For years I’ve just used a baking stone and a turkey toaster lid (preheated in the oven with stone). It can accommodate nearly any shape: boule, battard, bannaton, or 2 standard length baguettes. Super affordable and practically no shape restrictions.
I've made a lot of bread in my life and this is the best video i've ever watched on the topic. Actually answers questions you build in your head when you bake a lot at home.
I’m a proficient baker, and I made these this morning per your recipe and technique and they are outstanding! Best rolls ever. Dude, I’m almost seventy, been cooking since I was ten, but I’ve still learned a ton from your videos. I plan to watch them all, even if I don’t intend to make whatever you’re demonstrating, just because they are so well made and interesting. Though there are at least a dozen other cooking channels I follow, I can’t say the same for any of them. Would you consider doing a deep dive on fish and chips? I know there are probably hundreds already, but none are as methodical as your approach to nailing a dish. Either way, I appreciate your channel. You should have a million subscribers, but I think you’ll get there in time.
That's great to hear! And I really appreciate the kind words. I think fish and chips would make a good series! I'll definitely add that one to the list.
HOW DID I KNOW you were going to drop this video today? I spent the day making cheesesteak rolls based on your last video 😂 They actually came out amazing, only adding 2% sugar since I don't have access to diastatic malt powder. Came out incredible. Best roll I've had since moving to the west coast in 2005.
Charlie, first off you’re videos are awesome and the results are incredible. I just bought the challenger bread pan. Looking at the roll you baked in that looks like it came from a factory. Keep up the great work. I’m inspired.
Thank you! Yeah I do love my challenger bread pan, I hope you like it too! It's great for rolls and small baguettes, and you can even bake two small bread loaves at once, which is usually what I use mine for.
Any kind of cast iron skillet will also work in place of a pizza steel. I believe butter also has some natural emulsifiers which can have a similar effect to crisco.
Do you know that in south Philadelphia the Italian bakers used whey in their dough. One of the unique things about a Phila roll that makes those cheese steaks the best in the world.
Did you try spritzing the rolls with water before and while they were in the oven instead of covering the rolls? I think this is how french baguettes are made.
Wow. Your videos are LEGIT. Just discovered you, and so glad that I did. Not many folks get as in depth and nuanced as you do. These are the types of things that I geek out about and experiment with, as well; methods, percentages, vessels, temps, etc… You have a new subscriber, for sure!
Dude. I rarely find cooking videos where I learn anything any longer and you've given me a ton of tips and hints that are super useful. I wish I found this video days ago.
If you dont have a roasting pan etc. to put on top of your bread, at least in EU we usually have fitted oven trays that you can slide on top of your breads to the rack above them. This is to trap steam like a pan, but with things that usually come with your oven. Just make sure that you also put a some kind of steam source under the things you are baking. I've baked two sourdoughs at a time (because of the increased electricity costs and whatever) with this method and it works ok. Though its still its better to use a tray or something like the challenger to make sure the steam traps nicely. But the tray method is worth a shot if you dont have anything else!
I have been on a journey the past couple years trying to figure out how to make the perfect NY style pizza. I have been obsessed with pizza since i was a little kid. I have 2 NY style places in Downtown Olympia, WA. I decided it was time, so i took a trip to NYC with my misses for 5 days. I literally ate nothing but pizza 3-5 times a day, and every single time it was a new place. Never the same place twice with the exception of 1 place that was phenomenal and close by the airnbnb. Coming back to WA, i immediately same day tried both pizza places to compare. 1 was extremely close to NY style the other was unsatisfactory. Ive worked in many kitchens, even had a close friend who was private chef for Mr. Bill Gates for over 15 years. He was incredible, but even he didnt know the best NY style recipe. Your channel is a godsend, i have binge watched it all day. Philly steaks& NY style pizza? Phenomenal. I was very very pleased to find you have a website for your recipes, as i found it hard to follow an exact recipe just simply based on the videos length. !!ALTHOUGH!! Your videos are, again, PHENOMENAL. They explain the science behind it and why we need to do the things we have to behind the recipes processes. I dont think i need to comment on video and audio quality, you already know that part. BRAVOOOO! ❤ I am so happy to have found your channel. I have nothinf but the greatest desire to see you make a very nice living off of these videos. Whether you see this or not, doesnt matter. I had to leave my thoughts and praise, your videos and work are THAT (again) PHENOMENAL Best of luck, subscribed within minutes of the first video. THANKYOUUU!!
Great work on this series! I think Crisco works best for this because it's solid at room temp and makes things feel moister & more tender instead of oily like a liquid oil would. That's been a thing people have applied to donut frying forever. I wonder if lard would provide some extra flavor to the dough?
Charlie! Wow! This is incredible and I can’t imagine the amount of work you did off camera to give us this gift of a video. I’ve had a Detroit pizza style pan in my cart for a while, and I think now is the time to hit the buy button as it has more than one use. Curious what brand you use or recommend?
Yes I was going to say, I think Lloyd pans are pretty much the standard! The Detroit style pans come in two different sizes, so I have both linked in the video description. The one I have is the smaller one though.
Over proofed this on my first attempt but made them again this weekend and they came out bomb! The crust especially came out just as expected. I used the oven steel, one ice cube, solid square tin lid for 10min.
I love these I can smell them. I love that you can make them thicker. The stores are never thick enough n gettoo crispy when u toast them. I love love te shaped one's. My dad loves these. When I wasa kid he ate them like crazy. Imma make him some tom for him n freeze some for me too. Thank you. This will def go in my recipe book I'm gonna make for each if my kids, their friends n myself 😊
I would have tried a spray of water, you're in there anyway...removing lids, turning pans...just hit em with a spritz. That's how we did bagels at the bakery. And crisco is a good hack for making cookies stay soft and tender longer. Swap out 10-15% of the butter for crisco.
With a couple of personal tweaks on my end (need to lower the rack to the bottom, maybe not use convection) these came out absolutely perfect. These are the hoagie/sandwich rolls I've always wanted to make at home. Thank you for all your hard work.
A cheaper alternative to the bread pan might be to use a baguette holder that has perforated holes and you can move a baking rack up to the top and put sheet trays to help block some of the evaporation? Then do the traditional water pan below or mist the rolls with a spray bottle.
Best sub rolls I’ve ever made! Excellent technique and excellent recipe. I’ve done Ethan’s and Bri’s in the past and while they were serviceable they never really became something I wanted to show off when company came over. That changes now! I’ll be using this to build out some party sub rolls in the near future.
I baked up your rolls today and they are absolutely wonderful with amazing appearance, crumb, crust and flavor. I think it's the diastatic malt extract that pushes them over the top. I used EVOO because we were out of Crisco and skipped the overnight ferment to have the them on the table in three hours. For me they were the star of the meal. Next bake is later this week using Crisco and the overnight ferment. Thanks!
I had success with an oval shaped Le Creuset and also a Tramontina 5-Quart ($49 at Costco) - I put aluminum foil over it before I put the lid on for a better seal. The Tramontina comes with an insert for steaming.
Ok, I’ve hit my stride with this one. I do not have a Challenger cast iron bread cloche, nor can I afford one, BUT I do have a big ole Graniteware roaster with lid. I followed the recipe as provided (except I used oil instead of shortening). I did my final proof in the roaster - parchment paper, corn meal, divided/shaped dough. I baked it at 500° BUT first I ran water around the lid then added a few ice cubes to the bottom of the pan. 10m later I opened it to a blast of steam, baked uncovered another 6m, ran a stick of butter over it and let it cool. Came out super crounchy on the outside, nice and soft on the inside.
Cheese Steaks and the rolls we make them on are an Italian invention. Italian bread is generally not made to be soft, we like hard breads. I was a baker at an Italian bread bakery for 7 years. Our dough was made with Kyrol and All Trumps High Gluten baking flour, water and dry Red Star yeast. Only time salt was used was for large Italian long and round breads. Also anytime your dough is exposed to elements of your kitchen, make sure all windows and doors are closed and no fans or air conditioning. Air will skin your dough and the product is ruined. Lastly during cooking the bottom of our bread rose on a baking peel coated with cornmeal. That’s what prevents sticking in the cooking process, Italians don’t use flour or cook in pans.
I just made this today for a banh mi sandwich. Turned out perfect! I did the ol' put some ice on a pan method with my rolls on a sheet tray and it turned out great with some time and temp tweaking🎉🎉
Charlie, I am very impressed and experience my best efforts at sub rolls (I multi use them) with this receipe and process. i have tried several others with success, but these are the best. My supply of homemade burger buns was running low so I made 4 burger buns with this receipe and baked them in my lodge baker cooker thingy. long story short, it makes great burger buns. They weighed out at 103 grams each, and I probably need to bump the receipe a bit, as I think about 115 is ideal. Just an FYI, thanks.
Thank you for these videos. I am not into baking bread per say. Mainly because of the time involved. I have used Frozen Bread Dough for a pizza dough. Results were not bad but not ideal either as I recall. I can't find a decent sub roll for Subs, Philly Cheesesteaks in my Metro area with a few Commercial Bakeries around. Can't find a good Brat Bun either. The grocery store bakeries Brat Buns are made with regular hotdog style bread dough. Just 6 to a pan instead of 8 to make them bigger. Not a good Brat Bun does it make. These types of educational videos are a god send to those that don't like or cant afford traditional schooling. Thank You.
Many years ago, there was a front page article in the Wall Street Journal on why cheesesteaks outside of Philadelphia just didn’t compete with the real thing. They concluded that it was the bread. No one could duplicate what the Italian bakers came up with. Until now. You did it Charlie. Next is the Chicago Italian Beef rolls.
hey man! thx for the work you put into this! I think the proportions of the ingredients is a bit off on your website, because King Arthurs Bread Flour already contained about 0.5% malted flour. So, effectively when you add additional 2% malt powder you will end up with 2.5% of diastatic in your mix, now 2%
Try an enamel roasting pan. They are very inexpensive. Same concept like an oval dutch oven, except made of enameled sheet steel. Very common item in everyday kitchens. Lots of sizes.
I think with just ice cubes without covering works better. Theoretically more moisture improves heat conductivity to reach higher temps faster, to prevent drying out the bread by the delay of the peak optimal temp. Covering it in itself is its own, more cold with more ice the oven heat cannot penetrate, or with less ice either the heat is not directly heating the bread or just encasing heat that ambient oven temp is not the same covered.
Thanks for all of the work and insight. My only wish is that someone like you would delve into the science of freshly milled flour. I have given up on all milled grain bread for the moment as it’s nearly impossible to get good gluten development. I am trying this with 1/3 hard red wheat berries and as usual remove part of the flour as the fresh wheat is so thirsty. I am also shortening the rise because the yeast goes crazy and will overproof with the fresh wheat. Fingers crossed. Thanks so much for all of the explanations for each ingredient.
Just gotta say, as I grew up half an hour south of Philly in Claymont, Del., which is where PA and DE meet on I-95: no sesame seeds on a sub/steak roll. Ever. Oh and since I now live and work in NYC, what they do here is a sin: bell peppers grilled with the onions. Never ever ever put grilled bell peppers on a steak or a sub. Pickled sweet and hot cherry peppers (sliced or chopped) are the only peppers. Thank you.
Hey Charlie, check out Pan Sobao, it’s puertorican lard bread. It’s a mix between French baguette and Hawaiian rolls. Slightly sweet soft and delicious. I can’t wait to try this recipe! Great video!
Crisco was reformulated to reduce trans-fats but it's still one of the most dangerous foods you could possibly put in your body. Margarine, also, is basically straight hydrogenated oil. I doubt you'd get the same texture, but butter or lard would be much safer to use
Bro, I LUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUV the video. Was hoping someone would try Angelos. I hope you can try to replicate their cheese pizza, which in my opinion, beats any New York pizza all day long. If you can replicate the Philly Italian Hoagie, Roast Pork/Broc Rabe, and Angelos Pizza you will be a GOD. I think the Italian Hoagie might be the brand of meats as wells the way they slice their meats and vegies, as well as the fact that they love sharp provolone. Well done my friend!
Excellent! I've been on the same mission, and like you, I found that Bahn mi was close, but not exactly what I was looking for to make Philly Cheesesteaks. So thanks for sharing your tests.
I just plug the top vent on my oven when I create steam. And ice cubes are sort of weak, it is much better to have two junk cast iron pans on the oven floor and add about 1/2 cup of water to the first one when you start the rolls and then use 1/2 cup of water in the second pan after about 2 1/2 - 3 minutes. After the first 10 minutes steam is no longer desirable and you can unplug the top vent.
TURN your oven off so it wont vent.....🤘🍻 SOoooo preheat to desired temp.... turn oven off... introduce steam method... let oven spring happen...remove bread...reheat... bake to desired doneness...
Well, I tried this recipe yesterday (after a night in the fridge for the dough). I didn't have a means of steaming as used in the video, but I tried my oblong Le Creuset dutch oven as it has a heavy lid. I sprinkled the bottom with corn starch and the dough logs fit perfectly. After 6 minutes of steam the logs had swelled in size considerably. I simply took the lid off for browning and there I got into trouble. After ten minutes there was zero browning. I tried another few minutes, then more, then more.....I lost track of how long I had them in the 500 F heat.....As a last resort, I turned on the convection fan in the oven, and almost instantly the bread got a nice brown. Another issue I had was the darn rolls were "glued" to the bottom. It took me a while with a spatula to get them off. But after all that, the rolls were really good. I didn't have philly cheese steak meat handy, but I had Chicago Italian beef in the freezer.....and it was delicious. Next time, I think I'll stay with the dutch oven but use parchment paper to prevent sticking and use the convection oven for browning (I suspect the light colored walls of the Le Creuset were keeping radiation heat from the rolls. And next time will be a Philly cheese steak (I went to school in Philly when a cheesesteak was only $1).
Can you apply a pinch of flaky salt to the exterior before baking? Interior won't be affected, but you'll get that little bit of saltines in the bite. I would go very light so it is subtle. Medium holes in the interior are great for holding onto things. Nothing worse than biting a sandwich that pulls apart. To develop more flavor in the roll, could you age the dough in the fridge overnight? Pizza doughs and breads that are aged before baking taste a lot better. Is there a downside for rolls? Also, would ghee (clarified butter where the floating solids are skimmed off and the other solids are browned...) brushed on the dough before baking help at all? Flavor wise, that brown butter flavor with the high heat tolerance of the ghee (up to 500 degrees F) might be very nice. If it isn't good to cover the dough in it, it might be great brushed on the bottom.
14:54 if you put The dough under the baking steel for the first 10 minutes would that help the oven spring and help with over all quality of the rolls?
If I’m using a blodgert or Marshall stone pizza oven, will that affect the humidity? What should I do? Add ice cubes? This is for someone who’s making 50 rolls a day.
i think u can reserve engineer the salt content by looking at the sodium content. i forget its like 7:10 sodium:salt, but probably not that. whatever the number is, its probably not crazy crucial as testing results r more important
Bro! Thank you! ive been looking for someone to perfect the philly/jersey roll! Sarcones and liscios being my favorite as Angelos uses sarcones. I cant wait to try these when i get a chance! also what if i replace the yeast with sourdough. does that change everything? im new to the baking scene. i randomly stumbled onto your page. keep it up man! digging all the vids so far.
I've probably missed this but with all your percentages, how do you easily convert this to manageable units for your recipe? I'll try to look on your recipe to see if it's all spelled out there.
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