The only one is that where the centaur looks back at her to look at Sunflower, in the censored version, it doesn't make sense for her to look back as if someone was behind her
Looney tunes handled it better. They just put a disclaimer. "these cartoons are being presented as they were originally created, because to do otherwise would be the same as claiming these prejudices never existed."
as someone in the comments said, seeing the original uncensored version is good to see, as racism simply just doesn't go away if we ignore it and hide it. It is something to remember as the ugly truth about the past and one we should not forget, but move on from.
@GOP says God WANTED you to be raped Political correctness is the principal cause of this, why would company denied that kind of behavior when their little fan can be happy and buy more things. We all know that the true reasons for companies to change their logo to accomodate pride months is only for business, they dont give a shit about it same as that kind of unecessary censoring. Just to please those wicked snowflake, nothing else.
@GOP says God WANTED you to be raped ....um no Do you know how time periods work? Do you not remember that slaves existed? Learn your history before commenting, America was indeed very racist back then
@GOP says God WANTED you to be raped Well, the racist part is, that all others are white and beautiful and "master" horses while the only serving horse is black skinned and using all the racist cartoon stereotypes of these days, pretty much the same level as having a single jewish character and of course he's greedy and with a giant hook nose. Yeah... You could have easily done the same story and just have a small mule that mainyl looks like the others and would just be seen as cute little worker or whatever. If at least ALL the horses would look like that, it would be somehow more acceptable as choice of style, but to make all the other white and beatiful, just not her, oh my...
yes, but I think just the idea of showing the only black centaur in the whole short being the one having to clean up and serve the white centaurs is a very bad look either way
@@fightonafriday you missed the whole purporse of her character She doesn't serve her the other centaurs (that are her sisters btw) because she is poc, but because she's too young to get married yet, so she helps her sisters instead She's not the only poc centaur btw, there are also two zebra poc centaur women more onward in the movie And they are not represented in a strereotypical way like Sunflower btw
legit, I thought she ironically helped the first scenes, seeing she made all the centaurs seem self-absorbed and prissy. It's a pity she had to be ruined by racism. edit: why are there so many 14 year old white boys crying about this in the comments? What about "It's a pity that she had to be ruined by racism" hurts you this personally?
@@GrogSothoth Not really, her character designs are racist but the reason she was there was to help the other centaurs with their flowers. That (putting flowers in someone's hair) in and of itself is not racist.
I kind of happy to see the uncensored version. It is part of human history that we need to remember how racist it could be during that period of time. It is ugly and painful but we should not cover it.
My favorite part is that Disney edited her out and when people asked them about Sunflower, they lied and said she was never in the movie. People had to be like “why do I have her on a broadcast version of Fantasia I recorded? Why is she in this book. Look, she’s even got a name in the book!” And Disney was like “no, I don’t think so. Now Zippity the Doodah out of here.”
@@grugonk i don't think it's fair to blame the representation on "the times" because yeah, racist people have always existed, but so have normal people. if we cut the people behind the stereotypes some slack for not being a part of a more socially aware era of history, we forget that it still takes a certain level of bigotry to include this type of character in a movie
The most racist thing is that Sunflower was not portrayed as a beautiful horse, she was portrayed as a slave donkey that never gets respect from other horses. I wish they could've redesigned the character and gave her respect instead of cutting her out the movie. Update: Why are y'all fighting in the chat? Just chill, donkeys can be amazing animals and horses can be the opposite. I said this because movies always have portrayed donkeys as low clase animals but they can be so much more.
I think they simply removed her because actually redesigning over the already completed work would have been harder, but I nonetheless agree they should have redesigned her as removing also took effort, redesigning her would've just taken more
Donkeys are superiour to horses. A horse is a cowardly animal that runs away when threatened. A donkey is stoic and faces the thread. A horse gets 20 years old, a donkey 40. Donkeys are even more intelligent than horses. Stop speciesism against donkeys.
I don't think they should be able to erase it from history the way Lucas does to Star Wars versions, at the same time, i think they should definitely be allowed to rework their product so parents don't need 10 page essays to put something on for their kid at dinner.
They’re probably just showing us a version we’d rather see, there’s a surprising amount of “cartoon historians” here claiming they need to see the discrimination for this to be worth watching, it stinks of the confederate flag argument which I’m sure many people in this comment section have an opinion on too. Sorry but I’ll let Disney pay to fix their old shit while those who still want to see the original can still do so on the internet for these “historical” purposes you’re talking about
I don't mind it but preservation isn't really an issue and disney knows that, what I think they should've done is reworked the scene to let people know they are over that kind of stuff, but no that would be acknowledging they were racists once
i remember telling my family about these parts when i was younger and nobody believed me (cause by then we got rid of the old VHS) so we went back a couple years later (when disney + came around) and when i saw the scenes were deleted people ESPECIALLY didn’t believe me but i remembered her especially carrying the flowers on the girls back so i searched it up and it’s good to see that this part is recovered
Warner Bros: Warning, there may be disturbing content here that was deemed acceptable at the time. We shouldn't try to erase the past. Disney: The Hell are you talking about? We've always been squeaky clean and perfect.
I actually got a warning once or twice when watching the Muppets on Disney+. I'm not even sure what the offensive part was. Might have been the way they portrayed country folk. But as a country folk myself, the fact a respected actor from the south was playing the part made it perfectly ok in my eyes and I found it hilarious, not offensive. So they warn for non-offensive stuff, but cut out offensive stuff. Makes sense.
@@maybelinefox3878 me as well. One I know I get a warning every time I rewatch it is the aristocats, I think for more obvious reasons but I’m glad I can still watch this movie how it is since it will always be one of my favorites
@@maybelinefox3878 Yeah, anytime I watch Aladdin (1992), I get this 20-second warning saying that "This film may be considered offensive by today's standards", I'm assuming they're talking about the way they represented the life and people in Saudi Arabia.
I used to watch the uncensored VHS as a child and she was my favorite because she seemed more fun than the uptight centaur ladies. I hadn't thought of it and didn't realize it was a racist caricature until Disney removed her completely.
I remember watching the vhs version as a child. She was still in that version which I have to this day...I remember her being my favorite because I thought she was the baby sister that looked up to her siblings. My mom didn't want to tell me why she was actually there...I know now though. It's really interesting how innocent I made these scenes in my head as a child...but how could I know any better?
This reminds me of a story my mom was talking about and I happened to listen in when she was little the church ( I think ) they were going to get burned down while they were around ( or leaving or entering idk can't remember ) but all my mom could of thought back then was " wow look at the pretty lights "
i remember watching song of the south, which is known as one of the, if not most offensive disney movie, and as a child i just did not understand why it was racist. all i thought about back then was about how there was a cute bunny and a cool dude who sings yk. young kids don’t really pick up on that kinda stuff i think
Disney making an edit like that today would just prove that they want to act like this never happened even more. Disney needs to release the original theatrical cut and stop being so scared of offending one single person on Earth and just show their old media in its uncut and original form. Censoring stuff like this makes them look way worse in my opinion. They have the disclaimers on Disney+, they called the first US Fantasia DVD the "Uncut Version", but yet they still have the censored version in circulation to this day. Fantasia, Song of the South, and many other films need to be re-released uncut (and remastered) instead of Disney pretending like they don't exist.
I don't think Disney has animators that specialize in cel drawing anymore, and Disney has most likely gotten rid of all their old cels. If they were to redraw it, it would be SUPER out of place which is why I think that it is better this way
growing up, I saw the original & didn't think anything of it. I had no idea what racism was because I wasn't taught to look at others as any different. Of course as an adult it makes me sad & angry, but as a child I just thought she was the youngest & so the others were annoyed by their little sister like I was by mine. Hate is learned 🥺
That last line is fact. I grew up with those racist tom & jerry episodes but never have I thought it was anything like that. I always just thought that black characters in cartoons being potrayed as maids or servants is only a coincidence, or even I didn't think about it at all.
As one of the comments said: Instead of just removing the black lil centaur, make them beautiful as the others or edit them completely and paint them in "many colors" Also the algorithm is sooooo random
Is incredible stupid to read comments about people complaining racisms agains a non existent character from a cartoon of 1940. Even more stupid is how the algorithm of RU-vid make the comments section look like Twitter
@@CorreQueTeGorreo yall really underestimate the power of midia, while just mindless complaining and pointing fingers, like twitter usually do, is a stupid way to go about it, discussing this kinda of thing, where it comes from and it's impact on real life is valid...the power over image is a real thing that affects culture and builds stereotypes.
Disney Logic: Animator: "One of our characters was depicted as a racist caricature" Executive: "Make her disappear. Can't be racist if she doesn't exist."
For me it isn't just the way the black Centaur girl is drawn to be radically different than the others, but also that she's in a subservient role. I'm not black but yeah, I can see how that is offensive.
CJPurplePrincess : The censored/edited version would have needed to repeat some of the frames to make the timing and overall length match the music that was already established for the segment. It's a common animation technique for filling space without having to redraw everything.
Rogers Stinson : I think that instead of editing her out, they should have simply redrawn her to be less . . . um . . . I guess "racially insensitive" is the most polite way to put it. 🤔
@@ErykaSoleil The animators could've done that at Disney. In fact, Disney did modify one scene in The Three Little Pigs short; originally, one scene shows the wolf dressed up as a Jewish peddler. However, during its re-release, disney changed the scene to make it less offensive. I think when it came to Fantasia, being one the most expensive films of all time, they probably didn't think it would be feasible to reanimate the entire scenes involving Sunflower or Otika. Either that or they didn't even think of doing that. This segment on a whole is a bit problematic not just because of the black centaurs but also how centaur couples elope because of their similar skin colour. Do you see a blue centaur go off with a yellow mate? It's not likely because of the stupid Hays Code,which was like a censorship board for Hollywood at the time of the film's release. Sorry for the long-winded reply, but I have been doing a lot of research on this film, especially this scene. 🤓
@@katethemikufan9109 , the Hays Code was not stupid. It was a masterpiece of decency that set the standard for excellence in motion pictures for decades.
It's amazing how they perfectly edited her out to the point where you couldn't tell anyone was supposed to be there, but honestly, if you're editing is that good to the point where you can remove a whole character, then why not just redraw her so she's less offensive looking?
Look at every frame of animation that the character performs, now look at the static background, which do you think is easier to add in, especially when you’re masking out the character either way?
@@davyk515 true, but Disney supposedly has all the budget in the world to afford reanimating a less "offensively racist" design for Sunflower. It's a shame they can't be bothered enough to spend a little more to make it actually nicer
Besides I don't even think they have the original cells anymore. Remember, this was hand drawn, they couldn't store this on a hard drive. They had actual pictures to store and I highly doubt disney kept them...
I wish they had added her as a full fledged contour, instead. Made it inclusive and her an equil, not just removed her entirely. Hell, the person she had been serving instead could have been made into her. Still glad they didnt leave something so suggestive to kids in.
Censoring racist imagery in old media is distortion of history BS. In a few years the zeitgeist may have change another way and old media gets censored again, till nothing but a black screen is remaining (or white because that would be somehow racist too). Does that imagery up there bring a bad taste in the mouth? Yeah, but would it be better to erase it and pretend it never happened, so Disney can still make a buck of that? I don't think so.
Well, it's the greeks after all. And as we know today, only non-white ethnic groups can be slaves. So it's totally politically correct and representative of diversity. Don't know why they even censored it...
likely because ancient Greece had tons of white slaves but the audience of the 1920's wouldn't have recognized what was being reference so their writers thought it would be cute to use a more "relatable" servant for the time it was animated in
You have a very shallow concept of bad then. The racist is honestly miniscule. I even knew a girl who almost looks the little black centaur. A few things are racially exaggerated, though.
why are people being so stupid in these comments. The reason she was removed was because she was a caricature mocking black people. So before you come in these comments being ignorant and saying Disney is removing "representation" this ISN'T how black people should be represented in tv.
Is it sorta bad that I saw Otika and Sunflower as cute? 😭 Like, remove the racist stereotypes and undertones and have them hang out with the other horse girls like little sisters or something
Un fun fact: There's actually two black centaurs in this clip. I think the other is named daisy. They had two black characters and made them the same. Only difference was the colour of flowers in their hair.
Even less fun fact? There are three. Otika has all blue ribbons in her hair, sunflower has the sunflowers, and there’s another unnamed centaur with both ribbons and sunflowers.
I think its because Disney re-usesda lot of animation cells to save money, and all they had to do was change the inking for different colors and alter some cells to make little variations
I wish they weren't lazy and actually made something beautiful out of this. If possible at all , maybe reanimate it with a similar centaur girl... but black. A beautiful, elegant, gorgeous black one. Not lil go ofy mid_get Maid. Don't just straight up delete her!
Well, if I remember correctly, there were two African centaurs with the fat drunk dude. They had zebra halves and were animated as gorgeously as the other centaurs.
I wish they'd change her design to be no longer a caricature. A black little centaur girl would be really cute if they would draw her with the same respect they drawn the white-ish centaurs.
@@TheBossCrissCross she literally looks more like a black caricature than a black little girl. yes she needs some design altering. yes the imagery is stereotypical and racist.
@@TheBossCrissCross "the imaginary racism you're trying to create", "she should do the same what other characters do", so you agree that there's a problem here that they could fix, so she can act and be cute as all the other characters that aren't black, but you still think racism is an imaginary problem here? The black caricature is a product of a racist era. All I said is that it would be simply fix if she was drawn like any other character, black, beautiful and elegant like all others centaurs shown here. It isn't just me that sees this though. You yourself also agrees that she doesn't act like the other centaurs. So are you also seeing imaginary problems?
@@TheBossCrissCross she can still remain with black features, she should so. Just not to the point they seems like a caricature. She can have plumpy lips, very dark complexion and not look like like such caricature. At that point in time they didn't treat black people with respect, and black caricatures shows that. Black people can be pretty, cute, hot, and etc with their own features. But those old cartoons were not, and more so when they're contrasted with way prettier white characters, wich is the case in these scenes. She has a very strong contrast with all the other centaurs, that are drawn to be more elegant and pale, with simplified yet pretty faces. It's night and day. I like her concept, and if I squint to see everything blurry she is cute, but seeing it clearly it's obvious the caricature.
@@TheBossCrissCross it is not racist changing her design bc her design was MADE to be racist. Every racist animation back then had characters like this, check it out. Do you know what it means a caricature? She's a racist caricature. None black characters of today are draw like this.
@@TheBossCrissCross "someone else features" she's not real. She was made by racist white people with the intent of being racist. She's a racist caricature. She behaves like a sl4ve. She doesn't represent no one.
The fact i keep having to rethink how some of the cartoons or movies changed is hilarious to me. Like what was or wasn't cut, edited, or added in, etc. I grew up with a LOT of VHS and so most were origional copies, without any censoring with alot of cartoons and animations since the 40s(maybe late 30s) to 90s. On both or either DVD and VHS tapes.
I mean. She supposed to represent a slave. So. No. Plus what kind of message is that? The black girl takes care of white girls? Messed up. But thats human history.
this comment section is so rancid 💀💀how come yall get mad that disney took out a racist caricature of the only black character in the film? yes, they can resolve it a different way like adding a disclaimer at the beginning and taking accountability, but the film's plot wasn't impacted at all from the character's absence. that means she was only good for caricature and comic relief, and removing her in an effort to stop depicting black characters in such a way is not a bad move in the end. and don't act dumb and go "oh so yall see a black character and think it's racist? checkmate liberals" because i know yall and the confederate flag hanging in your room are very familiar with slavery. EDIT: i forgot that this character wasn't the only black character in the movie and was reminded. my point still stands though because she's still a racist caricature and her inclusion was representative of the animators' prejudice at the time.
@@ogrimbothesour2976 right, though it is worth noting that every black centaur in the film is a servant whereas the other centaurs get to have fun and hook up
I kinda like the idea of her being a cute little helper, but i don't like the idea of her being such a stereotype. Having a little calf helper in a disney movie would be so adorable! But not in this way.
I know the old lady in _Tom and Jerry_ is a stereotype but she's still the best character in the show. As a kid Tom getting yelled at by the old grandma who runs the house was something that really stuck with me. It didn't really matter whether or not she was a servant; to Tom her words carried the weight of God, and I felt that
And now you carry around that racial stereotype as an adult, becuase you were exposed to it as a child. So you should hopefully see why it's not appropriate for children.
@@EmperorSmith Except I don't walk up to every old black lady expecting her to slap me with a sandal. I just like that specific character. Same way being white and bearded doesn't automatically make someone a Gandalf stereotype.
@@EmperorSmith Just because she's a sassy servant berating a housecat doesn't mean she isn't a solid memorable character who was the secondary driving force of the show and, in subversion of her servant status was portrayed as the authority figure; which for 1940s was a risky move. As a kid watching I just liked how the grandma telling at Tom made everything feel real; but knowing more about the context of segregation she only becomes _more_ interesting. If the show was made by black artists she'd be heralded as a subtle coomentary on black oppression who toed the line of representation at the time but kept it comedic and stereotypical enough not to be shot down by censors, so that future artists could build on it and run where they walked. But nah, the writers are white, so f**k her.
@@the-fun-has-arrived With old copies of VHS or film, this movie was released in cinema after all. The song of the South is very difficult to find because Disney actually recalled all copies to destroy them.
I can answer that one. Companies bought movies from Disney. Sometimes theaters would do that, and sometimes television stations would do that. On occasion, a station would broadcast an older version of a movie that hadn’t been redone, especially older TV stations, especially in the South, where funding is thin and they can’t afford to be buying new movies all the time. This resulted in some things that studios might not like. I know a few people who grew up in the Carolinas who saw this version of Fantasia and Song of the South on broadcast TV, well into the 90’s. People had VCRs by then and could record these things. By the way, when this came to light and people asked Disney about the racist caricature in Fantasia, they straight up lied about it and said she never existed.
That's a pity, i watched the censored version as a child, and my favorite centaur was always this pink one on 0:55 It's Sad to be seeing my childhood favorite rolling her eyes like she's disgusted at the kid or something, i guess she wouldn't like me aswell. (i am Black too)
This comment hits hard. 😢 So many people here are debating whether or not the uncensored version is offensive or not, as though it's some hypothetical scenario that doesn't directly impact real people. It should be obvious that negative representation like that can be hurtful.
I liked your comment because it's so sad and sweet at the same time. To add something funny: I'm white and my favorite character was the cute little one that was censored. As a kid you don't see stereotypes. Much love and hugs
@@ouijacorn Agreed. I've been scrolling down for a while and while there's plenty of thoughtful and thought-provoking pontification as to whether Disney did the right thing or how they could have handled it differently, this is the first comment I've seen that really matters.
Sunflower deserved better, it’s sad to see how black girls were depicted in media back then and sometimes now to this day. I am glad for the non-racist redraws/redesigns of her coming out. It’s really nice to see. ❤
I feel like this character would have a lot of potential if it wasn't wasted on a racial stereotype. I say she gets a redesign and a leading role. All offensive traits should be thrown out the window to make room for an actually good character.
I heard people talking about the exact same thing and I agree as a person of color i love this idea she's honestly kinda cute and sad she wasn't repurposed
Hmm well I have the VHS tape from the 90s so it's probably uncensored... I get why they did it, but if you keep erasing things like this from older shows and movies then younger generations will be less aware of how bad things were in the past. I remember watching the Jetsons in the early 2000s on TeleToon Retro, and they had a disclaimer stating that the views in the episodes did not reflect their views but rather the views at the time, and to take that into consideration. The episode was about "crazy woman drivers". I remember it gave me a better perspective as to what the world was like in my parents' era while being aware of how things had changed. I was a teenager at the time, and not a small child, so that is a factor, but if we censor everything younger generations won't really understand how things were. Maybe rather than censoring it, it should be shown in a way that both embraces the beauty of the original film while acknowledging the things that need to be addressed, and perhaps shown to a slightly older audience?
I'm guessing they were probably focused more on publicity, but also if I were a parent, I would rather not watch a movie with young kids where black characters are portrayed as slaves. Fantasia was made for young kids and even if there is a disclaimer, they might be too young to understand the historical meaning of something like that. I think there should be an uncensored version available somewhere, but maybe not on the kid's section of disney+ or on the main cd release where parents could be blindsided by a scene like that.
@%D4YSTAR. ♱ Well, white isn't a nationality, it's a trait. And since we're getting so "technical"- by scientific standards, oceans and other bodies of water provide no uv protection, therefore, mermaid would've been black. The only way a mermaid could be white is if they lived in the deep, so they would have to have lots of flubber to keep them stable. But if we want to get even more technical! The Little mermaid should've been a man- given that the original author intended the story to be a love letter to his best friend. Since back then, non-heteroship was considered sinful due to religion. Anyways, just say you hate black media representation and move on, it's much easier for us all.
Wouldn't it have been better to add dark skinned centaurs to the parade and light skinned helpers to the scenes rather than erasing completely the only black character...? Ofc there's also the fact she's designed in a stereotypical way but that could also be fixed with a more respectful character design. Yes it'd be a lot of work but it'd been the fairest thing imo... there's even blue skinned centaurs... why aren't there black centaurs among the fancy ones?? 💀
Or just dont give a fuck bc it's not a modern peice of media and people of all color and race have rights. So there's literally nothing gained from redoing these types of movies.
Just to put it into perspective that slavery wasn't all *that* long ago, this movie came out just 75 years after slavery was officially ended, and the movie itself came out just a little over 80 years ago. Women weren't allowed to vote until about 20 years before the movie came out, and black people weren't allowed to go to the same places as white people and use the same services until about 25 years *after* the movie came out. To younger people alive today the late 1800s and early/mid 1900s probably seems like ancient history, but it wasn't that long ago. One reason the fight for equal rights for all people still rages today.
More perspective: a newborn baby the day this movie was released is likely a great-grandparent, or buried under a tombstone. That same baby could have served and-or died in the Vietnam War, been a member of the civil rights movement, or been a musician that loved and was inspired by Motown music. Hitler had only recently started WW2 and America hadn't even joined the fight yet. This really was a long time ago.
Seeing so many people like “they removed them cause they’re black?” NO, they removed them because they were racist caricatures both in appearance and status (minstrel)! There’s black zebra-centaur ladies accompanying the god of wine that show up later in the scene in all versions.
Showing that fat people that are drunks isn't discriminatory? It was just a kid centaur being minstrel but because it was black it's better to censor it and delete the kid
@@EnigmazGuide what??? 😭😭 not all representation is good representation. The character was a racist stereotype. I'll give you a pass since the way you type makes you sound really young, so you probably just don't understand
@@EnigmazGuide There are black zebra centaur ladies in the same animated segment that weren't censored. The removed characters however were not "representation", they were mockery. 1.They're half donkey, an animal ofter considered unintelligent 2.They're servants and clearly seen as inferior to the horse ladies 3.Their appearance is a stereotype, with exaggerated red lips and buck teeth. While I think it'd be better for Disney to acknowledge their past racism instead of erasing it, the removal of these caricatures is the opposite of racist.
Honestly I think her design is cute but too racially stereotypical. She could use a few tweaks to make her look less stereotypical and she’ll be fine ❤
Не слишком-то и стериотипно если по факту. Наоборот, говоря что это не соответстует действительности, ты преуменьшаешь расовую идентичность черных, ведь большинство, как сказал комментатор выше реально выглядят так. Негры с точеными и аккуратными чертами лица походящие на европеоидные это либо мулаты во 2-ом поколении, либо результат пластической коррекции.
@@juanpablosilva5082 you literally said it yourself, SOME may look like that, not all, and to stereotype someone, you GENERALIZE the WHOLE GROUP, not some, not most, you see ALL the people as ONE THING, which is negative not to mention the design was created to be offensive and to mock black people, walt disney was alive at the time of this movie being made, and he was a racist white supremacist, don't you think that he created the low quality design character to poke fun at black people??
Some would take offense to the chinese mushrooms as it depicts them as having vertical lines for eyes instead of pupils a common stereotype of asian people
@@A_Black_Sheep94 Okay, but like if you removed Mercutio from Romeo and Juliet then Romeo has no reason to go to the party and meet Juliet. If you remove the Nurse from Romeo and Juliet then we lose most of Juliet's monologues because she has no audience to talk to about it. (Notice that I am specifically choosing two comic relief non-main characters to keep it comparable) Characters exist in a story to help the story along. Ideally, every character adds to or alters the story in some meaningful way.
@@samuellasky7771 The thing that drives the plot forward can always be swapped for something else. Romeo already could have planned on going, it could have been spur of the the moment, it could have been literally anything. Non essential characters that can be removed, changed, or even swap places.
ok but this censorship is different from the censoring you're thinking of. This censoring is to make something racist enjoyable for others. This isn't erasing the original. We can still learn from the past because the uncensored version is still available.
"These cartoons you are about to see are products of their time. They depict some of the ethnic and racial prejudices that were commonplace in American society. These depictions were wrong then and they are wrong today. While the following does not represent the Warner Bros. view of today's society, these cartoons are being depicted as they were originally created, because to do otherwise would be the same as claiming these prejudices never existed." This is what they should have done. Something like this.
Trying to prettt up your history by censoring your old films instead of owning up to it is not a good look, then again what does Disney have to fear about looking bad.
They have a disclamer at the begininng of most of their old films now saying that certain depictions in the movie are from another time, and do not currently reflect Disney Values or whatever, so they do sorta own up to it
typical american way same they did through 30 years by rewriting soviet history for the pre-baltic chihahuas,to china's history,koreas,iran's,syria as well,heck even to japans they managed to convince that nuking civilians twice as a good thing lol.
@@teatree7334 nah the new films are the same except it's now whites as a minority.(hypocritical since in history white people were oppressed far longer esp slavs,but hey least ppl in africa understand tht better than the US)
@@stellarobado4269 such a briliand idea... dont show kieds "racism" and keep it secret/taboo then be surprised in xx years that they back with it way stronger, but its be "taboo" so no one will talk about it ... oh w8 it happened now... gues what the most grup is racist? bingo this ersed from this kind of shows and they put they "racist behavior" against European as well as Asians... but no one can say them this because its "racism" too hell yehh american logic XD
They should have put sunflower back in but had her be treated just as well as all the other horses... They should have done that to make up for it. Poor sunflower. They deleted her existence instead of fixing it.
I actually feel Disney missed a teaching moment about back then and now, there should have been a commentary on Sunflower as a character and the racial stigma behind it. Problematic as it is, we need to remember this is still a real problem
I fully agree, and also low key think this way has it's merit too, like maybe you could pick in the DVD menu if you want the censored or educational version, because technically the version with out the racism matches the experience the artist were going for, and could be more fun for people who want a break from the topic, (especially if they experience it).
It is a nice character, what it's based on doesn't really matter to an audience of kids. (in this case specifically, there are ofc worse depictions out there).
@@coffeepot3123 Ladies and gentlemen, coming from the "displaying same sex relationships in childrens media is evil" crowd, "Displaying willingly submissive slavery along with dehumanising black iconography is fine"
Todays standards are different so I would have left the original as is, so that people can see how far we've come. Appreciate the hard work of the time that went into it.
I definitely agree they should not have removed her, but I find it surprising that with limited tech, they were able to almost seamlessly edit her out of scenes to make it look like objects were magic
For the record, the modern change of adding more Asian or black characters is not to get “revenge” for this. That implies it’s to get back for historically being treated like- well this. No, it’s just Hollywood being unwilling to create new stories with them (SOUL is the only exception) and sometimes just to show what it could’ve been had we not been so horribly racist as a society for a few hundred years during the time these stories came out. Some stories back then DID have black main characters but had to be changed because people wouldn’t read/watch them (like Charlie from Charlie in the Chocolate Factory originally was black, but you wouldn’t know it without looking). The old versions of those stories haven’t gone anywhere and people can still enjoy them; people are just hateful and hate seeing black people in anything…
"People arw just hateful of seeing black people in anything", yes cuz that was a good representation of black people. Do you spend everydayvfinding racial differences in your life? If so then your not living life my friend, not everything is about race genius.
that's so true, she could be great character but yeah, they would have to remake everything and i dont think they would like to spend money on it remove it is just easier
Plenty of OG animators who would've jumped at the opportunity to animate new characters. But also preserve both versions for the sake of posterity rather than acting like it never happened
I don’t think bad is the correct word. Good and bad are constructs. Back then it was perfectly fine. So i don’t know how much you know about historical analysis but there are basically two ways. The “value-judgement” which is to judge a situation by current standards. And “objective-judgement” meaning what did the people back then see it as. If you take a middle ground between both you’ll find that these old versions are beautiful in its own right.
@@bendover4668 Back then half the world owned people, racist stereotypes are bad period. The person who perpetuated those stereotypes aren't necessarily bad people but they're 100% doing a very bad thing.
@@smiles9882 the people who did the animation didn’t do them for the cause of harm, they believed it’s normal. So if you view it fairly it’s not meant malicious. I find it rather beautiful.
Funny thing is that she was my favorite character in that scene when I was a kid. I wanted her to be my friend. I never even considered that she might be a slave. Probably because I was to young to know about slavery.
I think this can be called authentic whitewashed because a black character was taken to the extreme of making him transparent why is that or they gave him an enormous power up of being an invisible but tangible force that everyone feels and perceives
When I get one of those "everyone gets it on their recommended" videos, it's usually a few days or even weeks after most people got it. Right now I'm seeing comments less than a minute old. Wow.
So basically the black character was just there to stereotype and make fun of the black community, there was no reason for her to be there because the animation still is beautiful and works without her smh that’s what I got from watching this
not really, the scenes in the censored version where she was supposed to be look zoomed in and kind awkward, and the red carpet unravelling by itself is odd when there is nothing else magical like that in the cartoon, they couldn't have just have it already rolled out? That's a clear indication that something was removed.
Dunno why the algorithm randomly gave me this nearly 4 y/o video. For those bickering in the comments, the character wasn't removed because they are a person of color. They were removed because it showed the person of color in a subservient role to the "white" character. Doesn't matter that they're fictional creatures and not actual humans, the undertones are blatantly apparent. I swear people that blame "snowflakes" will do all kinds of mental gymnastics to make something what it isn't. People aren't saying there shouldn't be PoC characters in this, they're saying to give them more diverse roles than servants because they are just as capable as anyone else. And that's before getting into the exaggerated features such as the lips which are stereotypical racist caricatures.
More so, the people complaing about how "the wokist are ruining everything" clearly have no idea that the racist depiction in Fantasia was first removed in 1969. That's how backwards and out of touch these morons are.
I remember being so confused by that one scene were the centaur girl turns around and looks confused for no reason, and also the carpet unrolling itself. I'm not sure if it's even really my place to say what they should have done, but they could have at least cut out the whole scenes instead of painting her out and making the footage confusing.
