8:40 Wow guys, were you even listening the lyrics? He's not making a joke out of anything, in fact he's giving a pretty good message, and saying exactly what you were saying earlier. He was literally saying what you were, and you were somehow mad? In our modern free-spoken society There is a word that we still hold taboo A word with a terrible history Of being used to abuse, oppress and subdue Just six seemingly harmless letters Arranged in a way that will form a word With more power than the pieces of metal That are forged to make swords Just six little letters all jumbled together Have caused damage that we may never mend And it's important that we all respect That if these people should happen to choose To reclaim the word as their own It doesn't mean the rest of you have a right to its use So never under estimate The power that language imparts Sticks and stones may break your bones But words can break hearts ...jeez, unless you've had to live it ...even I am careful with it ... and in the end it will only offend Don't want to have to spell it out again... He uses the word Ginger, one because he is one, two because they have the same letters, and it helps to bring back the crowd to change the mood a bit, but not to make a joke of it, or make light of it. But rather as a very powerful message. I think you really did yourself a disservice for stopping where you did, and talking so much, you got yourself all worked up, if you had have listened to it in one take, before those emotions could really take hold you'd have seen he's on your side.
@PBMS123 You Nailed It ! Brilliant ! By the way, some 2nd generation or 3rd generation members of ashkenazy communities, have witty jokes about WWII. Well, let the talented guys meditate about that. Thank's to Tim to take us on a so talented, skillful and witty roller coaster. Tim is a very whole Hearted Activist, and therefore he is Edgy. He has a damn spine and a subtil brain. Keep All Turning Humour over, so we get more open minded towards other humans even if it is Dark Humour. Warmth and Whit to All from a french in France
The problem I have, is the segregation of the word and the emotions it invokes are a choice...TAKE AWAY THE POWER and don't take offense, and it means nothong....allow it to take hold of you, and you are at the mercy of it.....and that's a problem....agree they lost the plot but also they keep to an old plot we don't need anymore
I'm Black and I have listened to this an uncountable amount of times. It's brilliant and the message I think is being overlooked is he is using metaphor to let non-Black people know through humour, why it's not OK even if we use the word.
Kim i agree with your point. That's why i wanted to listen to it in its entirety before i formed my opinion. I was on edge for most of it, but for me, it was clever and edgy. He done did good lol -De
@@De.Dre.Universe I was really glad about hearing you wanted to give it a chance to see where it was going. It's something Tim Minchin does really well and he's a phenomenal musical prodigy. I love watching your videos and would like to see more of Tim and Bo Burnham. Great channel!
Please please react to more of Tim he is brilliant musician and very intelligent person . Cheers loved your reaction and that you talked and worked it out at the end 😉
100% agree. The whole point of this so his to point out that it is not ok to appropriate a word that doesn’t belong to you and that is can be hurtful to others. He is pointing out prejudice and how hurtful it can be and the trick at the start is that he is aware it is not his right to sing about the N word himself so he does it indirectly.
Tim is not trying to be offensive in this song. He is not one of those people that enjoys being offensive for the sake of offense. He does use humor, music and often profanity, to get messages across (in an amazingly intelligent and talented way.) Many will be offended by some of his works, and that is a shame because almost everything he does is thought provoking (if one is open minded) and filled with profundity. One of the messages I received from this particular song is this: Unless you are a part of a certain culture, even if you are empathetic, you can not understand the depth of the visceral nature some words may evoke. If we would try and understand one another a bit more, we would all be better off.
I’m so sorry if he hurt you. It isn’t a struggle I understand. He’s trying to make people listen while being amused, but the listening is the important part. He is genuinely trying to force people to understand that respect isn’t hard, so just do it.
Basically, Minchin gave us all a lesson here, that everybody has prejudices based on misunderstandings, stupidity, the lack of knowledge, etc. etc. etc. Those of us who believed he was singing about the "n-word" made a (faulty) pre-emptive conclusion - aka a prejudice. I would never use the "n-word" to or about anyone, but I *am* curious about the meaning and feelings it gives. And no, it is *not in any way unfair to be offended by something!* That is a price we pay for freedom of speech, and the only acceptable retort is verbal or non-violent action.
I think Tim found just about the only way a white guy (from Australia) can discuss the situation around the use (or more importantly the do not use) of that word. The point of the 'bait and switch' isn't to get a Gotcha moment but more to point out that we all have prejudice even if we don't think we do AND that it isn't good (words can break hearts) and being not good we should try to understand eah other more. Love the reaction, love the discussion and more important (to me) is that this gets a discussion going without causing a lot of hurt. I acknowledge that hurt is caused no matter how hard we try but his motive here I believe is understanding rather than derogatory. PS Ginger nuts are ginger flavored cookies 🙂
@@De.Dre.Universe i thing whole reason for that setup is to point out how most people have preconceived ideas and jump into conclusions before having all the information or in this case wait and listen
He was ALWAYS talking about the "G" word, your own "predjudice" came up with the "N word" Seriously, Tim was trying to convey why the word is offensive. Most of the ginger tropes he used apply equally to black people, except the "sensitive to UV" line. It was a way of talking about predjudice in daily life without being too dark about it.
So I don’t really think his bait and switch was meant to feel as harshly as you took it. His whole beginning but was essentially a social commentary. He’s basically saying like “some of you don’t seem to understand how words can hurt others and you don’t see how it perpetuates hate and is destroying our society.” He spells it in the beginning because he won’t say the word, and that’s the whole point. He doesn’t have the right to say the N word. Because he’s not in that group. He does use it as a set up to the rest of the song, but he does that for a few reasons. One is for the laugh- the first bit of the song was purposefully tense. No one was laughing because you weren’t meant to laugh. He was discussing a serious matter and really wanted his point to be heard, not everyone can say the n-word. So the switch to ginger is like a sense of relief for the crowd. It gives an easier space to discuss it in. Just like for you two, you felt uncomfortable and part of you maybe even wanted to stop the song. Changing the topic to ginger alleviates some of that tension so you can better hear the message. Another reason is because he is a ginger himself and can freely discuss it. Throughout the song he makes references to things we associate with black people; like the “once you go ging you can’t go back” or saying gingga instead of ginger. Those are obviously meant to mirror the conversation from the beginning. He’s also definitely saying that Ginger’s have been oppressed through history as well. Of course not in the same way and it’s not fair to compare the two situations , but the point is that people are defined by the words we choose to use when we describe them or address them. Historically gingers have been considered the devil, soulless (there’s myths about them stealing or eating souls), they’ve been outcast by society because of a genetic mutation they have no control over, much the same as black people being discriminated against for a skin color they had no control over. I think his point is, though he’s not black and can’t speak on their behalf, he can relate because he too had been an outcast for his genetics and so he can on some level appreciate how hurtful words are. He doesn’t know what it’s like to be called the n-word as a black man, but he knows how it feels to be called a ginger as a red-headed man. And so on that level he can relate. This is his way of telling people that they need to really consider what they say and what ramifications their words have before they come out of their mouths. Don’t know if you have, but I think that if you give it a second listen you’ll come away feeling a bit differently about the beginning bit. Or maybe not, and that’s ok. A lot of his comedy is about sparking social conversation, so there’s bound to be some bits that don’t sit well with people. But he’s definitely a musical and lyrical genius. I hope you keep reacting to him, cause he has some great songs. He was actually a big inspiration for Bo, for obvious reasons.
As a ginger I am so impressed with your response - not that being ginger was ever my real problem in life, it was mostly being skinny and nerdy, but yes, you defined the whole thing quite perfectly.
Most of his songs are misdirection songs, this song is actually making a point that prejudice in any form is wrong. His song “thank you god” is brilliant beyond words.
I love Tim's work, think its phenomenal but this song not so much. I'm not sure what his experience of Christianity is but there is a torrent of bitterness or hatred towards Christians that comes through in this song. Now I understand the various points he is making but the point is she IS just as important as anyone else, not more, not less. Also, in what is probably a fictional story however it follows many similar ones, maybe that miracle was never for her but somebody else in a far worse place who needed to see a miracle. He also delberatly chose someone on the exteme end that wouldn't take conventional medicine to emphasise how stupid he feels Christians are (Ive yet to meet Christian that feels they need to refuse traditional medicine). He also obviously hates things that can't be proved with science but he couldn't prove love with science either so in of itself that isn't an argument. Its not taking the mick out of Christianity that is the problem here, there are plenty of comedians, including Christian comedians who point out common issues with Christianity in a funnier, less insulting way. For example Rowan Atkinson hell sence is very funny to highlight like Tim did, what makes you think you have the right god in a more light hearted less offensive way. But the beauty of free speech is that we, Tim and others get to speak their minds and views and to curtail it would be way more harmful than offending someone.
Guys I loved watching the journey you went on. I came here as an Australian who loves Tim Minchin. I might be wrong, but the absolute brilliance of the song is that the listener becomes absolutely certain what word he is referencing, even though he never says a single thing specific to any group. So our existing prejudice convinces us that we "know" who he's talking about, only to totally expose our own well-meaning hypocrisy with the reveal that he means gingers.
I don't feel he is being offensive. He's actually making a social commentary in support of non-African-American people not being entitled to use the n-word, by using a word that was leveraged against him. The got-you moment is to make everyone in the room uncomfortable... Just my take from knowing Tim's comedy and style. By the way, redheaded people used to be considered "of the devil" in past times, and were severely discriminated against and vilified. I'd recommend "Thank You God" next 😊
The whole song is really talking about both words - whether it's ginger, or the n word. Yes, it's presented in a funny way, but the message either way is to not call people names.
Here's what I love about this song - it deliberately plays on our own prejudices. Is it good comedy? That's an entirely individual answer and is up to oneself. It gets people talking, it's clever, edgy, and controversial in it's nature. But bottom line is it opens up a dialogue as to why certain language is offensive or not and why we should not use it - and that is really important.
There is history of using ginger as a slur mainly in the UK and Australia (where Minchin is from) The 'ruling' class are English and the subjugated peoples are Celts (Scottish, Irish and Welsh) wherein the recessive gene for red hair is significantly more common. So over here and down-under ginger and other 'traits' associated with celticness tend to be used in a derogatory context (obvs not in anyway at the same level as ginger's anagram) and negative stereotypes are laid over our behaviours, e.g. we're angry, lazy, stupid, bad with money, poor parents but breeders, alcoholics, but good at singing and dancing... Hey if anything it shows WASPs aren't very creative in their hatred! In British ex-colonies/commonwealth with more influential/respected celtic populations the opposite is often true; so in the US, Canada and NZ having red hair is desirable and in most other parts of the world its pretty neutral if a little exotic. Sorry this song made you feel uncomfortable, as you said I suppose its supposed to, and led to a really interesting discussion. BLM. Solidarity.
Given the 750 years that Irish people were subjugated, imprisoned, deported, enslaved and executed by the British the similarities to African Americans SHOULD be more respected by African Americans too. The fact that to some African Americans that their pain is far greater than ANY other peoples who have suffered oppression (regardless any historical evidence) should at least be ringing alarm bells to some of them. There are many groups within society who have suffered for extended periods. Whether it be the Irish as mentioned, or the 400 years of European Settlement dispossessing Native Americans, or the dispossesion of the Balkans by the Mongols in 1242 there are other groups who have suffered at the hands of others for a very very long time. Jewish people have suffered subjugation or being outcasts for around 4,000 years. Probably the worst of all is the Dalit who have been clinically supressed based on their birth status for 1600 years. To be considered so unclean as to untouchable for 1,600 is quite possibly the worst discrimination in human history. None of those groups should be considered to be in any way less subjugated or supressed than African American people. If they are somehow less worthy of fair treatment and respect because of your own prejudice then honestly shame on you.
@@AndyViant Interesting, but I think you move into dangerous territory trying to rank or scale injustice. I realise you were responding to a comment where someone had done just that, but your response was to disagree with their 'ranking' - I think. They may not have known about some of the dark history you pointed out, and certainly, as I understand, primary and high school education in the US for topics such as this is well below par. Of course the persecution of groups of humans can, and probably should where relevant in discussion, include some commentary of periods of time, numbers impacted, extent etc. to give a broader context and increase knowledge in general. But to use a silly made up e.g., if a nation decided for just one day that they would murder all the Lisa's in my community and they came and took away my wife and murdered her, then I would consider that event to be worse then any of the other atrocities that have occurred in the world and I was lucky enough to have not been involved in. I hope my example makes sense. Anyway, regardless, your comment as well as some of the other comments and Mr Minchin himself of course, have evoked some great communication through the sharing of thoughts and knowledge. I truly believe, that communication and knowledge (truths) are the first critical steps required for any society hoping to overcome things such as prejudice, bigotry and racism, and the key perhaps to not allowing them to rise up and gain footholds if they've already been supressed. Your post was thought provoking though and I also learnt a couple of things .. so cheers for that mate...
My take, had you been at the concert you wouldn't have been able to pause the concert and spend minutes talking about where you THOUGHT the song was going and stir up (valid) emotions, so when the punchline comes you wouldn't have had to come back from where you'd walked yourself. But honestly, I fully understand and appreciate both of your reactions. Thanks for even trying Tim out.
Have a sense of humour....it’s clever....its funny...that’s what a comedian does......that word is ginger dude...it’s not about you...chill.....real humour is intelligent and this is very intelligent chill out - This is brilliant, you were meant to to fall for it...it’s ok we all fell for it
He made you think about it and discuss it in a rather different way than you normally would. As for Gingers having it rough, I knew a few growing up and they were tormented mercilessly by bullies who would gang up on them only because they were Gingers. I could never understand it. I have very mixed "heritage" so there was no one group that could pick on me so I was lucky that way but I noticed the injustice of the other children.
Fair enough, guys. But I honestly believe this is more a commentary about the whole issue. He is has a brilliant mind and he is a very moral and ethical human being. He makes people think. That’s the point.
If you're looking for more Minchin suggestions, maybe try "Thank You God" or "Three Minute Song" (specifically the version he performed on BBC Two) if you're looking for more edgy comedy songs, or "White Wine In The Sun" for a more genuine and emotional song -- if you're interested in seeing another side of him as an artist.
That got uncomfortable fast. For nothing in the end. lol I was like: Just listen, dude! You were right! It's not the word he makes you think it is! Calm down! lol
Tim is a social warrior and uses his platform to highlight injustices in the world from racism to religious bigotry to the environment. Tim lulls in his targets with humour to expose their hypocrisies.
Something to keep in mind when your facing your emotional response to this song remember that a) Tim is not american b) Tim is a ginger , c) music and beats are not the exclusive domain of one type of music and d) all the names and bullying he would have personally experienced. "Prejudice" exposes how individuals invalidate others experiences because its different. Bad words are potent and brutal no matter who they are directed at. He says at the start of the song about the power of language. That is what the song is about. Good reaction.
I am a 49 year old white man, and I would never use the N word, as I know it offends people. This song made me really think about it, and see it from perspectives I have never thought of before. Now I have a far better perspective on why not to use it, and and how it affects people. To me the song is brilliant, as even when you are listening once he has used the word ginger, you are still thinking about the N word, from about being bullied in the school yard, to why it is offensive for somebody who is not black to use it. This song engaged me in a way somebody standing in front of me giving a lecture would not have. As Kim Roberts posted, it is a song to let non-black people know through humour why it is not ok for us to use the word.
I am really glad I saw this video. I have been a fan of Minchin and this song for a long time, but never heard this side of the conversation. I also loved seeing two grown men having such an empathetic and honest conversation without some win condition. Thank you!
Interesting and very different reactions from you both. We have very different history in the UK and a different approach today. We don’t have freedom of speech, we have freedom of expression. It means you can say whatever you like here BUT cross the line and start deliberately fostering hatred against ANY group in a systematic way and you get prosecuted. Personally I don’t want the freedom for anyone to be deliberately malicious and try to ruin peoples lives without being called on it by decent people. As a person with ridiculously pale skin (though not a redhead) I found my eyebrows rising and thinking ‘Mm where are you going with this Tim’ only to laugh at myself when he brilliantly highlighted my conditioning thinking what he might be talking about and then paralleled the stupidity of picking on folk for the colour of their hair with colour of skin. Caught me! Wish he’d do one looking at the endless prejudice I face as a woman.
Very interesting reaction. As a white guy, I realize I can never fully relate what it's like to be the subject of prejudice based on skin color. I can empathize and try to be supportive, but I'm not going to pretend to know the black experience like some Rachel Dolezal-wannabe. I don't feign to know the current and historic pain of African Americans--but I do know pain. As a kid, I was bullied for years for being a fat nerd in an all-male boarding school where sports and jock culture ruled. That's not to say that racism and fat nerd-shaming are anywhere near the same in terms of social impact, but when you're getting mocked, ridiculed and beat up constantly for a prolonged period of time it really doesn't matter why to you personally, especially at the time. So I know about feeling attacked for who you are or who people think you are, and I think that's Tim's point here. I don't believe he's trying to draw a moral equivalence between racism and ginger-phobia; he simply saying prejudice is something most people have experienced, in a plethora of forms. Again, not to compare my personal experiences to being racially discriminated against. I lost weight and developed friends once I left boarding school, and the trauma affected me psychologically for many years afterwards. But obviously dealing with discrimination is something blacks and other minority groups can't avoid by shedding pounds, etc. so I get it's different in that sense. Shedding prejudice is not like dieting, to be sure. And that's why I really liked how you acknowledged yourselves that other groups can be offended by edgy comedy, such as the recent Dave Chappelle controversy over his remarks about transsexuals. You guys can't know their pain any more than I can, as I know you're aware. Nice job of not letting your initial, understandable visceral reaction to Tim lyrically toying with the N word cloud your ability to keep an open mind and look at what he was saying in context. Having watched quite a bit of Tim's work, I can tell you definitively he is NOT a mere "shock comedian." Like Bo Burnham, while some of his songs are primarily silly (but still insanely clever and entertaining), he often has something profound and thought-provoking to say mixed in with his comedy, as well as some songs like "White Wine in the Sun" or "Not Perfect" that are mostly serious as well as deeply personal and emotionally moving. Looking forward to more of both Tim and Bo.
Please understand, while there is racism in Australia (though from my perspective as a 50+ yr old straight white male, not as openly hostile to our First Nations people, as in the U.S.), basically *everyone* makes fun of Gingers. Tim would have grown up being shunned & ridiculed. So even though this message triggered you both on some level, it is his lived experience & it shows the prejudice of most viewers that they can only see it as a dig at things he has no right to make fun of.
Tim is from the UK (or has lived there for a long time) Gingers have been the primary target of hate for a very long time. He actually demonstrated your own prejudiced, you are only bothered about prejudice as long as you are the target, but remember you do not have the monopoly on being a victim of it.
"Thank You God" -- Just watch it, even if you don't react to it. This video will help you decide on whether you can handle Tim Minchin or not. Also, if you want to see musicality in a comedic act it is UNMATCHED.
And he actually hates this song. A lot of people don't get where he's coming from and he says he wishes he never wrote it. Try his Aussie Xmas song White wine in the sun. Trust me, Tim will get you a lot of new subscribers
This is the most in-depth discussion of this song I have seen, many say it is not about that word all the way through the song and it definitely is, even the ninja bit is as your body language showed. I'm very white so I can't begin to understand how you feel, but your honest discussion helps. Interesting your reference to trans etc, as a gay guy I can totally agree, we are the butt(pun intended) of many jokes. I grew up in a time in Australia where over 200 gay murders were not even investigated by police and it was a law that killing a gay guy who showed interest in you was legally justified...the "Gay Defence" All that being said. I honestly believe Tim is trying to be edgy but not trying to be offensive. I believe his intention is awareness rather than using the word as the butt of the joke. I hope you do more as I believe you will agree that most of his comedy is about social justice and calling out hypocrisy.
He is not trying to be offensive in the slightest, and he's literally saying the same thing in this song that they spoke about. In our modern free-spoken society There is a word that we still hold taboo A word with a terrible history Of being used to abuse, oppress and subdue Just six seemingly harmless letters Arranged in a way that will form a word With more power than the pieces of metal That are forged to make swords Just six little letters all jumbled together Have caused damage that we may never mend And it's important that we all respect That if these people should happen to choose To reclaim the word as their own It doesn't mean the rest of you have a right to its use So never under estimate The power that language imparts Sticks and stones may break your bones But words can break hearts ...jeez, unless you've had to live it ...even I am careful with it ... and in the end it will only offend Don't want to have to spell it out again... That pretty clearly isn't meant to be offensive. Going to ginger just breaks the tension that will develop in a white crowd, as they get uncomfortable thinking he's going to say it.
Doing Tim Minchin reactions I'd have to recommend "If I Didn't Have You" specifically for the stand-up he does after the song (it's like a 13 minute video) and the song and stand-up are both amazing
"People who are brutally honest are usually more brutal than honest." Wise words. I absolutely loved your reaction! Thank you for sharing your thoughts and feelings all the way through.
Just a shame it doesn't apply to Tim and was therefore totallt irrelevant...Also, I'd rather have the truth, no matter how uncomfortable, than sugar-coated lies, no matter how comforting. That quote is one of those sayings, which at first glance sound wise and profound but which, after even the most cursory of examinations, it becomes clear that they are anything but. This particular saying is used by people who want to shut down the truth and any discussion of what it may be. Sometimes it's done with the best intentions, sometimes not. Sometimes the intentions are unexamined and the use is almost subconscious or instinctive. Whatever the reason, trying to shut down the truth is rarely, if ever, a healthy and positive path to tread...
Great reaction, guys, thank you! And this performance did get you to think, and to try your best to vocalize your thoughts on a very difficult and sensitive topic. THAT is why Tim does his numbers this way. All his works are edgy and all the way up to the line which should never be crossed - because he wants people to start thinking, talking, debating, and understanding each other better. In the second part he did talk about his experience of being subject to prejudice as a redhead kid, so... we should understand that we all have some sensitive and difficult feelings within us (as you perfectly expressed, ppl who are gay, or trans, or woman, or whatever), and just, you know, try to be kinder to each other. But he does push us all to look a bit harder into our own hearts. And sometimes it's more a shove? LOL But every piece he does picks on one of the human weaknesses, and kind of exposes the fact that we all have it in ourselves to some degree, since we are all just humans. In that sense I see him as a kind of an activist of conscience :) Mind you, in doing that this guy is not gentle, and certainly not polite, just wraps it up in kind of a comedy of wit. So, if you believe that people should be exposed to a kind of art which brings out discussion and casts the light on some dark corners of our souls - Tim's your guy.
Guys. I am sorry that you had the hurt reaction. He is like the Aussie Borat. He is putting it out there that the language is something. He is describing on a Ginger way but of course it sounds minimising. Tim doesn't do racism. I still respect and appreciate your response 😁👍
Hey Janis! I really enjoyed the whole performance. Once i saw it through and let my nerves calm down lol. No hurt. Lookkng forward to more of his stuff. Thanks for the support!!! -De
A large part of my family are brits and live in England. I grew up watching a lot of British, aussie, New Zealand shows.... the term "ginger" has heavy negative meanings behind it. Also brutality against gingers in the UK and Australia, other parts of Europe has been horrific.
@@theConquerersMama I think the south park episode brought it home to americans, I started to see more ginger hate around that time. I was an unfortunate ginger as a kid, not the beautiful red hair some people had, but Weasly orange. I was made fun of a lot. People talk about representation a lot, but I was a little kid when the Little Mermaid came out, and seeing this red haired girl and red haired dolls in the store was amazing to me. (Still wasn't the orange hair I had, but still.) My hair started to darken through my teen years, and now my hair is more brown than red, although it still looks copper when I'm in the sun. Sometimes I miss it a little, but then I remember the teasing, the gum put in my hair, kids holding me down and putting mud through my hair, and then I don't miss it so much.
You totally missed the entire meaning of the song. It's called "Prejudice" because you made an assumption before the actual reveal ... assumptions that were "Prejudice"... and you were WRONG. So if there is one person you can be mad at - it's yourself.
With the exception of the one F-bomb, what did Tim actually say that you found so offensive? Listen to the whole first part again. Its not just a set up for the comedic twist. He was telling the truth about the problems with that word and its use. He's genuinely on your side on that issue. The only way someone could be offended by that video is if they misunderstand or are simply looking to be offended.
Can us white people stop saying, "N-word" all the time when we're talking ABOUT the word, or quoting someone else? I understand some family friendly shows would say, "N-word" if even that. Still, on late night or evening news, shouldn't a white guy get to say, "And then Dave Chappelle said, 'N (RU-vid will block my post for the word)'"? Ralphie May quoted Brad Williams: "'Midget' is as offensive as 'N.'" First: Ralphie was quoting Brad. Second, Brad was talking ABOUT the word, and comparing it to a derogatory word used against little people. In the 1990's it was fine, but reactions in the 2020's get everybody losing their minds about him saying that.
I love the fact that this art generated this discussion. I think that's what the point of art is, to unearth feelings and ideas and create discussion. I appreciate the way you guys approached this and your intelligent debate and conversation. And I agree about a line. I used to think I didn't have one, but then I realized mine is child abuse. To me it's never funny, and I hope I can be as intellectually honest as you to try and look for a decent message the next time I come across it.
Tim takes on child abuse in "The Pope Song." Don't want to give too much away, but given who the song is about I think you can see the direction it heads. Very strong indictment of the Pope's cover-up of pedophilic priests.
seeing as you guys react to bo burnham this guy is actually one of the people along with george carlin that he took inspiration from Edit: i think you guys missed the point a bit watching the video, you are taking it as if hes joking when hes really not. keep in mind this was released in 2009 when racism was at an even worse point than it is now and its clearly showing a message telling his audience( who are mostly white) that being racist isnt funny and it is uncomfortable and also why its uncomfortable. he basically said its not up to the individual person to decide why he cant use a word when the culture behind it has its own reasons they dont have to explain but you do have to except
Thanks for this context. We’ve talked a lot about this video since reacting and the main reason we wanted to get this video out was bc our reaction was genuine and we wanted people to see how uncomfortable it makes us. We’re not afraid to have the discussion necessary to deal with prejudice. And we’re excited to hear more of what Tim Minchin has to offer! -Dre
@@De.Dre.Universe super glad you guys didn't sensor your own reaction even when it makes you uncomfortable it really shows how genuine of a reaction it was and these are the really important conversations that should be had
@@De.Dre.Universe Kudos to you for doing that! That is the real strength we need today, not to look away from the things that make us uncomfortable, and to find the way to express it
I think you were being too defensive. Black people were not the butt of any joke here. He was juxtaposing the serious against the trivial to demonstrate the fallacy.
I think that you're offended because its a white person making a metaphor of something that triggers you.but when dave chappelle or chris rock or any black comedian talks about it and jokes about it...its ok and you're ok with it. In a way.. thats yourracism coming out. He makes you think and that iswhat combats racism. Just my opinion.
As an Aboriginal (Gamilaroi woman) Trainer from Australia. I’ve watched a whole heap of reactions to this song and yours is GREAT!! ❤ love that you almost knew it was an assumption!! Almost!!! 🤣❤️⭐️😊
Thankyou gentlemen for your honest reaction. Aussies enjoy taking the piss, and consider the C***# word a term of endearment. Your cultural and life experiences are very different to my own, and again very different to minority and indigenous experiences here in Australia. A gentle reminder from Tim for me to pull my head in about things I have no experience in. Cheers
Prejudice works both ways. Assuming someone is talking about you because you identify with some elements of their comments, before you have heard them out, is a form of prejudice. It might help you to know that the abuse of people with red hair especially children far far exceeds any racism most kids of colour might face in countries like Australia and the UK. The struggles of Black Americans are not the struggles of Black people everywhere. In the same vain the white privilege that white Americans enjoy is not the same privilege that white people elsewhere get to enjoy.
Tim’s heart is definitely in the right place. This was never one of my favorite Tim Minchin songs, but it’s the most popular I think because of the clever turn. But he has plenty of brilliant songs.
Dave Chappelle pisses a lot of people off, Tim doesn't. He's a nice guy that hates people using the n word who aren't entitled to. It's not just comedy, it's a social message to racists but he would never use that word. And he's a serious musician. For funny but not offensive try confessions. For great word play try his 9 minute beat poem Storm. And if you want edgy I dare you to check out the pope song 🤣 the man also writes brilliant love songs. Try I'll take lonely tonight
I think it was great that you pushed through and listened to the entire thing, even though it was clearly rather uncomfortable for you. So props to you for that and for sharing an honest reaction. Like many others have said, I actually feel he is making a rather strong point here in the hopes to get people thinking about the harm words can cause to others. I like that he points out that unless you are part of that particular category (whether it be skin colour, hair colour, gender, sexuality, body type etc.), it is best not to use words that may be offensive. Although I will never truly understand the weight of the history of the N word and exactly how that word makes you feel personally (being of a different ethnicity and raised in a completely different part of the world), I somewhat understand the feeling of having an almost involuntary response to a word that triggers me to feel some type of way. After being picked on and told religiously throughout my life, from a very young age that I was "fat", that word still triggers me. Even though I now will use the word when referring to myself, it can still upset me if people direct that word to me. Yes it's probably something I can work on and some may see it as a harmless word to describe people, similar to Tim's example. I feel it's another example of a word that can hurt, even if that person may use that word themselves. I'm most certainly not comparing the two words and there impact, just sharing another example of the impact words can have. I appreciate Tim's message 😊
Tim was making this for people who don't already think like you. Conversations are had in the reverse in places around the world. That is how racists are made. People need exposure to understanding, care, and boundaries to be able to model those traits. Compassion is grown through understanding (fun fact: that region of the brain has been shown to grow or shrink measurably depending on use. Experience alters the brain.) That is what he provided them in this performance. He provoked a lot of thought and conversations with this piece. And he changed minds and hearts, I have no doubt. He helped make the world a little more peaceful. And your reaction allowed me to put this little nugget into the world. Ty guys. Keep doing what you do. ✌
the only person in the king's court that can speak the truth is the jester. being an Indigenous Australian from the same city Tim comes from. I've followed his career since day one. He has been a staunch advocate or Indigenous Aussie rights and thoroughly anti-fuckwit since forever. Great honest reaction. Good stuff fellas!
Thank you both for such a genuine and intelligent conversation about this performance and topic. Really enjoyed your reaction. I encourage you to try ‘Thank you god’ from Tim, promise it won’t offend like this one did.
The ending line of one of Tim's songs called "cont" ('Context' is the full title) is: "I don't care about your colour or your creed, I will judge you no reason BUT your deeds" He put into words something I've felt for about 55 years. And for that alone I say "Thank you Tim Minchin" ❤ I'm a 71 yr old woman born in Melbourne, Australia It's another misdirection song for the first half 😀
Those complex, mixed feelings are the 'right' feelings, as far as I care. Good comedy can definitely have you hung up but still laughing. Another take is that he is politely explaining the issue to white people, with a placeholder word.
I have listened to this and other of his songs many times. I didn’t really think he was even trying to be funny, (clever and satirical yes, but not funny) but rather to illustrate how “words can break hearts”. Every time I hear the way he sings that phrase, and the way he sings the word “hearts” with that drop in the pitch, brings tears to my eyes and it hurts my heart to even contemplate what people of colour have been subjected to throughout history and today. I see this song as an illustration to me as a white person that I can have no real concept of the damage done by prejudice, including all the stereotypes that are often excused as “Oh, I’m not racist, I was only joking” its not a joke, it’s not funny! Prejudice breaks hearts. Words can break hearts. How do we stop it?
Laughter is the first step in acceptance. He's using comedy to talk about a serious topic. You both know that if someone can't laugh at themselves, there is something there, a knot in a muscle that needs to relax. A tension. He's not making fun in any way, he's mocking. Mocking the taboo. There's only one way to get past the word that we all know he's singing about, and comedy is one way. Nothing is/should be beyond talking about, and that's the core of this performance.
Also… Bo Burnham literally thinks of Tim as his inspiration. And Tim fucking LOVES Burnham. It’s a chain going back decades, really, to George Carlin and onward.
Same letters. Extremely clever. Ginger is an abusive term for people with red hair in Australia and the U.K. You totally kept stopping it and not listening right as he was ready to deliver the punchline.
Guys, the song is called 'Prejudice'. He's trying to get people to confront their own prejudice; to point out people are prejudiced even if they think they aren't. He isn't going where you might think he's going to point out with startling clarity the listeners' own prejudice and assumptions. And yes, he takes you on a roller coaster ride and gets you there with clever humour.
Fellas, this was one of my top ten reactions all time, all creators for sure. Came to your channel as a Kanye fan who enjoys the bo burnam video. Anyhow, I was pretty excited when I saw you hadn't dine this one yet, as it seemed right up your alley as fans of bo burnam. Dre, my condolences on the large amount of hate comments you're no doubt receiving in the comments. As you said, you were having a human experience, and that's real, and that's what any reaction fan really wants to see, even if it upsets them. It still makes them see the world a little bit different than they did before. Dre asked why joke about this, and for me your reaction was the point of the joke. From the moment it went there you were triggered (I mean that clinically not pejoratively). Check out how your leg reveals how much tension is building in you as you sit through this admittedly spectacular show. That's the power and influence that word has over you. The joke is meant to bring that up for you and massage it a little, and hopefully after that, it's power to ruin moments of your human existence will be diminished even if it's just a little bit. In any case, always really enjoy your reactions and will definitely check out the pod after this. 💯🔥❤️🤘
@@De.Dre.Universe I think Tim Minchin has grown up a lot since recording this. This is clearly a step along the path of learning and growing. He hasn't performed this song in decades. Although it's clever, it pushes the limits on a topic that is not his experience to discuss. Though it's an important message made palatable via comedy for his mainly white audience, he does that at the expense of some very uncomfortable feelings for those with personal experience of the power of that word. And that's not okay. A bit of teasing for having red hair is not comparable to the generational oppression and pain of that word and the weight of everything it encapsulates. I think his intentions were good, and we have to allow people to learn grow. Prominent people tend to do that in public and the evidence remains, years later. Let's hope it will help people like him to also learn and grow. His more recent work is not polemic and is more emotional, but still with clever, funny lyrics and incredible composition and performance. Have a listen to some of his tracks from his album 'Apart Together'. Best wishes H
Solid reaction once again, my doods! I always appreciate your intelligent, insightful, and in-depth conversation. My un-asked-for opinion: He is totally talking about the n-word, and he's not. It's both. So many people, (and I'm not necessarily talking about you two fine gentlemen, I'm talking about many people in general,) think things have to be one or the other. He is talking about the discrimination gingers have legitimately faced, but he is also absolutely talking about the n-word and how it is *not okay* for white people to use it. It's a message to white people.
He nailed the message he was trying to make with the word prejudice and hope people come to drop preconceived notions. Every person from every walk of life has had malicious things said about them or their ancestors at some point in history without a good reason to back it up. All races, genders and orientations get slurs thrown their way and its just a good way to bring up the subject in a light hearted manner. His message was brilliant and struck the nerve he was aiming for to prove his point.
Holy Sh... this one was deep!!! The topics of this songs are layered! It's not just about the N-word. It's really about prejudice. It matters, where you (emotionally) come from. Tim is luring you into a trap. Not personally you, but all of us. The level of offending one is about the level of your personal experiences in the past. So, your mindset determines, how deep you're gonna fall into his trap. The worse your past, the seeper the fall. But... The trap itself isn't deep at all. The listeners personal prejudice makes the depth. Tim is a genius! To be clear: the (w)hole topic only wokrs, because the N-word has such a cruel und dark history behind it. I'm massively impressed, how you guys dealt with the song. The way you waited for the end, keeping in mind, there might be a shift, building up the tension but holding it back. I'd say: you're totally right to feel offended by the luring to the N-word. Tim is using your prejudice to make his point. For a rather shallow mind changing the topic from the N-word to the G-word might release the tension into fun. But, it didn't work for you, did it? I'd argue, being aware of the mechanics of assuptions and prejudice makes the song valuable. I have a deep respect for your manners and your mindset! Halleluja! PS: next video I'll watch is "Ginger reacts to prejudice"! :-)
I am half black and half Italian...there is another word other than the N word. Guinee. That is what my Italian Grand Father was called and would beat anyone to near death that did it. It was their way of saying Italians were not white. They had words for Polish, Irish and many others as well. Yeah. White people calling other white people things for not being a part of their group and WE black folk have words for others also. This happens outside of America also. If you think America is even a little racist, never go to Japan or China and you may even find many places in Africa that will not accept you. Many in Africa think black Americans are weak and stupid and partly for what you displayed here...going right to racism. I have never been called that word despite having dark skin and do not feel about the word like you do. It has no power over me because of it. Its just a word. How it was used in the past does not effect how someone today may or may not use it.
@@De.Dre.Universe you're annoyed he's playing off the n word and because of that you don't find it funny. I get it, I would just call that being offended. It is strange though, since the n word is a white man's word.
Ginger nuts in australia come from the arnotts biscuit company, also famous for tim-tams and shapes crackers. You guys call biscuits "cookies" in the usa.
The message in this song is very clear. He is standing with blacks on this issue, and saying that only blacks can say it. He uses comedy, and yes it's edgy. I've watched many reactions from black You tubers, and they all love it. But I don't blame anyone for having a different opinion. We are all different, but Tim's message was pure for sure, even if some don't get it.
