Dread Talons and Night Lords in Codex Chaos Space Marines- Detachment Review and Thoughts! 

Abominable intelligences must go

I think you mean the loyal acolytes of Slaanesh?

probably the alpha legion one

:'( same

@@dragonofdragons1720the Red Corsairs one isn’t too bad

same as chaos knights. I've literally never had a game where the army rule or index detachment rule is relevant, or even impacted a game

not arguing its actually good, but battleshocked enemies have lot of disadvantages in the fight phase. No combat interruptions, no defensive throttles, no obsec. IMO the weak part is -1 to the test kinda doing not much to make it happen more often.

he has a 6inch consolidate

Yeah like if I have more than one unit of raptors does it also stack again?

@@Boneprince7413 Yes it does stack but I believe that it's only applying on Raptors ability and the night lord detachment ability once

At least this will do something lol, the dark angels battle shock only a activates like maybe once in a hundred times

@@Rikksmith Sure, but "doing something" shouldn't really be the bottomline ^^

It's even worse than that I reckon. The way battleshock currently works isn't healthy. There's basically 2 extremes. Either battleshock focused rules barely do anything (which is currently the case for most places this exists) or they are downright oppressive (if they are actually supposed to do something). There's just 2 extremes ... feels bad to use vs feels bad to play against. So absolutely ... they either need to rework it or stop writing detachments/army rules that work around it (and probably rework all the ones that already do). Personally, there's some potential to decouple all these rules from actual battleshock (aka the basic battleshock rule). Maybe introduce another state that inherently does nothing, but offers various buffs/options for factions that are supposed to be "terror" focussed. That way you can vastly buff the odds of reaching that state.

if battleshock also amde oyu lose your army rule for a turn, like AM cant use orders, Tau cant spot etc but for everyone, it'd be far more of an impact.

@@ZeZwede that's one way to make it more impactful but also more frustrating (i play both of them). It's certainly a way to make it stronger. However, it doesn't change anything about its unreliability.

Imagine how chaos knights feel 😢

Yeah, I think this is underwhelming detachments, especially without any kind of conditional battleline for Raptors/Warp talons to carry the operations, and the enhancement is lack on deep strike ability to caught enemy off guard

Sorry relics are too confusing. You can only have copy paste useless bonus rules in enhancements.

You can charge units when they fall back which isn’t even that cool in 9th you had a Strat that made it so much ounhad an aura of can’t fall back which is just better. Also the claws were awesome and the warlords traits were good despite the rule not being so good. So we get better shooting while battleshocked and the index gets better shooting for taking a leadership Test other armies get better shooting for shooting, while on objectives etc… so basically other armies get better or equal rules that you can actually trigger reliably and control while night lords get a crap army rule that will only Work 1/10th of the time if that and if it’s a critical moment the opponent will just use insane bravery and it’s pretty much a fuck you strategems To battle shock rules

Yea generating extra CP actually sounds cool

Hi, Tyranids player here. Try having a whole army based on it :^)

@@colindoan4135 as a chaos knight player atleast you have other detachments thats a joke we both are in the gutter with shit rules

I mean if you run deathstalker, neurolictor and screamerkillers it has a chance of working.

@@christophermetzger8183 exactly, A CHANCE 🤣

@@bestnameever1850 lmao true, *cries in 43% win rate*.

If you work hard with the raptors you can stack it to -2, but still not very effective

There is a similar idea in the current CSM Index ; "Do X, if you have the right mark, also do Y"

It's definitely a very swingy rule, but it came up in my last game and swung hard in my favor- tanks failing battle shock meant that they would need to desperate escape, no rerolls, and two failed battle shock rolls probably won me the game, even though the unit that failed wasn't on an objective.

plaguebearers with a poxbringer have another -1 to battleshock if you're trying to find as many tools to ruin checks as possible

Night Lords: unspeakable horror and psychological warfare Unforgiven: Joke's on you, I'm into that

I'd love that or a Varial the Flayer mini with Decimus being my first choice.

@@friendlyneighbourhoodsunwheel with the emphasis on named characters recently, a Decimus or Varial would also be amazing. The Nightlords deserve a chapter master level miniature for leading their units!

It’s a simple fix- drop everyone’s leadership by 1 point. At that level, even Space Marines are only about 50:50 to pass and a -2 debuff makes it 28%, meaning battle shock is somewhat reliable and you can plan around it to an extent. Being able to have a good chance of stopping someone using stratagems and claim primary is actually a really cool ability if it is reliable.

​@@dawkinsforpopethat really messes with the armys that cant do their faction rules if battleshocked Eg: Imperial gaurd and Tau, that feels like a bit of a harsh 'fix'

@@user-hv6gi9ux6z IG and Tau should be vulnerable to battle shock though. There should be ways to mitigate it as well, but you should need to build around it. Armies being affected by battle shock is a feature, not a bug. You should need to think hard about how to counter it; for example, by screening well so units can’t get in range to apply the debuffs to begin with, stacking multiple units on an objective so at least some of them will pass the test, using characters, etc. Everyone is fine building to counter units which can casually delete IG and T’au squads in shooting or assault- why not ones which can debuff them through battle shock?

A single 30pt commissar dabs on this entire detachment lmao

@@Sha_Bingus Not really. Commisars are once per battle round and only at the start of a phase, so if they get triggered by a deep strike, they're out of luck during the shooting and melee and then your own turn. Also, it just removes the Battleshock after it happens, and happening in the first place kills your orders, so you lose Go to Ground or Fix Bayonettes, or the Ob Control one, even if you off one of your own dudes. I mean, it's really not a big deal, the truth is that when Chaos Marines get with 12" of your infantry you're already dead anyway, heheh. The biggest part that worries me, is how Night Lords can pretty much make sure you won't get to use Reinforcements, cause you're going to be shocked when you get wiped out, and if you already used your Commissar and then got re-shocked, your unit is gone. Also, you can't Commissar if you already have 2 leaders, which means that Lord Solar + Command for Vox doesn't get one. I mean, my friend plays Night Lords... let's give him this one, I think he deserves it for playing Night Lords as Night Lords for years.

Against units with worse leadership, getting charged and having to take battle shock each turn just turns who holds the objective into a crapshoot. I'm also not sure if he can pull anything out of engagement range, or if they can be targeted when battle shocked, for the detachment ability.

It is wild that they just straight up give some armies double the options of others. Like, guys. Tau and Custodes got 3 usable detachments between the 2 of them.

Could split the dual box with someone wanting mandrakes.

@@keyanklupacs6333 if I was quicker this would have been an option but it seems like everyone who wanted to part out a box (aside from eBay resellers) already did

The porn bots appear to be butts posting flattering remarks about auspex. That might be ass but at least they know what's what.