Linus talked about that Backups are too hard for novice users and he wants to build a system where you can easily make backups to frieds/family outside of your network and having that secured so your friends cannot access your backups (and of course they can backup to your nas). That would be the killer feature for me .. backups, especially external, are quite hard to plan and most don't talk about that.
This was once a feature of the consumer version of CrashPlan (which is now discontinued) and it was great, plenty of options and safe to store because of the encryption.
Anybody can use rsync, easy and powerful. Since it's a command line, there are millions of ways to have timed or reoccurring backups. Example: rsync -avr --progress /source_dir /destination_dir
THE killer feature for sure! There used to be a backup software co that allowed local, cloud & off-premise (to another machine running the software) that I loved. They screwed over all of their customers that were less than enterprise one day, and I've yet to find anything that could replace that off-premise functionality.
Truenas SCALE (which this HexOS is based on) can already do that - you can use ZFS replication to another Truenas SCALE machine. I have two SCALE machines running locally but you can do that offsite as well. In my opinion the biggest hurdle here is knowing someone who also runs a NAS at home. Arguably, HexOS promises to be a lot more user friendly than Truenas SCALE so it might be a lot easier to convince a friend to get one ;)
So it's a custom GUI that hides all the advanced features and stuff that a novice user wouldn't normally need to use and adds in some scripting and wizards to make setup easy? I dig the idea. Especially setting up the remote backup stuff. Rolling your own remote backup setup isn't the hardest thing in the world but definitely outside the normal reach of a large percentage of the normal PC user space so automating that process could be a very popular option!
I'm hoping it's more than that, the main issue I have with truenas and user accounts and SMB and the advance options (only available via console) When I create a user accounts and share a dataset I don't need to know about ACL or other stuff (it should work like a qnap/synology) I have 3 dell servers here that I am looking at setting up to replace old server + backup (local) and 3rd backup offsite reciver for Synology and hexos I am hoping will just maje it work (without root/admin ssh)
Honestly not a bad idea for those who want what TrueNas offers but don't need the whole kit. I'll stick with Truenas personally but I can see this as a viable option instead of unraid for some depending on price.
You could simplify truenas with use-cases and some user-friendly autodetection. e.g. "Is this for streaming movies for home?" vs "Is this for editing video?" That makes a difference between selecting HDD and SSD drives. Backup hosts... "How much data is being backed up?" and "how fast is the network?" might change your drive layout from performance to capacity focused. It could make suggestions, "you'll need 3 drives of size X to migrate the data on your current array." For VMs, "I automatically enabled PCI pass-through in the kernel" would be nice. Then, "I did some driver detection on your PCIE devices... would you like this graphics card/NIC/blueray writer passed through to the VM?". Maybe some network scanning... "I found a TV but no media server, would you like one?" "I found some ubiquiti network kit, would you like me to install the manager and walk you through the install?" Or to address some of truenas scale's deficiencies... "click here to select a user which will always be used to run this kubernetes application, even if it updates."
Interesting. I’m gonna check this out. I’m a big fan of Unraid. My adoption hinges on docker and VM support. IMO a major strength of Unraid is its implementation of virtualization
as a noob the most crucial thing for me is the mobile apps. It is one thing to set up the Synology NAS, install Plex, download station, photo station, etc etc, but the mobile apps allowing you to do so much from your mobile are great. I've often been thinking that I should just build my own, but then so many of them don't have the mobile apps you get from Synology. Or maybe they do and I just have no idea.
This is something i would love myself. As is finding myself learning linux after moving away from windows, it's a huge change and takes A LOT of time commitment to learn with such a step learning curve. As is this, if i could have a more user friendly version to springboard myself into how it works, and apply the application, I can tinker with a working product, rather than tinker for days if not weeks on a product that isn't fully working, or breaks. Especially more so i've held off any backup software as when i want to back everything up, i want it done right the first time. I only have one set of hardware.
This is pretty much made for me, like I know a bit about NAS software and all of that but I care more about the hardware. So having something easy to set up would be great for me.
I think the hardest part of truenas scale is just the steep beginning lvl learning curve, it plateau very quickly the that first spike is really scary. Also people really aren’t a fan of only being able to expand pool in chunks. At my work it baffled people what. Could just add a drive
Expanding with 1 drive is currently in testing with possible release in November. ZFS is an enterprise file system so expanding a pool with multiple drives isn't a big deal.
Expanding was supposed to have been added last November update but instead they pushed out other stuff that most people are probably not going to use and moved raid z expansion this year 2024 (probably) qnap on QuTS hero os that uses zfs enabled it last year
This looks awesome ! I am not a savvy Linux user but I want to use a nas os on a rig I’m building and I’ve looked at a few options so far and many of them simply look intimidating. This is the first one that looks easy as a non Linux enjoyer. I know people who are in this space already are hardcore Linux lovers but I’ve tried hundreds of times to give Linux a shot and I never really fully enjoy it and find it a bit out of my realm. I like a clean and super simple gui. If you make me use a cli I just end up dipping out. I’m very very dyslexic and have a hard time spelling and also remembering commands and simple codes so I suck so bad it’s not even funny with just remembering and typing in simple commands. Is there any other options for a nas os that will be simple ? I’ll be running 2 14tb sata drives and 2 2tb nvme drives. CPU I’ll be running is a 12400f, 16gb ddr5, z690 chipset with 2.5gb lan. Main goal is network storage and backup for both me and my wife and have a way to maybe learn about some apps and if any of them can help us in anyways. All this is super overwhelming lol. I thought about buying a synology nas but the model I want with nvme support is out of my price range and I’ve been told all other brands are too risky and get hacked all the time. Any advice would be very much appreciated. I have watched 2 dozen or more of your videos so far trying to learn about the features and what your thoughts are on different nas units. Thanks for all you do ❤
I think this could have been a desirable product to me a year ago, but in that time I've learned that a free challenge is more enjoyable to me than a paid ride down easy street. Truenas for me.
Looks like it's just an overlay for TrueNAS that just sets specific switches for TrueNAS automatically. Basically preset templates. Until it's on my test server, that's all I can make of it.
This comment is so frustrating….. It takes all the features and yearlong work to make true as what it is but makes it accessible for people who just want to backup their iPhone pictures or something. Normies who unlike us are not chronically online 24/7. What are linux distributions if not overlays?
The issue with truenas outside of smb sharing (even that isn't simple on truenas) makes things more complicated then it needs to be and requires to drop to console to do stuff
I absolutely agree. I've set up Jellyfin on an Asus NAS - no problem. I'm trying to learn Truenas Scale; installed Jellyfin and...🤯🤬🤬k!! I can't get it to work to save my life. The forums are useless. I'm an _old_ IT guy and have taught myself a great deal over the last 20 years but this software has stumped me 😂😂😂. *I NEED AN INSTALL WIZARD* to hold my hand to set up the directories/permissions on BOTH Scale and in the Jellyfin app 🤪. I've used Windows Servers and IBM AIX so I'm not a dummy (subjectively speaking 😊)!!!
God yes, it is the worst part of TrueNAS, users and perms are the most god awful pile of shit I think I have ever used and it is so needlessly complicated. When I have to look up a tutorial for it, you have lost the plot.
Unix permissions are a nightmare, but where u can change to smb acls. Ive found always works better then. Lawrence systems does great videos on this topic
@@maxime_vhw Having worked with some development I think it's the idiot proof that makes it hard. It's supposed to be easy and idiot proof and idiots keep getting more inventive all the time. What was idiot proof a few years ago is weak sauce for a modern updated idiot.
@@blahorgaslisk7763 yea but how tf they gonna commercialize whats basicly a setup wizard for a free opensource software? I mean ofc some ltt fans will buy it just bcuz.
Which is not a bad thing imho, TrueNAS (Scale not core) is notoriously difficult for non cs people. I finally gave up and just bought unraid instead (which has been better and worse)
@@seansingh4421 i was gonna comment "Whats difficult about it?" But im 'cs people' so im biased hahaa. But idk how they're gonna commercialize a setupwizard to a free software.
No mention of OMV as an alternative to truenas scale and unraid. An up-to-date comparison of the features and limitations of these might be warranted now.
Can you make a quick video with NAS suggestions for newcomers? I am looking at starting a home system for file storage and some Plex, and I am wondering if it's a good time to go to Synology, or if I should wait a little longer to see what Ugreen does.
I would recommend unRaid. Its mostly not that difficult, pretty stable and has a ton of features. Every problem i’ve had was solved by a spaceinvaderone video. It is not super good for raw performance tho. If you need that. You should probably use truenas. Plex has some things going on. Maybe if you are about to set up a server you should consider maybe switching to jellyfin.
If you want to be up and running fairly quickly, go Synology. Spend a little more time up front and probably a bit more down the road then possibly QNAP. If you don't have a good grasp of networking, NAS, and want to spend a lot of time up front and more down the road, go Unraid or something similar. Many people will recommend Unraid ( I've tried it ), but they fail to grasp that most of us are not as technically inclined nor are we willing to take that long steep climb up the learning curve. I've been using both QNAP and Synology for 6-7 years now and the small extra up front cost is well worth it especially when you amortize it over the life of your NAS.
I am saving to deploy something big, EOY, I'm planning a hybrid thing not just SSD and HDD pools. Before I might have considered it, but I have worked it all out on trunas, been pretty happy on a smaller scale Lab. Also this is new software, built on ture nas I guess, I'm sure this will be pretty solid or whatever, but let someone else canary it.
I understand about the importance of complexity especially with the NAS My biggest disappointment with my Synology is it's inability to differentiate between EXPLICIT and IMPLICIT permissions. With a standard FTP server app (such as windows FTP server or Filezilla FTP server) I can create on over arching folder schema and just give certain users access to specific subfolders without having to give everyone access and then create a boat load of denial permissions . Example: Users: joe, schmo, curly, mo to give joe access to Users/joe I have to give everyone access to the entire path and deny schmo, curly, & mo to joe's folder Instead of just giving everyone access to the users folder and ONLY giving joe access to his folder.
I think the problems with NAS software is it is trying to do way too much often .... if it sticks to Network attached storage it all works much better.
Sounds like that on the face of it. But I just can't see people paying (both as an investment and as a punter) finance for this if it's just a skin. I'm assuming the setup options will be heavy profile based, or even just storage creation wizard, which then uses popular defaults for shares, users, containers, etc. od be more interested to know if, down the road, migration towards TrueNAS Scale (full) is seemless.
It's the same as Symantec Beestation - making NAS for the masses. Any average user who wants a simple NAS system with all of the Geeky settings hidden from sight is completely put off by channels like this !!! Listen to how you are trying to complicate and find potential issues in everything Hex is clearly trying to simplify and it hasn't even been released yet ! Synology and others have deliberately made NAS systems a geek fest so it serves them right that they have left a gaping hole in the market for other disruptors to take advantage of. By the way there is one negative - I can't stand Linus.
Oh man the Plex install was what really got me when I was trying to setup my own Debian based home server. As a Windows person, im trying to move everything away from Server 2019 and the damn file permissions on Linux are NUTS... Thanks for answering my question though since its been burning a hole in my brain for months. I figured it was a file permissions issue but, again, using Debian, its not that simple either. Im going with ProxMox and TrueNAS Scale for my main OS running the machines since they seem to be the best for what I need to do. It was "fun" trying to config my own setup but also a hair pulling experience. Cheers!
I've migrated from Server 2022 over to Proxmox myself, and you know what? I ended up spinning up a 2022 VM to do all my NAS duties. It's just so much better and efficient than all the other alternatives. ZFS is trash in comparison to Storage Pools. I could go on for hours as to why. I did run into a number of issues dealing with permissions on the folder level, share level, and on the linux side when mapping SMB shares. It can be a real pain. I do have all my stuff working though, if you run into further problems. Long-story short, as much as I love 'tinkering' with Proxmox, my bare-metal 2022 setup was LEAGES more reliable. Perfect example is how often I've had LXC containers crash the core OS. I never had this issue with Hyper-V and/or Docker running on Windows Server 2022. Getting LXC GPU access set up for Plex, Immich, etc is a nightmare. On Windows it was hella easy.
@@scrampker Yeah see, one of my big gripes with Linux and swapping over to this setup is that Windows Server has been absolutely bulletproof for me. I use spanned storage pools, super easy to setup. They just work with everything regardless of being in RAID or JBOD. 15 Years I have been running a JBOD with just scheduled backups and I have never had the array crash or lost data. TBH I probably will end up using a Windows Serrver in the ProxMox system because I do use game servers that can only run in Windows. The disk issue is a common thing across Linux hence why they have so many specialized NAS OS installs. For the SMB side of things I was going to go with TrueNAS Scale on a separate machine with a 10G fiber link. It seems to be the best NAS OS I have tried out so far. Ive mocked it up in Hyper-V and its quite nice. The ZFS issues worry me a bit now that you mention those so I will be looking into those. Anyway, thanks for the insights, here's hoping my swap goes ok.
@@onametaquest my ZFS gripes are two: 1) massive CPU and RAM overhead. Something like a gig of RAM per TB is the officially recommended amount. 2) to have something that's not slow as garbage, you need to run the equivalent of RAID10. RAIDZ1 is their version of RAID5, and instead of benefiting from the natural stripe situation of an 8 drive array, it's actually limited to the speed of your slowest drive in the stripe set. Even if you decide that RAIDZ1 is fast enough (it's garbage slow compared to RAID5 SS,) you come to find out that the storage overhead itself is close to 50%. I'm not exaggerating at all. If you have 100TB or raw storage and format it for RAIDZ1, you can likely only put 50TB of data on it before you start hitting various thresholds/limits. It's astonishing how 'bad' ZFS is and how much the fanbois nerdgasm about it relentlessly. It's like they've never heard of storage spaces and a proper backup solution.
@@onametaquest like... How is it possible that I get better performance with less resources and better storage efficiency by running a Windows VM instead of some native FS on Proxmox. It's hard to wrap my head around...but it's true by leaps and bounds.
Fingers crossed I guess... Like most things in the world of Linux TrueNAS. FreeNAS, OMV, Unraid are a lot like putting lipstick on a pig and claiming it's beautiful. Yes you could get intimate with a pig in makeup, but most would call that "Unnatural behaviour". My NAS (running in a VM) is an x86 copy of DietPi as the lightest functional Linux distro I could find, with CasaOS on top - great? No... but most importantly relatively free of the sub-surface ugliness and an idiotic lack of sensible defaults that is 'normal' Linux.
As former truenas and currently Unraid user I can only say that I am not looking any further for other nas os. Unraid simply has it all with easy to set up manner
People keep talking about ZimaOS as it's something special but it's just CasaOS with a new name and CasaOS started life back in sep 26 2021 progress on ZimaOS is slow.
That UI is equally as bad as TrueNAS. How hard is it to just look at Synology, UmbrelOS, etc. Even Terra-Master nailed it. It's one thing if it's an unfunded project - but if they are a funded company with the goal of making a good UI, they failed.
Well... I mean.. I do highlight that this software is ages from release. But also, it's all based on credible sources and the companies own site. It's clearly real (as in being attempted, at least), but I see your point
The user management / permissions management is the biggest issue with TrueNAS, I found it baffling and installed OMV instead. It seems like they have intended for you to hook up to a directory server.
I used to like Truenas Scale until they removed docker. Unless you run it in a vm, which defeats the purpose. k3s is huge hassle for little gains for home lab. I hope HexOS doesn't go down that path, but I have a feeling they will have to unless they are continuing development completely separate. I do like their goal though. Most OS's are gibberish to people and don't need to be.
I’m just not convinced that there are a lot of people outside who are willing and capable to build their own NAS but than use a very restricted OS because they are not techsavy enough. In my view they just buy a synology or qnap
I bought the ugreen nas and like it a lot as a hardware product but know it's pretty early on in its software developement, so I'd be happy if there's some like HexOS that I can just load into it without having to dive too deep under the hood
Corrupt? Is this still about what happened last year? Steve needs to make a follow up to his video like he is doing with Asus. Asus told him their plan and LTT publicly did an investigation and said/implemented their plan too but no follow up video for them.
@@protecteratrI'm guessing that there's a high percentage of LTT hate in these comments because this is a fairly hardcore tech channel and likely has a much higher overlap with gamers nexus vs tech entertainment channels. They don't care about how LTT actually operates or the truth as long as they can get their jabs in and agree with Steve. Of course since they are a direct competitor they'll never actually get treated as fairly as all the other companies Steve does his journalistic pieces on.
what kind of person will have the knowledge to build a hardware NAS but be so stupid to need a 0 level OS??? yes there are people that cant put gas in their car, but they didnt build the car to start with.
Not enough info. Also never be the beta. I will wait. Also how much will it cost? True nas is not free and licening it sounds pretty expensive. Do i have to pay for truenas then hex skin? I hope its not a subscription.
Truenas community editions are free, the enterprise versions are not. Going to assume this is built on the community versions because enterprise isn't cheap.
I realize funding is important and needed here, but doesn't this being LTT-backed erode perception of a quality OS (based on LTT history)? Is this just a skin, kinda like buying a screwdriver and slapping your logo on it. I'd be very cautious about trusting critical data here until long term support is proven. Maybe viable in 2029 or so.
They’ve shown the entire development of their screwdriver and very clearly didn’t just slap a logo on and it’s been independently tested so why would something that he’s personally invested money in just make it bad? I don’t get it
Some aspects of truenas are abominably awful. Potentially this may be a fantastic option. Especially if it works like gl.inet’s GUI works on top of openwrt in the router world (with the option of going into the full openwrt GUI for advanced features).
Interesting project. I tried TrueNAS and loved everything about it, except the user management. It was just baffling to me. I ended up using OMV instead.
I would love to have this as I like to tinker on things and learn the ins and outs of more complex concepts but I haven't found a NAS or NAS OS that, as Apple puts it (I believe), "Just works!" so I need something that I can basically just set and forget and should any problems happen I can take 20 minutes to an hour or less to set up instead of a complex potentially many day process to get things working again.
Thanks so much for this video. I'm looking at buying a new NAS to replace my 10+ years old Microserver Gen8 running DSM through Xpenology that has been dead reliable that entire time, but I was holding out until more information became available about this OS so thanks for this initial look at it. I get what they're trying to do with HexOS and I think a younger version of me would've been all over this, but I think given my experience with DSM and my need for something hands-off, I'll probably stick with what I know. Great that there's more competition in this field though. Especially with these Ugreen devices for example coming on the market recently, where long term reliability and support is still an unknown.
There's a huge question of WHO are they going to get to beta test this? If they're targeting novices, are they going to be able to trust them to NOT store the only copies of their files on a beta version of an OS? And why would experienced users want to bother beta testing something that isn't for them? Especially with the reach of LTT, I can imagine a scenario where a lot of people put too much trust in a beta product and a LOT of data gets lost forever. Scary stuff.
I think the Hex OS needs to be preconfigured and provide detailed settings, give options to fix, have secure and ready to go settings, with guide in menues for advanced folder permisions, and users, configure custom secure remote access priveleges, and focus on reliability. Truenas is awkward with connecting shares with users and permisions, and lacks native secure remote access and auto backups. I mean something like Synology OS for custom hardware is an unleashed NAS software i imagine users like me would appriciate.
The UNVR and UNVR Pro (Ubiquiti) will suggest a RAID config based on the drives you’ve installed. They ‘simplify’ it well but also provide the technical terms in the ‘finer print’ to appease both armatures and pros alike
Looks promising! Would be very welcome in this arena, I do believe. A user-friendly "shell" that would benefit DIY and home-users would significantly help those adapting and "rolling their own", building their homelabs. Watchout Synology, here they come! (evil grin) I myself would be interested (somewhat) repurposing my older (QNAP) hardware, if that is a possibility in their arena...
I think the hardest part of truejas scale is just the steep beginning lvl learning curve, it plateau very quickly the that first spike is really scary. Also people really aren’t a fan of only being able to expand pool in chunks. At my work it baffled people that u couldn’t just add a drive so I had to explain to them how raid worked
I haven't used it since it was still FreeNAS so I can't say anything about TrueNAS, but back then I can't remember that it was very hard to use or to setup users and permissions which it seems people find very hard today. And as I was a long time RAID user with a lot of knowledge and personal contact with the developers of several RAID controllers including the real big ones I didn't think it was that hard to handle. But as I said that was a long time ago and I can't remember the version number, but 6 seems pretty comfortable but then so do 8...
Not rules exactly. I want hugely clear. In brief, RU-vid has a copy recognition system and can flag a video if it traces content that is monitized/owned elsewhere. This can lead to (at best) revenue being held/delayed) or (at worst) a video being held and/or a community strike. If this was a 'bigger' video and with more time to clear all this before publication, I would normally do so. But this was edited and published very quickly, so to avoid any issues of the above, just easier to make it short and muted.
Honestly I've switched to omv after years of setting stuff up. I just needed something stupid simple... Im actually also installing cosmos cloud on top of it. I have to assume this is very similar to that. I just don't see the benefit for me atm.
Wonder how long it will be updated. I mean how long term they are thinking about supporting this software. With other option they are on the market for some time now.
I mean...not to stand up for UnRAID (they are big enough to stand up for themselves etc), but they ran like a lifetime support model for like £130...and the first rev of the software was in the late 2000s. I'm kinda surprised it took them THAT long to up the prices tbh. Think of the # of security patches alone....
LTT lied to their audience for over a decade and didn't make changes till they were called out. Why would you want to be associated with someone like this?
As with many things I always have to ask, “Who is this even for?” Seriously. If we’re talking about an “accessible” and “simplified” NAS and then throwing a UI on top of something like TrueNAS, then throwing in features like VMs and containerized Apps into the mix then you’ve already lost your target audience in favor of the competition. It’s already trying trying to do too many things at once, outside of basic NAS functionality. Then you have in the screenshots and specs of this utterly ridiculous example environment in their marketing. An AMD R7 7700X with 32GB of RAM and a friggin’ RTX 4070 ti 12GB and 10GBe NIC? WTAF?!? Exactly what “enthusiast” is running this kind of setup on a dedicated box and then looking for streamlined “simplicity” and “accessibility” in their NAS environment? If you’ve committed to that kind of setup, you’re already committed to and looking for the kind of complexity, scalability, and feature rich environment of actual TrueNAS Scale or UnRAID. Also for that kind of money, you’re waaaay into upper tier Synology territory. The price of Ryzen and RTX alone would already bag you a 12 Bay Synology DX1215II. Trow in a chassis, mobo, the 32GB RAM and NIC and you’re most of the way into some serious storage territory too. Again. Who is this for? Someone with the money and tech knowledge to build a dedicated custom gaming level rig, yet can’t figure out UnRAID, TrueNAS, OMV, Ubuntu Server, or a host of other similar new and old solutions (already saturating the market) over a weekend? I’m just not seeing it. Look, I love the idea of competition, innovation, and choice, but this seems more like solution in search of an audience, rather a solution to an actual problem or gap in the market.
I'm with @moto-rambler and if he's put his money on it, I guarantee that this is a subscription model. Linus's mask has been removed. He's a narcissist and all about $$
A. They already said it would be a subscription based model but also most likely offer a perpetual license too (not going to be cheap) B. Linus isn't having anything to do with the development. He literally just gave them money, similar to what he did with Framework. Yes, they can ask for his advice and he can give it but they don't owe him anything.
It's funny how a UI can suddenly be a whole new OS? We don't talk about Gnome OS or KDE OS when we are talking about which DE we are running. Call it HexUI or something.
@@nascompares Some people just have a need to point out their own intolerance for their misguided idea of perfection. Next time, tell him that the widget is made for aluminium and he'll really have smoke coming out his corn hole. God help you if you used the UrApeein pronunciation of router.
