Dead things living in snow, but cannot handle water, somehow managed to dive into a lake to put on the chains... no they must have just conveniently been there
They were definitely stuck in the middle of white walkers for at least 12 hours because you can see it became night and they started fighting them during daytime. So it's not hard to imagine they were there almost 24 hours
If you saw me one day in the morning & then saw me one day at night, are we to assume it's the same day? What makes you think it's not a few days or 36 hours? Thorin died the next morning, which is already longer then 12 hours. They don't show that The Hound threw the rock immediately afterwards. They cut away, it could be the next day, when he threw the rock. There is no clock anywhere. We are all assuming it's the same day.
my theory is that the night king is also a greenseer and knew dany was coming - and he waited for her so he could get one of the dragons. he needed the dragon. @@Angivel
My guess is that it took 12-18 hours from the time Gendry left to when Dany arrived with the dragons. Can't believe I was bored enough to try to reason this one out but here I am. lol As far as the distance and time I assume Gendry was running for 6-8 hours max to get back to the wall. 1 more hour for them to retrieve Gendry, write the note, and then send the raven. 2-4 hours for the raven to fly to Dany if she is within 200 miles as ravens can fly up to 50 mph. 1 hour to get the ravens note, communicate it to Dany and prepare to leave. Then roughly 2-4 hours (assuming ravens and dragons fly at the same speed) for Dany to fly north and help. Low end 12 hours, high end 18 hours.
From what I saw, Dany reached out to Jon first to get on the dragon but he pulled his hand back to let the others get on before him while he fought off the wights. Looked like he got so caught up in fighting them that once he realized then it was too late, they killed a dragon and then told them to leave before another dragon or they all lost their lives. He basically fell on his sword. And plus he literally is obsessed with stopping the army of the dead.
There is a lot of time lapse in the later seasons, so when it cuts to another scene, it doesn’t mean it was a few minutes later. She is basically flying on a 747, so it isn’t so impossible for her to get there quickly. It is a flight instead of walking.
I understand that. I don't doubt the dragon can fly fast. It's Gendry and the raven I'm doubting. On the map Dragonstone is almost 2000 miles away from Eastwatch. That's a lot of miles for a raven to travel in a day. And the writing is just poor in this episode and these last two seasons. The decisions characters choose to make don't seem to be in-character. Everything is just starting to feel rushed and so things that I may brush off before become more glaring issues. - Cam
@@ChannelSee1 that’s fine if you feel that way, obviously everyone can have their own opinions. I really liked the whole story, though I do think 9 seasons would have been ideal (but then again, the pandemic would have hindered that last season tremendously, so maybe it was better this way). I know the pace of the last couple of seasons really bothers a lot of people, and I do get that it feels quite different, as some episodes span a lot more time than they used to. When I rewatched the whole show again, I knew what to expect and was way more comfortable with the progression of the series, but that isn’t going to be the case for everyone. What happens in 5 minutes can cover days or weeks, which is a strange adjustment. As for the “out of character” stuff, I always saw the story as unconventional, especially when it comes to the characters. The “good guys” make some bad calls, and the “bad guys” do some good. So I think the usual “in character” progressions were never meant to occur here, and I found the characters even more “gray” in the source material. Anyway, those are just my thoughts, but I do respect that others feel differently. Thanks for responding! Have a nice day
The only defence I have for Jon snow is that, as you said, he'd feel invincible with the dragons there, he had no reason to think the white walkers could touch one of her dragons, so he might as well kill as many white walkers as possible while he had the dragons backing him
Only reason I can rationalize Jon staying behind and fighting is because everyone was telling him he was brought back for a reason. Maybe he thought that moment was his reason
The dragons don't even fly over the wall because of the Walkers and the magic, the dragons fear beyond the wall, seeing Drogon and Rhaegal fly over is so badly done. Queen Alyssane when she went to the wall her dragon Silverwing was afraid to fly over the wall, the same thing happened to Vermax the dragon of Jacaerys Velaryon, Rhaenyra's eldest son. The dragons fear beyond the wall and so is the cold.
I can give Dany a pass on that one b/c she's demonstrated being the only one immune to fire (Targaryens died by fire in the books and even Dany lost her hair), and her magic hatched three dragons after hundreds of years. So perhaps it was Dany's magic that let them pass the Wall...and promptly get hit with a fucking spear.
The last Wight didn't collapse when that zombie squad's WhiteWalker commander was killed because he wasn't turned by that White Walker. Some other commander raised him from the dead so he wasn't affected like the other Wights when that boss got wiped out. Also, you can tell by the change in the lighting while Jon's group is sleeping on that rock overnight that plenty of time has passed since they got stuck there. Yes, I agree, the last two seasons are too rushed for my likings as well, but many of the issues can be explained by paying more attention to details. Cheers 😉
It's best to just go with it instead of really thinking about some stuff they do. Like how did he just lift his hands up and turned all the dead people into white walkers at hardhome but this episode he couldn't just list his hands and raise the dragon? Like where the chains come from and who swam down and hooked them to the dragon under ice? 🫣If they can swim down then how come they didn't just swim across instead of waiting for the water to freeze again? See. U just gotta go with it and not think about it lol
I've never really thought about just how close Nightking was to the characters - so why the fuck didn't he throw his First spear at Drogon, Literally the Biggest, closest and only Stationary target. If he did they Most likely would have gotten all the characters as well.
Every film/tv series establishes it's own logic and set of rules. This episode broke rules that the show was consistently following for the previous 6 seasons.
You think you ate with that comment, eh? It just shows how dumb this is. The show breaks its own internal rules and conceits. Having Dragons in a show does not give it a free pass to be stupid, illogical and unrealistic especially when realism is the show’s whole conceit. khal drogo died of a wound infection. 🙄
1 thing I didn't like about the last 2 season's is that the episodes felt RUSHED BUT, I'm assuming the creators were on a time frame & certain budget so they had to work around that. Still loved this show tho. 🐉🐉🔥🔥🔥
We know George hasn’t completed the novel yet. Which makes it hard for any writer to finish someone else’s work and give it %100 justice. And with such show it’s hard to please everyone. I’m just mentioning these to say that they did great about season 6 and even season 7 was so good! of course it’s not as good as the previous 5 seasons, but the story was very complicated! too many characters with different stories for each!! I think even George got tired of finishing the books. I think instead of complaining about how the show could’ve been better, you can just enjoy watching the last season of the best TV Show ever 😊
Why do you D&D simps not quit complaining and let people speak their opinions about the show? Pointing out the problems isn’t the problem, pretending it was perfect is
I can agree with this. The reason why I have complains is that they rushed things when both HBO and GRRM suggested taking a minimum of 10 seasons. They were burnt out, I get it but to me they lost some of the magic towards the end. I would have appreciated at least the last two seasons being both full 10 episode seasons. - Cam
The show wanted a white walker dragon so they were willing to have Jon act like an idiot and completely at odds with his own win condition in order to get it instead of actually taking their time and fleshing out the turn
It's the dumbest episode of GOT. You're right about the time to get Danny back to save them. Also where'd the huge chains come from and who went underwater to attach it to the dragon. And why didn't they ride horses going up there? Why did they have to walk there? 🤦
Nah, I'm still waiting on the 400 Wildlings to show up at Castle Black after Mance sent them to climb a nearby deserted stretch after he discovered how weak the defenses at Castle Black was. Why are they discovering Wooly Mammath parts all the time now if they have been extinct for thousands of years? You have a hard time to conjure up that ships use anchors, that use thick chains, where ships may have been stuck in the ice during a deep freeze & are now discovered after a thaw? Remember Hardhome genius? How did the ships stay put in the middle of the ocean for the row boats to arrive? How many Wildlings did you see on horseback in the show? Maybe because horses couldn't survive the bitter cold? Funny, in dozens of movies or shows, we see someone drag something on the bottom of the water & bring up something by surprise. I seem to remember that the dragon had horns. Winter is coming, but not for you, you have no imagination, your brains is in a deep freeze from the previous frost. Stop over-analyzing stuff to make yourself a big hero with your fellow book readers. There was plenty of dumb stuff to go around in the early seasons, few wanted to critique it, because those who critique, are almost all George fans, who gave him a pass for the illogical things he put together.
there’s some people who use too much logic sometimes in watching shows and i’m one of them. but i absolutely loved this show so the last two seasons i just had to choose to abandon logic so that i wouldn’t let it ruin the show for me. even season 8 i’m just like yeh it could’ve been way better but fuck it…. lol butt fuck 😂
U reli dont know Arya if u think she'd choose Sansa over her favourite beloved Jon. She'd always protect her family especially him regardless of his choices, she knows Jon is a honourable soul like her Dad.
With all the information you have up to this point, he’d be her nephew not cousin. We know Rhaegar ‘took’ Lyanna which means Jon is Dany’s brother’s son
That scene with Jon is just poorly done, he needed to make them some time to mount a dragon, because the dead were all over them at that time, and it looked like he did for some crazy fighting stunt.
After season 7 y’all should just enjoy it and not try to make logic of the story 😭😂 that’s the best way to enjoy the last 2 season well atleast season 7 , season 8 there’s no saving it
As much as people hate on a lot of season 8, this to me is easily the most nonsensical episode in the show and worse than anything that comes later. Why did one of the wights stay alive? How could Gendry run to the wall that fast? How could a raven get to Dragonstone that fast? How did she get up there that fast? Why did Jon keep fighting like an idiot? Why didn’t Benjen just get on the horse? How did Jon know to call her “Dany” if he had never heard anyone call her that? Where did the chains come from?
Agreed, it was the moment i started to understand what to expect for the rest of the show... well really, Jaime & Bronn surviving 7x4 did, but yeah this just whacked you over the head with it.
Chains and Benjen issue doesnt make sense, everything else was explained. One stayed alive because that white walker is not the one who turned him. Ravens do fly fast, a trained raven's top recorded speed is around 48mph so they do be flying. And she got up there because dragons are literally the fastest creatures they know at the time. Its not like nothing happened or it was a slip in script when he called her 'Dany'. She was also surprised and acknowledged that it was unusual. it was also done so they could shoehorn in the line that actually matters: "How about 'my queen'?" It gave Jon an opportunity to establish familiarity rooted in attraction. It gave Daenerys the opportunity to deny the nickname by sharing a personal anecdote about one of the weakest moments of her life, while also accepting the attraction. And then, it gave Jon the opportunity to show a desire to be compassionate and pledge his loyalty.
You guys keep saying she got there so fast, but you missed the part where the guys were literally out there for a full day. they slept through the entire night and had enough time for the water to freeze back over. it was HOURS which is why she could get the message and get there in time.
1)Gents... regarding Arya and Sansa, you seem to be forgetting that Bran is home, and what his power is. The girls have access to his power to see the past and what has happened so far. 2)Regarding how long Jon and crew were on the rock island makes no difference, the Night King was not going to attack them until Dany brought her dragons. I think that was the whole point of surrounding the island. One night or a week, it makes no difference, so why show the time lapse. Benjin said the wall has spells woven into it, that keep Wights and the undead from passing, so the Night King needs the dragon to get around the wall. He can always start a new undead army when he lands on the other side.
Look at a map of Westeros. It’s not a time jump it’s flight by a dragon. It’s not that far, takes 45 mins to drive down the pch in Santa Monica to Oxnard. Probably takes mins by air
The army if the dead not overwhelming them was planned by the night king imo…if they overwhelmed them and killed everyone, the night king wouldn’t get his dead dragon
Of course Jon didn't get on Drogon! He defends people, he saves people; he doesn't jump the line when others are waiting. So instead, Jon Snow was providing defense while everyone else was getting on the dragon; and then what Beric said about the Night King was in his head and he was thinking about trying to take him out. Benjen knew to arrive because he was alerted by the Three-eyed Raven (Bran) that his Starkgaryen nephew needed rescuing because PWWP. I'm pretty sure Benjen was read in by Ned early on, which is why he went to the NW (to prepare the way for Jon, who would be beyond the reach of the powers of the realm). Otherwise, when Brandon died and Ned became the Lord, then Benjen should have graduated to lieutenant/holdfast status. At least, since Uncle Benjen is already undead , with dragonglass in the heart, he can't be turned into a zombie Wight.
he just ran that whole way, tf you want him to do? he's tired lol. yelling at them that they're stupid, but in the moment you don't know what to do. i'd be running anywhere i can go too. i mean dany got their first so idk the problem.
This is entertainment people. Everybody believes that a dragon can come alive from hardened eggs, can breath fire, a girl can walk through fire, Jon can come back to life, a guy can flick his sword & it's on fire, a man can revive a guy & turn him into the Frankenstein monster, but you have a hard time to think that a bird & a dragon can fly back & forth. I don't remember seeing a stopwatch on in the episode. At no time did we know if it was days or a day that they were on that rock. Remember in the pilot episode when King Robert said that it took him one month to travel to Winterfell? How is it in half an episode King Robert & Ned were talking outside of Winterfell about his bastard's mama & in the very next episode they are already in Kings Landing? Birds & Dragons move much faster then a whole crew on horseback. My point is, just chill out & be entertained, stop over-analyzing stuff. This was a great episode.
I think the idea with Jon not getting on the dragon, personally I tell myself that whole time they were trying to get themselves and their prisoner on the dragon so no one would fall off when they take off type thing. Only somewhat logical conclusion I could come up with for myself lol
Agree completely. It broke my heart to see his sorrow after the came back to life but it honestly made sense and if Jon snow was lowkey longing for deletion again it would make this episode make more sense
