Dr. John Ramsey - Ketogenic Diets and Aging 

You're so welcome!

And once again, another doctor who doesn't really understand chemistry and biology. For one, the fat that gets converted to ketones all derive from glucose. We make our own triglycerides via consumption of various types of sugars or things that convert to glucose (starch, fructose, lactose, etc.). This is the only way we get fats, we make them - dietary fats are useless, mostly either cooked, rancid, oxidized or all of the above in one meal. Second, any "doctor" who does testing on mice et al is living in the dark ages and didn't get the memo that this shows nil as to how humans metabolize - it's largely about lifespans and metabolic rates and mice and dogs etc, have vastly different lifespans and metabolic rates than humans - and the math is too exponentially all over the place and incalculable, making it impossible to translate to human health and aging.

@@oliverleslie7382 can u explain the first paragraph of ur comment to me please

@@ihavecrabs56 So so many have butchered the original studies that were called ketogenic - in the 1920's. It somehow became popular again many decades later and then co opted to be some diet plan. Originally it had all and only to do with seizure prevention - and that didn't pan out as a study - or they could never really put their finger on the correlation twixt extreme fasting and seizures. Today, like the game of telephone, early ketogenics evolved to this current idea of consuming dietary fats for optimum health, healing and weight loss. And, as I said earlier - one has zero to do with the other. Cooked fats can be all kinds of harmful, so too rancid and oxidized fats and oils. The fats that real science refers to when speaking to what happens on a molecular level in the body - is the fat we make, Triglycerides, via dietary sugars. All things are fueled by sugars - so much does not exist in the body without a ribose molecule (sugar) in the equation - not proteins, not fats, amino acids, ATP,. DNA/RNA (it's even in the names of DNA/RNA - RIBO nucleic). There is never a normal healthy time when ketones are fueling the body - ketosis is a near death dynamic and if not treated, without medical supervision, keto-acidosis can take hold, as well death.

@@ihavecrabs56 Oliver's idea is so far removed from reality it's hilarious

And once again, another doctor who doesn't really understand chemistry and biology. For one, the fat that gets converted to ketones all derive from glucose. We make our own triglycerides via consumption of various types of sugars or things that convert to glucose (starch, fructose, lactose, etc.). This is the only way we get fats, we make them - dietary fats are useless, mostly either cooked, rancid, oxidized or all of the above in one meal. Second, any "doctor" who does testing on mice et al is living in the dark ages and didn't get the memo that this shows nil as to how humans metabolize - it's largely about lifespans and metabolic rates and mice and dogs etc, have vastly different lifespans and metabolic rates than humans - and the math is too exponentially all over the place and incalculable, making it impossible to translate to human health and aging.

​@@oliverleslie7382 You've posted these assertions (without providing any evidence in support) multiple times now, why? Please post references and/or proof in support of your assertions please. To provide some criticism, may I point out they don't seem to make sense either: Can you for example explain the purported process/mechanism that allows the body to differentiate between fat liberated from adipose tissues and dietary fat in the blood? Since unless you can explain how this would work, and explain how the body would ignore a fat droplet of dietary origin and yet process a droplet sourced from adipose tissue that originated as carbohydrates, thereby providing and argument in support of this process actually happening, there's no good reason to think that your hypothesis is true. One would then still want to actually see experimental observation confirm this hypothesis as well. Moreover, I'd also like for you to explain how this relates to the existing, commonly understood process by which the body is known to process dietary fats. -- That is, the normal process for the processing of dietary fat (lipids) by the body, is that it is broken down into glycerol and smaller chain fatty acids by lipase (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lipase), a pancreatic enzyme, a process which is normally referred to as lipolysis. These compounds are then converted to triglycerides, which then travel to your muscles, liver, and fat tissues where they're again broken down into glycerol and fatty acids. Some ends up being used for energy and other biochemical processes, while the excess is, yes, stored as fat in adipose tissues. You need to show a) how this understanding is in fact incorrect and b) how your hypothesis is in fact correct. Moreover I want to point out that if your hypothesis was in fact true (that the only way we get fats is from making them from carbohydrates), then people on a VLCHF diet would in effect be starving themselves, since the calories in the dietary fat would then according to you "not count" and this fat would just, somehow, pass through the body entirely unprocessed (or something), having no caloric impact. Consequently one would expect such people to rapidly lose weight, similarly to people going on a starvation fast. However this is not what we observe in animal models or in people. On the contrary we observe quite the opposite, e.g. robust weight maintenance and energy subsystem durability (in for example long distance endurance athletes on a LCHF diet), from which one must conclude your hypothesis must therefore be seriously flawed or flat out wrong. Similarly it is in fact demonstrably possible to become fat from eating fat, if your caloric intake sufficiently exceed your body's ability to utilise the dietary fat intake. Finally regarding mice models, I'd like to quote the statistician G.E.P. Box: "All models are false... but some are useful." In science all our models are understood to not in fact be the thing being studied/modelled, so by definition they are not "true" in every possible sense. They are therefore simplifications, approximations, falsehoods, lies even, though *useful* ones. We wouldn't bother with a useless model precisely because it would be useless to do so. So I put it to you that science uses mouse models in precisely this way and that while they might be not be a perfect approximation of human physiology, we nonetheless do use them because they are in fact useful, even as it's also simultaneously recognised and understood that they are not going to be 100% accurate.

@@bytejuggler You ask for evidence as if something i said needed evidence. If you are a biochemist u already know these fundamentals i speak to. On your own you can learn that we make fats from glucose - google that for yourself. Also google rancid fats etc. Easy stuff to research - not hidden. As for testing on mice and other animals - there too that is common knowlegde - and if u think 7 percent useful is useful then i suppose so - but still, test on the species u are trying to treat, aiming to heal. Dietary fat is a generic term for something. "something". By something i mean to say we don't know what a dietary fat molecule is - each time we eat. The fat you eat is different all the time perhaps. One has to understand molecules first. Once we do, then we can understand the state of the molecule, what condition is it in - mainly, is the molecule fully intact. or, has the molecule been altered in any way shape or form. With fat and living organisms, the molecule is not intact - from live cow to your stomach. Not at all. The fat molecule in a live cow is not at all what is in your body after digestion. Once a cow dies, decay dynamics kick in and (you can google) decay dynamics begins the breakdown of all micro and macro nutrients (fats, proteins, amino acids, vitamins etc.). This is what biodegrading, decomposing, is all about. Google decay dynamics of mammals. If the slab of cow is frozen soon after slaughter, then decomposing is suspended - but once thawed, it begins again. Then, light and oxygen also impact molecules. Then, we have cooking - which also destroys molecules. Then, we have human digestion which also breaks down molecules. So, how on earth is this fat molecule from a live cow, remaining fully intact as it runs this gauntlet i just spoke to. It is not, not at all. All molecules, of any kind, must remain fully intact in order to function as they are meant to function. So, when we speak to dietary fats - those molecules are no longer true molecules but rather remnants, scraps, if u will of "something". When science speaks to fats in the body thus - it is referring to the fats we make from dietary sugars.

What is Okibetonic Secrets and how does it work? I hear lots of people lost their weight with this popular weight loss method.

And once again, another doctor who doesn't really understand chemistry and biology. For one, the fat that gets converted to ketones all derive from glucose. We make our own triglycerides via consumption of various types of sugars or things that convert to glucose (starch, fructose, lactose, etc.). This is the only way we get fats, we make them - dietary fats are useless, mostly either cooked, rancid, oxidized or all of the above in one meal. Second, any "doctor" who does testing on mice et al is living in the dark ages and didn't get the memo that this shows nil as to how humans metabolize - it's largely about lifespans and metabolic rates and mice and dogs etc, have vastly different lifespans and metabolic rates than humans - and the math is too exponentially all over the place and incalculable, making it impossible to translate to human health and aging.

There was no complexity. Just a bunch of wasted time talking in circles.

@@oliverleslie7382 "dietary fats are useless and all ketones are from glucose" so how are ppl in keteogenic diets not dying if fat consumption is useless? and how do you explain the bodys ability to use fat for energy doubling? you make no sense. most dietary fats are not oxidized if cooking oils have a high heat tolerance like animal fat. we make fats from sugars. how do you explain ppl curing type 2 diabetes and lowering blood tryglycerides and bad cholesterol from ketogenic diets?

@@1111111111202 The fat that is used for energy is first converted to glucose.... as well, the fat in our bodies - is made from dietary sugars. Yes, human adipose tissue is derived from dietary sugars. Humans make their own triglycerides. Bacon and butter do not make human adipose tissue - this for all mammals. There is no diet that is without some grams of sugar, not even a keto diet. We only need a wee bit of sugar and not even daily as true fasting has shown us. A keto diet still could drink wine, use spices, garnishes, beer, wine and liquor, ketchup, steak sauce, onions etc - everything i listed and more, are plant based or have sugars - like milk...

@@oliverleslie7382 you just contradicted yourself by saying dietary fat is useless when in fact it's used for energy hence why ppl who are on ketogentic diets don't eventually die from a starvation as there's maybe a month or so of stores of fat in their bodies. The glucogenesis you speak of that happens in the liver to make ketones is not the same as eating carbohydrates as it doesn't spike insulin as such. The benifit comes from the hormonal affect of what you eat. Carbs=high insulin which controls what happens to the carbs you eat plus it can lead to insulin resistance to which can lead to high blood sugars and fat storage. If you consume fat as your main source of energy, although ketones are made from glucose from the fat you eat, it doesn't have the same hormonal effect hence reversing type 2 diabetes and keeping your inflammation down. You seem sophisticated but you don't really know anything do you? Explain why it's working to reverse or cure illnesses? Observation is the purest form of science and you should look at the results and reverse trace what it actually does. Calling dietary fat useless and disregarding pathways of how these two forms of energy are processed is complete ignorance and lack of understanding on your end. How do you say dietary fat is useless and mostly are oxidized and unhealthy without understanding heat tolerances of these fats? Just shut the fuck up. You don't know shit. You know small parts of it like how ketones are made from glucose from the liver but have zero understand of anything in the big picture.

It’s not. You eat mostly fat

And once again, another doctor who doesn't really understand chemistry and biology. For one, the fat that gets converted to ketones all derive from glucose. We make our own triglycerides via consumption of various types of sugars or things that convert to glucose (starch, fructose, lactose, etc.). This is the only way we get fats, we make them - dietary fats are useless, mostly either cooked, rancid, oxidized or all of the above in one meal. Second, any "doctor" who does testing on mice et al is living in the dark ages and didn't get the memo that this shows nil as to how humans metabolize - it's largely about lifespans and metabolic rates and mice and dogs etc, have vastly different lifespans and metabolic rates than humans - and the math is too exponentially all over the place and incalculable, making it impossible to translate to human health and aging.

@@oliverleslie7382 How can you say diatry fat intake is useless? We digest and metabolize fat. It is beneficial to get it from a nutrient source provided it is nutrient dense. Vegan science

@@exoticspeedefy7916 Incorrect - we digest things that convert to glucose and that can then metabolize to triglycerides. Just like all mammals, all animals. Dietary fat does not at all make human adipose tissue. We make our own nutrients (real science;physics, chemistry, biology).

@@oliverleslie7382 But we often don't make enough of certain nutrients without getting it from diatry intake. Such as B12, Unlike other vegan animals, such as sheep and cows, humans produce B12 further down their digestive tract which means we can't absorb our own. k2, creatine ect. Diatry fat provides as a direct energy source, more nutrients and ammo acids and essential fatty acids. If you Are getting enough fats into the mix the body has no need to convert excess protien into glucose. Yes the body is allways going to produce some glucose true, but not enough to over power ketones if you are in ketosis. The body is verry good at adapting to specific circumstance and diet. And that's the importance. Off subject, If you know anything about how antioxidants from plants work. since all plants are exposed to oxidative agents and sunlight, plants have elaborate antioxidant mechanisms to maintain steady state. Plants also have other protective mechanisms like secondary metabolites which are main actors in antioxidant activity of plants. Phytochemicals like phenolics are proved antioxidants. But this term "Antioxidants are beneficial" can be misleading in wake of latest research suggest that antioxidants may not act as antioxidants in body. The reasons are: 1. Antioxidants at certain concentrations act as pro oxidants hence may cause oxidative damage. 2. Anti oxidant activity results vary in vitro & in vivo because different factors are responsible for antioxidant effect in vivo. 3. Metabolic products of secondary metabolites or falvonoids may not act as antioxidants. www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/diagnosis-diet/201712/the-antioxidant-myth

@@exoticspeedefy7916 The human body is genetically predisposed to make all the so called nutrients it needs - provided it is fueled (water, a carbohydrate, minerals, sunlight and oxygen). B12 is synthesized not just in the gut but elswhere through out the body - a common misunderstanding. When u speak to "dietary fat" what is the molecule state? What condition is this molecule u and others hang their hat on. The fat molecule in a live cow say, is not at all the same after the cow dies, decay dynamics break it down. If the cow is rushed, soon after death to a freezer then decay dynamics are suspened. However, thawing out the meat will once again expose the molecules rendering them altered. Further, cooking will againg alter (destroy) the molecule. And then we have human digestion which seals the deal on this once intact molecule, in the live cow, no longer being intact. So when u speak to dietary fat - tell us about the state of the molecule - that matters a whole hell of a lot. A molecule altered in any way shape or form is useless (physics and chem 101) - or not the same as it was before altered - no longer with the same functions. Dietary fat in know way shape or form - thus - is providing any kind of fuel. The fat we make, from dietary sugars can do this, bit still the fat will end up as a ribose molecule once again (ATP). We are not at all keto adapted - what we are is adapted to is eating, consuming, so much less sugar. We humans have, over the past 6000 years, consumed way more starch and fructose = and we became obese as a species. No other species exoerienced this (in the wild - pets, farm and zoo animals excluded). So when we fast - we learn, we realize, that we are just fine - on not so much sugar. Not so much sugar was how we existed for millions of years - and then we got hooked on sugar and it was a wrap. So - ketosis is not a thing. There are biochemical dynamics that require ketones - and many ketones are created first from sugars. A sugar will always be fueling each and every biochemical dynamic in all living organisims on earth. Antioxidants from plants - are created by the plant only for the plant. So too with animals that make antioxidants. We humans also make anti oxidants - and we make just the right amounts we need. If all the hype about antioxidants and ageing say were true, and we drank a bottle of pomegranite juice say, and the anti oxidants from the juice started working, started actually doing what people claim - one could be dead by the end of the day. We need oxidants - they provide a critical and vital role - this for all living organisms. To disrupt, interupt, or do away with them, this oxidation dynamic - again, we would be dead. Oxidation is one of our natural ways of refreshing the body so to speak, like when we shed skin. The body has myriad ways in which it rejuvenates our hair, skin, muscles, cells, organs, blood etc. and so much of this is do to natural oxidation.

Do you have any good fat bomb recipes?

Mary, Here is a post that explains why some patients see an increase in LDL and why it may not be a problem: blog.virtahealth.com/blood-lipid-changes-with-ketogenic-diet/

Mary DeHart Mine went from 69 to 204. And I’m sure it’s still in that range. And I’ve still got a good ratio.

Probably your LDL particles were the big fluffy one! 👍🥳😁

New theory on why LDL goes up..."

I believe our body (liver) is capable of producing glucose when we don't eat carbohydrates.

As long as you are healthy you will have a base level of insulin (which allows you to be in ketosis). What the keto diet avoids is massive spikes of insulin which takes you out of ketosis.

I never heard about conversion of ribose to ketones. And what is the source of the ribose then? Ribose not glucose

@@exoticspeedefy7916 It's basic chemistry. Our sources for saccharides comes from diet. All plants and animals will provide a carbohydrate.

@@oliverleslie7382 Use Google to find out that "ketones and keto acids are alternate fuel sources for the body that are made when glucose is in short supply. They are made in the liver from the breakdown of fats" i hope you are ashamed with your post

@@exoticspeedefy7916 what you describe is an extreme situation, also known as starvation. And starvation is not sustainable. It usually leads to death. Gluconeogenisis is not sustainable. It is the last desperate attempt to stay alive, doing whatever it can to make sugar.

@@oliverleslie7382 thank you for your kind care. Probably we need some carbohydrates. 50 g a day? Like glycogen in liver? I love to eat beef liver, BTW. So, I will think on it. May be I will eat more liver.