the Asgard are not using ZPMs tho. Their form of Energy production is most likely way more advanced than ZPMs given that the Asgard were contamporaries to the Ancients but when the Ancients left the Asgard remain to improve their technologies. The Asgard as shown towards the end of SG1 are very much on a completly different point in their development than the Federation is in Star Trek. There is quite frankly nothing more for them to achieve except fixing their cloning tech. But that is the one thing they can not do.
@@jensreiberg8086 The Asgard used a power source known as a Neutrino Ion Generator. Not sure how many the O'Neill has but it was said that a ZPM would offer no additional benefit to power on the ship. So while the NIG, or multiple, was as powerful as a ZPM, it was not quite on the same level as a ZPM.
@@PupSentinel the last sentence contradicts the prior facts does it not? But in general that is exactly what I meant the Asgard do not need ZPMs they can very easily cover their own powerneeds
Asgard warships can take multiple hits from Ori primary weapons fire. Starfleet wouldn't stand a chance against a species that's been in space for thousands of years.
That doesn't mean much because Starfleet shields are DESIGNED to counter high energy beams to start with AND they HAVE gone up against species that have been in space for thousands of years. UFP is comprised of over 150 member species... some of which like the Vulcans were in space for a few thousand years and UFP's level of progression is ridiculously fast. The Dominion predates the Federation by 2000 years, and they were both pretty much equal in most level of technology - plus the Dominion needed the help of the Cardassians AND the Breen too. The Borg predate the UFP (and most species) by more than that... and they assimilated over 10,000 advanced species in the Galaxy and incorporated their technology into theirs. The UFP lost badly at Wolf 359, but then a few years after that, they were able to incur heavy damage on a cube and destroy it. VOY was able to go up against Borg probes and spheres... and it even used hit and run tactics against a Tactical cube (just long enough to get away team onboard before they ran away). VOY was also able to destroy a Borg Queen's Diamond vessel while it was in Transwarp with 6 torpedoes (though granted, they collapsed the TW conduit in the process which probably helped in crushing the ship). Just because species were in space for thousands of years, it doesn't mean SF can't go up against them. And also, Photon torpedoes have a blast zone of 300km... this can only be achieved with a yield of 27 GT (in space). SG Earth gatebuster missiles which are used on their ships top out at 1.2 GT... and these in combination with rail guns of the 20th century were able to pose threats to both Goa'Uld and Wraith ships (wraith ships even got destroyed by just being hit by 1 such weapon). If 1.2GT is enough to bring down a hive ship by detonating against their hull, what do you think 13 to 27 GT of antimatter explosion would do them? Even the Ori would have a much harder time defending against volleys of 27G photons and 54GT Quantum torpedoes (plus volleys of about 5 to 10GT per phaser shot).
In-universe the Asgard have been a space faring civilisation for a very long time (millions of years) and by the time the O'Neill class rolled out they likely were the most advanced ships to be seen in the milky way (until the Ori). The mod version of the ship is probably underpowered if anything.
The Asgard were stated to have 100,000 years of written history- The Ancients were Millions of years old...the Asgard ships were more advanced than the last Ancient ships ie Pegasus Wraith War era ships
I mean, Asgard shields were able to resist an Ori beam weapon during that first big Milky Way battle. They were a very advanced race, but I would assume their shielding/defensive tech was some of the best in the Stargate universe (maybe Ancient technology was slightly better)
Well this is said about the Biliskner... But the O'Neill is much more powerful. "The Biliskner is powered by four neutrino-ion generators. In your Earth units of measurement, each engine outputs a maximum of one billion kilojoules." by Thor. The O'Niell class was able to travel from the Ida galaxy to the Milky Way within a few hours and in one episode travel 1,200 light years, with the Prometheus in tow in a short handful of seconds. But Starfleet ships (Voyager for example) would take them 75 years to go from the Delta Quadrant to Earth.
One billion kilojoules per generator (of which there are 4) is extremely small number though. The enterprise d warp core was stated in tng episode q who to be rated at 12.7 exawatts. In effect, the warp core of the enterprise d would only have to be in operation for 0.0787 microseconds to generate 1 billion kilojoules. If the Asgard are powered by 4 such reactors, then the warp core on the enterprise d is ridiculously superior energy source. The power source of course is not directly tied to FTL propulsion advancement. Warp drive is simply a slower method of FTL propulsion Vs the hyperdrive (and warping space-time itself is also extremely power demanding). However, quantum slipstream V2 was rated at 10,000 LY's per minute, which is even faster than Apollo ZPM enhanced hyperdrive (and state of the art Asgard hyperdrives are probably as powerful as ZPM enhanced Tau'ri hyperdrive since it took them the same time to ferry Dr. Weir back to Atlantis from Earth). In terms of weapons, shields and power generation, I think starfleet is the actual winner here. Starfleet also makes extensive use of subspace technology to radically increase the power output of their technology well into the gigaton range (27 GT for photon torpedo because it has a canon stated blast zone of 300km.... That kind of blast zone in space can only be achieved with 27gt explosion). Meanwhile quantum torpedoes are at least double the yield (Tau'ri Gatebusters and tactical nukes enhanced with Naquadah top out at 1.2 GT - which is 22.5 times LESS powerful than a SINGLE photon torpedo). Sorry, but if Tau'Ri rail weapons and gatebusters were able to inflict heavy damage to Goa'Uld, Wraith Hive ships and Asuran/Replicator Ancient warships, just what do you think would Starfleet's weapons do to them?
@@tigerbread78 the Federation advances far faster than Stargate races(aside from Earth absorbing Goauld, Asgard and Ancient tech) I actually do wonder and think 32nd cen Federation might contend with Asgard. 6-800 years after warp(29th cen) the federation had mastered time manipulation after all.
@@Altenarian The Asgard are a space faring species for at least 30.000 years when they constructed the Oneill class. Starfleet is in space for like 200 years. even in the 32nd century Starfleet has just 1000 years in space. The Asgard had less conflict in space and conflict breeds innovation but these numbers really don't work in favor of Starfleet at all. The Asgard also had interlectual exchanges with the Ancients and the Nox (at least)
@@bloodnin I'm so sorry I would never intentionally disrespect my teddy bears! We just know next to nothing about them so I simply forgot.. shame on me
😨wow Admiral.. I like the Excelsior refit.. very nice and style.. and weapons. The Asgard, seen it once in the show, tried to catch up but so many seasons gosh lol. That ramming part and the Asgard ship held, crikey.. wicked lol. I saw how tech advanced the Asgard were in the show and I would say, they have been around for a long time and updating their ships and tech cause of the Replicators but, hmm in the game , they were tough but in show I wonder.. hard to say..!! love the battle as always Admiral.!!😊🖖
I love the Excelsior Refit design. I was surprised the quantum torpedoes had no effect either. However...based on what we saw in Stargate SG-1 and Atlantis the Asgard weaponry and shields were pretty much unstoppable. So I do believe this is accurate and that Starfleet ships wouldn't stand a chance. Although....perhaps if a Starfleet ship was powered by a ZPM then it might be a game changer.
Most people saying the asgard ships would one shot a federation vessel because the asgard have been in space for so long or because their ships are so fast. I don't think either argument is very convincing personally. In star wars for instance hyperspace travel has been a thing for about 30,000 years, but technological progress is extremely slow. KOTOR is 4000 years before the movies, and there's practically no difference in the apparent level of technology. The Ori appear roughly on the level of the ancients technologically despite 50 million years to advance. The goa'uld were also technologically stagnant for thousands of years before Anubis came along. Compare that to the rate of advancement we see in trek, where humans go from first powered flight to first warp flight in just 160 years, to a couple centuries later leading one of the most advanced and influential civilizations their side of the galaxy. Between the 24th and 29th century tech advanced enough that a tiny personal vessel like the Aeon nearly destroyed a top of the line starship like Voyager. Using propulsion as a metric to judge combat capability never made a lot of sense to me. Sure, strategically being faster helps, but it isn't everything. Most cars can outrun a tank, but that doesn't mean they're more powerful in any way. The Millennium Falcon is certainly faster than any federation ship, but that doesn't mean it can outfight them. The shuttle Cochrane was for a time the fastest ship in the universe, but that never meant it could take on a borg cube. Voyager used on separate occasions a borg transwarp coil and a quantum slipstream drive to increase it's speed by a few orders of magnitude, all without increasing it's energy output. Hyperdrive is more efficient by far than warp, but that's the only real advantage the asgard ship has. Per Thor in Nemesis and Data in True Q, The old Bilisknir class ships had a total energy output of 4 petawatts, vs the Enterprise-D's warp core output of 12.75 billion gigawatts, or 12,750 petawatts. It may be a million times more efficient to open a portal into hyperspace than to bend space time around a ship, but as far as shields and energy weapons go, there's no way to get more power out than you put in. Even if a Galaxy class was only putting 1% of it's warp core output into shields, and a Bilisknir class put 100% of it's power into weapons, the galaxy would still be defending with 32x more energy than the asgard were attacking with. Now obviously the O'Neill is a lot more powerful than the Bilisknir class, maybe 5-10x as powerful, but it's sure not 3200x as powerful, and even then it would only put them on par with federation ships during TNG.
I'm not sure about those numbers, as the Husnok hit the Enterprise D with 400 Gigawatts of energy and took out its shield. Though, to be honest, the numbers and power scales given in early shows and seasons probably won't line up with what is seen and said later in the show, as the writers get more of a feel for the show, and as more lore is developed.
you really can not just compare the numbers in the energy output since both writers only used an absurd high number. it is out of question that the Asgard are more advanced in technology than the Federation is. The Asgard are able to create timemanipulating fields that can speed up or slow down time in a limited space. At the end of their existence they were even able to reverse time in that field. Asgard shielding is also shown to fully contain a solar burst while the Deadalus parked right in front of a star. The weaponry is the worst aspect of Asgard technology but even in that regard they were able to adapt to a change in need quite rapidly. As shown in the jump from the initial battle with the Ori at the Supergate and the subsequent development of the Asgard-Beam-Weapons that could easily take out Ori ships. You want military applications: The Asgard could easily put any Federation vessel in temporal jail and just advance another 10.000 years while the federation vessel only experiences like a couple of days. The Asgard are shown to quite easily be able to explode their own planet. that destructive power should be enough to destroy a galaxy Class ship. The shielding is superior to everything we see in Star Trek. Within TNG we see at least 2 klingon Bird of Prey and one Borg vessel being destroyed by mass ejections of stars. The BoPs in the klingon civil war and the Borg ship by Beverly Crusher and the Enterprise. At the Same time we see a Tau'ri ship with Asgard shielding sustaining and surviving a Mass ejection. The Deadalus was powered by a ZPM in that instance but since the Asgard and the Ancients were spacefaring at the same time and were very much in an interlectual relationship it is highly doubtful that 10.000 years after the Ancients created the ZPMs the Asgards were not able to generate similiar amounts of energy. (in Stargate we know that they know everything the Ancient repository knew.) I want to reiterate that when comparing cross IPs it is very missleading to just take the numbers the writers came up with at face value since the writers usually just try to create an absurdly high number. I find it way more interesting to compare the respective roles of shown technology within their stories. In a number comparison Star Trek has higher numbers and Star Wars has even higher numbers still. 6 Bioships of species 8472 can destroy a planet in one burst. 1 Bioship can not oneshot Voyager but most likely 2 shot her. so if we assume that voyager used all her power to survive the hit (which she did not since she went to warp right after so there was obviously power left) according to reddit a galaxy class starship has a shield strenght of 750,000 Kilo joules.(this should be a higher output than voyager has) The Death star can destroy a planet (not unlike the bioships) but the Deathstar needs 6.2x10³² joules to destroy a planet that is 82.6x10²³ times the power of a galaxy class star ship. when we look at those power differences there is no way a bioship could destroy a planet within Star Wars and there is no way any Ship could survive a hit of even only 1 percent of the Death Star within Star trek. So I usually prefer to compare it like this. Both the Bioships and the Deathstar are shown to destroy a planet so their primary weaponry can be compared. but if you just look at the numbers in the scripts they obviously can not be compared at all. When compared within their respective Ips the Asgard should have the edge due to their sheer massive technological superiority. When compared at the real word than there is not even a contest a shuttle (Star Trek) could single handledly destroy everything that exists in Stargate.
@@jensreiberg8086 yeah but then you've got Atlantis city shield being burned out by containing the explosion of an overloaded stargate, which we know from redemption to be 2 or 3 gigatons. That's like 47 photons or 17 quantum torpedoes. Arguably the Enterprise E tanked more than that in Nemesis. Certainly the Daedalus is not tougher than Atlantis with multiple ZPMs, therefore there's no way it should have tanked a CME. See this is the problem with going off feats. You'll varying have some that make the same faction look ridiculously weak and ridiculously OP. We could just take the example of the Omarion nebula battle where we saw a handful of disruptor and torpedo shots destroy half a planets surface in a few seconds and say that alone proves they'd win. Feats are inconsistent. When a writer writes a scene like that they're not whipping out a calculator to do all the math and make sure it fits, but the person writing in hard stats is thinking about those things. To disregard those numbers for a fan calculation after the fact is just ignoring actual Canon for fan fiction. I'm Comparing apples to apples. Also the federation could absolutely destroy a planet in the same manner as the asgard homeworld. They did develop a phase cloak, imperfect yes but it was a prototype. Rig one of those up to a runabout sized automated weapon, with a huge antimatter containment vessel, load up 30 or 40 tons of antimatter, however much it would take, fly it to the centre of the planet and deactivate it. They have the means, they'd just never do it.
@@SkywalkerFilms1927 The Hushnock vessel was a mind recreation from the DauW'd. Also, in Trek, power outputs are more than adjustable, and SF also uses subspace technology to radically enhance the power output of their energy source, shields and weapons. Photon torpeodes per canon have a blast zone of 300 km... this can only be achieved with a yield of 13 GT on a planet, or 27GT in Space (since they are space weapons, then 27 GT is more in line). SG gate busters top out at 1.2GT and those nuclear missiles are also used as weapons on Earth ships (and they were able to destroy Wraith hive ships with them, along with penetrating Asuran/Ancient shields with enough of them + Rail guns). Sorry, but I would give, power generation weapons and shielding tech to UFP/Starfleet in this matter, by multiple factors. Quantums are about double the power output of Photons even. Oh and, the ENT-D underwent various upgrades. It wasn't until TNG Q- Who that we got actual power numbers on their warp core, which was indeed rated at 12.75 Exawatts. Sorry, but while Hyperdive is infinitely more efficient to use vs warping space time... Trek has superiority here in sheer power generation, shielding and weapons. Also, The UFP encountered thousands of years old species and fought them successfully. The Vulcans were in space for 2000 years before Earth... the Dominion predates the Federation by 2000 years too but the UFP was on a comparable tech level (And the Dominion STILL needed the help of Cardassians and Breen to wage their war which they lost of course). People seem to be forgetting the UFP merged technological and scientific knowledge of 150 different species. Even if they were of similar technological levels, the differing perspectives between species and how they arrived at these methods would create a massive convergence in methodologies that would rapidly hyperaccelerate UFP's development allowing them to basically be able to match some of the more powerful species in their Galaxy. The Borg went from massacring 39 ships at Wolf 359, to SF being able to incur massive damage onto a Borg cube with similar number of ships and also destroying it a few years after Wolf 359 (and the Borg were massively more advanced in comparison). VOY alone went up against Borg probes and spheres successfully. It even used hit an run tactics to go up against a Tactical cube and survive (just long enough to leave their away team there after which it had to run).
@@Jarsia you are arguing well but completly besides my point. I do not fault you for looking at the numbers and comparing them I just think that this is an injustice for the sake of comparison and debate. also you say 2 things without any real basis. you just claim that Deadalus isn't thougher than Atlantis with multiple ZPMs which is true in a sense but besides the point. We know in Stargate Canon that the Asgard shielding is vastly supperior to the Lantean shields. Atlantis however is like 20 times the size and with multiple ZPMs obviously they have more power than the Deadalus has with just 1. You also proofed my point with the problem with the numbers. Given what we know when just looking at the real life numbers there is no way Deadalus should have survived the CME yet we can see that she does. so if you take the numbers, again there is nothing wrong with that, Deadalus and Atlantis are toast. and inserted without adjustment into StarTrek they would be. But I find it way more entertaining and stimulating to cast the numbers aside and look at the feets to have a more colorful discussion. btw: 47 photons or 17 quantoms is quite heavy punishment for any ship we ever saw. and when we now consider that the lantean shields had to be used in a way they were not designed to and the minimal damage atlantis took from the blast beside the shields this is quite an impressive feet in my book. You could argue that the E takes more punishment against shinzon but that would have to be investigated further. Shinzon also did not want to destroy the Enterprise if he did she would not have stood any chance at all. I would also argue that the existence of the Scimitar is one of these things hard to explain within its own IP. it tanks multiple Quantums like a champ and before the ramming is hardly damaged at all... (the entire last paragraph here is beside the original point. I just wanted to mention it)
I think the Asgard as a pinnacle race that had been on the bleeding edge of tech for the SG1verse were always going to smack the crap out of Starfleet and its much younger tech base. The refit honestly lasted longer than I thought it would.
Honestly, it should be 50x stronger in terms of weapons and shields compared to what you see here and even that's probably too weak. Late 24th century photons are around 45 megatons each. Say quantums are double that. An old Hat'tak can easily take 1 gigaton hits and it's shields are fine. The Asgard can basically one shot them and that was older Asgard ships. I don't see the Asgard losing to the 29th century Borg or 32nd century Starfleet. I'd put them closer to those super advanced future ships he's used before. Note, I love Stargate and Trek so I know of what I speak.
@@PKPhoenix83 yeah were balancing them similar to that, Were balancing them based on how fast they can take out the replicators, which wasnt very many shots, so i can imagine them winning against the 32nd century ships
@@GreystarSTBC Thank you! I was so tired of seeing SG ships be so weak against basically everything, especially Asgard, Ori and Ancient tech. I look forward to an O'neill tanking a Death Star superlaser shot soon. I mention that because a far inferior Ha'tak can survive inside a star's corona for an hour. That's gotta be close to a superlaser blast.
Badger...perhaps you should have started with the Asgard Science Vessel? 🤣I recall Voyagers EMH said something similar about picking a fight with a Borg Sphere instead of the "Daunting" Cube. I think in terms of Balance the mod is not far off...for me it depends on whether this Excelsior is post Dominion War or Star Trek Online Era as the nacelles point to the latter. Either way the Excelsior was more of a Threat than a Ha'tak was to the pride of the Asgard Fleet. An Asgard Beliskner Class (Oniell Types predecessor) took on and defeated 10 Standard Ha'tak in orbit of the planet Stennos in the Stargate Novels
That O’Neill is tough for what - in that Asgardian fleet - is basically a destroyer or light cruiser. You were hitting with quantum volleys and barely making dents in those shields. I’d love to see a ST fleet or task force dogpile on it. Maybe a mix of a Vor’cha, Miranda, Defiant, the Lakota, some B’rels. Or a Dominion cruiser and several bug ships.
I am not so sure, Quantum torpedoes rely on rapid energy extraction from zero-point vacuum to create their explosion... They use a photon torpedo or plasma warhead to jump-start the reaction, but after that they rupture an 11-dimensional field inside a zero-point field reaction chamber and the dimensional distortion effect disintegrates matter on a quantum level. On leyman's terms, it basically ruptures a mini proto-ZPM to cause the explosion and cause a slight dimensional effect as well - at least some bleedthrough from those torpedoes could bypass SG shields. Of course it's the difference between an H-bomb and a nuclear fusion power-plant, but the principles would be similar. Maybe once the Asgard see Quantum torpedoes in action they could easily find a way to counter ssuch bleedthrough, but on an initial conflict where both sides are unaware of the other's technological levels...
@@PKPhoenix83 You also miss one important fact: on the 32nd century the treaty of Algeron was null and void... meaning Starfleet vessels could (and indeed do) wear cloaking devices... amongst them phased cloaking devices. The only thing stopping a Federation vessel from phasing through, pulling a Merlin-phase or Tollan-phase and then fire a torpedo inside the Neutrino-Ion generators of an O'Neill or Valhalla Asgard Warship is that the Federation is not normally covert in such sense.
@@alexslgato1735 As we've never seen Starfleet of the 32nd century use such a thing, assume the tech was lost. Also, the Asgard effectively have cloaking tech and can also phase matter through objects easily.
@@PKPhoenix83 Asgard ships do not have phased tech, even if they know of the concept. So far only the Tollans and the Alterans used phased tech, and for the Ancient's case, it was rarely used. What the Asgard often use are regular cloaking devices with the same issues the Klingons and Romulans have (engage cloak means dropping the shields), stealth systems that make them invisible from sensors (albeit some of them leave them visible to regular visible spectrum); then transporters and time-dilation technologies, which could leave a similar end result of ending on teh other side of a wall. But an actual phased cloak on their vessels, no, they do not have. Also I'm not fully sure but Daniels, from the 31st century just after the Burn, used a phase-shifting device to phase through walls, so the tech is not exactly lost, same as dimensional shifting onto the Infinity room that is used on the far-future - just probably underused because "it is not the Federation way". Oh, also regarding hulls, Asgard Warships use a Carbon-Trinum-Neutronium alloy which is very tough; but 32nd century Federation vessels use either a Neutronium alloy too, organic hulls, holographic solid walls, or a combination of them. So I am not stating they are tougher or not, but they are comparable. Now, on a totally unrelated topic, I agree a lot of techs, devices and vessels used before the Temporal Prohibitions would have evened the field significantly (dimensionally-trascendental vessels, for example).
You should put an Asgard warship up against the same class of Asgard warship. It would be interesting to see how their own hull, armor and defensive capabilities hold up against their own weapons. Same thing for the BC 304 Daedalus with Asgard enhancements.
On an unrelated note, I've finally upgraded the canonical drone script to add even more canonical features, now if a ship dies from drones, the drones will seek the nearest enemy ship. And if after attacking, the drones find no enemy ships, they return to you, replenishing the ammo. For this you need to make your weapons be at more than a certain energy threshold and have enough energy remaining on the battery, else they will just behave like they did before.
Actually this went as I would have expected it, maybe far better. Starfleet is definitely pushing along but in reality, the Asgard have 10,000 years on them and this is the latest and greatest they have to offer. I'm actually surprised it didn't just wipe the floor with the Excelsior...well, more than it did.
I think this is about right as to what would happen if these two meet in combat. Asgard have been an intergalactic power for thousands of years. The tec superiority would be insermountable.
The Asgard were traveling the stars before humans were actually humans. They have ships that jump between galaxies as if it was nothing. It would be more realistic to have an Asgard one shot a fleet of Federation ships.
Many species in the Milky Way of Trek universe did the same, and when UFP was formed, it reached the point where it was one of the most powerful organisations in the known Galaxy and LEADING things in science and technology... by the mid/late 24th century no less.
as usually the cross-IP comparison is very difficult to make. but given their role within their respectiv ips the Asgard should be more advanced given that they have hundreds of years more time for their technology. That being said the Asgard are capable of designing devastating weapons as seen in the Asgard Beam Weapons the Tau'ri are getting, but the Oneill class was designed against the replicators and in terms of offensive power somewhat underpowered. The shielding feels right though. Within Stargate we see Asgard shielding absorb a solar burst. Compare that to the massive damage the USS Dauntless is taking with shields at the beginning of BC. (comparison falls down a bit since that star actually exploded but you get the idea)
@0:25 I fully expect the Excelsior to get wrecked here. EDIT: @1:58 yeah. Asgard shields, man. They make some fantastic shields. I love the Excelsiors too and I love star trek but they just don't beat Stargate tech not except in their far future. @3:41 yeah your aft shields went from 96% -> 35% with three torpedoes
Considering that the asgard have been space faring for thousands of years and an intergalactic power for at least several thousand years, I'd say that they're probably more powerful than the federation, even if you account for any stagnation in technology. They were one of the only races somewhat capable of fighting the ori, bwing able to take hits from their weapons, and only really lost in the end because they encountered an enemy that used their technology against them and the whole cloning issue.
Honestly, I'd have to ask a friend who knows more about Stargate than I do, if this is OP or not. At the very least, I would expect the Asgard to be just as advanced over 24th Century Starfleet, as the Vulcans were in Archer's time.
A very powerful ship, even if you put up 2 Excelsior refits against it I would still give the Asgard the edge. I am in love with the Enterprise H, see how it does.
The Asgard were multiple millennia ahead of humans in development. Probably a Type 3 or 4 civilization, at least. Of course, their ships are going to be way ahead.
@davidread83 Indeed. I guess it depends which show the mod creater liked the most. Although the Asgard were arguably more advanced than Starfleet. Although I imagine even an Asgard ship would have trouble with Quantums 🖖
@@RetroBadgerGaming I don't think the Asgard were more advanced than SF in several areas: power generation, shields or weapons. Why? The Asgard Neutrino Ion generators as used on the Biliskner would be producing 3200 - 32000 times LESS energy vs what the ENT-D Warp core is capable of per second (sure, the O'Neil was much more modern, but I don't think they made it more than say 100x more powerful - 1000x would be at best a hypothetical assumption on the upper end, and STILL the ENT-D Warp core would be at minimum 3.2x more powerful than that). Yes, the Asgard have a lot faster FTL method of propulsion (Hyperdrive), but that's more or less it. Starfleet however is no slouch... they encountered and reverse engineered Quantum Slipstream drive only 4 months after discovering the technology and it was improved to the point where it ended up at 10,000 Ly's per minute (which is incidentally A LOT faster than even Tau'ri ZPM enhanced Hyperdrives - the ZPM enhanced hyperdive and Asgard's own Hyperdrives were able to traverse the distance between Milky Way and Pegasus in 2 days - the QS v2 drive would do it in about 5 hrs) - mind you, SF was able to perfect the QS technology after VOY returned home, and had it installed in the SF built USS Dauntless and USS VOY-A (As seen on ST: Prodigy S1 and 2) I like the Asgard, but regardless of how long they were in space, they had little or no incentive to advance very quickly. And besides that, Starfleet took a different technological route. Warping space-time is EXTREMELY power demanding - hence the ridiculous energy generation capabilities of the ENT-D Warp core (12.75 Exawatts)... and that's probably why SF was able to beat SG in baseline power generation - the only potential exception to this might be a ZPM - but given it was stated that one of those exploding would be able to turn the state of Nevada into a smoking crater... an antimatter explosion from a Warp core of a Delta Flyer (which was a shuttle) emitted a DEADLY/destructive shockwave in a radius of 1 million km. Just imagine what a Warp core of an actual starship would do (it would be on average 10 - 100 times more powerful). So, as good as Stargate is, I would say that Trek has a fundamentally better power source and as a result, better/more powerful weapons and shields.
The Asgard are lightyears ahead in their technology compared to starfleet. And the O'Neil was developed to combat the Replicators, basically the borg on steroids.
Asgard have technology from 10,000+ years of development alongside of other species who had 100,000+ years of technological development. Facing them off against Starfleet ships ought to be similar to a modern Navy Destroyer facing off against a wooden sailing ship.
Starfleet is part of UFP that merges technology and knowledge from over 150 different species. The tech progression and advancement of the Federation is ridiculously faster vs what the Asgard could achieve on their own. UFP also encountered thousands of years old species and went up against them as equals... the Dominion predates the Federation by several thousand years and they were pretty much equally matched in most areas by the time the Dominion War happened (not to mention the fact the Dominion still needed the help of Cardassians and Breen to wage their war). So, how long a species has been in space matters less if an upstart species like Humans in Trek who frightened even the Vulcans with how quickly they were advancing were able to bring over 150 alien species together into a cooperative society that shares science, technology and resources for free.
@@deksroning125 I understand where you are going with this, but the scale doesn't really flex enough to make that work correctly. For example, the Ancients were flying cities a million years before the events of SG1 and the Asgard were mostly caught up to them technologically by the time period of SG1 (although they were still struggling with some theories). The Asgard were also leaving their own galaxy to explore other galaxies 30,000 years before the events of SG1. This puts the Asgard at least 10,000-100,000 years more advanced than the Federation who can barely schlep their way between quadrants much less consider regular travel between galaxies. On the topic of "all of these species pooled their knowledge together, therefore it's more advanced" eh... more diverse perhaps with also perhaps an ability to solve more problems as they arrive, however just because you get the smartest shamans from 1,000 tribes of cavemen to pool their knowledge on fire, doesn't mean that suddenly they discover how to harness nuclear power. There is still a scientific process to things where one discovery leads to another and another and another but they somewhat all have to be discovered in a certain lose order, otherwise they'll never be discovered since they require stepping stones to get there. That's why Starfleet is diverse but not militarily powerful and not so far beyond the technological development of the rest of the galaxy. BTW, in case you forgot, Star Trek has their own version of the Ancients who spread life to the rest of the galaxy in their own image. They also did that on a similar timetable to the Ancients (a million years ago) and their technology was on par with the Iconians at that time. The current technological development of Starfleet in the 24th century is still far behind their progenitors.
@@davidprinzing8059 Yes, but Trek and SG universes diverged in terms of technological development. Antimatter is ridiculously common for Trek and they used it since forever in Trek which opened up different technological paths. SG universe doesn't use that kind of power source - it seems to be restricted to more 'conventional' power sources and then enhance them via Naquadah in some cases - though to be fair, we hadn't really been told the specifics behind various power sources of more advanced species... sans the Asgard - and their own ships power source is at least 32000 times LESS powerful than what a single warp core of a Galaxy class produces... this means that even the weakest UFP ships would be capable of producing several thousand times more energy vs your single Asgard ship - and their defenses and offenses are powered by this energy... meaning they can pump significantly more energy into their shields and weapons (yields of which are then enhanced using subspace technology). Speaking of which, subspace manipulation technology is extremely common in Trek. In Stargate, subspace is predominantly used for Hyperspace travel... but for nothing else it seems. In Trek, starships project a low level subspace field to lower their inertial mass which allows them to travel at significant fraction of light speed (at least 75,000 km/s in the 23rd century, and about double or even close to the speed of light without relativistic effects) and they use it in a variety of their technology to enhance energy outputs, weapons yields, create portable shields which can counteract a variety of subspace effects or use them, etc. To be fair to the Asgard, they are impressive, there's no doubt about it... but there would be a limit to how far they can advance for example on their own and they started off from a different power source base. I just don't see the late Asgard (even their plasma beam weapons) as more advanced than 24th century UFP. Plasma based weapons are common in Trek, and while the romulans used it to devastating effects in the 23rd century, in the 24th, shields were more than effective enough to counter them easily. It just seems that the Asgard mirror the UFP in many ways technologically, but they can't seem to match UFP in Weapons, shields or power source. And they have reservations in using transporters as weapons, meawhile Starfleet doesn't and it makes use of finding/matching frequencies to counter many defenses (shields included). Plus I hadn't seen the Asgard develop transphasic torpedoes for instance, even though the technologically inferior Tollan had phasing technology and were almost ready in using it against Earth. Starfleet did - and they effectively bypass shields and hull to detonate inside a ship - though those are specifically very late 24th century/early 25th century weapons to fend off the Borg. Heck, if it wasn't for the treaty of Algeron, SF would have been able to freely develop cloacking technology on its own - and they developed a working phase cloack decades before the Romulans (technically).
Only Lantian tech can match Asgard tech. Poor Terrans 😄. They need to learn how to make ZPMs. 😆 Barclay should have told them how when the Cytherions made him super intelligent.
ENT-D warp core produces 12.75 Exawatts every second. The Asgard Neutrino Ion Generators each produce 1 billion kilojoules per second (the Biliskner had 3 of them). That means the ENT-D warp core is on average produced 32000 times MORE energy than the Biliskner. The O'Neil was much more powerful than the Biliskner yes, but I doubt the Asgard made it 32,000 times more powerful. At the very upper end it would be anywhere between 50 to 100 to MAYBE 1000 times more powerful than the Biliskner in power generation (and as such, STILL by MANY dozens of times LESS powerful than the ENT-D warp core). Warp drives bend space-time to achieve FTL... its a ridiculous power hog. Hyperdrives can operate with arguably LESS power... but that also means the energy available to energy weapons and shields is by dozens to hundreds of times LESS powerful what is available to the Enterprise-D weapons and shields. A ZPM was said it could turn the state of Nevada into a smoking crater. A contaminated ZPM could destroy a planet - but contaminated ZPM doesn't count since that's a foreign substance that seemingly amplifies the explosive effects of ZPM. The Delta Flyer Warp core explosion was able to produce a shockwave that posed danger to ANYTHING within a radius of 1 million km. The ENT-D Warp core, would be arguably able to produce anywhere between 10x to 100x more damaging radius.
The Asgard are an intergallactic civilization. Discovery Starfleet is barely fully galactic. It would be shocking if any variant of an excelsior class would scratch an asgard ship.
if that ship was commanded by the humans of SGC once the shields went down even slightly they would of beamed over a naquadria enhanced nuclear bomb vaporizing it Ya and the asgard are like million year old clones that fought galaxy wide wars repeatedly and i would say a gould Hatak would crush federation ships so the asgard would swat tham like flies
I would place the ships of the federation in between the goauld ships and the asgard. I'd say that a Hatak would scale to around the combat power level of the ncc-1701 enterprise. the Goauld would be able to bring hundreds of Hataks for each ship in the federation in an all out war, assuming you could get the system lords to play nice with each other.
That is power of heavy ion guns.....ST universe must understand that;)) That why even B5 most ships can destroy must canon ST ships with few shots(or just one) ;)
Ion weaponry deals more of a punch that regular plasma weapons to shields both in SG and ST universes, but for different reasons - Go'auld and similar-based shields have problems blocking them; while on Federation shielding they have a bit of a draining effect... but the Federation could still withstand several blows - just check that Star Trek Voyager episode where they were orbiting a planet whose timestream was faster than the rest and in a few hours they started firing Antimmater and Ion weaponry on them. And no, most of the B5 races do not tend to use Ion Weaponry, they use other types of Particle weapons, most often plasma for when it comes to the younger races. The Minbari do not use Ions either, they use Fusion or Neutron cannons. The Vree employ antimatter bursts on their Xill cruisers. The Shadows use a concentrated thermonuclear ray, the Vorlons a biobeam and the other First Ones use more esoteric methods to take a target down. The Shinindrea used phased bursts, last time I checked. Only the Earth Alliance (mostly the Warlocks... actually only the Warlocks) and Centauri Primus and Vorchans have been seen using Ion-like projectiles, the ones on the Primus effectively dealt decent damage to Babylon 5 station, cutting in half one of the forward pylons... but so could a phaser as well - thing is ST Federation and advanced-enough SG shields can just block Ion weaponry with little to no effect to their hulls, and sometimes with little to no effect to shields - just see how Anubis-grade Ha'taks could block Tollan Ion cannons with shields holding and no damage when beforehand a single Tollan Ion cannon bypassed the shields and dealt terrible damage, and a second shot finished the job.
This shouldn't Even remotely be a contest. Tens if not hundreds of thousands of years of space-faring experience versus a couple hundred... I call b*******. They should have the Asgard Beam weapon as well no, and it should nearly one shot anything from the federation or its contemporaries.
@@tigerbread78 riiight… so when targeting the Asgard ship, there wouldn’t be impulse engines, there would be sublight engines. If he were to target the starfleet ship’s propulsion it would read as impulse engines. Make sense now?
