@@allwalledup Well, Stan Lee did create a few popular ones. So do not completely throw him under the bus. Though yes Jack Kirby deserves more recognition than he currently has.
The characters/people were there because they were important to Jack Kirby. I don't think continuity should matter much there. The Fantastic Four attended the funeral, but otherwise, they don't exist in the DCAU. If you really want an in-universe explanation, then I would suggest something like this: Mr. Fantastic was monitoring the multiverse and found out about the upcoming funeral in a different world. He then built a machine to transport everyone there, so they could pay their respects. Then, everyone went back to their own worlds.
@@tracebaker Basically, yes. For the purposes of paying respects to Jack Kirby in this scene, they are the Fantastic Four. For the purposes of DCAU canon, they are random background characters.
I think the best explanation is simple doppelgängers. But if it needs a more fantastic explanation, I think alternate universe counterparts that were still drawn together by a cosmic fate but without the superpowers and grand heroics in this reality works pretty well, too.
@@Deoxys911 The doppleganger idea is what i thought of, remember in the cw flash tv show there was a doppelganger of the fake Jay garrick who had no super powers. The same could be said for steve rogers and the fantastic 4 in the DCAU, they dont have super powers but similar stories, heck tony stark in this universe doesnt build a suit or gets captured by terrorists like the Tony we know and is porbably just a normal wealthy business man.
@Will N Isn’t that more like the Squadron Supreme? Marvel characters who are clearly based on DC’s Justice League, but are still considered separate characters. Earth-8 would be the other way around, then. Of course, the Avengers once had a full-on crossover team-up with the Justice League, so their universes are able to connect under the right circumstances.
I believe that Ben Grimm is the one mostly covered up, next to Reed. I think Nick Fury is also in the back with the eyepatch (pre-Sam L. Jackson). This could be a before they got powers/alternate universe where they never got powers homage.
@@mattiesavannahpahl9934 oh no worries! I love the Watchtower Database😂nobody gets to shit talk about it in this comment section I hope I’m clear on that
@@elnacho3174 If i did make it, it would take place years after the last episode of Justice League Unlimited, taking place at are timeline "but it is not futuristic like Batman Beyond tell us".
@@elnacho3174 Maybe it would take place at the time where Batman & Superman are older and new heroes are taking they're places "Superman is still fighting crime because we know he can live for really long", the son of Superman name Rick Kent "who look like Val-El in the episode For the man who had everything" become Superboy "with a kryptonien s on his chest" and fight crime with his father while Robin becomes Nightwing.
That green screen behind Lex, I have a theory on that. Lex was so hooked up on kryptonite to defeat Superman that he started snorting so much of it he started seeing green. And on a serious note, all my respect to Jack Kirby.
You know you’d think that people complaining about obvious issues with both that issue and the missing two episodes of static shock. That they’d fix it when it comes to the Superman error and either put the missing two episodes up of static shock or give an actual answer on why they aren’t up yet. their customer support is nonexistent it’s completely unacceptable it’s pathetic.
@@batman200 Yes it does make them look like “incompetent morons” that don’t know what their doing. Either they forgot, couldn’t be assed or theirs more to it behind the scenes, like the episodes missing not the green screen.
This week our Brazillian voice actor that voiced J'onn J'onzz, Dário de Castro, has passed away... Not only did he voiced J'onn, but also Russel Crowe and Liam Nisson. For us, a JLU reunion will have a sour taste (and even if Qui Gon Jyn ever returns).
I’ve always wondered that myself honestly I personally think that they have changed a lot of the MCU characters than what they were in the original comics that he wrote in the 60s i’m not sure if he imagined Thor to look exactly like Chris Hemsworth or Ultron Sounding like James Spader Although Thor Ragnarok is basically a love letter to Jack Kirby The MCU seems very comedic oriented why I feel like back in the 60s there was a bit more pathos to some of the characters I’d imagine he’d be pissed off at the way Steppenwolf locked in the original Snyder cut
I really wish there was a Marvel Animated Universe made by the DCAU crew, specially with this amazing Bruce Timm art. Imagine a Spider Man show with the Justice League art style and story quality
Have you seen Spectacular Spider-Man, or Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes? I know they aren't a connected universe, but both of those shows absolutely S L A P P.
@@christianames2161 Spectacular Spider-Man is pretty good and i never watched that Avengers cartoon much. But man...the DCAU cartoons have a unique touch in story style, art style, characters development, concepts so i really wanted to see their view on the marvel mythos. The closer thing we got to that is Batman Beyond which is heavily inspired by Spider-Man. It has even the "Fantastic Four" in it
I actually didn't hate the guy, to be fair. Heck, even I don't understand why the writers didn't like Steel in S: TAS (though they did nicely deem him important again in JLU).
Apokolips Now is my favorite arc of the series. STAS (and the DCAU in general) for me is still number 1 at adapting the Fourth World. How they adapted the New Gods and how their send off for Dan Turpin here was a great tribute to Jack Kirby, the King that both DC and Marvel, and comics in general owe much to. Adding back all the cameos of his creations and friends is a great touch though I hope they put back the dedication card.
The problem with having Darkside's beams transport the Intergang guy to Apocalypse means that it's possible that Turpin was just transported there as well.
@@dcauwatchtower What I mean is the only other time (that I can remember) that they had someone get hit by those beams, they weren't killed but just transported to Apocalypse. Because of this, I had interpreted it that everyone thought his character was dead but he was actually just transported there. I get that the writers were in a tight spot and didn't have a lot of choice, but it cheapens the character's sacrifice.
Great video! I don’t think “Is Nick Fury part of the DCAU?” an issue. It’s a tribute. As far as in-universe, it’s just a man who simply happens to resemble the Marvel character. It’s not intended as a crossover. Just a very nice tribute. 🙂
It could be possible that the marvel characters could have different lives in the DCAU. For example, Steve Rodgers could be a a modern day soldier who didn’t fight in World War Two. If that was the case he probably be brought up. Tony stark could still be a business man that owns a company that probably isn’t big enough to be mentioned in passing. And the Fantastic four could just be a normal family. But Mattie you might be on to something with nick fury being part of Caddmus. We don’t know everything about it.
I never knew Dan Turpin was visually based on Jack Kirby! That is really cool. Looking back on Superman The Animated Series, and Justice League as well, I see how much Jack Kirby's art style influenced Bruce Timm's own art style and the character designs for both shows. I never saw that episode of Superman The Animated Series that featured Dan Turpin's funeral. The inclusion of Nick Fury, Steve Rogers, and Tony Stark is a little odd,but he did co-create The Avengers, before he moved over to DC. Very cool video! I
If they're looking for an explanation to give people to say why they're not heroes in that universe they can just say it's a universe where they're all regular humans and not superheroes
Kirby is my fave comic artist and writer. He was on another plane, the things he came up. How chaotic his art looked, but was actually all framed perfectly. Blend of sci fi, mysticism, humanity, deities. His creations and concepts are now cemented in our culture, inspired other works, and will continue to be the highest standard to reach. That’s. Why he’s king
You can find clips if not whole episodes of the thing here on RU-vid. Considering what else existed in animation even way back then, it is pretty pathetic excuse for a cartoon, made all the more apparent by the first Spider-Man cartoon that came out just a few years after. With that said, the theme songs are a delight, and it's so totally worth looking up, the cheapness is adorable and hilarious looking back at it now.
This was a helpful piece - I wasn't 100% clued in on everything that had happened. Probably a safe guess those working the remaster weren't aware of the Kirby connection.
Both comic companies have a lot of respect for each other. Clark Kent(unnamed) showed up in Thor #340 . Homage to Thor using glasses was given in that issue. Be that it may, the episode was in honor of the king for his influence in both universes. He still stands as one of the biggest influences in comics books. The man has an energy signature named for him: "Kirby Krackle".
The building in the begging of the first part that intergang breaks into with their hover tank has what could almost be seen as a SHIELD logo. So another fun Kirby thing I guess.
8:31 and the lack of Ben Grimm the thing. I guess Ben was trying to look for a suit for the funeral but then suddenly caught in a fight with the hulk and Solomon Grundy and some of the heavy hitters of Superman’s rouge gallery that cause him to miss the funeral, as for where he was before the rest of the fantastic four left for the funeral, he was at a bar. As for why the hulk fight the thing out of nowhere is because of Loki mind controlled him which he got so angry that he broke the mind control and “puny god” Loki, then some cops started to shoot at him and he started throw stuff at the cops and Ben Grimm had to come in and beat him up
I think a lot of young artists have trouble adapting to what makes stylistic art so good when we're just trying so hard to ditch every dumb habit we came standard with, to try not to 'draw like a kid' Eventually, over time, you get it..
I have never been so happy for a couple of seconds in a piece of media in my life. Never before have I related to the Star Wars Fanbase to this extent.
I think it seems more likely that in universe they were just people who happened to look like those characters. If they're not named then technically they're just people.
Marvel Comics had a Cameo of Clark Kent (this was before the Crossover, & it was Earth-616) but that Clark was a Normal Human (so Clark existed on Earth-616 but not Superman) So the same can be applied to these Characters Tony wouldn't be Iron Man Steve wouldn't be Captain America & Nick Fury wouldn't be the Leader of Shield To make some examples They would exist but without the Super Hero Alterego they would have a lesser impact on the DCAU than named characters
Darkseid’s Omega beams are a bit inconsistent. They either disintegrate or teleport what they hit through time and/or space. They are consistent in that they do both more then once though. (I’m talking about the comics btw).
I had heard about this funeral scene being redone after it had aired once, but I didn't know the reason until now. I had heard that it was redone because the characters were off model, which was obviously not what really happened. In a strange coincidence, the 2003 4Kids Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles cartoon also had a Jack Kirby tribute episode ("The King") which also was altered after its original airing. It's an adaptation of one of the Mirage TMNT comics, where Donatello meets an artist named Kirby (who's drawn to look pretty much like Jack Kirby). This Kirby has a magic crystal that he has attached to his pencil, that will bring his drawings to life. Don and Kirby are transported (via a portal that had also become real after Kirby drew it) to the world where these living drawings end up after they disappear from ours, and Kirby sacrifices his chance to go home so that Don can return. Before the portal closes forever, a piece of paper flies out which Don picks up. In the originally aired version, Don immediately looks at the paper and sees its a note from Kirby with a drawing of the Turtle, with the message: "Life at best is bittersweet". Then the episode abruptly ends. (I think there was a Jack Kirby dedication card at the end, too.) In the revised version (which, IIRC, Peter Laird paid for out of his own pocket), an extra scene (that was also in the original comic) is added, where Donatello and Raphael have a conversation when Don gets home, and only after that does he read the note from Kirby. This revised version was on the original DVD release. (Not sure if the other version was ever seen again.) This story had also previously been adapted into a children's storybook back in the 80s or 90s (during the height of Turtlemania), using the 1980s cartoon design but otherwise pretty much the same as the original comic story.
Hey. If Marvel can run a whole non-canon story of Bruce Wayne being a SHIELD agent. I do not see why DC can pay tribute to a man who literally gave them both iconic heroes and villains for their respected companies. After all. If Marvel (Disney really) does sue. The only people who would win big. The lawyers. The true villains.
Jack Kirby Cameos: - The Incredible Hulk Live-Actions, Lou Ferigno - Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles Comics and 2003 Cartoon - Marvel Super Heroes credits In Memory Jack ''King'' Kirby - Superman the Animated Serie Jack ''The King'' Kirby
When Dan Turpin died it hurt. I was at first confused. I saw Spawn when I was younger than when episode dropped. I was 10 in 98. Anyway when I realized he was dead and not transported somewhere, I was ready to tear Darksied apart. See Superman almost kill him in their battles after that was a joy to watch.
I started thinking when you talked about why Steve Roger's and Tony Stark never made to JL and if Nick Fury was on Cadmus. I'm a pretty big fan of both Marvel and DC (although more Marvel) and especially their TV adaptations (Avengers:EMH and DCAU). I have dreamt these past months how would a shared universe of those cartoons be. Maybe just one universe inside a lot of ones where Iron Man and Batman work one day to fight Bane and the next one all JLU and Avengers go to space to fight Darkseid and Thanos. I know there are some comics exploring that idea but I don't think they get into that a lot. I wonder, specifically with this TV series, how would a shared universe be? Can both Justice League and Avengers coexist? Will the Avengers Breakout affect other prisons (maybe Arkham but they always escape so, meh)? We will have two secret invasions (Skrull and Imperium)? How would Cadmus affect both teams? Maybe some DC villains join the Masters of Evil and Marvel villains join the Legion of Doom? Personally I have the idea of Copperhead joining the Serpent Society and some shared origin for Amazo and the Super Adaptoid. But well, some of my thoughts. I think this is an interesting idea but hey, if you want to have a debate it may be fun. Fantastic video, like always, btw
until you guys come up with something compelling, my headcanon is gonna be that the Marvel cameos at Turpin's funeral are just mundane versions of their civilian personas--Fury could be an old army buddy of Turpin's, for example, maybe they served in Korea in something though i guess the apparent Captain America cameo could actually be Hank Heywood XDDDDDD
I always thought Turpin was going return because, like you said, Darkseid used his Omega Beams to transport Bruno Mannheim to Apokolips. So I thought “oh, maybe he’s been transported like Bruno was” and that we would see him in the series finale.
I know that Timm didn't add any characters or mentioned any others but I saw two guys that kinda look like Donald Blake aka Thor behind Norman Ross and T'Challa aka Black Panther in front of the Fantastic Four
Restoring Kirby's creations back in to the second part of Apokolips now for Turpin's funeral was a must, it always should have been there. but deleting the Kirby inmemoriam in the new edit is heartless from HBO MAX. Also probably done by some soulless hack editing that had no idea what he was doing. time to do another edit goober, restore those backgrounds and replace that King memoriam. Also, Timm was always a fan of placing cameos from himself and his crew in episodes within the Timmverse animations. But Danial Terpin rules them all. all hail the king!
I don’t think it would be anything but “people that LOOK like characters Kirby created attended the funeral of a guy that looked like Kirby himself.” It’s not like they’re in costume.
There was a comic series in the 90s called marvel vs dc in which the marvel and dc universes begin to merge into the amalgam universe. Super soldier was a mix between superman and captain america. Dark claw qas a mix between batman and wolverine. A movie with these would rock.
I wish Jack Kirby was as popular as Stan Lee. One thing that probably doesn’t help is many of the fans of comics of my generation were born after Kirby died.
imagine a world where executives interested in not harming their audience actually FORBID you from cheapening death by not showing it or just bringing them back later. Where they were actually against censorship and the harm it does to everyone. wouldn't that be something. For them to not be clueless as fuck about right and wrong.
Do you think the physical release of the remastered will include Brainiac attacks and if so do you think they would re-dub it with the original voice if lex and brainiac (maybe also mercy)
