I do the exact same thing, I can spend a good hour with a cymbal to ear everything it has to offer and I often bring my other cymbals. If I can add a quick tip: Take the time you need to pick up the cymbal that fits what you seeking and try not to care about what others might think. I remember I had that fear when shopping for my first ride cymbal. I've made impulsive purchase to avoid this situation because I was so shy about my skills at the time and I cared to much about what others might think of the way I hit the cymbal and the sound that is coming out of it. This tip is not going to relate to everyone but for those who might be in the same spot as I was in, for sake of being able to express yourself and enjoying it as much as you can and your wallet, take all the time you need to pick the right one.
Charles thanks for the awesome comment and sharing your sage advice! Bringing your other cymbals is also a great idea that I do sometimes too. Forgot to mention that 🤪 Also, love your comment about not being hasty. Yes indeed, if we are going to drop hundreds of dollars on a cymbal, then it really has to be right. Keep swinging my friend 🤙
Thanks for the comment and for watching! That's great. I hope that other drummers read your comment because it drives home my point that we all have a unique cymbal sound idea. I hope you can make it to Osaka and pick it up! Keep swinging my friend 🤙
Im not a jazz drummer. I play more in rock and alternitive music bands. But I love to follow you anyway. Wounderful playing in the end of the video. Greetings from Sweden 🎼🥁🎼🥁
Thanks so much for your kind words here too! It's great to hear a little about your drumming background. Ride cymbals for your style are usually heavier and pingier to cut through the amplified instruments. Is there a particular ride cymbal you like to use in your playing situations?
I'm a K Con fan myself. My current set includes a 20" Bounce Ride, 19" Crash/Ride and 20" Flat (dark and smoky with crashability). If you can drop the cash, I consider the thinner Bounce and Renaissance rides to be the holy grail. The Bounce ride I own needed a tad bit of taming. I was using a chain for sizzle effect and then tried one of those sizzlers with rivets on a removable arm. It sounded great and reduced the little bit of wash buildup that I couldn't quite reduce with technique alone (I dislike using tape), but the contraption was a hassle so I bit the bullet and installed a 3-rivet cluster. It's perfect! Slow and medium tempos just float with this instrument and faster tempos stay controlled. I also installed a single rivet in my 19" Crash/Ride just to add a touch of sustain and to add a bit of life with brushes. I just love these instruments. I'm a firm believer in saving some money to acquire a Cadillac and not settle for a less expensive Focus. I like my cymbals to go vrooom! 😁 Great video. I agree, sometimes it's simply best to go in the store and just hit them one after another. If it's right, it will speak to you and say "pick me!!!"
Gary thanks so much for sharing your expertise and for watching! It's great to learn about your setup. It sure sounds like you've got some great cymbals. Keep swinging my friend 🤙
Just stumbled across your video. I just went cymbal hunting last week, and my process is pretty similar to yours. The only differences: 1. Before I go to the store, I check a lot of youtube videos from manufacturers and music stores to predetermine what might work well with my allready existing arsenal. 2. I ask the cats in the store if they have more in stock that is not on the display, as hand made cymbals even of the same brand and type can vary a lot. Initially I was looking for just a ride to enhance my Istanbul Mel Lewis set, but ended up buying a whole new set of MEINL Byzance (2 rides, a crash, hats and a trash). Hell, I love that 22 Foundry Reserve Ride ... better than any Keropes and K Cons I ever heard. And yes PRICE does matter, when you are on a thight budget. As for me I bought my Istanbuls 2nd hand on ebay and just was lucky that I got a huge discount on those Meinls as my local musicstore is closing down and clear out their stock. Otherwise I would not been able to get my 800$ ride cymbal. Sadly more and more smaller Shops are closing down and online retailers like sweetwater or Thomann taking over. But people seem to care more about the price and the best deal and take the risk of getting a bad sounding cymbal. I remember in the 90s, my then drumshop had the distributer come with a van full of cymbals and the owner handpicked what he wanted ... today you only take what you get.😢 Greetings from Berlin
Karsten thanks so much for sharing your expertise and for watching! You are so lucky on getting those Meinl cymbals. I'll look into the Foundry Reserve. I agree the Mom and Pop stores are going under outmatched by sales volume and price of the bigger companies. It is a shame for sure. That's why I really appreciate our local drum shops here in Japan. Keep swinging my friend 🤙
Thanks so much for the kind words and for watching! I'm glad you enjoyed the video. I threw in my playing at the end so you could also hear my cymbal set up. I hope you find the cymbals you are looking for too! If you need any help with your Jazz drumming, I hope to also see you at Jazz Drum School: jazzdrumschool.com/ Keep swinging my friend 🤙
"When you find one that you love, price is no object" made me spill my coffee!! Collector here, Von (++ sets -each w/own cymbals) Biggest problem I've found w/rides (& Sabian NOTORIOUS for it -yep, even hotsy-totsy HH/HHX/etc. lines) is non-musical RUMBLE or ROAR!
Wonderful information that I don't see in other videos. I agree completely with trying different sticks (wood tip, nylon tip, designs, weights, lengths, diameters, etc.), different brushes, mallets and even rods. I've spent countless hours of narrowing down which of these work with specific groups of cymbals. It's amazing how the same sticks will take on different personalities with different cymbals - particularly when you play the different "orchestra" parts of the cymbal. My favorite "sweet spot" is at the 7:00 o'clock position, about 3 inches in from the edge, but I still play all of the cymbal according to the sound that I want. Likewise, my different styles, weight and thickness of brushes and types of handles have a big effect on the sound. Then there is the angle of the cymbal. I also have specific stands dedicated to the different cymbals because of their profiles. When I want a quick setup, I like to have the stand's angle and height already pre-set. I do all the fine-tuning at home. I'm a low volume jazz player and I prefer the more acoustic jazz/pop/soul sound of small venues, so "less is more" is the main focus. (Hard to believe that I started out as a self-taught garage band rock drummer in the 60's.) Although I prefer listening to the cymbals in person - just like you did, by taking my own sticks and brushes to the drum shop - my favorite one of those you show in this video is the Zildjian K Constantinople. I would like to have seen some Bosphorus models as well. Thanks for a great video.
Thanks for sharing your ride cymbal expertise and for watching! You really dove into the details. You seem like the kind of drummer I'd like to listen to! Keep swinging my friend 🤙
So good Von! Believe it or not, last week I was also choosing a ride for my own drumset that I'm assembling these days. As a beginner I only could trust my inner intuition and I chose a Paiste that “resonated“ with me... I'm sure your great advice will help me a lot in the future when I choose another ride! Thanks a lot my friend 🙏
Miguel! Oh snap, I'm sorry this video was late for you my friend. 😭 Let's connect at Jazz Drum School and let me know how you're enjoying your new cymbal. Congratulations ⭐️
Ask the drum shop if they take trade-ins. Once the honeymoon is over, you may decide to switch cymbals. Thank goodness my local drum shop is good about this because I have gone back to trade in rides, crashes and hi hats. My tastes and playing style have changed over the years and I am amazed at how many cymbals I've gone through to find my perfect setup. Also, the internet videos can give nice comparisons but once you're testing these cymbals in person and side-by-side, you will be so glad you didn't buy any cymbals until after you've heard them in person. It's OK if you get a better deal from the internet, but just be sure to test them in person. I had to learn the hard way. You don't have to buy a new cymbal. An old one in good shape that has the sound you like can become your best friend. I just bought a pair of hi hats from the 80's and I'm looking at another pair from the 40's. Keep an open mind. A good drum shop will help you make good decisions. These guys like repeat customers. Besides, they can share some wonderful knowledge and history. I just wish mine had a bar, good coffee and maybe some beer on tap.
The most difficult instrument to select is a cymbal. Adding to everything you have said, (all correct), what we hear from the throne is different from what the front of the house hears. That delicious and beautiful stick definition may not make it very far forward of the kit in an acoustic setting. And then hard players get different results to quieter players when using the same cymbals and same sticks. I switched from K-Zildjians to Bosphorus Turks (very dry) to double-down on stick definition and get less wash than the Ks were building. At the same time I started playing with much less force. It is such a personal choice, but it is also pure science!
Picked up a nearly new 20' Constantinople recently and I am in love. Shop slightly used and save a a couple hundred bucks. A word to the wise: I am an older self taught (along with Von) drummer. I made some mistakes on my first kit because I did not understand that jazz drums don't require a 22' kick, or 16' floor toms. So think about what style and size drums are best for you before buying the first time. Also, spend a little on the cymbals the first time, if you don't you will be re-buying a better set in the future.
Fred thanks for sharing you thoughts here and for watching! It's great to hear your experiences. I also started with a 22" kick and now I use mostly a 16" 😂 Keep swinging my friend 🤙
Great vid!! New subber here. Im also a cymbalaholic, lol. Used Zildjian a and k / k sweets. But have recently gotten on a Meinl kick. The vintage sand ride is awesome! I scored one thats way more hammered than the others. Its dark, great stick definition. Cool stuff! Great vid!
Thanks for watching, your kind comment and admitting that you have a problem with no known cure or need for a cure 😂 I love Meinl too. I think Istanbul, Meinl and Zildjian are kind of in my ball park of taste. Share a link to a video so we can hear you swinging those beauties. Keep shopping my friend 🤙
Thanks for the comment and for watching! I'm sure you'll agree, that's why cymbal shopping is a hit or miss adventure every time! Keep swinging my friend 🤙
Great video! Some really good tips and insight. Nice to see a video of yours outside a gig or rehearsal space too. That shop looks dope! Japan is an amazing looking place - I wonder where else you could film drum-related content and also capture some of the local culture? Keep up the good work!
Clark, thanks for the kind comment and for watching! It was fun to make this video and I agree, more videos of my life drumming in Japan out and about is in order. I'll see what I can do in the future. Thanks also for the recommendation. Keep swinging my friend 🤙
Nice video choosing the cymbals but for most people price is a concern when buying cymbals When you said price is no issue that may be true for you and that’s great but not for everyone else People shop within their budget so I disagree when you said price is not a concern just buy it!!!
Thanks Dave for your comment and for watching! I guess maybe it was a bit of hyperbole and price definitely comes into play. There have several situations in my life where I have walked away from a great cymbal because of price only to regret it. In fact, if I priced it out over the number of years I would have played it, it most certainly would have been a bargain. I would say it's always better to be fiscally responsible and have the money in the bank before shopping. That makes for no stress and 100% fun. Keep swinging my friend 🤙
I do not make much money but when it comes to cymbals, I make sure to save up enough to get what I truly want. If I can’t find something in my price range, I go home with nothing but the hope that I will find something the next trip out. I learned that settling for something I had reservations over doesn’t work- I ended up never playing the thing because it’s shortcomings just got more and more irritating the longer I had it.
@@craigwilliams501 Yes that’s great! I saved up and sold some gear I had for a new Ludwig maple set You saved for your cymbals but I guess my point was when shopping for gear you need now prices are always important and sometimes you buy gear that’s within your budget even though you want something priced higher!!!
@@davepounds8924 I bet those Ludwigs sound fantastic! I bought a Gretsch Catalina Maple kit new, and while I do love them when they are tuned to their sweet spot, their tuning range is pretty darn narrow. When I am ready to upgrade to a pro kit, used Ludwig Classic Maples are at the very top of the list. I'm already a Ludwig snare junkie - I adore my 5x14 and 6.5x14 Supraphonics tuned medium high, and a buddy of mine has a 6.5x14 Black Beauty and a 6.5x14 wood Ludwig from the 50's with nickel hardware, both of which sound incredible tuned a little slacker than my Supra's. Cheers!
@@craigwilliams501 The Supraphonics sound great and I’ve heard a Catalina kit that sounds better than more expensive kits I’ve heard My first kit was a Gretch kit from China for 300 bucks but sounded good with decent heads
Great video, Von. On my last visit to Osaka, I stopped by the Mikki Gakki Drum Center and came to the realization that I couldn’t afford my drum hobby in Japan. 😂 Your Japanese language skills are excellent, by the way. Happy New Year!
Ira, thanks so much man for the kind comment and for watching! It's no joke man. With the weak Yen, cymbal prices have gone through the roof. Couldn't believe the price of that K Constantinople. I know you're a cymbal fanatic. I'd love to play some of your collection next time I'm in Hawaii. By the way, congrats on all of your pit work. If you've ever got videos of you working your magic in the pit, I'd love to watch. My Japanese is about Kindergarten level but I keep trying. Thanks always brah and keep swinging in the new year too 🤙
LOL 😂 I dunno, who is this crazy drummer running around playing gigs in Japan! Thanks for the kind words and taking the time to comment. I'm so glad you enjoyed the video. After many years of ride cymbal hunting, I thought it was time to share some things I've figured out. If you have any tips, be sure to share here too so other drummers can learn your secrets. Keep swinging my friend 🤙
Cool video! I'm a ride cymbal junkie, up to 9. Lol. My favorite have been my Sabian HHX prototype rides, 21 inch. Dark and great definition! 21 seems to be my favorite.
Wowzerz! That's awesome. I'm glad you've found your cymbal sound. Thanks for sharing your wonderful addiction with the rest of us here. Keep swinging my friend!
Thanks for the comment and for watching! When I take them into the drum room, of course, off come the tags. Just to get a taste, the tags are okay for me. However, I'm aware that may not work for everyone. Keep swinging my friend 🤙
I’m just a noob but I suspect the so-called ”best” cymbal can’t be picked in isolation because it has to blend with whatever else you have, or if it is picked in isolation because you’re starting from scratch, then additional cymbals should be chosen with it in mind. (Not sure where to start with that. Maybe a Von vid will come to the rescue!) Makes me think of when I bought a new chair. It was beautiful in the store but looked really out of place with my other furniture.
Thanks for the insightful comment and for watching! You are correct and if I'm really serious about a cymbal, I will probably bring some of my other cymbals with me. On this particular day, I just wanted to share my process for picking an individual cymbal. Maybe I should do a sequel comparing with my cymbals too? Keep swinging my friend 🤙
That Connie was definitely my favorite of the bunch. Some cymbals tend to run away in that 2k-4k range and it just makes me go 😣. That one did NOT do that. Obviously, that’s not my *only* criteria but it’s one of my earliest bottlenecks that really starts narrowing things down right from the start. Everyone has their personal taste…but that’s my first “discriminator” that shows up after general tone and characteristic have been established.
Hey Von, Season's Greetings! For me, I think that finding the perfect cymbals that melts my butter is a never ending hunt. I really do like and enjoy playing my Mel Lewis 22" Ride and a 19" Crash Ride. Like you, I also cannot find any Sabian Cymbals that I've really liked. I've had a few, and they're long gone. I've always liked Zildjian's, but it's so hit and miss listening online. Like you said Von, the best way is to play the cymbals at a Drum Shop, but that's not an easy thing finding a good selection these days. Your video is excellent, for players of all levels. Peace and Blessings in 2024 Drum Brother!
Thanks always for your kind words and great comments! Thanks for sharing your expertise here as well. Ah the Mel Lewis 22". Got to love it. I also get what you said about the selection in local drum shops. When I lived in Hawaii, that was a problem for sure. Most stores carry what is popular or what will move quickly. Alas Jazz ride cymbals don't meet either of those criteria. I do feel lucky to have a shop here in Japan that still has a lean toward Jazz drummers. Swing hard in 2024 my friend 🤙
@@jazzdrumschool First of all, how are you and your family with all the quakes, I pray for your safety. I've found that the best cymbal selections are at the well established Mom & Pop Drum Shops. The owners tend to be hands on and know their inventory and the quality of drums and accessories. I don't drive long distance hardly ever anymore, but when I do, just as I enjoy stopping at certain restaurants, I especially try to hit the Drum Shops, and I always try to buy something, even if it's sticks, brushes, t-shirt, and I always remember going to that particular shop. Some are gone now, and some have changed names and/or ownership, but most here in the mainland hold their integrity. Peace and Blessings and my prayers for all of Japan.
Thanks for the question and for watching! The cymbal felts do mute the sound more if we tighten the wing nut down. If we keep it moderately tight, not much change. Honestly, I don't really think too much about it. If your ears want to hear maximum sustain, then try it with no top felt. Make sure there's a bottom felt and a cymbal sleeve though to prevent damage and keyholing on your cymbal. Keep swinging my friend🤙
Hey Von Barron, long time no see. I just happen to stumble upon your channel. From Hawaii. Fellow Drummer. Perhaps you remember me. I was always a fan of your Samba skills. Remember a Adega Portuguesa?
If i tape my cheap Zildjian b8 crash/ride, then hit it with the thick heavy stick, then it sounds more like the 800 dollar Kcon ride one sort of.. The b20 does goes better with jazz though...Look how Nick Mason uses a lot of b8 cymbals, its jazzy rock sounding progressive..But thrn his older days his ears seemed more inclined to b20 Paiste..So i guess it depends on the music as always..
Thanks for watching and sharing your cymbal transformation process! Sounds like fun. Share a video with us. I'd love to hear how they sound, Keep swinging my friend 🤙
Thanks Victor for your kind comment and for watching! The only experience I have with Dream cymbals is when they first came out I believe in the 90's. They seemed rather fragile and had more of an earthy, china-type sound. How are they today?
Too bad they didn't have a broader collection of the Turkish handmade goodness. You need to head out to a cymbal shop in Istanbul to find the right ride...or just go over to one of the manufacturers. A hint--all of the current cymbal-smiths can be traced back to the original Istanbul factory. They all learned from Agop & Mehmet, or learned from one of their students.
Mike thanks for sharing your knowledge here! Actually, the owner of the shop went to the Istanbul factory after I made this video. I believe they have more of those cymbals now. Perhaps it's time for another trip to the store! Keep swinging my friend 🤙
Thanks for the question and for watching! I use the Vic Firth T1 General mallets: amzn.to/3RWFAt1 I've shared an affiliate link here. Thanks in advance for supporting the channel if you pick them up. I've used them for years and they always sound great on my cymbals. I hope that helps and keep swinging my friend 🤙
Thanks so much for the kind words! If you ever need any help with your Jazz drumming, I'd love to help you out at Jazz Drum School: jazzdrumschool.com/ Have a swinging great day my friend 🤙
@@jazzdrumschool Well, I walked in the store with my own pair of sticks and played for some hours ahaha glad the people working there were so patient Unfortunately I didn't consider using other sticks or brushes (which I don't use yet) But now I know :) It was very interesting to see what kind of sound you are looking for. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and experience!
Matt, it was my pleasure to share this video and I'm so glad it was helpful for you. If you ever need any help with your Jazz drumming too, I'd love to help you at Jazz Drum School: jazzdrumschool.com/ Keep swinging my friend 🤙
Yes! A Bosphorous Masters 21" flat ride. Next up for me is a Paiste 18" 2002 flat ride (my homage to Roy Haynes). Thanks for your fantastic videos, Von. Deeply appreciated. Cheers. @@jazzdrumschool
Show off! I only have 2 ride cymbals right now, each dedicated to a set of crash and hi-hats. I did have a lot more until I thinned out the herd. Still looking for more, though. It's like drugs....gotta have more!
@@boomerguy9935 If it makes you feel better, I have 3 rides because I'm fairly new to drums and I haven't really gotten into crashes yet. So, more room for rides at the moment at least... :)
Well, you've drunk the Kool-Aid. You will probably go through more cymbals than you can imagine before you finally find your happy place. It's a nice and educational trip but unfortunately, it's like paying tuition for college. I've tried many different brands, models, sub-models, weights, lathing and hammering. Thank goodness, I have a local drum shop that takes trade-ins for those cymbals I couldn't sell on craigslist. Now, just have 2 sets with one ride, one crash and one pair of hi hats. The several pairs of sticks and brushes I have make them sound like even more, according to what I need according to the size of the venue. Enjoy the ride (pun intended)!@@ruffryder13
Nice video choosing the cymbals but for most people price is a concern when buying cymbals When you said price is no issue that may be true for you and that’s great but not for everyone else People shop within their budget so I disagree when you said price is not a concern just buy it!!!
This is how it has to be if you’re gonna go for broke and get YOUR cymbal. Yes…money is an issue for many people, certainly most young people…but when the time comes and you’re searching for something as personal as a ride cymbal, that’s the time to *really* save your pesos and go for it. When I was young, I worked an entire summer and saved almost 3 grand to get my first real guitar amp. If someone as dopey as 16-year-old me can do it in the early 2000s when minimum wage was like $7 an hour, any kid can do it.
