How Cedar Fair Picks its Winners & Losers 

YAYAYAYAYYAAYYAYAYAYYYYYYYY

Sweet let the crazed expansion begin

You also forgot the consider the Dayton area for Kings Island

The Detroit metro area still exists? I go on Google maps and all I see is abandoned houses and open fields

Canadas Wonderland also draws from the Buffalo-Niagara Falls area that's just across the border though most of it's crowd is from Toronto.

That would be weird and work better as a park name

I was literally thinking the same thing lol

PointlessPickle2 Cursed

That basically would make me sense - a valley goes into the ground, yet a point would probably go up

🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯

Ok why can you ride any ride you want 3 times on the 4th of July?? Shhhh

Columbia sc here, this comment is very accurate

Cedar Point is pretty much engraved in the Ohio culture at this point too.

Carrowinds is an amazing park. KI is our home park. I wish they had some more wooden coasters though, but the place is a Mecca of steel coasters. We really enjoyed it both times we visited. I rode my first Gigga there at Night. Wow what ride that is!

Best field trip, hands down. We went in middle school for a band competition, it was a rite of passage for sure. I think I rode Top Gun when I was there (1999 I think)

I see you everywhere 🙄

Skii Animation ?

Skii Animation why are u everywhere

Gtccoasters I’m a bot

As someone who has family who lives near Detroit (Ann Arbor), this is 100% accurate. My aunt and uncle go to Cedar Point yearly, and yet have never been to Michigans Adventures once in their lives.

i had never even heard of michigan's adventure until recently by doing research for a huge amusement park trip I wanna do eventually starting with visiting every cedar fair park and I live in Indiana so there is no reason why I shouldn't have heard of it. it's also about equal distance of driving for me to go to Cedar Point and Kings Island because I'm in the middle of those two parks, but MA isn't that much farther tbh

@@AshleyChalfant88 its worth going to once because Shivering Timbers is fantastic, other than that there isn't much

Or Chicago either - given the drive involved it's better to go the extra distance to Cedar Point.

@@mikebarnes2294 they also have six flags great America

To be fair, Knott's is the most popular park in the chain. It just can't grow any bigger without some drastic changes like expanding into its parking lot. Canada's Wonderland would need to do the same to expand, but it at least has some mediocre rides that could be refurbished or replaced to make it better.

With a B and M hyper coming to CGA, I think it is a winner. Also, Kings Dominion should be a winner.

Kings Dominion is a have though.

Reilly Walker What about a multi story parking garage?

I’m close to Detroit but I went to Michigan’s Adventure for YEARS before I ever went to Cedar Point. I’m a huge adrenaline junky so of course I wanted to go to Cedar Point, but my family all hate thrill rides, so we never went. I’ve only ever been to Cedar Point 3 times, once with my best friends family, and twice for a school trip. I’ve been to Michigan’s Adventure more times than I can count, and I have so much nostalgia from it. I know it sucks but I can’t bring myself to hate it!

Another issue is the nearby airport which restricts ride heights to 275 feet. The Power Tower had to cut down its height from the original plans because of that restriction.

They could probably do something similar to the way they did excalibur. they designed both excalibur and thunder canyon with flooding in mind

Just kill Excalibur, and replace it with something good

Another "competitor" angle that wasn't covered -- Wonderland is 2 hours away from Darien Lake. Some Torontonians prefer to drive to DL since it's cheaper to get in and it's less crowded than CW.

Racing Photographer Except they have to go through US Border Patrol.

@@DoswarePictures That's no biggie, a lot of Canadians in these parts have NEXUS cards (like Global Entry but works in both directions)

@@DoswarePictures thats one thing I was thinking about, the hassle of crossing the border. Not usually much of a hassle unless you're "randomly" selected

@@racingphotographer8251 thats a lie. No one lies Darien Lake.

I grew up in Grand Rapids, used to go about once a year. Trust me, you're not missing out. Cedar Point may as well be my home park

I like to say I have two home parks because my family used to go to MA every year. That tradition slowly faded away and now we go to Cedar Point which is closer

@@toebel How long has Michigan Adventures been around? I grew up in the Grand Rapids area, but haven't lived there in thirty odd years, and don't recall hearing of that.

@@johnmullholand2044 They got their first coaster in '79 but have been around in some form since 1956.

A lot of those Ontario plates at CP are from the Toronto area... tired of the second tier coasters at Canada's Wonderland and SF Darien Lake.

@@racingphotographer8251 this is true. Standing in line for many of these rides I've conversed with many a Maple Leafs or Blue Jays fan about where they were from and the parks they've been to.

@@matthintz9468 These days you're more likely to see them wearing Raptors gear...

Dont forget the Akron canton area

also Fort Wayne, IN. i'm located equally distanced to both CP and KI. i grew up going to KI every year until I was finally tall enough to go to CP and would consider that my homepark now. never been to Holiday world bc it is over 4 and a half hours from me. CP & KI are roughly 2 and a half hour drives

It’s a joke. There was all this talk last year that a new coaster was on the way. All fake news. Good thing there is GA and HP. Both are getting new coasters next year so DP will die on the vine.

It is sad. Especially since Dorney is near Six Flags Great Adventure and Hersheypark, which have expanded beyond expectations. You would think Dorney would follow in their footsteps but nope.

Dorney Park has the oldest Wooden Coaster on the east coast Thunderhawk. The wildwater Kingdom side needed investment the water slide system being replaced was installed in the 80's by the last owner. It needed to be upgraded. The original wave pool was the first of its kind in the east coast.

something exciting from gravity group might be heading your way after this pandemic clears up

So I’ve heard.

XD

Knott’s Berry Farm: Am I a joke to you?

Person Guy yes

Person Guy yes

•Kings Island ~"I like the way you think, Blandy! But it's gonna take a lot more than a suitcase of cash to buy the Krusty Krab from me." ~"Oh, there's a lot more than that. The rest is over there. (Boat full of briefcases)" •Canada's Wonderland ~"I'm crossing over to the _Dark_ Side! (Half of the Krusty Krab is dark)" ~"Why should I waste money lighting the whole store?" •Carowinds ~"What's worker's compensation?" ~"You know, when you get paid for sitting at home!" ~"(Jolts up) You mean, _I_ can get paid while I'm at home?" ~"Yeah; what do you think compensation stands for?" •California's Great America ~"There's just one thing I don't understand." ~"What's that, laddie?" _~"That._ (Two Patricks laughing)" •Kings Dominion ~"I'm done with my shift, Mr. Krabs! And let me just say, there will come a day when I will make _something_ of my life, and I will never have to set foot in this grease trap _again!_ (Audience cheering in the background)" ~"Yeah, we'll see you after your lunch break, Squidward." •Knott's Berry Farm ~"SpongeBob, _why_ is my house filled with photos of your dumb junk!?" ~"Oh, I forgot to tell you. I took so many pictures, I ran out of room in my house." •Dorney Park ~"Ah, what am I worried about? I've got plenty of friends! I can name _three_ right off the bat! Uh... (Draws faces on three fingers) The gang's all here!" •Worlds of Fun ~"What a majestic view!" ~"What view?" ~"Oh, yeah! I forgot about your blindfold. (Removes blindfold; on a hot air balloon) Isn't it beautiful?" _~"Very_ nice..." •Valleyfair ~"Hey, what about me? Can I get fired, too?" ~"I'm afraid not, Squidward! You've got seniority." ~"Oh, yeah..." •Michigan's Adventure ~"Give me a raise, or I'm quitting!" ~"A... raise? Hm. (Scrolls book) That's not in my Hiptionary. Help me get with it, Jack." ~"Stop talking like that!" ~"(Rips off hair) These sideburns aren't real." ~"I _need_ more money in my paycheck at the end of every week; _capiche!?_ (Silence; Mr. Krabs laughs hysterically)" •Gilroy Gardens ~"The _Mitten!_ (Coughs) I mean... The Mitten." ~"That ride's for _babies."_ ~"Yeah. Let's ride it just to see how _babified_ it is!" •Geauga Lake ~"Close Glove World!? Has the world gone _mad!?"_ ~"Well... that depends on your definition."

Thank you! And youre right about Dorney being close to the population center in Jersey as well as Philly, but that actually bolsters my point that Dorney has a pretty decent population center to draw from if they saw it was worth going to

Stamfordbridge, I was thinking the same thing. Very well organized and thought out videos 👍

Knott's has an asterisk next to it as it's open 363 or 364 days per year. Their average attendance per operating day falls behind the two Ohio CF parks

@Quick Caliber Since I live 15 minutes down the freeway from Kings Island, I have a platinum pass and did a driving trip to toronto to visit Wonderland for Yukon Striker, and what got me was in the morning it wasn't very crowded, but around 11:30 - noon, it suddenly got super crowded on a wednesday... I had gotten to ride what I really wanted, so waiting in line at the point wasn't that much of a issue.

Knotts is my home park and I have very good times there small park but a good balance of rides and some rides can be very compact like ghostrider or xcelerator etc.

@Sam I am so true lol

@@rarecheeto790 Knott's was my home park too growing up. It's always been fun, but they have better rides under their belt now then they did when I was a kid. I would like to see them explore expansion options, maybe a parking structure, maybe buy and demolish the buena park mall and expand east, i dunno, but i think acquiring some more space is something they should think about.

Not a bad ideal as World's of Fun was a lot better run, was competitive, and had bigger crowds when the Hunt's owned it....

But not all parks succeed. Elitch Gardens practically died after being released from six flags.

I agree with your comment. Grand Rapids alone has 1.5 million people, but there are likely 3 million people or more within a 2 hour drive from the park, especially cities in southern Michigan, and only 3 or 4 hours to Chicago and Detroit or likely 10 million people. The fact of the matter is that Cedar Fair wants all those people to go to Cedar Point, and not Michigan's Adventure. That's why it doesn't change.

I was going to say this too. Every coaster enthusiast I have met in Detroit considers Cedar Point their home park. It's about the same travel time as coming from Columbus and adds 4.3 million people to the nearby population centers.

Yep I definitely overlooked Detroit, didnt realize how close it was to Sandusky

Yeah, same. If you ask anyone from Detroit what their home park is, they will always say Cedar Point. It's not far at all.

@@AirtimeThrills I’d say that cedar point also serves the metropolitan areas of Toledo and even Fort Wayne

Honestly, if I win the Lottery, definitely would buy that park

I would get rid of grizzly and put a giga in its place. I would put and rmc woodie like joker at sfdk

Yeah, every thing about that park aged like milk

Despite the low contribution to the overal revenue, the park is apparently profitable for the chain so yeah as long as that's the case I'm sure they are content where they are with MA

Thanks Great Reporting

It’s probably because they have a monopoly atleast on that part of Michigan. So the few people that are there have no choice and cedar fair has to do little to no work.

Michigan's Adventure is listed as getting 1.2 million visitors a year. Could double that if Cedar Fair did anything with it.

@@brianmcfeely9038 Since Cedar Fair no longer publicly shares its attendance numbers, I won't give any specific digits, but I worked in a job at a Cedar Fair park that allowed me to see attendance numbers across the chain for the last two decades, and I can tell you with 100% certainty that Michigan's Adventure does not get anywhere near 1.2 million visitors. In fact, Cedar Point Shores alone gets more visitors than Michigan's Adventure in most years. This was true before the pandemic, and it continues to be true today. I can also say that Cedar Point draws a deceptively large number of its guests from the Detroit metro area, and from the company's perspective, expanding Michigan's Adventure would just take business away from Cedar Point, where people are willing to spend more money. As sad as it made me to realize this, parks don't just "earn" a roller coaster by existing for a number of years; it is entirely based off of attendance and profit numbers, and Michigan's Adventure just does not pull in the crowds to justify any substantial investment. Unless later studies reveal that both CP and MA can expand without fighting with each other's markets, CP will always win, and MA will always lose in this regard. At best, they will get relocated coasters and kiddie rides.

Valley fair needs new coasters. I haven't been their since 2007 and I was floored when I found out they still haven't added anything new coasters. The water park is fun and all and it's has other shit todo but it badly needs a brand new coaster.

@@123456789554332 Maybe a B&M wing coaster and some sort of coaster that inverts, from, like, Vekoma or Intamin?

@@hmmyes7807 A Gerstlauer wouldn't be bad either.

let's be honest, it draws in people from Canada, Iowa, Wisconsin and the Dakotas as well - probably more. It's just a shame that those attendance numbers aren't a bit higher - but part of that is due to no new rides; and nobody, I repeat nobody I know wanted them to kill the Log Flume, Hydroblaster, the IMAX theater etc and put in that damn wave pool (and the astonishingly rough texture on the concrete all around it - got bad blisters just walking in that area) where they did. That was really poor planning. If the Flume was getting a wee bit old, tear it down and replace it with a newer model of flume with a higher riders/hour number and problem solved (they never did properly support that ride, despite it being one of the most fun of all for little kids and those too afraid to ride "coasters"). But to tear down that whole section of the park for tanning chairs? D'oh!!! Don't blame Valleyfair for poor attendance, blame whoever forgot we already have 10,000+ lakes and not enough hot days to keep that new monstrosity packed. The old tube rides were a lot of fun, and adding a few more could have been nice, but that whole new area screams of trying to sell overpriced food "brought right to your cabana" that was cold by the time it arrived since they don't even cook it there. Not a good business model, and no surprise the attendance numbers are down.

Facts. He only mentioned Charlotte for Carowinds but he mentioned Baltimore which is a 2 hr drive from KD

yeah man. there are apartments and neighborhoods being built EVERYWHERE. kinda sucks cause it makes the traffice much worse

I think he only mentioned Charlotte because that market is a given for Carowinds. Those to the west could go to Dollywood or those to the south could go to SFoG, while those in the north could go to BGW or KD. I'd say with all their investments there it makes alot of people more willing to drive to Carowinds but they share a 50/50 shot in the outlying markets with the parks mentioned.

Most of the Cedar Fair target population (middle class with disposable income) live to the west and south of the Raleigh-Durham area (Cary, Apex, Holly Springs, Pittsboro, etc.). Additionally driving past Richmond, VA from NC is a pain in the *** (I drive it about once a month). As such, Carowinds has a much more than 50% of the market in that area. Dollywood is closer for western NC, but western NC is sparsely populated, so there isn't much of a market in that area. Having lived in South Carolina, people as far as Charleston also are drawn to Carowinds, given that there really are no other parks of any significance that service South Carolina. With these factors in mind, probably 75% of the population of North Carolina and 85%+ of the population of South Carolina are in the market of Carowinds (about 8 million) would probably look at Carowinds as the closest park. And that doesn't include those from northern GA who would travel to Carowinds rather than going to Six Flags.

Yeah I don't understand why he didn't include the Atlanta Metro area. Sure we have Six Flags but everyone I know in this area makes day trips to Carowinds all of the time. I'm also very confused why he said it was the only major park within a 4 hour drive of Charlotte when both Six Flags Over Georgia and Dollywood take under 4 hours to reach from the metro area...

They're also competing against SF Darien Lake which is 2 hours away.

Agreed, the catchment area for wonderland is more like 8-9million people.

La Ronde is a dump that needs a Major renovation. Its dirty and grungy. Line flows are terrible, and layout sucks

@@racingphotographer8251 yeah but darien lake really isn't up to the standards that canada's wonderland is at.

@@racingphotographer8251 Darien lake sucks its basically a camground with one coaster

Carowinds Phase 1 starting with Fury 2015 thru 2018 was 50M...Phase 2 started with 2019 Copperhead,the new themed area which will be built out & the hotel...another 50M. Cedar Fair is thrilled with Carowinds growth & phase 1 was beyond their initial expected growth goals. Carowinds like Wonderland is in a phased development plan & they will continue investing at these levels as long as they keep meeting or exceeding their ROI goals.

They’ve Used 75% of the land and parking is getting outta control some of that land will have to be used For Parking

As was pointed out in the video, Charlotte is the fastest growing metro area in the country and it’s demographics are young. That is why Cedar Fair is investing so much in it. They would be dumb not to.

@@kevinthompson6986 they have 100 acres of undeveloped land

Building Carowinds up this much is a real thorn in the side of Six Flags over Georgia and Dollywood as well. The most visited National Park in the country is less than half a day from Charlotte as well (Great Smoky Mountains NP). And Asheville and Greenville Spartanburg have been on a huge growth spurt as well. Asheville is a close to halfway between Dollywood and Charlotte and Greenville/Spartanburg is about halfway between Atlanta and Charlotte. That's a lot of market to compete in so the way things are going you have to bring your A game or become irrelevant. And parking decks are going to be the answer to all of these land development/space issues. If you can't spread out you have to go vertical!

😂

Edward Isom Not Funny Didn’t Laugh. MA is my HP.

Dosware Pictures mine is KD and we’re supposed to be a top tier park but they keep removing our coasters and giving us decade gaps between coasters

Edward Isom Mine also used to be KD. Let’s hope they give good things in the future.

Edward Isom yah mine is KD as well I think it kind of stupid how we don’t get many coasters, but whatever hopefully volcano becomes something

Thank you as a Minnesotan valleyfair is it for major theme parks and it's not even that great and I hate it I just wish we could get something here that was actually amazing but sadly that's just the Minnesota way I feel generally bland and uninteresting but harmless

i feel like Valleyfair could have potential as Rochester and Mankato are only 2 hours away. In total those two cities add 500k people. Nearby states like North Dakota and South Dakota have nothing and the many people who get layovers at MSP Airport could spend a day at Valleyfair if there was a big expansion or better advertising. Honestly we need a new expansion in my home park. Im tired of underwhelming flat rides like Delirious. I see potential in Valleyfair but maybe its just me.

@@escminnesota5543 totally agree!

@@escminnesota5543 absolutely right - I can't recall them even bothering to do any advertising besides the Halloween deal in recent years. Also, they have a huge ass parking lot, yet still charge for parking... that in itself reduces their profits, as people don't want to pay for parking right before paying to go inside - there's plenty of space in that lot, so them charging to park there is BS. They assume it's to keep people in the park for lunch, but the reality is it makes casual evening visits less likely to happen. I did have the season pass about 15 years ago, and got the parking pass as well, but even that requires you to pay the first time to get in and buy the pass itself. Astonishingly annoying, and not a good business practice. They really need to push the season pass again, and make it so people can casually go for a few hours in the evening; that summer my buddy and I went at least 30 times - I frequently picked him up from work and if either one of us said "hit Wild Thing a few times?" the other generally agreed, and Cedar Fair got some of our money each time, as who can turn down a nice hot pronto pup? :D

Valleyfair 5 Year Prediction: 2022: Planet Snoopy Expansion (hasn't happened in 11 years) 2023: Funtime Slingshot, Chance Unicoaster 2024: B&M Mini-Dive (Dinosaurs Alive land) 2025: New Show, Zamperla WaterMania 2026: Zamperla Nebulaz, Petting Zoo Michigan's Adventure 5 Year Prediction: 2022: Larson Drop Tower 2023: Zamperla Rockin' Tug (old Big Dipper land) 2024: New restaurant near Thunderhawk, Corkscrew Removal 2025: Gerstlauer Eurofighter (Corkscrew Land) 2026: Front Entrance Improvements, New Petting Zoo Exhibit

Was that copy and pasted from the website?

@@adaml.5355 No, just felt like advertising for them lol. I went last week and once again it was a great time.

Carowinds market is infinitely better than KD's. CF has stated about a year ago in conf call the priority investment parks are Knotts, Cedar Point, Wonderland, Carowinds, and CGA. Cedar Fair has at Cedar Point an analyst day Aug where they stated in a slide presentation "The near term priority will be the tourist market in Southern California." So, one could take that to mean the rumored expansion of Ghost Town at Knotts is even more likely than speculated.

Dorney has a Allentown water subplant o site next to steel force underground were Dinosaurs alive was that's why no major rides can go there can't dig supports. Portable flats can fit on the site.

Agreed.

You also can't go wrong with the intro music. You listening Coaster Fanatics?

That would be way too easy. Magic Mountain and Great Adventure top tier, the rest nowhere.

@@racingphotographer8251Actually Great America and Fiesta Texas seem to get more than Great Adventure.

Alan Trotter very true, great America will be better than great adventure if it keeps getting new coasters every 2 or 3 years

@@markmccormick6628 great america already is better, unless gadvs 2020 coaster is some crazy good coaster.

Oohh looks like we already have some controversy. I definitely would put Great America in the top tier of that list

Ah, the man who thinks anyone who's favorite at Cedar Point is Valravn is GP. What a surprise. Love this channel NOT!

@@Fury325Fan how is valravn good at all?

As I was watching the video I forgot that this was posted a while ago so when I heard this I almost spit my drink out and was like “buddy you sure about that?”😅

That's something I can look into

Airtime Thrills yeah i don’t understand how they were nearly bankrupt a decade ago but SWO and both BG are now on par with CF and SF top tier parks. Quite amazing tbh they played their cards right. I remember rumors of them selling SWO

Airtime Thrills as BGW being my home park I’d absolutely love to see this

would love to see sea world shut down lmao

Brady Andres those were fake rumors stop lol

Ryan Thompson IKR like Cedar Point only has an RMC, Intamin Strata, Intamin Blitz, Intamin Giga, Intamin Impulse, B&M Wing, B&M Floorless, B&M Invert, B&M Dive, Arrow Hyper, and only like 7 other coasters.

Knott funny. My home Park is Michigan’s Adventure, and it’s still very far away.

Dosware Pictures just go to 6 flags great America instead or cedar point, they aren’t that far away

Mark McCormick Still pretty far, I might have to go to a hotel.

@Dosware Pictures I am going to cedar point and it’s 6 hour drive this summer, and I also have to get a hotel

No doubt! I think that for the moment CF has been kind of thinking, if it ain't broke don't fix it. But it's easy enough to slap up a 5 or even 10 story parking deck. The infrastructure cost is minimal compared to building actual rides and buildings. Universal has some impressively sized parking decks in Orlando that work quite well for them.

Haha thank you! I will do one for six flags

I lived in Orange County, and it took me about 1.5 to 2 hours to get to six flags magic mountain, i wouldn't consider it my "local" park.

Mike Connolly Yeah, but why go there when you got SFGA or Hershey Park?

NEONProductions a lot of PA schools have field trips there and PA hosts Music in the Parks there

@@etheralonyx4471 True, well, mostly summer camp groups, as sons schools in the area prefer to go somewhere more expansive, like Hershey

@@etheralonyx4471 some*

NEONProductions yeah when I went to summer camp I went to great adventure and Dorney park

Yeah CF isn't giving small parks that produce little revenue and ebidta much. It's called ROI. They are doing horrible...you might want to look as t their financials. Just reported Great Q2. Compare to SF..the quarter was cramped on by wall street and the stock plummeted after earnings for the 3rd quarter in a row. CF was up 3percent after q2 results. Cf reported great numbers and organic growth were the something SF can't do and are trying to cover it by adding more parks on leases and wall street isn't buying it no matter how much JRA tries to spin it.

The way the US measures metro areas are much more liberal than Canadian measurements. For example the Greater Golden horseshoe area is equivalent in area to the Chicagoland and Washington-Baltimore area and is more populated and should be listed as 2nd on the cedar fairs market list. The other difference is that the Toronto area is rapidly growing unlike most of the US metros in colder climates, which is probably why CF has been investing so heavily into Wonderland.

I live in Canada and I'd like to see Worlds of Fun just because it's themed to _Around the World in 80 Days_ and I think that's neat. Cedar Fair really should get more serious about promoting and developing its theme parks rather than letting Knott's be the only one in the chain that gets any love.

I’m close to Detroit but I went to Michigan’s Adventure for YEARS before I ever went to Cedar Point. I’m a huge adrenaline junky so of course I wanted to go to Cedar Point, but my family all hate thrill rides, so we never went. I’ve only ever been to Cedar Point 3 times, once with my best friends family, and twice for a school trip. I’ve been to Michigan’s Adventure more times than I can count, and I have so much nostalgia from it. I know it sucks but I can’t bring myself to hate it!

I remember the Haunted Shack, I had completely forgotten about that. I'm too young to really remember the park pre-CF (I started going in the late 90s) but I did appreciate the things they did for the park right after the purchase (though Ghostrider was already in the works under prior ownership)

You know what knott’s really needs? A BrainRush reboot, and on a network that fits.

Knott's was my home park growing up. Windjammer sucked, and i still miss to this day the Soapbox Racers. I feel like the park fumbled around for a while, but once they built Silver bullet I feel like the park was beginning to find it's footing and at the moment i think it's on a pretty good trajectory namely because the replaced that bumpy Boomerang with Hangtime. Honestly though, they should bring back the sky jump, it was fun to watch inside and outside of the park, also effing terrifying.

🤣

Under your system CW clearly belongs in the "could go other way" tier. It is clearly not a "have" park in a league with CP, Cwinds, or KI. It's the weakest link among those 4.

I’m offended at this stuff. Michigan’s Adventure is my home park and it’s still pretty far.

@@racingphotographer8251 given their massive additions on the 3-5 year timetable, I dont see why this park is 2nd tier. Just because Cedar Fair didnt start with much doesnt diminish what theyve added recently

@@AirtimeThrills KI and Cwinds both got puked on by Paramount. Unfortunately, unlike those two, CW still looks like a Paramount park today.

B&M Hyper 2021 :D, oh and give GoldStriker some retracting work if it's truly starting to get rough.

This aged really bad. :(

I wish they would remove the garbage coasters in Wonder Mountain at CW (Thunder Run and Guardian) and put an RMC dark ride in there. Think Disney's Space Mountain on steroids.

Yeah

For real, everything doesn't have to be a spinning flat ride or a coaster.

@@adventuresinthemeparks6683 the "Have Not" parks like Wonderland get filled up with spinning flat rides. The "haves" like Cedar Point get all the giga coasters.

Knotts has a few dark rides already (Bear-y Tales, Calico Mine Train, Timber Mountain Log Ride), probably to create some synergy with nearby Disneyland, which is almost nothing but dark rides.

Please tell me the water park your talking about isn't shitterbomb? Hahaha nobody goes there it doesn't effect oceans of funs attendance at all

@@TheNTMG Yeah that is the case now after the slide incident but when it first opened it was super popular.

Daniel Peppa-Pig Powers Wouldn't CP be worth the extra distance? It's a several-hour-long drive for the flagship park of CF and the so-called "coaster capital of the world", vs 2 hours or less for what is the worst CF park in every way, according to this video.

@@aggroknight4259 well, CP isn't so family friendly, and it's a *lot* more expensive. Mich Ad is trash, yes, but it's dominated by several family coasters and a surprisingly REALLY good water park. the waterpark is honestly what sells the park.

At least you got 5 rides, thats 1 more than Ive gotten on LRod

I had a similar experience about a month ago with Outlaw Run. I rode it five times. It was closed almost all day. It rained 3 hours, but stopped enough for the last 30 minutes.

Iron Rattler Fanboy I thought you'd be riding Iron Rattler! :)

Connor Conant aka the only RMC that was closed during my visit to a park