Final Fantasy VII Remake Ending Analysis & Critique | Spoiler Talk 

@Lockonese yeah, seems fair

Chocobo Phoenix down don’t bring people back to life the resuscitate knocked out allies...

@@zenith5048 same concept though.

GinsuJunior no if I knock you out you will eventually regain consciousness on your own. If I stab you through the chest with sephiroth’s sword you ain’t getting back up. Phoenix downs dont bring people back to life.

People are so dumb yes they can

CHEESEBURGERS, DRIVE-IN MOVIES, AND ROCKET SHIPS.

Both.

I personally think Aerith was conflicted on challenging Fate. It's clear that Sephiroth orchestrated this event and that on principle makes me personally not able to hate it (Sephiroth can do no wrong in my eyes). Aerith mentions that she misses the steel sky after referring to the terrifying freedom as a never ending sky. This implies to me that she misses knowing the future and how it would play out, as well as it being a double entendre with them leaving Midgar. But I will also forgive anyone who hates this, because I would be a liar if I said it was what I wanted because it definitely was not. I'm thinking this is their way of bring the aspect of choice into FF7 that they always wanted to be there. Everyone is pointing to the Seven Seconds referring to Aerith's death scene, almost leaving it up to Cloud. I think it is as if they are gonna give us both, or at least I see it that way. They might give us the option through choices in the game since it is open world that could actually impact the outcome of the story. For example, Cloud could actually save Aerith and be killed in the process, being replaced by Zack (not saying I want this but I feel it is possible). Or Tifa could die, instead of Aerith if Cloud succeeds. They could give you the option if you want to play out the original timeline or their new one. Zack could also have nothing to do with the rest of this Remake series and they are leaving it open for possible spin offs for what if timelines. People DO love Zack, so I can see why they would like the possibility to give him some more time, whether it is in the main timeline with this game or a spin off. I'm of the middle ground about this direction, my hope is this next game doesn't come out like 13-2. While I enjoyed 13-2, I did not care of 13 as a whole, the first one was just not a good video game, the story be damned. I agree that Final Fantasy VII doesn't need this alternate timeline, multi-verse direction but I am open to them doing what they feel is the best version of Final Fantasy VII they can tell. This game was still absolutely incredible and I enjoyed every bit of it. I beat the Secret challenge last night and it felt so satisfying to receive that Ultimate Weapon trophy. P.S. It was totally savage to literally turn the party against the fan expectations of the game manifested. It makes me feel as if there was a lot of internal debate over the changes as well.

That, or Multiple ending.

​@@rasdan1192 This too, I think it is truly impossible to judge this ending at face value. This game is Square's legacy, they know exactly what they just did, they aren't stupid. They know how much this story means to their fans, most of whom started playing the genre BECAUSE of the original. Also, I think it is unfair to not consider Square in this as well. The original director is now the producer, the main character/battle designer is now also the director, the original scenario writer is also the writer of this game's plot, one of the co-directors was a long time fan of JRPGs BECAUSE of the original and wanted to make video games because of it. They probably care more about this game and what it represents than ANYONE. Also, for everyone blaming the ending on Nomura, he isn't the writer nor the only person involved here. A lot of this could be a red herring, just because the game now has to exist in the multi-installment format. Think about it, why would Square Enix go through so much effort to give us the entire Midgar sequence in this almost completely faithful fashion if they intended on completely butchering the story in the next part? Up until Sephiroth was at the end of that road, this was the Midgar sequence all the way down to Motorball (give or take some details). Square Enix knows exactly who they pissed off with this ending, but everything I have seen they have said up to the release of this game was how it was intended to be a love letter to us and it was something they were truly proud of. I'm not convinced that they plan to completely change everything yet, things may be different but I think they are opening the possibility to please ALL fans of the series, not just the purists. Plenty of fans wish Aerith had never died, plenty wish they could have had more time with Zack considering he was never meant to be a fan favorite and was only a plot device for the story they wanted to tell with Cloud originally. Given what we saw in Crisis Core, it is totally plausible that Zack could have survived against all those Shinra infantryman considering the man went toe to toe with Sephiroth and defeated Genesis. That may be why they showed the Whispers there, to show that without the necessary plot elements they developed Zack for in the first place, he could have totally lived. They could be opening the door for ALL fans to get their ideal Final Fantasy VII, including the developers that had to make so many compromises with the original to get the game out in time after they left Nintendo. The purists aren't the only ones who have a stake in the game, and that's a lot for me to say because I was in the camp that would have absolutely hated this even a few months ago if I hadn't already played the game. The Remake is the best Final Fantasy game released since XII or maybe even longer in my opinion, I'm open to give it a chance to give me a fresh outlook on a story and characters that defined my childhood.

shanevstheworld it’s mentioned and shown in chapter 4

I think it was rasberry not raspberry

Cloud's name is cloud.... You know, like the one that makes it rain on your Parade

@ he likes the elements of nature. People in the ancient past were named things such as water river, previously, especially in tribes. The equivalent today would be something like Clancy Woods.

@ are you my dad?

Nomura is a god.

its like the evangelion rebuilds lol.

@@Jxudo Nomura can't write.

@@lolsmo395 but he sure as hell can draw though lol maybe he should stick to that

@@lolsmo395 he's a brilliant writer

Vincent * plz

Lol

Got em

i mean to be fair , this is the only explanation to be inside KH universe

😂😂

Somehow I don't think Cloud was going to disappear after saving Kairi's heart...

I'm fucking dying

chill Kazushige Nojima is still the writer Nomura is just there to direct. It is still the story of Kazushige Nojima. Director and writer has different role. Directing is just how you will execute the story of the writer, not adding or modifying.

@@skjor1989 How many times do people have to link the article that says Nomura WAS in pretty deep control?

@@sparxskywriter2589 of course he had! he is the damn director for fucks sake. But he isn't the one who wrote this but Kazushige Nojima. You peole are just making excuses to hate on the game. Just because it is Nomura's game. Fuck off really. Get a life.

Same man. I'm so sour.

Man I tell ya it took me a whole day to shake off the dread and sour feelings. Still worried about part 2.

When I finished the game Iwas keeping asking this to myself also LOL

Im not even mad about the ending now that i understand it more. I was just so confused at first

brivnii “Nomura: I Dont Know Either!”

its like the evangelion rebuilds lol.

In the words of Semi-Perfect Cell: "I HAVE SO MANY QUESTIONS!!!"

General Jimmies in some weird way, Sepiroth is Cell. Back from the future to claim what’s his. Also, when cloud fell through the church he talked to another cloud. Was that a cloud from the future? We already met Aerith from the future in this . Sepiroth is Cell. Cloud is Trunks lol

@@brivnii LOL haha exacly

^THIS!!!!!

I think you’re onto something here. Damn. Good catch.

I think that the game was intended to be this divisive because I cannot see them not having anyone on the team saying: Is this really FFVII? because if they had then it would not turn out like this. I am reminded of that meme when people are spouting crazy stuff and then someone says something logical and gets thrown out the window. People are talking about how works live in the public eye and not the with the creator when it has been released and this game is a perfect example because even if the game has the original writers the game apparently had a very different take for many people than what the creators thought when they revisited the story. Except for the characters, some mentions here and there and the scenery this game deviates heavily and early. Some changes here and there is no biggie because there is always room to fill plotholes or add content that overall doesn't really matter. Then comes these things that are so desynced from the previous game that no one knows if this is supposed to be a sequel, reboot, or remake. Sephirot being cryptic is nothing new but Cloud saying things like that or seeing Aerith's death so early as well as Aerith being harassed by the Whisperers when we meet her are major devitations caused because of a major addition. A lot of scenes were different from the original but the whisperers were added to course correct but why were there changes to begin with? This is where the other aspect of the remake comes in: fan theories. There are so many theories out there that are taken as fact by people so the works do really live their own life. These go above and beyond and are often fueled by passion but that passion wants to find patterns even if they aren't there leading people to be in turmoil in what is facts, developer talk or fan theories. The people that wanted the original theme and message of loss, grief, personality, and permanence lost in the first part of the series as it instead became about changing destiny, something I think very few would think FF VII was a good example of. They even bait and switch many deaths, tells people almost straight out that Cloud is not really who he thinks he is and there is basically joy instead of grief in the end in the slums (The only real grief was Barret thinking Avalanche died but they even reverted that both to him and later to us even more) in the remake making it confusing to see the same theme (but maybe that theme was an illusion, to begin with). Most people embrace the ending, regardless of what it might bring (which I think is a funny statement because then Cloud could be a permanent frog living at costa del sol etc) and justify whatever they can by discussion and debates. This is nothing new for games or media in general but there is a difference when doing remakes/reboots etc and that is the nostalgia factor and the "faithful" factor. You can use nostalgia as a force for good (like how most people like meeting the characters again) and you can deliberately go against it (to create subversion at the cost of retconning or adding new things that are out of place) and this game took that specific route. People that blame those with criticism often forget that they themselves have nostalgia but for the characters rather than the game in other aspects such as game mechanics or lore. Personally, I am saddened by everyone saying that this is the best way to experience the world of FFVII because it is the best way to experience FF VII remake. There are too many deviations to say that they are the same game, even most people agree with it as they have taken the timetravel/precognition/fatetheme to heart. Most people seem to want this to be a sequel just so that they do not have to rationalize why this game was not like FF VII. The same people often also say "just go back and play the old game" and many wanted an alternative version with heavy deviations to begin with. This to have subversion again and there are people on both sides claiming "true" fandom, which is just tiresome because they want different things, not to really invalidate people's feelings. The original themes can come back but to especially a western public we are not really used to defeat metaphysical elements and forgot them and their influence in the next game. We have a different view on things like destiny and how it actually works or is. The next game could easily focus on one of the original themes but the price was indeed heavy because they wanted to try and reintroduce subversion so now people want everything because the possibilities is there. So regardless of FF VII or FVII remakes theme we now have a mix of fan theories that because of an extremely connected world will always be considered to be some kind of "truth". Zack could join the party, Aerith might never die. These are things that the developer probably wanted people to relive the same way that people did when FF VII first came out but it is now impossible because they introduced a mechanics that is just so convoluted and they have fueled the fans that don't want it to happen instead of thinking about what it actually means. The unknown is scary because it is unknown but there is also an explorer in all of us. It is easy to be an explorer when you have nothing to lose and that seems to be the attitude that people are going with. After all, they just want more content. Most people do not want spoilers but most people that have read a book want the adaptation to be very faithful. Here we have a mix of all these things and I am told from all angels that I am supposed to "shut up and pay money" while smiling and liking the ending, its implication, and worship the brilliance of Square Enix or at the very least not voice any concerns or criticism. I am on my second playthrough but I have already played the ending more than once because I wanted to see if I was just crazy but from what I see I am not the one that is crazy. Anyway, just my Post FF VII remake Depression talking. Take care ;)

xLttPx he’s a RU-vidr, his job is to get subs and views. It’s entertainment.

Yes lot of elements goes in that direction. She's very friendly with Tifa at the first meeting and doesn't even introduce herself, she knows Marlene father before anybody tell her, she knows Marlene and the fact that she is in 7 heaven (she could have deducted this one), she give the flower to clud by saying that it's a memento, she knows RedXIII is a friend etc. In addition it's possible that she could share some knowledge, she does a weird things to calm down Nanaki, and also something happen with Marlene.

Yeah in chapter two cloud states outloud that he killed sephiroth with his own hands but he shouldn't have known that at the time. It makes me sad that we wont see this reveal in later parts of the remake... but i still like the new stuff.

Yes I feel like this Aerith knows things more than we expect I mean there was even a scene where Tifa asked her what she knows but those whispers stop her. I believe both Sepiroth and her knows the whole OG timeline and try to fix it

@@SLVperso Tbh everytime Marlene was talking about her dad I believed she was referring to his real father and not Barret. Also hmm Aerith didn't ask Marlene who was her father and just pretended to know him to make Marlene feel comfortable. I mean Marlene is so young, if Aerith told her she never met Barret Marlene would have never trusted her. Then I believe she is aware because of the Lifestream and I don't find this weird at all. For how I remember her in the original she seemed like she knew too much there too. Maybe it's just me and the 97's graphic limitations but she didn't even looked surprised when she died, It was like she was expecting it to happen. Ofc I'm not saying she was aware of EVERYTHING but...that's what I thought the first time I played FFVII when I was little.

Someone watched Jeremy Jahns 😂

Kaleb Perkins indeed lol

ahaha true thats what they marketed even in demo but at the end you get apple juice lol image someone selling lemonade at a shop then when you drink it its apple juice

Banora apple juice

Professor Hulk: "I see this as an absolute win!"

Basically this. I'm 50/50, it could be great and I could love it. There are some alternate timeline stuffs that I really enjoy. More shit with characters and worlds i love. But as people have been worried for a long time, square was extremely misleading. It is not a remake.

I'm more cautiously optimistic. My optimism largely comes from the competence in which they pulled off 95% of THIS game's story of course.

Right, because when the community asked for a remake they mostly wanted an HD ramake of the game that defined their childhood. Not an alternate reality, which lets be fair could be kinda awesome. But it isn't what we expected or asked for.

@@Rylos277 not what we asked for, but hey it's what we're gonna get! Lol. I've chosen to give them benefit of the doubt UNTIL this writing team shows me they actually can't handle it.

@@Tehblood A lot of the backlash with the ending is because of how misleading square was with what this game actually is. Im kinda the same 50/50 on it and im not a massive FF7

Hear me out here guys, but I believe there are in the remake; 3 sephiroths at this point. One of them is the consciousness from post advent children. The one cloud keeps seeing in a ghostly manner who is never there. This is who you fight in the last part of the game, who gives the cryptic warning that you have 7 seconds and he wants to see what you do with it. This Sephiroth is actively trying to encourage you to save Aerith, to change *his* fate. Even the fight at the so called edge of creation is just a phantom show. He is not truly there, a figment of clouds mind like many other things, the very same memory he tells you in advent children he will never become. Until shinra HQ no one else sees Sephiroth, because the Sephiroth who is seen at shinra HQ is Jenova walking around looking like him just like in the original. Safer Sephiroth is still recovering at the northern crater, not knowing about his future and controlling Jenova's body. This is the same version of him that will kill Aerith. The cryptic warnings come from impotence in being unable to change his own past self's actions. He is not some omnipotent being that controls the actions of all versions of him thats why he is trying to get cloud to free him from the circle jerk he is caught in. Basically helplessly watching himself repeat the mistakes that lead to his own defeat. Remember we are told repeatedly that Sephiroth cannot hear the will of the lifestream, that he is deaf to it but he becomes a part of it in advent children. Just like the whispers are a reflection of the future that Sephiroth is too. So he cannot simply inform his past self to do things differently he is trying to get cloud to do it for him. Hence why in the last cutscene we cut to Jenova's tank being empty. We don't actually fight Sephiroth in the original at this point and they hold of on showing this bit until after the fight just to sow uncertainty on wether you just actually fought the Sephiroth controlled Jenova body but that is a metaphysical fight you just had while Jenova's body escaped Shinra HQ as in the original 7. Then, when we get to the 'Zack' we see surviving in the final curtscene? We do not actually see cloud there at all do we? We see him calling out to a cloud that is supposedly offscreen and we see him picking up the buster sword. until the very last part. The altered stamp, the fact cloud is not shown until the final end, it is just a stand in for cloud himself and the delusion he made for himself. That Zack is cloud's altered memory of himself as a SOLDIER. A visual representation of him taking on essentially Zack's personality and memories to keep going. No real changes have been made yet, it is all just an attempt to mislead you as the player.

Keep hope alive

I'm expecting a 'Power of Friendship' by the end of the whole FFVII... thing (Remake, Rebuild, whatever) where Zack is summoned from the Alternate reality to fight among the party. You know, typical Nomura bullsh*t.

UberWraith Yes Zack becoming a summon lol

@TheNamelessAnt Thank you! I was planning on watching that for sure.

Hi, do you have the source of this quote?

@@sebastiangiannone5379 I think it's from an interview on Famitsu from a few days ago

Please all of us just tweet to these guys that we want a Remake, please. There is still time... however it's almost sad that they don't have even the courage to continue on this last-chpter-bullshit narrative int he future without listen to the fans... It was almost perfect... Damn... Sorry for the bad english

Hopefully not for another 23 years 🤣

If they want to see fan reaction of the game on social media, then it's a reaction they are gonna get. We have to band together and let them know. Everything was perfect except that ending. We don't want and need alternate universes or destiny involved. Just a faithful remake of the original story with the inclusion of additional content like they did with Leslie, Roche and all that. That's what we need to tell them and let them know.

It's a big ball of WIBBLY WOBBLY TIMEY WIMEY stuff.

What? How? Whyyyy?

muffin button

Nomura: “So how did you like that game, monkey?” Fans: “Uh, it was okay, it’s no donkey kong though - that has a pie level!”

they really dont need to add arbiter of fate , defying fate conflict , and alternative timeline plot in this game , these three things i believe is what makes ff7r being so polarized among PLAYERS , and among others changes they made in this remake these 3 things is what makes ff7 so different , then putting people off ... it's fine to change a things even as far as making aerith live again , but no... no no for this nomura merged with toriyama excessive obsession over a super abstract philosophical subject like destiny and multiverse stuff

This is pretty much how I felt about the ending as well and the addition of the Arbiters of Fate in general. Fleshing our characters or events that lead to the major plot points we know and love are welcome of course but not throwing in a literal stand in for the people who love the original game, stuck with it through all of its side projects despite their flaws, and have been wishing for this remake for years only to essentially tell us that we’re wrong and make us literally kill ourselves and our preconceived notions of what’s good or right for this game. It’s insulting and infuriating to say the least and it’s convinced me wash my hands of any further sequels under this game’s umbrella. I’ll always have fond memories of the original game as it helped me form the basis of my taste in RPGs and games in general, but I’ll be damned if I take Nomura practically telling me to kill myself because he knows better.

My thoughts exactly. Additionally, this game made me constantly think about spirits within and advent children. Those "whispers" really drove out the imersion for me.

​@@noktanold remember when aerith and cloud get dragged by arbiter of fate to another chamber in church ? it's just .... arghh

Well said David. This change effectively nullifies the potency of the original’s message. It’s basically the worst thing they could’ve done, and feels incredibly disrespectful to the original.

Regular Original ;_;

Proof that some bitches just never know what they want man.

She knows that leaving Midgar means she is one step closer to dying. She hinted it all through the game. Her last line just gets you.

@@taraqueen6954 Yeah she talked about a boundless sky before them. The steel sky is something defined, something with borders and structure. She knows what ever comes will be scary to here. But I do believe she is destined to die still. All through the game she knew things that were not right. Hell calling out Sephiroth as wrong is a clear sight that she knews he isnt how he should of been in this game.

in japanese version aerith says: sora ga kirai (I hate the sky) wich is different of english "I miss it, the steel sky." I dont like how they changed the script of english version... I dont fully understand japanese, but a bunch of others stuffs are not quite the same.... Who knows what else they are saying thats not the same thing -.-

No one is talking about wedge bc he isn’t dead

@@0ttomobile The last time we saw him, it was implied he was thrown off Shinra's building by the Whisperers.

Coffin it was also implied that he was crushed by the plate falling earlier but he lived. if there’s no body, I won’t accept it, regardless- his character isn’t important and that was the point of his character arc lol

@@0ttomobile Completely fair. But this time, we didn't get a glimpse of him alive afterward either. Guess we'll have to see years from now. lol

Coffin this is what happens when you rush the last chapter so much, we are left with too many questions

Everyone is either Xehanort or Sora.

Was thinking the same thing. That makes Aerith Sora

its more likely that he just saw premonitions of the future just like cloud does throughout the game. doubt theres actually any time travel involved. unless theres a time travel materia

gameplayx Honestly that sounds a lot more realistic, I hope time travel isn’t included unless it’s clear to follow - just for the story’s sake.

Septhiroth is thanos

Zacks death did happen for cloud though, assuming that everything up to the point where the timeline diverges has been exactly as it was. This is just showing an alternate timeline where he lives, which could perhaps lead to a different cloud appearing. Also I highly doubt they’ll not kill aerith but who knows I guess

That’s why this is not the same game, it’s a new timeline.

Because no one cares lol.

That's new to me. If that's true, it kinda makes sense that they'd throw it in as a reference, for the people who do know about that. I'm so happy he's still alive. Barret's not my favorite character but he's up there.

Where is this? This in the Ultimania?

@@catarena8031 they were choosing between Aerith and Barret at first, yup. It was early on in the writing of the original. Many things changed. They also had Aerith be related to Sephiroth and the scratched that to have Aerith be Sephiroth's lover and the scratched that again. They kept the same design though, both have the same bang shape from when they were meant to be siblings

@@Carla-watches That certainly explains the similar green eyes they have and the hair style.

Frank lol, maybe you are overthinking it. We didnt get much about Jenova in the original game. Jenova was an alien who took all weird kinds of forms so this was really not that crazy at all for me. I’ve played the KH games, and while there were a few things that appeared very KH in design...portals and weird bosses are not that strange for a FF game. We see a lot of this kind of stuff in the original ff7 in the crater. This reminded me a lot of the crater at the end of the game. It just looked to me like a set up for the rest of the story with tons of foreshadowing, getting us excited for what is to come in the next games :)

It's really not that complicated, it's just subverted your expectations and that's why it's been questioned. You change fate. Now the destiny of the world is thrown off balance and anything can happen. This happens across all timelines b/c the Whisperers are gone for good, hence why in an alternate timeline Zack was able to survive his fated demise. Nomura has Kitase, Toriyama and Nojima with him, they know what they're doing and want to make this game a journey to remember. Have faith in them, they've all put out masterpieces in the past.

StormSnake0618 yes that makes sense! I’m trying to keep an open mind, but like you said it subverted my expectations. I’m in love with the game and it’s one of my favorite final fantasy games (other than FFXIV because I have 260 days playtime). I am excited for what’s to come but remain cautiously optimistic.

Why are so many people saying it’s kh stuff when most of the things kh does is the same stuff that older ff games did before it

It's basically setting the stage and hype for what will come next, that's why they purposely left so many unknowns. Whether you love or hate the game, I'm sure the last 1 to 2 hour of the game left you with a huge WTF?

Complimenti per il tuo inglese invece, era perfetto! XD comunque la tua interpretazione è stata fantastica, mi è piaciuta molto e ha dissipato le nubi della confusione che questo finale mi aveva causato!

This would be perfect, in my opinion. I felt a similar way, and I really hope you're right

I really hope you're right. That ending killed all my excitement and the heartless boss didn't helped either. I just wish they don't change the story at all. Is okay to add stuff, and maybe remove somethings, but changing core aspects of it like not killing characters. Man I'm really scared of what they can do....

I am PRAYING that you're right, the only part of FF7 Remake I didn't ABSOLUTELY LOVE was that ending and the possible implications of it...

I think we are all praying you are right. The only great thing about the ending was Sephiroth standing in the cosmos. It demonstrates Sephiroth is clearly way ahead of Cloud and the others and his power is truely immense. "I think part 2 will be almost the same as the original, except maybe Aerith secretly knowing about her death, but eventually she will accept her sacrifice as the only way to stop Meteor from falling." Aerith drops hints in the game that she knows whats happening. She tells Cloud not to fall in love with her. I suspected from that moment that she knew. I hope they don't do stupid things like bringing back Zack and things like that. I hate time travel and alternate realities in this type of genre. It dosen't work.

FF Versus VII

Lyric Bembry And it’s a good thing!!!!

@@pjjulian5243 people wanted a remake. To experience the same game with the visuals it deserved. Not an alternate story.

Kevin Vu NOPE!!! I was expecting that, BUT to my surprise, it’s not!!!!!! I am all for it, this the new era and I don’t want to go back to 1997 🤣.

@@pjjulian5243 you're using a fallacy that we either go back to 1997 or tell an alternate story. And honestly that's messed up. Because this game promised this was ff7 remake. The version where we see the story play out the way its supposed to. Now it just feels like fanfiction....everything cloud is, is because of Zacks death. Everything cloud is after Aeriths death is because of Aeriths death. Now I fear everyone will survive. The strong themes of the lifestream and death and how people dont just die but still live on even after death. That very core theme of ff7 is actually being hindered. No one sees it. No is worried because they threw the biggest wrench at the very end of the game.

"This tragedy greater even than the seventh Umbral Calamity must be undone. If history is to be unwritten, let it be unwritten."

Red X I’m surprised they haven’t made sephiroth transgender. Because they clearly didn’t pander enough by making Barret the pseudoprotangonist and cloud a pussy.

@@velap4125 But....Barret was a pseudoprotagonist in Midgar in the OG. That's not new. Anything related to Avalanche and fighting ShinRa was mainly focused on Barret, while Cloud had Aerith and Sephiroth as plot-focus points. And Cloud isn't exactly a pussy, just less obnoxious than in the original. They just spread out his 'issues' a bit rather than info-dumping them on you at once.

@@JJA8020 You know.. I would not be surprised if that had a deeper meaning than we realize.

@@cercieshaia9498 It's what G'raha Tia says in the Shadowbringers trailer because he's a time traveler trying to prevent a bad end.

If part 2 is going to take a decade to develop, you'll be 40 and I'll be 50. That's just depressing.

Jokes aside, it's gonna be released in 2022-2023 if we're lucky

The French narrator from Spongebob comes in 2000 years later

Yeah after we earn our puffy white new balance shoes.

Well what ya think

That’s how I took it at first too, but everyone’s interpreting it differently, so I’m not sure.

But why show us an alternate reality Zack if he won't come into play?

This is what's funny to me, like to believe.. NO. You are absolutely right. It's like people saying Aerith knows about different itmelines MAYBE.. no. SHE MOST DEFINITELY knows about the different timelines or can atleast sense them due to her connection with the planet er... actually AFTER sephiroth touches her. Because in this version of FF7 the planet and lifestream can NOW be in touch with different timelines.

@@2sallads It's either to tie up loose ends of crisis core, but that doesn't make sense bcause that was tying up it's own end. I think in the next game or the one after future zack will help avalanche fight the next big threat. Which may not be sephiroth (atleast not fully.)

@@2sallads Square, as a company, is opening the possibility of making Crisis Core 2? Even though in the Remake's timeline he is dead, they can at least explore what if Zack made it to Midgar to be with Aerith.

João Macedo Exactly. I hate this dumbass mindset that if you didn’t like the ending then you’re a purist who wanted the game to be exactly the same. Everyone wanted the story to follow the original but more expanded and better fleshed out story, characters and events from og game. But now that it’s revealed to not be a remake, everyone’s saying “why would you want the same game?!? The original is already there”

A side quest where you can sit and watch the whole play, and Cid makes a brief appearance falling asleep in the middle of it.

@@gamerprince-tl5hg Almost makes you wonder what these people wanted when they heard about the Remake back in 2015

Its a Reboot, not a Remake. False advertising.

I feel this ending was more flashed out than the original, while still keeping the original FF7 story intact. I absolutely adored the game. Only me?

no he isn't...he is THE director of ff7r

This is a controversial opinion. Words have several meanings and from the Oxford Dictionary Remake means "a new or different version of an old film or song". Them naming it Remake was clearly a play on words.

Caramichael agreed. It is a remake though, because they did remake the game essentially. But they had to do a transition into the new. Because if they just did the end of midgar portion as the way it was in the original. It would be anti-climactic and would honestly be a letdown. They had to end the game with a bang, finish it with that rushed intensity and feed into that adrenaline u where having while your escape from shinra. I don’t see any other way they could’ve made it more perfect than this... remember, if they put the entire game in a disk, we would be most dissatisfied because of cut content to fit in a playable game that fits to modern ff expectations. Yeah they could have done an open world, but then u will get something like Skyrim or other open world games that the size of the towns don’t match the content and realism that would be envision by how this game was expected to show. Plus... developing the entire game in a re-release would cost them too much and potentially expend the funds SE has to even develop it to that scale.

@@letsfart4peace As opposed to the let down of an ending it has? I honestly feel after Motor Ball fight, having them find their way to the ground and wandering out into the desert would have been more than good enough. Same end, just less convoluted crap thrown in.

scythelord u think? It’s a single game, the ending would have no closure. And not to mention it was stated by Nomura and the developers that the game will not be the same frame by frame as the original. Plus the desert roaming is already a scene in the GS desert prison scene... have this put in twice????

@@letsfart4peace not "frame by frame" doesn't equal completely derailing from the source. Currently, we have Zack alive which is a crucial contrast to his story in the original.

DarkKnightCassus Okay, I've been trying to get the Platinum, how did you manage hard mode? Any advice by chance?

I gave up on platinum thanks to the push up mini game. It is imo broken and way too rng

Dante9006 A lot of it comes down to trying to conserve your MP as best you can. Try to use it mainly on healing. Exploit weaknesses on enemies by using Elemental Materia and their Element weakness rather than casting the spell. Pray also really helps as it does AOE cures for no MP, though it does use 2 ATB charges. If you do need to cast magic be as sparing as possible. Use Magnify with Healing is another useful tool

Dante9006 oh and if you know an end of chapter boss is coming, you can be a little bit more liberal with MP use as the start of a new chapter is the only time you regain your MP

Snake of Rivia It’s hard as balls but I don’t think Jules gets above roughly 44 pull ups that often. Just take your time with the button presses and it’s doable

I don’t know if I’d laugh scream or cry Prob all three at once

I'm expecting him to Xehanort Roche.

This 🙌😂

I mean, that is one take but I feel that the arbiters are a reaction to a group of fans who feel the need to "police" what Nomura and co. are doing with the remake, which of course would hamper their abilities to expand on characters as much as they want to, or have things play out in any way different, resulting in a completely predictable game. In a way, it allows for commentary and the deconstruction of what a remake is, but moreso I see parallels to Neon Genesis Evangelion and the film The End of Evangelion, which was ultimately created as a result of death threats being sent to the creators, and Hideaki Anno deciding to "give them what they want" but also not in systematically killing off all the characters whilst breaking the fourth wall with a more cynical take on his original message in the TV series ending. This kind of excites me personally, as though it's batshit insane and bewildering at first, it's going to allow for some more unpredictability - which I personally feel is great so long as they keep the human aspect in the characters that they've written so beautifully thus far. It would be nice to see more ambiguous/conflicted antagonists (not counting the Turks) than just the moustache-twirling fascist sociopaths currently depicted, but I guess we'll have to wait and see. That said though, the whispers may be a necessary evil, as well as a meta means of the dev team expressing how they feel with the project - one that definitely seems to be polarising but I feel and hope will allow for a deeper connection/conveyance of the original story's themes.

I like your take of this.

@@maxmakesfilms69 well said

@@maxmakesfilms69 These are more or less my thoughts too. Evangelion was just as big an influence on FF7 as Akira. And I like that unpredictably and meta commentary too. Seeing people say the game is trash and dismissing who knows how many years of work from Square (that fans have asked them to do for 15 years) based on crap like UE4's problem with texture load-in and dungeons being... dungeons has been disappointing to me. I can't imagine how Square feels about that. Not to mention shifting goal posts constantly on what they think "linear" means like every single game in the franchise isn't linear (FFXIII was merely the worst at hiding it). It's like newcomers want FF to be The Witcher or Breath of the Wild when I specifically play FF for that tight narrative and cinematic presentation.

@@maxmakesfilms69 when you use a meta concept like that to critique the consumer and expectations, you end up with lady in the water. I'm not against the concept but this just wasnt the project for it, its frustrating to see them have a great expansion of the story but also have one bad idea that permeates throughout it and alter the experience at a perceptive level. I didnt need the story to address that there were changes, i expected them. i didnt need them to basically say this is an alternate universe or timeline like its dc comics. thats just me tho there are people who are cool with it. I will say this tho, because of the whispers and the ideas they bring i cant recommend the remake to people who havent played the original, id say play that first and then sink your teeth into this one. Good game with one big story flaw.

That and it was about Hironobu Sakaguchi dealing with his own mother's unexpected death (his mother had died while Final Fantasy VI was being developed, and choosing life as a theme helped him cope with her passing in a rational and analytical manner as Aerith's death is to emphasize the feeling of loss and how to process it and live on with their memory driving you onward), but also his cynicism regarding the future of the planet itself, as even the first draft original concept idea for VII had the Lifestream idea utilized. He basically was at the darkest point in his life and used it as inspiration for Final Fantasy VII's story. The fact that they're already messing with his theme of death, mourning, and moving on by wanting to retcon deaths for fanservice and altering fate already show that they're missing the point of the original story at large just to swerve people and shoehorn the concept of fate into VII because Kazushige Nojima has a fate boner since that's his clearly favorite thematic...which he's honestly not even that great at handling in the first place.

These are the same people who made One Winged Angel, which was literally just a song title, into a literal thing.

@@palladiamorsdeus Are you ignoring the fact that Sephiroth DID have one single wing in place of his arm in his final form? The song's title was referring to that. I know he had six other wings in place of his legs, so he technically was a seven-winged angel, but the wing other titles gave to him are a reference to that specific one.

Your concerns are valid. It is scary to know they may go fucking Kingdom Hearts insanity.

A florist. A RAT DOG! dead.

Why are you using a quote from that universe? That quote doesnt exist in the alternate remake universe.

Part of my brain also thinks this way. I hope you're right on this one.

heyyyyyy someone else with a brain around here!!!

Good take. Its clear why the ending is divisive but im cautiously optimistic. There will be many changes and im ok with that - i makes it more interesting for old fans to not know what exactly to expect. But i think Aerith dying will absolutely not be one of them. Love or hate Nomura, hes not an idiot and realizes that changing such a integral part of FF7 simply cant end well.

They did bring wedge and biggs back from the dead though, so it wouldn't surprise me if they rescued Aerith as well, and that would blow :(

@@Wulfi4 They won't. I can almost promise that her death this time will be more tragic. Because they will come to the realization that she has to die in some manner. I can see a self sacrifice or some other means of death. It may also be possible that she will not die until the end of the assumed trilogy. Where in order to reconcile everything as the last surviving ancient, she needs to give herself to the lifestream in order to prevent a second calamity. I am obviously talking out of my ass with that, but I can see something that follows along the same beats. As far as Zack goes, I am on team Zack-is-dead. He avoided his Crisis Core death and is about to get picked off from afar while carrying Cloud. That scene was specifically put into the game to make people go WTF before Cloud's origins are explained further in the next installment or two. It makes sense that they would introduce Zack earlier this time around. I mean, try to remember the first time you played FF7 and saw Zack in a flashback. You probably said the same thing newcomers are saying now like "who the hell is this guy?!" I think most of the second part will focus on the obvious Sephiroth chase but will include Cloud's psyche coming undone. We will start to see more of Jenova's influence take hold earlier than we thought it would. Just my two cents on that.

Lol this made me happier after being disappointed by the ending

Keep your Kingdom Hearts out my Final Fantasy!!!! Lol i loved this though 100/10 comment

Makes sense. Nomura would want to tie in the remake to KH... not surprised. KH is FFVII's future 🤮

My mind hurts so much xD

This pissed me off and made me laugh. Well done.

You're one of the few who are thinking things through. Also am I the only one underwhelmed by the famous bike scene from shinra building??

Exactly nomura's meta-shite are a plague for the remake. The original story was grounded during the first act of the game and everything had a reasonable build up. The remake multi game structure had affected the original pace with dull side quests but the ending has literary ruined everything... Yeah going to the next game without knowing how things will play out is a nice idea on paper but this Nomura Bs of an ending honestly makes me nervous.... They destroyed the original first confrontation with Sephiroth and threw in the mix alternative reality Bs and com'on how could even a person have survived a whole plate collapse.... Nomura doesn't respect the original work and the original logic of Gaia and I think that the subsequent games may suffer from that.

@@pn8937 As Nomura's biggest defender for the whole FF15 debacle. I cannot in good conscience defend these changes. These are bad.

It really bothered me to not have the prison scene. Following the blood trails was so unexpected and impactful when I played the original for the first time. The ending and these MAJOR changes really really bother me. I think we will never ever experience the full FF7 experience on a full scale. At least this is what square tells us.

Kevin Vu I have to say that despite its many many flaws FF xv mess was not Nomura's falt... He made mistakes for sure but Fabula Chrystalis was destroyed by management decisions not director mess ups...we never got the game he envisioned, and some games of the series straight up got butchered or never got released... I even like the KH series too... I dont mind convoluted plot in a series of games that Sephiroth can meet Donald duck (although I never got KH 3 because I heard one needed to play all the rest of them to understand what was going on in the slightest). But I agree with you, FF vii remake changes are hard to defend. The original story was the main feature that made the game so iconic and changing the hell out of it just for the shake of changing the hell out of it is a dumb move which can destroy the remake.

Silence u whisper, we are no longer chained to the fate u desire

We still have the old game. It still exists. I dont want to see them turn this game into kingdom hearts.. but i'm fine with seeing where this goes as long as it deepens the story.

@@ZerotheeHero hope that was sarcasm because im exhausted of stories getting the multiverse treatment where everyone lives

I disagree with you strongerly lol

@@Meathamski yeah we still have the old game, but we wanted and waited for a full remake of that game lol. Though the story ain't finished yet, things could very much be similar in terms of story so we'll see.

He did. Commence being pissed. Source: Kingdom Hearts 3/ Kingdom Hearts 3 Re:Mind

you mean positively pissed?

​@@a7c777 It goes even deeper than KH. The secret ending of Re:Mind straight-up implies that he has similar shenanigans in mind for FFXV/vsXIII.

Enjoyed that read! Beats the negative comments I keep reading. I think the clues are there if people decide to use their brains and not moan cause its not linear like the original story line. Long live Sephiroth!

Those are some really good things to point out in terms of when the whispers were used. I definitely missed some of those. The storytelling is better in this because it's expanding on the original. They have a source material that's had 23 years for ppl to look at and optimize it. They don't have that luxury when taking a totally new direction, and judging by how jumbled and rushed this ending was, I don't have high hopes for its future. Also, did anyone else feel like Aerith lost all personality once she got to Shinra tower? I know she said she loses a part of herself when the whispers touch her, but like.... are we really going to have to deal with this new zero personality mystical Aerith who just talks all crpytically until her end or maybe even past it? The tifa/aerith bff thing was pretty cringe too. I'm really hoping this is just a weird phase because of how grand everything was and she'll go back to being how she was when we hung out with her in her first few chapters.

Considering how FF15 and KH turned out...... I have NO hope for a satisfying story on the same level as og FF7 under Nomura. Also they couldn't keep this "unique" direction for the newer games instead of messing with the old established one??? No because with the ff7 name they can ensure sales. They specifically said that the original story will be left intact however here they are proceeding to establish ground work in order to fundamentally change it. Thats was blatant lie then from them. Good to know.

youre exactly right.

@@JM-cf8zy they are just being whiny because the game is not doing what they expected. As long as the story is well written, I don't care which way it goes as long it continues in a similar direction to the original.

So does this mean that C+S is a thing in Namuora's mind lmao

Ya he walked right into this one lol

Sephorith probably payed attention and saw all of these gorgeous girls throw themselves onto Cloud and cloud didn’t don’t anything.

That might be the case, but I'm not sure how it would necessarily be any different from alternate timelines. The end result would still be that we now have a Sephiroth who is aware of his future and is taking extreme measures to change how the timeline plays out. Which would still effectively make this a pseudo-sequel, if not a full blown sequel.

I just want to know what's up with Marlene.

Wrong universe buddy. Remake is based in the universe where zack and aerith both live. Wait, or is it the other alternate universe where sephiroth turns to a good guy? Damn which alternate universe is it? 🤔

He mind f'd us all and our baby will be the second instalment

It was horrible... Still pissed!

He didn't mind fuck us he fucked the entire plot of the original and even has the nerve to call it the bad ending.

Get rid of "mind" and you're closer to how I feel.

@@RIELTURO Except that's not what the game implied. The main characters THOUGHT the future they were seeing was a bad one because they saw many extremely contextless moments they could know absolutely nothing about, so they did what was in their power to stop these events from happening, unknowingly doing Sephiroth's will. After all, wouldn't you do the same if you saw a vision of someone dear to you dying in the future? This game ends with the bad guy winning, and I have a feeling that the next one will be about fixing that mistake and accepting that fate: after all, finding a compromise between fate and free will is what Final Fantasy has been about since Final Fantasy VIII.

Yes, this. I feel like anyone who doesn't feel the passion and respect the writers have for their own creation during those final scenes was either not paying attention or they were actively looking for things to be upset about. That's not to say this ending is flawless, but I'm intrigued. It's far too soon to declare the patient to be dead. If it doesn't follow the original story to a T is that really the worst thing in the world?

You guys have to be joking. The writing quality was great as long as it followed the original game or expanded on it while staying true to its universe. As soon as they tried to diverge, writing quality went down the drain. Chapter 18 was a huge spit in the game’s diegesis. It doesn’t make any sense, is written extremely poorly (try to put yourself in the position of someone who hasn’t played FF7 and dare telling me this ending isn’t an incomprehensible mess), and it doesn’t fit at all in the FF7 lore. How do you explain Sephiroth being able to open portals to whatever place/dimension they end up in? How and why is Aerith somehow able to change Sephiroth’s dark portal into a light portal? Why is it possible to change your fate by simply punching it hard enough in the face? You, and SquareEnix, will not be able to answer these questions without breaking the rules of the FF7 universe, and that is a huge problem. So no: there’s absolutely no good writing to find in that ending, and even less respect to the original game. And that’s a shame, because beside the ending, almost everything else was a real love letter to the original game.

@@sabrakt Meh, doesn't worry me. You can nitpick the logic of just about ANY video game (especially fantasy based ones). Sorry if the ending wasn't explained to your liking yet! Kitase himself seemed to suggest the confusion was intentional, lol.

@@sabrakt How do you explain Cloud and Tifa being able to jump 50m in the air? How do you explain how Aerith couldn't be resurrected using a Phoenix Down? How do you explain cloud canonically outperforming SOLDIER members but still being "not good enough" to be in SOLDIER? How do you explain Sephiroth's ability to fly through the air or float in both the original and this? He clearly wasn't capable of it in the flashbacks. Having one wing doesn't help him. Can you point to a point in the game that argues they did change fate by punching it in the face? The whispers are a part of the world and the world's desire to stick to fate. Aerith is able to speak to that and follow because she is someone who communicates with the earth. Why is it possible to summon massive creatures for battle but only after a specific amount of time has gone by? Why do these creatures care about such criteria? Final Fantasy has always been a fantasy series with internally inconsistent logic in places. You cannot point to a few small points in this game that "don't make sense" (to YOU) as evidence that the game is written "poorly." My writing professors would ask you to actually support your criteria for poor writing and provide examples beyond "it just doesn't make sense." It functions as an allegory that any attempt to truly create an original will always have deviations (the butterfly effect) and the writers wanted to find a way to express and address that fear within the game. The video explains what it means to you and what the intended purpose behind it was from a writer's perspective, and many others delve into this as well.

Yes, the writing quality is amazing, I love watered down versions of original lines such as "Like this train, I suppose, it can only go one way" vs "It's like this train, it can't run anywhere except where it's rails take it", and "Not like mine, no, it's special. Mine's not good for anything at all" "Bet you just don't know how to use it." "Could be. Though I really don't mind. Just having it is enough. It's a gift from my mother." vs "But mine is special. It's good for absolutely nothing." "...Good for nothing? You just don't know how to use it". "No, I do... It just doesn't do anything. I feel safe just having it. It was my mother's." I feel like it's pretty obvious which ones are better written. Especially the materia scene. Implying Aerith knew how to use it is pretty important in the grand scheme of things. Even the fact that the new line is "It IS a gift from my mother" vs "It WAS my mother's", is an important distinction that removes a lot of emotion from the scene. There were a lot of watered down dialog choices in the remake that would have been better done if they had've used the original writing. Then there's Barrett. An entire mess of a character in the remake, and a nearly perfect example of good writing in the original. I actually loved the original Barrett. Then when I witnessed what they did to him in the remake, I was so shocked and disappointed. They ruined his character almost from the beginning. He never evolved, he was purely just a loud screeching banshee the entire time. They only made his character somewhat redeemable in scenes where he was revealing his fear of heights, but even then right after he was back to "Me caveman, me kill all Shinra." Even once COMPLETELY DESPAIR RIDDLED SCENES lost all point because everyone survived, except MAYBE some randoms, but not one person we've met, so it's only assumed that some people died because of the magnitude of the situation. I also lost all empathy for Elmyra. Her character in the remake was extremely bland and watered down AND she was a bitch.

Aerith is now a stripper at the bee inn to pay for her mother's cancer treatment. Cloud pitches in 2 Gil.

@@deepmind5318 Wouldn't surprise me given (pretty obviously) how little he thinks of his female characters.

Lol

LOL

That would be a great fix. They wake up in the cells of the makeshift ShinRa prison at ShinRa HQ. Cloud goes out and sees the dead guard, runs back and notifies the others. From there, we repeat the Rufus Battle and Motorball battles as Faux tutorials and the true game begins with the party leaving Midgar.

@@DO4M God that would be too good to be true. This ending was trash.

Or perhaps by the Dreamweaver. It said that it creates hallucinations and stuff.

best twist ever.

Mannnn I hope they will have something in their bag in part 2 🙏🙏

I agree with everything said here. Funny thing is no one previously wailed about wanting a new story before the release but now the camp who loves everything that is FFVII points fingers at people who don't think highly of the change. Just like you, I can't find anything intimidating to the party at this point that they already killed the giant god who controls time and fate itself. It makes me feel even Sephiroth is no more than a stalker to Cloud. The fact that he had to lead them to beat the fate ghosts for him to absorb means that he cannot do it by himself, thus making him look more like an opportunistic weasel weakling than anything.

@@JackBlack-jv2wg God yes, Sephiroth was so lame in this game. Thirsty AF for Cloud's attention and hardly intimidating. The game kept telling us to be afraid of him but didn't show us why. Even the fight at the end was super easy compared to other Sephiroth battles, including all the KH ones. They did my boy dirty.

You are so right about the stakes. Even Sephiroth seemed like nothing by comparison once the Watcher God was destroyed. Like you, I also don't have any faith at all that the alternate events will be separate or be included in the main story in a cohesive, sensible manner. As for your fourth point, I always thought that the ending of the original game was meant to be ambiguous, that at the end of the day the individual fates of the characters were small compared to what they accomplished as a party, along with Aerith in the lifestream. The final shot of the game is literally the first shot, after all, and the symbolism there was always clear to me, along with the overarching themes of the story. Why is Square finally caving to the demands of people twenty years who pleaded for some cheat or gameshark code to spare Aerith from her fate?

Bit lengthy, but WELL SAID.

dude i have my doubts. but i seriously hope you are right. i feel kinda insecure about these alternative realities.

Lol 😂 damn they fcked this game up good! Cant be surprised, it’s SquareEnix.

I know how you feel. I beat the game today myself

Same my guys... what do we do now?

@@Cloud5472 I'm considering either replaying it or replaying the original game or both. Maybe finally finish Crisis Core.

@@Cloud5472 Amateur, only took me 3 sleepless days

I was hoping wedge jessie and biggs would survive but knew deep down they were going to have to die... then wedge survived and I was okay with that at least... but then the ending.. they should of left biggs dead or have him survive in an organic way... I wasn't happy he was alive I was just like "... what? why?" it feels cheap, like they can just pull any of this jessie "psyche" bullshit.

She's alive because her gears on the counter top next next to Biggs

@Milkyway2099 Nomura is in charge because he is a good director and he is the go to guy to fix gameplay issues at square. Like a bug or how to animate a attack or how to express a certain emotion in a certain scene.

@@sarthakarora3212 Nah, they wanted to cash in on the KH crowd.

@@sarthakarora3212 Nah, it's likely that Square Enix is running out of creative directors to helm future projects, Hajime Tabata left the company which ultimately led FF15's future dlcs in the roadmap to be scrapped but still releasing Episode Ardyn as it was already done before the disappointing announcement. Nomura was even surprised that his name is in the FF7 remake announcement trailer, so he only got the job because there's no one else who's willing to do a massive project like this because the director has to be responsible for a multiple games of a remake.

Glitch Walker I was so wrong in my prediction. Based on the trailers, I thought we would 1v1 the motorbike soldier after the motorbike chase scene when we about to leave Midgar. I had Thought he was gonna be the main boss with multiple battles throughout the game. Literally right till the end, I was thinking I had nailed it, we crossed passed 3 times and he was there in the final chase as well. Way to subvert expectations SE....

Final boss for part 2 will be One Winged Angel God sephiroth, and for part 3 it will be a monstrously grotesque Genova that controls all your party members. But their conscience is active so you hear their cries of agony.

No no you're completely wrong. The ending in a nutshell: "we need a final boss, let's make it Jenova, naahhh after jenova we make it rufus. And then Motorball. No no no we need something even bigger let them fight the whole destiny of the world. This should be fine..... Just one more. Sephiroth (who basically should be jenova)." Mehhh

LOL, i'm good if they make every parts ending with fighting Sephiroth. he will retain his title as Final boss

FF7 takes place only a few months after zacks death tho

Zack being shot and killed literally happens days before the events in Midgar with avalanche not 5 years.

I might be wrong but i swear i remember barret saying something like he hated that shinra changed stamp.

@@2wheelzarebetter i think he was refering to taking a dog and turning it into propaganda not changing the dog itself but i could be wrong

@@nathanc4583 I think you are right on this.

Accurate. Too accurate. I got really worried when those stupid whispers revived Barret.

Andres Hernandez I got worried when I saw them hounding Aeris when she gave cloud the flower but then really worried when they attacked the sector 7 slums. In that moment I was saying that this is unnecessary and stupid.

@Slickfoot Agreed, disc 2 first thing you see is what he did to that Zolom. It's honestly like all these "so called fans" forget FF7 and just how powerful cloud was and seph was.

D The flashback when you go on the Nibelheim mission with Sephiroth and Cloud does 10 damage while Seph does 3000+

@@Kaliospectre brilliant! Though it seems people don't care. Sad thing is the new generation is so inspired by Tetsuya's work on Advent Children. That power scaling is off the table. Cloud is boiled down to " just cause". Their excuse is, " dude whatever, it's cool and its a game" So if it makes zero sense to the OG thats ok, because it's cooler. I duno, I think story writting is a thing of the past. Bring back Hironobu Sakaguchi

.........? No foreshadow....? Did we play the same game?

To be fair there was a lot of foreshadowing in the game

I am , and if they want to change things in the future , just do it but dont make us kill the literal fate ffs

The whole game is foreshadowing dude, seriously, the moment you see Aerith in the opining credits react to the invisible thing that scares her, you know the game takes a different road than the original. It’s noticeable during the first playthrough, when you play a second time it’s all crystal clear.

This should be the top comment.

I hope your right dude, I was enjoying it so much until the last 10 percent. Worried its completely getting turned on its head. I like your positivity that the entire story will still play out as it should, with new elements to make interesting. I'm just worried about multi verse and timelines, hate that stuff. My interpretation of the ending was that they destroyed the original narrative and the entire future can be rewritten.

@@Mike-ix5sv There is a worry of that, though I just feel there were enough narrative hints presented against that idea. For a start, the fact that Sephiroth has stated intent to 'defy fate', does that not mean that Cloud & Co (and by extension, the player) will have the goal of keeping things how they're meant to be?

@@Mike-ix5sv Well, that depends on us. We are the whispers in the game. The voices of fate rearing the story to the original. If we silence now, we change that fate. I know for a fact that the next game with be two games instead of one. I have some really big reveal on info that I'm making a video about now. I want to say it's a theory, but it makes too much sense to be a theory.

@@marbarosi alright, I'm intrigued. I deffinatly picked up on the arbiters of fate representing the og purist fans.

We learned to accept it cause thats life. We grew to understand it. Now it would ruin the story and her Sacrifice

@@eftultima no. She still has to die in the remake. It's pretty self explanatory on why that is.

The senior Square Enix staff clearly have no interest in retreading old ground. There's a reason why all of Square's other remakes are low-mid budget titles (the highest production value remake they've done thus far is the upcoming Trials of Mana and it's clearly not anywhere close to a AAA title). The only form you'll ever see a remake of a Final Fantasy title as long as the original team is still present is a budget game farmed out to another division within SE or an outside development studio.

Why is it so hard for nostalgia nuts to realise SE has made it crystal clear from the start they have no intention to do a 1:1 remake and have no motive to do so either

@@anemoneyas that's also because they lost the source code to all those games

@Michael Lochlann so 2 decades later and you expect them to only make this game to for your nostalgia? Play the original. And you lot are complaining without even fully understanding where the story will take us and acting like kids who can't get what they want. Like ffs wait and see what happens before moaning about stuff that may never occur.

I loved the entire game tbh even though I thought I just wanted a direct remake, but have to agree with you on the whispers. Only thing I didn't like were the whispers. Subconsciously, they makes it feel like whatever actions you take in the game don't matter (even though the game is linear anyway - hard to explain)

Depends what you wanted a true remake or a sequel/reboot so interesting to see what happens and the fan fall out

It would be more interesting to see the player make their own decisions on the games direction for different timelines. Therefore giving the player the option to choose from two different scenarios that will change the timeline based on that decision. The whisper of fate would simply give warning to the players choice subtly hinting an omen based on what option the player decides. Thus giving the player the ability to choose for themselves how the events play out rather than the game deciding it for you.

@@Theoneandonly88able Honestly that's what I'm hoping for.

I just want the same story with this stunning graphics and combat mechanism. Is it impossible? I’m sad!

Saying that of the arbiters doesn't really track for me, as there are so many significant changes within the story that they do nothing to prevent. And what was the deal with them trying to keep Cloud and Tifa from reaching the bar long before anything of consequence was to happen? That was random. Red described them as the will of the planet itself, which was a concept from the original, albeit merely an ethereal unknown in that game.

But on the other hands, now characters we know are fated to survive risk dying. I can totally see them sparing Aerith in a route but it leading to Tifa's or Barret's death. Leading to new entirely different emotional reactions.

No no Aerith did die tho. Just in a different timeline lolol

@DevilKaz Oh yeah that would a shitstorm, but then again how many still don't accept Aerith's death?

@@LadCarmichael I think they don't accept it because there were rumors that she can be resurrected. Now the story can lead to that, Aerith resurrection and she becomes Jesus.

I get your point, but that death was the event that sparked the game creation in the first place. I don't doubt that Nomura has the capacity to shock people and take that event or twist it away from the audience, I just don't see the point. It wouldn't be FFVII at that point.

Not only Nomura, but also Mutomo and Nojima have horrible track records... for a long time really. Nomura took people by surprise with his character designs, spiky hairs and leather were considered a novelty back in the early 00's (when anime invaded the west). Looking back, these characters always looked ridiculous. Sephiroth looks like a drag queen ffs (as a bonus, he got evil BECAUSE ALIENS). Nojima goes as far as FF8, he wrote that cheesy romance + incredibly stupid time-travel plot.. and here he comes again, writing similar cheesy romantic scenes and a time-travel villain. Motumo directed FF10-2, lol

Nomura has never had a good track record. Nomura is an aesthetic artist first and a writer after everything else. This is why he is easily the worst writer at Square Enix right now. The Whispers are the stupidest meta bullshit and Square keeps letting this wierdo direct their games.

@@ShawnWeeded510 Namura became infamous with time, there are reports about how he seems to be untouchable inside Square. No one knows why and how he reached this status. His character designs are still popular in japan, incredibly ridiculous looking characters like "angeal" or "genesis", he literally picks up the japanese equivalent of justin bieber and gives them a fancy sword and leather clothing... somehow the japanese public accepts it and he keeps going. From my perspective, this is so weird because Enix is not only for show, why not scout for talent on their side? Dragon Quest is simple as it comes regarding writing, but they at least follow a proper arc/continuation, why not give final fantasy to them? Development time is not a issue after all, Nomura made Square waste millions on FF15. And lastly, to use FF13 as the template for this "remake" is something nonsensical to me, the entire world despises this game (saved by japan of course, they are the reason why this crap got a trilogy). Same linear corridors, same combat concepts, same discombobulated plot, etc.. It's a goddamn mess

@@RRRRRRRRR33 Interesting you bring up Dragon Quest since the most recent game in that series ALSO has a time travel plot.

@@anemoneyas Yep, and it is a decent time travel plot imo. At least it does its job, usually writers uses time travel/multiverse to retroactive change previous events/plots... If the public loved these established events, why change them? Square is a giant company, they can scout talent inside and outside, but they still keep Nomura at the helm. It's inexplicable, like I said, the guy is unteachable for whatever crazy reason.

Honestly it was bad enough when wedge was alive. now biggs and zack are too? talk about undermining your own story.

I thought the whispers might be the spirits of the ancients trying to communicate with Aerith. Turns out they are stand in's for the fans.

Well, that wouldn't be the first thing they outright lied about regarding the game.

@@scythelord when wedge was alive I had a instinct red flag but ignored it since I thought they could expand on why he survived but no idea what was coming lol

@@eddunbar8613 gosh that makes it hurt even more :( now we were the villains just because we wanted the same story we loved but fleshed out in modern days

Agreed entirely.

Disagreed entirely.

really wish sakaguchi was involved in this one

He is a poison. I fell into the trap of trusting his handling of this project after everything we saw since last June. 10 months culminated into this convoluted fart of an ending. I am very sour.

I agree that he shouldnt do too much bs with FFVII. BUT KH is as beloved as this overrated OG game is. Nomura is awesome for Kingdom Hearts

I’m only worried because of all this time stuff. As convoluted as the KH plot is, it wasn’t that bad until they introduced time travel and I really don’t want them to over complicate stuff.

Kafka tbh i don’t think it’s time travel. imo the whispers were like a one time plot device used to just create a fork in “destiny”. i mean, we defeated the whispers so there’s literally nothing to stop us now. we’re going down a new path, but we don’t know how different it is. i also believe that everything up until the point you defeat the whispers, was the exact same as the game , i.e cloud is still living a lie and zack is dead. let’s think about it, they never really said it was time travel just changing destiny. for all we know seph didn’t time travel but just somehow accessed the whispers and saw the future hence why he wants to change it. anyways we won’t know for awhile

Franchino Santos That’s what I’m looking to believe. To be honest I’m open to any direction that game takes as long as they don’t unnecessarily complicate things.

Kafka honestly i don’t think they will. people are just blowing this way out of context cause now they think we’re gonna be time travelling or going to different timelines or even that whispers are still gonna be relevant. they won’t be, they’re dead.

And if it isn't? If each game progressively goes farther and farther into absurdity? If we can't even explore Gaia for sidequests like we could on disc 3 almost 25 YEARS AGO?

Oh trust me with the changes, part 2 is going to need alot of fixing. Unless you loved the ff15 story and kingdom hearts 3 story, you should already know that square isnt the company you want writing your video game stories. Im not buying the next one, borrowing or renting it is my only option.

I believe I am in for a suicide because FUCK THIS FUCKING GAME AND THE 300 EUROS I FUCKING WASTED ON IT!

This sucks.....this isnt a remake....they shouldve called it FF7 alternate...

"You're" means "You are". I think you were trying to type "your". Also, there are two e's in believe. You could probably get a job as a writer at Square Enix though

@@DutchDread Eh? How many copies did you buy?

@@jamesaldridge4257 1, the first class edition, unfortunately, because I thought I was buying a FUCKING REMAKE!

If that's what they're going for and we can all just pick the choices that get us to the original story, then cool. I'm all for having options. This is modern day Square though, so I'm not hopeful that we'll get anything as amazing as an "Everyone gets what they want" scenario.

Hadn't even thought that they may do multiple endings...it's a valid theory, although I'm unsure as to the likelihood of it being right.

I see it too, but that's admittedly the most optimistic outcome for these changes. There are loads of gameplay possibilities here. They could potentially do what Mass Effect couldn't, but on the scale of something like Bioshock Infinite across multiple games. That in itself is exciting. It gives new players the chance to experience something new, whether they've been spoiled in the last 20 years or not, and those with foreknowledge the opportunity to get the remake we've been hoping for. However, I don't have any faith that SE and Nomura will do it this way. I don't know about anyone else's experience, but I've seen people new to the franchise play and become extremely confused by the time they reached chapter 17. The pacing is ludicrous and characters stop acknowledging events that they ought to. More questions are raised than answered, and the player is just expected to "get" the references thrown at them about Sephiroth and future events, despite the fact that the former hasn't even been properly introduced or explained as a character. The Kingdom Heartsy way everything went down also removes the stakes of the rest of the story, as mentioned by others here in the comments.

If we get an open world next game it might be possibility. I hope you're right!

Considering how important your choices are in this part I E multiple alternate scenes throughout and even completely missable scenes and events I think that the dating mechanic and alternate endings is almost guaranteed

It dosen't look good though does it... Zack's death is something like Thomas and Martha Wayne's death. It seems like they want to change something that shoulnd't be tampered with. Besides we know what the problem is now. There is no Hinorobu Sakaguchi to reign these guys in anymore. Final Fantasy 7 was his project as well as theres and he's not there anymore to oversee it.

@Carlos Urroz Because you are in the "crossroads of time" and it just shows that in a universe somewhere Zack lives. Considering the translations coming out of the recent Ultimania in Japan. The majority of the changes sounds like they're mostly relegated to this first part of the remake. But we shall see.

Rather than panic, i'm enjoying the ride. i'll see where it goes. Having this game is better than having nothing. That said, I enjoy this game a great deal! I love the mystery they've created. If you want Zack dead, play the original game. That is still cannon. I for one am loving this unknown journey they've taken us on.

@@echoplanet2000 That's a healthy attitude to have.

@Carlos Urroz I think there are two ways to analyze Zack being alive. 1. They are going to bring him into the FF7R timeline somehow. They already traveled through a portal to a singularity and to the edge of creation. 2. They simply showed him surviving in another timeline to stress the significance of what it meant to defeat the whispers. They may not ever show Zack again, at least not anything more than a flashback. They showed his survival in the other timeline to demonstrate that anything can happen now.

Exactly this, I personally don’t believe the theory that it’s a time travel multiverse thing, I personally think it’s all just jenova and sephiroth messing with the groups head just like in he original however I’ll still be happy if this theory is confirmed. People see to keep looking for how this all changes the original but no one seems to be looking at how it can work within the original

@@TeAXIIIT13 I think the only thing that speaks for "something about time in a more definitive manner" is the Stamp poster with a different design of Stamp. Everything else can be explained without the mumbo jumbo. There are so many possibilities. Even just time theme-wise. And then more if we think about how there is so much vagueness, so much inconsistent, unexplained and inconsistent. Waiting is the best thing we can do here.

Yakusoku no Ji the stamp picture on the packet I personally think was just a nod to the fact that Zack was nicknamed pup or puppy in crisis core and that’s the only reason it looks different, I could be wrong obviously but that’s what I think

Me too

I hate it but watching ff7 remake get ff13ed will be hilarious

There are some great videos breaking it down perfectly they really gave me an appreciation of how well they pulled it off. It all ties in preety well

Totally agree. I'm open to changes like seeing Sephrioth standing on the edge of the cosmos with a new desire for chaos. Fate is also acceptable in the sense that the Planet needs to protect Cloud and the others, because the Planet wants to protect itself. But if we start going down the road of time travel and alternate timelines, it will completely betray the trust of the fans who love the original.

Exactly. When it comes to writing, we like to see actions and consequences. When you start to add something like changing destiny, time travel, alternate timelines and characters coming back to life, it destroys the sense of narrative logic that keeps us immersed in the story. You could call that "Kingdom Hearts syndrome", where it feels like nothing that happens really matters because the logic of the world changes at any time depending on what the writers want to happen next.

Yea, the game is good, but the ending has me worried. In the past, Nomura's creativity seems to dig huge holes that are too difficult to climb out. I hope Kitase and others in the team will keep things from getting out of control.

Yep

The thing is, Zack and Aerith might very well still die, we don’t know. Zack might have to sacrifice himself at some point. Aerith might still have to die. Maybe she’ll die at another point. Maybe other characters will die this time. It’s wide open now.

Dozens of different endings and super secret endings... Would blow my mind away and shut up all the negative moaners too!

Thats cool & all if they give us a choice to follow the original story and retcon this ending lol

But what bout all of us going back and trying to get all 9 dresses? My first play though involved doing all but the two Madam M quests in Walmarket (you can only get her's or Chocobo Sam's and redoing the chapter is the only way to get the other)?

@@Ginzino I hope they do: Pretty sure 1997-Fans would follow the Original Story and new Fans there "Everybody has to life forever BS".😂 If they give us the Chance to create our own Way, fine. The PS5 sould be have enough Power to create spreat Way's. For me: Only the Original. But if they only doing are new Story with some KH-Trash and destroying FF7, they can piss off forever. Then i'm done with Sqaure.

I think it's funny how people in 2020 still expect games that can split time-lines and give totally different endings and etc... After years and years of bioware and telltale games (also David Cage... goddamn terrible writer). It's about time to low expectations and look at the reality of this gimmick.

Its basically a reboot just play the original if it bothers you

@@mellowman1020 look I don't care about the changes, but this changes suck ass. Why would you take something that's already good and make it more convoluted than I needed to be. This is a new version, everyone knew that coming in. You could have a new unknown adventure without plot ghosts an fate gimmicks. That, go play the original argument is so stupid, people are playing this shit precisely because they wanted to see the original remade? You really think i would have sold that much if it didn't have the name FF7? With Square Enix track record of mediocre games... I don't think so. They can reboot whatever they want so long as it is good. This time stuff inevitably leads to ilogical, incoherent storytelling.

@@JesusMejia-hf6li The thing is, it’s really not that convoluted. This is nowhere near Kingdom Hearts stuff where the first game already lost me and made no logical sense. My first reaction was the same as yours: ‘what the hell, the game is the same, why are those ghosts even there?’ But then you get it, you get a second chance to right the things that were ‘wrong’ about the original. You could possibly save Aerith and humanity. Or maybe they let you think you can but something else even more tragic happens out of left field. What they are trying is give you the same gut-punching emotions that you felt with the original. But that’s not possible when you know what will happen every step of the way. Biggs, Jessie an Wedge could very possibly still die for example. Here we think they’re all safe and then ‘BAM’, Jessie might be one of Dyne’s victims at the Gold Saucer to name one thing. Who knows. My point is, the next parts will be 95% the same game we know and love but our expectations will be played with and some tragic moments might play out differently differently or not happen at all or happen in unexpected ways being even more tragic. There will be no Fate-ghosts or KH-bosses, that was just the set up, nothing more. They are just an excuse to give us the same game while still being able to surprise us.

I just don't want time travel/meta shit in it man. This potentially leaves in plot holes, and inconsistencies brewing in the midst. Ff7s story like plenty others were simple enough, why complicate the shit out of it??

Oz Deveraux I agree with this!!!!

Micah Blakeslee read my comment again. The whole point is to point the attention as to why you feel the need to have the exact same game again, when you can still play it. You are one of the whispers. Maybe you’re right. The path you want kills Jessie, Biggs, Wedge Aerith and others. There’s another path that can give these people a happy ending but the danger is that it present Sephiroth a chance again. I really believe in part 2 the choice will be yours. Wait until we have a resolution before proclaiming this is a failure. You still got 97% of an EXACT remake. That should be fine enough

RaginDXDemon there was nothing “simple” about FFVII. You may not want it but again this isn’t about what you want Per Se, it’s about what can be done. It’s keeping you beloved story intact while also saying “this too could happen” in the end you will get to choose which one you abide to. The original or the remake. You lose literally nothing.

Micah Blakeslee also you can go back and look at every interview. They never said it wouldn’t be changed, in fact at some point they said if you want the same experience you should play the remaster and not the remake. You tricked yourself into thinking it was going to be exactly the same; that’s exactly what the end is about. It is exposing your desire to have nothing change, that you came into this story thinking you knew all there was to know and playing your role as a arbiter of fate. Not liking the ending is partially what square must of wanted because it fits perfectly into the narrative. You want things to go back to the way they were and I’m sure that will be a driving force of part II. It’s not a Surprise that the twist ending is heralded by the Villain of the game

Wish I could share the sentiment, modern day square-enix terrifies me because I honestly feel like they cannot write a good story. Not a single one of their games since X has lived up to the golden age of final fantasy stories. The only one seemed to be this remake and that was mostly because the story and characters were already written.. up until the convoluted ending obviously.

*TY FINALLY* someone who sees the *bigger picture* here !!! I agree 💯👌

Yeah, I can't believe people don't get this. I understand they are afraid, but... I'm sure the rest of the project will be the same as the original, just with prettier graphics and some scenes here and there to spice it... Genesis, Leslie etc... 😆

TheDezmo73 yes yes I’m starting to kind of see it that way. Cause honestly I still am not completely sure how to take the ending haha

It's called the eject button

I wonder if they'll end up doing something like that if the ending ends up being as divisive as Last Jedi was. Like still keep the ending for those that loved the changes but have an option for those that just want to experience an updated version of FF7 story. This may be way to much work going forward and it's all wishful thinking, but seeing how more reactions are going to start to pouring in soon from both sides, I'm really curious to see how Square handles it all

@@water223 Agreed, I feel like they are going to have to put out some kind of press release at some point.

Here's hoping that new experience is worth it.

I get where they are coming from. But why not have both? Making ff7 with even graphics comparable to kh2 would not be hard. New models textures fmvs would be relatively easy, and people would eat it up. They would easily make their money back on a side project like that. Considering where software is today it wouldnt take more than a couple years to do. Or give it to platinum to mess around with. After nier automata I'd give them any ip and see what they do.

@@FuturisticJellybeans Go read or watch some Reviews for Secret of Mana, the screaming shit there could peel the paint from a barn from angry idiots whining about having to 'pay full price' for a game they already played, with just a basic 'graphics update' and a 'few worthless' added lines of dialog. That instead of 'keeping the battle system the same' they should have improved it to a more dynamic and interesting one, etc. The exact things that people are complaining about them DOING for FF7 Remake are the exact things people hated about, and are unwilling to pay for, in another game released in the last year. I think the Remake is amazing, and has so much potential that it COULD be fantastic where they take it, could fuck it up too, but I'm hoping for the best rather than assuming the worst right away. :)

@@OnimaruAnji howdy. I'm really not assuming the worst. People have been begging for a remaster for 14 years since the ps3 tech demo. Others still buy every new remaster of the kingdom hearts series or even skyrim so I'm not sure where the argument is for buying the same game over. If they dont want it in HD they dont need to buy it. But there is some serious love behind this franchise and it warrants many more renditions, additions, and updates. Hopefully somewhere we get a straight remaster.

@@FuturisticJellybeans That's fair, it might be nice to see just a straight Remaster, purely modern CGI classic battle system and materia progression. But with this one, there were SO many points in the original that were written BADLY for plot convenience, so I'd like to see where this new direction CAN take it, for better or worse. :)

The real issue is that Zack was in this game at all.

When I heard Zacks voice I was like "Oh no. You are not Zack Fair."

Rick Gomez has such a distinguishable voice that it's distracting when it wasn't him to show up. I'd say the same for Reno (Quinton) as well but the change actually suits his character at this point in the story and I got used to it

i had a tough time listening to Aerith's voice. I always imagined her to sound more calm and mature, but sometimes she sounds like a kid. Sometimes her voice works, sometimes it dont. i have mixed feelings about it

Nice to hear I wasn’t the only one that didn’t dig Zack’s new VA. Probably the worst one IMO, Sephiroth was at least passable.

It does make more sense that way, otherwise why isn’t there an Aerith, or a Red. Or even Cid, Vincent or Yuffie. They are from the future after all. Kadaj, Loz and Yazoo make more sense. But I thought they were Cloud, Tifa an Barret as well the first time.

I agree. Aerith is my all time favorite character and not going to lie, I want to see her live. But knowing Nomura and SE and how they messed up my other fav character Vincent with that awful game DoC, I'm worried about how they will pull all of this off. Even if they were to keep her alive somehow, I don't trust them to make it believable or well thought out. Personally, I would like to see her survive that scene where she is supposed to die, only to die later in the game. It would shock everyone for sure. That, or to have the player's choices affect the story's direction. Either way, I would like for her to hang on longer, enough to see her master her Cetra abilities. Perhaps she chooses to sacrifice herself because she knows there's no other way? I'm pretty sure that she's still going to die (whether it will be one of the options or the only option in the game we'll see) because there's a scene in FFVIIR when she talks to Cloud in a dream and tells him 'whatever happens, you can't fall in love with me" and says that "everyone dies eventually". Now personally I HATED that scene. There is no subtlety or mystery there. It's like she already knows that she will die. Part of the tragedy of her death was that we were lead to believe that she thought she would live. She said "I'll come back when this is over". And now they're creating this forced drama where she knows, to the point of warning Cloud? That made me mad, not gonna lie. But perhaps this indicates that she chooses to die, that it's a conscious and willing sacrifice instead of being like in the original, that it was implied she didn't know.

I want you to bookmark this comment and remember it reason why is because if she doesn't die nor does Zack 2 huge characters to Clouds character development i want you back here on this very comment ave apologize for not only making people read that comment but also for being too trusting in Nomura

@@iTz_Cheshire lol wut, not forcing anyone to read my comment and sorry but i won't apologize cuz it's not that serious :( like i said, if she (or zack) doesn't die then i'll be annoyed/disappointed but other than that, i can't rly do much else. i wanna trust SE bc i just spent money on this game and enjoyed 90% of it and am currently on an FF7 high. also the story is not finished so what's the point in being so negative? just my opinion tho fyi

Agreed, there's some baiting going on. How can you keep the surprise and use the same mechanics you used before, if everyone already knows the story? the game loses it's potency.

@@jessicahhh000-0 twas only a joke lol i was really bored last night

Part 2 can be Rebirth and then part 3 be Reunion

Brian Chang I literally posted that on twitter like 4 hours ago lol! Makes sense right!? I think they have most of the whole story figured out. Maybe not fully planned but at least outlined.

Final fantasy XII rebirth 358/2 final mix

@@aznchangdude I kinda like that.

then, birth by sleep, deep drop distance..lol

I saw a few comments already saying that Nomura is a terrible writer, lol. He's the director! Kazushige Nojima, Motomu Toriyama, Hiroaki Iwaki, and Sachie Hirano are the writers. I watched the spoiler discussion of Easy Allies with Maximilian Dood, and what Max talked about gave me chills.