Evan Turner and JJ Redick Passionate Debate On "Embracing Your Role" (w/ Andre Iguodala) 

This is a great convo because it ties into something that I have been confused by for the last 30 years of being an NBA fan. Why is it that certain guys get pigeon holed into a role that they are clearly capable of being more than their role, but if they try to break that mold they are "selfish"? For example. Kurt Thomas put up 30 PPG in division one college ball. This is practically unheard of. He was drafted by the Knicks late into the first round. I was watching every Knicks game that I could hoping to see this guy because I thought that the Knicks got an absolute steal. Coach Van Gundy wouldn't play him. Eventually Patrick Ewing got hurt in a game and VG had to put him in the game. Thomas is posting up, making solid moves, making his shots, his team is extending the lead and despite all of that, coach is glaring at him and barking at him after every play. Eventually Van Gundy yanks him out. Another Example. Brian Cook gets drafted by the Lakers. His rookie year he is fat and out of shape. He's playing behind Robert Horry and learning how Horry, who plays the same position, is helping the team with his 3 point shooting. Second year of Cook's career and he's in shape. He's shooting 3's really well in pre season and when the regular season comes, Phil Jackson will not play him. Again. Horry gets injured during the game and I believe Grant was already out. Cook is the only PF on the roster. Phil has to put him in half way through the first quarter. Cook is getting left wide open in his spots (same spots that Horry gets open shots). He shoots a wide open shot (just as any player would) and Phil Jackson is pissed. He's yelling at Cook every time he shoots the ball. Half time comes. The Lakers are up by 19. Cook is 5 for 7 from the 3 point line and Phil Jackson won't even put Cook back into the game. Phil played Rick Fox at power forward. After the game Jackson is talking about trading Cook. Cook never played another minute for the Lakers again and a week later he was traded to Orlando. Sorry for the long examples. But I genuinely want to know why some players are allowed to "break out" and other players are "selfish", even if they clearly have the talent to exceed the minimal role's that coaches prescribe for them?

@@Davivd2 im guessing it comes down to money, likeness of player, who brings in more money stuff like that and some coaches don't how to coach every single player,

@@Davivd2 cca 30 years of following NBA too. Great examples and there are tons of more like that.

This is why players need their own platforms. Great conversation. I hope these coaches and GMs are listening.

This was such a gooooood convo! Can’t wait to watch the whole ep. So insightful and honest about the decision to simply “play your role”. It’s always painted as the altruistic and “right” way to do things. Don’t get me wrong, for the most part, it is but it’s nice to hear players talk honestly about the impact that can have on a person, on maximizing your individual potential and on the trajectory of your career

Nigga you in the nba you better do what’s asked of you

That’s what happened to my dad. Nigga was the best football player VA back in the late 90s. The best at Fork Union. The best at UVA. Then turned into a 2nd string/3rd string player. I never asked him how that made him feel.

lets not pretend like the Coach and GM are perfect sometimes the GM gets a selection of talent that limits the capabilities of the individual players on the team and limits there success. sometimes the Coach uses rotations and plays because hes under pressure to stay on the stars good side while also making sure the talent the GM wants to trade gets minutes to add to there trade value. Never forget the 04 Pistons was a Fluke accident from a bad GM move ending up good Never forget Draymond doesn't have a career without a fluke accident The San Antonio Spurs and Pop have such a good reputation because for the last 23 years all they have done is develop who they got I feel Evan Turner that he could have been more than he was but instead they looked at his body and said "we can create a defensive mismatch" rather than utilize the talents he has had his whole life, what compounds the issue is every single NBA player looks like the GOAT in practice which enforces the feeling they have that "yall are just holding me back" and it must be maddening to go through even in the case were the Coach/Gm is right. for example Dwight Howard for all the trash we give him have you seen him in practice? in practice hes out there shooting like Dirk...

The problem with this scenario is that when your role gets shrunk at the pro level, then that typically means that your peers are better at that position. Even a Turner had his chance and was sub-par in every aspect of the pro game.

​@juicelord4792 not necessarily true at all. Sometimes it's just politics and coaches have their favorites. Even guys like Kobe was getting benched his first few years just because that specific coach didn't like young players. There are so many scenarios like that. Chauncey Billups and Kyle Lowry were on the verge of leaving the nba until they got coaches that gave them the opportunity to succeed.

Yea, why didnt they run a play for him!

Now taking in what he said think about how hard it is to win a championship. Makes me think how much players probably hate playing with certain superstars. Like LeBron, who's 1 of the greatest ever but he dominates the ball and his teammates are made to be catch and shoot players for him to be his best in attacking the basket. It's gotta be tough to be expected to make shots without a feel of the ball or a rhythm. We need to appreciate the others because without them your favorite player wouldn't win sh*t period

Love Evan Turner, always been hyper interesting to listen to. He really has a nice outlook on NBA things, speaks almost like a nba junkie with, at the same time, actual experience as a player.

@@TreeEl-gp2tx You nailed it. I always say that it's the role players that win championships. The stars are going to do what they do. But it's always the guys that are diving for balls, hitting clutch threes on a kick out pass, getting a clutch rebound that are that final piece that gets a team over the hump in the finals.

@@TreeEl-gp2tx least he past it cause Kobe was gone shot it regardless said it himself get the rebound

See, I think it also extended his career (Iggy) as well, because the league was going into a different direction with 3 and D shooters, so I don't know if I really believe he would be the second or 3rd best player at that point in his career. If you look at his numbers before GSW his number were already going down. So, I'm not necessarily buying that

@@michaelmcnally3813iggy isn’t someone who you stat watch bro. What you said to me is actually false because iggy went to the all star game 2012 then the next year helped an on paper average Denver team to the playoffs then joined the warriors and accepted a lesser role

@@Ballinbmac true, but his minutes were down, and he was going to play a lesser role wherever he went ( he was going to be the 3rd or 4th best player on any team he went too), because he wasn't an all star and he wasn't a shooter either and that's where the league was going. I mean, it was his 10th year in league by the time he got to the warriors. I love Iggy too and huge warriors fan

​@@michaelmcnally3813 Yeah I agree accepting that role has its own benefits but I think what Evan is getting at in this clip is the psychological toll being the 6-8th guy on a roster takes on guys who could be the 3rd or 4th guy on other (but not necessarily worse) teams. For Evan he spent 7 of 10 years on teams that werent really trying to win. Thats 7 years of training, dieting, traveling, showing up on time just to get in the game and take 5 shots and get bounced in the first round. Eventually you gotta start thinking what am I even doing here. For Andre I definitely agree his career could have been shorter as the league progressed but that begs the question would you rather have gotten 20 pts and lost in the first round or are you committed to scoring less but winning more?

My brother and I walked past this tall guy at lollapalooza one year, and it was actually Evan Turner. He was nice enough to take a picture with us, so shout out Evan Turner! 🎉

Good post

He did not say he hated the diminished role, he said that he diminished his career in order to help certain teams win. He knows he had to do that in order to adapt and stay 10 years in the NBA. If he woulve tried to force being a star he wouldnt have lasted 1 year in the NBA.

He wasn't the best athlete. He was slow and didn't have a great shot.

​@@josegabrielsanchez7938:20

For real. I can't imagine being one of the bes 0.00001%t in the entire world of 9 billion or whatever people at what I do, and be regulated to essentially "stand there and distract the other team from the star""

Especially toward the end. I was away from my phone and had to pick it up and look

Fair the the Dillion brooks comment was crazy. 60 percent of the guys in the nba shouldn’t be there then😅

The leader of the warriors dynasty

He has his own podcast called “Point Forward”

@@poptarts224 Dillion Brooks comments only scratches the surface of dumb Iggy takes. Just check out his views on social issues, yikes.

Appreciate this. Cheers.

That’s why I love iguodala podcast.

The Warriors would have won every single chip in their franchise history without Iggy. It might have been a little harder but they would have won them.

Big facts

​@@theoneafterthelastInteresting take. With that being said who would hav guarded bron?

Evan, T Mac, Grant Hill 😢

@@TheSportsandFilmFellowship T Mac and Grant Hill are HoFers lmao.

​@TheSportsFellowship Tmac never took a diminished role. Soon as he got to Magic he was the number one guy. Some might say he might have gave up opportunities to win championships because he just wanted to be the number 1 on a team and grant hill was definitely a star but injuries derailed his career

@@TheSportsandFilmFellowshipwhat are you talking about

@@TheSportsandFilmFellowshipdude, you are confusing a dream deferred, *with a lost opportunity* Evan gave up the flowers to play team first ball. TMac & Hill had injuries cut short their prime, like Zion & Lonzo today.

You a clown bigger than Turner. Turner sucked

Didnt get many fantasy points then lmao

@@The123carreracome on man

@@The123carreraunless you picked him up in 13-14 , you def didn’t get much from him lmao

He do be squeaking the truth

I took that as Iggy saw him higher up in the office, like a GM

*Why would you be a head coach?

​@@KreativeInstinctsame

I thought the same but he actually said why? As in your way better most likely.

@@KreativeInstinct He means that JJ has more influence and potential ways to make more money doing what he doing now as opposed to being a coach with less of a spotlight on him. Iggy only cares about the money so that's all he is thinking about.

💯💯

I always thought dude should have been a better player based on his skillset but hearing this it makes sense what he became

Evan Turner sucks.

It's all about what you want. I was always the best player on my team and could always score 30 but the role my team needed was for me to handle and distribute the ball. Yes I could have scored way more but we wouldn't have won as much if I didn't take the roll of a all around player and because I cared more about winning, I didn't care.

@@slimdigga9100 Did you play professionally though and did the role you have had affected your future salary and longevity of your career?

@@macieksz2829 not understanding at the time but in essence it could have. Because if I could have put up more, and better stats then I probably would have gotten way more scholarship offers that would have sent my life in a different trajectory. But because I had to tone down my skills maybe it did affect money I possibly could have made if I could have played at my maximum potential because I would have opened alot more doors. But I get your point about the NBA tho ijs

Evan had plenty of chances, especially after Iggy was traded. Team was built around Jrue and Turner. Jrue became an all star and Turner didn’t show any signs of improvement.

Thanks for watching.

@@daytonjohn777 -- Guess you would need to be 1 of the 5000 in history to participate to truly understand.

@@semi6544 True, but this happens in ALL levels of the game.

Really? You didn’t know there’s under-talented pro athletes who get by on being crazy? They’re in every sport.

@@k_hack9441 lets be honest, if youre good enough to play professionally, then we naturally assume that you have talent. What i didnt fully grasp was the mindset of telling yourself “im the greatest” just to stay in the NBA or other leagues as well.

Dillon was dropping 40 with 5 or more 3’s in college and dropped 40 on the nba, not to mention first and second all defense. iggy was just chatting and so are you 😂

@@TAYTHEWXVE.madeit ….just say you dont watch basketball, looking at box scores really dont tell the whole story. And youre really arguing against someone whos been in the league and won rings? Casual

Pat Bev was a prolific scorer in college and still able to get buckets in the league when he gets the chance. He just isn't the first or second scoring option on plays. His current % aren't even bad@@k_hack9441

He had that chance with the Sixers as a 2nd overall pick. He just wasn’t that good

wasn't athletic enough to compensate for his shooting. still think he could have been a bit better tho@@taj3618

​@@taj3618to be honest doug collins was the coach at the time and he litteraly sabotage him.

I’m from Boston and a C’s fan. I’m trying to figure out if I missed something in his game that you didn’t. I disliked him in green a lot.

Definitely

Great summary and analysis !!

Not just the explanation but the results as well. You can tell me all day why my role is important but if we suck then whats the point of me sacrificing my points, my stats, and eventually my money.

We weren’t tanking when Evan and Iggy were there. The “Process” started in 2014. When we traded Iggy in the Bynum trade, Evan was our 2nd best player next to Jrue. He never stepped up and simply wasn’t good enough.

@@officialthomasjames are you on that team? cause he said the franchise don't want to win games 🤣

​@@officialthomasjamesright these people forget so fast lol. We were 1 game away from the eastern conference finals in 2012

Evan was a star? LMAO. 2012-13 82 games played 2892 minutes: PER 12.2 (not all star) TS 48.8% (dreadful) WS/48 0.35 (dreadful) OBPM -2.2 (LMAO god u suck) DBPM -0.2 ( below average) Evan Turner was straight trash. Start to finish.

what kinda revisionist history lmao Evan turner was an extremely disappointing player and never a star Andre was also regressing three straight years averaging 14, 12. 13 before becoming a role player with the warrriors

Agree on Iggy. A star in decline before accepting his role-playership. On Turner, his high was not as high as Iggy, agreed, but that 2013-14 season, the 76ers traded high when he averaged 17/6/4 and was one of the team’s “big three” (for a losing team admittedly) with MCW and Thad Young. Anyway, my point is I believe him when he says that accepting more role-player type roles too early (mid twenties) when he felt he had the mental edge and the talent…is hard! And good coaches and GMs know what it takes to motivate their guys and get them not only to accept their role but also play the right role!

@@abdirahmanhassan1848 thank you. People love to bash the Sixers and are praising Turner. He had every chance in the world to become a star. He was a bust.

I hear Meatwad

😂😂😂 deadass 💯

Yeah nah I don’t hear your lil rapper what I do see though is that Jj was sold the left over pieces from Rogan old studio! Df are those background pieces in the set? Just random lines 😂😂😂

Or Kermit

autotune and everything 😂

The full ep goes about 95 minutes. So many great moments.

listened to them on Gils Arena and it may have been their best one....cant wait for this one....lets go @@JJRedick

Podcasters are lost to you?

​@@da11kingHe meant most

😂😂😂😂😂 I was wondering the same thing. This dude sounds like an 👽 🤣🤣🤣

Nickname is ET too💀

@@ThommyMckGoaty lmaoooo

it's one of the big reasons I absolutely hate tanking. it puts those players into just the worst place

Get DRose on here! And one more time after he retires so he can really tell some stories!

No 20 year career for role players except Udonis Harlem. Being a great role player can get 10 years. Being a great role player AFTER 10 years of being a very good player is more likely and even harder.

​@barronhall400 You're right, I was being too hyperbolic with the 20 year statement and should have said 10 in retrospect. Yet, I really wish teams had more veterans in todays league in a UD or Z-Bo type locker room presence situation. Even with diminished skillsets they could really help development. Most teams today got "vets" that are 28 years old cause of prioritizing youth rather than experience.

Number 2 pick in a weak draft out of Ohio State with projections of being a quality role player at best.

@@jamesonedwardsii4943 No he was not, He was a high level guard coming into the league where they were just getting started with accepting 6'7 PG's... In a draft with John Wall and PG... Stop.

@@OEThe11 shut up I’m not a fool to revisionist history. I watched him come up short at OSU. PG wasn’t a big prospect out of Fresno at all….. this was a draft with Udoh being selected as a rim protector at best, Derrick Favors a role player at best and Monroe a low post presence that didn’t do much else. The top prospects coming into the draft outside of John and Boogie were Xavier Henry and Wesley Johnson NEITHER being projected to be superstars. The ABSOLUTE ONLY reason ET went number 2 was because Boogies attitude dropped his draft stock….. the two guys projected to be super stars were Boogie and John no one else 🤷‍♂️

Big ten player of the year

@@jamesonedwardsii4943out of Ohio state supposed to be a Knock? They have a valid hoops program

#2 pick 9.7/4.6/3.5 on 43/29/78 Career negative on offense competent defender Are you sure about what you saying?. If he was a 15+ pick lottery sure, but #2?. That's a bust. That draft was trash too.

or, here me out, he wasn't good enough to be a lead creator/franchise type player. sometimes that's just the way it is. and if he had bought into that sooner maybe his career woulda lasted longer.

@@bigh92591 Facts. The amount of people I see in comments acting like this dude was good at the pro level is insane. Dude couldn’t shoot, or score at the NBA level consistently

What iggy said: Philly shouldn’t have drafted you. What iggy meant: you weren’t a legit #2 draft. Maybe his career could’ve been a step higher than the way it went. But let’s not pretend like he was anywhere close to All NBA.

ET wasnt a catch & shoot three guy... like he said he was a 6'7 point guard was midrange king & didnt get anyplays to himself to score

@@Arihiroki_LG dude averaged 26 minutes a game for his career and shot 43% to go with 9 points. Why tf would he deserve to have plays ran for him consistently? Also, damn near every team has a play designated for one of the key players with minutes, to say you have 0 is a damn lie.

Bro it’s a podcast what Evan said was compelling and eye opening. If he did what you’re asking this segment would be boring!

13:03 caught me so off guard