Hey Kris. I think this not only proves that woods, or maybe the construction of an individual instrument absolutely make a difference, but also the important of getting the 'right' pickups to match the character of a particular guitar. I thought that your pickups in Andy's guitar actually killed some of its character and magic, but they obviously compliment your guitar amazingly well.
Hayley Mason So so true man!!! I love both of these LPs in their original state. But I didn’t like Andy’s with my pickups. His pickups fit his guitar perfectly. And luckily for me, I prefer mine to his. 😅
You can change the tone of a guitar for the worst, by messing with the signal. Instead of spending thousands in reducing pickup efficiency and frequencies why don't you just equalize the signal in the amp or pedal?
@@BrunodeSouzaLino hmm. Not sure I understand your comment. The acoustic tone of an electric guitar has a huge impact on tone, and any other changes have varying degrees of influence. Just in my humble experience. Ymmv.
Electric guitars produce sound by using an electromagnet that picks up the vibration of metal strings, then outputs a voltage that's amplified by another piece of equipment. Electric guitars are not acoustic instruments. They're not built to resonate in any capacity. Even if they were built to resonate, like it happens on semi hollow and hollow guitars, you're still producing sound by amplifying the mechanical energy of the strings into electric energy. That's different than acoustic guitars, which rely on their construction as a resonating device to project sound.
@@matthias7455 The body of an electric guitar plays no part on how its sound is produced. The body is a structural element that only holds the parts in place.
About as informative as the other ones. Just like the other ones, just listening is not a satisfactory conclusion nor did it prove anything, as none of the tests in any of the videos respect any form of scientic testing methodology nor can be replicated exact due to several variables beyond our control. What this video has proven is that these two guitars sound different, which is a given, considering the materials they are made and all the other variables, not that tonewoods are what makes these two guitars sound different, which is the point of the video.
@@BrunodeSouzaLino Agreed. That's hardly a scientific method. The way to do it properly is to perform a _controlled experiment_ and this does not qualify. ========== *Controlled Experiment* - A controlled experiment is simply an experiment in which all factors are held constant except for one: the independent variable. - A common type of controlled experiment compares a control group against an experimental group. All variables are identical between the two groups except for the factor being tested. - The advantage of a controlled experiment is that it is easier to eliminate uncertainty about the significance of the results. www.thoughtco.com/controlled-experiment-609091 ========== What he has done here is not a controlled experiment at all. Also, it doesn't matter how an electric guitar sounds unamplified. The sound you hear when it's unamplified is not the same as when it's amplified. The latter is produced by disturbances in the magnetic field of the pickups. This can easily tested by stringing the guitar with nylon fish lines. It'll still produce sounds when unamplified. But zero sound through the pickups.
@@KrisBarocsi I wasn’t a true believer of tonewood to be honest! Recently though I’ve bought a Gibson Les Paul standard 60s I have a Gibson LP studio vintage mahogany which is my main guitar and I’ve played the hell out of her! Playing with the standard Ive immediately heard a more snappier lighter sound than the studio! Then I realised how much of a difference a maple cap can give to the instrument! 🤯
Madman, switching all those things on those expensive guitars. But I’m glad you did it! Super interesting and really cool to see the guitars keep their ‘character’ although it obviously changed the sound.
matthijsfix Haha, I’ll take that as a compliment. To be fair both Andy and I love our guitars to pieces and gig them all the time. That makes these player’s guitars and not “don’t touch it - don’t scratch it” instruments. Haha! So stoked you liked this (time consuming) experiment. :) cheers mate!
Andreas Arneth Thanks buddyyyyy! Now that we can finally talk about these two puppies without ‘spoiler alert’ I really wanna know what you think. Next Tuesday lunch at 12:30? 😂😂
Finally!!! This is the best video on the topic on RU-vid. Fantastic. It confirms what I found out in many years. Tone woods is not how mahogany sounds compared to whatever, it is how that one piece of mahogany sounds compared to that one other piece of whatever. I have never found two identical guitars sound exactly the same, nor in the lower range nor in the upper one. Yes we can tweak our sound (by the way, not enough said on eq pedals that can do miracles) but the way the guitar resonate is also important. Apart from tone, there are two things that differentiate guitars and cannot be fixed later: attack and sustain. Thanks for the video, great quality, great idea and .... great playing !!! One question: do these differences between examples of the same product apply also to tube amps?
akuakumc Hey, I fully agree with you- 👍🏼beside two things: changing attack and sustain later. For more sustain I had good results with putting a brass or steel nut and (the major effect) mounting roller saddles (on TOM) or brass saddles on the bridge. But: ...the tone gets brighter... Also quality hardware with tight fitting helps. Moving parts in contact with the string kills vibration. What also helps: increasing the weight of the headstock. I did it with locking tuner. But that could also kill sustain depending how it effects the guitars resonance balance between neck and body... So, not always the positive result... (edit)That happened to me on a BC Rich mockingbird... but the roller saddles balanced this little loss out😌And against brighteness I put short thin plastic tubings on the strings that are clamped by the tailpiece. But increasing headstock-weight definitelly helps for better attack. Mostly the very resonant guitars lack attack. Because the note begins to bloom after few hundred‘th of a second. Attack means very quick, dry response of vibration after plucking. Just my 2C, trying to help
What changed is the height of the pickups (slightly), the way you strummed (unintentionally) and the way the string "sat" on the new guitar (their dents were in a different spot most likely). And still the sound was almost identical. There is no tonewood debate. There is never a debate when science is involved. It's science vs belief and I understand that it's hard for someone to change a belief they've had for years and years but we need to leave this myth behind. Tonewood is 100% a myth. It makes no more difference than the material your pedal board is made of. I love your content man, I'm not here to bring negativity. Just saying science is science.
The results of the test and conclusion that wood matters more than electronics reflects my experience. And it isnt just wood type, it is also wood quality. Epiphone low quality mahogany does not sound like gibson high quality mahogany. It never does in my experience. However, i've yet to find a single one off example where a guitar made of one species of quality wood sounds just like another guitar made of a different species of quality wood. Ive never even found an example that sounds close really. I dont believe there is a strat out there made of high grade mahogany that sounds like a strat made of high grade alder. Its as much a pipe dream as finding an example where high quality pickups making up for low quality wood. They dont. They never will. Prove me wrong.
Excellent comparison. As an old guitar tech I can say that took quite a bit of patience to remove and replace all the electronics, strings, etc. Tonewood DOES make a difference, no matter how small, even though it's the pickups doing all the transferring of string vibration to the amp. String vibration is not one vibrating shape, the shape of vibration is itself effected by the body, the neck, and components, and it's that final 'shape' if you will, that the pickup is "picking up". Bravo my good man, bravo.
Fascinating and BRAVE Kris. Sometimes I think we hear what we want to hear personally on my monitors I don’t hear a huge difference over all. From personal experience the biggest difference comes when you change from really cheap electrics and pups to better quality ones. The body, neck, the pup positions and the quality of hardware help shape it and give it a slightly unique character. But please bear in mind I have only one ear 😂😂 -cheers
I agree there's a subtle difference between the two, but they're the same species, statements about mahogany sounding warmer than ash etc. is out the window. apparently, mahogany sounds warmer than mahogany. how about other factors like the way the guitar was glued together, the fit of the screws to the body, things like that
helldeirch Well in many cases mahogany will have a rich lower midrange BUT there are so many exceptions, that it’s not wise generalize. Yes, glue and / or fit of screws are (just as anything else on a guitar) factors that count.
Hey there I am sorry but, tonewood isn't real in solid body electric guitars,the nut is not the same and you probably didn't set up the guitars in the same way, also I notice that you pick your guitar harder/play differently in your guitar,wich is normal is your guitar :), and for what I hear the most Diference is in the attack and the way how the notes ara hit!
I like to call this the good ol case of "classic scoop sound syndrome" Your friends guitar sounds so much better in this comparison. I recently went through 7 different fender mustangs last month to finally get the perfect sounding one. I came to the same conclusion as you did here... The hardware and bridge and pickups didn't change anything but the body did. All the tone and character I was tirelessly chasing was coming from the body. It took me going through 7 guitars of the same model to figure that out. Awesome video man!
You sure the bridge is exactly the same, are they both zinc with nickel plating or is one of them brass with nickel plate. That makes a huge difference in the way the guitar and pickups feel. You put bell brass saddles on a les paul gives it a whole different dynamic sound. Just wondering. I looked up the specs for that reissue in 2016 it said zinc with nickel. But thats not what they used in 59.
Tonemaker Hey, that’s a very good point actually. I changed the original bridge to an ABM bell brass one on mine for that exact reason. So cool you checked out the specs, man! ABM is a german guitar hardware company using extremely good quality metals. I compared the two guitars at the end using my hardware (and of course pickups+electronics) on both. It was interesting, wasn’t it?
I think Jim Lill proved that pickups make up 99% of the tone in his video. Look up "where the tone comes from", Jim Lill, it's great. Well done on this one, but after his I'm convinced the tone wood thing is a myth
Consistent. Simple physics and a lot of work done with the guitar labor in order to display the obvious, that all materials interact with waves of all types differently. Density of material, determined by composition of material, influences wave interactions with predictable results.
Tonewoods are stable, look nice and might have certain tonal properties. But... It is impossible to pick pieces of wood and put together a guitar which sound exactly like . Make it look exactly like And have exactly the same setup (because of different properties which make the wood work (not sure if "work" is a correct term for warping/schrinking/twisting in English)). You can have 2 pieces of wood from the same tree. One piece IS tonewood, the other doesn't meet the qualities required to be tonewood. You can even have a guitar made of wood which isn't considered tonewood at all and still have a great playing, sounding and looking guitar... (Brian May, with his oak guitar) I would even grade how easy it is to process in the fabrication a quality of tonewood. Wood = magic
Hey....it’s not a fair comparison. Your Les Paul has top-wrapped strings over the tailpiece which makes a considerable difference to unplugged tone. When I topwrapped my Les Paul.. I got more bass. Well in fact more of everything.
Thank you so much! It was a whole day of work to shoot and a full week of editing. It was worth the time though. :) Your appreciation is highly appreciated! Haha!
Sorry, I didn’t mention it because I (falsely) though that it’s boring to even mention the wood selection of a Les Paul. Both have a mahogany body with a maple top and a mahogany neck with a rosewood fretboard. 👍 cheers!
Well, I agree if you are after a specific sound detail. Don`t go for the specs only, go for the one which sounds right to your ears. If tonewood matters, every guitar will be different - and even the finish matters, the sunburst on Andy`s guitar is darker and so is the tone ;-)
Great video, Kris! :) I was always sure, that wood definitely affects the sound! I especially see that with my new guitar. It's all about the resonance! The string vibrates, the wood reacts and gives vibration back (more or less. Depending on the type/hardness of the wood), creating different colours because of the strings behaving differently. Simple as that. Having a guitar now with a roasted maple neck (very hard!), I have a totally different frequency response and much more sustain. And recently, my brother put on a roasted maple neck on his old strat and he said that "this is a completely different guitar now!". I haven't heard it yet, but I'm sure it's true. And... of course you prooved it here. Without any doubt. :) Cheers! Markus
No, if the body vibrates it means that the string energy is being transmitted to the body and that will decrease the sustain of the instrument, not increase it. Wobbling bridges sound much worst that strongly fixed bridges because of it. In an acoustic instruments its completely different, you actually want resonance and vibration to move air, although even there the wood of the neck probably makes no difference in sound.
@@BrunodeSouzaLino Yeah and if the Earth was a ball all the water would run off!!! Have you even held a solid bodied electric guitar? Do you even strum bro??? 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Excellent video, isolating and eliminating all confounding factors for a true valid comparison! Over the past months, I’ve been really experimenting with swapping pickups in a few Les Pauls. My conclusions align with your video: 1) tone wood matters, or more exactly, the specific wood and construction of a particular guitar matters most and is apparent in the acoustic properties of the instrument 2) pickups matter, but more with regards to how they marry with a particular guitar to achieve a desired result. 3) Not covered in your video, unpotted pickups, because of their enhanced microphonism, amplify and are more sensitive to the fundamental acoustics of the guitar.
Electric guitars are transducers, converting mechanical energy (string vibration) into electrical energy via interaction between the metal strings and the pickup magnets. Acoustic guitars are not transducers.....the relatively massive body vibrates in resonance with the strings and thus directly increases the amplitude of the air-borne vibration. Mechanical energy is not converted, but simply increased to greater mechanical energy. Since signal production in electric guitars is based on the interaction between metal strings and magnets, outside factors such as wood, finish, moon phases, etc. are virtually irrelevant. String gauge may affect signal output somewhat, due to the direct relationship between metal vibrational mass and electrical output, and external resonance may sustain the vibration a bit longer.....but the relative effects of both are minimal. In acoustic guitars, resonance is the single most significant characteristic, and numerous outside factors can affect the guitar body's ability to resonate with the string vibration......wood thickness and type, internal volume, string gauge, finish, curvatures, etc. i.e. all the factors that have little or no effect in electric guitars. It's tempting to apply the acoustic guitar's susceptibility to external effect to electric guitars, but since they both operate on completely different principles..What holds true for one doesn't for another.
For what you are saying to be true you need two things: the guitar body to not vibrate (meaning energy is not lost to the body) and wood (all variations) to have a flat frequency response so that it steals energy from all frequencies equally. This does not mean that rosewood from a tree that only bears peed on is good enough for a gibson fretboard, but it does mean that there are no two guitars that sound the same due to the inconsistencies of wood as a material even with the same pickups. It also means that the further away materials are from the theoretical line between the fret and the saddle, the less energy they absorb and thus the less they affect the tone so you can't go around cutting off strat's horns to make it brighter. If you really want to go full analyst, air density also affects tone since energy is lost to the air as well. So the perfect guitar is probably made of bronze and played in the vacuum of space. The reason people use "resonant freq" for electric guitars is that that freq is what you'd expect to be lost slower, not that it is in anyway amplified.
@@MrMortadelas So far, none of the pro tone woods people have been able to devise a test that's repeatable and respects the scientific method. Air could affect only the mechanical energy of the string, but steel is much denser than oxygen and atmospheres cannot affect magnetic fields either. The guitar would still produce sound in a vacuum, because the pickups are not picking up the sound of the string, but rather the variations in their magnetic field as a ferrous material is moving close to it. This is why you have less sustain when the pickups are too close to the string for example, as the magnetic field is strong enough to cut the string vibrations short. Which in turn goes back to the point of my comment. Sure, the string could cause the body to vibrate, but that vibration is insignificant to the sound production, otherwise, you'll experience that in the form of uncontrollable feedback seen on semi hollow and hollow body guitars.
@@BrunodeSouzaLino Insignificant but constant is what makes real things not sound like midi. The reason that the body vibrations affect tone is not that they make a sound or something (for electric guitars) but that they transform the simple example of a vibrating string with fixed edges into a complex system of a vibrating string with vibrating edges. If you want an example there is the swedish dude that tested with planks ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-nrEar7dgVwI.html The things that you call insignificant is the only reason strings don't vibrate forever. If energy wasn't lost in the body, air and magnetic pull then there is no reason for a string to stop vibrating and there is no material that absorbs all frequencies the same.
Cool video, Kris! What's the weight of each Les Paul? I think that's the most important part of the Les Paul sound: more mass or less mass that swings or not (=more low mids or less low mids)
The differences are there with the same electronics but much much closer. I think it's close enough that if someone is running a specific set of pots,caps and pickups that you like the sound of it's worth getting the same.
You should strip the finish off of it and send it back to him with bare wood, as payment for what he did to your bass. Also, great video. Though one thing I'd have added is that folks need to understand that those micro-tonal differences add up. So a slight difference in tone because of the wood, pickups, bridge, thickness of finish, strings, nut, pots, etc... those all add up, and that's why there's such a massive difference in tone when you hear them originally compared.
This is another Andy. Haha! Funny coincidence that two of my best friends are called Andy... So I think I'll just let the finish alone on this R8 and give it back to him. Haha! And you're a 100% right about the slight differences adding up.
Hi Kris - thanks a lot for this video. For my ears YOUR guitar sounds a little bit "better" , but both are awesome. And what I have learned from this video is that really each of this intruments are unique. For example: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-YdT3ZL9qrxA.html This is a 2010 VOS 58er Reissue Custom Shop Les Paul. Of Course Gregor is playing in another style but its a very different sound. The pickups are "normal" Burstbuckers but I really love the whole character of this guitar. AND - I´m proud to say that I own this exact guitar since 2015 and never will give it away again! Greetings from Germay!
Awesome video and great idea!!! The woods are having great impact on the tone and lets not forget that the woods are something “alive”. They need good care so they can keep on “breathing out the tone you desire”! Peace bro!!! P.S. I love your playing
Kris Hello from TX \m/ Excellent Video on the ever deeeeeeep rabbit hole topic of Tone Wood! I've lost a lot of sleep thru the years on this one too. This wood vs that wood with these pick up .... blah, blah, bafreakin' blah right! I think that it really comes down to the basic chunk of wood that speaks to you especially when it comes to Les Pauls. So many factors (pickups, sting gauge, hardware...) that can "sweeten" the basic starting point of the "Acoustic" properties as you've done an excellent job at documenting in this vid! Nice pick ups btw! I've really been wanting to try those Raw Vintage PAFs! Excellent playing - I've really enjoyed your videos! Great YT channel! I do have a question about the way you wrap the strings on your stop bar by using the over or reverse technique. Why do you do that? I do this because I feel that I get a touch more tension out of the 24.5 inch neck scale & prefer the way it feels on the bridge - not a huge difference in to sound though.
Whoever believes that a component of a specific construction doesn't play a role in the .....construction...is an idiot. That goes for everything, including woods on guitars of course. Period.Well done on the video! Excellent.
ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-KbRlcdNHYDM.html Ill put this link here, there is Keith Merrow comparing bunch of SD pups in one guitar. I dare to say, there is bigger differnce in Kriss's video with same pups in 2 different guitars, then in Keiths video with 1 guitar and many different pickups.
Very interesting video and I must say I like your guitar better. Prior to watching this video, I would have thought that pickups would make the biggest difference and I was wrong. Now, I wonder what would have happened if you took your guitar's neck and put it on Andy's? You hear a lot that the character of the guitar travels with the neck. Maybe do a strat experiment next?
Nicely done. Your video shows clear evidence that the structural integrity of a guitar has a certain impact on the string vibration. Others may call it damping characteristics (Rob Chappers?). But the thing I wonder about this whole discussion is, can it be dialed out by the EQ. There are some major radio buttons in your sound system to dial the tone. The amp / pedal tone control seems to be the most efficient way to dial. So when you are looking for some specific tone characteristic anyone would start tweaking the tone control. And when playing in a live set situation, getting through the mix is even more important. These subtle differences seem to disappear when playing with a band. Owning a huge amount guitrs right now, I don't care too much for the initial guitar spec. The way a guitar responds to my playing is my relevant USP. Afterwards I usually tweak the tone by adjusting pups or hardware towards to eliminate specific weak points. No more than that. Thus, the way a guitar responds to my playing has a bigger impact on my sound than the guitar spec, as I will play differently. :)
There's no scientific evidence for tone wood, but any experienced guitar player who has transferred pickups from guitar to guitar knows that something is up.
Really nice video. Differences are subtle but audible. The same that in Tim Sway's video or Warmoth Guitar Products' one. So, yes, wood has some effect, but I wouldn't buy a guitar for the type of wood that it uses. You typically have dozens of tone knobs and eqs between the guitar and the speakers, and a small variation in one of those knobs is probably going to have a greater effect than the wood of the body. Or, another way to see it, you can easily get the same tone than the other guitar with minimal eq tinkering. P.D. Of course, differences where way higher when using different pickups in the same guitar.
Hi Chris , i was looking to change my les Paul Standard 50's pickups to be as close as possible of paf sounds. And when i ear your LP its just the sound im looking for. WE cant get JB signature pu anymore si what Can you advice to me as bridge , neck pu ? And what Brand for thé stop bar , tailpiece ? Hope you could answer to me . Thanks a lot for all your vidéos and all the work it représents
Everything in the guitar is part of the guitar sound but wood is the element that sounds unique because of the organic nature of wood. An interesting video would be to buy two sets of the same model pickups and see if the pickups sound identical or just very similar. If each pickup that comes out of the assembly line sounds unique then a wonderful sounding guitar is a wonderful combination of unique wood as well as unique pickups. What I always wonder is if overall sound has more to do with pickups or with wood...
tonewood is not a "myth", it's just physics. "but it's electric, there's pickups" yes and pickups are affected by the vibration of the strings, which guess what, are affected by the whole guitar. Stradivari used to hand pick the trees for his violins and mix different kinds of paint; now, i would not go that far for an electric guitar (since i suck at playing anyway) but yeah, there is a difference. Great video Kris
Acoustic guitar with humbuckers and it sounds awful ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-fwuGCmSj8TA.html. Its like putting speakers in a grand piano
To me it boils down to this: the pickups transmit an electrical signal of the vibration of the string, which IS the tone. The wood and/or construction affects the waveform of that vibration. Everything contributes to the sound.
You should rather use a Seymour Duncan Antiquity in the neck Not the bridge! as the neck antiquity was rated as the best rendition of a real antique paf neck humbucker, it is the bridge you should use a RAW vintage humbucker wound to 8.8k or higher!
Whenever I see this kind of comparison I always remember those people who say that a 1000 dollars HDMI cable delivers a "clearer picture" and whatnot compared to your cheapo HDMI cable. And a while back a saw an "audiophile" network switch being sold for 20 times what it should cost. This isn't exactly the same thing but the same principle applies, if you really want to listen to the difference, you will hear it, whether that difference is there or not.
The funniest thing is that most people who say "tonewood is not a real thing the difference is because of this and that and not the wood" have NEVER truly done a real comparison themselves. It's fair for me to assume that because honestly, who the hell has access to two identical guitars with the same pickups, strings, bridge, nut, and scale length but only different wood types to actually make that comparison?? If you have a video that proves me wrong via a REAL COMPARISON, cool, otherwise this claim has ZERO basis and this dude right here actually proved these people wrong. I agree that the difference might not be that dramatic and the pickups still affect most of the sound, but it really depends on who's listening and how picky they are with sound. It's like a beginner guitar player who tries to play a solo and thinks that he nailed it like a pro only because he played the correct notes on time but an experienced guitar player will notice all the small nuances and details that truly make the solo sound good and will play it better.
The change in the character is there between the 2 woods but the fact of the matter is “good” wood vs “Bad” wood (in terms of tone) is not real. It will only add a slight difference in timber to the character and feel of the guitar where as the electronics are going to give you the vast majority if the the tone ie, most of the eq curve, output, etc. you can hear in the video that the timber of one guitar is softer and the other a bit more edgy but with the same pickups they “mostly” sound the same. The difference is there but subtle. where quality of wood comes into play is reliability of the instrument. Theres a reason why squire strats never have straight necks.
The take away for me was that once you started adding any kind of clipping the differences narrowed significantly, and the more the signal was overdriven the narrower that gap got. Conclusion? Tonewood is pointless for high gain guitar music. Maybe it matters for clean and edge of breakup playing.
Awsome video! Take it one step further. Partner with seymour Duncan to see if they can pickup out the differences in the tone woods. Send the guitars to seymour and see if he could choose or wind the pickups so that both guitars sound the same.
Thanks for the video Kris. Keep it up. You asked for opinion so I will give you mine ;). Everithing matters and of corse wood matters. Hovever I dont belive in ''tone wood'' in a way people do. And you actualy just proved my point. Every peace of wood is different so I do not belive what people say about ''tone wood''. People who belive in it think just by knowing the tipe of wood guitare is made out of that they would know the caracter of the guitar. For example '' maple is brighter''. No it is not! Some are and some are not. I thint that there is no rule. It is to do with everithing ang mostley with construction and dencery of wood then the spicies. So you cant tell me that if you change neck on a strat from rosewood board to maple will be brighter. It might but it might not. There is no rule. And let me say it one more time. Wood does make a difference but you can't generelise. Onlu my oppinion ;p
To me this shows that it is NOT the species of wood implied that make the difference, so it have to be something else, maybe the different density of the woods implied in these two instruments... 🤷🏼
Hey Homie, the chinese have done it, that's right they have cloned vintage 50's and 60's Les Pauls and so well even the experts can't tell the difference!
Thanks for the info, I´ve being doing some small project under second hand guitars, when im buying them as long as I know i can resell it latter and so on..... Conclusion I´ve crossed some cheap budge guitar mostly of my time... but in certain moments I also have hit some great ones. So i was really looking for a video to compare them , tks for all those infos (i´ve also watched videos which says you can play guitar out of concrete , and I dont doubt about it, but it did not give the insight as I want , because you can really config many other characters that influence it)
On an acoustic…. Grain matters. On an electric, wood density matters for sustain only. Construction…. IE… joint design on neck. Nut and saddle density. Have an impact as well.
very interesting.. the tone wood exist.. the personality of the guitar can listen across the same pickups and make the diference.. perhaps with this tone wood the friend's guitar needsother pickups than your for the best tone
Hey Kris, great video. What did Andy’s guitar weigh ? I found heavier (10lb) guitars had more mid range, but maybe that’s just the ones I played? Not sure how Gibson select the ‘best tonewood’ for the custom shop just based on weight.
I learned something today. I was always in the camp that pickups give you 95%+ of the sound and that wood/build was a very small part of the equation and would only be obvious to a trained ear. This video showed me that every guitar has its own character so you better shop for one that sounds the way you like up front. In this case, I would take Andy's guitar over the other regardless of pickups/hardware as I really enjoy the midrange sound to the other which is way to quacky for my taste.
The two guitars sounded exactly as they did with the stock pickups or at least they sounded just as different as they did with different pickups in. I was surprised. I suspect a guitars sound should be judged acoustically before anything else. Woods etc all topics of conversation but I tried five Gibson R8s and the one I have to me at least just had “it”, one other was close and the other three just weren’t “there” for me at all.
Maybe you hear what you want to hear or play them slightly differently watch this guys comparison. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-n02tImce3AE.html
To those of you who don’t think that wood affects tone: Are you saying that the wood’s acoustic and resonating properties: how it affects/produces overtones, tone durability, frequency pattern and string separation - WON’T be picked up by the pu:s? I strongly doubt that.
One observation I've made is that the "anti-tonewood" camp claims that tonewood is a myth started by guitarmakers to sell more guitars. I agree wholeheartedly. By convincing you that mahogany and ebony aren't worth the money, because they're not tonewoods (nor are they advertised as such by higher end guitarmakers), these makers of cheap plywood and pine guitars feel justified in charging you top dollar for inferior woods, because iT dOeSn'T mAtTeR bRo! These are the same luthiers that, if they had access to the wood that Gibson had access to, would be telling you how their Sun-Ripened Nicaraguan Virgin Harvest Rainwood had "infinite sustain" and "deep, mellow tones."
There are some people who have perfect pitch. It would be rather insane for anyone to tell them that they can't really hear pitches. Likewise with color-blindness and a slew of other things. Thanks for your videos on the subject, Kris.
From your video. For me , tonewood contributes around 5% on tone. I have done the similar swapping neck test on my tele. The result is the same: 5% darker on rosewood to maple. But after changing pickup from humbucker to other humbucker brand, the result is massive. You use the same gibson pup then could see little difference. I used to replace the epiphone alnico pro to seymour duncan jazz, it changes almost 70-80% of the tone. And even from same epiphone brand, probucker to alnico classic pro, the changes is about 40%. The same on single coil, tex mex vs hot tele vintera ltd ed.
An amazing number of myths in the guitar world, from which the vintage guitars is probably the worst, because for example while you can make a modern guitar sound like a vintage one by sculpting the tone, you can't make a vintage guitar sound like a modern one, because a significant part of the frequencies is not picked by the much less efficient pickups used back in the days and the effects of age in the eletronics. Same goes for amps and valves
Many variables! I did this experiment many years ago and had the same result as in this video. 2 Gibson Les Pauls that sounded different acoustically. I swapped my SD Seth Lovers between both guitars. On one LP the sound was warm and bluesy (think Clapton). On the other guitar the same pickup took on a much more aggressive hard rock sound ( think Foreigner). A hardwood solid body guitar has acoustic properties. Just as an acoustic does. No 2 trees are alike nor any same size slab of mahogany for example. A slab of mahogany can vary anywhere from 5-25lbs. Some will be more porous than others. Some will have more closed tighter grain. Some will have more life and sustain longer than others. The wood is the heart and soul. 2 same pieces of mahogany will sound different when you tap on them. With different resonant frequencies. There are generalizations that hold true for different kinds of wood. Example Mahogany is warm and round. And Maple is known to be brighter sounding with great sustain. Hardware will add to the recipe. Wether it’s steel (bright), brass (mid-rangy), etc. Pickups of course will add and sound different from one set to another. The magnets in pickups will change the sound of a guitar if you swap those out as well (A2, A3, A4, A5, ceramic). Everything effects everything. But the bottom line and the heart is the wood. Some guitars just sound dead. They don’t sustain and sound muffled. And you can dress them up with the best pickups and electronics. And guess what? It still will sound dead lifeless and without sustain. And no I completely disagree with some people saying that you can make one sound like the other by tweaking the eq. That is false! You can play with the amplifiers eq but that is after the fact. It’s not going to effect the origin. Or change the inherit properties of the piece of wood that you are starting with. It’s like a fingerprint and there are no 2 alike. It’s in the wood!
Next time just pick the guitar with the neck against the wall, through the DI, and check if there are differences in sound waves.. I can tell you that if there are differences is because the most resonant have lower sustain.
Kris, firstly great job. It's clear the the overall tone of a guitar is not created by one a single element, or even a combination of a few major components, it's the entire instrument. Many major and minor differences combine to give a guitar it's particular voice. Both guitars sound good to me in their stock set up. We each may prefer one or the other, that's personal preference. Nice job though in showing us that the search for 'Great Tone', which we all seek, is not achieved just by replacing major components.
It never made sense to me how wood could make such a difference in how an unplugged solidbody electric guitar sounds, but once you plug it in none of that matters? If the wood guitar body resonates from the strings a certain way, that's going to resonate back into the strings.
Good job. I think it is short sighted to think wood makes no difference. I mean come on we’re guitar players, we are agonize over every little detail. How does string gauge effect tone, how many winds of nos wire are in the pickup, what value caps, etc, etc. Yet, that same guy will argue wood doesn’t make a difference....GIVE ME A BREAK! Yes it is a subtle difference, but so is every other tone shaping piece of puzzle that we agonize over.
The opposite is in fact true. Electric guitars are not acoustic instruments. On an electric guitar, the solid body is a purely structural piece and any embellishments you can see, like tops and things like that are there for aesthetics. The others...Well, let's say that manufacturers need reasons to have you buy their instruments, as they're losing money when they're not selling instruments.
BrunoDSL I’ve been building and playing guitars for 30+ years. My experience, not to mention this video, says that’s not true. The wood does have an affect on the tone coming through the pickups. Yes it is a subtle difference, that has never been disputed. The fact is this video proves the subtle difference. But as I said, us guitar players are always looking for the subtle difference. You of course have the right to believe what you want, but that doesn’t make it right. And I’m sure that you will say the same back to me and that’s ok. In my experience, the guys that have made sawdust and built instruments from scratch, generally agree and understand the wood does make a difference in the tone of electric guitars.
@@pops71 Nobody disputes that resonance can change tone, but for the worst, since resonance means that string energy is being lost, not increased. On the overall tone, what produces the tone is the string vibration frequency, so how would wood resonance affect the frequencies in the strings?
In so far, NODOBY that claimed tonewoods affect tone has been able to prove it nor devise a test that respects the scientific method and is repeatable by different parties with similar results that can be compared against. The two principal components of sound generation in any electric guitar are the strings and the pickups and that's it. If tonewoods play such a huge role on how a guitar sounds, why changing to different strings and pickups drastically alters the sound of the instrument? Why do I get more bass and my guitar becomes louder when I use thicker strings? People love to apply the same principles of acoustic guitars to electrics, but that's the same as saying that apples and oranges are exactly the same because both are fruit.
You hear with your eyes, not your ears. The "darker" guitar was brighter playing lead on bridge and the graph showed the higher peaks at the 5K range (see the comparison near the 11 o 8 minute mark). This is a perfect case study of bias.
Excellent! Your friend's guitar kept its low-mids peak and kinda muffled tone with your guitar electronics and hardware. If someone keeps saying wood tone doesn't come through the pickups, he/she's simply tone deaf and we can't do anything about it: it's their problem. String vibration is transferred to the woods which resonate (or don't resonate) at different harmonics, which get back to the strings (as a definition of resonance), then to the pickups as a consequence. It's not that difficult to figure out after all!
