"Primarchs are often banned at tournaments because having the same Primarch on both sides is not narratively compelling" And here I am, laughing at how Alpharius vs Alpharius would be the most Alpha Legion thing ever.
You prepare your army by buying 3 boxes of a 2-player starter set, every Forge World model you can't afford, and then sit on it for 2 years wondering how you're going to paint it all when you have no clue how to paint...
You buy the starter box, not for the models, but the rules, templates, measuring sticks and dice. After all, you can't play the game without rules and dice. Then you get a primarch and a stormbird, which you will field together, by having the primarch embarked in the stormbird. The rules may state that this is not a legal army, but disregard the rules, they'll only hamper your enjoyment of the game.
Unfortunately people dive-in head first and load up on the cool new toys without a thought spared for what they actually need on the table to play games, you can't just play a game with 2 kratos, horus and a typhon.
On Primarchs you once said “don’t buy one if you’re painting isn’t up to snuff, because it should be a special model, that deserves your best effort” and I feel like that’s a great piece of advice. That self imposed restraint let’s you keeps your options open for more practical units that you can play more frequently and get more use out of.
It also motivates you to paint all your infantry and learn from your mistakes on them, before getting the more expensive models. Not just primarchs, but elite units like the Deathwing Companions or special/named characters or even dreadnoughts.
I used to spend hours list building as a teen, it's the best part of the whole hobby for me. Themed armies. I usually like mounted armies. I had an entire mounted farsight tau army when they first came out when the Pathfinders and their vehicle could scout. People realised Tau can fight in hand to hand. It won tournaments. Best part for me is making a themed list that does the opposite of what people expect. It's an art that is dieing with the shinyness of models. Build a list and stick to it.
Mounted armies are the best!! I have my bretonnians still, who, well everyone knows what happened there, so to soothe my soul I started a nighthaunt army which is all mounted - in my eyes they're just the ghosts of my old knights! Are they ever going to win a game? No...but they're going to look really cool whilst they lose!
I used to own an entire goblin wolf rider army. I put them on the table, a Daemon Prince would fly over turn one and cause terror and my whole army would go by-by off the board. Sometimes it's fun to lose.
Fun video, I'm starting Horus Heresy at 2.0 and have only ever played "Everybody murders everybody else" games of Warhammer 40k with friends so I'm very excited to take a slower and more methodical approach to playing in the Age of Darkness, thanks for the help!!!
Listened to all, but still got starter box, 2 rhinos, special weapons, kratos coming saturday and sitting here next to me is a leviathan, volkite squad a dread dropod, going ham!
A measured ~&~ controlled approach to building an Army, complete w/ veins of both Strategy & *_Impulse Control,_* which is to building & growing a *_sustainable_* Horus Heresy Army. (* Thanks for your fantastic & objective input Mac! And don't forget: _"Clear Tha Area.....No Traces"_ (!) 🔫
Hi Mac! Great vid and good advice. For anyone entering the game this is great and tbh even for a collector like me, who will start playing, lots of good stuff about organisation. What I think is interesting for me is even though I am at level 4; the info on units v points size is very helpful and has kinda put priorities in my head of what is viable and what to finish painting first. Also how to actually build an army. Loved that it was SoH btw. Thanks for your knowledge and experience it’s a real help when planning and costing. PS I haven’t forgotten about Macca the dread and as soon as my Eldar are done, I’ll be onto SoH. Have a great day Macca.
Only useful advice if you intend to play (competitively from the start of your force). Picking up a center piece off the start is often a great motivation o get you in to your army from a painting / modeling perspective AND if you do intend to play you could use them eventually. Edit: parens
I started my 1st ever 40k Army on January 16th 2022..... as of June 16th, 2022 I have every Model in the Sisters of Battle (combat patro & purgatos mission set plus everything else), 2000 Pt of Black Templar, 1x Canis Rex Imperial Knight (for free blade), a Horus Heresy Box for (Imperial Fist / BT Lore), Rhino, Kratos Tank, and both upgrade sprues. I think im like Level 10 in Dumbassery
I look forward to seeing Part 2 of the Horus heresy videos on how to expand your list. From what you mentioned level 3 is where your choice of army might start to play into what units you should be taking. ala if you where playing a Thousand sons you might want to consider instead of the Deredeo Dreadnought or the Levithan dreadnought you might want to consider using the Osiron Pattern Contemptor Dreadnought or get extra tanks to boost the survivability of the legion or something like that.
Thus why I'm playing World Eaters and not Iron Warriors like I do in 40k. I'll have some transports and the Spartan tank to drop off a whole crew of butchers, but mostly I just want a ton of crazy dudes with chainaxes this time around.
Great video. I'll be following a similar approach. I am of course also one of those folks that bought the new Kratos because it was just cool, lol. I was also not expecting to field it in the beginning, it's more for the hobbying.
This is solid advice for any table top game. Good job Macka. This has also helped me plan my Alpha Legion from a Betrayal at Calth box I've had in the shame pile a while. Cheers dude.
Love videos like this. It's in that period of the hobby that has the most optimism, enthusiasm and excitement for what's coming. I just can't get past how I don't like the MK VI marines, or I'd get the starter.
Macca, I want to build myself an Night Lords armored claw like the Carandara for the new edition. I think about running them as an armored spearhead with a Spartan filled with Contekar and a Tartaros Praetor, two Proteus Land Raiders with TacSquads, two Rhinos with TacSupSquads with Volkites, two Vidicators and two Arquitors with Spicula rockets. This will get me around 3000 points, what is the typical game size me and my friends settled on. Is a Night Lords army as a medium to close range tank army viable? Because I LOVE the theme! Ave dominus nox!
as long as your mates are not trying to build meta mlg pro lists you should be fine. As long as you have 30-40 Tacticals you can basically do whatever you want.
@@sammaynard7600 Yeah, I really love that the good old Predator is so cool and viable in HH. For my army I want to go for a more "up close and personal" kind of tank army, but I think hunting packs of Preds are a very cool idea and fit the Night Lords very well :)
I’m going to try to be sensible & build up my 2 legions slowly yep I’m doing fists & soh. So the only thing I’m after next is some resin legion heads to give them more character, that & some transfer sheets, then another squad of 20 mark 6 marines, for a squad of heavy bolters & rocket launchers. Then plan on a box of mark 3/4 boxes to mix up my armour marks in each legion. Maybe special weapons squads next then once I’ve got a good base of infantry some fun stuff like contemptor dreadnought in each legion & lithithum dreadnought also then some legion specific troop choices as well as hopefully some shield breachers & assault squads in plastic at some point. Yes rhinos but primarchs/tanks will be the last things to finish my legions off. This is going to be a leisure of love & enthusiasm for each legion so I’m not going to rush it so I get the right level of fluff & thought into each legion.
This is important advice for all players. I think at some point we've all gone out and bought a cool centerpiece for an army and realised later you're a long way off from getting to use it, or even having an army for it to be the centerpiece of.
I'm not very smart when it comes to what is what or where to get it. I want to make an army that starts in great crusade then HH then into 40k. Is there such an army? Seems like most units change out heavily.
i just want to say thank you for your advice in getting start for heresy. iam building up an blood angels list. buildt up some nice charakters our of lemartes and astorath and got a old fw ba leviathan for cheap.
I’m trying to get into is slowly picked up the box the book and a special weapon upgrade box. The issue is I have no idea how I should equip my sons of Horus army. I plan on using the 10 meltas but outside of that I have no idea how I should build the other infantry.
I built out a 10-man World Eaters assault squad with jump packs a LONG time ago, prior to even the Forge World books. I also have three Mk 1 rhinos that I'm going to re-prime and paint up as World Eaters and then I'm getting the Age of Darkness box. This feels like plenty to get started with without feeling the need to make any big purchases until I've play a few games and understand what I'm looking for to round out the rest of what I want.
Honestly grabbing some resold parts from the box set to buff out your own box set isn't a bad idea. The special weapons box+the box set+20x marines+a contemptor will give you a fairly solid 2500pt list once you throw in a rhino or two. Contemptors are so damn strong.
I would also add, and although I imagine most people would have researched this before committing to an army game like HH - but make sure there is an actual community where you can play the game. One aspect of of TOCs videos that I enjoy is the concept of being aware of your finances and purchases in regards to the hobby, but if there isn't a community that is near you that plays HH why bother paying for a force in the first place?
Hi! What about building an army following a Rite of War? I want to run Dark Angels Dreadwing, as it is my favorite wing, so when I saw I could play a Rite of War that allows elite Dreadwing units to be played as troops, I begin building my list and 'levels' around it. Is this something that will last, or will my army be unplayable at some point? Interesting video, but not entirely convinced as you may understand.
I'd say that's a good way of going about it. If you have something specific you're aiming for, you can sub out the items in the various levels he mentioned; I believe Macca was largely aiming to provide a general path for people who aren't sure where their army will end up yet. If you're going Dreadwing, it still may be easiest to buy the starter set, and then use upgrade sprues/3D printing to turn some of the Tac squads into the more Dreadwing specific stuff (sorry, not real familiar with what those are honestly). A big thing to remember with HH over 40k is that the focus is largely on narrative, especially outside of a tourney setting, so your army will never be unplayable. It may require some tweaking to adapt some to local meta, make games closer to even footing, but a lot of people view the theme of their army more important than how hard it kicks ass...though it's always nice if you can have both haha
Good video but wouldn't I be able to just paint the starting termies as Justaerin~? I know they are missing the top knots and whatever but it would a be cheap alternative no?
So I just got the starter box. So far all I bought additionally are the cosmetic stuff for my tacticals so far cause I have NO CLUE about HH stuff (aos player and use to play 40k) and tyhus. I'm just unsure if I should build all 40 tacticals as that or save 10-15 and get weapon upgrades
I think im hardwired to just max out troop slots as default..not sure which edition thats left over from :D . i did a 100 man world eater army with minimal tanks, and then tried to do an elite ultra army..no its 85 infantry and no tanks, again...im broken haha
I already have my primarch because I also have a 40k White Scars army and I wanted to paint him. Having said that, I was kinda missing stuff like jetbikes, javelins and the Land Raider Proteus in this, where do you reckon those 3 fall? Tier 2?
Jet bikes and land speeders are probably in 2 as they are replacing your lighter tanks. Depending on your RoW you might make the tier 1 as the jet bikes can be troops that have line thus filling a spot similar to your tactical/despoiler squads or more of a roll like the terminators or contemptor. The land raider is probably a 2 or 3 depending on the rest of the force.
Correct you'll see them in tier 2. Tier 2 for scars is less about the transports providing mobility and more about packing bikes/jetbikes/speeders in as the white scars faster movement across the range makes it viable to foot-slog, with them moving 30% faster than last edition on basic infantry.
Armoured spearhead rite of war. Makes predator squadrons troops and sicarans elites. Can even make a command tank with z warlord trait/master of the legion. It's available to any legion.
It depends, Titanicus is a constant thing, but Titans are super rare in full size 30k 28mm. If you play games in apoc scale regularly you will see them, but they're so rare in 30k it's not funny.
Hey Macca, looking for some tips and advice here, i'm starting at level 1. let me know what you think: Rite Of War: Black Reaving. Sons Of Horus Praetor (box-dude) with a Justaerin Retinue Squad. Centurion: Master Of Signal. Troops choice: 2 Reaver Attack Squad 20 man. (per Black Reaving) 2 Seeker squads 10 man. Then either a Dread, vehicle or additional termies if points allow.
If i make a luna wolves force for Istvan would i use the upgrade kits from sons of horus? I can't imagine they changed the style of their armor becoming sons of horus. And im not buying the box set but would 20 assualt marines, 2x 10 tactical marines, legion contemptor, 5 Justaerin, and a centurion be a good start?
Well by Istvaan they were Sons of Horus, only after that did they repaint their armour. I'd probably avoid a lot of the SoH upgrades on them if Luna is the theme.
Quick opinion question. I am doing Alpha Legion and I was curious at what tier you'd put headhunters at? Extrapolating from your example would put them in at tier 3 but that does seem a tad excessive for a fast attack unit imho.
Headhunters could go in at tier 2, they are solid, but won't be the kind of mini I'm adding at the 2000 points mark, I'd be adding them earlier. At 2k+ you need to be thinking "how do I get multiple units to tackle all-comers"
@@kristophercooper3365 well, you'd need new arms, and you'd need the bits to perform the conversion, it's a lot of work when 3d printed or retail version exist.
In my case i play mostly home, with wife with homebrew rules, and we are building both3,500pts, 😆, so we both bought 4 boxes 2 kratos and 8 rhinos…. 😆 🤷🏼♂️
@@_PhamTuanCuong I play Ultramarines. They can be good, special units are excellent (Suzerain are crazy!). Can be a little one dimensional with their rite of war.
Quick question - I'm building a Heresy army but I'm not planning on buying the Age of Darkness box (mkvi doesn't suit my early-mid Heresy concept); should I still follow the general guidelines laid out in this video? I assume so, but I'd like to make sure regardless before I start spending money on it.
I honestly think the box is still an option if you can find someone who wants the tactical marines, because you still get the big rulebook, a spartan, a contemptor dreadnought and 10 cataphractii terminators.
@@jiffah Fair point, actually. I'm not sure a bout the Spartan and I already have a dreadnought I was planning on using, though the one I bought is a boxnought I'm hoping has rules in either the army books or the "legacies of the Age of Darkness" PDF. If the boxnought doesn't count though, then yeah, I'll probably get the set for the contemptor.
Wouldn't this limit the amount of scoring units you can take beyond 2000 points? I'd only have four troops at 3,500 points following this guide due to only having four power armored squads. Less if I wanted wanted one of them to be a support squad, which I'm not sure can score in this new edition
My old rule of thumb has always been 1 scoring unit per 500 points, but with the loss of scoring on basically everything outside of recon, tactical, assault, despoiler and breacher units, it's hard to achieve without absolutely spamming such units, and even then you'd max out at 6 scoring units in 3k points.
My build so far is: Iron Father in Gorgon Terminator armour with ten Gorgon Terminators in the Spartan, 2 squads of 10 breachers, 3 5-man tactical support squads (5 rotocannons, 5 Vulkite Culverins and 5 Graviton Guns) each with an apothecary in rhinos. A squad of 10 cataphractii terminators and I have a second Contemptor fully melee. I'm gonna get a third fully magnetised soon. On the shopping list: 2 land raider proteus to carry my breachers and a Leviathan Dreadnought (fully magnetised) Suggestions, comments?
I'm working on a World Eaters army that is half traitor and half loyalist and my goal is to have two unique 1500 point armies that can be taken in big games as a single 3000 point army It's fun to paint but list building is a frustrating affair
What if I'm a 4th edition old player that has a 3D printer and a few bottles of resin that will make me a 2000pt+ army for less than $100 dollars? What should I print?
Being able to run a primarch is one of the best things about 30k , not running one on the off chance the person you're playing has the same legion with one in is just weak
I disagree with your presmise. The more you have, the more you can choose from as you learn and move forward. Im just not going to use one setup for every battle I play. "How much ammo is enough?" You gotta think more like an Astartes bro.
