I've run a waste removal company for the past three years I echo your thoughts completley. Friends family think I can just sling something on the van for peanuts, and get rid, and occassions expecting it for free like you said the only person I will do something for free for is my mum. All the best pal 👍👍
My neighbour is a glazer/window/door/lock fitter, I have had him in a few times for jobs, every time he's laid i'll do it for £x amount, I've always said to him to do it for his asking rate, exactly because I understand people have bills etc and I'm not looking for mates rates, I'd just rather give the work out locally, always pay cash. That's how we should treat each other with businesses.
'Don't work for family or friends'. You can say that again. And not only that, being a van owner i regularly get asked 'oh, can you help pick up and drop off (enter white goods/large furniture item)' Thing is when i do it's not me helping, it's me doing.
I did a job all day on a Sunday, spent all day, he was over the moon, he said “il pop round later” I said “brill, no worries” he came round mine with a ruddy cake 🤣
Hi Rob. I feel your pain mate. I have lost so many friends because they seem to think I'm some sort of a charity. How anyone can expect you to spend all day working, and swallow costs to your business for the waste removal, is beyond taking the piss. But, we live and learn !
My sincere sympathy and total empathy mate. I'm a sparky, and have been in a very similar situation... they use the " Wife " as a blocker.. In reality they know exactly what they are doing, it's very crafty teamwork between husband and wife..... Absolute Shysters... In my experience,... long story short, I spent a whole 5 days wiring up a new kitchen for a mate,.... I got absolutely fuck all for my time.... he used the " Mrs won't be happy card"... Twats.. We live and learn
This is why i dont do electrical jobs for people any more. Cable alone is a big expense before adding on other materials then the work involved chasing walls out then plastering afterwards. So just refuse now. I just use the Part P excuse now. Dont have it or need it due to working on heavy industrial stuff.
I think the old saying goes "When it comes to money, you know no one" That includes jobs on the side and personal property. I am a former landscape gardener, and when I had the van, friends and family would contact me all the time to help them out. I really should have been a lot firmer with some of them. I won't go into the personal property side of things, but all I will say is: Never lend tools to anyone, ever!
On starting out on my own for the first time in my life I was eager to take on everything and anything. Scared to turn things down. No experience of pricing work up. Looked at a side on picture of a conifer hedge. I didn’t bother going to look. Guessed at how long it would take to cut to the ground. No thought on how I was disposing of the waste! And stupidly said I would do the lot, taking waste and all. Not even got a van sorted yet! Got there and told him I’m going to have to walk away. Eventually agreed on a price to cut to ground level and he would organise removing the waste. Painful! But lessons learnt that day!
i’ll tell you one that happen to me. i do car bodywork for a living. a friend asked me to take a look at his wife’s car as she had scraped the back bumper on her car at time. so i drive roughly 15 miles to the house look at the car. take the back bump off drive home again repair & paint the bumper drive back again a few days later. fit the bumper. the wife wasn’t there. the husband says she’s away shopping she’ll ring you later about what she owes you. i said ok. now bare in mind i was out the price of the paint, primer, lacquer etc. probably £60 roughly.. i never heard a word from any off them again wouldn’t answer my txt msg or phone calls. i was shafted big time. you dead right rob don’t do anything for family & friends.. all the best for the season ahead.
I’m a bit late to this one! 🤣 But totally agree. For some reason there’s an expectation that manual workers like us, or lower paid workers, are fair game to haggle down, to ask for favours or the old chestnut, ‘while you’re here, can you just…’. But at least the conversation isn’t quite as awkward when you don’t know them. It’s the same with tips. Taxi drivers and waiters seem to be the accepted receivers of tips. Gardeners on the other hand - not so much. I can’t think of any other reason than historical precedent. You can’t really say a taxi driver has put more effort into a particular job! But yeah, I also avoid working for people I know for the same reasons as you do. Great story.
Totally agree. You know what you are worth and people just prey on your good nature. I personally would have emptied the waste bags back on his property!
I have had exactly the same. Ask yourself what sort of person would prey on your good nature??? How must that person think to do that. It infuriates me !! Thank god we do not think that way 🙏
A friend of mine wanted some work done and as we are both tradesmen, i suggested that i will give him 4 days for his job, leaving him owing me 4 days. He disagreed. Because he considered his trade to be above mine, he said he would owe me a day and a half. He actually said that and i felt embarrassed for him.
Oh yes rented my house cheap to a friend paid every month as agreed till he moved out no problems it can work. Next a family of long term friends moved in charged them a cheap rent as I thought I could trust them everything went sort of OK for 18 months, then didn't pay the rent. So I was going to get them out till their friends beg me to let them stay and they paid what was owning in arrears, stupid I did so. Over the next 3 months I got £200 in rent and paid £6000 to put the house right after they moved out. And to top it off I was the bad guy from my so called friends. Fingers burnt big time.
Remember once I did a job for a young couple, friends of friends. I said it would be about £400. I broke a bone in my foot falling off a ladder on the job. Went back the next day and finished the job with a moon boot on in agony. I invoiced them £450. They made such a fuss about the 'extra' £50, I just walked (hobbled) away. Told them not to ever phone me again. I was raging. I actually know tradesman who ask for a reference from prospective clients before they'll work for them. In my experience it's cowboy clients not cowboy tradesman.
Been s/e gardener and grounds maintaining since 2001, I can relate 🙄 I reduced a beech hedge for my brother who lives in a national trust house and it's hedges had to be kept immaculate. Trimmed it on the Saturday thinking it was job done but the parish councillor said it was not low enough, and my brother asked me to lower the hedge by another two foot........ I did the following day (a Sunday) with loppers and chainsaw, it was another full days work. Thinking I was going to paid a mates rate to cover fuel, wear and tear and a few beer tokens, I was offered a family barbeque............ Never again 😕
My father asked me to help him lay some slabs for a path at a church , my father wasn’t getting paid and was being asked by his then daughter in law. The path was about 40 metres long and the auld slabs had to be lifted and new ones put down. We spent all day Saturday on a day that rained non stop for about 10 hours to get it finished for the Sunday. My father got a lovely letter from the minister for all his help and to thank his helpers, i went a bit crazy and said just a helper , never felt so under appreciate. And not one tea or coffee or biscuit .
I don’t know how I stumbled across this, but here’s a few words of wisdom. As a bathroom and kitchen fitter I wouldn’t even change a tap for someone without looking at it first. Sure if it’s a small job and you want to help someone out that’s great but never be a busy fool.. your price is your price, you are not a charity’s and if they can’t afford you they will have to look elsewhere. Never loose sleep about how much you charge. The cheaper guy might not want to live the same lifestyle as you. The amount of times I hear so and so will do the job for this is unbelievable. I always say well if he is so cheap and can do you a good job why have you asked me to quote on it.
It’s funny I have a very similar story to yours. I’m not a tradesman but like cutting my lawn. I got a new next door neighbour asked me if I could do his as he worked off shore. He said he would pay me. So one Sunday I cut my lawn then carried my lawnmower over to his got my big extension lead out to reach his house using my electric. Took me over three hours to do his front lawn and the two back ones. There in a big slope too. Thought to myself when he says how much what should I say. I had a good think and though it’s worth A minimum of £30 iv missed half a day seeing my daughter and used my electric to cut it. If he gives me more it’s a bonus. He came round my house when he returned from work with 4 cans of Stella. Unlike you I just smiled and said thanks. Raging inside.
Good video Rob. I did several visits to a particular Customer, just small maintenance work. They did pay and gave me lots of LAUDETS. However I believe that because they knew me things became to familiar if you get my meaning? I did another visit earlier this year and charged them £120: for the work carried out, ie; hand weeded all the stoned areas, trimmed up some small Ornamental Conifers and redifined all the edges of the Lawn. I was due to go back and do some more work. I made contact with them and when speaking with the Wife she said that they thought it was a BIT DEAR 😡. She said her husband said that I charged them £30: an hour as I was there 4hrs, I said I was there 5hrs plus.I came off the phone and I said I don't want to ever work for these people again!!! The Moral of it all, FAMILIARITY BREEDS CONTEMPT. Regards Jim from J.S.G.S N.IRELAND.
Great comment Jim, thanks. It appears that we all go through the same issues. Your so right, don’t get to close to customers, we run a business not a charity. All the best. 👍🏻
I can relate to this. I work in the pest control business i started doing favours for certain neighbours and treating their problems. This was the worst days work i ever did .....I had people at my front door at all hours asking for work to be done then never having the cash on them to pay. The final straw was when I was going on holiday and loading my luggage and kids into the car , when a very shirty woman came over and started demanding that i treat her next-door neighbour's rat problem. ...NOW... I had never met this woman and told her to phone a local company as I was going on holiday. She then stormed off saying she would not be recommending me for future works !! Needless to say, I have moved to a new house and do not do any local work . My personal life is now my own.
I've been a bricky all my life, now near retirement, and I learnt the hard way many years ago. I was out of work at the time, I'm probably going back to the late seventies, and money was tight. My mother said that some family friends wanted a garden wall built at the front of their house and would I do it. Of course I would, a job for a couple I'd known for years, nice and local, all pound notes, what could possible go wrong? Being young, eager and bloody daft, I dived right in. Three days later, and being too bashful to mention money, I finish the wall. Still no mention of money from me and certainly no mention from them. The male half of the couple was giving me a lift back home and I thought that when we get back to my house, well then he'll put his hand in his pocket. No fear of that, just a "...thanks a lot " and that was that. Didn't even get offered a slab of 'Fosters'. I got out of the vehicle and walked into the house, mad at them, mad at myself and if I'd have had a cat I'd have kicked him where the sun will never shine. Told the "Old Lady' to never ask on behalf of friends of hers again and I've always tied to stick to it. Simply not worth the aggro and advice to any youngsters starting off ? DO NOT DO FAVOURS !
And loading out, knocking up and laying bricks is one of THE hardest types of graft you can do. I learned the hard way too, did a days work for a relative while unbeknown to me her husband was making silly videos of me. I didn't find it funny...years later I helped him out on a job and spent WEEKS chasing my money. Never again.
Hope you kept the Fosters. Reminds me of a Hedge cut I took on a few years back it was 40 metres long by 3 meters high , I stupidly looked at it one winters evening after dark. The following week I turned up with my tools then my heart sunk to the lowest level ever and my jaw clunked on the toe of my boots, their before me stood this menacing PYRACANTHA with thorns the size of spears 😱😱😭😭😭 I returned home that evening looking like a pin cushion that had fought the battle of all battles . Never quote for a job after dark.
Sage advice. My late dad always said to me you are far too accommodating. Over the years this has led me to being a taxi service money lender and the worlds best shopper...quoted to me prior to being given a shopping list. Family and friends!!
Rob not all friends and family/ neighbours are like that. My mate two doors down has his own little one man gardening business and I get him to help me when I need a hand, I always pay him straight away. Rob but I do know where you are coming from--those tight wads are all over the place, they do not see the effort etc that goes into not only getting a business started but paying your own bills. From what you have said on here you have learnt a valuable lesson, good luck to you they won't catch you again.
I’ve been a Gardner self employed 27 years this year and my 2 golden rules 1 never work for family and friends/// 2 learn to say no...the latter being hardest of the two especially when you start out 👍
This has only worked out to my benefit once in 4 decades gardening. Quite recently a pal wanted 'advice' on a new lawn, which I gave, he did all the work and I agreed to put down the turf. He did a good job prepping, just a fine tune with the rake and we were away, he bought every turf to me from the front to the back of the property. Went and did first cut for him and he paid me well over the odds considering he did all the hard graft - I felt sooo guilty !! Weird but you kind of expect to take a hit on that kind of job. Nice change though !
Good but sad story Rob its amazing how some chancers sleep at night, great for you to put in a video for people, I've come unstuck by not viewing jobs and under charged, i look at all jobs now. Years ago one of my first customers (big garden tidy) told me she didn't see why she had to pay for me to rake up and bag the waste only for the trimming time ! so wanted to deduct money. We had a debate she did pay but couldn't understand why i didn't go back lol.
I know the feeling. Down the years I did a few jobs for friends of friends, and some of them didn’t go well. The worst was working all day to tidy a front & back garden. It was a difficult job and I also had to get rid of a ton of rubbish. The customer wasn’t happy and never paid me a penny, despite all I’d done. On top of that, I had to pay my friend £80 for helping me, and another £20 for the tip.
I think I'm lucky with a close inlaw that I work for, they listen to what I say and are pleased with what gets done. But going forward I wont be taking on any other friends or family as you say. It's not worth the awkwardness.
That's a bad experience indeed. I've had my fair share of crappy experiences. You lose time and money. And also spend days feeling upset about it. The Only positive is it's a learning experience. Be careful not to let it happen again. Cheers from Australia.
Now funny enough, my next door overheard me saying that I'm getting a new chainsaw and the first thing they asked was,,,, Oh Dave when you get your chainsaw, would you mind trimming my trees as i had a quote from a tree person and he quoted me £855.00 but I'm not paying that. lol you know what my answer will be then nooooo I'm sorry lol
The world is full of tight arses,who don't want to pay you,but are more than happy for you to give up your soul for them,my ex boss is a prime example!Best wishes from down south!🙄👍
Never a true word said👍done loads a favours for friends and family, just feel like I’ve been mugged off. If I ever have a mate do work for me, I pay em well and £10- £20 tip for a beer!
You’re quite right, I’m a black hack driver in Glasgow and a long time ago I learned not to pick up friends and family, was being mucked about so many times on a busy Friday or Saturday night. Only done it a few times but in the end I was losing money and time running about after them. It’s not worth the hassle…
As a tiler and guitar teacher I hear you , I ve been a fool far too often in this regard, hating myself for being a mug , great channel you have here , interesting talks and content
Great video, I think you either do it for nothing, if it is a very small job, if you know they can't afford it, in the the hope they give you a small payment/token gift or will hopefully recommend you to someone who is willing to pay you on your terms. Or let them know you are in business and need to earn a reasonable rate to cover overheads and your valuable time from the very beginning. Doing a job, then talking money, is the wrong way around IMHO. If they want the job done cheaper, they could offer to help to reduce your time and therefore costs. Unfortunately some people just don't think any further than themselves and if they are friends and they treat you like that, well they probably not what I would call good friends. Yes, I can see why you did it, I think we have all be caught out like that, but a lesson learnt the hard way, but now well remembered with new rules 👍
Good vid mate,you have to ask why friends and family want you to do their work. They’ll say because they won’t trust anyone else but they’re really after a cheap price 100%. Did a job for someone close who was on at me for ages to lay some paving and can well afford to pay the going rate, I’d reckon if it was anyone else it would have been £2k plus for labour. When they asked I said it’s ok,thinking they’d pay me £500 or something and I’d have been happy with that as I just wanted to get the job out of the way.After all the wows and plaudits I’ve received the grand total of zero. So your bang on with what your saying👍
I always hated friends and family getting me to do jobs for them . its the mate Rate they are looking for . and once you have done the job cheaper for them to help them out . no sooner have you finished and they are parading a new car or a foreign Holiday. and they wearing you like a badge telling everyone how cheap they got the job done
When I was a child my dad had a friend who came over on a Thursday evening, in the 1960s. They went for a beer. Dad's friend Jim asked dad if he could get 4 Morris wheel discs re chromed. Dad had them done and paid for them, 1pound for the four. When Jim took them home on that Thursday evening he said. I will pay you next week. He was never seen again. Friendship lost for 1pound.
Just found your channel tonight. Was only going to watch one video and two hours on I’m still here. Love your honest stories. Your a funny man. Good luck with everything.
Excellent advice! I've been involved in the 'you do a job for me and I'll do a job for you!' scenario before and it never works out amicable and can spoil a good friendship in the long run. Thanks for the video and good luck with your business 👍
Yes rob been there done that I’m a self employed decorator what I hate is Neigbhours asking me to do work for them. too close to home. They have no idea what the rates are when you tell them it’s £180-£200 a day there gob smacked But we’re all living in the same street they know what it costs to live why am l different? we have a trade or skill but they think that we are getting the same pay as them who are working in a coffee shop on paye! We’re Self employed van to run, fuel, materials, accountant to pay, 20% tax, stamp, insure a van, maintain it. They’ve no idea! Sorry for the rant I’ve had a couple tonight By the way great content! 😀
I just came across your Chanel . I'm a gardener up in Glasgow . Years ago I was £15 a hour . A customer messaged me to do her garden a few years after I'd charged £15 ... She didn't ask for a price . I did her overgrown grass ( 2 bins worth standing on the bins ) 4 ft off the bk conifer hedge , trimmed the front conifer hedge . 5 hours work + I took waste away in my truck , I said £110 ( to cheap ) She was on the phone saying that's to expensive ... She said she could go to £45 ! & If I sent my details she would transfer it ... I was so angry I said I tell you what since your not happy with the money call it free . People say I'm good & fair , I'll never forget & she lost a good gardener .
@@maxwellsgrasscuttingservices I'm just heading out , I'll definitely message you again . I'm lucky enough to be kept going pretty much all year although I do look forward to becoming a bit quieter in the winter as the body gets sore & needs a rest 🙂 I hope your business is going well 🤞
Hey Rob, cheers for your insight. I've started up in Essex, and doing nicely. One of my customers is my next door neighbour, lovely elderly lady. I followed your advice, set my price early and have to say a year in we get on better now than before. So glad I saw this. Cheers for now
Good advice, Rob I'm a musician and I get asked to play, all the time, by not just friends and family but strangely by members of the public, who expect you to work for free, or cheap "because you enjoy it!" They don't grasp the fact that it's my living and although I try to make every experience in my life enjoyable, at the end of the day it's still work and there are lots of places that I'd rather be if I'm not being paid to play. As amateur musicians, they may enjoy their hobby, but to me it's work and whether I enjoy it is definitely secondary to getting paid. Most people glean some enjoyment from work, if they don't they're in the wrong job, but making work bearable or enjoyable, doesn't mean that they shouldn't get paid. Never work for friends and family is definitely one of my work rules. I don't mind being blunt with members of the public when they ask me to work for cheap, or free, but it's too easy to end a friendship or cause a family upset when you expect to be paid for work, and they expect you to do it for free, because "you like doing it"
I enjoyed that story Rob ,been there got the badge,your so right in the end you just say no sorry,I'm too busy .Some people try to take the urine,if you let them.Keep on trucking mate.
That bloke took the piss out of you, he will have known you weren't gonna do it for free, he's tried it on and it paid off, and I wouldn't have given a toss if his missus wasn't gonna be happy or not, you did the job and you wanted paying for it, but one thing for certain is, you should have left him with his rubbish. People like that make me sick, I'm a builder and I've got a few horror stories, but why do these spineless bastards always involve their missus, if I give a verbal estimate, usually for small jobs, as soon as he says, I'll have a word with our lass about it, and I get that a lot, you know you're not going to hear from him again, he's not man enough to tell you to your face, so he uses his missus as an excuse, I always give a wry smile when that happens, because the guy has just laid his cards on the table without even realising it
Many friends are only friend(ly) until they need something from you... 😁 Imagine a person who you "know" - never say a word to you until... "Oh hello mate how are you. My car is making a noise can you have a look at it..." "Oh my telly stopped working I know you're handy with that sort of thing..." "Oh my missus has got a new phone can you set it up for her within the next 12 hours before we go to Spain, ideally at 4:15pm...." Grrrrr 😠😂
Or if they ask for a favour, I'll tell them I'm happy to have a look and give you an idea on price/a quote. Then there should hopefully be less surprise when the bill comes through and less confusion 👍 Lesson learnt really, onwards and upwards 🙂
Yep ...been there done that too ..Ended up doing a whole day landscaping and tip run for a family friend who said she'd pay me soon as they sold the house and got settlement. Found out 2 months later it was a rental
Getting great advice and tips think your doing a great job here seem like a man who wears his heart on your sleeve and tells it like it is, a smart man learns from his mistake a smarter man learns from an other man’s mistake 😉 so sincerely thank you because aswell as sharing your successes you also discuss some short comings which adds great value for others and fast tracks people learning curve like myself who are new to this so well done 👍👍
