That's actually the biggest thing in mountain driving. If there's one takeaway from this video, that's it. Use engine braking, etc. to avoid using the actual brakes any more than you have to.
We camped at Vogel State park last Thanksgiving in the North Georgia mountains, and coming down that mountain was tougher than i thought. This was great info and needed!
Another issue- especially in hot weather- is vapor-locking brakes. Brake fluid is hygroscopic; that is, it absorbs moisture, so as it ages it gets contaminated with water. Yes, brake systems are SUPPOSED to be sealed, but reality is they aren't always, some folks open the cap to check fluid levels, and sometimes the reservoir gaskets have flaws or otherwise don't seal 100%. A rig sits for a little bit and the water separates out and goes to the lowest point in the system...the calipers and wheel cylinders, where it can boil under prolonged heavy braking, creating pockets of steam and resulting in the pedal going right to the floor. Liquid is not compressible, but gas (vapor) is. This is also a good reason to have brake fluid changed out every few years on tow rigs and hydraulic trailer systems, or at least checked for contamination.
Nice Video. One of the best I have seen. I would add this: Just because your truck pulls your RV well on flat land do not assume it will be good enough for mountains. The mountains will tell you if all is sized and setup right sometimes with catastrophic consequences. There is no kill like overkill is my moto. In other words leave yourself some margin for emergencies. The top of a mountain is no place to find out that your truck is not big enough for your RV but that is how many people find out.
Not enough people apply trailer brakes before applying vehicle brakes. Also you aren’t kidding, West Virginia has some of the most intense mountains we have ever driven on.
Great video,very well explained 😉👍 I wish I’ve watched your video like 4h ago , because I Did not prepare myself mentally for the first descent in my life from Cloudcroft,NM towards Alamogordo, NM and even though I have a diesel truck ,(I’ve been living in the south for many years,aight , I did not know a jack thing about mountain driving....it’s really...f....flat in south Texas) 😆 any how My rear breaks were smoking so bad, I got out the fire extinguisher just in case it catches on fire while in a gas station! Luckily made it all safe and sound and so far it seems like an expensive lesson learned,gonna find out tomorrow exactly how much ,but hey....at-least the kids,wife and I are still alive! I’m probably gonna watch the rest of all your videos now since I got really high and still full of adrenaline and can’t sleep! 😄
Happy to hear that everyone's alright, Kamen! That downgrade below Cloudcroft is a big'un (we've driven it) and you're very, very fortunate that you didn't experience extreme brake fade. All that smoke showed that you were really close to it! Now you know, use those gears (and your diesel engine brake if your truck is so equipped) and you'll be able to safely descend those grades. All's well that ends well.
We threw ourselves to the wolves last year and took our first big road trip in the fifth wheel to the Blue Ridge Mountains. It was a little scary at first, but the truck just kind of knew what to do regarding the braking. I was concerned if I was doing everything correctly. After watching this great video of yours, it appears I did. LOL! Thanks for sharing! Have a Glamperrific Day! 👍❤️🌈😀🌈
Thanks guys! Well done! One thing we didn't get into the video is the fact that with most modern trucks, tow/haul mode will prompt the vehicle to downshift automatically when applying the brakes on a descent, but we prefer having more granular control by manual shifting ourselves. Even when not towing, one game I like to play on that 3,500-foot descent shown in the beginning of the video is to see if I can drive the full 8 miles without tapping the brakes at all. 😁
Thanks for you comments about the grades in Appalachia. I live and drive the Blue Ridge Mountains. Not only are some grades steeper, but most have smaller shoulders and more frequent and sharper turns. This requires the driver to reduce speed more often than out west. In many respects, I find trailer towing in the Rockies easier.
Great stuff! Thanks. I'm just starting to look into buying my first full-time travel trailer and 3/4 Ton truck for me and my wife. I don't know anything about towing a large travel trailer so this was incredibly helpful!
That was really helpful for a true flatlander .... you know we don't like hills or curves in our roads in Florida. I look forward to some mountain driving in the RV in the next few weeks.
Also when going uphill and start to overheat turn on the heater full blast. Also adding a additional after market trans cooler will help protect the trans and the cooler are very reasonable to add. Good video!
@@celestepalm6949 I honestly don't know if the fan makes a difference. Hopefully some others can pipe up on that, but running the heater full temp definitely helps, for it helps dissipate the heat in the coolant.
Great film on driving , particularly like the obd reader , never really thought of that looks like lots of useful information, I think the tips you give are great and even though it’s a very different style of towing in the uk the basic rules still apply ! Great watch
Very good video! Our first trip out in our trailer took us over 10 % grade, corkscrew type road. My wife and I had some “discussion”. Did I mention that my wife drove semi’s for fifteen years. I yielded to the more experienced driver. She is all about lightly squeezing the trailer brakes. I’m for running engine manually and using the engine to brake.
Good stuff. We haven't traveled to any mountainous areas since we purchased our TT so it should be interesting when we do next month. You're quite brave recording this while driving through those snowy mountains.
Grand Adventure it’s a pleasure to share good work and yours is always excellent! Many of the people currently RVing don’t seem to understand mountains and breaking. But then many of them also drive like the are in the home car... Let’s hope your video can save at least one brake pad from a since less early death!
I'm coming up on my retirement end of this year. I've had a plan to get a small travel trailer and hit the road. I've towed before and know what an over-packed trailer and under-powered truck feels like. I'm starting to regret my 4runner purchase and am worrying about towing, second guessing my RV lifestyle choice.
We've been guilty of that mistake in the past, which is why we went with overkill this time around with an F-350 diesel. The biggest downside of towing near your vehicle's limit is braking ability. Not only in mountains, but also in normal traffic. A harrowing e-stop right after we bought our first travel trailer, and I was at the dealership the following Monday negotiating for a bigger truck. 😁
That is lot of good information. It made me think of your video from last summer traveling the Million Dollar Highway in Colorado with your trailer. They should of spent two million and added some shoulders! One thing I have observed is the heavier the trailer, the quicker it picks up speed on the downhill. That is obvious but it means one has to be paying attention with a big heavy rig such as a 15K pound fifth wheel. It can come up as a surprise and get away in a hurry if not ahead of the game. I mostly tow a 7,000 lb travel trailer but have pulled a big fifth wheel on occasion through the mountains and you definitely have to pay more attention and anticipate the grades sooner with those heavy loads. Now you need to do a video on how to drive on snow and ice. My winter weather highway experience is limited and I do not find it a lot of fun. I have found unloaded pickup trucks in two wheel drive can be especially exciting on ice! On another topic, I was wondering what camper top you have on your truck? I just ordered a Leer 100XR cab height. I am looking to use it like a somewhat secure mini garage and to keep things dry. I also liked the A R E but the Leer removable front window worked out better for me compared to the A R E fold down option. I have a metal tool box in the front of the bed that I intend to keep for more secure storage and it being higher than the bed rails, I think it would get in the way of a fold down front window. I did want a single latch for the rear window door compared to a handle in each corner. It might be a little bit of reach getting to the opposite handle when hooked up to the trailer. It should take about four weeks to arrive.
LOL at your Million Dollar Highway comment! Shoulders would've been tough for much of it, but guardrails are virtually impossible as the road is open all year, and it would be impossible to properly plow with guardrails. Great point about heavier vehicles being harder to control on downgrades. Obvious, of course, but something that never really crossed my mind. 2WD pickups (or 4WD pickups in 2WD) are some of the worst vehicles that I've ever driven in snow. Putting our truck in 4WD is a night-and-day difference from 2WD mode. It helps slightly that I've got the shell on the bed, which adds a few hundred pounds over the rear drive wheels. Our shell is an ARE, although I had a Leer on the Tacoma. An absolute must-have feature for me is the side windows that both open upward, and also have a slide/screen. Being able to fully open the window means that I can get to something up front when the bed is full of cargo. That area was chock full of things when we were on the road for a 5-month stretch last summer, from our generator to tools, extra clothes to sports equipment. You can carry much, much more with a shell than you can with a tonneau. Many a time we've also camped back there (I have a full BedRug and carpeted ceiling on the shell to match), hence my desire for slide-opening windows with screens. I do regret forgetting to order the removable front window, which I had on the Leer, when I ordered the ARE. Never had a problem reaching the single latch on the liftgate, but then again we use an 18" hitch shank so that we can drop the tailgate while the trailer is connected -- the tailgate hits the tongue jack when using the standard length Fastway Equal-i-zer shank.
Really good stuff - thanks. I’m pretty much a novice with our TT, and I live in Colorado so your vid is very helpful. I’ve been living in the Rockies long enough that I feel very comfortable and safe driving in the mountains - trailering is another story. One question I have is when you are using the tow-haul made, is it OK to use the gear shifter as well to downshift on downhills?
Thank you Richard! The same safe mountain driving skills that you use without a trailer apply while towing. And absolutely you can (and should) by all means downshift while using tow/haul mode. All tow/haul mode changes is the shift point while your transmission is in drive. If you have a diesel with an engine brake, that's one more tool for your downhill arsenal.
Thanks so much for your speedy reply! Your comment makes a lot of sense. We’ve got a bunch of trips planned out for the summer, including one to Kodachrome Basin state park. First trip with the new trailer is about 2 weeks away.
@@richardradcliffe6047 That's fantastic! Here's wishing you safe and enjoyable travels. And you're going to love Kodachrome! ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-h-qqTCTB-6g.html
I’m a new subscriber very good video. Can you mention the scanner your using and will it only be compatible to certain vehicle or do they all work on any vehicles thanks Mark
Thanks Ron, and we're very happy to have you along. Unfortunately the scanner we're using is no longer sold on Amazon. However, any of the scanners found by searching "obdii bluetooth" on Amazon should work just fine with Torque Pro. They're vehicle independent, too.
Trying to decide how much to use manual down shifting or blocking out gears when towing with a ford expedition through mountain passes. The expedition is configured for max tow with 10spd transmission and 3.5L high output ecoboost engine plus transmission cooler... but the transmission seems to get very high temp already when stressed on moderate passes. Might need to be ultra careful in choosing trailers and limiting weight. Expedition rated for 9k lbs and based on f150 but has suv brakes and no diesel engine brake.
appreciate your feedback, Mark! We're still trying to find our happy balance. Unfortunately, RU-vid normalizes the audio when they process the video, so it's difficult to predict exactly what they're going to do with it, as it never sounds the same as when we upload it.
Trucker's refer to it as "stab braking". Decide on a downhill speed. When you reach 5 MPH past that speed, stab the brakes. Meaning hit the brake pedal as hard as possible without locking up the wheels. In the case of a semi close to it's 80,000 pound gross, that can require BOTH feet on the brake pedal!!! When you are 5 MPH below your decided speed, release the brakes. Do not touch the pedal until you are 5 MPH over your desired speed again. The time you are on the brakes is short, so the brakes do not heat up as much. And being completely off the brakes allow them to cool. With the help of your engine holding you back, and using stab braking, you can go down any hill and never run out of brakes. The WORST thing you can do, with ANY automatic transmission equipped with an overdrive (which almost all vehicles have now) is leave it in drive. One way newer vehicles increases highway mileage is freewheeling when off the power. In other words, your engine will provide zero resistance to speeding up going down a hill.
Semi truckers use "drag chains" on the rear trailer wheels when snow chains are needed but I never see any info on using drag chains on a travel trailer if you are in bad snow conditions towing a travel trailer and if you use the trailer brakes on a downhill steep slick icy road...any thoughts...?
Come to mention it Greg, we haven't either. Sounds to us like it would work, but then again our method thus far of towing on slick, icy roads is avoidance altogether. Right now, for example, we're working on blending skiing and RVing for an upcoming episode from Deer Valley, but we're looking for a dry weather window to film it.
Hello. Just came across your video, but we want to ask a particular question. We just got a 2017 GMC Canyon, and we tow a 22 foot camper. We know how to use the manual mode for flat driving, but our question concerns going up a mountain and descending the mountain. We've been told to go into L8 to ascend, and then go lower gears when going down. Could you give us more detailed information about what gear numbers to use when going down. Thank you!!
Catherine, we use the transmission in automatic (i.e., "drive") while ascending. While descending, however, use whichever gear will hold you back at the proper speed. Which gear that is will depend upon the grade, its length, and the appropriate speed for the road.
Thanks for the tips. I'm heading from Pittsburgh to Myrtle Beach, driving I79/ I77. This will be my first time pulling through the mountains. I'm in a 2006 Dodge Ram 2500 Cummins pulling a 2021 Sporttrek weighing 8200lb. I do not have an exhaust brake. Watching your video here, I'm looking at full trip in tow/ haul. I also have an overdrive off option. When in mountain areas ascending in D or 2nd. Descending in D2 or even D1. Does that sound accurate?
We are planning a trip from Iowa to Zion National Park. 26 ft travel trailer. 6800 lbs fully loaded. Chevy Silverado 2500 HD. What route would you choose? I 70 or 80? Or do have other options that would be better? Appreciate your help. Thank you!!
Although both have substantial grades, I-80 across Wyoming is far and away much, much easier than I-70 across Colorado. If you're not venturing further north than Zion, I'd also look at I-40 across Arizona to Kingman, then up through Vegas.
Only you will know, Stephanie, for it's whatever gives you adequate torque going up and adequate engine braking going down. I'd use "M" (manual) and manually choose whatever gear gives you the proper reaction from the vehicle.
@@richardkoch8752 no you sure can't. It cracks me up that places like O'Reilly Auto Parts charge $100 for what's essentially an identical item. Sure, the one on Amazon is almost assuredly cheap Chinese stuff, but the manufacturer of the one at O'Reilly says only "designed and distributed in the US" on its website. I'd bet my last dollar it's also made in China. I like to buy US products where I can, but you'd have a hard time finding an OBD2 monitor that's actually made here, and I'm unwilling to pay 10x the price for something only "designed" in the US when it probably comes from the very same Chinese factory.
Great video as always Mark. I notice it looks like you drive a Toyota Tundra? I upgraded from my Tacoma to a Tundra just for towing our new fully loaded trailer of 7,000lbs. I’m trying to determine if it’s the right truck for the job or should of I brought a 3/4 ton. The Tundra has plenty of power, what concerns me is the payload. I’ve taken it on 4-5 trips now from mountain, Valley and coastal terrain. My concern is the bouncing around and movement the trailer does to the truck. It’s not a major problem but I also having been in any windy or stormy weather. Is there anything you did to your Tundra to make it a better tow vehicle?
Thanks Rick! Like you, we traded in our Tacoma for a Tundra when we bought our first travel trailer, which was similar in weight to yours. We were pleased with how the Tundra handled it We used a Fastway Equal-i-zer E2 weight distribution hitch, which minimized the chucking you describe and handled crosswinds rather well. We were concerned when we bought the fifth wheel which is 3,000 lb heavier, wondering how the truck would handle it, but it's done admirably. Sure, a 3/4-ton diesel would tow more efficiently and brake more effectively, but we're fine with keeping the Tundra for this year. Surprisingly the Tundra works a bit less and gets better fuel economy with the heavier fifth wheel than it did with the TT, likely due to aerodynamics. The only modification we made was to add airbags when we upgraded to the fiver, even though the truck squatted surprisingly little under load. However, we'll hit 150K on the odometer by the time spring arrives and when we do trade the Tacoma we'll likely go to a 3/4-ton diesel for the improved fuel economy, increase in power, and exhaust braking.
Mark, I have a trailer that is about half the GVWR capacity of my Nissan Frontier 6Cyl. I have had a trailer brake control installed and the truck is equipped with factory tow package. Am I working myself into a lather about mountain towing for no reason?
Yes and no -- how's that for an answer? To explain my thoughts, we originally towed our Evo with a manual transmission 2007 Toyota Tacoma V6, which had a towing capacity of 7,500 lb. On paper everything was OK. We were within our weight limits both dry and loaded (although loaded was pushing it). And we did that for a few months. However, what scared the living crap out of me was not the truck's ability to tow the trailer, but instead, it was its ability to STOP the trailer. I had one e-stop situation on the Interstate where I had left about 200' between me and the semi in front of me. The trailer's brakes were adjusted correctly, too. However, when traffic came to an unexpected halt and I hit the brakes, there was no way that the Tacoma was going to stop that freight train from rear-ending the semi. I was very, very fortunate that I had time to check and verify that the lane to the right of me was empty, change lanes, and bring the rig to a halt alongside the semi. That made me realize that it's not all about capacities and towing capabilities. The Tacoma just didn't have the mass to fight the pushing of the trailer. For a time I considered upgrading the Tacoma's brake system to something more robust than the OEM brakes, but I feared that towing the fully loaded trailer over big mountain passes was just too taxing on my beloved Taco. So instead of upgrading the brakes I traded the Tacoma in for a used Tundra. I still miss the Tacoma -- I could take that truck places that this Tundra could only dream of going. But overall I know that I made the right decision in the end.
@@GrandAdventure thanks for the followup. I enjoy your channel great info and production values. I will be in N.Georgia and Asheville NC later this summer and just take it slow no tailgating. Maybe a bigger truck when this lease runs dry in two years. Mostly flatland Florida other than this trip to the Blue Ridge. I'll keep watching.
@@timothybrown3558 and we very much enjoy having you here! I forgot to mention, that incident with the semi happened on a pancake-flat stretch of I-15 here in the Salt Lake Valley. If someone had changed lanes between us, or if the adjacent lane had been occupied, I shudder to think how that would have turned out. My heartbeat nearly escaped my chest wall for the next 10 minutes. In the meantime, maybe look into some high-performance ventilated rotors and brake pads for the Frontier? Just be careful out there! Know your limits and stay within them. Like I said, glad to have you here!
