Hello you savages. Get my free Reading List of 100 life-changing books here - chriswillx.com/books/ Here's the timestamps: 00:00 What is Attachment Theory? 05:15 Why Is This Useful in Evolution? 12:53 How Attachment Styles Are Formed 23:07 Attachment Before & After 18 Months 26:15 How to Discover Your Own Style 30:47 The Core of Anxious Attachment 34:42 Tactics to Regulate Anxious Attachment 46:31 Is Anxious Attachment More in Women? 53:27 Understanding Avoidant Attachment 1:03:11 What Does Being Avoidant Feel Like? 1:12:29 How to Regulate Avoidant Attachment 1:24:49 Can You Improve Attachment on Your Own? 1:30:18 Having a Foggy Memory of Childhood 1:35:48 How to Help an Anxious/Avoidant Partner 1:42:44 Where to Find Connor
thank you Chris for having this episode. this is my favourite one so far. i have watched several podcasts on this topic but this is the one that hits the bullseye. it explains everything and also HOW TO MANAGE your attachment style so u can work on moving towards secured... thank you so much for this and keep up the good work! love your channel ❤
The stuff he talks about men refuse getting help and pushing the therapist away even when those men realy interested and trying to move forward.. - Shows how hard and deep men are traumatized from childhood. If girl cries the world stops.. No one gives a f** about boys. Even the own mothers teacher aunts fathers onkels and so on. We all halfway abuse boys but no one screams at girls.. no one punishes girls but boys need to learn. - We literly f** up men. On top of it we have woke culture and fe**ismus who drives woman to behaive more avoidens towards men. And movies and again teacher goverment and so on. Everthing is literly build so that you as a boy get crushed and even as an adult men get crushed. It is so sad if you see all that in the world. - And then the next woman comes out and gives a talk about how men need show emotions and be more in tune with their feelings. -> No one talks about that we(mothers/woman primerarly) as society need to stop "opressing" boys and just meeting their needs instat of giving talks to meet and do more so woman are more "safe", making them behaive more towards men negative.
I know one that is avoidant and one that is anxious! Both lack internal self confidence and love! I figured out super fast with how they carry themselves.
As a fearful avoidant myself, this guy nailed it perfectly on the head. You learn to rely on yourself so much that you just feel frustrated at yourself for not being able to let go and just ask for help. You just lie to yourself and everyone around you about being okay, but inside is this storm of negative emotions and self hate.
He didn’t nail fearful avoidant at all, the research is quite clear that fearful avoidant responses can run the gamut to anxious neediness and avoidant pseudo-independence, this is why they are called disorganized: the researchers could never predict the fearful child’s response, whether he’d be mad the parent had gone away or whether he couldn’t care less. His response characterized them as just a more intense avoidant and he emphasizes their sameness
1:22:33 - For those looking for the same thing I was, the combination of both, he called Fearful-Avoidant or Disorganized-Attachment and he mentions it here. "Really deep desire for intimacy and closeness while feeling completely unlovable and distrusting people to accept who you are and actually support you."
I spent over a decade (IN THE PAST CALM DOWN) in therapy with a whole multitude of issues, and it just took this 1 podcast to COMPLETELY explain my entire life and why I am the way I am. I'm actually in mild shock and disbelief right now. EDIT: To tell people they're freaking out for no reason thinking I'm still in therapy.
@grahamvandyke It was the same for me when I learned about it!!! I've watched loads of videos on Attachment Theory now and am always discovering something new that explains me so well! Enjoy doing a deep dive!
Advice: Get a therapist that focuses on attachment theory ASAP. You can spend years in therapy and it not do much for you if you're with the wrong therapist.
As an anxious person going through a breakup with someone who was more avoidant, this video has been extremely reassuring and helpful with coming to terms with what I was doing wrong, and with how we were incompatible.
@@ManTalksas I said in the general comments it’s the ONLY podcast/interview/video in the whole internet that answered ones of the big probs that I had until this day since these 6 last years (start of my severe 2 years long depression). And you did that job thanks to you and Chris. Am so grateful for that. So thank you Connor to bring the light to so much darkness 🙏
What he said about making yourself the center of your own orbit since you know youre not the center of anyone else's... Thats legit how it feels and is good concise description.
Conner Beaton is at the forefront of addressing issues as a man. My life has changed for the better since I started listening to ManTalks. His book is fantastic as well, and I highly recommend everyone read it, man and woman.
Like many of us, I have watched/listened to what now amounts to hundreds, if not thousands, of videos and PCs pertaining to self-help, mental health, wellness, and the like. Not a single one hit my innermost soul as hard (nor resonated with me as much) as this blessing to the world. Thank you both beyond measure. 💓🙏🏻🌹
The "Healthy Gamer" dude eloquently and succinctly explained THE phenomena of a particular FORM of meditation NOT WORKING for an individual.... He said self-serving less educated instructors have a vested interest in pushing the ONE (of the over 112 meditation techniques) technique in which THEY are trained....rather than observing their method DOES NOT WORK for the individual (or the individual at this TIME of their lives)...and recommending their client SEEK ANOTHER teacher/technique 😅~ one which IS effortlessly EFFECTIVE ~ they "double-down" and insist you TRY HARDER. This is a RED FLAG that particular instructor IS INCOMPETENT and SELF SERVING. The solution is NOT to "try harder"...it is to SEEK a technique which /teacher WHO is both EFFORTLESS and HELPFUL to YOU.
Great video. One of the things rarely talked about is how family emeshment can lead to avoidance. Some people felt they had very loving parents when in fact they were quite enmeshed.
@@UnknownHumanOnline Emotional Enmeshment: This is all about feelings. People feel like they're responsible for each other's happiness and sadness. It can be hard to separate your own emotions from everyone else's. - Intellectual Enmeshment: Everyone thinks the same way.
It took 5 relationships to recognise i was constantly with emotionally unavailable people as it mirrored my upbringing.. once i figured that out i then began to see my anxious side.. however, through later life trauma i also inevitably swung to avoidant to cope (though i didnt realise that) suffice it to say, after several years of then feeling like i just couldnt seem to make friends, partners or keep a job and had a mental breakdown did i finally understand i had disorganised attachment and was only ever keeping one plate in the air. Trying to keep both up was hard and for the most part i have the anxious side sorted in external relationships though still get triggered by my parent - the avoidant side is much harder to handle as its become somewhat of a shield now. Trusting that others will stay and actually care is the core issue left to tackle. And now in therapy to do that. Love this in depth video- great to hear it all so well explained and in one video not ten! Lol Have saved to share with others in the future.
Another really good breathing technique a friend taught me when u have trouble breathing when anxious, is to breathe in deep, then try to breathe in just a little more. Hold it for a few seconds, then exhale slowly. Has saved me from a few panic attacks.
(Dismissive) Avoidant Attached here. Grew up with a Disorganized Attached father and a Secure Attached mother. My father dealt with war trauma (Japanese Occupation in the 40’s) and he was very verbally violent. All I could do as a 4 year old (and on) is go into freeze, shut off and avoid. I did this for 43 very long years. For you people out there, Avoidant Attached people want to connect! But we feel unsafe in our bodies and we are scared to be vulnerable again because: ‘what if?’. Somatic Experiencing is helping me heal and to move into Secure Attached now and oh boy…. It is worth it!
Similar history, almost in secure zone now, would like to compare methods of recovery. Just drop the dot in the correct place between my German and English parts of the name, and add dog and gmail extension after, if you ok to connect and talk.
The problem is your defense mechanisms with your dad are being used to prevent you from bonding with people who have had nothing to do with the experiences your dad gave you.
I watch a lot of RU-vid videos but I’m half way through this one and I already want to send it to everyone I know. This guy can truly change peoples lives!
I try to be sympathetic towards avoidant men when it comes to dating but it’s hard to try to show sympathy when they ghost. Did I get played? Did he begin to catch feelings and run from them? Regardless I was heartbroken and never got an explanation as to why they disappeared after seeming so eager to start a relationship. The lesson is, it’s not your job to fix men, hope they go to therapy and improve but don’t destroy your mind trying care for them when they’re giving you nothing
Because we have tried talking to women about failures in how you treat men, and you fail so completlely to listen. Tantrums, attacks, denial, anything but learning. You have been taught to treat men as things, and we dont want that anymore.
Disorganized attachment is what everything has pointed to for me but I had a hard time accepting it because I was never physically abused or in fear physically. In the rear view mirrow..my family/home/care providers went to crap during my teen years. I actually had 2 primary father figures at same time(1 was grandfather). Grandfather murdered in robbery at 13, father diagnosed with severe illness during same month and eventually became extremely needy physically and needy as in selfishly demanding, tons more shock traumas in the family, then my mother started to lose her mind trying to hold us all together. I was emotionally closest to her before all of this. She became highly emotionally unstable and unsafe for me to be around emotionally and she'd lash out so I walked on egg shells. I even remember holding my breath in the mornings when i heard her foot steps going down the hall never knowing if she was coming to attack me for not being more helpful or if she was going to ignore me. These teen years are years I remember learning to withdraw from conflict and withdraw from bonding with my parents emotionally even though i strongly desired the bond we used to have before the world fell apart. Now I'm married to an avoidant woman and our relationship is extremely difficult for us to bond and I just recently discovered all these attachment issues and have no idea how to fix it all. (It was nice just to type this out somewhere where I'm anonymous)
It seems like I have a Fearful Avoidant Attachment Style. My mother is Securely Attached and my father is Avoidant Attached. I know I had this fear growing up that if I mess up I will get punished for it. I didn’t get much explicit encouragement but I definitely got some error signals when I made a mistake or messed up. On top of this, although I had a great childhood with a pretty healthy home environment, I was rejected by two girls at 16 and 17 years old who I really really liked and the second one crushed me and I rememeber saying the words “never again” to myself and shoved it deeeeep down. I think that shaped my avoidance mostly as I find it petrifying to trust the relationship developing without me having a guard up. It is my responsibility to let go of. No one is to blame. My biggest takeaways: •You can’t think your way into secure attachment •You have to connect with the experience, the sensations, and the nervous system, rather than memories and thoughts. •You should implement exposure therapy alongside inner work and let go of that charge that arises
Recovering anxious here. What has worked for me is breathwork (Buteyko method), meditations from Dr Joe Dispensa to rewire my somatic patterns and self esteem work (Six Pillars of Self Esteem and learning to trust myself by keeping my word and unraveling my need for external validation). And Stoicism as a framework.
by "worked for me" do you mean you were/are able to be in a relationship/talking stage/etc. in a secure manner without your anxiety flaring up again? Or that in the moment you feel these techniques are helping your mind shift towards secure attachment (ie; "recovering"). Just asking because I also believed I was in the same boat right up until the avoidant person reached back out again and the anxiety creeped back up again. I'm also working on self esteem work mainly, but am interested in the other things you've listed as well. Thing is, self improvement in this area of life seems inconsequential just working on yourself on your own, instead of engaging in another relationship with preferably a secure partner that can lead you to being secure. Would love to hear your thoughts on this.
@@burningspeed2096 bro I am in the exact same boat. I know exactly how you feel. That being said its for sure the second one. At the moment our best bet is to use the techniques when they flare up but subconsciously practice them every single day so it rewires your nervous system. But also before you jump back into the relationship think long and hard if its worth going through all those anxious feelings. Just because you worked on yourself doesnt mean your partner has too. Avoidants typically just process how they felt months later but usually dont do the internal work like us anxious do. (we reflect fast and want to change fast however we think were better until we flare up and then realize nothing has worked)
This year has been the most helpful in knowing who I truly am than any year I've lived. I was in a, what I felt, loving relationship with this person who was in a 10 year relationship 2 years ago. For the past few months her and I really hit it off until the first of April where she completely flipped and by the end of the month she completely shut off and ended the relationship without any communication or way to work on it. For months I tried no contact and thought she'd come around (she didn't) and it only took until me missing her birthday she decided to block me on almost everything. This whole time I had been anxious thinking it was me even after working incredibly hard by going through therapy, AA, working out, and eating right to know it wasn't mostly my fault. My anxiety kept telling me that I wasn't good enough or she'll reach out if I did this or that but, in reality she needed to work on her emotions because I did the work and didn't warrant being blocked or not talked to at least since the break up.
For an avoidant, questions framed as are u WILLING, rather than do u WANT TO, can be powerful. They likely will NoT “want to”. But they may be willing & it then puts it into their court to decide
For an anxious like me, I have grown weary of constantly thinking of how to bear phrase things to my avoidant partner. It triggers my obsessive thinking & over explanation tendencies.
Let's not forget that no matter how you phrase anything at all, they're capable of lying to your face to go do whatever they want. And they're also capable of telling you that they'll indeed do something but never do it.
I think Chris asked a good question about brain scan differences in people with attachment disorders. I wish there was a bit more of a discussion about this here but I wanted to add that there are differences as evidenced by brain scans and clinical research, and it is fascinating especially when it comes to avoidantly attached individuals. There are numerous published studies that show avoidantly attached individuals suffer more memory issues, respond less to stimuli, and overall show fundamental physiological differences in their brains. 🧠 it’s not as simple as they feel anxiety about intimacy and then ghost; they actually in many cases aren’t wired to even receive and experience closeness the same way secure or anxiously attached individuals are, so their experience of “anxiety” is likely not the same. I personally would be so excited to see an episode with Dr. Kirk Honda who runs the YT channel Psychology in Seattle. His content is high quality. He has hours of discussion on attachment theory on his podcasts and RU-vid channel.
@@smokingcrab2290 How did you enter into a marriage if she can't experience bonding and connection? I think you should reevaluate your marriage and start taking steps to protect yourself and your assets. Think about what you stated, if she can't experience it, then you need to question what motivation she has to be married to you if she is actively combating your attempts to improve your relationship. Does your wife tell you she loves you but then subsequently performs these actions? Please evaluate her on her actions, which from this one comment I can tell are probably abhorrent and exploitative of you. I truly hope I am wrong.
They also don't have serotonin, healthy dopamine, or oxytocin or vasopressin. They mostly survive on cortisol thus the health problems and early death, addictions, impulse etc
I wasn't always, but have been an avoidant individual for the past decade or so. I'm decent looking, fairly intelligent, and have average social skills, but after experiencing trauma I detached myself socially. I'm now afraid to go out and have no one to go out with. I'm also a perfectionist, so I only want to show the best version of myself and afraid to show vulnerabilities.
Shame is the master emotion that drives change. All emotions are good when used correctly. By denigrating shame you are ironically shaming people for feeling it at all.
It’s not. Depends on the degree of fear and the trauma - even if she tells you that you showed her the true meaning of love for the first time in her life ever, her having been raped 2 times, escaped more attempts and was treated like shit plus difficult childhood w/ona father who cheated on mum can have the fears surpass love that is off the charts but fear is more powerful sadly…
Connor and Chris are some of the best masculine role models I came across in my Life, especially for modern men. Thank you both for your massive work for Men's mental health and healthy Life.
amazing ......i have watched hundreds videos, listened huge amount of podcasts...read 2 books a weeks, but this video BRILLIANT...absolutely GOLD.....GOD BLESS YOU
I’ve never known what was “wrong” with me. After watching this episode. I’m sure that I am fearful avoidant. I’m definitely going to bring this up with my therapist today. Thank you for this episode. It’s really helpful ❤
Personaly I chose to not go into therapy just because I had the firm belief that it would be completely useless, tried to manage the whole thing on my own. Had both anxiety and avoidant type, now got rid of the anxiety one thanks to the ton of self education on the internet, but the avoidant one still remaining for no reasons. This episode is completely relieving for me. « Someone finally understood my problem »..
Thank you, Chris, for bringing up the dual attachment style, "fearful avoidant,". I haven't really looked into attachment styles, but I'm sure there are a few people out there who can relate.
Chris, I want to thank you for ASKING about the difference between the dismissive avoidant and the fearful avoidant attachment style. If it weren't for you, your guest wouldn't have even mentioned it. His short response also shows he doesn't know much about that third insecure AS, or - what's worse - believes it's just a subtype of the dismissive avoidant one that doesn't even deserve to be mentioned. As a fearful avoidant woman, I do not relate 100% to the dismissive avoidant people - one of the things I'm scared of is how anxious and dependent I get once I start to care about someone. They never experience that. I do want to thank Connor for a few things though: for making it clear that you can't think yourself into the secure attachment style and that you need to use other ways and methods of healing yourself; and that you can't do it alone - you get hurt in your relationships so that's where you heal as well.
I know this was for men, but this helped me more than so many books and podcasts. I realized I may be one of the few that have disorganized attachment. I always thought that I was anxiously attached but a lot of the techniques really didn't help me. I run away from relationships also and this was the first time I heard someone so clearly describe the avoidant piece in an empathetic sort of way. The strategies and techniques provided are something I'm going to speak to my therapist about and this may be the start of a whole new chapter for me, thank you both.
Regulation tactics summary: Anxious: - Understand roots - Meditation (guided) - Breath work (pranayama style) 35:00 - You cannot think your way into secure attachment due to integration of the body. Physical work is needed - training for lack of better word. 39:20 - For anxious work on self-worth is needed. What are you bringing into relationship. - Robust system of self-validation (gratitude journaling (for, important to me because, it makes me feel) 43:05 - Detach worth and safety from external sources 44:00 - Exposure therapy - saying NO to a partner 44:50 Avoidant: - Understand roots - Prioritize experience and expression of it (speak about what you want or don’t want, how you feel) 1:13:00 - Shift from blame to ownership 1:14:00 - Start to use shutdown as a bridge to reconnect (race to repair) 1:15:40 - Relation regulation (physical exercise). Co-regulate exercise in relationship: forehead to forehead, hands on bottom of ribs of partner, follow partners breathing. 40 to 50 breaths. 1:17:30 Fearful avoidant (disorganized attachment): deep desire for intimacy and closeness, while feeling completely unlovable and distrusting people to except who you are and support you. Work on both above summarized attachments. 1:23:30
This episode was really eye-opening and offered information I haven’t heard before. (And I listen to attachment material all day for my job). Really great episode. The mental health perspective of men with avoidant attachment style is not talking enough about outside of dating context.
This was so insightful. As a woman that grew up in an unstable home (alcoholic father) and raised in a country that was in war we fled our home and I had to grow up quickly. at age 10 I was filling in my parents taxes, taking responsibility early on. Didnt really have a childhood. Now I have trouble trusting people and being in relationships. Feelings overwhelm me and i have an emotional wall around me. I often wonder what my life would look like if I was raised in a calm and stable home but I also know I am resilient because of it.. This helped understand myself much better..
THANK YOU for discussing the drawbacks of mediation for people with trauma. I've never heard this on a podcast before; typically meditation is seen as a prescription for everything, but it can be a stressor for some. I love all the actionable suggestions in this episode.
Fearful Avoidant here👋 It's not a beautiful thing, it sucks pus😂 It's hard! I'm even studying psychology and trying to heal this is hard! Thank goodness the urge for connection is greater than avoiding everything, disappearing into the woods, and becoming crazy old cat lady. Seriously though, great podcast❤️❤️❤️
As you get older it improves. Marriage and legal attachment helps. As does actually inventing a life you could lead if your relationship ended. Good luck.
It's awesome that you are studying psychology as part of the process to learn and heal yourself. 🙏 very admirable. Best wishes..... from an anxious person that just got out of a relationship with an extreme avoidant... my head is still spinning 😂
I am really emotionally avoidant. Though I cannot say this has anything to do with my upbringing. Actually my mother was always very caring and approachable, and frequently complained that I never shared with her. This avoidance definitely fortified itself when I understood how terrible people are at listening and understanding. So I grew up becoming a good listener and a great avoidant. I always carried the mantra with me that "If it's my problem, it's mine to worry about, and up to me to find a way to fix it"
People who never accept help unintentionally (or not) constantly put out the message that they are superior to everyone. Other people need help-not me. You need help because you are weak and I’m not etc etc. I’ve talked to my husband a lot about that. It’s not a message he intends to send at all. Just thought I’d mention it. People often feel very proud of never receiving help, without realizing how actually demeaning it can be to others in the long run. Accepting influence is important.
@@andianderson3017 I don't ask for help because whenever I do they use it as a way to dominate/shame me either in that moment or in the future. It creates vulnerability, whether you like it or not.
After 54 years on this planet with more heart-ship that one person should have, the best attachment for me is to have NONE..zero..only to myself. This redeemed me and made me whole and happy
I’m anxious, my ex is avoidant, but it almost seems like he has a lot of narcissistic attributes as well. He would turn off his phone and leave for 2 days to go party with friends…. While I was home with the kid…. Took 13 years and I finally left. He also has addictions so that was an issue too
Similar... my avoidant ex would turn into a not very nice person once he began to drink, which was several times a week.. Also got me into using mushrooms and ecstasy...drinking a lot and we were about to start using coke as well... Dont even get me started on his fetish addictions.. Caught him cheating twice and there i was, still trying to save the relationship.. Everything ended in a huge spectacle outside his house... we both called the police.. he hit me because i was demanding he show me his conputer to delete all my pics and videos... as he had uploaded uploaded a video of me to a fetish website without my consent... Crash n burn... i broke so many of my boundaries because i was crazy about him... he knew id do anything for him. This was my first experience with a full blown avoidant... Wow... what a total mind f*ck. Part of me wants to hate him but I mostly now feel sorry for him... especially as i learn about all this.
I've argued/yelled at my phone/you guys on other topics, other chats & podcasts, but this is your best work yet! (not womanhating/projection/patronizing to the ladies) Emotionally 'in tune' intelligent and humble and honest. Beautiful! (for quite some time lately lol) Ive wished i was a lesbian. But I still love men! ❤
Love how healthy and Amazingly both expressed love and appreciation to each other in the end. That brings me joy that gorgeous men can be loving. There is humanity and goodness in them 🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼 hope more men become like these 2 are ❤
I have a Secure/Avoident attachment style. I am the eldest and was given responsibilities at a young age and therefore have had to rely on myself to ensure that things got done! This has nade me a "man of the world" which is very attractive especially to a female who is anxious attached but conversely can cause issues with their fear of abandonment. Sadly, these individuals can suck the life out of you! All had been through a lot and overshared but eventually you feel burdened by them! I think also that your attachment style can change with age and circumstances and is hard to break away from! I like being in a relationship, do not fear connection and have never worried about being left. What I think I fear in a relationship is engulfment!
Not sure if this was mentioned in the video, but I'd like to add this before I forget. What is considered secure attachment may look different for different cultures (at least that's what I heard, but I forgot who said this). Most of the time (like in psychology), we view things through a Western lens. There are many different perspectives, so what is considered a secure attachment style in the US, Canada, of the UK may be different from what is considered secure in Asia or the non-Westernised parts of Oceania.
Chris and Conner-amazing!! Love the sweet comraderie that you have as the conversation unfolded later. All was amazing and learned way too much-need to re-listen again-but what stood out was about gratitude-I always found it completely meaningless and thought terrible things of maybe I’m ungrateful! Thanks for clarifying immensely how to talk about gratitude. I’ve hated gratitude talks and manifestation talks too and just couldn’t put my finger on what it was that didn’t sit right. Thank you, thank you, thank you. I have three amazing sons (teen, preteen, and younger preteen) and I’m pro-female and pro-male and they know it! Such a poignant episode.
Chris, I urge you to invite Canadian developmental psychologist Gordon Neufeld to have a chat. He's buddies with the very famous Gabor Mate and they have written books together. He is really great at communicating attachment theory so it's really easy to understand. Sadly he's not very present in the podcast universe, but he really should be, and I'd love to have someone get him to comment on present topics like the culture wars, politics, the psychedelic renaissance, etc. He's a hidden gem!
Need and want are words of the lower consciousness. We are in a huge shift in consciousness and vibration of words plays a huge role in this. We recognize we are capable of meeting our own needs and we become clear on that which we VALUE. We recognize we are capable of getting what we want and we become clear on that which we ENJOY. Value and enjoy do not imply lack whereas need and want imply it is lacking. Literally practice this and you’ll see a difference in how energy materializes in your reality.
This was a brilliant exchange of wonderful thoughts , not that I would presume to be intellectually capable to qualify this marvelously instructive sharing of most helpful ideas. Thank you so much, gentlemen.
I'm not sure if this is even possible but i've always seen myself as avoidant and noticed my avoidant tendencies through various relationships. But as im listening to this podcast and reflecting on my last relationship of 4 years i realised that i'd cycled through all 3 attachment styles. I started the relationship secured but after a year my partner started to complain more and more about my behaviour. One day he admitted to breaching my privacy behind my back (which im fine sharing when we're in front of one another), I realised how little trust he has for me. I suddenly turned into the most anxious person clinging onto him, asking and checking if my behaviours were satisfactory to him (seeking validation). After another year nothing changed and I just became avoidant. I stopped sharing my thoughts, what i needed, i just grew hyper independent within the relationship -wanting to do everything on my own, disregarding his feelings. And slowly the r/s went towards the end. So based on this story did i actually display all 3 attachment styles? Or am i understanding this topic wrongly?
Attachment theory was very helpful for me (f, dismissive-avoidant). I kept asking myself what was wrong and couldn't find a solution, and I'm one of those hyperindependent people, who press through every obstacle without help. By all means, I should have been able to solve this stupid problem. I had fixed myself before in other ways, like developing good social skills from scratch. I had even pushed myself out of my comfort zone and had difficult discussions with people, although I just wanted to run. I SHOULD have the skill set and will and endurance to make things work. But they just don't. And it's getting worse with age. The more I improve socially, the more friendly and open and caring I become, the worse I am treated. People treated me better 20 years ago, when I was a recluse, who couldn't hold a conversation. Fixing myself has done nothing for me; in fact it feels like it has harmed my ability to brush over abuse, like I did as a child. But attachment theory did something for me. I only got diagnosed last year, but it has changed things. I realised that I was damaged by my caregivers before I could even speak, and that this did cause a subtle form of brain damage (or rather an abnormal form of brain development, that can't be reversed). I will always have a crippled amygdala situation, that no amount of therapy or medication can reverse. It doesn't matter what I do or say in social settings. This time I can't fix it on my own, and professional help is insufficient in a case, where I would need a functioning relationship with a person willing to help. Which leads to the next problem - normal people don't want a nutcase, that they have to fix to get along with, and they're right. A relationship partner should not be misappropriated as a therapist. It's too much, it isn't fair, and I don't want to feel like I'm dating a caregiver. And that's apart from the fact, that I couldn't find someone willing to go the extra mile, even if I wanted to. So here's what attachment theory did for me: It gave me permission to finally quit this $hitshow. I'm not continuing to date people. I will keep my friendships on a superficial level - get rid of friends, who show toxic behaviour, and not open up much with new friends. I've had enough of being treated like dirt, and sadly (based on the environment I grew up in) I attract Cluster B personalities (narcs and borderliners), even when we're just talking about friendship. This stops here, and finding out that I'm avoidant and never stood a fighting chance to find a single safe relationship helped me to come to this decision. That took away a lot of pressure and made me feel better, because all those years I thought I needed to fix something that was unfixable from the start.
That's what you took away from this?! I actually feel great relief as a fearful avoidant knowing that I wasn't born like this and I can heal from it. I'm excited. I don't understand the point of you seeking friendship with others only to keep it shallow. That gets old real quick for you and your friends. I wish you well either way. I'm not going to stay in the cesspool with you.
I know a lot of people who talk about their 'great childhood' because that is the family story that they are told, and it's the story they want to believe, even though it's clear that can't be the case.
I like this podcast, bc it doesn't bring shame to avoidant partners. Although, that still doesnt mean that we have to do whatever an avoidant partner says or wants, especially when their coping mechanisms is to be physically or emotionally abusive to you. Name calling, disregarding, acknowledging that theyre rude to you but dismiss it as who they are is wrong. You can be as patient as you can w avoidant partners, but if they make it very clear that theyll never change and will continue to live w their insecurity and project them on you and make you suffer alongside w them, you'll have to make the decision to leave. You can still love them, but you cannot change a person, they can only change themselves, you can inspire them, but think of your partner, how much do you truly know them? Abuse is abuse, no matter how broken the person is. imagine how many court cases wouldve been dismissed if that wasnt the case I think whats most important is, if that you do decide to leave, make sure you make it clear that you still love them, but their inner issues are projecting onto you that it can make a secure person insecure
What a great video, I honestly needed this video. I know have a better understanding of myself. I’m an avoidance person and often shut down when I get to a point.
I have avoidant style, recognised a few years ago by a friend in mental health. I was a ‘mail order’ adoption via a London agency and at four months I was flown out to my adoptive parents living in an African colony. My new mother, a single child who’s father died when she was two, didn’t warm to me and struggled to bond, frequently leaving me with a neighbour, my dad was on an upward career path and his time was limited. At 3.5 years my sister arrived after fertility treatment and she became the focus. I was a mischievous kid , a handful and would often escape the house to explore. Primary school was stabilising, weekends and school holidays would be daily escapes into the bush with my school pals, on my returns I would be punished, hand, shoe, dog lead, swinging broom, belt whatever was to hand. At nine after being brought home by the police for the third time I was sent to boarding school, 1200 miles away in South Africa, to be ‘straightened out’ left there 3 days before school started. I became a scrapper to manage the bullying, a behaviour which came with frequent canning. After starting I didn’t return home for two terms, there was a problem with my adoption which delayed a passport being issued. When I got home, we were sitting around a pool where my parents told me I was adopted, that I wasn’t their natural son and about the passport issue. I got up and sat the other side of the pool and cried, my sister came round and gave me a hug and told me I was always going to be her brother. That pool became symbolic, I felt unwanted, school became ‘home, I dreaded end of term and became independent. At 14, my folks returned to the U.K. and a whole new set of experiences. There’s more but whilst my folks were indifferent to my sports and career successes, my sister always kept me tied into family events. This cast covers much of what I felt and feel, experienced and experience.
I still don’t understand after all this time, these decades and experience of life how we can still be in this situation where our parents didn’t want us at the time and haven’t developed an inner maturity enough to maintain our level of psychological sanity. So much waste 🤦♂️
@@dominostimes2119This style is more common than you think. Everyone is different in how maturity and experience develop their coping mechanisms, something a psychiatrist and a cast like this will help you understand. This communication style starts as a baby, adopted or natural, it is about the level of attention and affection it gets from its parents, a connection pattern that continues between them into adulthood and even onto how the grandchildren are treated. I never had therapy but over the years I would write down my thoughts to help me figure out and work through the moments, which I’ve pulled into a script for family record so my children understand how dad became dad.
@@dominostimes2119 time alone doesn’t heal psychological wounds. They are really hard to heal. So much damage is done in those early years that has long term effects. Its so unfair that the victims are the ones that suffer the effects until we die it seems, except if we do a lot of ongoing work to recover.
@@universaltruth2025 that was my case 6 years ago. Been on severe depression for 2 years minimum with regular suicidal thoughts, on my complete own to recover and dig in this whole mess. Self educating again and again, inner work constantly. Here for the avoidant style that still remains and have no solution for, didn’t acknowledge it and my regular incoherent interpersonal and intimate relationships.
The section regarding the foggy childhood memory is interesting, because I've heard from my neighbors that my home life growing up was stressful and chaotic, cop cars coming and going, screaming matches on a weekly basis mixed with physical abuse, the whole gamut of an unstable family life with emotionally taxing events happening more often than they should. I don't remember a whole lot, because a lot of it seems to just blur together; same shit, different day. I remember very vividly the things that happened to me, but I feel like my experience doesn't have credibility because I can't recall every single unfortunate that happened to me at home. I don't need to be validated for my misfortunes and stress growing up, but I wish I knew more about what I experienced so I can learn and more effectively move past it. Not being able to recall as much makes me feel defunct, like I am stunted in my memory recall and that I shouldn't feel justified in thinking I still have things I can resolve to achieve emotional "fullness".
I’m not a professional in any way but I was wondering if you think it’s the thing your brain does to protect you from trauma. It just blocks the memory so you don’t have it?
@@debslagel1132 Perhaps. I'm more lamenting the possibility that I'm not 100% of the person I want to be, and I've spent years training my perspective to be a person who is able to look forward absolutely as opposed to being half in the past and half in the present. I have behaviors and beliefs that can be attributed to things I experienced (for example, being admonished by my father in front of my mom for my childhood obesity, leading to complications with self-image, self esteem, and needless perfectionism), but I feel that not being able to see the whole picture leaves me unable to fix the whole problem, if that makes sense. An easy way to get around this is to believe wholeheartedly that I don't have a problem anymore, but it's difficult to believe that when you've had friends who can't give you the benefit of the doubt in regards to how you perceive things; I can only act upon what I know, and no one else knows what I know unless I inform them. The trouble is finding people who can accept you once you've given them that knowledge, and perhaps forgive you for needing the reassurance that you're as worthy of kindness and love as they are.
@@debslagel1132 I unrepressed my childhood. I think what happened is basically my mother did everything to ensure I forgot. And since my father stopped living with us full time things got better... i just forgot until my brother died. Then i remember growing up with him and WOW...oh boy...the memories were rough as hell. I think it was just nothing reminded me, and i was too young/emotional/alive to even care about my childhood until my forties. The day i got a bike and was able to leave home alone to see my friends until night time i just put my childhood in a box under the bed as I was free..and i remained free. I rarely spent time at home from 10 years old onwards.
@@XxIsolationistxX try cbt therapy? deb is onto something - dr nicole lepera talks about dissociation and trauma, worth looking into.. also eckhart tolle teaches living in the present moment and other stuff. also worth learning, good luck
At 1:22 - Chris described a Fearful Avoidant. My condolences to them, and to any one with them. I'm AP ( 50% secure, 25% AP) - had an extreme DA gf, and that was bad enough. But to have BOTH characteristics? Holy shit. Hard road.
For the anxious attached out there. "You cannot think your way into a secure attachment" And.. " You have to begin to give yourself the validation you are seeking from others." I find this very helpful. I have always been very confident and viewed myself as happy etc. But a lot of my confidence comes from other people and their validation of me and my personality. I've realized recently it doesn't necessarily come from inside myself. I definitely lean on the anxious side. But I know how to perform and act avoidant if that is what will get me what I need as well.
I think a main point missing from this conversation is how your attachment traits/style will vary depending on the person you’re spending time with. You can be totally secure with one person, yet anxiously attached with another.
Forced into responsibility? By what? By who? No one can ever force you to take responsibility for ANYTHING. At the end of the day you can always just curl up in a ball and refuse to do anything. Taking responsibility for things is always something you choose to do because you want the benefits. I promise the benefits are worth it. Abusive/semi-abusive parents are never fair, but they arent going anywhere. Someday you might meet a young person thats dealing with the same shit you are and you might save their life with the insights you gain from taking responsibility for yourself. I believe in you.
@seraph...4473 you don't help anyone by shaming them even more for their feelings and reactions. Trying to "fix and prescribe" for other people is its own dysfunction.
@@Rut-vi7iz I didnt shame them, and its the yt comments, they agreed to have responses in the act of leaving their own comment. I also understand that you think saying what I said is a dysfunction and I disagree. Have a good day.
@@seraph...4473 you can't make those choices as a kid if you're groomed into responsibility even if your parent is in the wrong for cursing you with it. As a kid you just don't know.
If these labels are based off the strange situation, it makes sense. And generally people will fall into a general category. But I think we all display varying levels of each trait and behave differently with different people. Ive found attachment styles to be extremely useful to understand but looking at circumstances and asking “what am I doing?” rather than taking on a specific label seems like the most accurate approach.
Men: choose the mother of your children very carefully. Women: choose the father of your children very carefully. Regarding love, we often think of and are fed the message that love is altruistic, but this (imo) is just one of two parts of love. The other part of love is attachment. Attachment is the aspect of love that is selfish. You can only have love without attachment if that love has first moved through attachment. To go straight to love without going through attachment first is to not love, but be indifferent. Attachment (when healthy) helps us determine if someone is a suitable partner for us.
Thankyou! Such a wondrrful and helpful discussion. For me and others that struggle in relationships, forming and maintaining them this is wonderfully practical and i hope it helps others in creating a more satisfied and locing life!
This is the best podcast I’ve listened to on this topic and I listened to tons after months of hell - I’m anxious and was ghosted off avoidant ex for 8 weeks (I’d just been through cancer this the anxiety was already high) after 8 weeks he finally got in touch apologising, bread-crumbing for 3 weeks before agreeing to get back then discarding me by text the following day. The pain was horrific but it’s forced me to dig deep into childhood trauma abandonment abuse etc and I’m slowly healing. I’ve promised myself I will never go through this again I will heal secure and therefore date a secure partner when the time is right. Thanks for a great podcast 🩵
If you're with an avoidant, just run. Fucking run. You will never feel more alone than with an avoidant. You will be guessing your sanity all the time. You will be gaslit into oblivion for merely desiring a baseline connection. You will have to cater to all of their needs while getting nothing out of the relationship. Avoidants need to just be left alone in the woods. They are so not worth it. I'm married to one and I hate my life. Every single day is a battle of "how busy can I make myself so that I stop thinking about my miserable relationship?". It's the worst ball & chain I've ever dealt with.
I put my running shoes on a year ago and have never looked back. I can be peaceful and not need to wait for their breadcrumbs or deal with the psychological drama. Trust that you will be okay without this dysfunction. Life is too short for that misery
I feel your pain. I was involved for two years with a severe DA ( definite narcissistic tendencies/behaviors). Don't fight the battle of busy-ness. Build ESCAPE VELOCITY and leave.
I'm sorry for what you've been through and what you're going through. Not happy to hear about others going through similar but it does help me feel like im not alone... especially not crazy. My ex would constantly blame me for his behavior... yes, it's my fault i caught him kissing another women... took him back then exactly 3 weeks later, caught them both naked... he said i should have gone home and called him the next day to complain. Ridiculous. Anyway.... it just hurts to know so many other people are still in similar or worse situations. Being breadcrumbed and treated this way hurts so much.. i would never wish this even upon my worse enemy. I wish you strength and courage. *hugs*
