How Math Can Help Decode Art

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Even though math and art feel like polar opposites, it turns out computer algorithms and calculations can help us see masterpieces in a new light. From using wavelet decomposition to study Van Gogh to using convolutional filters in restoring the Ghent Altarpiece, there's tons of high-tech ways we cal learn about antique masterpieces.
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17 сен 2024

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Комментарии : 179

@SciShow Год назад

Head to linode.com/scishow to get a $100 60-day credit on a new Linode account. Linode offers simple, affordable, and accessible Linux cloud solutions and services.

@beepboop204 Год назад

@MariaMartinez-researcher Год назад

4:27. Summa Theologica is not just a "14th century religious text." For starters, it was published in 1485, so it is a *15th century* work. It is one of the biggest, most important, *first systematic* compilation of (theological) knowledge in the history of knowledge. Yep, for non-Christian (Catholic, specifically) or non-religious people the magnum opus of St. Thomas Aquinas, Doctor of the Church, may seem unimportant, but the history of culture includes all manifestations of culture, and that includes religion; Christianity is, for better and for worse, a defining element of Western civilization and culture. Most of the video is about a religious painting. Without basic theological knowledge, you won't be able to recognize the characters in it nor understand what the painting *means.* Also, theological librarian here. Summa Theologica is a fundamental part in the education of modern Catholic priests, and very important for other churches too. It's an *encyclopedia,* written centuries before the Encyclopédie. Please check the Wikipedia article for more details.

@joyta1518 Год назад

@@beepboop204 😅😊😅😅😊😊😅i😅😅ì😅😅ìi😅😊😅😊😅😊i😊i😅i😅ì😅😅ì😊7😅😅😊😊😅😅😅😊😅😊😮😅😅😅😮😮😮😅😅😮😅😅😅😅😅😮😅😅😮😮😅😮

@acoupleofschoes Год назад

I had a professor in college who had done research in this area. When Van Gogh was painting, he bought rolls of canvas, then cut out each size he needed. X-ray imaging can take a photo of the canvas' weave structure underneath the paint. Our final project was to use those x-ray scans to try and organize some Van Gogh paintings in the correct sequential order and orientation the canvas came off the roll.

@jschouten1985 Год назад

That's actually a different area....that has to do with science instead of math

@acoupleofschoes Год назад

@@jschouten1985 It was an Image Processing class. We were using convolutional filters.

@jenniferr3144 Год назад

That is amazing.

@jameshill2450 Год назад

@@jschouten1985 The most famous thing about science is how it doesn't ever involve numbers.

@michaelmicek Год назад

As someone who taught himself some image processing circa 1990 to help petroleum engineers, and also took a course in metric topology, convolution is so simple it hardly feels like math.

@catherinebaldwin6580 Год назад

“Wait? Art is Math?” “Always have been.” Joking aside, as an online artist and applied math major, I love the combination of art and math in my field. This art recognition program sound like something I would like to do for a thesis.

@spindash64 Год назад

And if we count in Music, then it’s even Mathier. And also linguistier.

@Hecarim420 Год назад

Language is also mathematical 👀ツ ==> Like the rest of Universe ¯\_(👀)_/¯ ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

@whiteshadow7584 Год назад

I wish I did something related to image processing for my undergraduate thesis in Mathematics. Unfortunately, there were very few professors in our Maths department who did applied math (the institution itself was more focused in pure maths so most faculty members specialized in those) and I resigned to getting the creepy professor as an advisor and doing a topic I didn't much care for. It's one of those things I regret doing but I had to.

@Halal_Sahibi 6 месяцев назад

I guess math is the law of earth

@hannahhaugen1694 Год назад

What a lovely introduction to convolution! And art history too! One of my favorite Scishow episodes I’ve watched in a long time.

@wonder_platypus8337 Год назад

Same. Felt like it went into a lot more depth into the subject.

@sdwvit Год назад

same here, its so good

@LectrifiedGypso Год назад

At first I thought this video was going to be about the geometry used in art. Instead I got to learn about technology that I had no idea about. Thanks for the interesting information!

@LukeVilent Год назад

Yeah, convolutuonal neutal networks, the backbone of the image processing - now being replaced and merged with transformer networks. My bread and butter.

@Birddop Год назад

Always new topics to learn about 🥰 thank you guys so much

@CuriosityRocks Год назад

Would love more videos about the science and psychology of art please

@Aabil11 Год назад

We love you, Hank... praying for your speedy recovery

@matthewsemenuk8953 Год назад

You got this Hank! We believe in you! ❤

@SamHunley Год назад

I just wanted to say that I appreciate that y'all avoided throwing around hot buzzwords. It would have been easy to play up the machine learning/AI aspect of these tools, but instead, y'all focused on the mathematics. I'm not sure if I'm making complete sense (I blame a head cold), but in short, y'all could have tried to go viral, but instead, y'all focused on quality. And I think that's awesome.

@treehouse318 Год назад

totally.🧠😎📚

@ZweiZombies Год назад

Amazing video! Really cool that you go into some detail on the tools involved. Also going to plug that Maths is really just a form of art, once you master it to the point where various tools (read: axioms, theorems, definitions, entire subfields) just feel like different Lego blocks

@SmittenKitten. Год назад

Loved every second of this. Fascinating!

@cpu088 Год назад

"as wide as a two-car garage door and almost twice as tall" - Americans will use anything but the metric system :D Love the show, btw, thx for sharing!

@MrOiram46 Год назад

Well, that description is easier to visualize, more so for Americans because some American homes do have two-car garages. When it comes to smaller things though, I hate the fractions and prefer mm/cm

@willd4686 Год назад

If you want a fun programming challenge write code to do edge detections and blurs. No libraries though! You need to implement the matrix multiplications yourself!

@KittytheKatfish Год назад

Could you tell your friends from PBS EONS to make another season of their podcast please?

@_HMCB_ Год назад

Great channel. I’ve watched three of your videos today and love the depth of the research while not making it overbearing. You’ve earned a new subscriber. 👍🏽

@BakeBakePi Год назад

Very interesting!

@BlackRainRaven Год назад

and now imagine this kind of tech gets refined, improved and integrated into the AIs doing art right now, or Chat GPT for that matter. If we figure out code to analyse and distinguish artists and their methods, the already scary AI and Deepfakes are just going to reach a new level, giving the artistic community even more headaches. Not sure if this kind of development is good or not but certainly entertaining to observe from an outsiders perspective.

@Mallory-Malkovich Год назад

Maybe now a computer will finally be able to tell which paintings are Picasso's and which paintings are actually Elmir's. Some famous galleries are in for a surprise!

@jameseddleman6944 Год назад

No no no no no, no no no no no, no no no no no. I did not hate math and only doodle in class just to have this be true.

@llipses Год назад

"Hey, you got math in my art!” “Hey, you got art in my math!”

@grandvivant Год назад

I feel this. I’m out of university now but my last year of high school I took a self taught online AP computer science course and nearly failed it because it had crappy lessons and I am a horrible self moderator. The project it all went south on was me trying to make convolution filters. It isn’t incredibly hard as it is mostly working with arrays of variables (think of the array as being the values of the pixels and then another being the kernel in the video example and a final array being the output values for the pixels of the image). I am pretty sure it went south because that was a lot of loops to keep track of in code and I was not understanding object oriented style of C++. But man this video gave me some ‘not paying attention in class’ flashbacks

@SquintyGears Год назад

Relax it's just about pattern recognition. Your doodles are safe

@rwesenberg Год назад

Didn't know math could be so ...creative, did yah?

@wyndhamcoffman8961 Год назад

@The European Bee here's the thing that most people don't understand. You are the describing arithmetic; (which, quite frankly, is so boring we invented machines to do it for us) while arithmetic is math, not all math is arithmetic. In a lot of cases, you have to get away from the numbers and picture it with something a little more intuitive. But basically math it self is more of a way to describe logical concepts in a way that is repeatable and easily manipulated.

@rosebishop5755 Год назад

I think this is my favorite scishow video ever! So cool! love the marriage of math and art. Hadn't ever heard of that art work before by the two brothers. I'll have to look it up now. So sad and sweet he finished the painting for his brother. Also that they actually painted a page of a book on that massive artwork. Mystery solved.

@krisgardner7160 Год назад

This video and the fact that I’m a CS/ Comp Engr major really makes me want a SciSchow Computer Science channel/series

@ololh4xx Год назад

this is also a great explanation about the inner mechanics of software which the media keeps calling "AI". Its a misnomer - neural nets like these ones have no connection to artifical intelligence. At all.

@stephaniet1389 Год назад

There was a comment somewhere how back in the day, they didn't call it "A.I.", they called it statistics.

@nemonomen3340 Год назад

I’ve heard this a few times now and it’s always a little more annoying the next time. Is it intelligent? Check. Is it artificial? Check. I’m calling it artificial intelligence. The boomers were wrong when they named it.

@ololh4xx Год назад

@@XOPOIIIO they are *vastly* different, you should read up on the topic - neural nets only simulate singular, apparent, abstract, simplified functions which are connected - neurons on the other hand are far from being simple, even apparently simple processes like signal exchange are highly complicated, unlike the trivial operations done by neural nets and their nodes. Just because the results of GPT are impressive and just because you *want* something to be true it doesnt have to be true ;-)

@ololh4xx Год назад

@@nemonomen3340 read up on the facts. NN has no "intelligence" at all. These are static collections of mathematical functions which approximate a desired result. You would've known that if you had understood this video

@ololh4xx Год назад

@@stephaniet1389 exactly - its basically fancy statistics - nothing more and nothing less. Impressive statistics - but statistics nonetheless

@digitalnation2876 Год назад

much love from Indonesia ❤

@elainebelzDetroit Год назад

If you stand in front of the Old Guitarist at the AIC (kinda below, when I was there), you can see there's another image under it. Very cool. After spending a lot of time around Dominicans (Order of Preachers) in grad school, it's kinda nice to hear the Summa simply called "a 14th-century religious text."

@michaelmicek Год назад

😂

@y_fam_goeglyd Год назад

Fascinating stuff! I did a bit of art history back in my uni days and have always found it fascinating. If any of a bunch of particularly excellent art historians do a new series, I'm going to record it to keep so I can rewatch it over and over. Thus I'm _very_ familiar with the Ghent Altar lol - it's one of the most incredibly detailed paintings throughout history, there is so much in it that you couldn't possibly see everything if you went there every day for a week and studied each panel intently. I'm not sure a month would cover it. I'd love to see what the neural network or whatever it's officially called could come up with for Mona Lisa. (No, I haven't even read that book or seen the film. I'd been a huge Leonardo fan for decades before that pulp-worthy trash was written. It did terrible things to poor Leo's reputation. Some people still think it's nonfiction! It doesn't help that the "History" Channel and its piers - those which once lived up to their titles - has done so much twaddle on the Knights Templar and insist on talking about Da Vinci as part of it. Though tbh, I stopped watching those dubbed as "new information about the secret organisation" which back then made it sound interesting, after the second or third one...) We know there are different versions of her hands and face, and there are some tiny marks which look like they might well be something definitive yet currently can only be honestly described as a paint mark. So much study has been done each time scientists and engineers come up with new scanning technology, but this would be worth a new mathematical study (unless they've already done it and not told us yet!)

@shielatemplo8015 Год назад

The golden ratio is used in the most popular art like the Mona Lisa and starry night

@chelseascreatures Год назад

the whole painting on top of another painting doesn't really surprise those of us who create paintings for a living and canvas is expensive.

@TazPessle Год назад

@1:52. Plus the aging and differential contraction/degradation of different components over the years. Even stable ideal humidity can't stop general degradation of historic materials.

@God-ld6ll Год назад

my two pieces of art. How to measure anything: treat such as a set of categorical points, or what i would call, for now (if you can guess why), pixel calculus. Treating "pixels" as a superset of "bits", or what i would call "pixits" or "pixies" for now. Hope this is clear, and also "pragmatic" or "useful". Could also be a "pragmatic approach" to things.

@michaelborror4399 Год назад

Thoth is the god of writing and wisdom, depicted as a babboon, or sacred ibis, or as a man with the head of an ibis, and the ghent alterpiece. While I was just reading about the falcon headed god of the moon, khonsu who's name means traveler, and the ram or rhino headed god of potters, khnum.

@MikeyMxes Год назад

But @hankgreen, can math show me what to get my mom for her birthday?

@BUG25985 Год назад

M.C. Escher has entered the chat

@davesatxify Год назад

Wow. Just wow.

@warrixsin Год назад

This was a really nice video

@AuntyKsTarot Год назад

Yes! My love of art and math justified!

@LukeVilent Год назад

Thing is - math is art. Choosing what you want to work on in math is not different from choosing an artistic style. And why I can't call myself an artist, I feel that once you choose the style, a good piece of art follows as if by itself, like theorem from a set of axioms.

@7Alberto7 Год назад

Amazing!!!!

@yanguskhan8513 Год назад

i misread the title of this video as "how meth can help decode art"... that would be a completely wild video.

@chrystal1062 Год назад

Math has never been independent from art. I took a class last semester that focused on optics and lighting, and that requires a lot of geometry, and also knowledge from science!

@chrystal1062 Год назад

It’s interesting to see how there are different ways to use technology to better past artworks!

@shakiMiki Год назад

The very existence of Leonardo da Vinci settles that false choice.

@treehouse318 Год назад

seriously cool episode, y'all. thank you!😎

@VisualZentube 11 месяцев назад

"Galileo Galilei in his II Saggiatore wrote that “[The universe] is written in the language of mathematics, and its characters are triangles, circles, and other geometric figures.” Artists who strive and seek to study nature must therefore first fully understand mathematics. On the other hand, mathematicians have sought to interpret and analyse art through the lens of geometry and rationality."

@JWQweqOPDH Год назад

In a way calling neural networks math is like calling humans chemistry. It's technically true.

@michaelmicek Год назад

Yeah, this is all numbers. Mathematicians rarely deal with so many numbers. What this really is is engineering.

@bruh-xm6fv Год назад

WOOOAAHHGGH

@paullough4946 Год назад

One of my Uncles was the best art forger in the Western Hemisphere

@KitsukiiPlays Год назад

Actually, math and art have one thing is common: I can’t understand either

@starrywizdom Год назад

Great job! Do one one Math & Music, please?

@wurzelgnom5760 Год назад

People who think that math has no creativity in it have no idea what math realy is. It is about connecting ideas and arranging arguments to prove stuff. Like these guys did, you need creativity to come up with this solution to that problem. Just calculating stuff is like colouring by numbers, you just doing whats left to do after someone else has been creativ. So many people fail in math because they don't realize that they should be creative in math.

@AA-eq2zq Год назад

Yeah it's really unfortunate that math is (generally) taught like that. This reminds me of an article I read recently by Clifton B. Parker, titled 'Research shows the best ways to learn math', that talks about what outdated mainstream education (and therefore most people) get wrong about mathematical thinking and ability.

@shakiMiki Год назад

Art historians are notorious for getting things wrong. However much they may know, desire for things to be so, for the best or most base reason, totally distorts their judgement. That is why fakes are so easy to slip through. Experts can seee what they want or need to.

@zralok Год назад

This is like the most basic introduction to image analysis, but good video.

@robertfindley921 Год назад

This technology has been around for 30+ years. It's been used in probably every major discipline known such as medicine, archeology, meteorology, metallurgy, astronomy, .... Computers are just better and faster at it today.

@sdwvit Год назад

which tech are you referring too? markov chains or kmeans?

@sleepypotato4046 Год назад

I’ve felt upset with no rime or reason for it. Bo particular trigger and no negative thoughts in my mind. Just feelings. Can you make a video about that? ❤

@AA-eq2zq Год назад

You should see a doctor and psychiatrist about that if possible and look the issue up ("mood swings" and "feel upset for no reason" should be good search phrases). Wishing you well!

@sleepypotato4046 Год назад

@@AA-eq2zq thanks❤️

@Jesse-zk9ge Год назад

Personally for me, although being a starving artist I might be a little biased. But I think stuff like this is actually the right way to use tools like math. I think it's a lot better than using our gifts and talents to squander in a way, the incredible way that people create things. Personally I think that we should be using our gifts more and art in cures, then greed and bombs.✌

@SS-pw8en Год назад

Meth or math? 😆

@Jesse-zk9ge Год назад

@@SS-pw8en whoops sorry! I used the talk to text feature, it tends to screw up worse than my old phone. There I think I fixed it. Thank you.🙏✌

@nothinginteresting1662 Год назад

This is my dream video....😁

@robbob1866 Год назад

I can see this being misused instead of being a "tool". Investigators can get too close and familiar with the "experts" they use and develop a bias flavouring the results of the expert without getting a second opinion or insuring that the person has the credentials for that subject. Basically the program can learn what gets liked most and a person might get more reliant on it's results rather than putting in an effort to double check it

@ivanborsuk1110 Год назад

2:57 2 * 2 = 2

@gordonwchas Год назад

Loved this. Thank you for not explaining this in a convoluted way.

@carlosvergara4132 Год назад

"As wide a 2 car garage doors" Just use meters man 😅

@shakiMiki Год назад

Americans will use anything but metric measure.

@jensphiliphohmann1876 Год назад

00:45f: _...computers which can process images in ways humans can not._ Technically, they can, it takes just way too much time. Humans programmed the computers in the first place with that very algorithms which do that work.

@jonatanromanowski9519 Год назад

Go Go Sci Show!

Год назад

X-rays also reveal that art supplies have always been expensive and maybe the artist is just saving coin 🤷‍♂️

@TrippLilley Год назад

Disappointed that you didn’t credit the principal investigator on the Ghent project, Phil McCracken.

@MariaMartinez-researcher Год назад

@michaelmicek Год назад

Yes... it was an astounding abstraction. Another commenter who has spent more time with Dominicans than he wanted thought it was excellent.

@briancrainfan Год назад

Get well soon

@paineoftheworld Год назад

First, we must take the idealized, fully spherical piece of art and measure its volume of worthiness...

@michaelmicek Год назад

That would raise the level of discussion to physics. Still not math.

@user-ht9ns6ho6p 5 месяцев назад

this is really helpful for my exhibition and it is even helpful to make me a successful kid and i am a 11 year old kid

@jurajchobot Год назад

Is it possible to make the same video but for music?

@brendanmooney7607 Год назад

NO EDGE!

@erkindanger Год назад

DUDE, NO EDGE!!

@lauram9478 Год назад

❤

@yellowflowerorangeflower5706 Год назад

Cool

@Rick.Fleischer Год назад

Michelangelo was a mathematical artist.

@Zappygunshot Год назад

I'd like to point out that, in fact, _literally all_ art today still involves a human that can love and suffer and experience the world. AI 'generated' art isn't a new creation, the AI has just stuck together stuff from a database, in a way that AI's creator said it should, based on input parameters provided by a commissioner. When it comes to who made that, it's not the person who typed in the prompt; they're a commissioner. It isn't the person who made the AI, either; they crafted a tool to be used by others. And it certainly isn't the AI; they had no intent of their own. Therefore, the person or people that made the work is the person or people that made the things in the AI's database. Humans, not AI.

@michaelcovelli9461 Год назад

Fun fact the ghent altarpiece was, at one time, painted over by art restorers. The lamb was made less ugly but was later removed to reveal its creepy ass face! Also I hope you’re hanging in there Hank❤️

@Rhenzkiller Год назад

in movies this is called "enhance"

@kellydalstok8900 Год назад

When is the world finally going to learn to pronounce Van Gogh? If I were to pronounce Hank’s name using the Dutch rules of pronunciation, he would be called Hahnk Grain, with a gutteral R. But we try to pronounce names like they’re supposed to. English speakers really are living in a bubble when it comes to language.

@michaelmicek Год назад

"Europeans call Niklaus Wirth by name, but Americans call him by value."

@_SimpleJack_ Год назад

"he did the math on accident before he excaped" - most American sentence ever

@riccardo_aquilanti Год назад

Yes it's mathematics, but it wouldn't be possible without computer science

@michaelmicek Год назад

I would say it's hardly math, and hardly computer science... which is kind of theoretical applied math anyway, and not really about computers (as the quote attributed to Dijkstra explains).

@krellend20 Год назад

Is this the focus testing to see if saying "Math" goes over better than "AI"?

@sarahkatenoel Год назад

Lololol. Okay, I admit it! "Computers using statistics" does sound better to me than "Skynet."

@catherinebaldwin6580 Год назад

But this is technically not an AI, it’s a stats computer problem. That like saying a toaster is a robot because it does a task. The only AI is the neural network, which to be honest is more correct and cooler sounding. An AI is a general process that can change it task if the job changes. A stats computer program is not that.

@sarahkatenoel Год назад

@@catherinebaldwin6580 I'm confused, I thought AI that can dynamically change to fit a broad range of problems was called General AI? And that, um, G-AI was under the umbrella term of "AI" along with "Neural Nets," and "Machine Learning"? (I'm actually asking, my AI/ML knowledge is extra basic and I want to eventually get the terminology right)

@catherinebaldwin6580 Год назад

@@sarahkatenoel Sorry. There too many different types of "AI" Specific AI is design to do a 'task' like beat the human in a game. They can change based on the moves of the human, but can't say, predict weather. General AI is technical impossible right now. It's an AI that can predict the weather, beat the gamer, control a robot, all with one program. This is not an Specific or General AI, because the outside can't change it's behavior. It will always do say, 2+ no matter the number. Neural Network is a type of AI, that is so compilated, but it still Specific AI. I just wish there was a diferent word for the Neural Networks designing art vs the level 1 COM on Smash Bros. I just Really, Really don't like how they use the same name, because they aren't the same thing.

@sarahkatenoel Год назад

@@catherinebaldwin6580 That makes sense, thank you

@curtiswritt8474 Год назад

The first time I read the title I read How meth can decode art!

@donpeters9849 Год назад

I'm thinking that there are a lot of sellers/collectors, very worried about this.

@madtscientist8853 Год назад

I'm going to say this we used math to make art so it only makes sense to reverse engineer it use math to decode it. 101

@TheRealSkeletor Год назад

Anybody who thinks math and art are separate and unrelated things is neither familiar with Fibonacci spirals nor with the Golden Ratio. Also, "Van Gogh" is not pronounced like "Van Go."

@gaeshows1938 Год назад

Bagayna

@filonin2 Год назад

Why is everything italic?

@peter4210 Год назад

Math cant decode art. Math can't even handle a division

@rustix3 Год назад

Title should be more like how computers can help decode art.

@jandoel Год назад

Oh man, you're probably better off enrolling at the University of Phoenix than getting an art history degree these days

@alexzheng7441 Год назад

Hey, did anyone instantly think of 3blue1brown?

@CaritasGothKaraoke Год назад

Please start pronouncing Van Gogh’s name correctly. How would you like it if someone mangled your name like that. The “gh” IS NOT SILENT.

@michaelmicek Год назад

No, because 'murica. (Says the man who spells his name "Micek" but insists on "me check".)

@diegoantoniorosariopalomin9979 Год назад

People who have read Steel Ball run can confirm

@Trag-zj2yo Год назад

Might put art forgers out of business

@michaelmicek Год назад

Nah, on the contrary, it will lead to better and better forgeries.

@sugarfish Год назад

I guess it would take a few more episodes to explain how AI create new art in real artist’s style.

@michaelmicek Год назад

Yeah, I expect Markov modeling is involved, though.

@deborahbloom4624 Год назад

WWwwwhhhhhhhhaaaaaaatttttt????

@ibrahiymmuhammad4773 Год назад

Answer to why more people that wear glasses are nerds

@xpndblhero5170 Год назад

I don't like the idea of this..... It's a little to Matrix for me. LoL

@johnmaurer8596 Год назад

I was hoping this was going to be about the geometry used to layout paintings. :|

@oldman_eleven Год назад

Hey at least youre not telling us math is racist.

@jensphiliphohmann1876 Год назад

I never thought of maths and art as opposites.

@pjpcarv Год назад

"As wide as two garage doors" - americans will use anything as a measurement unit, but metric. ;)

@nicstroud Год назад

Yeah, cool story but am I the only person who wanted to know what was written on the book in the Ghent Altarpiece? So, you pique our interest and then just leave us hanging? Not cool.