod (15), Icarus grip (15), Extend mag(10), and sometimes even air assault. (10), thats a hunter using Austringer, it has a base of 13 AE, if we add it up. Thats only 83, and I've sacrificed an exotic, a modslot on my helmet that isn't even going to stay season to season, a perk, reload speed. It's a lot to sacrifice to just 'build into AE' and not even hit 100, I want to hit 100, I really really do, but at the moment the current system doesn't allow it for hunters, not that easily. I want to play MY way, my combat strengths, or playstyle.I'm an invis hunter, I love manipulating the radar, do i have to play solar to achieve this? Am I forced into an exotic, weapon choice and subclass? Before even considering how I want to play, what kind of build I want? I really really think that they should've given us AE investment mods on our legs, per weapon. Just like scavs. Make it give 50 AE on Primary, and 25 for special, at the same cost of scavs. Hell you could re-enable scavs and give players a choice, go for scavs and AE for snipers? thats 10 mod cost, you don't get class mods or stat mods. Giving people build choices. Because at the moment? your legs have holsters and something you can't even use. That kind of sucks. Thanks for reading.

@levistaeirssr2684 Год назад

When I saw that poll, when high accuracy low aim assist was winning, my thought was isn’t this the system they have? I don’t think the destiny community knows what they want lol

@The10thdrago Год назад

I'm fine with them undoing the -50 ae on stompees. But I want them yo actually nerf stompees. Just like opidians they give to many bonuses for free.

@yoshi1951 Год назад

Thanks for clearing this all up. That's why I said one should try a gutshot straight hc, to see that you need the aim assist even on m&k. But what's not completely true is that reticle friction is directly tied to aim assist. I know the text told us it is. But 2 hc of the same archetype with very low and high AA doesn't feel different reticle friction wise. And perks like under pressure and tap the trigger should only increase accuracy and stability but you can definetily feel the increase of stickiness. Think about the main ingredient. The bolts often times follow the motion of the target. This is not the effect of accuracy or stability only. Bungie just didnt told us the whole truth. Thanks for the video

@deanb5912 Год назад

I would love more info on Special weapons with this. I have tried Sniping using Wings of Sacred Dawn at around 79AE total, and it feels like there is just less range. Closer targets I can sniper no problem, but long targets are uncertain. At popping Heat Rises for 100AE I feel like I am just landing shots fine, but that could be confirmation bias.

@Commander_Pika Год назад

Finally someone covering it more in-depth to educate people on it 👍 Good breakdown. Got this from reading the notes, but great tool for people that don't understand the system and how it compared to old airborne gameplay.

@no911isownage Год назад

I feel we need leg mods what give us AE. That way the trade off is a mod slot.

@failfurby Год назад

Before I watch: my thoughts on AE It has zero effect on my gameplay and a lot of other casual PvPers gameplay. I ignore it completely on weapons. It's not a natural motion/instinct for the vast majority of people to JUMP before engaging in a gun fight. Specialized, counter-intuitive engagements SHUOLD take special investment into to be as effective as the average, normie player BECAUSE they are counter-intuitive, they are hard counters to the normal, average way people play. Now, I think they may have overcooked the initial rollout of AE, and the re-balance of Primaries being given more base AE is evidence they agree with that too. But, the existence of AE actually improved my PvP existence and encouraged me to engage in it more than I used to, which was not at all.

@CRISPRcass9 Год назад

I totally agree with you. There is little to none ways to build into AE. Let's say a hunter wants to use ace, this the best he can do- 14 base AE+ 15 helmet mod + 20 lucky pants buff and that's 49 AE. It's just sad 😔

@solemn_titan23 Год назад

what if AE was removed for primaries? Making them equivalent to 100AE. Since they keep buffing primaries

@antorico2gaming774 Год назад

Something you forgot to mention that pre AE weapons would have full precision aim assist, unlike now where its halved like other aim assist cones Previously while airborne, players would get full aim assistance for headshots provided their aim assist cone overlapped the head at all. "Previously while airborne, players would get full aim assistance for headshots provided their aim assist cone overlapped the head at all" (April 21 TWAB)

@eulers Год назад

When players say they want high accuracy, low aim assist, they arent speaking in terms of cone angles. Let's forget about the aim assist cones and focus on the fact that Destiny has accuracy cones. That means even shots with pixel perfect accuracy will sometimes miss in the absence of aim assist, which is nonsensical. The AE system exposes this. That's what pisses people off.

@jem-jams Год назад

I can’t help but feel like you’re completely wrong. What about all those test clips from when AE came out where people would point perfectly on the head but miss? If the current system is precise accuracy with low aim assist, why did they miss? Regardless, it’s well known that Bungie’s special sauce for shooters was high aim assist. What on earth compelled them to create a system that removes the Bungie special sauce? That’s a rhetorical question: it was dumb of them to remove the only reason people love Bungie’s gunplay.

@BuffGenji Год назад

Tbh, I’d say just give maxed accuracy on all weapons no matter what. Shots disappearing when aiming right at their chest just shouldn’t happen. Just have AE scale with aim assist

@Jei4Del Год назад

He says this after calling for a stompees nerf because jump shooting was too much for him..... He wants horizontal game play only

@fringehouse Год назад

once again Mobility should give up to +20 AE at 100 Mobility like how Resilience works. It makes sense

@ThaNarc Год назад

I wonder if airborne accuracy effects supers or melees

@Nosavo Год назад

new barrel perk options for ae would be cool. Pinpoint barrel: -5 range, +10 handling, +10 AE

@Sagasity Год назад

So wait cool guy about the parts where u said MnK could potentially have more AA then controller are u just talking for destiny or fps games in general ?

@Galaxy-Creator Год назад

I'm probably not on the majority side when it comes it scrapping the ae system, because it needs either a rework a relatively easy way to build into it on all classes and subclasses and not just stuck to 1 subclass on 1 class like it feels like atm, or go back to the old system. When it really hard to build into a system that you are meant to build into at least a bit its going to make the gun play kinda shit till it can be fully fleshed out with easier ways to build into and with a proper explanation etc of it

@Jcs000 Год назад

Ill say it again: AE isn't about SKILL gap, but INPUT METHOD gap. until you understand that you will think AE system is 'totally ruining the game'. Destiny is a franchise BUILT on controller inputs. MnK turned Destiny into something completely different. Bungie made the decision(with the crying community) to bring all the platforms together, and with that; input devices. Bungie KNOWS MnK is a far superior input method by default and is trying to reign it in. They have all the DATA, they know. if you do not understand this concept, everything Bungie does will look like a backwards decision. Airborne Effectiveness is absolutely necessary to try and bring some semblance or FAIRNESS to the game between MnK and controller. It is a FACT MnK players shit all over the vast majority of controller players. Don't believe me? Go find a really good controller player video(before AE) and see how much they jump in the air for their kills. Unless they are playing CLAW and maybe with a SCUFF its going to be rarely. And the go watch someone who is a good player on MnK(before AE). It's going to be a NIGHT and DAY difference on how many engagements are taken and won from the air. When you have a portion of the player base being able to take advantage of the vertical space(domination of the vertical space), and a portion who cannot; you're going to see that the ones who cannot are HANDICAPPED. MnK already has a significant advantage on the ground, add in the fact that controller players cannot compete in the air. it's a recipe for disaster.

@aaronchisholm4 Год назад

So at 100 AE, you have 1:1 accuracy, but NOT aim assist, correct? If this is true, max AE is only slightly better than before. Personally, I feel like at a 100 AE you should be 1:1 with everything. All in. That way 70/80 AE would FEEL that much better. It’s just a shame this system was launched with it being so undercooked. Everyone’s got they’re own idea and solutions, it should’ve just been left alone.

@CallinOates Год назад

Honestly since the AE changes I completely switched over to Sunshot/DFA/Tears of Contrition as my PvP primary due to Explosive/TPayload rounds. Being a Skylock main have a hard time staying on the ground. Otherwise play Echo on OW2 to get my AirPlay fix

@Jcs000 Год назад

you know how bungie has showed the community literally ever single stat/metric we could possibly think of? you know which one they haven't showed us yet? win% of MnK vs Controller. AE system isn't about skill gap, it's about input method gap. because cross-play that everyone begged for, there is an elephant in the room which is the Domination of the Vertical Space. Controller players rarely jump when engaging targets, so the AE system rarely affects them at all. MnK players always jumping while engaging.... so who was the system designed for? all you favorite MnK streamers tried to trick you into thinking AA on controller was the devil, and when Bungie changed the AA, which is all the AE system is, they got EXPOSED.

@zazapackbussin Год назад

also i find it HILARIOUS how the whole reason this DUMB ahh system was even made was bc aerial gunplay was "opPrESsiVE" to newer players (and bot walkers that cant look up) but now if a newer player wants to get good at aerial gunplay, well TOO BAD BUDDY! youll need this mod with that armor and that gun w this perk to even be on equal grounds instead of just playing and improving lol what a massive L all around

@DudesterGX Год назад

Enjoyed the video, just can't get this line out of my head: 2:10 "They're HALVED, so if it was a Nickle (5 cents) before, it's a Dime (10 cents) now." Me: "wait...."

@jaktheripperer Год назад

The pvp sweats and most streamers will likely never admit their AE could be better than before. They'll wine and complain until I feel like I'm getting AC-130'd in pvp. I enjoy pvp more with people fighting on the ground with the exception of sidearms and SMGs. This isn't Halo. Honorable mention to titans and warlocks floating above doorways with shotguns: I hate you.

@dogureqs Год назад

About that poll, I would argue that we don't have a "High accuracy, low AA" system, I'd say it's a low accuracy, low AA system. When Bungie first talked about AE, they made it sound like (to me at least) that there would be almost no AA in the air but perfect accuracy, meaning those lines would all come in to make an X. If that were the case, then the player would land a shot or not every time, because the bullet goes to one place and one place only. So then would the system work better if the in-air accuracy cone was brought way in for all weapons? I'm talking, like, 0 AE is at least if not better than the current 100 AE accuracy cone. Because if AE is supposed to be about requiring skill, then there needs to be VERY LITTLE randomness involved in where your bullets actually land. And of course weapon type and bloom would affect things. If accuracy was high enough, low AA might be okay to deal with, but currently it's not nearly close enough. If Bungie is too afraid to give us that kind of accuracy, then they might as well bring back more aim assist.

@joshuasmith6909 Год назад

I think the system itself is sound but the implementation is poor. A scalar stat for airborne accuracy is good! The lack of build features, the impressive penalties and high investments to get any benefits at all, that’s bad. The ability to build into AE needs to be fleshed out, and weapon behavior in-air needs to be improved for “builds” that invest only somewhat into AE. Why isn’t there armor mods for weapons? Weapons specifically designed to have high AE but are compromised in other areas? Where are the Barrels that improve AE and minor bump another stat? More perks that grant AE? I bet a lot of people would take 40 AE in exchange for -20 Stability, for like the Iron Banner perks.

@Mrsp8472 Год назад

This could just be a difference in philosophy. Like, I think airborne gunplay should be situational and not the norm. The current system gears you (literally) to that unless you are willing to invest heavily into playing a specific playstyle. Sure, you could also say that takes away from the primary benefits of warlock or titan whose float allows for strong aerial play. And maybe you're right, investment into that kind of playstyle should be lowered, but I still think it should be hard to achieve. I'm waiting for you to start crying about aerials using DMT, Snipers, being domed half a map away with chaperone while in the air, and stupid strong TLW. Might as well boot up Anthem and just fly around shooting things. Then again, you might enjoy that. I remember that video you posted about Shepherd's Watch.

@Volker_A4 Год назад

If AE could be built into I probably wouldn't have quit the game, but I still would be having less fun than before it was implemented. I've never found things like flinch or AE rewarding to build into. I'm just wasting points trying to increase the baseline consistency of gameplay. Making ability or exotic focused builds was always vastly more fun and engaging to me. But, now I'll just have less options than ever because I'd have to default dedicate even more mods to just making the general gunplay feel acceptable.

@protodevilin Год назад

Wow, I actually feel like I understand the AE system now. Still hate it, but at least I understand how it works. I've said it before, but I am baffled that a developer would give players so many aerial mobility options, yet also make being in the air such a thoroughly miserable experience. Bungie, just let us have our leaping 360 no scope trick shot funzies. Stop trying to make this a serious grounded tactical shooter. It's got space wizards, ffs.

@Someguy1357 Год назад

AE simply shouldn't exist, just like RNG pellet spread is going away. A gun behave in the air just as well as it does on the ground. However, it is harder to fire a gun while jumping/flying than not.. but your bullets should go where you aimed them. Bungie could have removed the system, then added airborne aim assist penalties/bonuses the mobility exotics they wanted to nerf/buff respectively.

@mrowoofers101 Год назад

Halo players would get the whole aim assist (bullet magnetism) part and why it's essentially to weapon accuracy. If we didn't have aim assist in Halo, we wouldn't be hipfiring our DMRs on Reach, racking unbelievable headshots (when compared to other video games) and that applies to console as well as M&K.

@Sliq_tv Год назад

If you're going to be disadvantaged in the air regardless of how you spec into it, then AE needs to be easier to build into.

@dvdossbsvskfbdvav Год назад

My biggest pet hate right now is AE haters that fundamentally don't understand how it works. Imo, Bungie have done a really good job with explaining it but people just claim that they're lying despite them not testing it properly. I don't want to spread hate, but Aztecross' video on AE was absolutely awful. Horribly misinformed and blatantly awful takes were just throughout the whole video. He's not the only person doing it, but people need to realise that AE is actually a good system and just needs more adding to it, which is exactly what is coming