I totally agree! Softness is in the hands. I've seen horses who are very gently en precisely ridden with bits and shanks, I've seen horses get their faces yanked on with sidepulls and bitless bridles, and everything in between. I ride both, in a halter and with a bit, depending on what I need to be doing and what my specific goals are at that moment
I had a family member try to tell me bits were a mean thing to use. I told them it can't hurt when my mares foal kept taking her bit before I could put it in the mares mouth. He'd just hold it in his mouth until I was done with the saddle. I always made sure to keep an eye on him though so he didn't hurt himself.
I have two comments.......... On young colts always have your veterinarian check for "wolf" teeth. These are sharp, very small, shallow teeth infront of the molars and can cause discomfort if the bit hits them. Very simple to remove them. My second comment is, one time I asked Greg Darnell, (a well known bit maker) what I thought was a very simple question on bits. He was generous with his time and 30 minutes later, it was painfully obvious that I had a lot to learn about bitting up a horse.........lol. Tongue pressure, bar pressure, palate pressure. Wow, what an education. Anyway, another great video Dewayne.
You make good videos We agree for the most part. We're glad you state that the bit is not painful in the hands of the experienced. Problem is that most of horse owners are not and the horse pays the price. Where we part off is the use of force multiplier shanks. If a horse can understand a signal at 2oz. of pressure, there's no no need to to use 12oz. Also if the horse doesn't understand a signal just like a person that doesn't speak English, speaking louder is not going to get the message across. We love your videos. We just have a little different take on this one. God's Speed.
I have always wondered about this question. I don't own a horse so I had no clue at all. I always thought it was cruel. I had no idea about the space between the teeth!! I figured it was always just jammed to the back of the mouth. I finally googled the question, and your video popped up. Thank you sir, I appreciate your answer.
You may be helping folks and that's a good thing, but the real winners are horses. Making it possible for them together a better deal. Great job on this one!
I totally agree with you . I always ride with soft hands and sometimes just a little wiggle of my finger on the rein will do it. That is so much better than being harsh and heavy handed . Good video.. God bless you.
I always find it comical,that those who are the Most vocal in condemning the spade,are those who are the least educated on them..I then tell them,,that i agree,that it is best,for them and their horse,to avoid them...ALL true Bridle horse people i know,took years of dedication to learn to apply and use them properly and are a hell of a lot less physical on their horses,than most using a snaffle bit,a mechanical bit less bridle or halter..I tell most to completely stay away from the Traditional Hackmore,until properly educated on them as well,because they are the very important foundation for the spade and just as misunderstood and misused as the spade by most..
Great video 😊 Also, hats off to the good old boys wearing the extra long silver and blue pointy boots. They were able to test the S.H.A. Snake soft technique on a black muffled chap pony with the newest technology tapping spikes which enhanced the rodeo clown’s agility while allowing him to move around in relative to the old style double toad style strap in hand. Also , Don’t miss the opportunity to see their video on their website- Texas State Farm Counsel ( TSFC ) filmed in Ratlesnake Ben state park in Argentina.
A wonderful, concise and precise explanation. It's a shame that those who disagree with you will continue to disagree anyway. They are convinced they are correct and no well reasoned discussion will convince them otherwise.
I've ridden dozens of horses just fine in a rope halter. I agree a bit may give a little bit of a finer control or signal however you want to put it. Still if your trail riding how fine of a control do you really need. On a dude ranch I would think you have people riding who the last time they actually rode a horse was never. Surely some are getting up in the horses face with the bit.
Great video. I'm one of those who's always wondered about bits. Thanks for the explanation. By the way, it might be helpful to add a link to your Patreon page in the description of every video. Make it quick and easy for anyone interested in checking it out. That seems to be how most channels do it. Just a thought.
Hey Dewayne, that was funny the way you explained that. Thanks on the half of the spade bit users who are said too oftentimes to be tortious - torturers - tortillas, not pretty sure because, as you guessed, English is not my grandma’s 👅 🇫🇷💨
Well said partner. I have yet to miss any of your lectures on horsemanship, a lot of these people these days don't know what it means to really ride a horse, they think that back in the old 1800s are ancestors just well tortured the animals and that we're no better. We both know the truth they know little to nothing. Stay cowboy partner. Texas Ghost Rider
A bit is like spurs. Used by an experienced rider they are gentle communication devices. Used by a sloppy or inexperienced rider, such as my self, they can hurt the horse. I stick to snaffle, doing my best to be gentle and do not wear spurs. If I develop a good seat and upgrade to a younger more vigorous horse - maybe I’ll try to learn reining horse type moves. For now I’m somewhere between rider and passenger. Always glad when horse tolerates me...
This video and your advice is all excellent EXCEPT that I don't believe a shank bit with a broken mouthpiece gives clearer signals than a single jointed snaffle. In fact there aren't many bits that give more confusing signals than a leverage bit with a broken mouthpiece. Quite a lot has been written about that, usually referring specifically to Tom Thumb bits, which yours isn't, but the principle is the same. If there is no solid metal hobble connecting the shanks together at the bottom ends, preventing them from moving closer together or farther apart, then a broken mouthpiece will result in a confusing mess for the horse.
Awesome video! Also most State Laws require dude ranches to use a specific type of bite on all horses being ridden by customers! Yes this video is a very good one but surprisingly most people don't really understand the differences in reactions/ communication different type bites do! ALSO why when people are actually having horse issues verses taking the time to do better training with a horse, like a stop on a horse, they just put in a bigger harsher bite, VERSES actually both of them getting training
Is this true? I've worked on guest ranches here in the midwest and never heard of this. We always just used what the horse worked best with. For most, we used eggbutt snaffles or d rings. Had a couple of horses over the years that had less than ideal history and we used large diameter curb bit for more whoah, but we were always careful of the rider going on them.
(ALSO why when people are actually having horse issues verses taking the time to do better training with a horse, like a stop on a horse, they just put in a bigger harsher bite, VERSES actually both of them getting training) Which takes less time and money$? There's your answer.
I myself have limited experience with horses, so I'm not really judging people, but a friend of mine who only rides bitless had two horse skulls in their barn. One was of a horse who was ridden with a bit, and one was a horse that never had a bit. They looked completely different. The one who had the bit's jaw was worn badly down. He said, now tell me that didn't hurt the horse.
I would argue that at a certain point in a horse's life and training you can move away from even a spade bit and go to a halter or no bridle at all and they can do everything with just your legs, seat, energy and intention. Takes a lot of years and a lot of miles/rides but I find that usually by the time they hit 15 - 16 years old I can usually do anything on them without a bit that I can do with a bit, including spins, backups, roping, side passing etc. But I agree that a bit is simply a tool and like any tool, how you use it is what matters. I told my boys growing up, don't ride like an @sshole, only touch the reins if you have something to tell your horse, if not leave the reins and your hands down.
I agree and disagree agree not all horse are smart and the same can be said for the rider. If you both have the capacity to learn and to be taught something. The yes liberty riding is great. But for most that just want a weekend trail ride. They are going to need a bit and bridle. I do say ride with the softest thing you need to do the job you need done. It is better for you and the horse.
Move away from the spade bit? Sounds like you don’t k ow the proper traditional use of a spade bit. I would argue that you don’t need to move away from it. I fact going to the halter would be going backwards. The halter is used to mechanically move your horse while the spade is (if use properly) is nothing more than a signal to alert your horse it’s time for him to move of your seat. So why would you want to go backward??
There's never a time to move away from the fundamentals of anything, be that animal care, gardening, shooting, hunting, etc. Nobody and no critter anywhere is too cool for the fundamentals, and if they think they are then they're suffering from a lack of information pertaining to their lack of information.
@@katiek.8808 never mentioned liberty. I specifically mentioned the spade bit. More precisely I referenced progression to the spade bit. So your coming out of left field with liberty is severely off topic.
@@katiek.8808 well Katie, bless your heart, that makes two of us not reading the comments huh? You didn’t read mine, I responded specifically on tradition and nothing further. More precisely, traditions in regard to the spade bit. Nothing else of the original comment was touched on me. Progression. To the spade bit was all I touched on.. nothing else.
Well said Dewayne ! I ride pens at a feedlot . Bits and Spurs are tools . They need to used correctly . No way would l ride without them in the situations l find myself and my horse in .
That horse looks SO sweet and mellow. Such a good looking horse as well! Thanks for the information - those of us new to all this appreciate it! Be well, all the best.
I agree with you. But, think about this. A normal size horse has a 5 inch mouth. A broken mouth bit is normally 5 inches wide. But when you pull back , the bit becomes scissors. The more you pull back the narrower the bit becomes. If you adjust your bridle too short, that 5 inch mouthpiece can become a 4 inch mouthpiece.
@@joligra, not all of us barrel racers ride like that! Some of us actually learned a thing or two outside of barrel racing, but yes a lot do and need to go back to the basics of riding not just going fast and having an out of control horse! A lot of the youngsters think that’s acceptable for their barrel horse to act that way! And that’s not the case!
@@CowboyKel34 Need more people in the world like you. It's sad to see it and it needs changing. But imo once money is involved, ethics go out the window, seen too much of it and not enough pressure in the community to change the status quo
its great intel i live in maine and its gets darn clod in winter but i get a kick out of people that blanket their horses they are just fine in open runin shed faceing south east out of the wind had arabs for 20 years none of them had a problem great youtube chanel thanks
When I was learning to ride I was always taught that the bitless bridles or halters were the MOST severe because the nasal bone is paper thin and horse are nasal obligates so you have to have perfect hands for a bitless bridle whereas the bars of a horse are thicker ...the pressure on the sensitive area of the nose is huge ...I think you really need to be a master to truly ride bitless well and even then there are many things you can't do without a bit. If your hands are sensitive enough for shanks that is fine. It's weird the way the horse world has gone in the US online at least no idea if it's that crazy in real life. But here crops bits etc spurs..just normal if used WELL.
I've watched some of your videos for awhile dewayne, and have enjoyed them very much, I've only just got around to subscribing, and hope to see and hear more of your wisdom. The way you present yourself and your lifestyle, even to someone like me from the south of England, I think we all could learn to be more like you. When you talk, it's like you're talking to that person only and giving them your respect and passing on the all the know how you have built up over the years. Than you for taking taking the time to make these videos, and I look forward to seeing more of them.
I ride with braided reins, a braided rein gives more feeling to the neck. The horse will feel rein better as it moves against the hair, the horse if giving a chance will start to take signals before the rein ever pulls tight against the bit.
I suppose it becomes a matter of personal communication between horse and rider, no argument here, I use a crossover bridle myself but, it's probably like brussels sprouts...they ain't for everybody...God's peace to all
Hi Dwayne. I've seen most your videos and find them quite educational. So on this matter of the bits, what would you suggest doing with a horse that has no stop regardless of what kind of bit I use?
Isaac, we have to come to the understanding that no bit is made to teach the stop. We teach the stop, and then the bit simply communicates to the horse when we want him to use it. On a horse that does not want to stop, there’s two or three methods that can be used to teach them. One method is, using a regular O-ring or D ring snaffle, circling them around until they stop. In simple terms when a horse does not stop, they want to keep moving their feet. So when we want them to stop, we make them, or we let them, keep moving their feet but we make them do it in a circle until they decide they don’t want to move their feet anymore. It is not comfortable for a horse to move in small, tight circles so we are making the undesirable uncomfortable. So we use this method consistent and regular, along with a verbal whoa, so that they learn that if they stop when you say whoa they will not have to move in circles.
Dwayne you explained it quite well.i have been on horses with a hard mouth.%hey have been on a sawing brainless exploit of man.i don't know if anyone could help them forget.it is SAD.kat,ct
Uneducated horses with uneducated people trying to be nice to the horse by going bitless is a dangerous thing, when thot shit hits the fan and someone gets hurt the horse is always blamed and suffers as a result. The reason it’s been used for hundreds of years is because it works
Bits have actually been around for THOUSANDS of years. A modern human would instantly recognize a 3000 year old bronze Greek bit for what it is. Then again riding bit-less has also been around for THOUSANDS of years.
Not if the rider knows how to ride properly. Too many people sit on a horse that's moving & call themselves horse riders. . Big difference from a trained rider. He's right. A plain snaffle is easy on a horse. I use it. But again, it's the knowledge of the rider. Same as spurs. Experienced rider know how to use them painlessly.
Hey DeWayne, could you explain, why some people ride with a nose gard, and a bit, is that more of a teaching or refinement tool. By the way, I really enjoy your videos, your lad back and relax, thank you.
@@robgriz72 Sorry, Hey Remmy, the nose gard is called a caveson and I have seen like plastic rope on the nose, with a bit, to put pressure on the nose, that would really hurt? To me less is better. Thanks
There are two different things that people put across the nose of a horse, and they are for two different reasons. In my opinion both of them are wrong. The one as mentioned above is a cavason. A cavason is for the purpose of keeping a horses mouth closed when they’re gaping at the bit. And a horse often will gape at the bit because the rider has not made the horse, comfortable and relaxed with said bit. The other item is a tie down. You’ll see that mostly in rodeo arenas with barrel racers and ropers.
Great presentation Duane. Now you have opened up another can of worms. Who is sending stupid comments that bits are harmful? So I will give a little instruction to all. The first thing horse and rider must learn is the principle of bend. This is accomplished with hackamore and or snaffle. I start my horses in both at the same time. When a few miles into the day and the horse will bend easier I will use the hackamore rein alone. Remember Clinton says the key to virtical flexion is lateral flexion. A shank snaffle will pinch the bars. Use a ring snaffle or hackamore for years then go to the spade. You will be amazed how much the horse likes the spade after they have mastered the principle of bend. When using any compression bit use your legs for turning more than the bit. But then if you are taking dudes there is no point in teaching them the fine art of reining. Watch the working cow horse competition and you will see they all use only a ring snaffle. Thus the name snaffle bit futurity. When ever I am on the range I ride with hackamore and snaffle for at least 5 years. In order to bend a stallion a hackamore alone will not get it done. 99.9% of people on you tube both north and south america are using a compression bit incorrectly. Watch as their horses throw their head in the air and say no, I am not going to do what you tell me. One group wants to slam a curb bit into the mouth and buck the horse out in hard pack gravel next to a barbed wire fence. You know who I am talking about. Enough of this see you next time
Many experts agree. Many experts disagree. What qualifies as an expert? What makes you feel better about your self? And what do you have to offer to the conversation in way of experience that is worth consideration?
@@DryCreekWranglerSchool What I offer to the conversation is to remind people to not rely on one opinion source because unless you can show an MRI of a horse's brain pain center while tugging on his bit, that's all it is...an opinion.
It’s never the bit, friend. It’s the hands. It has always been the hands. Any real Horseman across any discipline knows this. Knows this far beyond the realm of "opinion". You follow your opinion, and I will follow my 30 years of experience and study.
a properly trained horse wont have the bit pulled on whatsoever, and normally younger horses are ridden bitless until they can understand neckreining a little bit.
Would you recommend someone who is just learning and not great with timing and softness start with a halter or hackamore (sp? the one that goes over the nose)?....Asking for a friend :D
I would recommend a simple o-ring or D-ring snaffle, if the horse is manageable. I never recommend the mechanical hackamore, that’s the one with the band that goes over the nose but with shanks that you attach reins to like a bit.
Those people who automatically say that the bit hurts the horse, are the same people who think that spurs hurt the horse. I know a guy who says he would never use spurs, because they hurt the horse. My answer is yes they can, IF you don't know how to use them. I mean common sense tells us that if you need some extra speed then spurs are the best tool to use. But personally I think a lot of the issues with spurs, bits, etc. come from Hollywood's presentation of the Western on film.
I saw horses in a parade with bits in their mouths that were foaming at the mouth. One horse looked like its tongue was stuck, and it was very stressed. It made me feel really sad for the horses because it looked like they were in pain and distressed. Can you help me understand these situations?
Seriously!!! Just don’t put a bit in a horse’s mouth. Full stop. Stick one in your mouth and let people force you to do what you don’t want to do and steer you where you don’t want to go. See how you like it. Since time began white people have always excused the sadistic use of painful instruments to force animals and slaves to do what they want them to do. Smell the roses. It smells of shit. It is pain. It is forcing them to do what they don’t want to do. It is not “fine and clear communication”, because the same reasoning was given during slavery. You defend it, because you don’t want to stop doing what’s clearly wrong.
'Do bits hurt horses? ---------They can. Are they needed? ------------No. If one has a good connection with the horse, a traditional hackamore or rope halter do very well. In rare cases, if the connection is of one mind, no head gear is needed at all.
Nice try. But one can get the complex communication you mentioned even without any head gear if rider and horse have a good strong bond. Yes, can work cattle. Yes, can rope off the horse. One can get as fine tuned as one wants in a rope halter or traditional hackamore. And as far as the spade bit bridle horse is concerned, you watch some of those horses carefully and you will see the horse avoiding pain through their body language.
You were talking about the top one percent horseman in the world. The average horse rider who wants to have a good relationship with their horse is not at the level that you are referring to, and therefore needs a good communication tool. I’m here to help those who need help, not parrot those who already have everything figured out.
