How God Transforms Suffering - Fr. Dave Pivonka at the Napa Institute 2022 Summer Conference 

I refer to the healing of the man born blind. Christ is asked, "Who sinned, his mother or father, that this happened to him." Christ responds with, "It was not that this man sinned, or his parents, but that the works of God might be displayed in him." It is so that the work of God would be displayed in his life.

My good and gentle Jesus, help me to always cling to your cross and suffer bravely for love of you. 🕊

Bitterness is SO difficult to overcome cuz it gives you a false sense of security. As long as that shell over your heart is there you won’t get hurt again.

"The Lord gives, the Lord takes away. Blessed be the name of the Lord" - Job, sufferer extraordinaire

My father lived with ALS for 3 years. His voice only left him near the end. Before he died, he begged me to go to church. I hadn't gone in a while. He spoke to me about it with urgency. He knew something more than I knew.

May we pray for Jordans conversion! Have a blessed day brothers and sisters!

How do we deal with suffering? After grieving for the loss of my first born lovely , 35 year old son, ( killed in a head on crash by a drunk driver at 9:30 in the morning, I said to God.. what am I supposed to learn from this? Eventually I came to understand that because of the Lord's death and Resurrection, I could rely on his promise that some day I will see my son again. You might say I gave my grief to my Lord, and he sustains me with that supernatural virtue of hope. He is my example, having encountered grief over lost loved ones, thinking even of the contemporary John, the Baptist, and probably others. He carried on loving humanity, proclaiming the kingdom of God, healing, teaching, restoring fallen men and women. I thank God that at the time of our tragedy, I knew who to turn to. As the Scripture says, we grieve, but not as those who have no hope. I pray for those who do not believe, etc.....

Let us pray for this man to come to know Jesus and the one true Church he founded!

Chronic suffering, at least for a man, is very humbling. Jesus is humble. Chronic suffering can bring us closer to understanding our humble savior. That becomes strengthening. Then we can more often go to Him in prayer. And our prayers can take on more life in them. And our closeness to the Father and the Holy Spirit will grow. We find that we “have their ear,” so to speak. Then we can be stronger in our pain and fear it less. Then we can begin to “offer it up” for others. Then our suffering begins to have real purpose. Then it no longer seems useless. That’s when we begin to understand the biblical instructions to “count it all joy,” as in the gospel of James. But it’s still a painful affliction, and it is normal to ask for healing. But then if we aren’t healed, and since our trust in God is now strong, we know He is using it for good. And we can be at peace about it.

I'm always amazed about how Dr. Peterson's ability to put on the ground very complex topics.

Incredible dialogue. The path to less suffering is going thru your suffering and finding your faith thru the journey. As someone who suffers with kidney and liver disease I find that allowing God to transform me with it is the only way.

The most difficult part of the terribleness is that we have to maintain a higher level and forgive. When we know that God is Love, we don’t need to question why? The higher virtues: Faith Hope and Love!

What I found astonishing when I first started to study the Bible was the fact that we weren’t ever supposed to suffer or even die but once God, through Jesus, brings an end to Satan’s rule over this earth mankind will then return to the initial state that we were created in …. Pure Love 🥰 Since the expulsion from Eden we’ve been very much in the grip of something malevolent …. It’s no wonder the planet and it’s inhabitants are in such a terrible state 😬😢 Revelation 21:4 AMP … and He will wipe away every tear from their eyes; and there will no longer be death; there will no longer be sorrow and anguish, or crying, or pain; for the former order of things has passed away.”

it is so good to see the grappling with the questions around suffering, God bless us each and everyone,,,,,,

Very interesting conversation! Would love to see more.

This is very powerful. Will more be shared?

I hope to live long enough to witness JP’s, full initiation into the Catholic Church!

There would be no point in accepting one’s cross, being falsely accused and tortured to death, unless Jesus forgives one’s mortal sins which justly condemn one to eternal perdition.

Thank you for your words. They were very encouraging and transforming. Awesome conversation about suffering! Thanks God Bless!

The mystery of suffering, exemplified by Brendan Kelley born with downs, became sick with leukemia at four. As told by Austin Ruse. Tears on every page not only in sadness but joy for his love of the Eucharist and Jesus. A must read. 2000 people came to his funeral all touched by him.

A lot of things have been broken in my life. As I keep surrendering to it, I find the hole that it carved in my soul, inevitably gets filled with God and with love. I’m not sure that it can all be rational. When you fall, you find yourself unexpectedly caught by Grace.

I hope the thousands that follow Jordan will soon follow Jesus. Come Lord with your healing 🙏 ❤

I had experienced consolations during times of suffering that gave peace. My 5 yr old son had a vision of purgatory and JESUS pulling my brother up to Heaven.. I believe him!

Exactly! Suffering can heal the sufferer's soul.

In order to transform your suffering to merit for souls or Yourself,you have to be in a state of grace

Honestly, I don't think Jordan Peterson is really in any position to make any authorization Theological claims at this point if he denies the actual Deity of Christ, His incarnation, death, and Resurrection in a literal historical sense.

Saint Theresa sed to Jesus: I understand way you do not have a lot of friends! it is a fine humor but also a deep truth!

Where is full talk?

The problem with highly intelligent people is that they don’t realize what others are going through, it is easy to solve tough problems with beautiful sophisticated language.

The ultimate meaning and purpose of our earthly lives is to reconcile with God. All the suffering in my life has lead me to reconciliation. To know the feeling of human heartbreak does not even come close to understanding God's heartbreak over his children turning our backs on him. God lifted my bitterness when I turned my face towards Him, the Sun/Son and now my personal suffering is eclipsed by remembering how many years I was away from home, how much harder I made it for myself. Glory to God for welcoming us home through Jesus.

My takeaway: Suffering, it’s both a bug and a feature

As the rain of blessings and trials fall on the just and the unjust so is our lives. The Christian has to embrace suffering when it comes;as the very symbol of our faith rests on the cross.Christ shows us the way that through the suffering and shame that He endured comes Glory. A power and strength in our faith to withstand life’s trails;that cannot be attained any other way,a purified life and a relationship that’s built on humility with Jesus as Lord; that’s worthy for eternity. Psalm 66:10-12 For You have tried us, O God; You have refined us as silver is refined. You brought us into the net; You laid an oppressive burden upon our loins. You made men ride over our heads; We went through fire and through water, Yet You brought us out into a place of abundance.

13:30 necessary suffering and unnecessary suffering. Discriminating which is which is the challenge and tying ourselves up in knots trying to.

Cristalisation of IQ, on a 40 year scale; Jordan : our little ethical problem is confirmed by Glickenhaus; What if I did not like golf courses.

Sigh... 1. "Let us make man according to our image and likeness and let them have authority....": That would be....Christlikeness! For Christ is the exact image of the invisible God. 2. Mankind fell. The image and likeness of God in man got lost. That's the mess this world is in. But...: 3. As Christ, God returns the divine life of the ages back to you-manity. For free, because of love, purpose, destiny. "I have come to give YOU Zoë (divine) life in abundance. It pleases the Father to give YOU the Kingdom. Freely I give you My Kingdom. Heal the sick, raise the dead, cast out demons, freely i give, freely share. I WILL send Holy Soirit, He WILL be IN you, guide you into truth and give you explosive power. You will understand that the Father is in Me and I am in you." "Those that receive this abundance of grace, this free gift of righteousness will walk in Zoë/divine life". How do we receive? We are mesmerized by what we see and welcome Holy Spirit to change us in to Christlikeness. The Gospel: a restoration of a man/woman, back to the image of God. Changed by His very own Spirit working in you. Changing you from the inside out. An outpouring from within you. So wherever you are at in your life, you have great purpose in life. Walking in the same divine unselfish love and glory/power as Christ. Growing in to Him in all things. Key-understanding: Christ represents all of humanity. So, you too!! In Him you already are completed! Co-cruisified, co-raised, co-seated, transferred, made perfect. You start where He finished: "You and I are one. He who meets you meets Me. The Father is in Me and I am in you". What a God, what a love. He came full circle. Let's love on someone today. ❤️🎁🎊💪🔥💃🕺

God could not allow evil to come into the world without some suffering to contend with. So why did God allow evil. The answer may shock you. Romans 9:22 “what if God, willing to show his wrath and wanting to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted for destruction, that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of glory he prepared beforehand for glory.” We cannot possibly know how good God is - without the other side of it. Similarly, you cannot have a good day till you’ve had a bad day first. When Johnathon Edwards was asked, “why did God allow evil to come into the world?” He answered, “That his glory should shine ever so much brighter.”

Such an amazing talk!

Merry Christmas and ✝️ God bless you all. Love from Australia 🇦🇺

JP talks like a man on a journey, trying to understand the world. It’s difficult at times to actually listen to him because his answer is always ends with “idk.” There’s nothing backing his “do good & prosper” when it’s followed up with WHY. This is why it’s important to hear from older religious people, particularly with the WHY part. If the religious is book smart & applies himself… it’s like gold. Even a regular working man off the street with no formal education, if he’s religious he has more wisdom (& experience!) than any armchair intellectual.

The closer you get, to The Lord God… The MORE PAIN you will have and the "harder" it is to "see" him the Darker .. the world falls away and no man SEES GOD.. Think of the darkness and "terror" (Moses and the Israelites went through) on Gods Mountain.

But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, to show that the transcendent power belongs to God and not to us. We are afflicted in every way, but not crushed, perplexed, but not driven to despair; persecuted, but not forsaken; struck down, but not destroyed; Always carrying about in the body the death of Jesus, so that the life of Jesus might be made manifest in our bodies. For while we are always being given up to death for Jesus’ sake, so that the life of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh. -2 Corinthians 4:7-11

The Priest Speaks to Peterson, Peterson turns and gives a speech to the Crowd. First is having a personal Conversation,asking and giving direct answers while Peterson is sharing his theory impersonally with everyone almost Grand standing to avoid answering the specific Questions. This is what people do when asked a question that makes them feel Vulnerable.

I feel that Jordan misses something. Not sure what. I think he is too pessimistic, too dark, too much bemoaning the fact of suffering. But hard to say that as someone who has not suffered as much as him.

.... currently, the Holy Spirit has laid upon my heart the topic "suffering". Througout the discovery process, personally mindful of my opposition to the word "happy" .... Satan has certainly played the word to his advantage to the masses. Oh well, a topic for another day. Over decades of conversations...the question "If there is a God, why does God allow such vile devastating suffering amongst the innocent and otherwise". Jordan Peterson offered insight into the individual suffering which gives way to the "Presence of Jesus" within. This concept has given depth to the above question. Thank you, relevant video!

This is the difference between our separated brothers & sisters, (Protestants,nondenominational Churches) We Catholics see God’s virtue in redemptive sufferings. They believe that your need more faith because of your suffering, we embrace it, they reject it. 🙏✝️❤️

how does god transform good people into judgemental hypocrites-through religion.

7:41 it is going to be ok. My experience was that of my soul being in that darkness of that night that can consume us and knowing that I am a child of God and it would be ok because of His atonement.

Jordan will become a Catholic

Jordan Peterson is distinctly wiser than he once was

Thank you Father Dave

Amen. 🙏

Peterson looks like he feels at home. And relaxed.

Beautiful, thank you both.

I really enjoy hearing Jordan Peterson think out loud.

God bless FR. Dave

Alll is transformed IF taken, given and left with Jesus WHO suffered (though Innocent!) and Resurrected (over pain, suffering & even Death!) Matthew 11, 28* “Come to me, all you who labor and are burdened,* and I will give you rest. 29* Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am meek and humble of heart; and you will find rest for yourselves. 30For my yoke is easy, and my burden light.” Besides, in John 19: 26-27... Jesus said to his mother, “Woman behold your son.” Then he said to the disciple, “Behold, your mother.” These were among the final wishes Jesus had for humanity just before He died on the Cross...

Jordan Peterson is each of us, deep down we doubt and we ask these questions of suffering. God loves him as he loves each of us, deeply, and allows each of us to come to terms with our own suffering. Jordan Peterson is not afraid to show himself as he truly is, as Jesus was not afraid to hang on the cross in total nakedness and humility. Jesus said My God, My God why have you forsaken me….

God bless and keep us all thank you for the knowledge

I think I picked on Jordan a little bit in another post. He has an amazing intellect, but all the words in the world cannot explain God. People turn to God in times of trouble as it is a deep psychological idea designed to protect us from harm, kind of like a third alternative to the fight/flight response. Faith in God turns on our ability to endure, with the historical knowledge that suffering does not always last. But in terminal cases, belief in God can make us face our suffering with dignity and give us the strength to live as long as possible and fulfil our duties on this planet.

We can be overcomers with God's strength . It is how we overcome the suffering or life's challenges , that makes us who we are... "God is our strength and fortress" It is Hard to be humble and ask for help. Human's have alot of pride But as it says "pride goeth before a fall. ... How many lives did Jesus touch on his Journey... We can touch many lives too with God's help and guidance....

Through my own suffering, I fell more in love with Jesus Christ 🙏❤️‍🩹❤️ Every single day

....???🤔🤔🤔 ...🤭🤭 .... ..."CHURCH MIND 'eh.." ...😡😠.. ..'Judgement day's ..(..judge mind A )

Matthew 23:9

It's funny how we all can talk about what god does, although there is no evidence of any kind, that any god or supernatural power even exists, so we just make shit up. Can anybody show me any real reason, besides emotional ones that shows what god does even if he does exist?

Only understanding the cause of sufferings from the 4 Noble Truths and follow the Noble 8 Fold Path can i eradicate sufferings. I have seen too many God believers suffer more in late life, especially when they found out these evidence that thrir religion is fake but helpless: 1) A CREATOR god claimed to be ALMIGHTY should be the oldest and only religion but all the pagans, Greek, Chinese, Hinduism religions existed earlier. 2) Why should an almighty and all knowing God allowed their people to branch off and kill their parent religion Judaism or Zoroatruism and later allowed Islam to be created and had holy wars/crusades with Christianity? "Free will" is not an excuse since they claimed their God killed all people with a big flood earlier. 3) Many of the Bible's mythologies are copied from older pagans, Greek, Egyptian or Hinduism religions(note the names too) E.g. Adam/Eve from Atman/Jiva a pair of birds, big flood and survivor Noah/3 sons from Manu/3 daughters, Abraham/Sarah from Brahma/Saraswathi, Moses from Krishna etc, all had similar stories details. 4) Jesus similarities with Buddha: Maya to Mary, miracle to virgin birth, birth during a journey home to from home, prophesied after birth, had a disciple who betrayed them, walked on water stories, Gautama left the palace at age 29 and Jesus appeared at 29, Gautama became Buddha at 35 and Jesus died and resurrected at about 33, Buddha had a big meal while Jesus had a last supper before they died, the Buddha sacrificed his family to seek the truth in order to eradicate human sufferings while Jesus sacrificed himself, 500 arahants witnessed compilation of Buddha's teachings and over 500 witnesses to Jesus's resurrection, there will be a future Buddha and Jesus will return, the Trinity is same meaning as in the 3 bodies of the Buddha etc.

I had, a job I had a girl, I had something going somethin'-------------Did I forget to give back a pack of matches when I left from MTL......do you want to see a spark ? At the movies ?

This is earth, not heaven, earth is suffering and heaven is joy. People can tell you they love you but desert you in an instant when hard times come. This is what God is doing “proving” you through suffering. “The government is upon His shoulder”, means God’s rule is the cross, bearing it patiently for “patience is perfect and entire, failing in nothing”, “Be perfect as your father in heaven is perfect” and “esteeming these scourges to be less than our sins deserve”. Look up these quotations on DRBO online bible. Imagine St. Padre Pio refused anaesthetic before an operation in imitation of Jesus refusing “wine and gall” before crucifixion. St. Augustine said “God had one son without sin, but He never had one without suffering” God bless.

I do not know the word Corpus. It is a disconnecting language. Vertically and horizontally even so is your robe. Latin is dead. So how can this approach connect with my inner mothertongue the moment I leave your Church construction and I watch people living their lives day and Night. This is so Off gentlemen.

Question: Why did God allow the suffering of six million Jews and other poor unfortunates in the Nazi concentration-camps? Answer: There is no God.

Dr Peterson would like to be more Fr Pivonka, way easier to answer suffering from a christian spiritual sense than psychological ...oh Jesus , the Ointed, oint us

This is essentially an argument from anecdote. Just because some people find meaning or purpose in their suffering is no answer to the problem because the evidential problem of evil is why do some people experience meaningless suffering? And saying “Jesus is there in the midst of the suffering…” is meaningless if his presence in the midst of that suffering is not discernible. And you cannot deny that is some people’s experience because the psalmist himself admits this. But at the end you really show your real answer and that is to play the mystery card. You don’t have a rational answer. You shrug your shoulders and believe despite the evidence against.

One does not get strong by lifting light weights. In my most dreaded experiences, i.e. the individual deaths of my parents, the Lord was ever present. Had he not given such evidence of his presence, I would have thought, "My God, why hast thou forsaken me?" But he didn't do that. Somehow, he gets us through.

What faith brings you to, is believing stuff for which there is absolutely no evidence. This is just arm waving to justify believing in a god that allows an incredible amount of human suffering for no reason. Ridiculous.

I don’t think people listen to Jordan Peterson because he’s necessarily interesting. I think people are attracted to him…because he comes across as genuine and empathetic. The traits leaders are made of. Being genuine, and empathetic. You can’t teach this at school.

Where is that leap of faith Dr. P.? Mary Therese

emmmm....god made the suffering in the first place so why does anyone think he's great if he 'transforms' it ?

Don't pray in the marketplace with the Pharisees and hypocrites, Jordan.

There is no evidence to even suggest the existence of any deities or gods. It’s a patently silly concept.

ETERNAL BEING IS THE MOST CONCRETE REALITY; IT IS NOT KANTIAN ABSTRACTION. VOLITION IS NOT TO BECOME ALIENATED FROM INTELLECT.

Oh my goodness that was awesome

Hope, hope is realizing the great person you were always meant to be has been lost 🕊️

Or… there is no god, no rhyme or reason to life and we just have to make the best of it.

"Have GOD show me my cross"........."When you see people bear their suffering NOBLY, there's nothing in that but good!" - Transormative....Inspired.........True! Thank you!!

❣️

..wisdom ..what's'time🤔 ..why it's dumb..🤔 .......... ...waste I'm...👉👁️ ..why:. it's time. ..why .......😱😳 ..I'm. ..why??? ..🤔🤔🤔, it's time I am.. ..(???DOME!!!!!!!)

Dr. Jordon, you ask how does one navigate without becoming bitter. The answer is what ancient Christians called the "rudder". The Psalms my friend. CHRISTIANS ARE MEANT TO PRAY THE PSALMS.

When we ERR as Co-creators in life THE suffering burns off the errors. Cruel? Crude? Yes. But look.at how we (humans ego) will fight The Structure of a MOSTLY freely given (Existence) Life. Always remember that this is only our self-created one reality. There are Heavenly ones --- bear your cross & move on... TO them.

From the book “God’s Bullies,” by Perry Deanne Young comes the following That the religious were so concerned about other people’s drinking habits and sex lives said much more about them and their own minds than it did about those they regarded as sinners. In the name of Jesus and God, they had perpetrated all kinds of little cruelties on others and had meanwhile fooled themselves into thinking they could do no wrong because they were always carrying out God’s will. You realize, then, that people see God through mirrors-and the reflection is often that fearsome, intolerant beast inside all of us.

In the last days.... (whenever that will be) small children will have dreams of Heaven and dreams of God's plan.... This means Christ will GIVE TO small children to know what Christ will do in the future... THIS IS IN THE ROMAN CATHOLIC BIBLE !!

Is there another clip that is longer of hosting Mr Peterson?

Sorry for always being the party pooper but it all sounds like Stockholm syndrome to me. Seeing benevolence in cancer and divorce etc. should we see Christ in schizophrenia, autism, human trafficking…. The list is endless. We seem to live in an endless cycle of perpetuating suffering. Why? Because it’s all part of gods amazing plan! We are all abused and traumatised and then express love for the creator of it all, that is Stockholm syndrome!

We tinizza, though, I like clams, I have friends.....I liked bone made tools, clams, and brand new alcaline batteries; I like mineral Contrex Water;

I actually think the “church” mostly catholic religion,has deceived the people by preaching that GOD is in charge of every move you make and orchestrates every outcome.It’s of course a moneymaker so I see the goal,more warm bodies in church more income.If you actually believe our Creator can and will influence every positive part of your life you have to also believe he’s directing all the negative parts also since he obviously was asleep when you were stricken with some awful malady

Father! you talk too much. Let the guest speak!

For me personally, it's generational depression. I was just consoling my mom today cause it's on my dad's side of the family yet 3 of her 4 children are psychiatric patients(including myself). This has lead me back to the faith so eventually I set aside the shame. I've abandoned my intellect to the teachings of the church. It's been 6 years now and in the midst of suffering, the sorrowful rosary mysteries come to mind. My lifelong sorrows have been genuinely transformed. Glory to God. I intend on being a catechist to younger children because the identity crisis is one of the things that leads to rather avoidable hopelessness.

Praise to God. These my fav 2 people right now.

Only temporary suffering is to bear which means the amount of suffering must be to oversee wherefore stands open reason as Heaven's promise to future justice which results in patience. Faith is the trust on the prevailing law for Heaven's future promise fulfillment which brings to what is foreseen in Heaven's policy by promise to reach the promised future of eternal life in Paradise. Faith requires a justified contribution which starts from the day of birth while in the womb was the preparation since the first heart beat. The aspect of karma and eternal foreseeing is next followed by the structure of reality being part of and its conditions.

This linked to the theory of relevance realization being a possible way of solution is quite enlightening

I had a job I had Matches, ARAWAK ?

Oh, that was good! Thank you.