Thank you for continuing this series. Although Mr. McSpadden certainly will always be missed, and can never be replaced, your comforting and easy going manner was a welcome relief. Great job!
@@richardjiles3654 It’s the who guy use to host this series who died in plane crash! Not a random person, you must be new here. That’s ok learn something and safe skies!
I fly this exact airplane professionally down to the same paint scheme. I am a retired airline pilot with 30,000 hours who retired at age 65 in 2015, and am currently flying the PC-12NG. My plane is one year older, but other than that, the two are identical. This airplane is a handful flying single pilot, especailly in the weather with no autopilot. I believe than a guy with just a private license flying single pilot is a very unsafe combination. My boss, who owns the Pilatus I fly, WISELY insists I have a copilot any time the plane is flown with passengers and that the copilot, like me, is a professional. My guess is the autopilot kicked off due to turbulence in IMC and this pilot did not have the airmanship skills to hand fly on instruments and suffered from spatial disorientation, which we used to call vertigo.
Well stated. Would not suprise me the autopilot was fine, the pilot was just too reliant on it and his hand flying ability in weather was just not competent. Seems like we hear frequently of people who depend on the automation too much.
It’s worth mentioning that the pilots son died in a motorcycle accident a few years ago. Also important to note that his daughter died two weeks ago. No cause of death given. They buried her the Friday before this crash. There’s a fair chance that his head simply wasn’t in the game.
Well i think there should be a faa rule fetched in thst for first six weeks after a life majoring event that uou shoulfnt fly as pilot 8r you should have another qualified pilot eith uou. Whrn I lost my mum to normal old agd not a trauma like this family had in 2014 if I'm ho est I've never recovered as I had msny mrntsl health issues that reared themselves after that do yhis family wernt in a good cognitive state to be flying themselves only cosoluyion is there all in heaven yogether
In the flight levels the Pilatus is below gear down speed (indicated). It will be interesting to know if the pilot lowered the gear once he started losing control of his ship. If you can keep the speed “in check” you have a much better chance of regaining control. Thirty plus years in the industry and I would never let my family go around the traffic pattern with a pilot of those credentials. Flying jets and turboprops in the flight levels is a serious game best left to professionals.
Richard produced a video on my daughters accident in Burley Idaho Much to learn as a pilot RIP all who lost their lives and bless their families and friends. Been an AOPA member for 25 years. Great organization. Too bad the FAA is a waste of money. They could do a lot more but are and we need that.
My deepest sympathies. I have watched the video on this channel, Blancilirio, and Pilot Debrief. Your daughter was a good pilot. She was a victim of things beyond her control. Those stacks should not be there.
Can we just talk about how terrifying it would be to be flying along... Having a few minutes of petrifying flying maneuvers and then actually witnessing your aircraft breaking up at a very high altitude! Wow! If this doesn't scare you to make sure you fly safe I don't know what will. Be safe and knowledgeable everyday, everyone!
Very good summary Thank you for continuing the series, wonder why they are only in our thoughts and not prayers as well. Prayers to the remaining family , what a rough stretch of life for them.
Thanks for your report. I was a huge fan of this group. I am anxious to hear a thorough report of the flight and ultimate crash of this aircraft. Thanks for making it easy to understand what could have happened.
There have been a few losses with pc12 when autopilot clicks off as they do in this plane with light and moderate turbulence. The north carolina loss also had a lot to do with many just dont ever hand fly the thing enough. The pusher is also there as long as you dont interrupt it. Boutique went right up to the pusher in their crash as well as the hunters did in the dakotas. The nice thing is in the higher flight levels you are already near va and gear speed both so if something goes really wrong you are setup for a level attitude recovery even with a good loss of altitude if you did infact activate the pusher. It is agressive and you will lose a couple thousand feet in recovery. The t tail is no friend to a stall whatsoever.
Thanks for the analysis, and for your work for ASF. As a small criticism, I found your looking up at your offscreen notes distracting. Might be better/less distracting to simply consult handheld notes if need be. Thanks again for your work.
Nice and concise briefing. Flight service stations calling should be a must. They have guys that are good at knowing conditions and what likely is going to appear on the route. Conditions can change and a FSS can figure movements and reported and expected conditions actual and developing.
Thank you very much for your report which will begin to help us understand and possibly answer some of the questions that people are struggling with. God bless you, Sir! 🤔😔
Mike, at 240 kts TAS, at 25,000', IAS would be about 160 (2%/1,000'), he might have been a bit faster. Va in a PC-12 is 158 kt as GW, maybe at his weight it might have been 150 kts. He probably was at or near Va. his flightaware data was showing a GS of about 240-250 kts minutes before the upset.
Structural failures are mostly caused by pilots suffering from spatial disorientation and losing control, as this pilot did. Airplanes normally do not come apart soley due to turbulence, unless it is severe. But most structural infight failures are pilot induced.
This kind of thing is happening way too often. “Hours” don’t mean a thing if you don’t have the real world experience and hand flying stick and rudder skill to accompany it. People are relying way too much on automation now and when they lose it, especially in the weather, they are crashing planes left and right. I hand flew a BE-1900 single pilot in the worst weather and terrain single pilot, no automation, never had these kinds of issues. Been flying since 2005 and I’m now on the 767/757 but besides the point, don’t expect someone to push out hours and work an autopilot and network their way into an outfit like this and then not run into problems they can’t handle. This will keep happening. The root of the problem is the cost of entry barrier and low quality of training, combined with over reliance on automation in the cockpit, is creating a new generation of ill proficient pilots.
Mike, Nice job and you are looking good, especially with the S-3 in the background. I recently spoke at the Utah Aeronautics conference and emphasized airspeed, especially Va which most pilots don't know as gross weight goes down, so does Va. And this PC-12 was well below GW. Airspeed is everything to safe flying as airplanes are hard to crash while maintaining appropriate airspeeds. And most of us fly older birds 50 or more years old, my V-tail turns 50 in November and we don't know their entire history which is why sometimes it is better to maintain a Va speed a few knots below their published numbers. That also applies to Vlo, Vfe, Vne, etc. As an aside, have you notice all the inflight brakups of PA-46 lately, three or four in the last few months?
if you look at the weather at the time, I don't think it was all that bad. My point is that PC-12 should have handled that weather like a champ. I think there is more to this than weather like most are claiming.
Thank you for your analysis. Respectfully, if you do any further analysis of the crash, you should know the proper pronunciation of the last name. It is not "nee-lon". It is pronounced "NEE-lun". I've known the family personally for over 40 years.
"Having trouble with the autopilot"? That says it all. There is way to much comouter and automation aboard todays aircraft. And the pilot's (most at least!) simply DO NOT have enough training or experience to handle even a "minor glitch" in these very complicated Electronics 🤔. If you can't IMMEDIATELY take manual control and continue the flight that way, you probably shouldn't be there in the first place. I know numerous pilots who regularly fly in IMC while being FULLY DEPENDENT on the onboard Electronics! THIS IS NEVER GOOD.
YOU DO NOT TURN OFF THE AUTOPILOT! YOU TURN OFF ALTITUDE HOLD. THE REMAINING FUNCTIONS OF THE AUTOPILOT WILL HELP YOU MAINTAIN ROLL. IF THE AUTOPILOT TURNS OFF…TURN IT BACK ON! KEEP TURNING IT ON AS NECESSAY BUT REMEMBER, ALTITUDE HOLD OFF.
It will be important to know the pilot's total flight time, time in type, time in the last 90 days, has he attended the Pilatus simulator training, has he attended annual recurrent simulator training for the aircraft, has he had any other accidents, incidents, or violations. We'll have to wait for the final report for that information. Did he have a current medical. Any medical problems?
He and his wife lost their daughter (only surviving child) about ten days before the crash. I would tend to think that would affect a pilot's concentration.
How is it low time military pilots can safely fly single pilot, supersonic fighters without issue, and civilian trained low time pilots are killing themselves and their families in single engine turboprops? Answer…. Inadequate civilian training!!! 0:10
Everyone on the flight was either related or knew each other. They were on their way to Alaska to Join Bill and Gloria Gaither for a cruise. The pilot and his wife were friends of the Nelons.
I’m a corporate pilot with about 12,000 hrs total time of which about 5,500 are in Pilatus aircraft. About 4,000 in the PC12 and about 1,500 in the PC24. There is no finer turboprop or single pilot jet. This is simply a case of a pilot not being prepared or proficient. He was unable to hand fly the aircraft and relied heavily on the automation of the PC12 and his lack of skill cost all onboard dearly. One last observation is I highly doubt this was a Part 91 flight! Even if the aircraft was leased the pilot should have been at a minimum a Commercial Pilot, not a Private Pilot. More like a 134.5 operation….
Like how you didn't pull any punches. I'm never flying GA. And not setting foot inside a Boeing. Either be a real pilot, or don't fly. There should be some ego-evaluation for pilots.
Chris A, I’m sure you’re right. Question for you, by percentage, how many commercial pilots do you believe are capable of taking over from the A/P during IMC if it were to kick out? Many go to A/P soon after take off. Thanks.
I absolutely agree with you & I’m only a 76 year old, 2000 hour VFR wonder? A whole series of bad decisions coupled with not being truly qualified or proficient. Best / R👍🏻
I was driving through Southern Wyoming right around the time of this crash and encountered some seriously intense thunderstorms. Traffic was slowed to 45mph with some cars electing to pull over.
They are not the first. My close friend had a similar event in 2004 with two others aboard. In their case it was at night. Flying a Beech Bonanza they spoke with an FAA controller just 7 minutes before disappearing on radar. He too was an instrument rated pilot on a filed flight plan. He apparently lost control of the airplane in moderate weather, went into a spin and the airplane exploded on impact. A fourth declined the week-end hunting trip on Friday morning citing his own safely concerns. My friend, the pilot replied to him, "your missing a hunting trip of a lifetime". They had gone pheasant hunting in Winner S.D. and were returning home on a Sunday night.
Good preliminary review of this tragic accident. It certainly sounds like weather and poor pilot proficiency. Sidenote: I think we've met before during my 27 years as a NASAO member. Keep up the good work with these ASI reports!
I have a question as someone who knows nothing about aviation but does enjoy and appreciate the wisdom offered by pilots in these forums. I’ve read about several calamities happening - including this one and the Kobe Bryant accident - where a primary cause was a pilot being unprepared to take over flying on just instruments. Often in the same paragraph we learn that the pilot was “instrument rated.” Is this a term that doesn’t mean what it implies? Is it that these scenarios don’t present themselves often enough for most pilots to really be comfortable taking over on instruments? Is there a way for a pilot to stay sharp flying on instruments without intentionally placing his or her self in dangerous situations just to get the practice? Thanks all 🙏
An instrument rating is required to fly an aircraft in instrument condition or where an instrument flight plan is required. The certificate is issued when a pilot completes a check ride with the FAA. However, a pilot's certificates do not expire so once a pilot receives a rating or certificate they will retain it until it is suspended, surrendered, or revoked. The FAA recognizes that pilots need regular training at fixed intervals to maintain what is called currency. Being current allows a pilot to exercise the privileges of said rating/certificate. In our case an instrument pilot must practice instrument flying every six month to remain current. A pilots failure to meet this requirement prohibits them from flying in instrument conditions. Here is where you can have an accident involving a pilot with an instrument rating, but not being current who should not be operating in the conditions. There are a number of other factors in play in any accident but this is one such reason.
Never fly with a pilot who is not proficient with his aircraft in both recency and familiarity in every technical aspect of his aircraft, especially in Instrument Met conditions, and is probably distracted by family issues. Private pilots who fly sophisticated aircraft occasionally are a no no.
While your advice is appropriate, you leave out the critical part how you go about determining a pilot’s proficiency and familiarity with the aircraft. As a retired professional pilot, I don’t know how to assess that without being in the cockpit and watching a pilot in action. How is the general public supposed to gauge that?
@@speedlever Fair question. Obviously I don't know the circumstances behind this tragedy but it does seem that the pilot was a high profile guy in his career and therefore in church community, it was known he was dealing with family sorrow, and that even tho able to own a very expensive aircraft, had not been flying much of late. I qualified as PPL and completed all commercial exams to be better aware and even taught aviation in ground school - realised that a partly experienced wealthy pilot is to be avoided at all costs, no matter how attractive the offer is.
@@MrKylehornsey See? So at least you have a basis to make that assessment. Joe public out here assumes Joe pilot is safe to fly with and has no way to assess the pilot’s competence. Not fussing at you, but I’m genuinely perplexed how the uninformed public is supposed to properly assess the situation when invited to fly with Joe pilot in his airplane. 🤷
@@speedlever That is precisely why I posted my comment in the first place - not to be a smarty pants. Us pilots have a duty of care to warn the general public unaware of the real dangers. In this case the warning signs would have been known in the community.
@@speedleverA consumer protection website or app for commercial operations and pilots might be helpful. Much more serious regulations would probably be helpful.
Well, now that we have a tail number... It's registered to a Haynie Enterprises.. Isn't that the pilots last name? Looking at the flight history for N357HE, that plane stayed on the move pretty good. I always ask, Who is paying the bills?
God damn your analysis and retrospectives are so well produced. I won’t ever get my wings due to a medical grounding but these videos and this channel definitely deserve high praise!
I don't see any mention of instrument currency. 6 hours and 6 aproaches in the preceeding 6 months minimum or an instrument competency check by a CFIA&I in the pilots logbook. This was no legal air taxi flight either. Unfortunatly an elderly pilot flew a flight he was not legal to undertake. He counted on an autopilot that failed and he couldn't handle it. I have flown into a line of thunderstorms in a C-172. I was very proficient and a CFIA&I too. We made a 180 and flew out. Not before the storm set off my ELT. It was rough air!! Now I'm retired and only fly with an instructor.
Complete conjecture on the legality part. Zero evidence to say that the passengers paid for this flight, and if not, that could allow this to be a Pt 91 flight. This also could very well be an example of the Private Pilot privilege to fly for a company whose business is incidental to that flight (61.113B), not flying pax or cargo for hire. The pilot was the CEO of the company that owned the airplane after all. We just don't know yet, so to start casting doubt on what very well could be a legal flight is very inflammatory. Also, there wasn't any mention of currency, because there hasn't been an investigation yet. For all you know, he could be plenty current! Hell, we don't even know for sure if they were in IMC! So please, can we just wait to have investigators looking at facts before throwing out scathing remarks like "Unfortunately an elderly pilot flew a flight he was not legal to undertake. He counted on an autopilot that failed and he couldn't handle it." Those two sentences are pure conjecture that lay the blame squarely on the shoulders of someone without any facts or investigation. How would you feel if you were his family member reading those comments? Additionally, how would it feel if a few months from now an investigation discovers that due to a maintenance error, the elevator fell off in level flight, leading to an unrecoverable loss of control that was in no way the fault of the pilot? Please, the internet just doesn't need RU-vid comment section accident investigators.
@@mitchellh5869 this was not an "only incidental trip." The pilot was specifically there to fly these folks to their destination, i.e., his "business" that day was transporting people from point A to point B. They even identified him on cameral as "our pilot." Pretty damming evidence.
I don’t understand why anyone would get into these super singles without a properly trained pilot who doesn’t need an autopilot to control the plane. An old college professor once told us , “ they ran out of airspeed, altitude, and ideas at the same time”
@@AlbertHess-xy7ky I was referring to the plane breaking up before it hit the ground. So technically he did not have a functioning aircraft before he ran out of altitude.
