Slade has fallen off a cliff with his performances. I would have given him a 3 maximum! I don’t believe he would get in any of the other six Nations sides. Anthony Watson, I agree with one of your other commenters, would be our best fullback. Ludlum, I agree, is as honest as the day is long in terms of his consistent work rate and effort. But you should need more than that to get into an England jersey. Making a historical comparison, but that is where we are,it seems.Sinckler is a distant shadow of his previous form of a couple of years ago. But he hasn’t got anyone breathing down his neck for his place. Like so many of them.
If you took a rating of 7 as a minimum, then only seven current players are eligible for an England shirt. Planning needs to start now for the 2027 WC.
Could a midfield of Farrell, Manu and Lawrence work? I think we definitely need to look at Tuilagi again based on his game against Ireland but Lawrence was good in patches too. Are they a little too similar though?
Yes, too one-dimensional. Manu had a few nice carries but nowhere near the impact he once had and? He is a bit of liability in defense. He doesn't kick or pass particularly well. Need a more rounded pairing at center.
no it won't be an improvement on what we've seen. Need to find a new 13 so maybe try and blood Tommy Freeman. But Northwick does not have an vision for backs so will only pick on club form in club positions unless your name is `Farrell
I like your ratings, I think fair generally. The ones I would maybe change would be Ribbans, he only really played 1 game, the Ireland game and I thought he was very effective, so I’d have given him a 7 (but need to see more which we may now with Chessum out). I think Mitchell 7 as always offered impact. Farrell for me sets a high standard and fell well short I don’t think his contribution against Ireland merits a 7 overall, 5/6 for me his kicking was worst of all 10s in the tournament. I think tuilagi was good against Ireland and maybe showed that his international career isn’t over…
A player like Van Poortvliet has no place on the squad - every time the camera is on him he comes across as a deeply unpleasant and unsportsmanlike individual. Legacy of the Jones-era management team failing to tackle bad attitudes, cynical play, and nastiness from good players (often rewarding with captaincy / leadership pathway!) that you now have a team culture incapable of incubating good sportsmanship across the ranks. Very difficult to respect many of the the players as individuals or give benefit of the doubt RE cynical play - honestly think it must be a difficult environment for any new call-ups to integrate into, which is something Borthwick is going to have to overcome. That being said, I'm not entirely sure he recognises the issue yet.
So, if we take this England team as a whole and ask if a single one would get into a Lions shirt, the answer has to be a big fat 0. Let’s say we classify the very best in the tournament, such as Dupont, as worth 9 points, what scores would you give now? So let’s get real with these scores. Dan Cole and Mako - totally ineffectual when they came on - 3 George and Sinckler - shadows of their former selves - 4 Genge - 6 as he can still improve Chessum - monstered by France but has potential - a 5/6 Itoje - even at 90% one of the better members of the team, but lacking the power of previous years - 5/6 Ludlam- ineffective though tried hard - 5 Ben Curry - not good enough for international rugby- 3 Dombrandt - just about better than Curry so a 4 JVP - anonymous and when up against the best, looks so slow and second rate - 4 Farrell - will he ever improve back to the player he was 6 years ago. You have to say no. As a captain unable to rally his troops and an ineffectual player, he’s a 4/5 Smith, the same- disappointing but at least he is young and has skills Farrell can only dream of. How you give Olly Lawrence 8 is beyond me. Did he somehow outplay Fickou? Yes he tries but you can already tell he hasn’t got the power to fill the inside centre’s shoes. A 5/6 for him with Tuilagi coming in at 5 ad he’s just lost the power he once had. For a man who has 50 caps, Slade has been the biggest disappointment of the team. 3 for him and time to end his England career. Really poor. I’ll deal with Arundell first as he had potential, but looked so far out of his depth against Ireland, you can tell he needs a lot more senior rugby before he makes this kind of step up again. A 4 for him. Hassell-Collins. Anonymous and never came looking, so 4 there Watson improved against Ireland so 5/6. He was shaky earlier in the tournament. Malins - his problem is defence though his running is always awkward for the opposition- a 4/5 because of that Steward - he can catch a ball but so slow and often caught out defensively because of this. I’d switch him to the forwards at say 6 as he had good hands and would do well there. Mitchell was underused so giving him a 6 for the time he was on may be too generous. Really showed up JVP for the slowcoach he is both in passing and running. Isiekwe - not international standard - a generous 4 Which leaves Marchant. Athletic but pretty much as ineffectual as Slade when he played. So there you have it, a really poor England team. The 2003 World Cup winners would easily see them off as would Eddie Jones’ 18 match winning streak (yes I know some of them are I. The same team, but you know what I mean). I realise I forgot Willis. He’s. 6/7 when he’s on the field but marked down to a 5/6 as he is not yet fit enough to compete with the tournament best. In case you argue, Olivant and Van der Flyer compared to JW and again you see what I mean
I appreciate that you said in the video that all might be a point either way and I largely agree with your assessment and have only adjusted 5 scores, on my personal scoring. Genge 8, if 8 was the high score for the team then he was as good as anyone. Curry 7, marked him down a point for his performance in the Scotland game for this score but thought he was as good as any other player apart from that. Van Poortvliet 2, was the worst English player of the tournament and the slowest English scrum half at the breakdown I think I've ever seen. Tuilagi 6, I think he did pretty well yesterday, if only he could have stayed fit over the years he would have been a legend. Steward 8, pretty much the same as others that I promoted by a point as he was easily as valuable as any other player, although I agree about his pace. Another great video, looking forward to following you during the World Cup :)
He's about six kilos heavier now than when he was when he was the World's quickest T/Head. It's done him no favours carrying all that extra weight. He's never been naturally big enough to be an Int'l 3 and bulking up has robbed him of his USP which , to be honest , isn't his main role anyway.
For an England whose performance was a 5th in table the ratings are flattering. None of the players are world class and they will not play in any tier 1 side as it stands. Maybe Jack Willis and Genge. So the ratings as an average should be a 5 at the best. I would make it 4.5
What overwhelmingly strikes me looking at that line up is that the majority are players who are significantly past their best. Many peaked in the NZ semi at the last WC. Even Sinckler who is a relatively young bloke is a shadow of the player he used to be. How many England players would get in a Lions squad? Not many. I had a love/hate with Eddie, but this is his fault. He refused to blood or give a real chance to new players coming through so we're left with players who are well past their prime. Maybe Eddie was working for the Aussies all along ;-)?
Looking in from outside (Irish), it seems obvious to me that England's players are well below the standard required. It could just be aberration - a particularly weak generation - but by far the most logical explanation is the sacred cow of the premiership. The English professional clubs destroyed the Heineken Cup, and I believe their powerful position within Wnglish rugby is now handicapping the English national side. It mirrors what happened in soccer - the English prem was fully corporatised and became a monster, while the standard of homegrown English players, and consequently the national team, gradually declined.
I agree with many of the scores but think its a bit harsh on Smith, arundell and hassel colins...they never really got a look with dominate forwards or ball in space... I think England should give them a chance in the world cup warm up games to see if they can improve.
I think a 5 for Mako and Cole is generous, by the time they come on the opposition scrum is tiring, Mako is a poor scrummager technically, and neither of them is sufficiently mobile to make much of an impact in attack or defence. I think Sinckler has been a big disappointment this tournament, he seems to have lost his enthusiasm for the fray, and it is a serious problem that we have no up and coming tight heads.
A pretty honest and accurate assessment of where England are. I would have given Dave Ribbans a 6, he brought a bit of much needed muscle.. Owen Farrell has to be given credit for his leadership skills, without him England are a rudderless ship, he pushes players to do better, he is vital to the set up. England do not appear to have anybody else interested in being captain, pushing Owen Farrell for the job. This is problem, it's difficult build a world class team without several leaders in the team. The team of 2003 had half a dozen captain quality leaders you could chose from and at least two outstanding.
I reckon that's a fair analysis of the squad. What irritates me as an England fan is the line-up on paper usually looks great but the performances fall so short of what is expected. It almost feels like the 'Golden Generation' of England Football. I'll admit that my knowledge of young up-and-comers is pretty scant but there does seem to be an over-reliance on the players who proved themselves 3/4+ years ago (Cole, Vinipola, Youngs, George for example). Personally I went into this 6N with hopes about as low as could be, an England camp in disarray with fans rightfully losing faith in a floundering camp. It seemed to me like this tournament would have been the time to test the new generation of talent coming through in a new and exciting play style, not the hybrid of playing proven players and squeezing the young players into a style that took the world by storm several years ago (personally I think back to the Eng v NZ RWC semi-final which was hands down one of the most incredible games of rugby I've ever watched) but since has been worn down and proven to be ineffectual on the current international stage. I'd have taken some more exciting and prosperous games with attacking flair over the sub-par and, at times abysmal showing, that we got instead. Either way, thank you for the continued detailed analysis throughout the tournament, it's been filled with highs and lows and I've certainly learnt more this year from finding your channel. Just a damn shame most England videos begin with a sigh and we've all as fans had to lean on the 'could've beens' learnings we've taken from the 6N. Bring on the World Cup... I guess
How many changes can we afford before the World Cup? However, Watson looks really good for a fast full-back and then you can get extra speed on the wings as well, H-C, Freeman, Murley, etc. All we need then is a few good props!
All pretty fair although I think bit harsh on Dombrandt. yes he was woeful against France but so were rest of pack. Against Ireland he was fine, overall a 5 I think. Also Ribbans was good against Ireland so I'd go 6 for him. Slade though is poor, flatters to deceive so 4 at most for me.
Mate in that France game? Smith dropped the ball on a kick which set France up for their BP try. He also tried to place the ball when over his own try line which gifted France a try and he got run over continuously. Yes, forwards deserve bulk of the blame but Smith had a bad game and it is ok to say so.
Agree with your ratings in general. However. I find it hard to believe that England has fallen so far off the level that took them to the World Cup final so I am confused as to what has happened in the past few years. Itoje was truly world class and am totally confused why he’s not dominant still. Is it that every other team just got better?
Borthwick might as well spin the wheel with a lot of the older players, Slade in particular. Can see big positives from Steward but he really lacks pace, have to play him with other backs who have pace. Moved on from Eddie but not enough, particularly in selection of back and bench players.
Steward doesn't just lack pace in attack, in fact his real issue his is lack of pace in defense. FBs have to get to spots to cover kicks, be in position to make tackles etc. Steward far too often this 6N did not get to those spots and even when he was in right position? Missed tackles, that didn't even slow the ball carrier. He is world class in the air, has a decent boot and a solid, physical runner but...his weakness got highlighted this 6N and to the point in France game it became embarrassing.
One good carry doesn't mean he had a good game. Manu pretty much vanished after that carry. Contrast that with Aki who had an outstanding game in attack and defense.
Certainly some positions up for grabs.. 8 and 9 in particular, maybe Borthwick will look at Billy again although he seems to have some personal issues there, if Barbary stays fit he could certainly be a contender for the shirt.. 9, Mitchell could well become a regular or we could look again at Randall, again, if he's injury free. Outside of that, Lawes will walk back into the side once he's fit, at 10 RA did a very interesting video about possible alternatives there to Smith or Farrell, I personally Charlie Atkinson kicks well and he strikes a balance. Defends better than Marcus Smith.. lots of food for thought before the WC.
Tuilagi gets a 6 from me tbh he was surprisingly good against Ireland. Also malins should probably be lower- he lacked attacking threat and was a little weak in defence
Was he? He had one dominant carry but outside that he did very little. 9 runs for just 12 meters. Missed a couple of tackles and had a turnover. Not really seeing that as "surprisingly good." Aki was by far the more impactful player. Manu is not player he was and yes he will give you odd dominant carry but England need far more than that.
There’s been too much “talk” ref Itoje and underlying health issue(s). If this true, then if there other locks out there available they should’ve (should) be used? If your not 100% fit why are you being picked? We’ve seen MT being used carrying niggles, and he breaks down (poor lad) it throws the whole back line out? Are SB and the medics so in awe of his past talents that make him undroppable? Go away get sorted then come back surely?
I was astonished at that little revelation. If it was meant to excuse Itoje some below par performances, it actually raised more questions than answers, as you point out. IF it's true, it made the England set up look ridiculous.
To be brief...the standout poor performances and need dropping are: JVP, Dombrandt, Slade. Some others maybe too but those 3 either drastically improve or just make way please
I saw that, great work. I was going to go through the top 10 in my next video. You win the respect of the viewers and a shed load of Guinness I expect!
I think Smith was lower than 5 tbh. If you consider defence he's a 2 at best and in attack when he played he was a 4 I reckon. I think I recall a couple of nice moves - a kick for Malans maybe to score but currentky overhyped internationally. Still think he can get better but this tournament overall I would say 3 or 4.
Concur. In France game right after England scored, Smith dropped a kick that set up France for BP and game ending try. He also tried to place ball over his own line which gifted France another try. Thought he was really poor this 6N and showed he has a long way to go before he can be considered a solid test match 10.
Smith had one start against Scotland with Farrell at 12 (Not ideal), he then got benched for Italy and Wales, Started against France when the pack was obliterated and JVP took 3-5 business days to distribute the ball, and then didn't come on against Ireland - So give him a 3 is very harsh all things considered
Smith needs involvement in every game if he is to develop internationally. He's key to the Quins set up, he can be for England. We don't want the top game to lose players because they're not built like panzer tanks. Smith brings skills and subtleties that the game also needs.
@@archiecapon4445 I agree there is an issue with scoring players individually in a team game and with fly halves maybe even more than others but I think he often chose wrong options, tried too hard and his kicking wasn't great. I think he is a fine player in the right circumstances, I'm just not sure he's showed us he is good enough when it's not ideal for him and certainly during this competition he wasn't very good. A score of 5 is just below average. His attacking was more than below average and his defence was abysmal. I still think he could come good I just don't think currently we are seeing anywhere near the best of him.
Genge 8 - started well, faltered carrying England George 5.5 solid set piece poor around the park Sinckler 6 - started well, some good moments but some bad moments too Itoje 6 - similar to above, good at times poor at times Chessum 6 - started well, faded as it went on Ludlam 7 - started really well bit faded longer it went on Willis - 8 some good moments and generally played well throughout Dombrant 3 - not only did he go missing and was poor throughout, he actually cost us in defence JVP - 3 devoid of confidence, caught at break down and offered every little Farrell 5.5 - few good moments in defence and leadership. But slow and kicking deserted him Smith 4 - did nothing all tournament Lawrence 6 - good v Italy, average v wales and poor v France Slade 2 - slow, missed tackles and offered nothing Hassle Collins 3 - didn’t see much ball or do much Mallins 5 - scored few tries but faded and missed tackles Watson 6 - looked better than rest of our wings but still to show consistency Steward 4 - awful v Scotland and Italy, brilliant v Wales, poor v France and not good v Ireland
In interviews he's channelling his inner Steve Mclaren. He just has three or four points he wants to say and doesn't answer questions with relevant answers. Think he needs to be more genuine, stop trying to spin everything. Also hope he starts blooding some younger guys because Cole, Mako, George and Slade are only going to get you so far.
To early to tell. It took time to turn leicester around but he did it. He will not be afforded the same time to turn England around but a vastly improved showing at the wc will buy him some . Failure will see him gone, as will another poor showing in next years 6n if he does survive the wc.
If I were to pick just one rating of yours to argue with, it would be Ribbans. On the evidence of this tournament, I have Chessum and Ribbans as the starting pair. As a Sarries fan, I'm shocked I don't have Itoje in the top two, but that's how it has played out. Ribbans looked good and carried well against Ireland.
Not sure Farrell was a 7 and find it difficult to rate the backs because what ball they did get was so slow. You could put the best centre in the world at 13 and he would struggle with the ball they are getting. Until the forwards release quick ball and the 9 gets it away quicker then we will struggle including Dombrant
Watson 8! He's a living legacy of the 'dull and safe' problem. On the law of averages he must have the odd game like v Ireland when he'll be seen getting in the way of the ball more often. He then has to do *something* with it. 8! lol.
agree with your ratings. It also shows our strengths and weaknesses pretty well. We have one class prop (I thought you were a tad harsh on Genge, would have given him an 8). But we need to find two THs (or Sinklair step up against top quality opposition) and hope Maro gets back to his best (Chessum will be such a loss). (I'd love to know your opinions on who could come through in the pack either for WC or after). We desperately need an 8 and maybe one more backrower to step up (then with Willis, Curry T, Ludlam, Lawes we should be okay. Maybe Mercer (another player Eddie should have played more), maybe other Willis or Barbeary if he is ever fit we may have a pack. We need another center (I'd love Marchant to get a chance, but maybe if W Joseph gets back to his best him? Freeman move inside for club?) and one of our many promising wings to step up. There is hope there, but probably not for this WC.
The issue with England at the moment is that they seem to be giving caps just to fill the shirts. If we had the likes of Connor Murray and Jamieson Gibson-Park, JVP would never see the number 9 shirt again.
sorry wrong on Dombrandt he needs a 5 you have it in for him....against France Smith had the 2nd best tackles record....a bit of prejudice in your scores me thinks !!!!
Very fair assessment. Above all, England needs an honest appraisal without "sympathy" for the low achievers who've had their chance. A similar rating should be applied to each of the coaching teams, which will also serve as an education for many of us who would like to know more about preparation behind the scenes. This should also include PR and communication skills (to include a "bullshit monitor") as well as coaching ability and results.
Hi there - given the overall position of England and only two wins I think the ratings are all to high by 1 mark for all starters. The reality is that the team underperformed again, for another year, and whilst Borthwick and team should get a pass these players should not (it’s the same ones failing and making the same mistake). Add to that the thumping by France at home it’s not good enough - the team average should be below a pass. The English players had a poor 6n.
Think 5 is harsh on Ribbans, he has looked good every time he’s got his chance for England, I’d have given him a 7. Be interesting to see which back rows go to the wc given there will likely be 6 or 5 spots and due to lack of depth at second row I’d be taking Lawes in a lock spot. I reckon as of now: Ludlam T.Curry J.Willis Z.Mercer A.Dombrant Then potentially a fight between B.Earl, B.Curry, S.Underhill, T.Pearson for final spot? I’d probs take Pearson as a bolter
A 7 for Farrell is laughably generous. He is basically an over-hyped version of James Williams at Bristol. He can play 10 and 12, is solid and doesn't do much wrong BUT is essentially working as a foil for MacGinty and Semi. England have the likes of Ford/Smith and Tuilangi/Lawrence who can play similar roles but never get a real chance because everything goes through Farrell and nothing comes out the other side.
@@rugbyanalyst Thinking about it again though, I reckon if Farrell was billed as 'a nuts and bolts player who keeps things ticking over' he'd deserve a 9 for that. As captain, main decision-maker, chief playmaker and overall focal point; a definitively average 5 seems appropriate.
You definitely have your little pets; and those you like to berate. Pets - Chessum, Ludlum, Farrell and Watson. Dunces- Sinkler, Itoje, Dombrandt, Smith. Cole, who appeared for all of 10 minutes, scores higher than Sinkler? Was Chessum really two points better than Itoje? Ludlum scores 7 and Dombrandt 3 - Dombrandt was poor, but no worse than any of the subs you’ve rated. Mitchell played ok, but was he 2 points better than van Portvleet? What was it that Farrell did in than last game to get the attack working? He was one of those picked for the game to keep the score down. Smith needs to do a lot more, but considering he was picked in sides where he either has no-one at 12, or was behind a beaten set of forwards, I think you are too hard on him. Farrell at 10 for the World Cup may get us to the quarter finals of the WC - is that our aspiration? Watson is joint top scorer - what was it that he did to deserve that? I didn’t see much from him that you would expect from a decent club winger. You need to try to be more objective.
You can't give a player a bye because they were "injured" come on now. Willis had one good game, and one atrocious game. Outside of that he was no more than ok. A 6 is fair.
Really think we need to have a look at changing the red card rules in rugby as have just watched the U20 game and again England were down to 13 men at one point after a red and then a yellow. Completely ruins the match. However well done Ireland, both the seniors and U20's, both teams deserved the wins.
Referee for the full international red carded the player for a tackle which was too high and refused to consider pulling out of the tackle as mitigation Referee for the U20 match red carded the player for a tackle which was too low and refused to consider trying to lower the tackled player down as mitigation As both referees were from the same country there might be some hope of a consistent approach Apparently not Both games effectively ruined by referees upgrading yellow to red and ignoring realistic mitigation
Steward an 8? Ian, he had at best a mediocre 6N. Just because he is good under the high ball that does not magically wipe out his poor play in other areas. Specifically defensively. He missed tackles, was badly out or position again and again. He also despite the space he had to run into very pedestrian with ball in hand. In Scotland game alone he whiffed in Duhan and Ben White. Both scored tries.
I think 🤔 Farrell should be taken off the squad. I couldn’t believe his comments in front of Steve the coach in the press conference. “We never did what we were asked to do” he clearly doesn’t get on with his coach/manager. I’m Irish ☘️ but Farrell played shit this year... he thinks he’s the bees 🐝 knees and I think because of he dads position, England won’t sack him. He’s rubbish 👊
😢 Now that EJ has Gone WalkAbout !!! I never got to elite Standard - but the Coaching I experienced from Local District to Regional Areas was Huge. Players needs to be moulded into being the Best Versions of Themselves!!!! The Systems and Processes that are played need Match the limited time that is had with individuals. The Rugby Analysts view used encompass this, but he seems to be losing that Nuanced attitude that brought me to this channel. Please 🙏 keep looking at the Rugby World 🌎 from that Authentic + Original Position !! Or think Nah - "Suck Dat, I want that RU-vid Algorithm to keep ticking over and growing Subscribers " Just my opinion RA ?? I will keep watching ❤
I always strive for balance and have fun but also have to say it as I see it. That won't be the same as everyone's views so don't worry if I have a different opinion to yours. thanks for the views
