I agree with one of the comments here. We need deep dives of 1st generation and obscure groups especially with bizarre stories. It will be a huge thing for this channel for sure!
except nobody wants to train adults who probably can't absorb shit like a sponge and will need even more lessons to be up to par with other trainees :)
@@dt4654 this isnt even true lmfao. So adults can absorb new information easily enough to change careers and start new jobs but you dont think they can learn dance routines and songs? oh please. if anything its easier for adults to train and learn because they're more focused and mature developmentally.
@@dt4654 When I was 17 I took a kids dance class, and had a nightmare of a time trying to learn to dance. I had to put in 5 hours for every 30 minutes everyone else did. After that I didn't dance again until recently. Now I'm in my late 20's and learning dances is 100x easier and I have better focus and discipline.
I hate that now 20 is considered old, its not old at all. You can still have dreams, hobbies and interests after your teen years. It's ridiculous, soon every kpop idol that debuts is just going to be toddlers or something as every year it gets younger and younger. Even for trainnees, now the max age is usually 17, ppl are going to have sign up at birth or something in the future.
It's so sad that some of these kids don't even know the full extent of what they're getting into. I hope there are laws on this soon because it's not right for young kids to be working especially in the kpop industry
the fact that I just thought about YG ent age limit did when they they posted about auditions months back, it the age minimum was for anyone born in 2019 or 2020 🥺 btw.. the maximum was for anyone born in 1932 or 1933 😂
Tbh you mostly have things after 20... like more mature way of thinking, so your art is also more personalised and stable. I guess industry doesnt want mature idols cuz they cant control them and people reason for wanting to watch kids is because theyre creepy. I dont even wanna turn back when I was 17, I came out of that time pretty well and as a 21 yo woman, Im getting better everyday. Even my face. I cant imagine how beautifull my MİND gonna be when Im 30, and have even more experience with life so I can start to share them with younger generations. Every age is special as long as you try to improve.
I think this is the 2nd most thing I hate about Kpop. Age is so important which is stupid. There is no cutoff for talent. BoA, Kahi, Hyolyn, Lee Hyori are all examples of that.
The fact that Dr music as a company has lasted this long.... I was a fan of both Rania and Baby Vox and I can't even get myself to get excited for black swan knowing the shady things the company does....
Yes but I think we’re lucky young idols has been a thing in the past too. But I’m glad Spire debuted Omega X because then it can people help know they aren’t too old to be a kpop idol. But I know bigger companies would never do this. I actually hope thanks to Omega X becoming a popular small company rookie group bigger companies can learn from Spire
I think it's fine to be trainees - they are training. There's no difference in work load between an idol trainee and a sports trainee. All the great footballers, tennis players, basketball players earning multi million trained since they were children. The problem with art is just it's unpredictable if you win or not unlike sports. It's easy to know if you have no talent in sports you can just cut your loses early but in entertainment it all depends on luck.
i feel so sad for her. i can't really imagine what she had felt with all those hates since when she's still on her first group. ageism is so stupid when it comes to kpop. she just wanted to enjoy her idol life but those anti-fans ruined her dream. i hope that she's just fine now. i never knew dr music is so fucked up since day 1 🙄
Actually DR music tried to be supportive to Lee Heejung and her dreams as best as they could. In the 90s-00s, kpop fans never would’ve accepted her if they knew her real age. It’s not the company’s fault, it’s those toxic knetizens and kpop fans that deserves the blame.
No of course not! Those big companies just have a mind of their own. Smaller companies have accepted idols in their 20s especially the 2021 debuted group Omega X. Especially since all are fighting for a second chance too!
@@gwenmloveskpopandmore companies is another thing but FANS are whole thing dear,You should know this ...... Fans in Korea are monsters in human disguise
I don't even think she is the one that lied about her age like she was already under the company and they knew her age but somehow she is now 10 year younger... sus af 💀
I remember researching on older groups (1st and early 2nd gen) and on k-profiles it said something about that member being removed from the group for lying about her age. I wondered "how did the company let that happen? Wouldn't they know she was lying about her age?" I had no idea the company made her do it! Also, amazing research! Like I said earlier, I was researching 1st gen/early 2nd gen groups and I know that it's really not easy. Especially not knowing Korean that well. I can tell you worked hard on this video, so great job!
I'm 30, and I really wish it was more normalised for Kpop idols to debut later. Honestly, for those that debut under 18 that's literally child labour, and the amount of scrutiny and sexualising of idols is way too much for a child to handle. I'm glad there are so many idols these days in their 30s still killing it - hopefully the industry will realise turning 30 isn't the death knell they think it is.
kpop companies need to realise that times are changing. By now i'm pretty sure that the "kpop community" is made out of at least 30-40% of fans over the age of 25, because it's people who got into kpop when 2gen had it's peak (or at the start of 3rd gen). I know a lot of people and i've seen a lot of comments about people being uncomfortable stanning 4th gen groups because of how young they are, it's weird having a bias or comment on how good looking an idol is if they're 10+ younger than you, and a lot of people (myself included lol) can't relate to the lyrics of the songs because they talk about school or first loves. Besides, being over 20 it's not old! a 30y/o performer can still dance and do the splits like nothing happened, it's not like you start to rot once you've legally become an adult lol
As a person who has been biasing idols that are around 5-7years younger than me past few years. IMO, you don't need to thirst after an idol to bias them. It is not weird to be a fan of younger celebrity, is more of the mindset of respecting idols and not just thirsting after them. How is biasing a younger celebrity different from biasing younger athletes?
5:00: "He eventually convinced the singer to sign under his label Deungryong Planning now known as DR Music." Welp, pack it up, boys, it can only go down from here.
suprisingly dr music started out well with baby vox becoming really popular. though indeed it's just downhill from here. rania's whole career was probably funded from baby vox's money
@@dt8602 It’s from bits and pieces of interviews. They had a bad relationship with their managers, Miyeon said that recently on Knowing Bros. And I know they pushed for the US release (with the awful plagiarism), which eventually broke them up. I don’t have a lot of concrete evidence.
Opportunities came her way and she took them. The world is about hustling, she had dreams and goals and went for them. Now on the other hand the companies knowing her age difference should have sat down with her and discussed how they were going to pull this off, change of wardrobe was not enough, when you are liked by the fans they will learn everything about you. The red flag for her was the dance choreography. At the end of the day she lived her life.
She's living well! Tough she's still ashamed by this incident :( She moved to Busan and didn't make contact with the external world for a while but she managed to continue with her life. She's mother of two daughters and she's married (she had another husband but they divorced) and she joined a mountaineering club (where she met her new husband)
it's so heartbreaking that debuting at 20 is seen as "too old". becoming an idol is a life-altering decision that can leave one in a huge debt and with many health and mental issues, it's definitely not something a 14 year old should be allowed to do! ugh, this industry frustrates me to no end
Teens can make their own choices and in Korea they would be 16 which is mature enough. even if they debut at 20 they would still have to be a trainee at a ykung age and being a trainer for a longer period of time puts you into alot of debt for when you become an idol. You debut at 15 or 16 you have alot less debt
This age thing is getting out of control not only in kpop but every where. I notice that now a days being in your 20’s is considered old. My nieces who are 15 don’t want to age any more. They don’t want to get “old”. So sad really because women are made to feel like they don’t matter anymore after they hit a certain age.
I would. I'm the same age as she was when this all happened and I would wholeass pretend to be a decade younger if it meant that I could have my dreams.
Honestly, I don't think that she would have been treated any better if she was up front about her age, especially with the concept she joined the group with. It's really saddening (and a little disgusting if I'm being honest) that 20+ is considered old when it's really not. Tbh, it just shows how exploitative the industry is. Instead of taking someone who can speak/think for themselves, there's a demand for children that can barely tie their shoes correctly (I'm being dramatic but still). Kpop fans (especially with this gen) are quick to call someone a hag once they reach 20/21 but will stan the first 14 year old they see and it's very weird to me, especially when it's older fans. Personally, with gen 4, I think we need to get on companies necks about debuting children and letting the 20+ folks debut, especially with the girl crush and mature concepts being at their height. 16 and under should be able to live their lives and not have to worry about the stresses that come with the industry
Mom the Idol is a perfect example of a first and second-gen artist getting an opportunity to re-debut despite having children and their age. Maybe this is a turning point for the k-pop industry to allow artists to work despite age. Just like other genres of music, the veteran artists still make music, go on tour and have a huge fanbase... hopefully k-pop can follow suit. There are so many talented artists whose time was cut short due to agism.
They would have torn her apart if she’d debuted as her real age. They’re agists and unfortunately her lying gave them cover to be ageist under the guise of being upset at the lie. Had she debut as her real age it would have been great but the ageists would still hate her and try to harass her out of the group.
I'm so glad she did what she had to do. I liked that she was brave enough to trick the fans by playing upon their own prejudices. That's real girl crush, not just a concept.
I was a huge Baby VOX fan. I vaguely remember the age controversy. I don't remember where or when I read it but the little I saw about it back then the blame was put on Lee Heejung and that she lied from the beginning. It's good to know the truth behind it.
I love that you are doing videos focusing more on the past of Kpop! I really want to know more about the past and history of the Korean music industry and Kpop so your channel and DKDKTV's channel really helps. I'd really like to see a video on forgotten controversies or conspiracy theories. Nevertheless can't wait to see what more you have in store!
it so sad how it's normalized to debut young women in their teens and people seem to be okay with that but if a kpop company debuts older women are in their 20s (mid and late) society seems to hate it. stop debuting litreal young women in their teens and start debuting women who are in their 20s (mid and late)
Your adult life is just starting around 20. How can you consider that too old to start being an Idol?? And how can people expect minors to make such an important career decision at that age?
thanks!! its make me cry her story i feel really bad for her :( sometimes the fandom and the kpop industry can be really hard with womans, i hate that im just hoping that Gai is safe and healthy
1st gen was chaotic. There's SHARP where the manager exposed a member for bullying another member because he couldn't take it anymore and the bully member walked out of the press conference. Then there's the death of DEUX's Kim Sungjae who was allegedly murdered by his girlfriend due to her jealousy. Then there's the sad unexpected death of NRG's Hwansung which still saddens me to this day. Many were saying it was because of SARS but I'm not sure. That time, there was still a website where they could post their voice recordings and Hwansung even left a voice message saying he's okay after he was rushed to the hospital. But his condition worsened right after. Then there's the time k-yellkies broke the car they thought was owned by DSP's CEO after sechskies announced their disbandment, but the car turned out to be owned by an actor. Luckily, he didn't sue the fans because he said they're too young and they're just students. He didn't want them to have a criminal record.
Woah this is crazy. This some how reminds me of Tablo's Stanford scandal. I honestly didn't think anything could shock me more than the Tajinyo's antics
Thank you for doing lots of research for all of your videos. Some youtubers never research for their videos and are just full of misinformation and also thank you for the amazing video quality. I always enjoy you videos :)
Me, at 32 discovering Kpop. Then discovering i'm too old to even listen to it apparently!? I don't watch the music videos/performances - I know it can get a bit iffy with some concepts. But like.. even the fandom is age-gated.
i swear you're one of the best kpop RU-vidrs and i like, don't know how you're so goddamn underrated with this much research, editing talent and info 😩
Makes me think about how VIVI's age is different on her model vs. loona profile. I wonder if that's why she doesn't want to look back on her old career
Vivi is not older, Orbits literally lied about this as a “joke” have you ever heard of the kpop stan twt phrase, “orbits are liars”? Please do not spread misinformation
Controversial opinion. I don't see the problems on lying about their own age. Like we don't lie on our CV's when applying for jobs. Stuff like writing down 2 years of experience when we only had 1 year of experience. Same thing with being member of a girlband. I don't see the problem of lying about age. If they're good then they're good, simple as.
This woman didn't even look that out of place in the group. The company just put her in an awkward situation here. I hope she is doing well and that she still has lots of happy memories of her time in the industry.
Wow, this is really fascinating, I love hearing stories about stories from the earlier days of kpop and also I truly believe agism really has its hold on kpop, making alot of companies seeking out more younger and younger trainees, so that when they debut, they will already be young to debut.
this is why i always disagree with new kpop stans who say “i wish 4th gen was like 1st/2nd gen”, 1st and 2nd gen are literally worse than 4th gen, i bet you no 4th gen group would do something like this.
Nice video. You've covered older gen idols in a couple of your recent video and I enjoyed it. I wonder if you're open to topic suggestions since I have some in my mind: - 7 Princess (7공주), one of the youngest Kpop groups to have ever existed - Marronnier (마로니에) and their "Cocktail Love" song scandal which is similar to the "Milli Vanilli" case. Thank you for doing videos focusing on the old days of Kpop like this. Keep up the good work.
this is whats annoying about kpop and the music industry (and society) in general. people act like once you turn 25 or 30 you should just shrivel up and dissapear or something. then they wonder why women are killing themselves just to look "younger." because according to society, getting older is the worst thing that can happen. its also so funny to see young girls/women try to make women older than them feel bad, or make it seem like women who are in their 20s are old. like okay yeah, lets see how you feel when you're in your 20s too lmfao.
I hope everyone watches this video would check out BABY VOX's music. they were basically the pioneer of girl crush concept we know today. they have such a good discography and all the members are so talented. i recommend: get up, betrayal, coincidence, game over, killer, yayaya, doll, wish, etc
As a Korean, I'm pretty impressed with your video about her. Though it would have been nicer if you added that Lee Gai's voice was really soft and beautiful. You can tell that she sang most of the chorus of "Ya-ya-ya" and "Change" if you listen carefully and glued the other voices together well. Also, her off dance was most likely due to her injury. As you said, she was the female version of So-Bang-Cha and did all sorts of acrobatic moves on the stage back in the days so being that off doesn't make any sense. Anyways, I wish I could give 누나 a big hug since I liked Baby VOX a lot when I was in high school.
I would love older generations videos, as you mentioned, there can be a lot of different statements due to the age of stories, and could make new kpop fans interested
That's a sad story. I don't think the public would have been any nicer to her if she were honest about her age. The sad fact is, ageism exists in many, many industries, and it is particularly hard on women.
Fantastic video! I love watching videos about the 1st gen and older Korean music. Thanks to this video and the previous one, I now learned that there were groups and solo singers pre-Seo Taiji and Boys and it wasn't just trot music 100% of the time. I hope you'll continue to do videos like this.
solar from mamamoo is one of the very few examples i can think of idols that debuted “late”, but she is a great success and i hope she inspires other girls not in their teens anymore to continue pursuing their dreams
I love hearing about the past of Kpop! It is really helpful to me since I became a Kpop fan during the 3rd generation. Thank you for taking the time to research these things 💕
20 is too old??? girl wtf yeah not like they have 70 more years to live or anything……. I’m 18 and even ik that 40 is young! 45 is young! and idc if there’s idols that are 80 in fact I’d love that so much. you’re telling me that wouldn’t be pure amazing that an 80 year old is dancing and singing on stage. I don’t wanna see some 12 year old getting milked for free/cheap labour literally wth…. like yeah you’re cute and you’re talented but go back to preschool and learn your abcs 1st please! I think you should be at least 15/16 to debut and you should only do part time promotions until you graduate high school. that makes so much more sense. and idk who the sickos are that wanna see minors sweating in stage but get a grip that’s disgusting 🤢 🤮 … honestly though you’re encouraging underage labour, pedos, etc. like do you really wanna see kids who can barely dance just got potty trained 6 years ago sound like squirrels their only vocabulary is what they learned in elementary school they can’t even spell yet twerking on stage?????? I just I don’t get the appeal AT ALL!! y’all are sick for wanting that idec you’re actually sick. and if they really wanna become an idol then they can learn 8 times 3 1st and graduate from kindergarten!! seriously so gross have fun watching toddlers stripping to blackpink songs ewww lmao okay yeah y’all are crazy do you even realize the sincerity of this? brains aren’t even fully developed until like 20-25 and you wanna see someone who has LITERALLY just started to grasp the understanding of emotions and how that effects other people. they can’t even understand reality yet most people don’t until mid-post puberty some don’t until they’re 32! also we need to get over the obsession that unless you’re 11 you look like you’re 212… doesn’t even make sense but okay. and imo majority people look very young until 40 there’s not much that changes that besides genetics, alcohol/drug usage, excess sun, etc. that woman heejung/gai/jisoo looked just as young as the other girls. actually no she did look older she looked 20 because all the other girls were literally like 3 years old so ofc she’s gonna look older. she looked like a young beautiful grown woman. not that the other girls are ugly but they’re literally 13!!!!! idec if they aren’t actually 13 they’re still too young and they look like teenagers which is what they are and that’s disgusting to me. okay I’m done nobody’s gonna read this anyway cause I just typed a whole ahh novel series about child abuse in kpop and how fans not only accept it but embrace it and loathe in it. okay seriously bye I need to vomit 🤮
I read it and you're right. You have to remember that kpop is an industry that panders to pedos so much. So here's one of the reasons why younger people are needed.
YES YES! ALL OF THIS! Lol Ily for saying this. I can't believe there are people who actually defend and support debuting 14 y/os. Even 15-16 I is too young to debut imo. No one should debut before at least 18-19. If it were up to me, idols wouldn't debut before they turned 21-23 and earned an undergraduate college degree. Completing high school is an absolute must. Idk what it is with debuting infants in the 4th gen, things weren't this bad in the 2nd or 3rd gen. This is exactly why by the time an idol reaches 30, most of them become jobless. It's like there's no respect for experience in the industry when that is one of the key aspects of what makes someone a good entertainer
Finally. Even tho I'm not a kpop stan anymore, this still popped on my feed. I've always known that there was a member from baby v.o.x who lied abt her age because back when i was still kpop fan, I've always made research abt the early groups and now that the new stans are also seeing this now is raising awareness abt ageism in the music industry💗
I really hate how netizens said that she should have been honest about her age and embraced it, yet were the same ones bullying her for looking older. Of course she had to lie! Ageism is rife, especially in the music industry, and unfortunately women fall victim to it the most.
20 isn't old omg and neither is 30! Or 40! Like if anyone has shown that age is just a number, look at all the badass female vocalists there are out there in their mid 30s and 40s and for S.Korea, I feel like BoA proves this fact very well. She's a year older than me yet she's out here literally holding a candle to idols born in 2002 like cmon man. But then again I know that kpop, as fun as it is for us normal people because we enjoy and appreciate watching the result of the time and work put in refining oneself vocally ans through dance or whatever but this also an industry that panders so much to p3d0s, so it's honestly not surprising. Old Hollywood was the exact same way.
She deserveS so much more imho…talent prevails…it’s the industry and idiocies of (I’m guilty of it too but I try to defy what we’ve been programmed to believe re: ‘entertainment’ vs ALLOWING myself to enjoy artistry no matter the imagery) of consumers….
I hate how most of the time it’s women who suffer from ageism. I don’t get why people expect women to suddenly look super old at 30 and then be like oh she looks so young(Irene for example) like, is she supposed to look older? She’s 30, not 40. I also find it sad that girl groups always last less than boy groups. For example, the girl group who lasted the longest was Jewelry but by the time they disbanded their lineup was completely different(not even 1 original member remained in the group). Anyway great video! I’d definitely like to see more of these 1st gen or even pre kpop gen deep dives
After School broke the rules when Kahi and Jungah debuted, at 28 and 26 respetively. From my point of view, usually women are forced to retire at certain age. It's like the entertainment industry only feeds on the lolita image.
Kpop is messed up oml...it's like building a whole image for yourself, giving up on who you truly are. Age, zodiac sign, height, weight, personality everything is manipulated...
"20 is too old to debut..." Well, 13-14 is too young. I actually find it strange that there are people out there that prefer a much younger age as 14 to debut than a young but mature age like 20 or even 18 and 19... I see it as someone saying that you prefer minors instead of young adults... Weird...
im seeing this after read news about former the seeya Song Minkyung rebutting in 4th gen GG Yayaya. She is 35, and a lot of knetz say she inappropriate to be in group of 20s . I dont know why knetz expectation nowadays you must be some 14-15 yo underage girl to be in 4th gen GG. Its just felt wrong.
I honestly dunno what their record label was thinking. Record label: *wants to disguise one specific member, makes only her wear hats and sunglasses but nobody else* Fans: *notice the strange attire and find out the secret* Record label: *surprised pikachu face*
She must have been pressured by the company and she must be the reason the group could be where they were due to her vocal. And the company just threw her under the bus, I hope all the director will stub their toes every morning.
I hate how much importance they gave her age, like why is it necessary to know her real age and why kick her out for it? Ik lying is bad but forcing her out of the group for such small lie is just... wow. Lot of those fans are acting like they never lied before 🤦♀️ also know there is mature person that can help the members during promotion could have been reassuring. They just ruin her dream for no reason and that upsetting 😒
there's no way it would've gone better if she hadn't lied about her age. she still would've been bullied out of the group by fans for being too old. for god's sake, they literally replaced her with someone half her age. i remember a few years back twice fans were saying nayeon's too old and she's turning 27 (international age) this year--those comments were made about her years ago, too. it's sad but i truly don't think she was ever going to make it to the final lineup, especially since they only added her bc they needed a keyboardist and she kept messing up the choreography.
Im confused how kpop agencies are debuting younger idols and force them to be mature and then debut older idols and force them to do typical teen stuff 💀
Thank you for this video. Anything similar was not available at the time I became a Kpop fan. Sadly it shows why I can't find in me to support any new Kpop group these days. And it has nothing to do with the idols, but the all about the media and the companies and fans of Kpop.
There is a rumor that was circulating a year ago that a 4th generation girl group member who debuted in 2020 and was semi popular was lying about her age. I remember people where brainstorming who it could be for awhile.
I think this is the first time that I am hear Midnight theories talking about Blackswan and Dr music. I could be completely wrong but it feels like it.
how did fans want her to embrace her age if they wanted the company to remove her from the group because her “old” age would “take away from the group’s youthful and fun concept” at the same time..
