How Formula 1 Pistons Are Made (I went to the factory) 

Right? The tooling these guys have access to is incredible! I guess that's what happens when you have F1 money backing you. 😄

It's not that big of a deal really. Eccentric turning make things like this pretty easy actually.

Haha. Any old shitty lathe can turn excentrically, just make sure it ain't level and backlash will do the rest....

Controlling the ovality however , that is another concept entirely.

I'm betting the tour and the talking points were written by marketeers, not engineers. And the person saying the story was told this is what to say if you want to keep your cuhsy job.

Mahle has my respect too- I've built street bottom ends with their pistons that went for 300K miles

Funny that, Mahle have a building next door to Cosworth and Mugen Honda is or was around the corner.

I always loved that my 740 Volvo used Mahle filters and I think pistons.. we were religious about those filters. One day I’ll build back my resto mod 740 that is nice to travel and eats roads. So much space to make your own subframe,motor mounts and even for a AWD system.

The 919 evo by Porsche is an example of an entire car built on that logic

all that is needed is a fat wallet

Simple task eh, did you watch the video properly? 😂😂

And just look to GM to see bean counting at its best.

100% agree

Yup. What you did last year wont help you this year in F1.

Definitely. It’s amazing.

The engineering is exciting ,but the actual racing is yawn 🥱

Yeah. I look forward to when they can start upgrading their engines again. Would wish teams had a. It more leeway in the aero though so we could see some more variation

From what I understood from a cosworth documentary from the 80s, is that Cosworth resisted using a turbo for as long as possible.

@@paulmichaelfreedman8334 For a road racing engine staying NA makes a lot of sense as the throttle response will normally allow the driver to make better use of traction while cornering. For maximum power of course the turbo engine is going to be able to make more...but lowest lap times are the goal and more power often doesn't translate into lower times. When the Penske Team first got their 917/30's driver Mark Donahue complained that the throttle response was non-existent which made them very difficult to drive. Porsche engineers scoffed at them saying 'It's a racing engine and we don't worry about part throttle power'. Penske then made their own spool valves for the FI system which would allow good control all through the throttle range and even though they made less maximum power...they allowed Donahue to drive it much faster. On the Porsche test track when the modified spool valves were tested, over the Porsche engineers objections, Donahue cut several seconds from the cars lap record which proved the point that drive-ability means more than absolute maximum power.

Here's one for you, of the two types of performance pistons it's generally accepted that forged, like you see here, is stronger than Hypereutectic. However when Kawasaki designed and developed that silly fast turbocharged H2R they released about 7 or 8 years ago (if it was longer than that please don't remind me, I don't need to feel any older than I am) they went with Hypereutectic instead of forged pistons. They found during development of it that forged is indeed stronger than Hypereutectic, until you start getting into the ridiculous combustion chamber temperatures that go along with turbocharging a racing engine, seems that at those temperatures forged pistons start losing their strength wherein Hypereutectic one's dont.

Erm, try putting up a video on how to prevent people from kidnapping ones kids and see how quickly it gets banned by RU-vid. I know from experience, as that's exactly what RU-vid did, and they wouldn't listen yo any appeals. Tells you who they are.

Yep. And that is critical

Are we watching the same video? Its alot of talk from Mansel without him saying very much

Servus ich bin aus Bayern, braucht ihr eventuell meister aus dem bereich mechatronik? 😂

It's amazing that they last longer than a minute.

Well crap! I feel ancient at 63! Just kidding, you do whatever you want to at whatever age as I’m doing exactly that at 63. Good luck to you my friend.

At 59 now, I know I would never have qualified for a job at Cosworth, although I could quite happily sweep the workshop floors should they have a vacancy for that position. 😉

Identify and Follow your passion. Money will follow on. Never chase money.

43 isn't old, 63 is.

A DMU 50 On your first job is pretty cool 👍

You are one lucky dog! Darn!

I saw the name on the Porsche 919 hybrid and had to Google it 😊😊😊😊

Banning beryllium was so incredibly stupid. Thanks ferarri...

Except the fia hates innovation

Aluminum MMC is a fascinating material, it’s a shame it’s so dam expensive to use.

Yes. And that is critical

So we are still looking for a better "alloy", but not "too exotic".? A quick glance at the periodic table tells us we have only Ceramics left, but thats a good thing..

That’s a critical part

that's crucially needed if you have to work with Siemens software

​@@Gizfreek I was happy working in NX until they made us go to Teamcenter

@@Gizfreek siemens makes me want to jump out of my window sometimes

This is why the JWST primary mirror is beryllium with gold coating. But expensive and extremely toxic

there is some use of allite super magnesium in F1 engines and transmissions

​@@asicdathensmore expensive than my ex-wife. more toxic than my mother-in-law

1) Active cooling is of course used in F1 engines, it is called an 'oil gallery'. It sprays the pistons with oil from below. Also common in high power cars. 2) As far as I remember, AlLi has limited hot strength, thus the nr. 1 alloy is still AA2618 or derived from it (average piston crown temp can be >250 or 300°C, derived from softening curves). And also, the price is of concern, believe it or not. Today, there is a tendency to go back to steels and use a design more like the pistons shown here. The pressures are getting ever higher year by year. An Al piston must be very tall in a turbo engine. 3) The piston weight is not the most important parameter. The piston pin is WAY more important, it is the single most important part, because as a connecting element, it affects both piston and conrod. And as long these are made of steels.... 4) It has become of lesser interest to reduce piston weight, because modern F1 engines don't rev very high anyway (forces are ~ m.r.omega²). 5) Al and Be, of course mix very well indeed. Just look at a phase diagram, not a single ordered phase in it! Perhaps you had some foreign element? 6) In fact, the pistons Mika Hakkinen won his two titles with were made from Albemet. A birdie told me they had Be detectors at the factory, and any dry process was strictly prohibited. Ferrari thus protested and since then Be is banned above a certain w%. But it is still used as alloying element. Where? I wont tell. 🙂And also you probably wear a belt buckle containing Be.

@@emefff Good Info. Thanks

My old moped tuning kit had 2 piston rings... I swear the commenters (and presenter) are making this out to be much more complicated than it really is - as if some F1 circlejerk is taking place.

Not to forget the small production volume and strict quality control that would be uneconomical at mass production level.

Most military items are much larger and more mass produced, even the typhoon may reach 750. Where as f1 only need a handful of engines/chassis of each design. Also there is less risk of tolerance where human flight is involved. But if you see the production process of the latest military jet engines you will see some things even f1 doesn't get involved with. There are many technologies that have filtered down from military/aircraft world into f1 such as carbon composites.

Yes, you're right. The pneumatic valve springs of the old V10 F1 engines used aluminium "discs" carrying a rubber seal, that acted very much like a piston. The air pressures were not trivial either, and those skinny aluminium discs deflected enough to see with the naked eye. They also acted as an upper valve guide - the tolerance to the pnuematic cylinder providing radial location for the top of the valve stem. And the inertia loads were just as high - the valve head movement often followed the piston crown as closely as possible for maximum opening, so they had similar peak accelerations and velocities. Temperatures were not quite as fierce, though, giving some respite.

That’s one thing I’ve never seen explained to my satisfaction is pneumatic valve springs. As an auto technician for 25 years I understand engines pretty well. I still have many questions about how those work. Fascinating!

The Race F1 tech show explained them well. Great insight into pros and cons ​@scottsmith4315

Mee too👍 I need some for my V12 supercar build 😆

You can have whatever you like, if you got the money.

You can't buy my love though😂😂😂​@@bomberaustychunksbruv4119

Yamaha from 07-14

In this case, very tiny pistons and low reciprocating mass! 😋

​@Nismo11 Which is all totally scalable of course. The question is not only the mass, but the _number_ of pistons. A 500cc Twin, in V8 format is a 2000cc engine. Potentially same pistons, very similar stresses, etc. Watching videos about oil development for F1 engines, engine developers (and specifically Cosworth), supply Castrol, Mobil, etc. with V Twin "motorcycle" style test engines for oil trials (and therefore not supply any _secret tech_ to the oil companies).

It's a small engine, really small engines have gone a lot faster

Pneumatic valve spring!

The conrod and gudeon pin (wrist pin) do a good job of keeping the piston aligned. Only the rotation about the wrist pin provides and freedom to jam. That's where the oval machining of the skirt comes in. Slightly vulnerable when cold, a hot piston gains the thermal expansion to adopt a "perfect fit". Furthermore, inertia loads and combustion pressures are vertical forces on the piston, that react against an angled conrod to produce a lateral force that literally pushes the piston against the liner. It doesn't take much skirt area to both provide a stable platform, and resist the lateral load with the oil film splashed onto the liner. That oil film fills the gap such that the piston does not really have room to move. But get the ovality wrong, and you risk "pickup" - metal to metal contact between liner and piston, that usually results in metal transfer and a rapid piston failure after that. Years and decades of experience with what shapes work, is the main database benefit Cosworth has in machining these pistons. This introduces a tradeoff, though. Reducing the skirt height makes it more difficult for the skirt to generate the torque that keeps the piston aligned, requiring thicker (stiffer and stronger) webs and beams that connect the skirt to the pin bore. Over the years, it has been realised that height matters more, resulting in a modern trend of very narrow, but relatively tall, skirt geometry. Like, almost a square rubbing patch on each side, with the rest of the "cylindrical" part being purely there to carry the ringpack. Which, those in the know will know, is only 2 rings for an F1 engine, not the 3 rings of most road car engines. One failure possibility is that IF the gudgeon pin becomes "sticky" (either through poor dimensions, heat, or lack of oil) then the torque applied at the pin bore can be enough to wrench the piston around, crushing the skirt support webs (and failing the engine instantly). Been there, seen it happen... but it is a rare failure.

The thumbnail pic is deceiving, it makes it look like there's no skirt

The two phrases where one: close enough for government work. And two: I can't see it from my house.

@@phukfone8428 1 more phrase...."It ain't going to Indy."

Yarp.

Or conversely the longer the stroke the faster the piston speed and acceleration

Sure buy your going to sacrifice a lot of hp/L and eficiency

The NA V8's lasted like maybe 500 miles. And that was because of the 18k rpm regulation that strangled power. They would've been much worse if they were allowed to rev out.

I'm not so sure. The margins are so thin in F1 today, even if they had an engine that reliable, they'd immediately find a way to eke out a few extra tenths at the expense of that reliability.

Moved away from NA due to global idealism, F1 is a large spectacle and if they can perform well with hybrid engines, your daily driver can too! I personally think modern F1 is choked by some of the regulations, unlike its earlier days but that’s just me. I understand why they have made some choices that they have but, I love F1 for the innovation side. We don’t really hear much about that anymore aside from top side aero.

@@codyfrance2537 bro they turbo easily drop the compression ratio and they have more power smh turbos don't even rev to 11k during racing.......it's about the engineering any man can put Force induction n a car but who can get take a plain engine and get most from it????? That the beauty in this sport

Mahle have a building next door to Cosworth's in Northampton so I would put money they are made here.

Also; they made V8s and had a V6 prototype

And the highest load on the pin isn't from combustion, it's from the transition at TDC from exhaust intake stroke.

Think they eliminate the requirement for timing chain or cam belt changes.

Clickbait for you to follow this channel for as long as possible😂

I dont think it will ever happen, just to much money needed

Given that downforce to generate 3 to 5 g is easily done, it is trivial to design a car that will stick to the roof of a tunnel once travelling at sufficient speed. It would thus seem as though this "challenge" is thus trivial. However, perhaps the difficult part is transitioning from the right way up on the ground, to climbing the wall and getting onto the roof. I believe the tunnel barrel roll in The Italian Job was camera trickery, and not actually real in any way. Although, with enough momentum, a "loop the loop" using centrifugal forces to keep the vehicle pinned to the inverted surfaces for a moment is technically quite possible. Much like the old "Wall of Death" motorcycle stunts, where centrifugal forces kept the bike pinned to a vertical cylindrical wall.

@@garagecedric thats what i thought as well but the last time i looked they had already invested alot of money into it or so they said. i just wanna know whats going on with it.

Not just cost, but they probably underestimated the logistical nightmare of building and taking down the upside down track structure, also doubt anyone would insure them. I mean it is cost in the end but I bet their estimates were off by a factor of 10 when it started involving a construction project.

Needle bearings = weight (bad for inertia loads). Likewise hardened inserts = steel = much heavier than aluminium. DLC and oil films are lighter and slippier. Lawnmowers = "as cheap as possible". Believe me, I saw the brief from a manufacturer on that. So, minimal machining of the casting, and no forging. Internal voids tend to be squeezed shut during forging, and peak stresses of any structure are ALWAYS at the surface (excepting some unusual internal cooling channels where thermal stresses can develop around small holes - which is still an exposed surface!). With pistons, it's what's on the surface that matters. Particularly when lots of post-forging machining can cut away enough material to expose those internal voids, resulting in a surface crack. It is also not impossible that enough residual stress is put into the part through forging plus "poor" heat treatment - quenching in particular can deliver strange stress distributions - that the machining again removes surface material in compression leaving the tensile stresses inside sufficient to crack the "new" surface. Lastly, if a casting and forging process has a tendency to produce internal voids, that gets developed out before that new process is accepted into routine production. The likelihood of there being internal voids is thus so low, that checking every piston for them would be prohibitively costly, and technically unnecessary. On the other hand, I was watching a lot of the QA processes here, and thinking "AI could do that 24/7..." Which could include X-Ray inspection. Sorry to say it, but automating much of the checking and inspection and testing is one of the likely applications of AI in the looming future.

It's not as reliable as your lawnmower either.

It’s so the Southerners can understand a Northern accent

Correct

@@BrokeWrench red line on tack is there for a reason..