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Great comparison. A tip I’ve found with my drums is a put a bit of water between the drum and the sandpaper. The surface tension of the water helps keep the belts on while spinning, but they are still easy to take off when you’re done.
Soak the dry drums in automotive radiator coolant. It is the best rubber conditioner you can get. The water that runs thru the hoses is super hot yet the rubber doesn’t dry out or crack because of the conditioners. You can wipe it on dry cracked tires and the cracks close up it work great. They are unusable as is so it couldn’t hurt.
I think this video will be very helpful for future unsuspecting buyers, ya know it really is a crap-shoot when it comes to diagnosing what`s really wrong with those cab king wheels, it sounds like it`s a bigger problem than just your two wheels, this is why you are so important rock-hounders you genuinely care about your viewers by save us money, warning us about problems, and turning us on to valuable information and rock-hounding spots, so with that i say thanks for another great video and i`ll see ya on the next one.
We got 6 of those "do not work so great" versions (we saw that deal and went waho!), we just thought we were doing something wrong, so thanks for the enlightenment. We ended up adding a strip of rubber pond liner between the wheels and the belts which so far has worked well for keeping them in place way harder to change them out though.
I'm sorry to hear that you also got some bad wheels but I'm glad you got them working. Yeah that is the down side it seems with the fixes people offer for it, they all seem to make the changing of the belts more of a task.
While there are, indeed, several possible reasons for loose fit, the first thing to check is the wheel and belt size. Unfortunately, there are two sizes in the market that are very close. Lortone 25-1/8'' belts will be too tight to fit onto Expando drums, whereas 25-7/32'' should fit perfectly. Likewise, standard 25-7/32'' belts are too loose on the Lortone EX83 drums, and perhaps on some other older expanding drums. Beyond that, check what is shown in this video, and of course also make sure that your drum (wheel) is mounted in correct orientation, with fins pointing downward on the front side.
Thanks for sharing this, after your last video I started considering the drum options. You brought up some good things to be mindful of in this video that i would not have known like the amount of slits and how squishy they are. Thanks for sharing
I think the issue is speed of rotation. Some lapidary units are run direct on the motor shaft. But some are driven with a separate shaft that is driven by a step-down pulley from the motor, as is yours. Centrifugal Force (expansion) depends on speed
I see what you're saying here, but that is not the case here. These wheels were spinning at the max rated RPM for them of 1725rpm they were just not expanding due to poor quality.
Thanks for responding. I hadn't seen anybody else suggesting it, so thought I should. From my limited lapidary work, recently restarted, my experience is showing a lot of sellers out there that shouldn't run a hotdog stand. Posting for sale items not in inventory, not telling buyers items are backordered, etc. I've been shocked by what I've gone through just trying to buy oil and blades lately.
@@jimnelson7740 The lapidary machine market is currently at an all-time low in my opinion. So many companies are complete trash to order from, and so many manufactures have gone out of business.
If you weren't planning to use the cab king ones for another project, I was going to suggest carving the fin gaps so they were longer and maybe wider to see if that helped with flexibility. Oh well, at least you're going to make use of them in the end! Thanks for the educational video.
I use the same Loritone arbors... this video is a life saver! I am coating my hard rubber wheel with rubber cement as a gripping surface to prevent slippage...
@@CurrentlyRockhounding hey, do you know if the slant vs. horizontal lap machines have many differences? I have no idea why some (hi-tech) are slanted. Thanks!
It took me 3 motors to get my rock Tumbler running! Not just any motor will do! Especially on a budget I also flipped the mount over and put a fan in the cabinet Good to know about the expanding wheels A grinding set up is my next project Maybe it’s like winter car tires Some grip and well…….others We don’t always think about rubber technology Back in the day there wasn’t any choices
Jared, I personally would contact the supplier, Regardless when you purchased them. A lot of times companies put items on sale that they are either phasing out or they know there is a problem! Especially since others have had similar experiences. It diffidently shows that the new product works!
I've had Lortone expanding drums for years....I believe the the older Lortone drums take a 25 1/8 inch belt. Kingsley sells the shorter belt. The 25 7/32 belt is to big for my drums. I'm not sure of belt size on newer Lortone drums.
I'm glad I haven't had that experience. I think I mentioned all of my wheels are whatever came on my used machines or in buckets of spares I bought. Some have even had stuff growing on them. They've all worked. The only time the belt has migrated is when I use excessive pressure and then move side to side. Guess I've just been lucky.
I purchased that machine new around 1970 and just got back into using it. My machine has the original wheel and it is a match for the hard, bargain wheels you purchased. I also have the old sanding papers and they fit snugly over the wheel and has never slipped. It is, however, a pain to replace so I suspect that somewhere along the way, the wheel and paper changed to make life easier. My paper is the original stock and so old it separates along the seem. The new paper must be a little longer. After watching your video I suspect when I go to buy a new supply I will have the slipping problem unless I buy the new drum. Perhaps Lortone can provide the history. Enjoy your videos.
Not sure how reliable the information I got was but I was told that cab king drums take a belt that is about 1/2" shorter preventing the slippage from occuring.
That might be the case but the CabKing website says the belt size for the drums they sell are 25-7/32". I wouldn't even know where to find a supply of belts that are slightly smaller.
just thinking out of the box... Since we know they don't expand as they should, how about DIY-ing them to be more flexible. I would think with 1/4" long drill bit cutting into each groove/channel would give more flex. That way you don't mess with any adhesive or whatever on the outside that will create lumps and not rotate 'true'. So in essence, shave the grooves open for more movement and play. The harder route would be to file the channels open more.
I had that problem. My solution was to change the pulleys so the wheels are spinning at aproxamently 2400 RPM, But mine I bought used and didn't have a Max RPM marked on them. NOTE: Never exceed manufactures maximum speeds, it can be hazardors to your health.
Thank you for that. Its good advice for anybody that is purchasing expandable drums. Less is not always better. Im glad kingsley north could fix your problem. And its weird that cabking drums, wont hold a belt. But now we know! Thanks Jared!
Haha I kept thinking 'is it too cold in the shop for it to properly expand?', but you undoubtedly squished that thought with the reassurance that indeed, 39° in your shop is a summer-like temperature! 😂🤣 Also, while you were talking, I was brainstorming an idea for how to reuse the wheel and thought it would be a great piece for a larger arbored sander of sorts. I mean, it's not like you already have one and don't need a second, but it at least crossed my mind. That, or use both of them for an ultra wide-wheeled rc motorcycle! Because vroom!😂🤣
Hi Jared, another good piece of information for all to consider. I don’t have to worry about that at the moment, don’t have the equipment, (yet), though it is a good bit o& info for the future. Keep Safe out there mate. PS. Maybe time for some new gloves, might be a bit safer. 👍🤣🤣
That will work fine for a contact wheel for a belt grinder, which is probably what it was intended for. The vendor sold you a wheel not suitable for purpose, if it was labelled as an "expandable wheel". If they won't return it I'd never do business with them again. Just because it was "on sale" doesn't mean it can be other than what was represented.
It is intended and made to be an expanding drum for lapidary machines and not a belt grinder but perhaps they could be repurposed for that. The issues wasn't that it was on sale and or anything related to that but I was pointing that out due to the fact that I took advantage of the sale before and got them before I was able to test them and when I did it was beyond the return date.
I wonder if printers belt dressing would help. It's used on the rubber print belt after multiple strikes have flattened & stiffened the rubber. After applying it you can see the rubber raise up and become softer.
I have had this exact problem for years. I just outfitted a six drum station with Cab King 6" expanding drums. Only two wheels keep the belts tight. I too, first thought it was the belts. Since the diamond belts from Eastwind tend to slide off and the Crystalite do not. But your findings make feel like it is all a wheel issue. I think it is time to replace the Cab Kings with Lortones. Thanks.
In theory if the belts are all the same size and two different companies make the exact same size of wheel but one is soft and expands really well and the other is firm and does I think its just a design issue.
@@CurrentlyRockhounding the Crystalite Diamond belts backing are made of a much stiffer and tougher material then the Eastwind Diamond belts. I believe the stiffer material has less give and thus stays in place when the Expandable wheel reaches max rpm. Two of my Cab King wheels are really bad with the belts sliding off the wheels as soon as I power on the arbor. I use a piece of plexi 1" wide to keep the belt from wandering off the drum. I think I will buy two Lortone wheels to replace these two "bad" wheels and see how that goes. Did you buy your Lortone from Kingsley North? Thanks.
Is somebody about to make a vertical belt sander? They would be just fine for that application. I noticed the lights on your display shelves could use some custom made reflectors to cut glare and focus more light on to the specimens. Another chance to use that new sheet metal brake!
Maybe I haven't looked hard enough, but do you have any videos on pre charged polishing wheels? Like, how long do they last? Can you charge them? should you? Are they are good as self applied?
Interesting. I see the RPM question has been answered already. Are the less pliable wheels being sold for cabbing machines? Industrial size belt sander came to mind for some reason. Maybe it's just a case of getting what you pay for as compared to the good wheels.
This a good video for those that are wanting to get their own expanding wheels to upgrade what they may have. Sure the better ones are more spendy but it's worth it in the long run.
Wonder what the longevity is with the expando wheel versus the Nova wheel? I realize there is a lot to consider, belts vs lifespan of coating on the Nova? Lifespan of the rubber wheel itself? Thanks, good vid.
1750 rpm which isn't exactly the max that they are rated for but close enough to where they should be expanding. Lots of lapidary products are rated for 1800rpm because 1750 or 1725 is a common RPM motor speed.
