You have no proper use of multicore utilization, you have no portal culling. You are an unoptimized source port that has been twisted by particle effects and botched voxel rendering into a crude mockery of John Carmack’s perfection.
@Nic-Usor not British either, but I do find it funny that you will refuse someone (the developer in question) basic human respect because they worked on a sourceport you dont like
@@ikagura The guy who was nicknamed "Marisa Kirisame" creeped on a child and from what I gathered, the mods on ZDoom is protecting him instead of banning him by banning anyone who mentions what he done. Sorry I didn't reply sooner! I was busy with IRL stuff. Also OP pinned his comment to shame the guy.
"It's optimized to play DOOM STUFF" "So you can play with mods?" "Hell no, are you crazy? If you run GZDoom with mods you will get a lot of problems" "So... Why i will prefer GZ over any other source port, any source port can run Doom very well, with mods" "You're not supposed to use GZDoom to play with mods" "If I don't want to play with mods then i will use steam version or any simple source port" "You're banned from the discord server, pal"
>hardware acceleration and OpenGL/Vulkan rendering support >”omg you’re not supposed to use it to run anything beyond Doom! omg you’re literally Sgt_Mark_IV!” And I thought texture filtering by default was their worst decision.
I once saw a couple of comments like creator of GZdoom is A-grade ahole and forcing his own bindings, settings, etc by default. Not sure if it's true, but I do know from a personal experience with communication and participations in those projects that almost every single creator of popular mods, emulators, source ports are indeed an aholes because they can't handle all that fame and popularity of their job.
they managed to make a game that runs on a printer, various calculators, a fridge, an ATM machine and a fucking pregnancy test require military grade PC builds in order to hope getting more than 40 fps
@@Water_White053 It's not running on a pregnancy test, and it's definitely not running on gut bacteria. It only uses those as displays, and the gut bacteria one is 0.00003 FPS
My whole channel is based on gzdoom mods. Thousands running on phones. What are you talking about ? This hatred against others I making me sick. Both sides! .. Get your sh.. together and stop fighting. If all the doom modders and developers for the engine and source ports would come together, think about the possibilities. But you all rather being self centered introverts not capable of communicating without getting offensive when someone disagrees. Talking about all the people who think it's ok to bash others for their hobbies, having fun or asking questions. And since that's absolutely BOTH sides .. I'm happy I'm not one of them. I enjoy all doom source ports .. And. Btw. If GZDOOM is sooooo unoptimized. Why are the most mods made for that port? And especially the most insane and feature packed ones? Ashes, unreal RPG 99, total chaos, the crypt, venturous current, Budapest, brutal doom Platinum, dragon sector, postal gz, dozens of Half life,quake, duke and other demakes brought into gz. Sure, zandronum is awesome. And lzdoom too. But those have only a fraction of the mods I can get for gz. I've collected 50.000+ (240gb). And uploaded 14gb of universal add-ons if you're interested.
@@AndroidFerret Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't the Android port of GZDoom run on GLES? If you use OpenGL ES instead of the normal OpenGL on the PC version of GZDoom you'll see a huge performance boost in more advanced mods but a few of the fancy graphical improvements might be gone.
The funnier part is it advertises itself as having "limitless modding potential", and then they sit chatting shit about anyone who tries to make a decent mod in GZdoom
Voxels: Zdoom: "I can handle it, no problem!" Zandronum: "I can handle it, but there's some really minor issue. Nothing serious." ... ... GZDoom: "I can load it, maybe I-I-I-I ca-a-a-a-a-a-a-n hand-d-d-d-d-d-dle i-i-i-i-i-it!"
isnt gzdoom supposed to be "zdoom but better" i know absolutely nothing about doom modding though so if im wrong please point me in the direction of a good source port
@@superdan333 It's supposed to be "ZDoom with OpenGL rendering", eventually it became way more than that with added features such as floor-over-floor (3D floors), ZScript. By itself GZDoom IS good (and is the definitive source port when it comes to being feature-heavy), but the problem is that it's not all well-optimized for the new things it brings to the table.
What really gets me is a lot of the people saying gzdoom isnt being used "as intended" in the video are themselves very popular mod authors. Beside, if i wanted to play doom as intended without any mods, id use dos box or prboom.
I'm no expert myself but I have a newer prebuilt pc running an i7, 16 gb ram and rtx 3000 and I can run some pretty hefty load orders with no frame issues, I also have an older pc with an amd fx6300, gtx 760, 16gb ram, and even on that I really have no issue unless I'm trying to do some really heavy graphics mods, it seems most of these issues just stem from people not reading mod descriptions or having terrible load orders. Always used gzdoom and barely had any problems that stemmed from bad mod development, just me being impatient 99% of the time lol
@@dylanbasstica8316 gzdoom isnt that bad in all honesty, its actually done a lot for free gaming. Buts just not optimized for lower end hardware anymore. I typically run doom on a gpd win max, which is similar to your older build but with integrated graphics, and it runs smooth most of the time but i have to turn graphics way down and occasionally still deal with lag spikes and crashes (mainly on larger maps). I think the main gripe people have is the fact you need this kind of hardware at all when doom is almost 30 years old and gzdoom is almost 20 years old at this point.
My laptop runs GZDoom with no mods in 30 FPS, it runs horrible without mods through Delta Touch, it lagged on my old computer which I used to play GTA 5 and a bit of Doom Eternal. This engine is comedic
I think even Sgt_Mark_IV is trying to avoid that sort of buggery with Brutal Fate. IIRC, the system he's using to build that game has an Intel i5 that's a couple generations old and GTX 750 Ti
@@zebos2432I shit you not my phone's screen fell off because my phone keeps on overheating when running pb 3.0 and ended melting the glue holding the screen in place
This sourceport is so well optimized that my old laptop (i5 5200u or some shit like that, and 4gb of DDR3 ram) got more performance than my new one (GTX 1650, Ryzen 5 3550h and 16GB of DDR4 ram)
@@lod4246 GZDoom, like all Doom source ports, is limited by the clock-speed of the first core of a CPU (because the engine was created before multi-cores were a thing). Of the two CPUs listed above, a quick Google search suggests the i5 5200u has a base clock speed of 2.2Ghz, while the Ryzen 5 3550h is only 2.1Ghz. Therefore it would make sense that GZDoom would run slower on the weaker hardware.
@@bauul. I don't even think GZDoom is able to run on more than 1 CPU thread, lol. congrats GZDoom dev team on making a game engine in the 2030's run even worse on more powerful hardware architecture and not even use any hardware acceleration. This is truly the pinnacle of software innovation.
Some map packs also run horribly on GZDoom during some moments. In Ancient Aliens for example once ya reach the level with UFO ships and ya just look at em, your fps dramatically drops and yet in PrBoom+ it runs just fine. Another thing is Holy Hell Revealed, just a slaughter map with buttloads of monsters to kill, you run it in GZDoom and it goes at 5 FPS. Run it in PrBoom+ and ya have 60+ fps.
This is exactly why there needs to be a fork of GZDoom that sheds all of the technical debt. A "fuck previous mod compatibility, but get this thing running like a beast" fork.
VKDoom ditches OpenGL and its translation layers for pure Vulkan, but loses OptionsMenuSimple support and some other stuff. (Couldn't get ucminimap to load, haven't yet found what its looking for that the sourceport doesn't) It also doesn't handle viewport or resolution changes at runtime, at all, so get used to manually editing .INIs for changing settings.
In German, it's "ghey-tsett Doom." Reminds me of the post-war (i.e., installed by the winning side) abbreviation for the Nazi concentration camps, KZ (khuh-tsett), instead of the original K.L. for "Konzentrations-Lager." (They chose it so it sounds "harder." Can't make this shit up.)
I remember actually testing this to see what people said was right. The first PC I used had a 1st gen i5 with a 1050, and it got nearly 1000 fps on entryway. The second had a 9th gen i7 with a 2060, and it got around 800. Both were tested with the Vulkan backend and at 640x480 in fullscreen. I don't care what the developers say about optimization, any program shouldn't run slower on newer hardware.
GZDoom has been in this sad state for a long time. A good 13 years ago when I was looking into source ports, out of Zdoom, Zdaemon, Skulltag, Doomsday. The only source port that ran poorly was GZDoom, no matter how much I've played with the options, even on plain Doom 2 it was chugging.
За то это неискончаемый кладезь мемов, начиная от самого порта и заканчивая его разработчиками, более никакое сообщество не может таковыми похвастаться
GZDoom is so damn poorly optimized because it's single core, EDuke32 (Duke Nukem 3D source port) is the same exact thing. LZDoom is much better performance wise, but that doesn't save it from being a fork of GZDoom
I don't think the CPU is the bottleneck in Doom's case. 3GHz should be enough clock cycles to run a game from 1993 that was built to run in software rendering. My uneducated guess is that it doesn't batch draw calls correctly, leading to a lot of downtime when the CPU and GPU need to sync (Ion Fury did that as well, it managed to bring PCs to their knees at launch)
@@juanchol21 prboom+ at least runs good because it's mostly just vanilla Doom. It's just the nature of the Doom engine being CPU reliant and single core
@@Catonator It actually is with the more demanding maps and mods. It is so CPU-dependent (1st CPU thread) that it couldn't run certain maps properly even on a CPU from the next century if the IPC didn't get much higher from what they are today (and we've long reached the practical limits of transistor technology, mind you). Graf Zahl actually wrote on the forums that reflections and some other calculations are done on the CPU, so even the fastest GPU won't help you much if a map has the CPU loaded already.
The day that another engine supports slopes, 3D floors, colored lighting along with other quality of life changes [maybe minimal ACS implementation] that is also fully compatible with demos, I'll switch over. DSDA recently got updated to support UDMF, MBF21 format is highly capable of custom things while also being demo compatible, and Odamex supports that same level of demo compat along with full color software rendering and some more advanced features (like MBF21 and Hexen format! Hopefully UDMF soon). Honestly I'm perplexed as to why "PrBoom with 3D" floors doesn't exist yet, considering recent advancements.
Eternity engine afaik has it all except for 3D floors (which can be worked around to an extent using portals) and runs better from my experience but in no way as well as prboom+ and its derivatives
Never forget the time I tried to play splitscreen with my friend Steve on GZDoom using a couple of cvars and then my computer fans turned on after like 15 minutes. someone help me setup doom legacy i beg of you
@@mr.m2675 Thanks dude. I actually managed to snag a PC with a quad core and now it runs wonderfully. Graf Zahl should still focus on optimizing the game. I know GZDoom is known for fancy graphics but it's a bit shameful that something like that can sometimes not run very smoothly because of poor optimization.
@@theraymunator "Known for fancy graphics"? by default its *stretched* to 16:9 and has texture filtering that makes everything look like mush. I was shocked how good Doom actually still looked when I played it in a real source port like prboom+
Using the latest hardware to run a 30-year old game engine with a decent frame rate is downright frustrating and head-scratching. I'm glad that more people are aware of this. And don't get me started about the Doom forum drama queens and their new GZDoom versions using new syntax codes that limits custom content when using it with old Doom wads (the "A_FireMissile" function now replaces the "A_FireProjectile" code that makes it unfriendly for custom projectile coding). This is why up to now, I still only use LZDoom and I think I will switch to Zandronum in the future if I feel like it.
Zandronum completely mogs GRAFDOOM simply by being more optimized and able to run megawads without frames dropping every second. What's more it's a decade old source port that's based on ZDoom.
I remember when Blade of Agony was released, devs tried to avoid and dodge performance problems for years, until they finally realized that the best answer is recommend to basically turn off and lower every possible graphics settings on modern high-end PC and enjoy 25-45 fps because it's normal even at static corridor scenarios 🤣 P.S. Brutal Doom is insanely optimized tho for all that mess and chaos that is happening on the screen, especially the latest version given the maniacal level of passion from it's developer. And even better optimized with Brutal Doom variations and forks, so another horrible example by those gzdoom forums smartazzes.
Also, Sargeant Mark made an amasing optimization for bd v22 where if the enemy count is way too big the game lowers particles and enemies projectiles quality to improve performance.
@@DatGuy12345 Yeah, I guess I was talking about this one. There is a video comparison how much better it performs and detailed breakdown how it was made
@@bl1tz533 keeoing interactions to strict business of discussing adding another useless feature to GZDoom and dogpiling everyone who brings up obvious optimization problems? Good idea, but nah...
GZDoom is so cool with its mods,but even with my beefy PC,the fps it sometimes gets is honestly unacceptable. its one of the main reasons im gravitating twords DSDA for anything i can run with it,instead of GZDoom.
Tried gzdoom 4.6 non-vulkan version on my pentium T4400. OpenGL mode doesn't run good, at most 10 fps. 640x480 in software mode yields 35 fps straight, but struggles with lightings and particles. Lzdoom on the other hand... It's like day and night. Fullscreen 1366x768 in OpenGL 1.1 at 60fps and runs brutal doom with minimal gore and decals.
Try the latest GZDoom with OpenGLES. It should fly, but you can't use the software renderer. Advantage: latest GZDoom features. Btw LZDoom is unmaintained unless a critical bug appears.
GZDoom being one of the most popular doom source ports with one fatal flaw that their snowflake ass server makes fun of because people have a legitimate issue with the fact that one of the most optimized games ever was turned into a super difficult to run source port with the intent of running tons of wads at once then saying everyone uses it wrong like then how do you properly use GZDoom????
i hate discord circlejerkers, even if they were right, and they're not, this attitude literally makes me lose all respect for these closeted 'communities'
>Has got a cheap "decent" ahh laptop (1920x1080 res, 4GB RAM / 32GB Storage, Intel Atom-ic bomb, enough to run Prboom+ pretty good) >GZDoom with some touches can't go more than 24 fps, but with heavily minimal changes goes clear 60 >Eduke32 runs almost better w/ minimal changes "Yeah, def it is gamechanging"
I tried running Reelism 2 and it works really well but on really big open maps where a bunch of enemies are constantly spawning the game slows down a lot. I'm glad to know that it's not like PC acting weird or something. I also recommend playing the Reelism 2 mod its a lot of fun.
that explains why my pc ran horribly, I have a potato pc and believe me it suffers with gzoom, I used gzdoom because it was what I used since I started playing doom, recently I switched to prboom Plus and it's another world
I like the Versatile and uniqe modding features of GZDoom and Eduke32... But tbh I rather have made or someone make a Custom engine thats similar but ya know... Able to handle such high modd shit?
Sorta like what Bethesda did with the unity ports? I know some people didn't like that but I think it's a smart idea to keep the game more compatible with modern technology
Honestly the Doom community can really suck. That's why I just play and never reveal how I play to people. The elite crowd can leave a bad taste in the mouth.
I worked on a mod team for a long while. I still fondly remember the great job we did, but afterwards I realized how sketchy some of the people on the team were, and they were people I actually got along with in the community! Between that and the Blade of Agony shitstorm, I quit. I don't know if it was always like this and it just never surfaced, or if once-decent people lost their marbles.
Tbh, I only downloaded that shit so I could play Doom. Though I was very very briefly considering trying my hand at making a mod for this, but this is making me reconsider. :/ Call it luck, since the thought has only lasted 10 minutes until I saw this video. :D
i remenber this one time i was trying to develop a mod and when i tried to use a mp3 sound file for one of the weapons sounds suddenly the game got slow as hell
I'm pretty sure MP3s are a universally slow format for sound effects in games. Part of the reason why so many AAA games are huge is because OGGs and WAVs are still being used.
I have a way shitter setup than that and I can still get a relatively consistent frame rate of 59-60. Cut back on some of the graphical settings and cut fov to 88-92. I dig pixel artwork so I always keep textures unfiltered. Looks better a lot of the time though with some games I'll keep it on a little bit. I can even have dynamic lighting but on a very low setting
My rig can't go any higher or I would. But for smooth play this is what I gotta do. A lot of these retro shooters have the goal of being able to be played on weak setups if needed. I think that's super cool but definitely will upgrade at some point. Cheers
I only play it with the voxel mod and black gloves cause the original look of the gloves makes it look like Doomguy has weird skin creases on his wrist
aaaaand now it freezes when loading in OpenGL/OpenGLES and Vulkan, forcing me to use softpoly, putting my resolution to the 2 lowest settings fuck you Graf
GZDoom, horrible backwards compatibility, doesn't properly emulate complevels 2, 3 and 9 (even under "strict"), very poor multiplayer performance, and recording demos is out of the question Only good for heavy mods and total conversions but even then complevel 21 is catching up DSDA-Doom is the new king on the block. if it ever gets multiplayer C/S asynchronous for casual play and synchronous for demo recording, it'd be the perfect source port
Say fellas, what y'all think of VKDook as an alternative to GZDoom's godawful performance? I had good luck with it so far, but I dunno about GZDoom mods compatibility.
As a person who runs gzdoom on a gpd win max (low per core speed and integrated graphics), multicore support would help, especially with making it crash less.
Sure, *just* rewrite an entire single threaded engine to multithreading, hope you're ok with rewriting compatibility for 20+ (actually almost 30) years of content which everyone expects to be able to run problem free.
@@0neDoomedSpaceMarine uhh lilith would like a word with you. Theres also mods like exp doom that just dont support the latest gzdoom anymore. Also also i dont think dividing instructions onto different cores actually changes compatability, you arent rewriting the sourceport from scratch or removing script functions. But what do i know.
@@0neDoomedSpaceMarine you mean theyre both edge cases. Exp doom uses consoles functions that are no longer supported either. In either case it shoes gzdoom isnt highly concerned for compatability with every mod.
