Yeah things sure have changed. They were in money trouble in the 90’s but I think they were trying really hard, now cost of goods is high, so they reduce wherever they can
@@crankygunreviews SIG’s and Glocks still ship their striker fired guns in nicer plastic cases. Even Ruger does now. I bought a stainless Mark 4 Target when they first came out. Gun was $675. Cheap cardboard box for an expensive gun. Friend of mine just bought a Mark 4 Tactical for $450. Came in a plastic factory case. Costs are higher for everybody.
@@kbm-zw5jd I know but every company is run differently. Most people (myself included) don’t store their guns in the factory cases or use them anyway, so they get thrown in a closet or attic, or sold
Not true my 686 plus came in a plastic case like that and I got it brand new. Yeah my Glock cases and xds and smith are up in closet I have a pistol rack for them in safe except safes full so two sit on night stand in holsters .
The Glock v S&W lawsuit was settled when S&W agreed to change only ONE thing about the Sigma design that Glock contented was a patent infringement. It ended up being a plastic shelf in the sear housing that acted as the drop safety. Glock has a similar shelf in their trigger housing which was part of their patented "Safe Action System". If you disassemble the post lawsuit Sigma's, it will have the number "97" stamped on the sear housing just to the right of the ejector indicating the year of the settlement and that the pistol is compliant with the settlement
I bought my Sigma in 1999 and still have it. The trigger sucks but the pistol after thousands of rounds shoots accurately and has been failure free and absolutely reliable.
Got mine in 2005 accurate never had a fail but the trigger pull sucked, 12 buck spring kit brought the pull down to like 5 pounds, for 50 bucks now you can buy a apex trigger that get it to 4lbs with that spring. He should also note the sw40ve and sw9ve the lower is the same you can actually change there slide using the same spring that in the top just have the using the spring that come with the gun for the slide
The SW40VE was my 1st S&W semi-automatic and my 1st handgun in 40 S&W. It has proven to be absolutely 100% reliable, very accurate, and now has quite a few 40 S&W "relatives", including one from FN (with a hammer, no less!), KAHR & KelTec, and some M&Ps as well. My second favorite caliber to reload. A " 25¢ trigger job" and an Apex kit makes it pretty close to a factory GLOCK trigger (which ain't saying much), but the reliability factor is also very GLOCK-like. For the money (which totals about $2.00 per month over 18 years) it was one of my best firearms purchases ever: I estimate I've shot 4K rounds and it is still on the original RSA. CHEERS!
Thanks for the feedback! I know they’re reliable, seen lots of videos on them, and I have had a SD9VE for several years, it’s been reliable except it doesn’t like aluminum cases ammo or some no-metal cased steel
A sw9ve was my first 9mm handgun. Always have a special place in my heart. Having said that the trigger was absolutely the worst i have ever felt, but after shooting that for years a glock trigger feels like a match grade trigger. I can shoot revolvers no problem because of that trigger.
@@crankygunreviews That will help a lot. I ended up doing the free trigger job i found on youtube and that lightened the trigger to about 5 lbs. Glad you got it in all black, looks much sexier than the two tone. Might want to pick up a recoil spring and extractor also just to have. Put theminto your cart whenever you place your next order. Not sure if they make spare parts anymore.
I have a SW9F that was my first gun purchased in Cali. It came in a real plastic box and everything. I didn't realize it was so collectible. It always shoots great and never had failures. I recently picked up a Sig P320 and P365 that both came in a cardboard box. My original firearms safety cert card is older than all the guys behind the counter at Turners. LOL I appreciated the history lesson in this vid. It made me pull the old girl out of the safe. She's going to the range for the first time in like Ever. Thanks great Vid Cranky Gun Reviews!!
I don't have a Sigma, but I have the SD40 (non-VE) with black slide and factory fiber optic sights. The factory trigger was pretty bad, so I installed the Apex trigger & spring upgrade kit. That gets rid of the hinged trigger, lightens the pull, and gives it more of a crisp break. S&W just released an SD9 2.0 within the past month or 2. It has a different slide and supposedly much better trigger than the SD/SDVE, more akin to the M&P pistols.
I have two SW9VE's that I have lightly customized with trigger jobs, CeraKote finishes, Hi-Viz Front sights, and DPM Recoil Systems. They've been great Pistols and occasionally serve as CCW's. Trigger Pulls are still a bit long, DAO, but are now smoother and lighter. They've also been very very feed reliable and accurate.
The SD9VE was my introduction to semi auto handguns, everyone said it had a crappy trigger but, me being a wheel gunner most of my life I had no problem with the SD9VE !! my one and only fault to the weapon was I could conceal it while standing but if I had to sit or tie a shoe...it got uncomfortable very quickly !! I traded it for a Taurus gx4 and I ain't looked back !!
My first automatic pistol was the same SW9VE. At the time the gun show salesmen were basically just saying, “this is Smith & Wesson’s Glock, but a whole lot cheaper”. I have seen several videos on RU-vid on how to remove a redundant “extra” trigger spring that will greatly cut the trigger pull. I haven’t been able to due this mod myself due to a botched hand surgery.
I bought my Sigma 9mm in July 1996. It was $249 and included 2 mags and a free range bag promo that I still use today. Being my only service size auto, I didn't notice that the trigger was that bad. Up until I got my Shield 9mm a few years ago, the Sigma was my EDC. I even loaned it to my buddy to use in the Carbine Course at Gunsite.
I bought 2 .40 Sigmas around 2010. I keep them in pistol safes under my car seats with 3 spare mags, a folding knife, flashlight, Visa debit card and some cash. Even though I always have other "better" guns on me or in the cars, those are ready to go just in case.
The slide release lock swaps between the Sigmas and Glock, have done this many times with Glock extended slide releases on both my Sigma and SD's. Great pistols.
Mid-2000s, a buddy bought one of these. We took it out for a break-in day, and well, it broke alright. The trigger was crap and stopped working in the first 200 rounds. S&W fixed it, but I suggested he sell it. Can't rely on broken guns.
In 1995 I bought my first gun, it was a SW40F and at the time was my duty gun as I worked at an armor truck company at the time. I still have that gun in my safe and has always been reliable. As a S&W fan I collected a few S&W over the years. So right after the SW40F I bought an SW40VE and after that the SW99 and the SD9VE and then the M&P's and so on. I still have them all and as much as people like to hate on thier triggers this old pistols always go bang and has past the test of time. Yes the triggers are long and heavy but they were ment to be like that. Their market at that time was police departments switching from revolvers to semi automatic guns. It made for an easy transaction coming from a heavy and long revolver trigger pull to a semi-automatic pistol with similar trigger.
I agree with you- the triggers feel like revolvers, and you get used to them. At 6 lbs with an apex kit they’re way better than the 12 or 13 they are from factory though.
My buddy has a SW40 with a black slide. Bought it from original owner for 250. If Glock sewed over that gun you'd think ¾ of the gun companies now would be in court.
I was so excited that you were actually about to open an sw9F :( I was thinking omg Im not the only one who started off 2024 with an sw9F! I took my old sigma out of the box and put the 9F in it.
Yeah I can't stand the trigger in either iteration of those, almost bought one until I dry fired it once. Wonder how the new 2.0 is... supposed to be more like 5-6lb modern trigger now with way less creep too.
Wonder how what 2.0 is? The M&P? I can say I didn’t like these triggers either, but after I bought a Shield 9mm, I got used to them. You almost have to put an Apex kit in any with these hinges triggers though, or change to a flat trigger and put a spring kit in.
@@crankygunreviews I think he's talking about the brand new SD9 2.0 that just came out within the last month or 2. It has a different slide and completely different trigger than the SD9/SD9VE.
I had the 9F. The trigger was way better than the VE. The F probably tried to steal the Glock trigger hence the law suit. You have the black slide Allied Forces model. The VE functioned flawlessy, but the trigger was hopeless. The 9F has a chisel type striker like Glock. Ugly ass gun, but the trigger much better than the VE or SD.
Haha. I still call them Smith Sigmas. They did not do much changing from generation to generation to call it a SD9VE from the original to the 9VE you have. Its still a Sigma and you are right. The trigger had to be the worst trigger I have ever pulled on my neighbor's Sigma....um SD9VE. Really sloppy and I recall saying that Smith should be ashamed of themselves for such a trigger since Smith pistols have always been known for having high quality triggers on their revolvers and even on their generation autoloaders.
Small arms solutions did a crime series video on these with history on when Smith made these- they were losing tons of money, and were mad that Glock beat them to market with a 40 S&W chambered handgun, when S&W developed the cartridge. They were scraping bottom and needed something, they couldn’t make anything better than Glock so they copied them, and switched parts side to side in the gun. They took years to pull their boot straps up- the M&P series really helped
I actually have a Beretta PX4 Storm in .45ACP and I can highly recommend THAT pistol - the rotating barrel system spreads out the recoil over a slightly longer time period and makes the gun very pleasant to shoot. Also they are somewhat of an unloved pistol like anoither one of my favorites the Ruger P-series. : )
Definitely money well spent! I have no experience with this pistol, but I have always been a bit intrigued. I do have extensive experience with the M&P models which are great guns.
@Ray-vq2jc I have to disagree with you on that one. I carried one on duty for four years before I retired, and I had one up until recently with zero problems. In 2008, my department transitioned to the M&P in 357, and I was one of the transition instructors. We ordered approximately 600 M&P's at that time, and we did not encounter any issues during the transition. My department later switched to M&P 9mm's around 2014, and they are still using them. If M&P's were problematic, the department would have moved on to something else. FACT!
If you're looking for a real rare "collectible" Sigma, i have a SW357V, chambered in .357 Sig. Very few of these were made. Weird, odd, unusual, etc... but i got one! (I paid too much for it, just because i had never even heard of it...)
I have heard of those, but never seen one for sale locally, and most online auctions, plus shipping, plus transfer fees always cost more than I want to pay
Just put a apex spring kit in my sw9gve. I tired the apex trigger but it didn’t work right. The trigger bar was off and wouldn’t catch the sear. I put a boudica trigger and it’s great now
I have Apex trigger and springs. You may have to file the front trigger stop. The gunsmith missed it twice in mine. After about 75 rounds I would have to nudge the trigger forward to get a reset. I called Apex and the tech said to watch the video again and file the front a little at a time. They only lightly mention that step. It has been flawless since.
Not available for my state yet. As near as I can tell it’s basically an SD9VE with better slide serrations and a better trigger… which is about what my SD9VE is already. I’ll wait till some 2.0’s come in used then I’ll buy one- unless they’re like $300 out the door
No, the police were NOT carrying the Sigmas in the 90’s. Completely incorrect and bogus rumor. What the Sigma was known for was for use by the “less funded” (aka: “financially strapped”)security guard that had to buy his own weapon. That came straight from S&W in a round about way. It was the “Harbor Freight” of pistols, for someone that couldn’t afford better quality. They are junk guns.
If it’s reliable it’s not junk, even if it’s cheap. And there may have been some small police depts that carried these… however I could see security guards carrying these.
@@crankygunreviews “There may have been some small police departments that carried these…”. Noooobody or rather no agency issued the Sigma. I can’t speak for the individual officer that bought his own, but then again a the extremely rare and unlikely possibility of a professional mechanic relying solely on Harbor Freight tools these days wouldn’t surprise me either.
Saw a sw9ve and the sw 380 at a local shop last year. Have seen three of the 380 one now , they don't feel nice . Not a bad pickup especiallyfor the price and all the magazines, they can be a little pricey, I have a SD40VE that I've had for awhile.
We own the original model sw .380...there are zero parts available...the magazine is still intact, but the day a clip on either side snaps the gun will shoot no more...we shoot a few rounds every year through the gun, clean carefully, and put it back into the safe...s&w put out that the gun has a lifespan of about 3,000 rounds, and I'm pretty sure we into the 2nd thousand by now (the 3rd thousand feels a ways off)...the sights are minimal, the gun very snappy, and I always worry it going to fall apart in hand while firing...perhaps the worst lemon s&w ever let out the door...
Plug the Hillary Hole on your S&W revolvers with the Original Precision product or the same product offered by TK Custom. I have had all my revolver Hillary Hole afflictions deleted.
Yeah, but a 5-6 lb trigger with a long pull is better than. 14-15 lb trigger with a long pull… I am ok with how the trigger works. But it needs lighter springs. It’s dangerous if you pull shots because you can’t squeeze the trigger too ;)
Good stuff! I'm incredibly high, so not sure what that 1990's history lesson was neccessary but I do have good ammo from back then! Have a great weekend
I own a 40cal. Sigma with the silver slide and the 40cal. SD magazine is not interchangeable . Sure , it will fit perfectly but the slide will not rack. Maybe you owe a retraction on this? or your just fake news like the Media? By the way , this gun has the best grip angle that fits my hand better than any of 16 hand guns I own and I have no problem with the trigger. Very underrated.
Well my SW9VE and SD9VE magazines work interchangeably. I cannot speak to yours, and I do not have a SW40F to try with my SD40VE magazines, but I have SW40VE mags that work in my SD40VE as well… maybe the gen 1 to gen 2 or gen 1 to gen 3 don’t work, but what I said is that MY SW9VE sigma mags interchange with MY SD9VE… not fake news.
@@crankygunreviews Thanks for your prompt response and you have a great channel . This is a mystery to me that the SD40 mag would not work . Maybe this only applies to the 40cal. The fake news comment was just satire. I was glad to subscribe to this channel. Thank you.
@@Ray-vq2jc thanks lol, I tend to be a bit snarky sometimes cause there are a lot of keyboard warriors that spew facts but never shoot or post their own videos.
We tested the trigger on it at our club and the trigger weight just said error. 😅 And dont go dissing mosin nagant triggers ive had 2 mosins snd they are way better than the sigma. The sigma is easily the worst gun ive ever shot. Its so bad to shoot that after shooting it our best shooter had his first miss with his own gun.
I wasn’t dissing Mosins, I love them, but they’re not known for having good triggers. I can pretty accurately shoot the Sigma, I’ve done a couple range videos with it.
@@crankygunreviews yes, sir. I wish I had the gen 2. Id be willing to trade a 9f for a gen 2 if it presents itself😉. JK my delaer has a gen 1 17 and a gen 2 19. He has them for sale for like 5 thousand dollars (a piece), and they are in ok condition I guess.
