ELECTRIC vs PETROL CAR - which is REALLY cheaper?? | What Car? 

no, I am still hoping synthetic fuels, come to the rescue.

Nope...

Yes if I was a driver

Absolutely. Partly because the ban on petrol and diesel is coming, partly because of the environmental benefits. Yes, I know, they're far from perfect. But they will be better for the planet.

Yes yes yes

I don't think that entirely true. The majority of people that can afford an EV are not hurting for money. Most EV's are not cheap to get into (at least in the US). If you're buying new, you probably have plenty to spend. I can't count the number of Tesla's on the roads in my neck of the woods, but it's rare to see cheaper one like the Leaf or Bolt. These are the same income brackets that buy BMW, Audi, Mercedes..etc. Cars that either famously unreliable and/or expensive to repair. I cannot count the number of customers I see on a monthly basis that pay obscene prices to maintain and repair cars from these brands (all considered luxury stateside), and they act like it's no big deal. If you're getting into an EV right now chances are cost of ownership is not your main concern. You're either attempting to be environmentally savvy or you WANT something new (not need) and you can afford to spend 5 or 6 figures to make that happen. I say all of this as a 2022 Bolt EV owner.

@@divid3dbyZero You may be right. Some people have sufficient resources to satisfy their whims without any thought. Some people do not the funds to meet their essential needs. Others are resource constrained and desire to make rational choices. Within the framework of rational choices, at least in Europe, comparative energy/fuel costs is not the major component of vehicle ownership but depreciation is. So I refute your allegation of untruth.

... and the cost would include a full ecological footprint analysis.

If people actually realised how much their cars cost, I think there would be less car ownership!

in short: it's a much higher starting investment with much lower running costs. it's great if you can afford to shell out the money to buy the car, but most people can't. w a petrol car, it's more money in the long run but more spread out. what needs to happen is EVs need to become significantly cheaper, so that the avg. person can have one.

Think about your comment… if you want services costs over the years, then you probably want fuel costs as well over the years too, at that point that’s a different video about the long term costs of ev vs ice. So tell me why would they include long term service costs in a video about a single motorway journey? What you’re asking to be included should not be in this video at all, maybe in a separate video including all costs over the long term.

Battery replacement would have to be included too.

@@rayquirk4947 no it wouldn’t. Apart from manufacturing faults there will be no reason to change them, they will last the life of the car now.

@@luckyrobp says who? More like battery life dictates the life of the car

@@luckyrobp there are 100s of thousands of 12+ year old cars on the road that are cheap to buy (under 6k), cheap to run (40+mpg), cheap to insure, are reliable, and if serviced will last another 8 years. The cost to the environment is only the fuel burned, the oil used, and a couple of sets of tyres, so is perfect if you care about how your kids will survive in the future. You could also run your car for 3 years, resell it, and be less than £5k out of pocket.

And the cost of your EV?

You could have bought 2 oil cars with at money, or the purchasing difference could maintain the oil car to run to the ground.

@@BaeLasso Sorry but EV's are now at same price as ICE cars with the MG4 selling for about £25k and the sports model at £35k with better performance than a much more expensive VW Golf Gti at £45k

@@stevehayward1854 In Australia, EVs are much more expensive than equivalent oil cars.... about 1.5 to 2 times more expensive...

@@BaeLasso I suspect thats either purchasers willing to pay more or your governments fault with import duties. I know they are very much in favour of coal and anti renewables, despite that, renewables are taking over, including grid batteries. 3 years ago EV were dearer in the UK but it seems the prices are coming down reasonably fast

Bear in mind that most petrol stations charge around £1.35 a litre of fuel on average. I have a diesel car and my diesel car at 60mpg which is my overall average just about breaks even per mile with an electric car, and an electric car costs so much more and i would never get 600+ miles on a charge in an electric car. The tech isn’t there yet in my opinion to make me switch, however I have driven a few electric cars and can see the appeal.

@@jayveevee Not sure how you get the break even point of fuel cost. I pay 7.5p/kWh to charge my car and works out at 1.9pence per mile. I typically use a public charger for the return journey home maybe once every 6 months. Servicing costs are also far cheaper. Brake pads typically last 50-100k miles depending on car and driving style. No oil changes. No DPF to worry about, and over 1000 fewer parts in general. I'm still recommend some people don't switch when I know it's not worth it in their situation. But if you look and the price of EVs now, they are getting very close to equivalent ICE cars.

@@Dr-EV can you name one single ev that isn’t £10k dearer than it’s ice equivalent?

@@TheComputec not at the moment, but this is currently the reason why certain people buy EV's, because they intend on doing the milage that makes running cost much cheaper, and because they are far nicer to drive. But don't forget, mobile phones started off as huge bricks, massive in comparison to a home phone, yet they eventually evolved. Guess what's happening with batteries in the next 2 years and the years following on, massive gains in capacity, charging speed, more abundant materials, longevity and best of all, lower manufacturing costs. And they benefit you are already seeing from this big shift to EV's, is the battery technology in mobiles, laptops etc.... Have mainly driven forwards much faster due to existing EV demand. So I fully agree, don't move onto EV yet if it doesn't suit your needs, it may never provide the convenience you are looking for your self, but in just a few years, there will be very few reasons for people to reject the newer, cheaper, better models. Look up the cost of MG4 X-Power price and find another hot hatch that can do 0-60 in 3.9 seconds for that price.... Lol.

go to 12:00 , they mention, but they compare the motorway usage. not home or city usage. so they have to use the fastest charging to get better comparing.

Not even that point is valid. If you're using public chargers all the time you're going to have charging subscription with lower prices. I think you're giving the morons that made this video way too much credit.

@@MattCasters Exactly. Using the Ionity Passport plan would mean the i4 would cost £29.29 charge vs £52.09 for the petrol car, completely destroying the narrative of this video. Something stinks, and I'm not just talking about the poor fashion choices of the drivers....

I'll stick to dinosaur juice

@@enfield7123 Because you ARE a dinosaur...

So you saying you can take 84 kw off thr grid for £6.30 ? .. what tariff are you on ? . We have to pay 38p / kw ( SHELL ) , so that would be at least 32 quid , whats going on ?

My monthly expense for BMW 116D was £64 ish. It's now £5.22 for Hyundai Kona Electric. They really convinced me to go back to fossil fuels.

give it 18months your battery will be soing half that 🤣🤣🤣

I have an EV. Understanding how to maximise efficiency is good, but I find that very unenjoyable. I want to enjoy driving the car and enjoying it does not mean coasting whenever possible, accelerating super gently, turning off aircon whenever possible 🤷🏻‍♂️

@@bbcdentist I have a KIA EV6. I don't bother with efficiency at all. Sport mode all the time and ragging it a fair bit and still get 3.5m/kWh

I think you have missed the point of the video, it was to highlight what its like if not charging from home and using expensive motorway services.

You clearly do not have greedy Tory government. British road users are taxed to over £120 billion pounds each year and our roads are worse than aweful because they only spend £6 billion on road maintenance and new roads in total. We have old Eatonian gangsters for mp's

This is an utterly pointless video. The most expensive public fast charger costs everyone knows can be up to 80p / kw/h. Home charging, which 85% of all charging is, can be as little as 15p, even standard daytime charging is under half that cost. Similarly fast 22kw public charging is well under half that price at around 30p So, go ultra fast public and you're 5 x the low home charging cost, who knew? UK isn't that big a place and the average daily mileage is around 30 miles so maybe a once weekly home charge at 4p per mile. My daughter commutes 90 miles a day on electric which is quarter the cost of her previous ICE fuel cost, over £2000/ year cheaper.

So with this RUC thingie EVs aren't worth it as they cost basically the same and are much more expensive to buy.

@@ulfw What are you talking about, there are indeed many evs now with purchase cost parity with comparable ICS cars, having said that there are also many which are ridiculously expensive, but many of those will disapppear. Running fuel cost depending on where you are and electricity cost and whether you charge at home/work or at commercial chargers, fuel cost can be a fraction of ICE fuel cost. e.g. UK low tariff home charge cost is around 1/7th the comparable ICE fuel cost, but the most expensive commercial charge points can actually cost more than ICE fuel. Example - average miles per year for a UK car is 8,000 and charging on low tariffs at home for a comparable medium size car would save £2600 - 3,000/ year.

@@iainwares6361 Where does the stat that "85% of all charging is done at home" come from? Is that historical fact or marketing spin? I would be keen to see a link

Your absolutely right Gary. I have also said this on the petrol ped youtube channel. He has just published a new video which is worth a look. This backs up the argument that, unless you have a home charger (which only half the country can have) its a big issue. It needs more motor journalists to keep highlighting the issue before we just plod on to a disaster.

That compassionate lunacy of the corporate European agenda- would reassure you that cycling is good for your health and you sell your carbon credits.

The cars have a range of 200-300 miles?! That's a once a week charge for most use cases. That's plugging it in when you do your weekly shop. This test is the worst case scenario for EVs. Continuous high speeds, more expensive fast chargers. Supermarkets already treat petrol as basically a loss leader, there's even more reason to expect that they would see ev charging in the same light. And that's before we get to other potential solutions for charging, which will crop up when everyone has an ev. Edit to add. From a social pov I'm more concerned about the less well off not being able to afford EVs and the savings that come with them, and being at the blunt end of govt attempts to force IC card off the road. Fuel prices aren't the problem, it's the upfront cost.

@@paulkeenan2691 No, it was Boris who passed the law to ban ICE cars from 2030, not the EU. Indeed there is no EU mandate as it was left to individual countries to determine their policies.

These cars have an advantage when charged at home and used only for city driving. The car future is absolutely dreadful

Exactly this. Electric cars have still got a long way to go before we can start to treat them like traditional gas cars, where we don't even need to think about ranges anymore due to the number of chargers available. Sadly I don't think this will happen anytime soon, even after the 2030 ban on new gas cars has come into effect.

Thats what you get if you buy a poor standard of EV. I have Tesla M3 and it will do 280 miles at motorway speeds, the Tesla chargers are always up and running, they always have spaces, they are also fast, I can put on 200 miles of range in 15-20 minutes.

This is why you buy a Tesla, the charging network for non Tesla is at best pathetic making the electric experience a disappointment

​@@stevehayward1854yer pay 50 grand for a tesla and two years later sell it for 15 grand 🤣🤣🤣

Agree with everything you say but also that this is mostly true of the non tesla chargers... Tesla have already got this to perfection and Ionity et al need to do some serious catching up! It will come but I get for non Tesla owners its not always a great experience.... I bought Tesla though so no isses to date but as Tesla open up to non tesla cars it will be interesting to see if it results in a poor experience for Tesla owners.

Interesting! Do you need to install a charger at home?

@@dianao.4757 Nope, just the regular 220v charger

In November we took a 1068km trip to Tasmania and back. Total charging costs were $468.20. Estimated it would have cost about $820 if we had taken our previous 2013 Golf GTI or $1200 if we had taken our two motorcycles (Niken GT & Vulcan S).

Seriously? I have a 2015 Land Rover Discovery Sport 241 hp version. Did a road trip from Hungary to Swizerland, Bern 1174km. The total trip costs me 302 Euros and some change. How much fuel does the GTI use to pay almost 900 USD for just 1068km? or more like what are your petrol prices per L over there?

@@chrishander9328 Oops, I typed the wrong numbers. The trip was actually 5469km. The 1068 was the number of kwh of electricity we used.

Exactly what plan/tarrif are you on that is 7.5p per Kw/h? Supplemental questions:- is it 100% renewable energy What happens when the majority of people get home chargers and the overnight "off-peak" rate is no longer off-peak? Whatever answers you come back with, just remember these points:- Not everyone can have a home charger, The UK doesn't currently have capacity for even 40% of people to have a home charger Your postcode has a large bearing on your energy cost Charging a large capacity battery from home on an 11Kwh charger can take 18hrs

@@TheComputec it is Octopus Go. They no longer offer that tariff, but the new Intelligent Octopus tariff is better still: they access your car (most brands) or Ohme charger (any brand car) and ensure the car is charged by the mornong. You just set what you want and by when and the cost is 7.5p/kWh. Yes, it is fully renewable and with Intelligent Octopus they of course pick the times when renewables are highest, say when a storm passes through and wind power is at a peak (and at night, the grid has plenty of spare capacity as other use is low). Not everyone a home charger: it is true, though my local council installed some Ubitricity chargers in some of the lamp posts when they replaced the old posts for LED ones. Those use less power, so there was spare power available on the grid that powers those lights. It is council dependent, so lobby your council. For those in apartments with off street parking: new builds need a certain number of chargers by law. For oder homes, either lobby your landlord or tenants association (for shared freeholds). Postcode: there is some variability, but not that much. I understand the 7.5p is available to most on the mainland. Charging a large battery: The Tesla Model Y, Kia EV6 and a range of other 300 mile+ popular EVs have a ~75 kWh battery. On the standard single phase 7.4 kW charging, that takes 10 hours. The largest batteries on UK EVs are currently 100 kWh, so around 13 hours. Besides, London to Birmingham and back is 240 miles. That would be an exceptionally long commute. In a Tesla Model Y which has 4 miles/kWh, that is 60 kWh so only 8 hours of charging. Besides, with Tesla, the cost of Supercharging is not all that high, currently around 38-43p/kWh, so can be used if you really need and much cheaper than say Instavolt. Over time, charging costs will come down for everyone, e.g subscription services are becoming available that lower the cost if you commit to a certain network.

I was going to offer to pick up your mike and hand it back to your opponent, but oh dear, he seems to have run back to mummy.@@Alex-ek5fb

What if we all get EVs and charge at night? Surely the grid will have massive demand and the prices will increase to reflect such.

But that is the BIG issue. This proves that EVs are NOT the answer! Not everyone just drives around town and not everyone can charge at home!

You sound like you’ve bought an electric car 😢

​​@@SpeedRacerVThe average car journey is 20 miles per day. Most people use cars for local driving, a long trip like this is generally very uncommon, he is absolutely right, it is not a fair test.

@@aldozilli1293 I have designed and debugged EVs for 14+ years in the US, China and Europe. EVs need Big Cities and Big Cities need EVs. But, everyone if trying to force EVs for all usage. Therefore the analysis that EVs cost more to operate and maintain is true for a large percentage of people. For me there is no place to charge an EV. I travel once or twice a month round trip 700km+. Fast DC Charging does damage the batteries, especially since all EV manufacturers are reducing cost. There are NO EVs designed today that properly maintain the cell core temperatures.

43??? My 1.7cdti Zafira design Nav does Cornwall to Edinburgh at an average of 53mpg

My M340i to the Lakes on M6 from London did 44.6 mpg so not surprised. Some M6 speed limits were 60 mph thought but .. ..

@@iangraham4510 Sorry but 53mpg from a 1.7L vs M340i with a 382hp 3.0L Inline 6 that does 43mpg is a horrible compromise. That is not impressive at all.

£200??? Is that one journey or is that there and back? I mean the mpg was impressive but the cost is still insane.

BMW 6 cylinder petrols are the perfect compromise between efficiency and power + sound I have an older 125i with the last naturally aspirated i6 and get 40-45mpg on the motorway

Meaning, what kind of moron will spend $15K or more on an EV when Gasoline is cheaper.

In the real work e 208 save so much money if you use charging in home and mostly you do city running , for 6£ you get 45m for petrol ( just an example) and you get 6£ for 200 mile for electric

@@Hamid-ml5th In the real world you've just spent £11,000 more on you electric 208 and it depreciates 30% faster than the petrol. Better get driving your break even point is around 150000 miles.

@@Hamid-ml5thin the real world a lot of people don't have access to home charging and anyone needing to travel more than 150 miles a day will have to waste time and money charging.

@@davidowen2859 anyone planning driving 150,000 miles ain't going to do it in an e208.....if they have any sense.

At least they were the same unaffordable cars! 😁

Haha yeah start the cost analysis with with expensive BMW s

Yeah. Affordable is 2k eur. Not 60k wtf

Most people don’t have the luxury of off road parking so won’t be able to benefit from cheaper more convenient charging.

same thinking here these persons are 'a little' out of the real world

loool fiat 500e is what you need

@@dingopisscreek maybe not for you and the infrastructure needs more work but petrol and diesel will soon be old fashioned

Except that you won't be charging at home at the destination will you?

@@alistairjohnson8185 nope you'd do that for the first journey. Overnight home charging for the outbound trip would have cost me £7.86 for the BMW and £5.86 for the Peugeot. So even with the expensive fast charging at the other end I'd still be saving around £35 to £40 on the whole trip.

​​​That is until the government lose their revenue from petrol and diesel then to get the revenue back your home charger will get taxed ,and think about the job loses at all petrol stations that will close .

Even now I would not recommend an EV if the user/owner/driver cannot charge at home/work. If you can, then the first 250 miles each day (ymmv) are literally 1/10th the fuel cost. So even the days you go a long way you have halved the fuel cost and for most people most journeys are less than the daily range so 1/10th cost for those. Not bad for something that is better, more reliable, less servicing and for sure more fun!

Do you suffer from range anxiety and have to visit smelly petrol stations? I charge my car like I charge my phone - overnight and never have to worry. Savings over 1000€ per year and not killing the planet = smug. Every followed a diesel car and smelt the exhaust?

​@@derekr1113 The problem I have, is that I have family and friends throughout the country that I enjoy visiting, and I enjoy driving to many of those places. I also travel for work regularly, but not far enough to fly, and I also enjoy vacations. So, I am not always home to charge overnight, and I rarely see an EV charger at the hotels I stay at, and if I am visiting someone without a charger, I would be out of luck! So, I guess if you are a homebody that never goes anywhere, charging overnight is fine! And let's not forget when California told you that you couldn't charge your EV overnight during a heat wave, because the grid wasn't capable. Finally, don feel too good about saving the planet, because many studies have showed that during the total life of an EV, it is worse than a gas car. There is a TON of minerals that must be mined for the battery, and very large, fossel fuel using equipment is used. Most of the energy used to charge your EV is generated from fossil fuels, and lets not forget the unknown about what happens to the battery once scrapped.

​@@derekr1113can you articulate your points without being condescending?

That's the big point the EVangelists conveniently forget....the cost of time charging for a self employed person or a company having to pay their drivers to be idle. Both costs are way higher than any possible savings (which really don't exist on long journeys anyway).

@@derekr1113 You sound like a right cheapskate. A 1,000 euro a year saving is nothing.... you can easily save that much by turning off all electrical items of a night before going to bed, do you do that? If you are so tight fisted and think 1,000 euros a year saving is a lot, I question how you could even afford the over-priced EV in the first place. No to mention the cost of replacing the battery, generally higher depreciation cost.. the fact that a LOT of garages won't touch EV's due to the lethal high voltage batteries on the underside.... meaning insurance costs are higher in EV's than in normal cars. You might be saving 1,000 euros per year on "fuel" but when you factor in the depreciation, possibly higher insurance and inconvenience of having to find a garage (or get ripped off at a main dealer) the actual "savings" are a lot lower. It's ironic you ask the person who uses an ICE if he worries about "range anxiety" as range anxiety is pretty much only experienced for the most part by EV drivers... this video is a good example of it. I've never put 400 miles worth of fuel in my car and then been worried I might not even be able to get 300 miles from that supposed 400 miles of estimated range - my car's estimated range on a full tank is around 420 miles, and yes it's a "smelly diesel" but it is as quick off the line as most EV's and even faster than some of them.

If we make the Total Cost of Ownership, charging at home and making more than 10.000 km/year , then BEV wins.

@@yoyyaesta4808 only 10k km a year ? I doubt it.

@@yoyyaesta4808 I guess it depends on each person needs. If I split 10k over 48 months which is usually the time I keep a car is going to give me £208 per month to use in petrol which is a lot as I only spend £120. Not saying no to electric cars but at the moment the asking price to buy one is ridiculous

If you just want a runabout/commuter, there are plenty of used Nissan Leafs for under £10k that cost pennies to run ...

No its not. Even when you drive only 10K each year EVs - even much more expensive ones - are cheaper for the full lifetime of the vehicle. Of course if all you see is the price of the vehicle itself - nobody will be able to help you. Please continue buying expensive petrol, visit the garage for maintenance, do not foget every 80-100K a new engine, AGR, DPF, intake, turbo, a few oil changes, new timing chain etc. pp...

This is a really good question and has a really complicated answer. Volvo produced an excellent report, which identified that production of an electric C40 produced about 70% more carbon than an ICE XC40, and that break even could take 9 years, depending on how your electricity is produced. I think keeping an existing car on the road seems an easy win in terms of pure carbon emissions (as opposed to buying any new car).

It will depend heavily on the how you charge. Renewable or the grid.

Superb point,my 420d easily hits 60mpg on a motorway run..it takes 5 mins to fill up and gives a total range of over 600miles..why would I swap to an ev ?

@@peterlumsdon4289 to stop people dying from strokes, COPD, lung cancer and asthma caused by the increasing air pollution from cars, maybe...? 🤔

@@peterlumsdon4289 Diesel ❤️

Seams the resale value of one year old EV's is reported to be 50% of new price.

And freeze to death 🙈

⁠@@Jestey6 Heated seat, heated steering wheel, heat pump. No need to freeze - unless stupid enough not to dress accordingly. Running a couple hundred miles around town might mean several days of motoring with top-ups taking no time at all - possibly only 7.5p /unit electricity, too. Several cold starts for the ICE, continuous air pollution for all around (ICE drivers like to forget this?). De-icing in cold weather takes little energy in an electric, but a lot of effort and steamed up windows for the ICE - unless warmed up before moving off. The overall efficiency would be streets ahead for the BEV. Of course a large, high powered ICE car is not really needed for ‘town use’ so, again, horses for courses arises. But the EV would reign supreme. All-round motoring includes both town and longer distance runs. Occasional expensive electric charging just has to be put up with. I’ve topped up just twice, at public chargers, in nearly 4 months of ownership. It would only have needed one - if person at the place where we stopped was not paranoid of BEVs bursting in flames when charging! I only top up with sufficient charge to easily get home - then replenish with cheap power at my leisure (while I am asleep). Potential fuel saving over 3700 miles could have been as much as £500+ (was actually about £400 because I’ve not yet completed changing my electricity supplier - but a little more if solar energy is taken into account. I expect that figure will decrease during the winter months, but every little helps to defray the extra up-front purchase price. Running round town, on short runs, only returned about 25mpg for our larger diesel car, so near 30p/mile? The obvious means of town-travel would be with the bus pass but that is rarely convenient for our situation. Electric is ruling fine for our household. No going back to ICE. The second car has been driven just a handful of times in the last 4 months - only used when carting roof-rack sized timber and such like.

@@oliver90ownercan you tell me if you were doing 3700 mile with electric in town , how much would cost you home charging, I am taking normal home charging with box , not solar panel or ,,,?

@@Hamid-ml5th My mix, at present, is typically mostly 30 mile round trips, then local and occasionally forays up to 200 miles away from home. 3700 miles around town (a smallish town) would likely not be much extra m/kWh for my car - it is not a ‘city car’ - but 4.5-5.5 m/kWh should be easily attainable for urban driving in a more appropriate vehicle. I expect a lot of newer, smaller vehicles coming onto the market will return 6 m/kWh or better for urban driving? Depends, of course, on type and amount of heating/cooling demanded by the driver and/or passengers, too. Simple maths to work it out. Miles per kWh and cost per unit of electric will provide that answer by the formula: 3700 miles divided by m/kWh and multiplied by the unit electricity cost (in GBP) for the chosen tariff. If that 3700 miles is an annual mileage, it is an average of little more than 10 miles per day. My average mileage, per day, is currently more than three times that. My cost, at present would likely amount to around £170 - perhaps less, so less than a third of the cost for a reasonably efficient fossil car. Lots of cold starts and short runs, in an ICE vehicle, could make its fuel consumption much worse. Now, if I choose the ‘Octopus Go’ tariff, my fuel cost would be reduced by a factor of two, so ~£85. Making the ‘energy cost’ about one sixth of that for a petrol vehicle. The ‘Octopus Intelligent’ tariff would cost less than £70 - but would, at present, incur an extra outlay approaching a thousand pounds. Both those tariffs, at present provide other benefits, of course. Running every electrical appliance at those reduced rates can provide substantial savings on the usual household electricity costs. I fully intend changing my electricity supplier in the near future, but I first need to work out the costs, for our particular annual electricity usage. The efficiency of the car will doubtless reduce during the colder part of the year.

You forget that over 40% of the population do not have offstreet parking so are at the mercy of commercial charge points. It’s ridiculous to force everyone in to EVs.

@@alanbooth7280 Well for them you have plenty of other options. Spend 8 hours at work charge there, charge at the supermarket and contact you local council to install post and lamp post chargers as they are already being used.

@@alanbooth7280 correct but the infrastructure is moving on well and in the next five years we should see much better solutions for those who do not have off street parking. There are already options in many cities for lamp post charging and this will only improve but it does need the government to step in and legislate local councils to provide multiple solutions.

@@alanbooth7280 That should be a huge clue to people w/o the ability to charge at home.

@@Ben.Royals you live on another planet clearly 😂. Every other charging option is far more expensive than running a diesel car for example. Infrastructure is simply not there yet

Yes correct. I think it is a good idea. Although, I know it can also be a devisive topic

Which shopping centre lets you charge for free?

Free now later a fortune, plus you'll be limited per your social credit score

@@illawarriorhill70 Almost all of the ones here in Sydney - makes people come there instead and spend their money 😉😉

In the US and AU electricity never needs to go up significantly. Investors love the market and build the wind & solar farms as needed. The IRA is going to place public chargers every 50 miles along major roads. EVs will rule.

@@tmayorca8770 Do you live in china? or plan on living in china?

@message me on my telegram👉👉 Official What car do it every day for the last 10 years...

you have to also add the emissions for extracting oil, refining it and transporting it to the gas station. Gas doesn't grow in the tank directly

@@mihaiconstantin-pau5116 and 65% of the electricity for charging your car is still coming from fossil fuels... and making those batteries isn't exactly a clean manufacturing process

@@TheComputec 7.5% from fossil fuels in France, and falling in France. Much cleaner than petrol, diesel, oil refining.

@@davidperry7128 Whichever way you look at it, EV's are not as green as you think. Now, you can carry on deluding yourself, but facts are facts. 90,000 miles have to be driven in an EV before it's carbon footprint begins to reduce compared to an ICE

Actually, it takes about 50k for the EV and gas car emissions to break even.@@TheComputec

83kw per hour, 57 quid so 45 mins to charge plus he waited so guessing an hour in total compared to 5 mins for petrol.. if you're waiting, likely to grab food so another 10er spent

@@manbearpig3231I make sandwiches 😂

And so it happens that a lot of people have ideas about driving an EV ... until they meet someone like us or a colleague, a friend, a family member ... to then learn all the information they got was false. In the end it makes the petrol heads like the producers of the video, look like low life scam artists really. Chances are the misinformed are going to be a bit agry at the deception and never go back to burning dino-juice.

Right? I'm in my 7th year of owning an ev and I've rapid charged less than 5 times. Total. And, my home charger tells me how much every charge costs.

So about the same.

​@@iain8837 how so?

@@notroll1279 My bad, somewhat cheaper for an EV depending on various factors.

@@iain8837 I just don't know...that's why I'm asking... EVs apparently need less mechanical stuff like brake pads etc., have less moving parts. On the other hand, they're hard on tyres that can be quite expensive and it remains to be seen how well all the suspension and steering components take the increased mass of an EV. Battery life expectation is a big unknown. Tax is none or low, insurance can be very expensive. With various unknowns in the equation, I couldn't say, really. I'm not in the market for a new car right now - I'll probably stick to my old Saab for some more time and let others find out first.

@@notroll1279 I have an EV and an ICE, Both do 5k miles a year so no problems for me with general wear and tear. Not service the EV yet so not sure if cost. No government reduction for EV here. Insurance and TAX are identical, fuel costs for EV will be 30% of ICE but with 5k miles it’s no big deal anyway. The way they drive, I take theEV every time as instant torque and ease of driving is great. That’s the main reason my wife switched. Battery has 8 year warranty, car has 5. Won’t keep it longer that 8, that’s for sure!

PHEV’s are only efficient in small journeys once the battery is empty when on a long journey the engine kicks in and you are essentially carrying dead weight which doesn’t make them any where near as efficient as claimed. You are better off with a HEV.

@@itechtalk03 yes, I completely understand that but there must still be people that do occasional long journeys in a PHEV that want to understand the long range economy figures. We don't live in an ideal world.

It focuses exclusively on the worst case scenario for EVs: Road trips using the most expensive charging network out there and even resorting to intentonally not use energy conservation methods on the road trip, even though they're available. And it totally ignores maintenance costs. How is that a good test?

@@berndborte8214 It's a good test, because comparing going slowly in an EV, worried about your range, is not a comparison to driving a petrol car at the speed limit with no range anxiety. They compared the most expensive chargers to the most expensive petrol, so that seems fair. In real life, you'd fill your car at the local station at a lower cost, just like you'd charge your EV at home, so the journey there would be cheaper for the EV. However, once you are in Leeds, you would find a supermarket for cheap petrol, but the EV driver would be stuck with a fast charger. I'd like an EV, but whilst charging costs are currently 85p Kwh, it just doesn't make sense.

For now but not in the near future......

@@gordonmurray2631 Electric vehicles are 3 to 4 times more energy efficient than combustion ones. The most energy price rises the most the EV saves you money.

You assume that 95% of the population own their own homes or live in places where they can easily charge at home and can afford these electric cars and drive like 80 year old grannies. That is just not the case

@@gbej1 I assume petrolheads are unable to own a garage or plug the car in the supermarkets wallbox. Too hard.

@@gbej1 what he said was factually accurate and for those who can’t charge at home, Tesco now offer free EV charging for all customers in many of their supermarkets

In the United States, cars manufactured after 2015 produce less than 1% of annual Co2 emissions. I would imagine the same for Europeans.

wait a minute.... why are you doing 58 in a 911? LOL.

@@kevinn1158 Scotland is awash with permanent 60mph average speed cameras.!

@@davidthegolfer Grrrrrrrr. They only put those mostly in school zones in Toronto. And inner city main roads where they know people really speed. Like the limit is 50kph and people are doing 80-85 because it's a big straight road. If you are on the highway, people go 120-130 all of the time. 100kph is the limit.

Can you lend me £100,000 to buy a decent one then? 911 is a specialist ownership. Tell us about a major service and Porsche parts.

What puts most buyers off an EV is the initial cost of the car in the first place. They are significantly more expensive than ICE equivalents ontop of the other drawbacks of range/charging Infrastructure aswell as unknown variables like battery life and cost. Technology will improve in the coming years but for most people not there yet

@@johnjackson2349 You are telling me between the lines that most buyers (common people I suppose) did never learn at school or elsewhere something as TCO....and also do not calculate for their ICE cars the TCO when buying, but go for the cheapest to buy (and possibly paying the most for energy and maintenance)

That Skoda dropped 120 miles of range in 35 minutes with the caravan hitched - 28 miles into the trip. We aren't told all the bad things about EVs, if that Skoda is favourable like your previous vauxhall surely there's no benefit, the Vauxhall is far cheaper and can haul a caravan too if needed and gets a longer range. Can't quite grasp it

But what if you were towing a caravan or trailer?😐

And what happens when we can get our ICE cars converted to hydrogen from water? You can't do that with an electric motor and battery... plus the fact that we are actually running out of the essentials for the manufacture of batteries...

You hear wrong.... Evs are most popular in Norway 🇳🇴 now have a think 🤔

Except that claim is pretty absurd. No one is casually driving 200 miles somewhere for a quick meeting and planning that trip to the minute. The average miles driven in the UK is 7400 a year, which is barely 616 miles a month. Which obviously means people are not doing 400+ casual round trips on the clock...

But then if you are only using public chargers you aren’t going to be paying the pay as you go rate like the idiots in this video. BMW gives you a charge card getting ionity at 24p per kWh for £11 per month. That’s £59 to do 700 miles a month (£48 for charging and £11 for membership). The same in a 60 mpg diesel would cost £100 for 700 miles a month so £41 more.

Exactly. I'm getting my first EV next month. And week to week I'll go from £50 min to under £10

​@@shogunpxpJust buy petrol. What is wrong with you

@@mastershadow1637maybe he cares about the environment although I suspect he isn’t vegan

@@shogunpxp lol, I just bought a Model Y last week ;)

@mastershadow1637 what's wrong with me? Iv done over a 1000 miles and it's cost me £35 stop being a sheep and think for yourself. Click bait follower

lol! A motorway journey is hardly an unusual journey - you're an apologist!

100% agree... these articles always take the worse case EV and dont forget it might catch fire on the way burning a hole in the planet!

@@MassiveBenny for most people a full tank/battery motorway journey is a rare thing on a daily basis... Most UK commutes are less than 40 miles a day.... you're a scaremonger

@@andym1548 that's bullshit but carry on....

@@MassiveBenny well thought out response... keep on trucking

only cheap if you charge it at home or some work places

Forever petrol car, even without oil.

Half the cost if charging from home

They’re both awd….

i bought a 3 year old model 3 performance and previous owner supercharged it only once throughout it's life time.

Not eye opening at all honestly just another bunch of EV haters who designed a test to favour the fuel cars. No one drives their EVs like this all the time. Most driving is done with home or destination charging and you get that significantly cheaper (home charging is on the order of 2p per mile compared to fuel cost of 17-22p per mile)

​@@TJWhiteStarquite a lot of people don't have the option of charging at home.

​@@TJWhiteStarOh, of course, because hurling insults at people is the most sophisticated way to showcase your true, refined personality for the world to admire.😂😂😂

They died at Diesel Gate.

My EV cost me around 4cents per mile, about 3cents per km. No diesel is getting close to that.

After watching this video i can see why people are being mislead into staying away from EV models. The video is showing a real life situation but at the same time not telling viewers all the right information. So let me explain (other may have in other comment but i have not read any of them). Like the video states if you are solo charging from home then yes hands down will be cheaper, BUT when driving on motorways/long journeys and using the fast super charges it will be more expensive BUT, with the correct research you will quickly realise no one pays the expensive rates at the charges. These are many companies with a monthly subscription which lowers the chargers. I have a VW ID4 and i use a company called ELLI WE CHARGE, for £9.99 a month, lowers the 0.69p or higher charge down to 0.28p, so now that cheaper then charging at home right now at 0.35p/0.40p. Would love to see another video from which car telling people that truth and to give people other options.

@@carloperna2769 agreed, my EV cost me around 5cents per mile, naturally i try and recharge as much at home at night when electrity is sround 10-12cents per kwh. If i have to take a long rd trip or tow I take my truck runs in diesel. But 90% of our daily driving is by our ev. Id have to be mad to daily my truck, cost around 40 cents mile in diesel

I agree, nothing wrong with Euro6 diesel engines. Huge economy and range.

Except you need MORE money to outlay at the start. The cars cost more... the EV charger you have to buy and PAY to have fitted. In the UK this can easily cost £1,000 or more, often as much as £1,500. Then you are subject to the mercy of your electricity company, who could if they wanted to, quite simply, just double their price for overnight charging rates. I've never seen a fuel garage charge more than 45-50p over the average market price for a litre of petrol or diesel.. but the cost of electricty has drastically increased here in the UK in just the last 13 months and even in other countries like Spain, electricity is still very expensive. Your analogy of "it's a gas car so it needs gas" is a bit daft.... guess what. Your "electric car" needs mains electricity. In the UK, EV prices are a rip off. The government used to give you £5,000 back towards the cost of the car, but they still weren't good value even after that. This scheme then went down drastically to just £2,000 back from the government and within the last 2 years they scrapped it completely and you get NOTHING back now.... EV's only really work if you can charge for free or extremely low cost reliably, and have shorter commute distances.

its also worth noting that many people will not be able to do home charging,

Its also worth noting how much the Solar Panels Cost

@@MOSSFEEN both true, but as I say - if you already have off-road parking in front of your house, and solar panels on the roof (as many hundreds of thousands of people in the UK have) running an EV becomes much more affordable than in this video.

If you haven't got a home charger then as of yet evs are not the answer. In all other cases evs are cheaper

@@MOSSFEEN Electricity from your own solar panels will cost about 8-15p.

What battery replacement costs? EVs (at least the ones that I am interested in) have a 4 year warranty for everything and then 10 year warranty for batteries and drive unit. So what is exactly the battery replacement cost on that? £0? Lol - even after the 10 years, most EVs that are older than that drive for thousands of miles before you even have to consider a battery replacement.

Has your EV broken even on its global emissions yet though…

@@ZodbieMan I did the numbers, another 1/2 year will break even. After that, it's good.

home charging also equals the cost of home charger install. ours was around £800, that pays for a lot of petrol

@@MrDead1975 I installed it myself both sides, £1600 - cost of the parts. Unfortunately, for owners don't know how to DIY, it's a lot of money.

@@g600f700 so you near the 90,000 miles it takes to 'become carbon neutral'?

And if not; most people would be on a subscription charger service, which would see the cost of charging half , compared to the prices shown in this video

Even though public chargers have become pricey since last year (Poland) Superchargers are still free - but I rarely use them, since their located too far from highways. But since more widely spread public fast chargers have become too expensive to make sense I’ve stopped using them and charge solely at my destination - even if they don’t have a wallbox, they have a regular outlet somewhere. I’ve done it this way on all of my journeys this year - not only does it save me money, but time as well.

Little miss sunshine, no offence and maybe you were going for this, but your name is one of the biggest red flags I've ever seen! Unless you were being sarcastic and are quite the opposite of course! Love and respect but if that ain't an inside joke, change your name! 😜

Thats simple 90% of charging happens when you are asleep, the small amount of charging for business/holiday etc trips is not usually a problem. Just avoid the chargers at MacDonalds around lunch time.

@@kevinashurst634 So who are these people using the ever expanding number of public charging stations. The one in the video was completely full. Are they all asleep in their cars then?

@@MarkJT1000 There are a LOT of chargers around, 6,500 rapid chargers now. Use zapmap or the cars inbuilt nav system and go to a charger that's available.

@@MarkJT1000 there are 6500 rapid ev chargers in the uk, probably over 100 around Leeds. Why did What Car go to a charging station that is often busy, when the car and various apps would tell them where the next nearest and a lot cheaper available charge point is ? Any yes some people do have a sleep whilst charging. I use that Ionity charger sometimes and it is busy with Porsches/Audis and Kias who can ise the full 350Kw facility and they aren't there very long.

That's because typically I spend about 30 Seconds to charge my EV. Soo my labor cost which my company charges clients is about £125 per hour. Comes to about £1.04 vast majority of the time I charge my car that has 250 miles range. £1.04 Labor Cost is why people don't care and never fact it in.

Or you could just have the battery pack refurbished, like the UK owner of a 10 year old Nissan Leaf, who took his car to Cleveleys Electric Vehicles in Gloucestershire. They carried out a battery pack refurbishment, which took 4 hours. The cost was £500. Cleveleys posted a the video of the refurb on RU-vid, so that those who felt you *had* to buy a new battery pack, could discover that was not the case......

Motorways are not friends of evs above 60mph

that is 8.7 mile to a litre which was £1.99 or 23p a mile. plus road tax cost for that car, plus servicing part ( oil, oil filter, etc) or a new exhaust every 3 or 4 years.

A monster fossil burner from the last millenium. Outdated, inefficient, expensive, stinking.

😂 at £2 per litre

@@wolfgangpreier9160 but arent EVs just the same? I mean really? They just dont do their dirty business on their own doorstep. Instead they leave their fossil burning in the vicinity of the local powerplant (in most cases) whilst still requiring the use of an even more finite resource? It doesnt feel like the giant leap that its supposed to be, to me.

@@wolfgangpreier9160 who hurt you pal 😂

@@SteYoung Yes, Electric motors burn fossil ressources which we will never get back, produce much poisonous gases that hurt us, our children, our plants, the animals everything, are dirty and loud, must be maintained regularly and cost much too much to produce and destroy. Or did i just describe FOSSIL BURNING MONSTERS? We do not burn any fossil ressources to generate our electricity. Of course some still have to do because we still do not have enough Lithium, Nickel, Managenese dug out of the ground. But with every battery cell it less fossil fuel must be pumped and burned forever. Battery cells can be recycled. Burned fossil ressources not.

Also, a ground up ICE car should be compared to a ground up EV, not an EV based on far from ideal ICE chassis..

LOL it was rigged.

Came here to say this, thank you for being the voice of reason

@Joe Lynch Pretty easy to achieve that within any EV these days. Hell, used to do 25,000 miles annually with a 30kWh Leaf... & there's been a 3-4x increase in range since then.

well one of my cars can be doing 180 miles a day (community nurse) Also we tend to go on holiday to Scotland etc at least once a year and regularly have days out to the lake district etc so i am interested in what happens in an electric car if you actually leave your local area.

@@del4668 I tend to prioritise accommodation with chargers & maybe have a look on Plugshare as to what's in a particular area. As for long trips (& I do 500 - 750 mile ones irregularly) it tends to be a case of letting the car + sat nav pick up on it, e.g. few months back got on the ferry in Dublin to Holyhead & on to Harwich, ferry over to Hook of Holland & on to Poznan... didn't do anything more than set Harwich (or Poznan) as the destinations on driving off the ferry, let the car to figure out where best stop for charging.

@Joe Lynch 30-40k a year makes EV ownership a hassle, but what you could save in fuel costs is potentially massive.

I see no obsession with range here. This is a long-range rest of the cars, therefore the range of the cars is relevant. If one is testing, for example, the boiling times of different kettles, this doesn't mean that one is obsessed with the boiling times of kettles; it is simply what is being tested.

honestly PHEV/range extenders are the way to go. having a Kia PHEV and an id4, the smaller Kia is honestly the car we prefer to take on in town and long distances. middle distances (~200 is miles in the US north east) the ID4 is preferable.

LOL why do you think the guy selling you electricity is going to charge you less then the guy selling you gas. Charge at home when you can. That is where most people do most of their driving.

@@danharold3087 home charging is not an option for many of us in London

@@ianelliott229 I tried to say that. Could have been more plain. If your goal is to cut pollution it still makes sense to have an EV even if it costs you a bit more. The few people I know that work in London drive in on scooters. None of these 'gems' doing these cherry picked comparisons consider the enviroment. It does not fit their narrative.

@@danharold3087 While you yourself will be cutting pollution, it appears the amount generated by the manufacture of said vehicle will take you many years to break even over say a petrol. Probably longer than you will even own the vehicle. So overall you are not actually benefitting the planet at all.

@@richardgp5691 Unlike an ICE car that will NEVER break even. Just gets worse the longer you drive it. Not to mention the pollution generated by drilling refining and transporting gasoline.

If city driving depend if they do it in peak hour. If peak hour with crawling traffic the electric would blow the petrol car apart. There would be no comparison, and that is from seeing my mitsubishi outlander reset the average fuel consumption and if not driving and idling it sometimes reaches 65 L/100km. When get on the freeway 10 mins it goes back down to 14L/100km. If like the BMW test was, the reason it was 39 was fuel economy goes to the moon :). Mitsubishi outlander I have lowest has been 7L/100km.

Not true

I have one of these too! Its the best thing ever! Best of both worlds!

out of interest what PHEV do you have and how much did the home electric power point cost ?

@@wokeupandsmellthecoffee214 I have Lynk & Co 01, with 17,6 kWh battery. It is super efficient since electric motor is built in the 7DCT gearbox which helps to recuperate a lot and it also works perfectly with ICE in hybrid mode. It costs me around 4800 SEK/Month (swedish crowns) as a company car leasing, otherwise the car costs 460 000 SEK. According to WLTP electric only range is 69km, however I've achieved around 70-75km during the summer, in couple of rare occasions 82km, during winter at -1 Celsius range was down at around 50km. I've heard some complaints that people had only 35km of pure electric range during coldest winter days but I don't what driving style was that... Charger itself did not cost me actually, since my apartment garage has chargers included. However, housing association charges 200 SEK/Month for PHEVs and 300 SEK/Month for BEVs to cover investment and infrastructure cost. Whereas cost of used electricity is super cheap at 1,25 SEK/kWh. That leads to around 3 to 5 times less cost per month in my monthly driving compared to my previous ICE golf.

If you remove government subsidies and tax breaks - both on the car and on the electricity - then ICE vehicles are significantly cheaper. I expect EVs are cheaper to run but you'd probably need to run 8-12 years to reach break even/equivalent.

Do you have an enormous bladder and never stop to eat or drink? Boody well done you. I wonder about the wonderful things that you drive past, just off the motorway - shame you will never see them

Nope, EV live much longer and have much lower maintenance cost because they have only very few moving parts. That makes their cost of ownership including the buying price over the complete lifespan signifcantly lower.

I had a 330e and it was fantastic. I regret selling it. It was the best of both worlds. With sticky tires and a full charge I could keep up with the Porsche Club at my local track! The extra shove from the electric motor really made a difference. It covered tons of miles with ease as well. I am with you on the PHEV idea. I live in a very cold climate and only get the ranges stated on the sticker about 4 weeks out of the year so petrol is a must for me no matter how I try to make it work. -25f cuts my range by half, more if I don't want to wear snowmobile gear and use pocket handwarmers to stay warm.

Same logic I'll be taking... If electric cars do become affordable on the second hand market will get one but long journeys will still have to be a diesel affair

We switched from 1 petrol and 1 Diesel to 2 EVs. Total fuel savings £350 per month. The savings over 10 years pays for one of the 2 cars completely. This only works with off peak home charging. I totally agree that anyone without a driveway will struggle to see any benefit in EV ownership.

How long do you think free charging will last ? Once 30 or 40 % of people own them expect all charging stations to start wanting there investments to make money.

@@MrGrim2u1987 I'm honestly surprised it's lasted this long. I'm genuinely impressed by this @WhatCar video as usually videos that question the all-round superiority of EVs over ICE vehicles have some click-baity title like "My EV ownership has turned into a NIGHTMARE!!!" and then the video is pro-EV and anti-ICE. One particular bugbear I have is charging times. We have a lot of drivers who are incredibly impatient. We have drivers who, when approaching a lane merge, race up the merging lane and force their way in at the last minute, or the drivers who speed along in lane three of the motorway then cut across all the lanes to make their exit so they can get ahead of other drivers, just for a couple of examples. The idea that these drivers are going to happily faff around for ages while they wait for a charger to become free seems unlikely. It's all well and good saying "I have a home charger!", but look at how many households have 2, 3 or even 4 cars on their drive. I suspect there is an agenda to force a lot of "ordinary" people off the road, by making car ownership too impractical for most people.

EV range anxiety soon goes away, we charge our EV6 average once a week overnight. Public charging is deer but have done it x 2 in 7 months about £19 total. buying Car is biggest outlay. for us £12.5k "more" to replace than the diesel model we used to own. Similar specs, Diesel used to cost us £160 a month road tax £15, service £40, Ext warranty £39 £264 a month total, EV has free road Tax, costs £37 a month to charge service is £18 a month. so £55. has 7 year warranty so saving £211 a month. 2.5k a year so takes 5 years to get money back. Fly in ointment is resale values ICE likely to fall as we approach 2030 EV likely to be better 2nd hand because they are so dear new. So we won't know for a while what's the best. If EV costs drop people who currently own will also lose big time if they sell.

​@@markgc65 Entry cost isn't my big concern, as I think I'd lease or PCP my way into EV ownership rather than buy. For me performance is the big plus of EVs. I really DO like the idea of home charging, as I find going to a petrol station to fill up a nuisance. All things considered, given my low daily mileage, I probably would be a good candidate for an EV, but I'm not quite ready to take the plunge yet.

@@MrSonicAdvance Best thing we ever did. Would never go back still have a lovely low mileage sports car 155mph 0-60,in 5.6 secs manual gears, But to be honest Now with Ev it's lost its shine. We have KIA EV6 GT line.

I have had one for a over a year now and cannot fault it does what I want and as you say charge at home for the short runs and the petrol engine does the longer ones. as for this net zero nonsense which will not be met anyway they should have promoted small engine cars with a electric motor so could be used in city areas but also capable of long trips.

I am not sure about those either. For shorter trips alright, but longer trips once your battery is out you are basically burning more fuel to carry the weight of that battery which is doing nothing.

@@AvinashSingh-jv7uq when the main battery runs out, with the smaller battery, it continues simply as an hybrid car. No dead weight bro. I know this because I own the Toyota prius 2020 phev. I compared the mpg of my prius with my wife's vw 2L diesel car, even on motorway, the prius out shines the diesel. I have also driven a merc eqa 250, I know how Fast the miles/kwh of electric cars drop on motorway but most efficient within the city compared with Ice and hybrid cars.