Good (and BAD) Romance in Fantasy [CC] 

Am a senior citizen fan of the Harry Potter books. The only "romance" that got my attention was between Arthur and Molly Weasley. Loved their interplay.

“She’s really bad at having emotions” ME

It's one of my biggest peeves about the Harry Potter films that Ginny's personality is severely cut down. She is awesome in the books!

You were absolutely right about Lupin and Tonks not making any sense. They went from hand holding at the end of book six to married at the beginning of book seven. That's only about THREE months. Tonks then gets pregnant about two months after that. Then she has a baby and thinks it's a good idea to run off to a literal war zone about a month after giving birth. She has her grief-stricken mother looking after her infant child (remember that Ted Tonks dies earlier in the book) so that she could 'be with Remus' when they both don't even survive the first round of fighting. Their relationship was insanely rushed only so that there could be another orphan that symbolically represents Harry towards the end. That never sat right with me.

The phrase "and then they had sex" would honestly be a great improvement to 90% of books including a sex scene.

maybe the true meaning of Fantasy Romance in that the romance is a fantasy

I'm a sucker for romance, I feel like something is fundamentally missing when there is no romance, but that's just me.

Call me a masochistic but I recently learn to LOVE when the couple don't end up together. I mean, when it's for a good reason, like prioritizing 'their people' or 'their duty' bc they know is the right thing to do ... I love those heart breaking goodbyes (even more than the death of one of them ) and the tears rolling down my cheeks. Other thing I think is great it's when one of them both don't like the other at the beginning but then develop the caring and loving

Also. My husband: I’m all for the Hermione/Draco pairing. Me: You’re off the committee. Him: Really though Hermione don’t need no man. I want her to be the next headmaster. Me: Redeemed.

Lupin in Tonks was meant to happen off screen because Harry is the least observant person ever.

One of my personal problems with so many of these romances is that the protagonist is usually the recipient of affection and we follow them processing it and figuring out what they want. Can’t relate!! I don’t have a trail of boys thirsting after me, I can’t relate whatsoever to “processing my feelings” and being indecisive. I rarely read stories where the protagonist wants someone and struggles to express it. I’m all about that yearning.

The worst romance I’ve read that really bugged me was from “the selection series.” I read them all because it felt like a guilty pleasure read but I was pulling my hair the whole time when America couldn’t make up her damn mind and kept stringing both boys along lol

0:00 Merphy is officially Mrs "Okay so" XD

I don’t like ANY of the romances in Harry Potter. To me they all came out of nowhere just for the sake of having couples.

I am mostly just really glad that there was no romance between Harry and Hermione. I hate it when authors seem to think you can't be best friends with someone from the opposite sex

Jeans romance in Red Sea under Red Skies is sweet, and sad.

I bet the die-hard Wheel of time fan buddy is Daniel lol

I really liked the romances in the Harry Potter books in a sense that they were never ever the main focus of the story. It was just a natural part of the characters' coming of age story (having first crushes, kisses, jealousy etc.). And I will defend Hermione and Ron forever. I feel like people shipped Harry with Hermione ONLY because of the movies. In the books there was never chemistry between them, Harry calls her his sister. We are in his head all through the series and he had never once romantic feelings towards her. Honestly, I would have been really mad if they'd ended up together, boys and girls can actually just be friends you know. Ron and Hermione were meant to end up together from the very beginning. Having said that the last chapter should just have been left out. It's ridiculous that they all stay together. It should have just been left to the readers' imagination.

I don't like Ron and Hermoine. I don't like Harry and Ginny. I love them all separately but the couples always seemed forced to me. Just my opinions, plz dont attack me lol

"She's really really really bad at relationshiping and she's closed off and she's not trusting." Me. I accidentally wrote a chapter what was two characters who barely knew each other falling in love in about 3 hours and sleeping together beneath a stars. Yeah. This video helped me realize that was stupid. I still think it's more natural than most romcoms these days.

I don’t really understand why people don’t like Harry and Ginny because of the lack of build up. It seems to me very realistic to teenage romance. How many high schoolers date someone that they started liking years earlier? Lots of times you see a friend in a different light or just through maturing you start to like a friend. I think it would be more weird to have them get together after liking each other since middle school.

SPOILERS!!! I think that Harry and Ginny work together for one very important reason; they've both been royally screwed by Voldemort. There's that scene, I think in either Phoenix or Prince, where they're talking about Harry potentially being possessed, and he legitimately says to her "I forgot" when she tells him what it had been like for her. And he feels TERRIBLE for forgetting. But she's the one who's able to clear up that point for him and I think it brings them together through shared experience. That and you KNOW he'd have to be adopted into Ron's family somehow. Mrs. Weasley loved him as her own from book 1, for God's sake.

I'm more and more starting to think I'm the only person who enjoyed reading about Kvothe and Denna a lot. In no way is it a healthy relationship, but I do feel like it's a lot of them both dancing around each other, terrified to make the wrong moves, and not just Denna stringing him along. And while it is frustrating, it's also very believable to me and I enjoy reading it...

"You probably know that I don't have a heart." Merphy Napier . Feb. 13/20 aka the Tin Woodswoman type of KY. Don't think JKR knows how to write romance. And she ain't alone among authors. How much of romance is at least a fair deal about avarice (espec. if a character is less wealthy than their significant other) and lust anyway, even if a & l ain't brought up.

It took me so long to figure out why I was confused by the edition of Harry Potter that you're holding up until I realized it's the German one (which I grew up with) and you're not German :'D

While the romance in the Gentleman Bastard series isn't in any way cute or even healthy, I don't think it is badly written. It feels like the author is fully aware these two are dysfunctional together. That's kind of the point though. I think it's far more frustrating when the romance is supposed to be cute, romantic etc., but the author just botches the execution. As far as HP is concerned, I bought Harry/Ginny and even Hermione/Ron as teenage love interests (hormones being hormones and all that), but I have a very hard time picturing them as adult couples. They just don't work long term.

Harry and Ginny are my favorite! They are such a healthy couple and so much fun to read. Rowling had the opportunity to use the “I have to hurt you to protect you” trope. But she didn’t! Harry just tells Ginny the truth about why they can’t be together! He just tells her the plain truth, that it’s too dangerous, that they can’t afford to get distracted. And Ginny accepts it! It was such a mature and honest conversation. I’m still amazed that a relationship like Harry and Ginny’s, which is devoid of any nonsensical angst and drama, can even exist in fiction. Also love Siri and The God King from Warbreaker, and Darcy and Elizabeth from Pride and Prejudice. But holy crap do I hate Perrin and Faile! Ugh...I mean, my baby Perrin deserves so much better. Also, Rand and Elayne were so random.

OMG!! I KNEW MERPHY LOOKED FAMILIAR! she looks like lacey chabert/gretchen from mean girls.

It's been a long while since I read the books, but my reading of it was that Kvothe was just infatuated (and then borderline obsessed) with her right from the start, and despite getting no real interest in return just kept pursuing her regardless of what she did. And I felt that she used him for occasional comfort or support because while she wasn't that interested in him, she didn't dislike him either and it was clear that he wasn't going to leave her alone anyway. It was really frustrating because I kept yelling at him "dude she's just not that into you move ON already" and he WOULDN'T. Mostly agree with WoT. Perrin and Faile was the most abrupt and awkward pairing I have ever read. I had to do some extreme mental gymnastics to justify it - I was on board with her being attracted to him and just deciding that he was meant to be hers, but the time it took to bullyseduce him into submission was ludicrously short. Rand and Elayne I never totally bought, though the other two were more believable to me. I think the main problem with RJ's relationship building is that the characters keep following their own plots so much that they rarely spend a decent amount of time together, so it's hard to accept that enough of the relationship is built off-page to explain the on-page romances. If that makes any sense? The most believable romances, I find, are between characters who have shared significant challenges together. Being forced to depend on each other, seeing the true mettle of the other under pressure, learning to trust the other.

I don't like Lupin/Tonks because she lost all her personality when she fell for him. In "Phoenix" she's buoyant and sprightly and maybe the best thing about the fifth book, and then she becomes a love-sick Eeyore in book six, and positively tragic (in the Shakespearean sense of the word) in DH. I like both Harry/Ginny (for the reasons you say) and also Ron/Hermione, just because I like them both and think they complement each other. I know these two are based totally on JKR interviews, which are not canon (to most people), but I have no opinion on Luna/Newt Scamander's grandson, because we really don't know anything about him. I'll just say it would be understandable I think if Luna reminds him of Great Aunt Queenie. And Neville and Hannah Abbott...?? That one _really_ seems to have come out of left field!

with regards to romance in the Wheel of Time, Faile is the absolute worst. She straight up verbally abuses Perrin and she never really learns not to be like that. Perrin deserves so much better than her.

Nobody ever talks about Dalinar and Navani but they have such a good relationship with so much depth

Yess, totally agree that Harper should have ended up with the other male interest, they were so good together! But since this is a Beauty and the Beast retelling, I saw it coming so I wasn't that upset

I love how Corey keeps commenting from a distance (did I spell his name right? Sorry if I didn’t). You guys are so funny and sweet together!

One word: podcast. I'd love another medium to add to the ways I can listen to your book discussions. 🙌

Aviendha and Elayne (sp?) have better chemistry than either of them do with their love interest and no one can convince me otherwise

JESUS CHRIST THANK YOU!!!!!!! I HAVE BEEN LOOKING FOR EXACTLY THIS FOR THE LAST 3 DAYS

Yay! I love these example videos; they’re really good for writing inspiration. Thanks, Merphy!

When it comes to the romance in Harry Potter, I have never really invested myself in it. Many felt weird or abrupt, so I just stopped bothering. 😆 If I ship anyone in Harry Potter, it's Luna and Neville. I think they're really cute together. 🙃

I kinda feel like sometimes authors add in romance sub plots just because everyone expects them to, not because it’s an authentic and touching addition

I was surprised, when you showed the german edition of Harry Potter and the sorcerer's stone. I didn't exspect that!! :D Greetings from Germany!! :)

A story I've been planning for a while now (the second in a trilogy) kinda focuses on a romance. Having videos like this to let me think on it more is really helpful.

In one book series I've read, it is a fantasy series with a lot of romance weaved into the story and it is done great. All the characters who end up in a relationship have been shown how the relationship has been created. For example, one couple doesn't get together until the end of the last book, but it is a beautiful moment between the two who have had a really close friendship for all of the books. Another pair get together during the second books out of four, and it shows them growing in their relationship and dealing with all the obstacles of their lives. Also, they are all gay which is awesome.

I'm hearing impaired and i rly, rly appreciate the close captions. It really helps me out, and others i'm sure.

Excited for the romance recs! Love you Merphy!

Corey’s got some of the best character development I’ve seen.

To me the "Harry Potter" example is like how you described "Wheel of Time:" came out of nowhere when I first read it, makes more sense when I reread.

The movies didn’t do the Harry and Ginny pairing justice.

I picked up letters to the lost because of you and I loved it so much!!❤️

I will always love my Vin and Elend and their story. Thems my babys

I am so glad you are loving the book I sent you! The Rage of Dragons was my favorite book of 2019. It is SO SO good!

Omg I really adore Harry and Ginny! So happy to see there’s someone having the same feeling!

You should do a Dear Authors on book descriptions. I've had books recommended to me that were great but the description would be meh.

I loved this video!! I also love Harry and Ginny together! They just seemed to click in a way that other couples in the series didn’t.

You have me super pumped about reading the Rage of Dragon!!! I watched this video and another video where you just started it and now I'm itching to go get it after work! Keep posting great and terrible reads!!!

Huge Harry Ginny fan. They cute!! Also hard agree on A Curse So Dark and Lonely. (Spoilers) The author made Grey such a wonderful person, and I loved our protagonist, and the whole time I kinda felt like the Prince was a bland sandwich.

Harry and Ginny wasnt abrupt, you could already see small things in the 5th book when they decided to finally give Ginny more page time.

I’m watching this and suddenly hear your voice critiquing and reviewing the romance in my work-in-progress. This is a compliment. I respect your opinions :)

Always love to see your books full of post its!!

When you got to thee Harry Potter section, I was bracing for a rant against Harry/Ginny, but was very pleasantly surprised. They were my favorite couple in the books. Strangely, I did not like Ron/Hermione at first, but they grew on me in the movies. Go figure. Thanks for sharing this :)

Even though some people may disagree, I LOVE the relationship between Harry and ginny in the books. It feels so real and somehow mature. Ginny is a great character with an absolutely strong personality. I'm happy she ended up with harry

I am on book 8 in the wheel of time and so far literally every romance as annoyed me or at least confused me a little and I have been totally unconvinced

I really like the romance in warbreaker from Brandon Sanderson

I agree with what you said about WoT: I love the books and most of the conflicts, but the love stories are... Meh. That actually wasn't a big problem for me, because when I read a fantasy book is to read about sweet sweet magic battles and intrigues and traumatic characters traumatic events (and 99% of the times I will happily gloss over any romantic subplot/ships), BUT it was something that I could defenetely tell. I repeat, it didn't really bother me (unless the character behaved kind of weird... Like all the events in the stone of Tear), but even someone who is 99.999% blind to romantic subplots like me could notice it.

I totally agree with you about Harry and Ginny. There was plenty of buildup in book 6 and even more if you count their friendship in book 5, and their personalities are perfect for each other

Six of crows did an amazing job at making the romance a side plot but also involving it in the main plot. Plus the couples just pair each other so well. And two of the pairs have history one of them trust the other the other not so much. Waylan can sunshine... that’s all I need to say for that couple. But keneji is my favorite

Re Harry and Ginny: is it so unbelievable for a teenage romance to start abruptly?

I also really like Harry and Ginny! I think they were a great match and I was super rooting for it in the sixth book.

You just made me decide to re-read all of Harry Potter when i'm done with The FInal Empire. Used to read Potter all the way through several times a year as i was really caught up in it all when growing up, but it's been nearly 8 years now... It is time!

I personally love Katsa and Po in Graceling. I loved the way the author built it up over time and how they treated eachother. Also a fan of Valek and Yelena in Poison Study ^^

I love this video and this idea pls do more parts 🥺💜

Great video Murphy!

YES!!! AN Unkindness of Magicians!!!! This book was everything you promised me and more. And the romance is just hinted at and isn't the focus, but it also made me ACHE! SO sweet and deadly, is this book.

I was sooo expecting this video from you

Just started Rage of Dragons and I'm so excited to get into it!

A well executed romance in a fantasy series is definitely Tavi's relationship in Codex Alera. No instant love, trust and respect each other, no silly love triangles. Perfect.

When you talk about books or refer to them. Could you write the title and author on the screen, because it's sometimes really hard to hear and remember what you say? And it's hard to see on the books you hold up at an angle for three seconds. :P

My favorite love story has to be Korey and Merphy. When she was like "👌thanks husband 👌", it was just so sweet!

I completely agree with a curse so dark and lonely! I haven't read the second book yet, but I have a feeling that this will be rectified!

I was so expecting this video from you

I said YES out loud when you pulled out The Name of the Wind because that's exactly what I was thinking of when you talked about Locke's romance 😅

Thanks for talking about Letters to the Lost. I feel that book needs way more attention than it seems to get. It’s one of the best YA contemporary novels I have ever read.

Currently a little over halfway done with The Starless Sea, and i totally agree! I'm actually really enjoying the book for the concepts and short stories and atmosphere, but the character work is BLAND.

I’ve gotten an unkindness of magicians and the lies of lockmorra and I can’t wait to read them haha

I have almost ordered The Rage of Dragons a hundred times then stopped myself but I finally did it. Between you and Greene praising it so much I couldn’t resist!

Absolutely adore Harry and Ginny as a couple. Think they were written so well. Can't understand people's criticism of there not being enough foreshadowing, and that his feelings came out of nowhere in HBP. The seeds were planted in Order of the Phoenix. From Ginny finally being able to be normal around Harry thanks to her dating Michael Corner (which Harry noted), to her scolding him for secluding himself because of his connection to Voldy (showing she cared), to them having their first real conversation in the library (which Harry enjoyed), and finally (and IMO this proves his feelings once and for all) on the train home Harry asked her to sit with him, but she sat with her friends, which made Harry realise how much (up until that year) time they never spent together, and the need he has for her presence now he has finally spent more time with her. (There was also indication in GoF.) The movies did loads of damage as well, since it's the main thing Harmoine shippers use (Because the director wanted to push Harmoine even though the book clearly shows he has no romantic feelings for her at all) and absolutely disrespecting Ron and Ginny to do so. And as for his relationship with Ginny, it's one of the healthiest relationships in all of YA and Soft fantasy. From Harry breaking up with her to protect her from Voldy, To Harry constantly ensuring she's safe by looking at the Marauder's Map, to his feeling of dread/concern when she got caught trying to take Gryffindor's Sword, to Harry not daring to call out to her when he was on his way to sacrifice himself knowing if he did he wouldn't be able to do what was needed, to his final thought being of kissing her. Their relationship (from Chamber of Secrets all the way to Deathly Hallows) was a relationship built on pure and undying love and admiration no matter the circumstance

I really need to thank you merphy I love books but i never read any books in English. (It's not my native tongue) I just loved your opinions and the way you talked in the first video i saw. But I'm not good at English. You helped me learn so much and become so much better at English

I just got an unkindness of magicians for my birthday and I am READY to love it

As an aspiring writer, your videos actually help me get better. I'd give *ANYTHING* for you to read the book I'm currently working on Merphy.

I think literally the only fantasy romance I've liked was in His Dark Materials by Philip Pullman. You really need to read it, I know it's on your radar but still :D

Just found your channel, neat stuff! This was really neat to see, because you seemed to have a great dislike for abrupt romances and prefer that we see the romances develop and I'm sure that most of us agree. But to also know that you like many normal readers like what you like and put the Harry Ginny romance on your good list was unexpected for sure. I thought for sure you were gonna pick Arthur and Molly, or even a romance like Bill and Fleur. I wish I was more familiar with the books you mentioned, but hey now I have titles I can look into!

CAUGHT IN A BAD ROMANCE! - Lady Gaga Surprised no one mentioned this yet! ;P

I love Harry and Ginny together, even if it was maybe one book of build up. I think I once heard that Rowling was thinking about putting Hermione and Fred together and I jumped that train so fast. Sorry I would have killed off Ron to keep Fred.

Very excited to hear your review of Rage of Dragons - I also devoured the book but still not sure how I feel about the ending

The "romance" in the Kingkiller Chronicle is almost my life. Happy Valentine's Day!!!!

"When Dalinar starts having a rough time" I almost spit out my coffee at that joke

I was waiting for Vin and Elend to show up on the good list ;-;

Totallyyyy agree with the couple you mentioned in Oathbringer! They have a really healthy and supportive relationship that I love! What do you think of the romance in Warbreaker? 🥰

I think the series “An Ember in the Ashes” does romance really well ❤️

People don't talk about An Unkindness of Magicians enough! It's SO GOOD and I'm excited for the sequelllll!!!! 😍