jointlinetrains How to design and play a model train switching puzzle, or shunting puzzle. These puzzles are similar to John Allen's Timesaver and Alan Wright's Inglenook Sidings. Music "Hot Heat" by Topher Mohr and Alex Elena
Watched this a while ago but needed to come back to comment: great video, good lighting, nicely edited, and fantastic voice to go along with it. Switching puzzles is what got me into the hobby but after getting my fill I soon learnt that I needed to get my fix with something a bit simpler. Thanks for sharing!
Bill, I like changing things up rather than playing the same puzzle over and over again just trying to "improve" my time. This way I'm not really racing against the clock so I can let the engine and cars move a bit slower, and then change things up next time I play. Cheers, Kevin.
Greetings from the UK. Interesting and fun take on railway modelling. I've always held that model railways are a hobby and hobbies are meant to be fun.
Jim, back when I started in model railroading I was modeling N scale with DC control as well. HO is much easier on my now older eyes and DCC control offers a lot more freedom in running the trains. Thank you for the very humbling compliment of comparing anything of mine to John Allen's Gorre and Daphetid. Cheers, Kevin.
Thank you for this video. I want to restart to rebuild a layout. Every little bit helps. This is a good track reference. I got something out of watching this. ☺ Happy model railroading!
Thank you. At 76, N scale, and a 30" X 4 Ft. lay out you gave me a lot of ideas to do besides just running around. With your 3 x 5 cards I think I can shuffle and build or switch a train etc.
That loco sounds amazing! I feel the most Ive heard (Im a Märklin user).. just sounds like "idle" or "full throttle" -engine sounds. Ive only done the Inglenook before, but this looks really fun. Cheers
I really enjoyed this video.. I've read about and seen these type of layouts..never viewed an in action along with a schematic of the planned movements. Really good stuff. I like your ideas at the end of the obstacles to increase the level of complexity and it's not my idea but, I also like the idea of leaving the cars that you have already switched .. roll a die to determine how many cards will now come into play..almost like a car card system of shuffling the cars on and off the layout within the puzzle. Thanks for a great video. Tom
I just downsized from a house to an apartment. I've got the second bedroom where I am going to build a 2" x 11" layout with switching similar to what you have done. I enjoy switching and I'll use the index card idea to locate cars. I
What an absolutely fun idea. I have my O Scale up all of the time but with so much N, now I have a great new game. Plus, this will be something I can certainly share with my grandchildren. One of the kids name is Jacob...such a small world...
Thank you for this wonderful video! Your video coupled with the movements shown at the top of the screen was executed beautifully, and it made this so easy to understand and replicate. I have been wanting a a puzzle layout, and this is perfect for my intended use.
I currently have enough Kato track for a double oval, but no space. This is definitely a good solution for people like me. The switching puzzle is also attractive.
Glad to see this. Do you put drops in at every spur/siding? I’m not too familiar with the Unitrack but see the various wires in your video. Thanks, Kennedy
I'm running DCC and Kato Unitrack is power routing so I try to put a feeder on ever siding to ensure power is available regardless of how I have the switches thrown. Cheers, Kevin.
I've already watched this several times, and it keeps popping up in my RU-vid feed. Are the model railroading gods trying to tell me I should build a switching layout?
Have you watched my second one yet? Either way, maybe you SHOULD build a switching puzzle. Lots of fun for just a bit of effort, and then you can take it down when you're done. Cheers, Kevin.
@@Modeltrains Yes, I have seen the second one - at least two or three times! With any switching puzzle I'd build, I would to some extent have one of the complications you introduced there, since my loco roster consists of a pair of Geeps. Maybe I could double-head them. :)
WOW! what a neat idea. i play the same game, but as a BEFORE-your-game build-up of the train that begins your game. your HO trains are OKAY. however, my game uses On30 cars: sizable freight cars on HO tracks. thanks from central canada for sharing your entertainment with us. we need to entertain one another as was people's custom back in the 40s. north america was spared invasion in the world wars. we will ride roughshod over this virus. covid-19 will learn that WE are the masters! mike
Mike, glad to hear you're having fun with some switching puzzles as well. I've got some On30 trains as well and actually thought about doing another video/game using those cars. Cheers, Kevin.
Hmm.... I'm in the midst of planning an N-scale layout that fits on a door, but mounting a 1x6 shelf on the wall in my spare room and a few turnouts and pieces of sectional track could give me something to do in the meantime!
That's a great idea. Then you can decide to either keep it as a branch of your door layout, or just get rid of it and use the space for staging. Either way will greatly expand the operation of your door layout. BTW, back when I started in trains in 1993 I was in N scale as well and built basically a door size layout that fit into a closet (I took the doors off my closet to make a train nook). Cheers, Kevin.
I have 2 questions 1. Is there any rough rule of thumb for determining whether any given puzzle layout that you design is or is not solvable given the various restrictions prior to it's construction ? 2. How were you controlling the turnouts, manually, push button, dcc controller ? Thank You
Douglas, no rule of thumb. I have created a few that I found out about half way through I wouldn't be able to "solve." At that point I usually change the rules where I leave behind a car or something. Usually the problem lies in having too many cars for the length of the run around and having enough spurs facing the correct way in order to temporally store cars while getting all the switching done. I was controlling the turnouts manually. Cheers, Kevin.
Hi SMT&C , RailSol here. I feel identified with you in your video. I have no money to buy and time to run a scale model. Anyway im playing a very simplistic curious simulator called > (JB) BAHN ... its a simulator not fucused in awesomenes of 3D graphics, its more focused in a extended track network and automation of railway operations, anyway you also could control trains, at your own level of difficuty. Looking your layout in your video, I feel that its not irrealistc after all. 😄 because my last work is a small yard of 6 tracks serving a logistic center. The central part of the yard its similar like mine. THe difference its only the status of the consists. The challenge its handle automatically.there are a track for the switcher, a track for cargo engine, 1 track for reversing, 2 main lines, 1 track for storage or general purpose. 3 tracks for arriving consists, and 3 tracks for departure consist. and 1 track for the Logistic center. The yard are divided in some of 8 sections, made for the automatic work of the operations. I pass near 2 days thinking about how the automation could be to handle the operations. (the yard only takes me a morning to construct). I enjoy a lot the brainwork. And of course its very relaxing and confortable feeling watching all the system working. Surely like you do. sadly my engilsh its not perfect and my (shy)level its huge to make a simple video showing the work. Anyway , i enjoyed a lot. thanks.
After watching this video I'm thinking about sorting out cars from a long train (let's say 20 cars, 4 different types, in different quantities) reversing into sidings that are all in the same direction. The 4 parking spots are just big enough to fit all cars of the same type. There's one spare track that you can put on anything you want, but no more than 5 cars at once. There's one additional rule: You can only move with a minimal of 3 cars or with no cars. Obviously you would need at least 3 cars of one type to make the last move, but I think it would be a great puzzle.
Glad to hear you enjoyed the video. I made the track schematic in Anyrail track planning software, saved it as a picture and then imported it into Microsoft PowerPoint. Cheers, Kevin.
@@Modeltrains Thank you for sharing, it's always helpful to see the shape of the layout during run sessions. I will use your tip in my future videos as well.
Really well done video, and a great example of how you can still enjoy this hobby with a minimal investment in materials and layout size. (I really need to build one of these.)
Do you have a list of the Kato track pieces, or part numbers, used to be able to recreate this layout? Thanks in advance. Enjoyed the video so much I want to recreate this switching puzzle to use myself.
@@Modeltrains Thank you so much for the information. Will be setting up and running my train this week. I enjoy all of your videos. Thanks again. Oh, just FYI, I am a Santa Fe fan. My grandfather worked for them in Oklahoma City back in the 50s and 60s.
The website www.wymann.info/ShuntingPuzzles/ has several designs. Also, there are some online playable ones at www.transum.org/Software/Shunting/Puzzles.asp . I have no affiliation with either site. Cheers, Kevin.
Cool idea, might have to do this since I am on Covid lock down. And not at home, thanks Army... Why didn't you keep the tank car when you dropped off it and the flatcar? You could have dropped that boxcar, then the tank car and still had room to run the coal car up.
Nice i like that when i think about it this is all i wanna do looks to me fun but no one ever say anything about what or how & what track pic's you need to build it now know you said you have a 8 by 2 ok i got that much room Well your layout is nice.
Ken, depending on where you power feeders are and whether you use power routing switches or not, the run around could become unpowered depending on how various switches are thrown. You may want to try putting a power feeder to all the tracks which make up the run around. Hope this works for you. Cheers, Kevin.
how I do my shunting layout with I just start off easy I take a clipboard a big blank white sheet of paper write down the cars that I'm going to spot in the cars that I'm going to switch then I just use my memory to remember which car goes were
At 18:23 had you gone down and got the Tank Car you could have set both it and the Coal Car in the same set of following moves It would also make the final two car easier
Make a ten Paper Standing Triangle and and use tape to place one on ten cars The label 6 stations to part rolling stock at No Cards to deal with, just dice Then roll a 10 sided dice and a six sided dice to get a list of the rolling stock and station it is to be delivered to you can roll for 3 to 6 at one time After the stock is in place you can roll again and start round 2
At 7:03 And you have a sort of "MAIN LINE" that has VERY LONG STRAIGHT LEGS, (either side of the 2nd mainline turnout) - that you designated, and immediately forgot about completely - as it's by far the LONGEST LEG - to shunt / switch - slip any wagon off your original train - or to "pull out onto" from the lowest siding - this side, being the 1st siding to set the end of your "wagon rake" (being without a caboose left well away at the far left main - the flat car gets SET first. Period. leave the caboose out on the incoming main IF YOU NEVER BRING THE CABOOSE IN - until you need to run the loco around it you only have five wagons to work, then doing that (at the start) allows you to IMMEDIATELY set the flat car into it's siding. FIRST One down - & just four wagons to go The coal wagon being set last. (yep last not 3rd) The tank car being set 2nd last - and the 2 box cars being SET (together one loco movement) - immediately after setting the flat car. My way ? But no - you wiggle and waddle that loco all over the yard - many times - one wagon at a time ? So many back & forth loco movements (and a caboose in the way of everything). & Yet - there really are so few loco movements "my way".
Nikolaos, it is a term to describe a section of track whose primary purpose it to allow an engine to move from one side of a car to the other by passing the car on an adjacent track. Cheers, Kevin.
Interesting thoughts ... personally, I thought the information transmission rate was very slow (i.e., video was too long and repeated too much information).
Yes, I had to get some explanation in first on this video. In my other video on my switching puzzles the game starts at 0:00 and plays out the whole video. Cheers, Kevin.
Kevin, you should make a Talking Trains Series using your model trains. Just like Thomas the Tank Engine and Friends. Joint Line Fables: Characters: Kevin the SP GP40-2 Daniel the BN SD40-2 Alicia the ATSF SD40-2 Jack the ATSF SD40-2 Nicholas the ATSF SD40-2 Ron the DRGW GP40-2 Shawn the ATSF C44-9W
I like as an English person when looking at the videos I too hate listening to that dam bell that seems to be "ON" all the time. Is that the rule it must be ON. In ols Liverpool Docks they put them on the tank trains because there was always people around. Can you stopped the bell when nobody is around in real life.?????. Thanks.
I remember my grandpa challenged me to figure out a problem with my Lionel trains when I was a kid . Here's that same problem . You have two freight trains that are one mile each . They meet at a halfway point . But the siding is only a half mile . How can they pass each other ??? Also .... My grandpa said that this happened in real life .
Sounds like fun Kevin! I might have to give that a try! I have a few new vids on my channel recently if you get a chance to stop by. Great video Kevin! Thanks! Stay safe! Cheers, Danny
@@Modeltrains I will give it a go Kevin! As it is, I am still working everyday for now. As a Florida State Park Ranger, the governor has deemed us as essential services. We are catching up on painting and pressure washing and tree trimming for the time while we are closed. Stay safe! Cheers, Danny
Enjoyed the video. Great mind scrambler. However, I think you're incorrectly referring to 'spurs' as 'sidings'. Kinda threw me for a loop. The task is educational but might consider correct nomenclature. Keep up the good work.
Wanna'make a bzillion bucks ? Design a switching puzzle track design that can be even more quickly reconfigured, for people with very little space and those interested in trying many new track plans.
12:37 and THAT WAY - that you do thing. That has to be the slowest - most useless and utterly TIME WASTING multiple movement idea, as to how to "spot" & set - all wagons of that train (via it's different types of wagons - into their various locations) - doing the entire operation - ONE AT A TIME - from the closest track (beside the camera) to that one away at the back left - of all the other tracks? ONE WAGON SHIFTED across the entire yard - WHAT A WASTEFUL TIME. Obviously - you haven't thought that (all) through .... as in the very beginning you made a fatal mistake - !!! YOU BROUGHT THE CABOOSE INTO THE YARD - which ("being in the way") needed to be shunted here, there & almost everywhere ? .. Solutions are easy if done simply FIRST. Plus - the Flat car is SET first and the coal truck LAST The two box cars are only set, when you have thought it all through (and shunted them behind the flat car - at the very beginning). The incoming train from the MAIN LEFT - need ONLY "arrive" on the mainline - and the LOCO stop short of the very first turnout. Allowing enough room for the loco to "run around" anything (on either of the two main/loop tracks) to get the loco back to the LH Main entry track without shifting the caboose once. By leaving the rest of the train - to the extreme left of any mainline turnout - !! The loco has all other options remaining to loop &/or shunt / switch with. Now --- Apply the train brakes and uncouple the caboose (we won't be needing it - ANYWHERE INSIDE THE YARDS - for any shunting operations). LEAVE THE CABOOSE - ON THE MAIN LINE AT THE EXTEME LEFT, "brakes on" until it is shifted at the very end of shunting operations. After all - every operation to get all the other wagons / cars - into that zig-zagged yardwork - will require multiple trips across the main (more so your way) .. which the caboose DOES NOT NEED TO BE INVOLVED IN It is very easily "parked" out on the main (protecting all yard work and shunting / switching operations) until every last wagon - has been "set" My way - there also be - very few of those slow - ALL THE WAY ACROSS (the yards) - loco movements Without even once - ever needing to SHUNT the caboose "anywhere". It stays on the MAIN at the far left of this yard - protecting every operation (when the loco is going to be remarshalling everything - to where it should go / to be set.) REMEMBER .. you "do not" need to actually shunt the caboose "at any time". (it isn't on the end of the train now, as it's still away back at the entrance to the zig-zag yarding system - brakes on). Now pull all the rest of the train (including the very last wagon - being that box car) And take them all up past the 2nd turnout & shunt / slip / switch (whatever YOU call it) 3 wagons - ! Use that turnout & ONLY That turnout - to get the exact 3 wagons in the correct order, placing the 3 of them correctly, into the lower siding. You know - the one that you used to put ? THE ENTIRE TRAIN - ALONG WITH THE CABOOSE - (INTO) .? It only needs 3 wagons and the loco - when "setting" the flat car. Now also remember - that as the FLAT CAR will be remaining in that bottom (flat car) siding - it needs to be put there FIRST (Unlike what you did when you put not only the the caboose 1st but the whole train in there, with the box next to the caboose.) OK 1st - switch out the flat car Then do the switch/shunt-boot &/or slipping of BOTH box cars. Now - shunt all 3 into that flat car siding - onto the stop-block. The Flat car is disconnected and is thus SET. That's that siding done (for now) Next - you will need to run-slip / boot or shunt/switch the tank car - back towards the caboose (where it still sits at the extreme LHS on the entry Main - with it's brakes on). ... Only then will you DROP the Coal wagon (where you eventually put the caboose) on the 1st loop - via the very 1st turnout. Now - run the loco around it - (via the yard and the top mainline siding and the 2nd loop track) and return the loco into the flat car siding and pull the 2 box cars out and up past the last turnout.... ....... Now comes the (not) very tricky - HARDEST part - of all see. YOU SHOWED US - that the Tank siding accepts 2 wagons PLUS the loco - as does the coal siding - (as does the box car siding). The 2 box cars - can now be set by the loco - into their own (Box Car) siding at the LHS (very top corner) of the yards .... Now comes another very tricky (not) second "set" operation. You bring the loco fully out onto the RHS Main siding, and run it past the coal truck (via the RHS loop on the main) until you connect onto the tank car DO NOT PUSH IT ONTO / nor couple it with - the stationary caboose. - (as that will still stay - exactly where it was left at the very start). Now, tow the tank car as you enter the 1st loop where the coal truck sits & connect onto the coal truck. Keep moving by push/pulling both those wagons out onto the tank track / RHS Main siding. Then reverse and push the tank car into it's siding (pulling the coal truck behind you) to SET the tank car.. As we have seen before, that TWO WAGONS plus the loco will fit into the tank siding, (clear of the turnout). This means that there's no problem to simply uncouple the tank car & leave it at the end of it's TANK CAR siding To then push the last wagon (the coal truck) into it's siding to leave it there (set) as well. THAT'S IT - all 4 wagons that needed to be set (during the shunting operation) - has been completed. .... Finally Withdraw the loco OUT OF THE YARDS - all the way back onto the caboose, couple onto it & drag it further along the main line into the RHS loop Drop it there & run around it via the 1st loop (to get the loco back onto the main) and recouple the loco onto the caboose. . Lastly - you are on your merry way home - pulling the caboose behind the engine (as you depart to the LEFT - along the main line). ... NOT ONCE - has the caboose been shunted (either backwards &/or forwards as part of a remarshalling task), and it has NEVER left the main line. Unlike your time consuming back and forth shunting method (moving JUST one wagon at a time) What a wasteful / slow operation - all whilst shifting the caboose several times See - you did NOT need to be shuffling the caboose all over the yard? Nor do you need to move the loco very far between switching operations - nor do you need to remember where everything is - or goes? Just a very simple method of LEAVING the caboose out on the main (setting the flat car 1st) And only (then) short-slip/shunting wagons at one turnout at a time, until all wagons are "ready" to be set. Setting all on the top side of the yards is done fairly quickly and with minimal effort.
