I don't know what's more ludicrous, Lex Luthor discussing evil plans in a shopping mall, or Ivy being allowed in that mall just hours after trying to destroy Gotham.
Do you realize how often Gotham is almost wiped off the map? If you are still living there, you bounce back pretty quick, or become one of the guys responsible. There really is no middle ground in Gotham.
Yeah, but Harley brought parademons to Gotham which resulted in SEVERAL people dying last season, but NOBODY brings it up. So it's not that surprising.
That's one of the best things about this show. It's not afraid to criticise the "strong independent woman" gimmick that other writers keep throwing into their work without bothering to make them actual characters. Heck, Queen of Fables was all the negative aspects of modern feminism rolled into one character and Harley rightfully knocked her block off at the end of Season 1.
Ivy: “Harley don’t be like the Queen of Fables, she takes things too far and you are too good for that. Harley, don’t destroy the world with a Para-demon army.” Also Ivy: “Harley, why did you stop me from beginning a zombie apocalypse that will wipe out all life as we know it?” Girl, you are sending really mixed messages
@@graffititurtle11 if it was what she wanted she wouldn’t have saved Harley. Because Eden requires all humans dead or as plant things and Harley is a human
@@graffititurtle11 that’s the contradiction. Her stated goal is to wipe out humans for the good of the green. And yet a human is very important to her. If she can’t bring herself to kill Harley then she can never do her stated goal.
"I trust the threat I payed more, than the threat I don't". Say what you want with Luthor, but the man is a wiz at win-win situations for himself and lose-lose for others.
@@dominicjuckes3988it’s like having a live tiger in your house. It will kill and eat you, but you would probably prefer to know where it at all times, even if it is in the same room as you
@@ericapowell7195 it's lex luthor we're talking about here. he's making her think she's gonna run it. You think a that man will just give away all that control for a plan he doesn't believe in?
I won’t be surprised if Lex is using her for his own gains. He wouldn’t be dishing out that much benefits unless he knows he’s getting something out of this
@@Elipson52008 He might be genuine, depending on what his goals are. For example he might be trying to drive a wedge between Ivy and Harley. Harley's moving in an anti-hero direction while Ivy leads a Legion of Doom? That's some serious conflict of interest between them.
I can't believe how good this season is. Shows like this drop off in quality around this time and it's only getting BETTER. I don't know how they manage to pull off these genuine moments in between bombastic jokes-per-minute, BUT IT WORKS. God I love these characters.
Kinda cute how Frank was clinging onto Ivy when she picked him up and that he was riding in the baby seat of the shopping cart like a little kid. Him being annoyed with the tacky pots was cute too XD And the grabby hands (leaves??) for the plain pot :’)
I love how Ivy is just casually shopping for groceries after she almost whipped out the citizens of Gotham lol and Lex hacking those flat screens seem to be a common thing too
Frank: get that paper! Ivy: hey, I really missed you Frank: I know Me: 🥹 I feel like people don’t talk enough about how cute their friendship is. They’re like family to each other.
Yeah, except Harley is showing more concern for people (to an extent) moreso than Ivy. Honestly, the two should break up due to their goals being so different.
It’s almost a running gag that Lex has hairless or semi-hairless pets. Off the top of my head, he had an Iguana, a Sphinx cat, a hairless Guinea Pig, and now a Chinese Crested.
It’s Gus recruiting Walter for the superlab all over again “A (wo)man provides. And (s)he does it even when (s)he's not appreciated, or respected, or even loved. (S)he simply bears up and (s)he does it. Because (s)he's a (wo)man.”
As much as they shit on Bane in this universe. Canonically in the comics Bane came the closest to permanently beat batman and is the first super villain to temporarily defeat batman.
So, anyone else think it's ironic how Ivy loves plants more than people or other animals so that makes her vegan? Shouldn't her love of plants make her a total carnivore? Is there an explanation I missed?
@@davidmarshall3683 so you're saying eating more animals would cut down on the living beings that eat plants? Sounds like something that would get her bloodlust going.
@Diego Palacios paiva agreed , especially for lex, he doesn’t even bend the knee for darkside he’s not gonna go with ivy, especially since her whole plan rn involved killing all the humans, which he is a part of, so yeah he’s up to soemthing
Its Lex his main goal will be to gain the research Ivy creates to weaponize it for his own benefit, since its easier to steal the end result without having to work for it
I mean, probably. But it also doesn't need to be convoluted like that. He IS getting something out of this, even at surface level. Ivy is (usually) more level headed than most of the villains that will be at her flank. Victories for the Legion would be victories for him even by proxy. He can still reap rewards from that. And he knows by now that Ivy would have the greatest chance of ensuring that. As corny as it is to say, she really is a force of nature.
@@bamban_garcia5562 this man can cure cancer in 20 mins with a high schools chem lab , I get he’s known for cake stealing and crimes but I doubt he would wait for the end process especially since a lot of ivys “science” happens inside the green where he can’t even collect data
not gonna lie, this kinda shows why Harley and Ivy should break up or aren't meant to be. If Harley is meant to be more heroic (more willing to sacrifice herself for others) while Ivy is more willing to end humanity and is pissed at Harley for doing the right thing then I don't see how they can be together. It honestly feels like Harley and Ivy have changed too much.
Same here. There was a very recent comic plot line about this where Harley left a small Eden and Ivy decided she was going to KILL HER for leaving because Harley loved humanity more than Eden.
I am actually really curious how this show is gonna handle that. I was honestly very frustrated when Ivy suddenly showed interest in working with Lex in the Legion of Doom, because we already went through that whole thing of her not wanting to play any part in it (yes, i know that was under different circumstances, but the point was still very much that she works alone). And if Ivy actually works with Lex and leads the LoD, how can she and Harley possibly stay in item while trying to more or less achieve the exact opposite? This isn't just about interests clashing (as this episode implied), it's about entire philosophies and visions for the future. This might be a bit of a self-indulgent wish, but I had always hoped that Ivy can find a midpoint between her love of plants and her newfound humanity. Not only is that likely the only way their relationship can keep making sense, but more importantly, I've felt for a while that it's a somewhat logical next step in her writing as well. She herself admitted that she too now has people she cares about, and I really want to see that aspect of her explored more.
I feel like ivy got lost in her purpose you can see in season 1 she had kinda lost that eco terrorist thing and didn’t have that whole single plan to getting what she wanted but thanks to Harley she started back up on her Edin plan and got to lost in it too see the zombie thing was way to left in the goal. She even told Harley in season 1 about limits but completely forgets it here cause she to deep into her goal
Giancarlo Esposito voices Lex Luthor in this show! - Gustavo Fring. (Breaking Bad & Better Call Saul) - Moff Gideon. (The Mandalorian) - Stan Edgar. (The Boys) - Anton Castillo. (FAR CRY 6)
I am really loving this Lex scene. Wish I could find full episodes of this show. My favorite Lex for a while has been Clancy Brown, but Giancarlo is nailing the whole genius but also suave thing so well that he can still be cute with his ugly puppy as he negotiates for global domination
Ok here's were I got a problem. So when Harley stops Ivy from taking over the world Ivy gets all piss. But, when Ivy stops Harley from taking over the world everything is fine kind of sort of. What sense does that makes?
Ivy actually wanted to take over the world because she wanted to. Harley tried to take over the world because she wanted to Ivy to like her, even though she didn't like to do it. Ivy did not want Harley to do things she doesn't like to impress her. Here, Ivy's mad that a plan that she had failed mainly because she didn't talk to Harley about it. She kept her in the dark and stayed vague about it until her plan was just about to be completed. I think Harley does want to take over the world, but not in an apocalypse-like scenario.
Remember how in S1 Ivy has managed to gain the loyalty of Shark, Clayface and PSYCHO? Just imagine Ivy gaining a legion of loyal followers (no pberomones). That or the LoD in Mama Macaroni.
I call it, Lex is the next big villain for S4! His offer to Ivy is just too good to be true. He definitely wants to use her or manipulate her and this will create even more tension between Harley and Ivy. I'm so hyped, but also so scared.
I like how there having this conversation in the middle of a store with other people in it ya think they'd wanna have this conversation somewhere more private
This is the arc when ivy becomes very evil and harley very heroic and at some point they will have to fight eachother to see if they really love eachother or love to be what they are a hero and a villain
I swear im about to watch this episode and if Harley and Ivy split in the season finale....I just don't need that disappointment today. really want to see them work it out but man harley did kinda screw up but I'd be disappointed if she didn't do anything to stop ivy in the first place.
You could say that but I saw it as Harley trying to preserve Ivy's original plan/vision which didn't involve a plant zombie apocalypse. Sadly sometimes the only way to help someone when they're too in their own head is to do something drastic to snap them out of it or prevent them from making irreversible decisions they wouldn't normally make.
I hope they do, for one reason. They're completely different people at this point. Let them illustrate that even a great relationship can end over time simply because people change. It doesn't make either side bad people inherently, it's just a normal fact of a relation. If people stayed static, life would be boring.
giancarlo esposito is brilliant at whatever villain he plays! YOu know this when you see one moment he's very friently before he instantly changes to be threatening
