The fact these were actual power levels and not just like “if we had power levels it would be that x this” like in gt power scaling - shows the pure effort put into this. WE HAVE BUUS PL. great job scholar this is very cool
Something that could be said about the kili/kiri levels is that they could have a logarithmic factor. A 2.0 earthquake is 10x stronger than a 1.0 earthquake because log(100) is 2 while log (10) is 1, which means that a 3.0 earthquake is 100x stronger than a 1.0. This would explain how goku is only a 3000, as the lower levels are easier to increase.
Novice powerscaler here that Makes a lot of sense actually seeing on how bibidi ship was a literal death trap it make for Goku to have his base form at least 25% but Vegeta on the other hand is always on guard and ready for a fight and it stated that Goku and Vegeta were equal here when at 100%(not including ssj3) thus Vegeta should roughly be at 100% Goku's Stated Kili was 3k if my memory is correct assuming Goku was at 25% here making Vegeta Kili level 12k because 25 X 4 is 100 meaning 4 Goku's at 25% power would be equal to 1 100% Vegeta meaning TLDR Goku and Vegeta are OP
Power levels don’t seem to be tied to energy anyway. I tried to calculate what energy a power level is equivalent to using comparison with planetary destruction and got values differing by multiple orders of magnitude.
The fact that hercule is THAT strong makes him that guy fr lol..we all know he is a normal human but he survived all attacks from these crazy villains.
He DODGES attacks from Kid Buu. Let that sink in for a moment. SaiyanScholar puts his suppressed level at 120 million, but that might actually not do him justice.
<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="79">1:19</a>:30 - Wasn't Elder Kai's prediction that "you won't even need super saiyan" based on the assumption that Goku would be fusing with Gohan, not Vegeta?
What no dude, did you read the manga or watch the anime, he said it would drain his life if he fused while in super Saiyan, elder kai said to do it AFTER he transformed
As a person who started watching you for the pass couple of months I found all your content to be the best out there when it comes down to DB, DBZ, and DBS. Keep up the great work!
A great breakdown of power scaling. Although neglected and ridiculed by some, its great to have some kind of numerical measurement. Your video does a great service to those still keen on the numbers, particularly for those who cannot process the math!
How I handle Kibitokai is to give him a lower multiplier, based on a combination of a) plot needs him to be irrelevant, and b) it would support the idea of fusing two beings with widely different power levels having some kind of penalty. Fusion doesn't tolerate freeloaders. I like to think of him as being SSJ2 level, but not as strong as Goku and Vegeta. His ability to teleport (Kai Kai) and heal is far too valuable to risk sending him onto the battlefield, especially if he can't actually help. (Though... could he paralyze Kid Buu..?)
@@ragnarok7452 In universe there's nothing to suggest a multiplier to begin with. =) In universe fusion logic begins and ends with "the sum is a couple of orders of magnitude greater than the parts." Which leaves us with a huge amount of wiggle room to make up our own rules. It just comes down to headcanon really.
<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="2212">36:52</a> - The way I've always seen Grade 4 is that it's basically the non-wasteful version of Grade 1. The way I think about it is that Grade 1 super saiyan actually boosts your total power waaaaay beyond 50 times. However, it only adds up to 50 times because a significant percentage of that power is wasted due to lacking ki control. It flies off in all directions, causes oceans to ripple, clouds to part, etc. All of the power that is doing those things, for fighting purposes, is being completely wasted. What Grade 4 does (in my headcanon) is it means that instead of all of that ki flying off and being useless, it directs all of that ki purely into fighting. Basically allowing the super saiyan to use 100% of their boosted power. So if I had to put it into hypothetical numbers: Let's say that turning super saiyan actually boosts someone's power by 200 times. But let's say that with a person new to the form due to lacking ki control 75% of that power is wasted. It just flies off into the surrounding areas, parts clouds, moves oceans, keeping the super saiyan in their form, etc. and is useless for fighting. That puts the Grade 1 modifier at 50 times. But when you reach Grade 4 suddenly you are no longer wasting that 75% of power and you can use the full (or almost the full) 200 times boost. That also explains why it's so good for stamina. If you're leaking energy all over the place, that has to be exhausting you constantly. Whereas if you're only losing energy when you actually punch, kick and blast then that allows you to stay in the form pretty much as long as you want because when you're not doing anything almost no energy is being lost. And even when punching and kicking you're only using the exact amount of energy you want.
i like your analysis on the true power of super saiyan grade 1 although the only hole in the theory is that if that ki is causing oceans to ripple and clouds to part then that power isn't really being wasted that much since if it was due to a problem with ki control then namek would have been evaporated long before frieza said. basically if the ki is doing that it wouldn't really affect super saiyan grade 1 since it is causing rather minor damage to namek most of that ki is still within super saiyan grade 1 any ki lost isn't really significant since no planet was being destroyed
Daizenshuu 7 and Toriyama say 50x for SS 1 in general. In super they say it's tens of times. Not hundreds. Goku also has no reason to use grade 1 if it were different from grade 4.
Tien's tri beam, uses his life force to attack the lifeforce of the enemy and physically damage them. so the damage is also spiritual in a way. So it damages the opponets in cases where u think it wouldnt if you just looked at as energy attack that only harms the phyical
I've always wondered about Buucolo as well. Yes his power gains is very miniscule compared to just Super Buu - but I feel the mind of Piccolo would play a pretty interesting role here. Piccolo after all is a very experienced fighter as well as being one of (if not THE) smartest. Plus, he has trained Gohan many times - he should know Gohan's core combat fundamental and habits. I really do feel that Buccolo would have put up a decent fight vs Gohan (initially). I think an overlooked factor in why Gohan was so dominant vs Super Buu - was due to Buu not really having much formal combat skills (based on a humanoid-figure going hand-to-hand with another humanoid-figure) despite having so much power.
@@SaiyanScholar However, don't forget that Goku seems to suggest that Piccolo is holding him back somehow (see 1:13:47). Is it possible that he might have been *weaker* than just regular Super Buu? Budokai 2 at the very least indulged the idea that absorbing someone too weak would actually hinder his power rather than add to it, but of course, games aren't canon. This also isn't an idea I subscribe to, but it's worth mentioning.
Honestly I adore Tien, and have since his introduction back in DB. He was deffo the strongest human during the Cell Saga (not that that’s a high bar) considering he and Chiaotzu were in King Kai’s planet training longer than anyone else, even longer than Goku was. Chiaotzu’s potential for growth seems a lot less than the other humans’ but Tien I imagine definitely got mileage out of all that training. Not to mention he definitely went harder than Krillin or Yamcha did during the 3 year wait for the Androids. I remember a theory I read once that Tien “not knowing” Kaioken despite having been with King Kai so long is because he combines its properties with his Kikoho/Tri-Beam instead of using it like Goku does. Tien does mention during the Frieza arc that if he wants to surpass Goku (lol) that he’d have to “put his own spin” on things instead of just imitating Goku’s training and methods. I could see him taking the concept behind Kaioken and using it to pump up the Tri-Beam, explaining why it’s so strong when he uses it against Cell, but that’s of course just headcanon. Either way, the guy is legendary.
Great video WOW! Insane work! Good job! Am I the only one who appreciated power levels much more during the Sayan and Freiza sagas? Numbers like 22,000 are much better to read than 58,325,650,000,000
@@Arbron Freeza in general...lol .05% of Freeza power annihilates everyone during the sayain saga..Goku Namek arrival would only need .5% of his power.
As far as the Piccolo/Kami fusion goes, I think you pretty much got it. Kami was 220 when they split. King Piccolo was 260. Them fusing would be restoring that original entity to its full potential, granting a 1.85x power level.
I disagree with Power Domination Scale, although plenty of the other logic is sound. Of course most of this stuff is headcanons, & we do have to look at guidebooks (which aren't always accurate as many would argue was the case with Nappa) I would have started with the arrival of Raditz to form a baseline during the Saiyan, Namek, & Frieza Sagas rather than just the Frieza Saga as was done in the video. The guidebook claims Nappa was only 4,000 when fighting Chaotzu & Tien. Power Suppression wasn't really a technique that Nappa ever learned with most of Frieza's Army being unaware of it. Certain Attacks like Special Beam Cannon (Japanese Name is too hard to pronounce & remember spelling for) have special properties with a 1440 power attack of it being enough to mortally wound both Raditz (1500) & Goku which goes against your Domination Scale. Another good example of defying the scale in the manga was when Krillin used Kienzan (Destructo Disc) to cut off Frieza's Tail of course many will argue that both Frieza (1 Million) wasn't expecting the attack & his tail was significantly weaker than the rest of his body resulting in an attack less than 80,000 doing that. I'm personally of the opinion that Raditz got a Zenkai that boosted him from 1200 to 1500 right after he left Vegeta & Nappa to go to Earth alone which is an easy explanation for that. Comparing Goku vs Vegeta is 1 good case where the Domination Scale fails. Vegeta at Over 18,000 had the clear edge against Goku's Over 16,000 making him use Kaioken x3. Namek Saga gives further explanation for why it is possibly closer to 1.1x Starting to Overwhelm & Highend Domination happening before 1.5x in many cases. See 1st Vegeta vs Zarbon Fight & Vegeta vs Recoome for what I'm talking about & compare the power levels officially given. Vegeta was Over 30,000 yet Recoome was past Tanking Attacks Unhurt despite being stated less than 60,000 as you said that happens at double. Now that we have settled the basics you were a bit more generous with power levels than I was. Android Saga Goku was never actually healthy during the fight against 19 as suggested by Piccolo he was off the entire time he was Super Saiyan. I'm not 1 to give Billion Levels prior to Cell Saga & see that as clear overestimating. Androids 16-18 have the unlimited energy & there were obvious reasons Toriyama abandoned powerlevels after Frieza Saga, mostly he didn't want to worry about these numbers anymore & just wanted to focus on the story. Androids 19 & 20 (Gero) were much weaker than the Unlimited Energy Model with most of their power coming from absorbing it from stronger opponents. As for Piccolo I agree he likely got likely x4-x5 immediate multiplier from when he merged with Kami putting him at just above 17. As seen with Super Anime Tournament of Power it is reinforced that Kami (other half) & Nail were both special, although Piccolo also trained drastically more than his massively merged opponents. Super Namekian is just a title meant to say he can fight at the level of Super Saiyans. The amount of multiplier from Nail is arguable because we just know he got done training on King Kai's World & some headcanons I have seen had him get past 200,000 before merging with him on Namek even though your take of x20 is much more likely. Imperfect Cell was significantly weaker in Ginger Town compared to when he arrives to absorb 17. For starters I'm of the opinion that Future Cell (Our Cell as well) had power comparable to the future androids who were roughly equal to Future Trunks (200-240M). This is where overestimations of power scaling are broken such as what you were using unless you can justify the per human power increase as being enough, although I don't think it was that drastic. A lot of my estimates on the lower end are about 10% of what you have which gets drastically higher than my highend estimates for powerscaling. My Low End (Which I tend to favor) is that Androids 17&18 are 280-300 Million, Ginger Town Cell 250-280 Million, Piccolo 330-360 Million, A16 400-450 Million, Island Imperfect Cell 400-420 Million, Semi Perfect Cell 700-720 Million, Perfect Cell 1 Billion. Your scale treats every saga like Frieza Saga increases. The numbers on your list get so ridiculously high that I have to give up on watching the video.
I actually mostly agree with you. The hardline rule of following power scaling doesn’t work for me because we’ve seen Vegeta at 24000 dominate base Zarbon & Dodoria at 23000 & 22000 respectively I think your estimates are the best of most I’ve seen while my estimate are slightly higher. 17 & 18 being in the billions is crazy to me. I have the SSJ Vegeta at about 260 mil before the HTC with Goku right behind him (if healthy) and Piccolo a distant 3rd before fusing. 17 & 18 at around 450 mil & 440 mil. Imperfect Cell at 360 mil. Piccolo fused at 475 mil. Imperfect Cell after absorbing people at 500 mil. 16 at 525 mil. Semiperfect Cell at 750 mil, etc etc These are my rough estimates but I think you’re mostly right
This powerscaling is also crazy as it means SSJ Gotenks was over 5x more powerful than SSJ 3 Goku. A punch from SSJ 3 Goku to SSJ Gotenks wouldn't even tickle Gotenks based on this power scale🤨, forget SSJ 3 Gotenks. Same thing with Kid Buu against Super Buu. Super Buu is then almost to Kid buu what super saiyan is to base. SSJ Gotenks would absolutely demolish kid Buu then.
@@Reivaz88 That's true. I feel they may be a bit inflated at the least. But undoubtably SSJ Gotenks would have to be a lot more powerful than SSJ 3 Goku to do damage that Goku didn't even think he could achieve against Super Buu. So from a powerscaling perspective, SSJ 3 Gotenks>>>>SSJ 3 Goku based on what the Anime implied. But probably not as much as this video implies.
<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="63">1:03</a>:35 I don’t think it’s ever implied or stated that 17 got to near Super Saiyan Blue or Super Saiyan 3 levels of power in almost 10 years doing nothing. I think the general consensus among the DB community is that due to 17 having unlimited stamina he could train for as long as he wanted at max power when he wasn’t working or being with family.
@@zaidenbrown4356 It raises many questions (with no answers) no matter how you slice it, really. 17 and 18's powers are artificial in nature, meaning there's no reason to suspect they can even "train" them. They might still be able to train their *human* asepcts, but in that case they would start developing a ki signature that can be sensed. A line of dialogue confirming that would have been nice. Otherwise, by "filling in the blanks" we are pretty much doing the writer's job for them, in some ways *better* than them... and for no paycheck!
@@Arbron I always just chalked it up to 17&18's enhancements simply being massive force multipliers on their organic selves. In theory, this would also mean that the effect of training would be subject to the same amplification, and would likely mean you would need less training to reach higher highs. Although we also see that 18's growth is relative to her brother's as well, but still smaller in the ToP, so it could also be that the perpetual growth was simple a part of Gero's design for them, at least in the timeline we follow, not so sure about the timeline Trunks was from TBH, since we know things are different there.
I agree with your assessment for the most part. Except for SSJ Goku Grade 4 against Cell during the Cell Games. That fight was awesome. Cell was still suppressed and stronger than Goku. Yet, he was caught off gaurd with the instant Kamehameha wave. It blew off the upper part of his torso and created a retcon that was then corrected. Goku performed quite well during that fight and counter all of Cell's techniques. It was only after Cell regenerated that Goku was fucked up by him. Cell started dominating Goku at that point. Granted Cell himself was tired too. Just not as much as Goku. So even though suppressed Cell was stronger, the gap could not have been as wide. Otherwise he wouldn't have had his head and torso blown off by Goku
Its kind of poetic how every main villain in the OG series gets a set of numbers greater Piccolo - Hundreds Vegeta - Thousands Frieza - Millions Cell - Billions Buu - Trillions
I'm just going to pick on a few random things. Gotenks is definitely stronger than Super Boo from a raw power standpoint. This is implied at least twice: first, when Gotenks escapes from the Hyperbolic Time Chamber, he makes a clearly bigger hole than Super Boo did. Second, Gotenks was about to obliterate Super Boo just before the fusion ran out, proving he was able to overpower him. Another thing: I agree than SSJ3 Gotenks is stronger than SSJ3 Goku, but not *50 times* stronger. That's just crazy.
The more frustrating thing is instead of wishing goku get his full power back or trying to use the spirit bomb ... why not just wish ultimate gohan to where the fight was after he was brought back.
The narrative needed him (and Gotenks) out of the way. Simple as that. If you think about it, Kid Buu was screwed from the start. Say he kills Goku and Vegeta, destroys the World of the Kais, teleports to Otherworld... and comes face to face with Gohan and potentially Gotenks. Happy ending. Also, didn't Goku outright suggest having those two help only for Vegeta to shoot the idea down? It's a poor excuse, but it wouldn't be the first time "they need to take care of themselves" was used to handwave away a much smarter strategy. In fact Toriyama probably did that on purpose. He knew the situation he'd written himself into. Probably the same reason (besides narrative drama) he had Goku scheme to have Gohan kill Cell. If they'd spent another day in the time chamber, they'd likely have come out with enough power to just kill Cell and be done with it. Instead, Goku wanted Gohan to do it because "I won't be around forever."
I always kind of assumed Friezas mecha parts allowed him to use his 100% power with more control and not bulking. Just my head cannon/implied since it removes the need for reasoning why he stronger than his bulky namek self. In my head 2 choices. Either his new non-bulky form is simply stronger than his bulky namek self. Or his new parts let him exert his 100% without transforming. Those 2 make the most sense rather than guessing if he's surpressed
Yeah that makes more sense ...in turn lowering Trunks' pw level and the rest of the android saga. I always thought that the androids (17&18) we're 3-4X that of Freeza. So more like 300m-500m.
@@thediaz07 Well not nessicarily. Remember, the android's were stronger in this main timeline. And the z-fighters were already rivaling several of frieza's forms. Then TRAINED FOR THREE whole years before the androids came up. Thats right, TRAINED. Remember how strong goku got in the hyperbolic time chamber in just 1year? Well they trained for 3. THey got insanely strong comparitively to when the Mecha Frieza fight occoured. Meaning the androids were dozens, if not hundreds of times stronger than frieza
@@Telarius I have a problem with power scaling during the years that we're not shown...we had MANY stagnant years in DragonBall where there power levels didn't double at all..going off DBZ we can't really estimate there power ups like when they were fighting the next immediate threat.
<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="61">1:01</a>:50 *SAME,* I call it that as well and I loved Budokai 2, it was *GREAT.* However, I think this is the most accurate the power levels can ever be. I appreciate *ALL* the effort and information you gathered to make this video. I seen a power level listing years ago and they were no where near these *INSANE* power scalings or as accurate and believe it or not I actually talked and convinced people these were the power levels lol. How wrong was I. Next time, I'll show them this video...because *WOW* they were waaay more powerful than I expected, but it makes sense. Seeing you show off how powerful *GT Goku* was and you convincing me that he is the strongest Goku without a doubt...I just simply agreed, numbers and evidence don't lie. But let me finish the video. I'm almost done as you see lol.
I think he highballs powerlevels too much, even my highest end list doesn't make the Kamehameha that killed Cell get past 20 Billion. It's like every increase is Frieza Saga levels here & it is clear that Akira Toriyama didn't want to deal with numbers like this when abandoning them. Does video uploader think Cell Power Unlocks (Grand Elder Guru did this) his victims inside of him or something?
@@WaterKirby1994 I agree. I don't think Super Saiyan makes sense as a straight 50x multiplier. It makes calculations a lot crisper, but it doesn't fit with the evidence.
Well cell leaned away from the final flash at the last moment, what was destroyed was the part of him that got hit. There was nothing shown to imply he could raise his power level in a couple seconds.
The one thing I always check for in these videos is if people think buff boo was weaker than kid boo, if they do think this, they are completely invalid. Thank you for doing your research is what I'm trying to say.
I don't see the logic in equating Earthlings with Freeza's level. It's evident that Earthlings have limitations in terms of their potential for power level growth. Besides, the Ginyu Special Forces have always been renowned throughout the universe as the strongest after Freeza. How could mere Earthlings be on par with their level through traditional training? Earthlings are considered a weak race in the Dragon Ball universe. Android 19 confuses Yamcha's ki with Goku's, possibly based on the data he had about Goku before his trip to Namek, which was around 8,000. I believe this is a more realistic estimate of his power level. Kuririn and Tien would likely have slightly higher power levels than that, but still significantly below Ginyu and his team.
So for absorbing the humans- he’s either able to absorb their potential power, so what they would have after training, or is highly effective and efficient at absorbing energy so can multiply power absorbed. So if he absorbs a PL of 5 his body can squeeze 20 out of it.
<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="3509">58:29</a> I have a problem here, I read the whole Thing and it says “According to dabura 200-300 kili is enough to destroy a planet. If kili is 50 thousand then damnnnn frieza’s first form is 10,000,000 (he blew up planet vegeta in his first form) so yeah that v-jump thing is confusing. maybe kili isn’t a specific number just a different type of ki? <a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="66">1:06</a>:22 I also have a problem here because (at least in the anime Idk about the manga) it is stated that you need equal power as the other person to perform metamoran fusion that or the stronger one lowers their power to match the weaker one, so your multiplier only works for potara fusion. The correct multiplier for metamoran fusion would a or b squared (depending on whose weaker) x100
I wonder what Cell with his absurd regeneration ability and the Sayian Zenkai boost could have become if he didn't use the Gallick Gun or Kamehameha but the Kikohou instead. He would hurt himself with every attack. Potentially putting himself near death. Then his regeneration could kick in and he would get stronger, leading to an even stronger Kikohou the next time he uses it and another power boost to go with that.
LMFAO 😆😆, Hercule is probably 2/3 of Raditzs power AT BEST....in Super not Z...being realistic Hercule is probably like a 100 PL. Mind you Roshi was less than 250 when he blew up the moon 😮😮😂.
@@camillepradeaux9130 probably...we could do some weird head canon ish and pretend that Boo gave him some extra power from when he was revived by Fat Boo. (He got shot by those 2 guys who went to try to kill Boo). Bc Hercule was able to take a few punches from Kid Boo without dying . So maybe end of Z Hercule is around 1-5k. p.s. I really don't think theory of mine is true but it would help explain how Hercule was able to not die instantly from a kid Boo punch.
I like how in the numbers at <a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="82">1:22</a>:22 the "strong energy blasts" are both shown 1,000x weaker than they should be.
Pui Pui,Yakon, and Dabura are meant to represent the main villains of the previous sagas in terms of power. Pui Pui brags about moving in 10x gravity and is beaten by Vegeta in his base form. Goku requires Super Saiyan to beat Yakon. Gohan needs ssj2, and still can't beat Dabura, showing how far he's fallen since the Cell Games.
@<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="1658">27:38</a> pretty dope that Base Vegeta in the Android Saga is as powerful as 100% Freiza in the Namek Saga.
I remember when I was a kid I used to write all of the power levels of the later sagas in a notebook according to things I read on the internet about how SSJ 2 was "times 50" and SSJ 3 was "150" or whatever. As I've gotten older I feel Toriyama stopped caring about power levels and it really doesn't matter anymore. I guess it's interesting other fans got a similar joy out of coming up with imaginary numbers.
The manga is THE version though. The anime is just for the half fans. Come on everyone knows this is the actual truth whether it’s admitted or not. Collecting the manga is one of the highlights of this entire franchise for me. I wish they would put the GT and Super in suitcase sets
<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="75">1:15</a>:00 "Oh, man. Mr Satan's not exactly a warrior... and his lack of understanding of our energy could hurt too. But he DOES know basic martial arts..." -Goku, English dub Attaboy, Goku! You know a good fusion partner when you see one. #GokuleIsCanon
I always wonder where people get these multipliers and numbers from. Like theyre completely made up but somehow its still interesting to hear their interpretations. cool vid
They get super saiyan multipliers from non-canon guides. The "how dominant someone is over someone else" multupliers are usualy based off the fights in the saiyan-frieza saga when there were stated power levels.
@@deckzone3000 Google: Yes. The original Dragon Ball manga, the Jaco manga, and Dragon Ball Super (movies included) is the definitive canon of Toriyama's story. Both the DBS anime and manga are canon and simply tell different continuities of the same canonical story, but they are both supervised by Toriyama
i like the tameness of your multipliers, but i think i have to point out i don't think goku got nearly that big of a power boost in the 3 year skip before the androids, and you overshot gero and 19's power significantly because of it. that sent your whole calculation out of whack. p cell at 2-3 bill and buus at 8 bill + is more than plausible, and much more reasonable and "realistic" based off of power displayed.
@@originalgreatdouchebag2866 I think that only works if you ignore Toriyama's statement that Goku was 50x stronger after Super Saiyan. That's reasonable.
While I do think post-saiyan power Vegeta was above 3rd form Frieza, you're definitely right about him being an unreliable narrator when it comes to sensing the enemy's ki and comparing it to his own. Perfect Cell is the *perfect* example. Ironically he actually assessed the situation more accurately against an enemy *who couldn't even be sensed* (Android 20) than one right standing right in front of him.
Super interesting stuff compiled here. Though I've gotta wonder.. when F. Trunks returned to his timeline to dipose of F. 17/18 - what if he decided to go Grade 3? Obviously his power would further eclipse them so much more - but will his speed decrease be enough for the Androids to evade Trunks long enough until Trunks gasses out? Something tells me that if Trunks even gets close to either of them - his over-radiating surge of Ki would simply vaporize them 😅
He found out how slow he became with perfect cell and that fight so I would think that he’d smarten up by the time he returned. Anyways Grade 2 is enough for them. Vegeta mopped the floor with semi perfect cell so regardless, he wouldn’t use it
@@SonGoku-wd4mi Also it's not exactly clear if Trunks and Vegeta are using 1st or 2nd grade at the Cell Games so he might have just abandoned the idea altogether. At any rate he wouldn't have needed it. Vegeta gets all the glory, but Trunks was "almost" as powerful as him, after all. Regular SSJ would easily pull through, especially since he'd spent a second year in the time chamber.
Using your math, and assuming the tri beam gives a multiplier of 100-1,000 (it does drain life force after all) gives Cell Saga Tien a max power level of 150 million (SS Goku on Namek) to 15 Million depending on the multiplier of the tri beam. 15 Million seems very reachable for the humans considering what Piccolo & Gohan achieved. Him reaching 60 Million would only require the multiplier to be 250x
<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="1658">27:38</a> but if grade 2 is a x4.3 boost from grade 1 and you kept ssj2 at a x2 boost from grade 1 then why would anyone not use the former? it doesn't reduce speed but increases it and I'm pretty sure it doesn't have significant stamina drain so am I missing something here?
Honestly, the SSJ grades kind threw me off a little bit, in my view grade 2 and 3 should be lower than 2x multiplier since thats the SSJ 2 multiplier, otherwise according to your own calculations gohan SSJ 2 would be weaker than gohan SSJ grade 2 since grade 2 gave a 4.3x, would he waste more energy fighting cell? Of course, but vegeta and trunks were shown fighting perfectly fine and even dominating semi-cell withouo getting tired, and considrering cell max power is the one stated on the video gohan grade 2 would be overkill, goku grade 2 would be more than enough, and if you think enough even vegeta or trunks could give perfect cell a run for his money in grade 2 after the second time chamber
Yh I never understood why he gave Grade 2 and Grade 3 SSJ that much power x amp, clearly with that much raw power all the Saiyans could have just gone SSJ Grade 3, which where they all power up their best final attacks blasting Cell to oblivion, no? I always thought the whole point of SSJ2 is that it harnessed the power of SSJ Grade 3 but was actually useable in terms of mobility, hence the electricity around the Ki aura empathising the pure speed + mobility with the brute strength of SSJ Grade 3, my head cannon of SSJ Grade 2+3 has always been x75 and x100 respectfully, I think he forgot to index for Cell suppressing his power, Cell doesn’t need to be full power from the get-go like Frieza for example he didn’t go 100% straight away and toyed with his prey, however with all that being said I still commend him for his great work he put into this video
Imagine being a full grown man coming to the realisation that a teenager has a power level in terms of billions,gohan really was something special,only if he had his head in the game from the start,he might have even won.
Vegeta went from 2 million on namek to 1.2 billion as a SSJ fighting Android 19, with base power around 24 million. So a 12x increase in base power, 600x increase overall in the span of a few years...That's insane.
Lol was Korin's final scene in Dragonball Z just of him sussing out Cell's power level for Goku...? Im thinking he appears later but I literally couldn't recall any scenes, maybe a quick cameo during the Kid Buu Spirit-Bomb final fight?
... Huh. I recall he appeared when Goku went to get a senzu bean for Videl, and he warned him about the coming threat of Majin Buu, though not by name. Hence why Goku has multiple senzu beans left over after healing Videl.
@@Arbron lol well my point still stands, at best its a ending cameo scene...Korin literally has throwaway dialogue within their exchange(at the end of episode 217), this is almost ver batum, " Goku better not use those all at once, cause reason's!" Worded by Dende, Roshi, Yajirobe, wouldn't have changed any of its meaninglessness bc its still highly irrelevant being a dumb trope of take this its dangerous to go alone out there cliché. Yeah Korins last big contribution to the Z warrior's still seems to be during the Cell Games. Fr I only was trying to bring attention that for being one of Earth's sagely beings there's never a big contribution or an interaction w/Dende or Popo w/Korin, even Roshi(or any other protagonist?)who had literal history with Korin, his trials and the Super Divine Holy Water never interact again...idk lol
i ran the first dragonballz website and your numbers are spot on even with anime they isn't much difference. the piccolo part i have a different opinion. First off piccolo is realistically the batman of DBZ. He didnt need to suppress his power i believe he slowly released ki when gero was clasping his mouth. I ask a question who was OG of mouth ki blasts its piccolo he only let gero take what he wanted him to take because say it with me scholars PICCOLO IS A GOD DAMN VETERAN
