Fort Steuben Mall | A Crestfallen Dead Mall Amidst Buckled Floors and Fractured Walls | ExLog #16 

Thanks everyone for watching! Between the comments, and looking deeper into it, it turns out that the floor buckling issue is due to the fact that the mall was built atop a slag heap. The slag will expand, and cause rifts in the foundation. I have no idea how to go about fixing this...hopefully they can hire a good floor guy for the job! Thanks again for watching and subscribing!

I wish you could have been to this mall in the 80s. The fountains, the stores, restaurants, coffee shops, the arcades, the salons, the ice cream. It was always crowded and you never left empty handed. Good times and a lot of memories.

I live about a half hour from Steubenville for my entire 52 years. It was the first mall I remember and it seemed giant when I was young. Every time we would make the drive Fort Steuben Mall would be packed, it was amazing to me coming from a small southeastern Ohio town with one stop sign. Fond memories of days gone by, we would eat at a place called Sweet Williams that served mostly ice cream and other deserts. My brother ordered the "Sweet William Special" which seemed to be a gallon of different ice creams, a huge desert that took all of us to finish. The cinemas were also amazing to me since we only had a couple drive-in theaters near our home. We had Harts and Big Wheel in Bridgeport, they were our go to stores to look at toys. Wow I am babbling on, good old days I guess. Thanks for the video sir and well done.

This breaks my heart. Moved up on 213 hill from Philadelphia when I was 7(1992) and that mall was a huge part of my Life. The cinema was the my first date with my high school sweetheart. My mom worked at the hallmark for years. We would get dropped off there and walk around for hours. The ville was this place of mystery bc it was a bar and restaurant and I never stepped foot inside. Aladdin’s castle brings back memories. I completely forgot about that. Jesus this video brings back so many memories. Getting old sucks. Time flying by sucks.

I live 5 min away from this mall....i remember those fountains. You really did the history and downfall of this place justice. It is sad how and when things fail.

Seeing that Chi-Chi’s was a blast from the past! I have some really fond memories of seafood enchiladas and ladies’ lunches with my mom and grandma as a little girl there... “Oh, hey, clueless security guy!”

Sal, the decline of the modern mall is a sad moment in our national history. The loss is in our sense of community. We shopped together and enjoyed the food court together. We rushed in to get those Christmas deals. Black Friday was a shopping holy day. Now we shop online and a social loss occurs while we lose that connection. The modern day mall's decline is a tremendous cultural loss for our society. Huge loss indeed. By the way, you are a true historian in your commentary and background music which puts us all with you as you walk through the mall. Great job!

'The smell of chlorinated water and fried food." Man, you nailed that one!!

What most people don't know is, the site for this mall was originally a landfill. They removed all the garbage and threw a mall on top of uneven and already sinking ground, which is common with landfills. That's why the floor and walls crack, because it has uneven leveling and settling, because it was a dump before it's construction, now it's a different kind of dump.

This mall was the place to be in the 80's and early 90's (my teenage years). I was hoping for more old pictures. lol. My brother and I used to throw pennies in the fountain. We ate at York Steakhouse or Elbys or Long John's. We spent literally hundreds of dollars in the arcade, and bought every suit we ever owned at Meyer and Stone Men's Store. My parents and grandparents spent so much time and money there I could walk in, buy a suit and shoes and a tie and tell Mort (the owner) to put in on my dad's bill or my grandmother's bill and walk out with my sweet new suit for the Homecoming Dance. My grandfather would buy his lottery tickets at Tobacco Land. I loved the smell of the pipe tobacco in that place. Circus World was the greatest toy store on the planet. They had EVERYTING. Too bad it's all gone.

I’m an 80s kid from Mingo and I have so many memories of growing up in that mall. The fountains, the train, begging my mom for Trolls dolls in Woolworth’s, standing in line with my dad for the first Ninja Turtle movie for what felt like an eternity because the line extended all the way past the photo place, and scarfing cheeseburger kids’ meals in Elby’s Big Boy. I remember getting one of my favorite videos ever from KayBee Toy Store for spending a certain amount of money on toys. It was a Kool Aid video with all kinds of wacky clips and a bunch of Kool Aid commercials in-between.. Yorgo’s and hot dogs at the food court, winning buckets of off-brand POGS from a faulty machine in TILT, spending some of my birthday money on mood rings from Afterthoughts, and buying Game Boy games from the Family Toy Warehouse. Calling 1-800-9-FRANCE on the pay phones and messing with the French people that answered the phone, browsing Waldenbooks with my friends, buying Looney Tunes t-shirts and pining for Starter jackets in Kaufman’s. The list goes on. 😭

How do you not have tons more subs? Your vids are great man keep it up.

Very good story about our poor mall. Reason being the floor is cracked: the mall land was old strip land and they used IMS slag from the mill downtown for the foundations fill; which it expands and contracts with moisture. And an original Kaufmann's storefront still exists downriver in wheeling,wv on main street...if it hasn't been torn down yet

Terrific, well-balanced video, Sal...I didn't want it to end! Well done!

This isn't just the mills going down, or "Walmarts" fault, the mills are down in Pittsburgh ? now Robinson mall is the place to go, it's greed , the owners of fort Steuben are well known for their's , a business gets a good year and the mall penalizes them by raising the rent! which obviously was too high , but they would rather have empty stores than lower the rent to help the businesses.. owners that don't care is a guarantee of failure!

Really enjoying your videos. I like that you give a full outline of the history of the places, and even of the local community they are in. Well done!

steubenvillan native here. I grew up in this mall in the 90s. I was the quintessential mallrat. we had two arcades. Aladdin's castle, and the tilt which was located inside the food court. we used to have multiple elaborate fountains in every corner. I remember being very young, and ashtrays were littered throughout the mall. old men would congregate in the center and smoke cigars, while their children ran amok. I worked at a game store in high school, and still have Christmas rush flashbacks. like you said, the foot traffic used to be pure madness for the holidays. as time went on, the West end hallway began to warp. because of the mineshafts built underneath that entire area, not just the mall. many of the fancy houses behind it, called country club, are experiencing the same structural issues. when that hall became abandoned, the mall cops actually let us skateboard in that section only, since there was no stores there. we had a good rapport with them for a while, since we had our own space they didn't hassle us in. we had lots of run-ins in the parking lot. through its tumultuous history, this mall has finally having a Renaissance of sorts. there's a new arcade that's gigantic they just installed & many new local businesses have opened inside as well... but it's still a pale, hollow, shell of its former glory. thanks for the nostalgia trip ✌️

That one hurt, sink holes, cracks, no pirate ship restaurants. I would love to have seen the Kaufmanns in its hey day. They were all about all consuming aesthetic. Coloratura and character at some point will be missed and hello retro. Keep up the journey, Great Job

I think you do a great job....I love that you give history about the mall's

Awesome, as usual...so much information..love it!

Frequented this mall while I was in college and immediately post as well. To think of where it was 10 years ago to today is staggering. Thank you for the footage; I thoroughly enjoyed it.

Another great fallen mall tour. For me, any video about a mall fallen from grace is always tragic. That being said to hear news of malls going under in the rural US where the communities have very little commercial confidence under a 50 miles drive is mindblowing. I feel sorry for these communities. I hope things improve for them in 2018. As always, thanks for sharing.

another great video with great history behind - looking forward to more!

Walking out this crumbling mall and into the lovely late afternoon light was a great way to wrap up this video 😊😍 Thanks for the excursions, Sal 🌇

Your narratives are second to none...subbed and notification squad-ed!!! 😁

Keep up the good work. You are getting better and better. You put so much into it. I love the comercials.

I returned to the area in 2002. I called the office of the mall the other day (Jan 2019) to ask if the local college was offering free tax preps and was told a 'new owner' from New York was considering purchasing the mall. I went to the cinema the other day, midweek. Sad, 5 of us, but I am grateful they are still open when one doesn't want to travel far in the winter.

Jeez. I'm a 80s kid malls use to be the place to be. I remember staying until they closed as a kid seeing movies chillin at the food court etc. Trying clothing going to every store playing freakin atari and colleco in the first video game stores. those were the days. The new millennial generation have ruined all that. Now ebay and amazon is the only way to shop. You can't find quality stores anymore and everything is to expensive. I would love to go back to the magical 80s. People cared and things were alot more simple.

Thank you for the memories of the '80s Long John Silver's! This is my hometown mall, and I remember its glory days well.

I grew up going to that mall in the early 90's, it has fallen so far since then. I still live close to Steubenville and went to Fort Steuben maybe a month ago just for old times' sake. It's so empty and depressing, contrasting to even my eyes having been a pre-teen then. I remember the fountains and arcade mentioned in the video. I went to a few birthday parties at Aladdin's. I even had my first date and movie there when it was going into obvious decline. However, considering the collapsed economic state of the Steubenville/Weirton Ohio Valley area I'm imagining the mall will sooner be condemned and rezoned before we see some kind of resurgence. Considering the myriad of other similarly crumbling, vacant storefronts nearby the place won't be open much longer. Sad times...

These videos are great man, as someone who grew up going to steubenville mall weekly, it’s a real shame to see the shape it’s in. I walked around during both the sears and macy’s closing and it was shocking seeing the difference in traffic once they officially closed.

The condition of the mall is sad the grounds shifted beneath ...maybe due to old mining... the economy in the area didn't support it... unemployment in the area has drastically changed with the closing of the steel mills in the area... Steubenville had fallen on bad times... it still struggles to come back from it's days of grandeur... we still hold hope for the days to come...

Another excellent video, the original interior ... extremely aesthetic, turning it into a sterile deteriorating relic. The buckling floors are insane i wouldn't doubt that there are more issues underground. Keep posting these videos enjoyed them all so far.

I enjoyed this video very much. Well done, especially the details you present about this mall. I feel sad watching this since it brings back so many memories. First, going to our local malls as a kid. Later, taking my own children to the malls.

Great video .thank you .

I love your channel so much. These videos give me such mixed emotions. I love the nostalgia wave of seeing the bones of these old malls, reminding me of my childhood memories at my local mall. But man it makes me sad how malls like this and so many others are not long for the world.

Management should convert the space to an OUTLET MALL. All major retailers have outlets and they bring visitors from outside the local community. New visitors = NEW REVENUE. Further, outlet shoppers aren't concerned with the ambiance, just the prices.

My dad once told me they digged for coal on the grounds of the mall years be for it was built and that's why it's caveing in the ground was not settled yet . But I have a lot of found memorys there in the late 80's and up untill around 1998. But even as a kid in 89 you could feel the ground sinking in .

I worked there for 6 years in the maint department if the companies that own that mall didnt charge its tennants thousands of dollars a month it would be alot better and dumped about 15 mill into it

I'm loving your videos. You have a very pleasing voice that if you ever choose to I think you could definitely do a podcast too. Just a suggestion.

My husband and I got engaged in this mall 21 years ago!!!

Just found your channel, its really great, I'm a big fan now, good job my man, keep it up!

Recently found your channel, I’m totally hooked! Keep up the good work.

I love your videos! Keep up the good work

Thanks for the great memories. I worked in that mall during its golden era. I worked at the CPI Photo Finish from 85 to 87 during high school. The theatre had 6 screens then. The Arcasde was right next to the theatre then. Even in 87 the mall was starting to fall on hard times. There was a department store in the back parking lot ( Hills I think) (it was an out building.

I went to visit this mall a few weeks ago. More stores have closed down, including AT&T. Claire's was closed, but their stuff was still in there. CarMike Cinemas shuttered too. That was *likely* a combination of factors including COVID 19 and general movie attendance as most people I believe preferred to go to the Cinemark in Robinson Township, PA.

I thought you might enjoy some updates: the Kay jewelers is leaving the mall but staying local, they’ve built a stand alone building in a strip mall adjacent to the mall property. The sears, which was newer, doesn’t have the same foundation issues as the rest of the mall (the buckling from slag, it was built better), and a local entrepreneurial family bought it, and is converting it into an indoor family fun center, complete with a restaurant and bar, laser tag, indoor go carts, arcade, and more. The movie theater was recently bought by AMC, and as far as I can tell, is doing pretty well. I remember the floors being “hilly” when I was little, in the 80’s. I remember because i thought it was just a fun feature that malls had. Ah, child like innocence! I also remember the long John silvers, and yes, the aesthetics were amazing for a little girls imagination! All aboard! You really did feel like it was something special. There was another restaurant, Elbie’s Big Boy. They had their front decorated as though you were in an English village and wanted to pop in for a bite. It looked like an old stand alone building that had a mall spring up around it. It was very charming. I do also want to point out that when the mall was built, we had a population that could sustain it. Around 40k just in Steubenville. By the 1990’s, our population dropped to 19k, under the best conditions, even pulling from the region (which also dropped population in similarly drastic numbers), thats simply not enough for an investor to want to take a gamble on. If you look into the statistics on the economic gutting of the rust belt, Steubenville has the highest rate of decline among major steel industry hubs. Even if the owners of the mall had poured every last penny into it, and given the retails rent free space for a year, the people were losing their jobs hand over fist in the 80’s, 90’, and into the 2000’s, and couldn’t have spent enough to keep the stores open. Those who lost their good industry jobs but still had years In them moved away, it was standard advice to high school kids to go to Columbus and beyond for school and work and never come back. Retirees, if they could afford it, moved away. It tanked the real estate market, which we still haven’t fully recovered from (even taking into account the mortgage bubble of the 2000’s, which actually didn’t hit us as hard as the rest of the nation). We will probably never recover the population loss, we are barely maintaining 18k year after year.

From what I’ve gathered people tend to go to malls these days for two things. Food and Movies. Getting rid of the food court probably wasn’t the best idea.

Awesome history and narration. Hope you get way more subscribers. It would be well deserved. Greets from the Netherlands.

I used to work in Sam Goody there. We closed last March.

amazing research and footage as always

I remember the night this mall opened they had a mall sleepover and us kids were up roaming the mall all night. It was something back in the day!

I loved going to Long John's there when I was a kid. I can still see it... Wooden planks was the floor u walked on to get in and up to the counter Anchors, round floats... The lights like torches on the walls... It was magical as a child. 💓 Now there's almost nothing there anymore. I worked for a company that did most of the inventory close outs at the stores. Their reasons for leaving just let u know the mall will be completely empty soon😭

These videos are all super cool, I subscribed.

Nice work! Enjoy your videos!

You left out how the former New York based ownership pushed nearly every business out with insanely high rent fees. Also, Carlisle's was gone long before the late 90's.

You have great commentary and background information on all your videos

The place to be socially if you grew up in the late 70's and 80s..

Wow your videos of the dying malls are excellent - I subscribed. There is a dying mall, fairgrounds square mall in reading Pennsylvania you’ll really like and has mabye 12 or so stores left open

Times change, when I was you we went to the mall just to be at the mall.shopping was almost an after thought.

Fine job, producing Vids... Those buckling floors... Whew!

Interesting and entertaining video. Thanks.

Interesting to see one of these videos about something local to me, even though I never really went to that mall. I live closer to the Ohio Valley mall and while it still seems to be doing okay, the writing on the wall is there that it's going downhill pretty quick as well. I was just in there on a Saturday afternoon and the place was pretty much dead. It never felt like it was really dying until the Kmart closed, and with a few of the other big stores (Macy's, Sears...) on life support, I foresee it getting more and more depressing.

I've really taken a like to your videos. I used to work at Park City mall in Lancaster PA. That's where I had my first job in 1992. Greater still are memories of late 70's-80's Park City. There was even a public flea market, cinema, and ice skating rink! It was a real treat to go there and have Orange Julius! What ever happened to That establishment? But other things I like about these sad(in a good way) videos, are the history of them, and the seemingly endless expanse of consumerism, but also that eerie rythmless ambient synth music throughout. That is key to watching these. I can't help remember Silent Hill 3. In the abandoned mall. Phew! Bad dream... I where the inspiration for the game came from(the mall)? Yes, I've had too much coffee:) How are things at Nesheminy mall? That was an interesting mall. Very sad, but interesting. Oh, I have distant relatives who were with Von Steuben. Thank you for these videos:)

I live in the Steubenville area and it's really sad see what has become of this place good jobs have left and the drugs have moved in for decades now. Crime is through the roof. Seeing our mall in person really will blow your mind at how sad ut and our area is now.

The mall has deteriorated even more since you filmed it. The area roped off (Regis Salon) has buckled even more; Regis is "temporarily closed" as of this week. When we moved to the area from Colorado Springs, CO, in 2005, we looked into opening a shop in the mall. The rent was outrageous. It was about the same as the Citadel Mall in Colorado Springs - a city with population of 383k in 2005, supported by two military bases and the Air Force Academy. I was told in 2005 that Fort Stueben's owners would not be making any repairs as they planned to use the mall as 'a tax write-off', ergo they discouraged business via steep rent. Of course, that's just one story. Other stories include the prior owner having knowledge of the strip beneath and having no inclination to fix it before it was sold to the next owner (no disclosure of the foundation situation). The new owners defaulted and US Bank had their seven minutes in court. From an engineering standpoint, there isn't any way to "fix" the buckling without tearing down the mall itself.

Long John silvers was just tore down a few years ago. Wasn't just in the 70s & 80s lol but yeah our mall is crap 😔😭

Thanks for another great video Sal, I've been wanting to see this video for a few days now. The video is tragic but I'm happy to hear something else about Steubenville Ohio other than all the rapes that happen and get covered up in that town. Steubenville made national news a few years back over that subject. It sounds like Fort Steuben mall had a great run. But with the floor sinking and the walls cracking, also hearing that the place was built on a pile of slag structurally even if it has a ton of work done it sounds like the mall itself has been compromised. I don't know how long that place can still stand safely before becoming a public hazard. The fact that the closest mall is 30miles away yet the place is severely struggling isn't a good sign either, that tells me the median household income for the area is far less than the national average. Also, I read a local on here comment that the locals in that part of Ohio cross the state line into PA to do their shopping for clothing to avoid the states sales tax? That's not a good thing for the community or for the state either. Now I can't say personally I blame these people, lower income people have to do what they can to survive I can't fault them. But the money being lost does add up on everyone's end! In my home state of VA, we have a sales tax on everything except OTC and prescribed drugs. But for one week in August, we have a sales tax holiday on clothing and office supplies to help lower income people buy clothing and school supplies for the kids going back to school. It applies to every sale except online purchases, the politicians actually got that law right! As a single childless adult I've taken advantage of that tax holiday in my state, last time I spent $350 on clothes. Between the deals they run in the state retailors give it that Black Friday vibe and the taxes I didn't pay I saved roughly $200! Now who wouldn't take advantage of that? I say this with an empathetic heart to the people of Steubenville, I see no sign of life in this mall. Not one beam of light at the end of the tunnel, sorry but I say to every local visit the place while the doors are still open. I see a wrecking ball in this malls future. Once again thank you Sal for another great video. BTW another historical fact about Steubenville Ohio. Its the birthplace and childhood home of Traci Lords, the infamous pornstar who was huge in the late 80's in the porn biz. She came forward after turning 18 to tell the world she preformed in all of her videos underage except for her last feature video! She's spent most of her adult life trying to get major rolls in Hollywood but has only been in cameo rolls.

Thanks for the video! I grew up going to that mall constantly. It was spectacular at the time (80's). It is so sad to see it now. But with the economy of the area, it is not surprising.

Out of all the dead malls that I see on RU-vid, this is the one I want to see the most back when it was open & thriving.

always a good adventure

Chi Chi's! I truly loved that restaurant as a kid. This must have been a fantastic mall back in the day.

I like your commentry and your depth of knowledge is impressive. I think retailers need to watch these videos to see where they could be going wrong and how to evolve with changing times.

Hey Sal... Thanks again for another great video...One worth checking out.. I haven't looked at all of your videos and wondered if you've gone to the Steamtown up in Scranton. I've been going there since 1995 and a neat but small two-story. Boscov's does well there too but the other anchor was the closed BonTon. I believe it was Montgomery Wards before that. Also a Steve & Berry's years ago but not sure what it was before that... I think the Mall was built in '89?? Food-court only had a pizza place and something else open when we were up for Christmas... Should have taken as poor Santa looked like he was going to fall a sleep!! Sad because I remember how busy it use to be. Take care!!

Wow Chi Chis is a welcome sight! We use to love going there when I was a kid. El Grande Burrito with beef was my go-to.

Pretty cool video Sal

I've been saying this for years. If I ever hit the lottery I would totally redo the mall. This sounds funny but...I would bring back a lot of things that it had years ago. The fountains would be put back in. I would rip the carpet up and level out the floor. The old tile floor is still there. I would bring back Long John Silvers and have the old wooden deck with ropes and lanterns back. I would put a food court in. Bring back an arcade. The train would be back for the holidays too. You see...everyone I talk to misses the things I just mentiond, myself included. A lot of the stores shut down because of the owners greed. They charged to much for rent. So they left. I would change all of this. I GUARANTEE you that I could have that mall booming again within two years. It would look and preform like it did years ago. People would love it.

Great video .Must be very depressing working in the last few stores that are opened knowing you will eventually loose your job .Here in the U.K. it is the high st which is suffering as nearly every week some large retail chain goes out of business .Keep up the good work for it is people like you who are recording the social impact of the retail closures.👍🇬🇧

The 30 miles fact is correct, but two enclosed malls are around the Steubenville area within 35 miles, just above the range you specified. The closest is The Mall in Robinson Township, PA (which is a super nice mall and is defeating the need for a mall in Steubenville), 31 miles away. The other one, 34 miles away, is the Ohio Valley Mall in St. Clarsville, Ohio (along I70, about a 10 min drive from Wheeling, WV). That mall is actually pretty decent (nothing like Robinson Township is, but still), and you still get a good bit of people going to that mall, as well.

That's what happens when you build a Mall on Strip Field Land!

This is the mall I used to goto all the time when I was a kid and in high school. Now there is almost nothing there. Seeing how it looks now it makes me really sad.

I left steubenville the day this was published. Wow, I used to go there often up until my favorite shop closed, that was spencers closed. I lived that shop. Anyway keep us updated about different places in ohio or w.v. or Pennsylvania

Great video! I made a number of day trips to Fort Steuben in the 1980s and 1990s and the mall was very nice. I REALLY LOVED the Kaufmann's ad! Kaufmann's was a Pittsburgh tradition; macy*s is just an overpriced Kmart and has closed so many of the locations they bought.

Check out the Oakdale Mall, Johnson City, NY.. JC Penny and Burlington are the only remaining big stores.. This mall ruled my childhood. Smelled like Cinnabon and Clothes... Sears, Macy's, Fowlers, Montgomery Ward, Bon Ton all in the past. Sad

The portion of the Ohio Valley which includes Steubenville and Wheeling WV has been lagging and declining in population for decades. South-eastern Ohio is covered by the Appalachian Regional Commission. Ohio is the only state in the Midwest which overlaps with Appalachia. There is not much affluence in the region which this mall served. In my mind the best thing that could happen to that mall would be for some employers such as small technology companies and back office work for banks and credit card companies to come in and occupy some of the space. Retailers could then come in and the mall could become a mix of retail and employment.

I forgot the name "Aladdin's Castle" until I heard it here. It was the place I most wanted to go as a kid... no money but I liked looking at the games.

I went to this mall when i was in high school. So sad to see it this way. But lots of mines and steel mills have closed.

Grew up near this mall, it was the place to be in the 80's. St Clairsville mall was also a big deal then

Here in California we've got the same problems with mostly deserted indoor malls... just some of the department store names thru the years are different. Of course we have (or had) Sears, Penneys, Montgomery Wards, Woolworths and later Macys. But we also had the Broadway, the May Company, Ohrbachs, Bullocks, Buffums, the Akron, Gottschalks, Weinstocks, Liberty House, I. Magnin, Joseph Magnin. Robinsons, Mervyns.

I loved that mall growing up. Its sad now

I do like your logs.

Metro Mall Phoenix as well as Castles and Coasters in Phoenix. Those would make great videos as well. Keep up the good vidz!

Reminds me of west park plaza here in billings Montana. Until it was demolished and now is called west park promenade.

This is my hometown and I avoid the mall at all costs. This isn’t strictly because there are no stores worth going to anymore, more so that it’s downright depressing. I have many good memories of this place from my childhood and it’s a shame to see what has become of the place. In many ways, it is a perfect metaphor for the downturn of the area as a whole.

I remember when the mall first opened up, it was jam packed with shoppers, my mom and dad used to let me toss a coin into the fountain. We always went to Baskin Robbin's Ice Cream shop, it's so sad how it is today you can actually hear your voice echo throughout the mall.

I WANT TO SEE THESE SMALLER GREAT CHANNELS GROW MAN..!! 👍👍😁✌

Hey Sal. You might want to cover Oxford Valley and Neshaminy Mall. Both are showing super-early signs of Dead Mall status.

The Mall was a great place at one time.

A lot of people from Ohio go to PA to buy clothing since they don't tax it. I wonder how much that affects shopping areas near the border.

Been in Stubenville mall, Century III, and Cascade galleria. I live in the area and it is sad times all over!