How to Lower your Deck's Mana Curve in Commander | Advice for Budget, Casual, or Competitive EDH 

I told my wife I just watched a video on RU-vid that will give her universal tips for lowering her curves and she got mad at me for some reason.

Nice video! In the universal tips there the benefit of drawing less attention to your board. Thus leading to safer and efficient plays!

Awesome. It's also worth noting that consolidating your strategy is also a good way to better manage your average cmc. When you can test run a strategy and also through any alternative counter-strategies within the same curve, you are that much more likely to consistently carry the game to your desired win con.

You guys are like the best new content makers I’ve seen for a while. Keep it up! Also great hoodies.

Always nice to see your videos in my notifications. Thanks for the helpful content!

You guy's are killing it! Love the videos, keep em up!

Being able to play more stuff is always fun! Ive played a gimmicky eggs deck and even when I was losing I was having fun

Would definitely want to see you guys take on limited! Been meaning to request that in a comment, actually. Limited is probably the best way to play Magic imo, not that I play it too much.

I like your videos. They help me make my decks better. It's so hard to fix the mana curve for Hallar, but I been working on the deck. Tribe scout out. Also when I buy cards I use your link. Hope it helps.

One big thing you should also consider for a smooth running deck is mana-costing activated abilities that you rely on. So mostly equipments and certain commanders. When counting for average cmc (though not for the curve) I would consider their cmc as their cmc + activation cost.

The new merch is nice!! I like those hoodies!!

I find including some kinds of looting, or discarding for value, can have a pretty positive impact. I’ll often put Frantic Search in blue decks that have higher cmc stuff...or like in my mono green deck, Fauna Shaman discarding a fatty early to go find Priest of Titania, or in decks that go voltron Key to the City can be quite effective. Even Faithless Looting. It puts you down a card, but often, I find it’s worth it for the card selection...discarding expensive creatures to find land or ramp, then reanimating them later maybe. So many ways to achieve this.

Thank you for making videos that risk telling people what they don't want to hear. No one wants to hear about how their deck isn't good enough, no matter how true it is. " What is good enough? " - Yeah, I understand that, and so do you guys. Only a few videos in, and I'm glad I found you. Much better so far than channels like Playing with Power or Tolarian Community College. Neither of those channels really tell the whole story. They just tell people what they want to hear for views. You guys sound like you've read some of Patrick Chapin's books. Many kudos.

Great tips guys ! The hoodies are awesome :)

Took a look at my werewolves deck and it was already 3.5 average. Took out some 6 drops that were redundant and got it close to 3!

I spent the last month or so just redoing all of my decks and lowering the curve. They just are so much better. My fav deck being varina, I was averaging around 2.90, had alot of zombie staples. With newer releases I cut a whole bunch of fluff including rooftop storm and grave titan, Got my cmc to about 2.75 and now its some control/draw deck that can go wide with zombies. I am having alot of trouble with obosh right now. Just due to the nature of his effect

So I also tend to have pretty low cmc decks, but I also tend to play a lot of jank decks. When you want to win with a bad (but efficient) deck, one of the best ways to scale into the later game is to make sure you hit land drops and start playing more then one spell a turn. So even in decks with an average cmc of 2.5-3 I tend to play 34-36 lands

I agree with most of it, but the thing about Krosan grip is totally a "meta call". If in your meta tons of people play some "annoying" combos that can be activated "in response" then having split second is considerably better. True, a Nature's claim with good timing can have the same effect but can also be played around easier. Nice episode guys !

Another way to lower the mana curve is to derive bigger effects from synergies rather than from individual cards. A dip in the mana curve at a single CMC is not necessarily a bad thing. If it occurs higher up in the curve, say at 5, it's not problem if you have enough lower drops or mana sinks in your deck, because you can play combinations of lower drops instead of a higher drop. On the other hand, if you're playing a lot of ramp cards with CMC1, it's just reasonable to have slightly less 2-drops, because there are so many one drops and you should be able to play a 3-drop on turn 3. If your commander is a 3-drop and you want to play your commander early on, you don't need to run as many 3-drops, since you're always going to have your commander available.

Looking professional with the hoodies boys. Nice work

Y’all had me checking my average cmc in all my decks on moxfield looks like I’m good like the new look you guys look very professional

for the CMC to be calulated in your intention by tappedout, just type * CMC:0 * for example for force of will (just replace the zero with any number) or * CMC:7 * for cyclonic rift. But keep that in mind when it comes to cards that care about cmc like adnauseam or yuriko.

this has to be the best edh podcast. big fan

I don't mind drawing an 8 or 9 mana card in my opening hand as long as I have 4 solid mana sources. I run Jodah Archmage Eternal, and generally by turn 4 I have enough mana and artifacts to filter or tap for whatever I cast for WUBRG and put like Zaxara out. Such a good feeling.

I love the merch keep up the great videos

Lowering your curve will make the deck so much more efficient. If i have six mana availible, with a lower curve i can cast maybe three or even four spells in that turn. If the curve is higher you might be stuck with a five drop and a six drop and have to choose wich single spell is best at the moment

Another replacement for Grave Titan if you want 3-4 bodies for 1 card played: Chittering Witch! Love that old lady :)

great tip for edh! Its the only way I can keep playing with friends using différents stratégies:)

So I have a few quick question about calculating the average mana cost in my deck I'm playing commander. Some things to point out 1 running blue green 2 commander is Kruphix I have 3 X cost cards in the deck and don't know how to calculate their cost They are Biomass Mutation B/G B/G X Curse of Swine B B X Fractal Harness G 2 X Next I have a split instant sorcery Incubation G/B & Incongruity B G 1 Do I count each as separate or together as a 4? Also I have Leyline of Anticipation B B 2 That if it's in my opening hand I start the game with it on the battlefield Last I have 4 cards that can be played one side or the other 3 of those are lands the other can be a sorcery or creature Vastwood Fortification G / land Turntimber Symbiosis G G G 4/ land Bala Ged Recovery G 2/ land Wandering Archaic 5/ Explore the Vastlands 3 Without calculating my X cards and treating incubation Incongruity as a 4 and the either or cards as their most expensive cards my deck is a 3.3 but counting them at lowest cost and treating the lands as lands my deck seems to be a 3.1 My important question is would I average the numbers and have a 3.2 mana cost deck I calculated the Leyline as a 4 cost for both numbers because normally it won't be in my opening hand?

Do you recommend heartbeat of spring over mana reflection? Regal behemoth over nyxbloom ancient?

Why my mono blue deck is fun. Low cost cards with extra draw power. Arcanis for a commander is dumb but I have 5 counterspells and 4 ways to get them back to keep him safe. Fatestitcher illusionist bracers for infinite everything and lab man win condition

*Commander is a social format, where you can play high mana cost haymakers, not viable in constructed competitive formats!* Yes but actually No.

OH BOY look at those sweet hoodies dang :)

I like what you said about cards like Dig Through Time how they really don't cost what the printed card says. I have 1 7 drop, 2 8 drops and 2 9 drops in my best deck but the 7 is a mdfc, the 2 8s are treasure Cruise and Dig through time and one of the 9 drops is Blasphemous Act so the costs raise my average cmc but it's deceptive.

My cnc is just below 3 and not sure if bringing it lower is useful to my decks goals.

I have a question about one of my builds. I want to assemble Radha, heart of keld as my commander in kind of an lands matter voltron style commander. I’m going with multiple combat steps because I want to combine her with Moraug, fury of akoum. Therefore I’m playing the aggravated assault Combo with sword of feast and famine and nature’s will. My question is: I want to go with some other assault lines and I was wondering if I should run both of the Nehebs (They both go infinite with it, with a little bit of setup) or if I should run savage ventmaw. He is 6 mana but if he comes through, without being blocked or removed, he assembles the combo for sure. On the other hand the Nehebs are only 4/5 mana and need more setup, but are easier to tutor in my deck as well... besides that ventmaw doesn’t do much else for my deck. I was even thinking about 4 mana dominaria Radha as well, she goes infinite, but only with a wide board and while I’m more voltronish I have only few synergy (scute swarm) for that. Any suggestions or maybe an other route to go for me there ? (I have not playtested any option yet but was just wondering what you think about that). Thanks for the great video 👍

Hey team, I am moving from a more cedh play style to a more high power, less turn 3 combo format. Running a Kenrith reanimator list. Serious question. Is there an optimal cmc in your opinion for a high power format? I am sitting at 2.20 but that actually seems so low in this format. Thoughts?

My weatherlight captain Rainbow deck's CMC is 6 and that's the dragon engine coming down turn 7. But I've found every low cost legendary i could find working on this historic style super friends deck and it runs smoothly. But any comments to it would be much apritiated because i want to run it faster and just out value my opponents with low cost bombs🤙

Would having more ramp help a higher curve cuz i run dragons and i dedicated 20% of it to just ramp and most of that 20% is 2 cmc or less or would i should i try dropping some of the creatures

While Nature's Claim is ridiculous and you should definitely run it in every deck that has green, I don't think you should take out a Krosan Grip for that effect. Yes, it's 3 Mana versus 1, but it's also a spell that can't be interacted with except for maybe a couple very niche circumstances. I'm willing to pay a bit extra if it means it can't be countered. But any other 3-drop removal spell in that family probably isn't going to cut it for me.

one challenge that i face sometimes is when i make a tribal commander deck. to stay tribal on some tribes, it gets hard to try to stay tribal with also lowering the mana curve

I appreciate the broad appeal of this content.

In general, choosing certain cards for a deck is like always trying to find a compromise. That's how it is basically.

I used to play grave titan in a lot of my decks. Now it's only in my 5c golos Fotd zombie tribal deck because I have cut army of the damned

How did the moxfield ad not come at the dig through time tangent lol

What about not playing at all cards with the same cmc as your commander ? For instance not playing at all 5cmc spells in your Gitrog deck ?

My Goreclaw is probably my biggest and it's only 5.35 CMC...Any suggestions what I could add to bring it up to 7.00?

Grave Titan is a beast

“Grave Titan is a house” -Joe Cherries

If you don't mind my asking, what is the range of CMCs for your guys' decks? I've been working on lowering mine and typically get around 2.8-3.0. But I would like to decrease it a bit more, as my decks don't always get going as consistently as I would like. I also mostly play paper though, so budget is a concern.

no No NO! Increase those Mana Curves even more! We want those THICC CURVES!

I don't think you should compare k grip to natures claim that extra 2 mana says they can't interact while you interact with them. Both are good in their own right but 9/10 times I want to kill something without counterspells/any activated ability crapping all over it. Good advise tho guys on the lowing your curve by starting at the top end. Keep up the good work.

For mana to bodies ratio sprouting thrynax and mytotic slime are also a better value than grave titan.

While it's generally fine to have a lower curve. I think it's better to avoid overcrowding particular slots and have a good distribution of spells

Krosan Grip should never be cut because of splitsecond that ability can decide if a combo player wins or bricks because of they can't respond

Ok so here me out, when you say 3.8 to 3.5 on mana curve how exactly did you get that number? Like whats the formula to calculate it? there are plenty of things telling how to make ascending and descending piles based on CMC but not the actual formula used to give you the numbers like 3.8 or 3.5, like am i right in assuming you count the total of the CMC for the whole deck divided by the number of nonland cards? Example: CMC 0 (4), CMC 1 (16), CMC 2 (13), CMC 3 (21), CMC 4 (10), CMC 5 (5), CMC 6 (3) so CMC 188 divided by the 72 nonland cards being a CMC curve of 2.6 Would that be right or am i missing something here? Like i don't see anyone explaining the formula used as i think a explanation would be really helpful to many. Also even though it don't matter since you might be curious lets just say the lands are Simic Guildgate, Transguild Promenade, Command Tower, Unknown Shores, Mana Confluence, Thornwood Falls, City of Brass, Forrest (x10), Island (x11) also lets assume there is plenty of ramp and draw to justify only 28 lands in a 100 card deck well technically 99 cause of the command zone.

i was thinking Grave Titan in The Scarab god deck. If you make a Scarab God deck, I guarantee you will think about adding Grave Titan. Is that a good choice?

Where do i put X-Spells in my mana curve?

I really needed this episode! Although, a question guy: I've built a Purphoros, bronze blooded deck. So I care about big stuff to cheat into play. As a result of that, my curve is way to high. I'm afraid though that by lowering it I'm gonna compromise the goal of the deck. What to do?

1 win condition is too fragile in my opinion. i prefer 2-3 win cons with backup cards for at least 1-2 of them. meaning if i need a sac outlet i will run 5 or more, if i need a lab man, i'll also run thassa's oracle and jace.

My best deck has a average cmc of 2.25. It has 1 6 cost, 1 5 cost, 4 4 cost, and the rest is 3 or less. I run 33 lands and it's great

Nice Sweaters guys ! :D (Nice video too :p)

Would it be possible to make a video with tips on how to improve an aggro deck?

I am normally pretty good at lowering my curve when I want to. For some reason im struggling to find low cost Azorious cards I like. Got any 2/3 drop favs?

I have a question about deck building so decree of silence and solemanty

Sorry but ill keep my grave titian. Scarab god enjoys his presence. edit: Also you get more zombies everytime he attacks! not does damage, so i send that boy all over the table

My korvold average cmc is 1.82 my jhoira is probably lower. My golos is probably the highest (I’m afraid to look) followed by gishath.

i dont like the grave titan example where you say enthusiast can replace it. yes it's three bodies for 6 mana but it keeps creating two bodies with every attack, that's a waaaay better card. usually if i have to force my opponents to remove it i win because that's one less card they have to deal with my commander or my actual strategy.

hmm Does one neet to a patreon to get access to the discord?

Replace Craterhoof Behemoth with Memnite.

You guys seem confused at wether this is a budget cut video or a Mana cut video

Premium video boys!

I have an ur dragon tribal deck......I don't see any possible way to lower my average curve.

Hey guys, just want to say thanks for all the content. You guys have become my go-to deck tech channel. I have build several variations of your decks in paper: Grand Abolisher: Persistent Petitioners K'rrik Purphoros, bronze blooded Grismold I really like your game play style. Lowering of my curve is exactly what I have taken away. If your looking for deck tune ups I would love your feedback on any of these decks: Niv-Mizzet, Parun - Wheely Good Time archidekt.com/decks/61950#Niv-Mizzet_-_Wheely_Good_Time Pramikon - Benevolent Control archidekt.com/decks/254190#Benevolent_Control Thanks Again!

My mana curve might need to be raised not lowered Lands= 33 1 mana= 16 2 mana= 23 3 mana= 15 4 mana= 10 5 mana= 1 + commander 6 mana= 1

Run mono red.

I play 28

Have y'all thought of making a discord?

Random question, how old are you guys?

122nd!

But I want the highest of cmc cards to flip for yuriko !! Oh what shall i doooo

My decks are 3.5 to 4.5, except for golos, grixis, and dragons

NO NOT NICOL BOLAS 8:14

I'm confused... You guys recommend tutors, but most of the reddit community absolutely hates on tutors...

I need a shirt!! How much

Wanna really lower your curve? Open your wallet.

Video is very helpful once you get done talking through the beginning. Get to the point faster

Beezy is 🥰😍

Great video, doesn't really start til around the 9 minute mark. If i can advise anything to you guys, you unnecessarily disclaimer A LOT (not just disclaimer guy: he's da best). Let people leave their stupid comments - that just drives up your algorithm placement, right?

I wonder how much outrage there'll be over the video this time...

garbage. also, you should thank me because I just made you 5 dollars on my click