This is one of those narratives that started back in the day on reddit/4chan/twitter and with a couple of clips that don't tell the full story. It paints the JP fanbase in a more negative light than was actually the case and gives more credit to the overseas fanbase than is due. Not saying that some JP fans didn't over react and that overseas fans didn't help, both of these are true, but it's been exaggerated to fit the narrative. It's been repeated so often now though that most people just treat it as a fact. There was never a mass exodus of Towa's JP fans. As is often the case with this type of drama it was just a small number of crazies. Also the issue wasn't that she had a bf, it was that she panicked and lied that it was management...very similar to the Rushia situation where the issue was never "GFE" or that she was messaging mafumafu, it was that she panicked and broke her NDA. Overseas bros absolutely had her back though and it was around the time Hololive was blowing up in the west because of Korone, Miko, Fubuki and the others so there was a large influx of EN viewers to everyone. So overall still a great video, I just think that overtime the facts tend to get sensationalized and made more melodramatic by fans retelling it because it makes for a better story, making finding what actually happened a lot more difficult. Keep up the good work!
@@somerando6215 Girlfriend Experience. Basically when the vtuber goes full on "yes we ARE in a REAL relationship" to their fans, giving them tons of fan service and what not. One example of this being Rushia, going so far as to sell wedding rings with marriage certificates.
@@somerando6215 Girlfriend Experience. It tends to get labeled on vtubers/streamers who do ASMR content or do yandere skits like Rushia did. My personal opinion here, but the whole GFE label is kinda absurd to me. 95% of Rushia's content was gaming streams, she rarely did ASMR and the yandere skits were no more than any other member like Korone or a bunch of other vtubers do. She was famous for her rage, not for acting like a girlfriend.
Says the extremist fans that drove away Coco. And the toxic fans that got Rushia fired. If you ask me, there is no such thing as "foreign" fans being better. Toxic fans are going to be toxic regardless of where they are from.
I wish I knew about her back then when she debuted so that I could also give her all my support during her rough times. I’m so glad she’s doing great nowadays. She’s bought me out of the dark times of Covid when I hit rock bottom. She’s my everything now and from the bottom of my heart, I wish only the best for her no matter what. Kenzuko forever 👾💜🫶🏻🙏🏻
It unironically ended up being one of the best moments for her career. By purging her audience of fans like that during her early career it has allowed her to be unhindered when it comes to collabs. Nowadays she has the most amount of connections in the Vtuber community of any Hololive talent by far having played with people from Nijisanji, Vspo, 774, a bunch of large Japanese indie Vtubers/Regular RU-vidrs, and even Western Apex Pros like RPR .
Yep. This is pretty much a blessing in disguise since her popularity skyrocketed, and she got a ton of exposure and connection that usually takes a lot of time to get. plus, a free "Garbage" disposal at the start of her career. A pretty much best case scenario.
If it weren't for this case, which purged all her toxic "fans" in the beginning, Towa won't have shining career in APEX. If she kept "pure idol mentality" like Kanata and refusing any contact with men, she won't be partnered with CPT, Mondo or Selly, and would never win any APEX Tournaments. It is truly a blessing in disguise. Her fanbase nowadays dont give a crap whoever she wants to collab with, men and women alike.
@@Cosmoman78 what you have against kanata, just asking because she Is successful in her career as an idol to the point that her Path as lead her to More success than towa in the wallet department, maybe if you understand More about them too you Will see that neither towa or kanata are doing nothing wrong in their own paths as streamers, towa was a lot More of an fps gamer that Is why she needed connections, kanata Is not so good at gaming so and she actually had a bad reputation with the community at the start called a leech to coco and now she overcome that, but because you dont watch her you are trying to shit on her and her choice to be like she wants.
This also shows how much the company has changed, they went from: "we're sorry for inconvenience caused by the talent", to: "Our company has no control over the talent's private life".
@@TOBY-jy7bz Rushia's drama prior to her Termination, the company was defending her "potentially having a relationship IRL", up until she leaked information, and then she was Terminated
@@TheDarkSinedwestern fans could find their own wife cheating on them in bed with another man and still take her back the next day this is the mentality of 'overseas bros' 😂
@@nev781 Time will show what happened to her (maybe). She joining another group? Doing something else? Or just staying private and never stream again. We won't know the true cause, until we do. Tons of people who talked shit about her are trolls who just want to put a group of people in bad light. Some are actually in that group. THE HATE FROM BOTH SIDES IS BAD NO MATTER WHAT AND IS NOT JUSTIFIED.
She really has been one of the most committed to learn English, which is great. I think her fanbase includes many Korean fans as well, maybe because she played much with Korean Apex players.
so who that male voice? her brother too??(like other vtubers that called brother/sister that secretly their bf/gf) is he in one house like rushia mafu n fbk oga too?? moona brother now its famous as rendy the moona pregnator(congrats of the first kid moona irl) maybe we dont deserve their irl time becoz we just love the virtual vtuber not the irl girl who voicing them, so i dunno what we can do in future becoz the all talent irl have future too
It literally could have been anyone, a brother, dad, or yes a boyfriend. It's legit sad that people fetish/fantasies got messed up from the mistake, sad really.
It was probably none of those! The voice wasn't even from inside Towa's home, it was over the in-game voice chat. It was even more inoffensive than what the video states here.
Wait are you trying to tell my all the the hololive girls don't love me and may actually have a life outside of playing video games? Next you'll tell me they're using the toilet during idol meetings.
As a kenzoku i am very happy for towa sama her music saved me when i was in a despair a 2 years ago thats when i discovered hololive and she became my oshi
It was around that time I found this community as well. I often wonder how many people were genuinely saved from the mental mess of 2020 because of the lifeline Hololive sent out to them. It really did create an escape from the political and social strife. Ultimately it's just internet entertainment, but it still represented something wholesome and optimistic that was sorely lacking elsewhere at the time.
I'm the same way, cause I kept jumping from different people in hololive and always thought that okayu ( hoped I spelled that right ) was my favorite. Once I gave towa a chance due to seeing a clip of her 3D debut I was in complete disbelief with how incredibly talented she was. So from then on she is my absolute favorite and will forever be my oshi
I also remember reading a comment about Pekora (I think it was Pekora, could have been a different member) getting backlash after she accidently showed that she tracked her menstrual cycles on a calendar, and some of the obsessed fans thought that meant she had a "partner". It's unreal how parasocial fans get with idols. Really happy to learn that overseas fans helped Towa through it.
lmao that's the stupidest shit ever (also a sign that these mfs never really interacted with women irl lol). Women HAVE to track their menstrual cycles for health reasons, not just bc of sex lol.
At one point, her chat had mostly English comments. Nowadays, it mostly has Japanese comments, like any other JP member, which is probably for the best. Also, between this "controversy" and how nicely the incident with Mel's stalker got resolved, relatively speaking, has left us wildly inadequately prepared for when Mano Aloe left.
All the Kaigai Nikki Kenzoku are still there with Towa, they just mostly use the Fandiscord to talk instead of speaking in english in chat. But when ever Towa asks something regarding english you will instantly see the chat get filled with english. They are here, they just dont saturate chat with english.
@@VindyCh. Oh, I'm not accusing overseas kenzokus of disappearing. I'm just saying that her Japanese audience has grown dramatically since then, which, for a streamer who is most fluent in Japanese, is a good thing.
@@MaidenlessScrub We Kenzoku Protect Towa-Sama as much as we can, if she's upset we cheer her up. If she is feeling like giveing up, we give her power to push on. It is pretty much the same treatment Aki gets, i am in the rabbit hole since Sora Dai Senpai's debuted. I have seen them all grow over the Years. But Aki always has a sweet spot in my heart and trough out the Gens it was Coco and Towa wich i spent the most time watching. I will always be a Tatsunoko, but same a Rosetai and Kenzoku.
@@jaferg I am actually really happy that Towa-sama has grown her Japanese fan base also over the Years since that incident. But Percent wise its still more of a 60-40% Kaigai Nikki fan base for her, she has a massive English speaking fanbase and also a rather large Korean Fanbase.
First off, if it was a boyfriend or husband, that shouldn't be any of our business. Secondly, the voice could be a lot of other males with no romantic or sexual relationship. Father, brother, roommate, friend. All of those and more are possible relationships this man could have to her.
This video is a little bit incorrect about the incident itself - the voice wasn't even from inside Towa's home. It was over the in-game voice chat, and the male voice was talking about the game. It didn't stop a certain sect of viewers from absolutely losing their minds over it, though. 🙄
You talking about the ideal and i agree with you but unfortunately thats not how idol culture work in japan. They know what theyre getting into and accept what come with it
@ルリ except no one should accept such bs. It isn't anyone's business who anyone is friends with in rl or what their relationship status is. No fan is owed anything of this sort no matter much they want to believe they are. This is toxic..
@@nobody-xh6ii even heard when in rome do as roman does? This is exactly it except its japan. I dont like it too but it is what it is. They know the risk and accept it just like how they accept the reward.
I didn't initially like her design, but her voice was captivating, especially when I listened to her covers. Then I grew to like her more as the years went on and hearing this story just makes me appreciate her even more! Do your best, Towa-sama, and everyone else in the Hololive company!
This reminds me of Rushia's controversy, and it makes me sad. It shows that she could have bounced back from what happened, but she panicked and leaked information that broke her contract with hololive.
Yup that's why i don't like how strict they are with BS about things there. I believe they should have their personal life hell i hope they have boyfriends or are married those girls are amazing and really talented all of them and people just shitting over them because some simp can't get trough his head that some girl can have a boyfriend is really f...d up.
@@kylewood4488-b9r yea, I'm up to date with it as well. It seems like Rushia is just unstable as a person in general. Her possessive and insecure behaviour makes me concerned for her mental health.
Do note that nowadays Towas fanbase has gone back to majority Japanese. After the whole male voice debacle Towa has suffered quite a slow growth, I believe one of the turning point to this is her 3D debut stream. Her singing Error in that stream jumpstarted her rise. Other than that, her participation in various APEX tournaments also help boost up her popularity. A lot of JP Apex viewer saw her performance and fell in love with her resulting in her current viewerbase.
Man, I remember this. I fell down the vtuber rabbit hole around that time, and would watch and support Towa after all the drama, glad to see our angel managed to bounce back and become one of the most beloved members of Hololive.
I got in Hololive a few months after this, via Korone's Doom streams. So I was never aware of this incident. So it turns out there's much more to TOWA's effort to speak English than just from playing APEX. That's great to know. Thanks for creating this video.
>idols must be pure Ah yes, good old Perfect Blue Back in the mid 90s or something I had a mega crush on Naomi Tamura and I didn't even know who she was at that point but I lived in the sticks, In Germany, and I was completely taken away by this new awesome kind of exotic music. She coulda had 9001 children and twice as many partners, I was still listening to that crappy wobbly tape my penpal sent me on my crappy cassette player radio to listen to her songs during summer like crazy. Idols should be required to have a partner to become idols from now on. I don't see how it would get in the way over fawning and parasocial, hel, for men, having a ring on your finger attracts women who might think they can outperform your wife, man. Lol. But perhaps they think they can be her first...what a delusion, man. Poor idols.
P.S.: And I stand by the children and partner things. If at that point in time, back then, I could have had an opportunity to hear her sing one of her songs live, i would have gone. And if she winked at me or blew a kiss at me, I would have gone crazy like "Oh wow she noticed me" lmao, even if she had a whole darn harem for herself. I really hope the industry one day shakes this off. And no, I'm not a feminist or anything. If it were just vapid whöering then I'd be put off, virtual or not. But i bet you're getting what I'm saying anyway so I'll stop explaining.
Hey man.... Congrats to whoever is with Towa-Sama. I hope he's just as proud of her as we are and supports her as much if not more than we do. I'm just happy she continued to stay and give us entertainment that we enjoy and I'm glad we got to listen to the amazing bangers that she's released.
not only did the overseas fans help she paid it forward when it comes to the ID and EN girls shes the one who communicates with them first shes the one who helps them when they are over in japan and u can truly see that she loves overseas people as a whole
i love towa. she was one of the first hololive members i saw clips of, and i took a liking to her personality immediately. she is so funny and sweet. i’m happy both she and her audience are in a better place now. it’s nice to see her grow
Imagine almost being cancelled by your own so called "FANS" for something so petty. It's really sad that they would do such a thing. I don't understand their mentality, but damn.
I remember that it was sad (her followers dropped a lot, but after that many overseas made her followers increase more and more). In retrospect, thanks to that now she can even do collabs with men. Personally, I see that incident more as doing a weirdos cleanup.
Tokoyami "the beloved" Towa sama. . The unspoken title or nickname given by the viewers as early as 250,000 subs. . Despite the hardships she had encountered, towa sama always has been worried towards her viewers. . Miss Towa cares. a lot. That's why everyone simply called her "Angel." . Everyone knew they met someone "special." . We love you Towa Sama! 🥰
I still remember seeing all this happen in real time and seeing the overseas fans rally up for Towa in that week alone. It was kind of a blessing in disguise in that Towa never really had a notable identity since her debut until after she returned. By that time, only her real fans stood by.
Ah thank you for bringing it up for those who are unaware of this drama at that time, it's basically "The needs of the many, outweigh the needs of the few" quite from Sentinel Prime that Towa's overwhelming English speaking viewers came to her rescue and saved her career.
It was a dark time for her, it's really amazing how far the Asian audience can go for such nonsensical things. Towa sama is an incredible streamer and it would be a shame if for something so small they had destroyed her future in hololive. I really like Towa and I even traveled there to see her in concert because she is worth it ❤
It was a dark time for her, it's really amazing how far the Asian audience can go for such nonsensical things. Towa sama is an incredible streamer and it would be a shame if for something so small they had destroyed her future in hololive. I really like Towa and I even traveled there to see her in concert because she is worth it ❤
i feel like at this point if you're a vtuber and god forbid,a females vtuber you should have a gigantic red light indicating that the microphone is not muted
I remember back then that there was this artist who draws alot of amazing Towa art. He only draws Towa, and I've never seen him drawn anything else, but Towa. His art is incredibly fantastic, and back then when Towa was not as popular, he was the only one who's art I see related to Towa. One of his art that I really like was this illustration of Towa crying because she has an halo and an angel wing on his back. However, this artist has unforunately took a break from illustrating because he is going to join the army, and Towa has fortunately send him off. I'm not sure if this artist is still active from drawing cause I barely see his illustration on my following post, but I give that artist a salute because he was one of the original artist who stick to Towa from the very beginning and brought shine to Towa when she was still small. Today, Towa has like 4k+ illustration which is absolutely wild for me, cause I've stick with Towa ever since her 3D debut. Honestly, an incredibly journey from an incredible person, both Mr. Lime and Tokoyami Towa.
I don't care what happened. Instead I want to say that when I heard Towa's cover "Brilliant" for the first time, it was like I was struck by lightning. I never heard anything so beautiful before. Since that day I became kenzoku and there is no way back.
Seeing Cover's response on Towa back in the day apologizing, vs Cover ready to defend Rushia about personal relationship rumour before they found out the NDA breach, yeah, Cover did really learnt about protecting talent, rather than pleasing minority of fans (even tho i feel like they were way smaller back then, i can see they need to please the small number of fans) I hope this is a good projectory first for talent, and it trickle down to cultivating better fanbase
In my country indonesia we call these people halu😂 wayyy too much halu the problem is why you still single hahaha and also that man voice that can be her sibling or her dad man this is jpn culture that i dont like.
I get both sides, but I think her agency needed to stand up for her. That's where they screwed up. Our jobs never stand up for us but they always expect us to dance for them. Companies like her agency are garbage. Cold corporate cutthroat garbage. No love, just profits.
Kinda sad really, they fail to understand that outside the character, our oshi still have life to live lets be honest here most if not all of em has a boyfriend already and probably has to keep em secret just because of hardcore fan, but still i love watching them because i see a friend, a sister, a mother (eh somewhat you get what you get tho), a dad (im looking at you dad), a kusogaki, because i like their personality and enjoy their stream
You mean to tell me.. that my already unattainable Tokoyami Towa is... even less attainable?! The horror! Seriously though.. she is just so damn charming and sweet. Not to mention talented. She obviously has a life outside of streaming. She's not Korone, after all! That woman lives in her stream and I swear she doesn't even sleep. Only stops to snack sometimes. Or maybe blow our eardrums out with her idol-sneezes. I hope Towa has exactly the life she hoped for and enjoys every bit of luxury that her hard work gives her. And yes, that includes having a boyfriend.
I started watching hololive in late 2019, and I feel like this was a really important event in the vtubing story as a whole. Had this happened maybe even 6 months earlier there could very well have simply not been enough western watchers to rally together. It showed that not only could we be a part of the culture, but that we could even make things better than when we arrived. I also get the feeling this was significant to Cover. This would have been around the time EN would have been starting planning. Yes there was Coco, but to arrive at the 11th hour and save not only a talent but also their image showed that overseas viewers were a viable market, and that was even with a language barrier.
In hindsight this was great for her career, especially as an apex/fps focused streamer since most apex streamers are male. It let her clear the male collab hurdle early on in her career and any shit she'll put up with won't be as bad as the first incident. Now she can comfortable collab with any apex players, female or male alike without any resistance or problems because of what she's gone through and i think she's happier for it too.
i really appreciate overseas fans for supporting her the male voice could her bf,family or friend or others,idk. idol or not,She has her own life outside her job.
Yah this is the time i fell in the rabbit hole... Im still trying to know as much holo talent as much as possible and 4th gen hasnt had their 3d debut, i jusr discover towa was on break regarding this issue that time
One of the first hololive members I subscribed to. There have been smiles we have failed to protect before but seeing Towa's on her 3d debut and the original songs she's made for us, I'm glad that we've managed to protect this one at least
Sometimes I find it hard to stand parasocial JP fans over the whole "unpure idol" when it comes to talents. There always seems to be some kind of bad blood between overseas and JP fans when it comes to male voices or mentions by talents.
@@129das For a time Towa and Aki were at the top, now I don't mean amount as in dollar amount I meant percent compared to japanese superchats, so their personal total
Faintly recall this, and not bashing the JP fans while we can point the finger really sad japanese companies are the way their are with non issues and gotta be how they are issuing a statement on literally a not issue. And funny i see more American (give or take) kpop fans on twitter on related things, anyway don't watch TMT much watch EN vtubers on twitch but i hold the mass flock of us american's fondly and sure we all can hope the drama that happens can end and us fans no matter where and past it all we can vibe and be civil human beings!
It suck how it only take some minor percentage of the fan, making a big deal out of nothing, to cause problem for not just idol but entertainment personalities in general. But glad this story got a happy ending, also nice going of the fan who know better and treat it as no big deal, which really it isn't 😂
Did you really remove the HEAVILY upvoted comment criticizing what you said here? You're giving the impression that you want to intentionally hurt Hololive's brand and community through your misinformation.
Is this a joke? The top comment is pinned and critisising the video. You're claiming I removed a comment without any evidence. When I've responded to and agreed with comments critisising this video. Your comment is slander lol
Never knew any of this happened so thanks for the info. I feel like her prominent role in the recent GTA event has helped fans like me (who barely understand a word of Japanese) see and learn more about her, so undoubtedly her star continues to rise.
この時の配信って3度チャンピオンをとるまで終わらないってやつで、チーミングで八百長してるんじゃないかって疑惑の声もあったのよ。 The stream that was the scene of the incident was one that was intended to not end until three championships had been won, so there were suspicions that they were cheating by teaming up.
I haven't watched a lot of hololive recently, but I really like watching Towa and her Apex streams. I'm really glad that she stayed in and continue to stream today. I really love her singing streams and also songs and covers too!
This controversy is so stupid people getting mad over a male voice being heard in Towa's stream, Who the hell cares?! it doesn't make her any less of a person. Its her own private life it don't matter who she talks to. Some fans are just so toxic, I'll always love and support Towa even after she graduates. People essentially just complained because she has a life outside being a vtuber, she had no reason to apologise for that.
Back then Gen 0 and 1 barely conceived the notion of a vtuber, and everything was intended for japanese audiences.Their jokes, their type of talking streams, and their tv show were all made for Japanese audiences (referring to their broadcasts before Holograffiti). Yagoo is more of an entrepreneur so he really couldn't have. They were testing the waters if they even had a successful idea.
I doubt it he didn't know what he was making back then he was just supporting Sora's goals that's was to create an virtual idol group. Yes he did come up with the idea off likely one of her off handed comment or long term goal.
It's a really interesting story that started with Sora and A-Chan looking for tect to basic create Sora the vtuber and going to Yagoo tect company for high end technology at the time.
Towa also built up an large audience outside the dedicated Hololive crowd in Japan, collaborating frequently with VSPO, Nijisanji, Neoporte and independent streamers, notably not shying away from collabing with men, unlike many in Hololive. She together with Matsuri and Laplus just go there own way, without minding the expectations typically on a Hololive talent.
What's so frustrating about the whole idol thing is not so much that there are fans who are creepy and toxic like that but that the companies usually side with them and blame the talent.
I remember this happening and i was confused as to why people were angry. I had no idea having a boyfriend or even a males voice being heard would cause so much controversy. Id been watching miko since late 2019 but this was my first taste of idol culture. Even now i still dont care if they have boyfriends or husbands. In fact im worried that some of them wont get married😅.
If i remember correctly, Towa's mistake was that she said it was her manager, and cover said that it was a lie, that was the reason she took a week break. The main problem that japanese fans are confusing "Idol like" Vtubers with real Idols, Vtubers have the rights to anything they want, as long as it doesn't break the rules, and Hololive Vtubers are free to date anyone, exept co-workers as stated by Matsuri. Real Idols on other hand doesn't have rights to have a romantic relationship, smoking, drinking alcohol and etc. And it's not just rules, it's the essence of being and idol, if you take one thing off, they will not be idols anymore, because these things are basis of idol culture.
every time i hear an idol is being cancelled because her fans found out she has a boyfriend, i wonder how they can be so selfish. They basically want the idol not to have feelings, to be a product and their concept of pureness and devotion to total strangers that would replace her the moment they don't like her anymore. Both fans and companies should stop perpetuating that concept of idols or at least make clear that they're a normal person outside of their character and job
I know you said that this video wasn't to bring up old drama and i believe you, but there really was no need to bring this up 3 years later, regardless of your intentions, especially after saying how cover had done such a good job of clearing the Internet. I know you didn't mean it this way, but it's very disappointing. So many people in the comments are saying they knew nothing of this. Personally, I think it should have stayed that way.
@venandr Thanks for listening. I almost deleted my comment multiple times but I've been subbed for a long time now and know how good your videos normally are. Keep up the good work.
@@skum73 I am open to the feedback and I feel that I made a couple of other mistakes myself in this video that I am working on eliminating in future projects.
This is also one of the reason why Yagoo now stating that they are an Entertainment Company. Some people argued with me, even Cover is an Entertainment Company, Hololive is their Idol division thus it should stay as is because Idol division is also part of an entertainment. But let's face it. We all know why Yagoo said that. Yagoo is no longer want the company get stuck in Idol world. because Idol business got no room and tolerance to expand. Also, Hololive/Cover once said that they don't want to breach into talent's private life.
Good god you people that idolize virtual people, movie stars, musicians and anyone else who falls under the famous title are pathetic ....this is just facepalm levels of embarrassingly sad
As long as she is happy (let her stream with whoever she wants idk) she makes good content and good content makes me happy so im perfectly fine with her streaming with males.
I looked into the usual doxxing JP boards to see what kind of comments the JP side had on the whole male voice thing, and the controversy was about cheating in Apex when she said she was streaming solo. So it was never about being parasocial, but about being a fair, transparent streamer-which is presumably why Towa-sama took the criticism in her apology (now deleted or privated, I think). People just ran with the narrative that it was about parasocial viewers when the evidence was practically nonexistent and it was a bunch of EN viewers who didn’t know what was going on relating the facts as they knew them. It was mostly non-viewers who propagated the current narrative. I only startsd following her later so I wasn’t present at the stream in question, so I can’t verify the truth fully, but the GFE narrative seems irrelevant from what I saw (drama boards, replies to her deleted tweet).
I wish these self-proclaimed righteous westerner stopped spreading misinformation online. especially blaming the japanese audience which is the primary target for towa streams. this is as toxic as the idol culture in japan. stop criticizing something when you are literally clueless about how thing happened in the past.
I missed this controversy by a couple weeks, only really dabbing my feet into the rabbit hole around the time she debuted. But its crazy how similar this was to Mano Aloes controversy. I know she did a couple other things towa didnt do but the thought of Towa requesting graduation makes me sick. Shes done so much and has one of the best singing voices in the company, and even becoming one of my favorites with her music and cuteness alone. Glad she got through it and was able to shine bright going forward
Yeah this video also reminded me of her. Makes me think on the "what-should've" for our short-lived succubus-in-training, but yeah that's the way the cookie crumbles I guess.
